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Sexual mysteries
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In the Aristophanic play Lysistrata, the women mourn the fact that they're on a sex strike, and, in particular, that they can no longer perform the move "the lioness on the cheese grater"
This has stumped scholars for centuries.
Fabbers: what sex move is this? |
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"Have they translated it correctly? Because seriously a cheese grater just made me shudder "
yes. lol
My first thought is that a cheese grater looked incredibly different in ancient Greece, but it's emphatically not an area I can speak to. It's just one of those mysteries I'm aware of. |
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?"
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end."
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem? |
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"Have they translated it correctly? Because seriously a cheese grater just made me shudder
yes. lol
My first thought is that a cheese grater looked incredibly different in ancient Greece, but it's emphatically not an area I can speak to. It's just one of those mysteries I'm aware of."
That is madness, know they're retranslating some of the old Welsh books, because of errors in them.
I'm now to figure out what kind of cheese grater they would have back then? Have they ever found one swing? |
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"Have they translated it correctly? Because seriously a cheese grater just made me shudder
yes. lol
My first thought is that a cheese grater looked incredibly different in ancient Greece, but it's emphatically not an area I can speak to. It's just one of those mysteries I'm aware of.
That is madness, know they're retranslating some of the old Welsh books, because of errors in them.
I'm now to figure out what kind of cheese grater they would have back then? Have they ever found one swing? "
I don't think so - although I do know similarly wtf moments have been solved by archaeology.
Work's been done to update translations, it's ongoing (and the Aristophanes I have in translation is way better than what you can find online, fewer euphemisms - Aristophanes is filth). But I think that particular translation is pretty stable. We just don't know wtf it could possibly refer to, other than an item to choose off a menu |
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By *ee04Man
over a year ago
Essex |
"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end."
This would have to Athenian as Spartans only had sex with women to reproduce (well in the warrior class). Love was reserved for fellow warriors. |
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem?"
Pupil?
It was performed in the last quarter of the 5th century BCE - as part of a religious festival and competition. |
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
This would have to Athenian as Spartans only had sex with women to reproduce (well in the warrior class). Love was reserved for fellow warriors. "
It's a work of fiction.
Also, given how little writing remains from Sparta, that's probably pretty difficult to substantiate. It's probably one of those myths about Greek sex that exist.
They* weren't an LGBT+ paradise, they weren't great lovers by most accounts... just had different hangups.
* Most generalisations like this are mostly about Athens, because Athens wrote a fuckton more than other poleis. Notably Sparta kinda thought writing was for pussies. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem?
Pupil?
It was performed in the last quarter of the 5th century BCE - as part of a religious festival and competition."
Yeh, I was told it was written to help opinion with the revolution however that one of his pupils may have been not taking his duties seriously enough. |
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem?
Pupil?
It was performed in the last quarter of the 5th century BCE - as part of a religious festival and competition.
Yeh, I was told it was written to help opinion with the revolution however that one of his pupils may have been not taking his duties seriously enough. "
I'm not aware of that background.
I tend to think about it more as, it's a reflection of concerns people had at the time, tied up in the absurd (or, in the case of tragedies, in the divine) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem?
Pupil?
It was performed in the last quarter of the 5th century BCE - as part of a religious festival and competition.
Yeh, I was told it was written to help opinion with the revolution however that one of his pupils may have been not taking his duties seriously enough.
I'm not aware of that background.
I tend to think about it more as, it's a reflection of concerns people had at the time, tied up in the absurd (or, in the case of tragedies, in the divine)"
So I was taught about him in combined Latin and Greek. Basically this was a response to the coup of the 400 even tho it was a comedy, however he would have had a pupil or pupils he had to influence. He was clearly requesting his pupil/s to seek peace instead of pissing about, shagging and killing, probably by whoever their parents were. I reckon whoever it was written for specifically had mental tastes in bed, I just dunno who he was tutoring at the time. |
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By *avinaTVTV/TS
over a year ago
Transsexual Transylvania |
Taking the historical and cultural context out of the picture (yes, I know, blasphemy, context is king, etc)... Looking at the description of the action - I'd say it's a woman riding on top, cowgirl. Lioness might refer to a sexually voracious woman in a sexually dominant position (on top).
As for the cheese grater - that's a sliding to-and-fro motion. (And yes, a man's pubes can be a bit rough and grating in that situation - we've all been there).
 |
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"What kind of story is that to teach his pupil? Stop fucking about and focus on the country cos your parents are pissed?
Very bad precis of the plot of Lysistrata:
Athens and Sparta are at war. The wives of Athens decide to stop this by putting on a sex strike. They can't stand it, they need to be fucked, and shenanigans ensue, but eventually the sex strike brings the war to an end.
Yeh, have seen it, but just don't get why Aristophones HAD to get that message through to his pupil. What was his pupil's problem?
Pupil?
It was performed in the last quarter of the 5th century BCE - as part of a religious festival and competition.
Yeh, I was told it was written to help opinion with the revolution however that one of his pupils may have been not taking his duties seriously enough.
I'm not aware of that background.
I tend to think about it more as, it's a reflection of concerns people had at the time, tied up in the absurd (or, in the case of tragedies, in the divine)
So I was taught about him in combined Latin and Greek. Basically this was a response to the coup of the 400 even tho it was a comedy, however he would have had a pupil or pupils he had to influence. He was clearly requesting his pupil/s to seek peace instead of pissing about, shagging and killing, probably by whoever their parents were. I reckon whoever it was written for specifically had mental tastes in bed, I just dunno who he was tutoring at the time."
I'm not sure where the pupil bit comes from at all. He may well have been wanting to teach/ influence his audience, theatre being didactic and all of that? And yes, certainly, being in the midst of the oligarchic revolutions, shortly after the disaster of the Sicilian expedition, etc. It was also not the only gender based play on in that festival.
(I learned about it in undergraduate/ postgraduate specialism in Greek history) |
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Yeah, gut feeling is that it’s a woman on top, grinding away on a ‘fully inserted’ man. That rocking the hips back-and-forth motion that sometimes *really* hits the spot. If you know what I mean. And I think that you do.
But whether that gut feeling is correct … fuck knows. Could be referring to anything. |
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"Taking the historical and cultural context out of the picture (yes, I know, blasphemy, context is king, etc)... Looking at the description of the action - I'd say it's a woman riding on top, cowgirl. Lioness might refer to a sexually voracious woman in a sexually dominant position (on top).
As for the cheese grater - that's a sliding to-and-fro motion. (And yes, a man's pubes can be a bit rough and grating in that situation - we've all been there).
"
That is a common interpretation of what it might mean, but it's not a settled issue.
Although I can't imagine given the wider context that sexually dominant women were... a thing? I mean maybe, but off the top of my head the social/ legal/ medical literature would seem to indicate otherwise. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In the Aristophanic play Lysistrata, the women mourn the fact that they're on a sex strike, and, in particular, that they can no longer perform the move "the lioness on the cheese grater"
This has stumped scholars for centuries.
Fabbers: what sex move is this?"
Rubbing her clit on the cock in one direction only!!!! ????
Think about it  |
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"Have they translated it correctly? Because seriously a cheese grater just made me shudder
yes. lol
My first thought is that a cheese grater looked incredibly different in ancient Greece, but it's emphatically not an area I can speak to. It's just one of those mysteries I'm aware of.
That is madness, know they're retranslating some of the old Welsh books, because of errors in them.
I'm now to figure out what kind of cheese grater they would have back then? Have they ever found one swing?
I don't think so - although I do know similarly wtf moments have been solved by archaeology.
Work's been done to update translations, it's ongoing (and the Aristophanes I have in translation is way better than what you can find online, fewer euphemisms - Aristophanes is filth). But I think that particular translation is pretty stable. We just don't know wtf it could possibly refer to, other than an item to choose off a menu"
Well this is definitely going into my interesting facts library in my brain. |
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"Have they translated it correctly? Because seriously a cheese grater just made me shudder
yes. lol
My first thought is that a cheese grater looked incredibly different in ancient Greece, but it's emphatically not an area I can speak to. It's just one of those mysteries I'm aware of.
That is madness, know they're retranslating some of the old Welsh books, because of errors in them.
I'm now to figure out what kind of cheese grater they would have back then? Have they ever found one swing?
I don't think so - although I do know similarly wtf moments have been solved by archaeology.
Work's been done to update translations, it's ongoing (and the Aristophanes I have in translation is way better than what you can find online, fewer euphemisms - Aristophanes is filth). But I think that particular translation is pretty stable. We just don't know wtf it could possibly refer to, other than an item to choose off a menu
Well this is definitely going into my interesting facts library in my brain. "
My favourite about Aristophanes is how the fuck we got our hands on it.
Most classical Greek material comes to modern Europeans through medieval monks, who kept it for its rhetorical value or to instruct pupils about learning the Bible
Aristophanes, as noted, is *pure filth*. It's rude, it's sexual. Imagine your stereotypical religious person/ instructor using erotica to teach you a foreign language.
Because that's why we have Aristophanes. The monks thought it was excellent to teach Attic Greek grammar  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?"
They could cut gears within tolerance. You're worried about them being able to make cheese smaller? |
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"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?
They could cut gears within tolerance. You're worried about them being able to make cheese smaller?"
I'm not worried about it,it already happened! |
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"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?
They could cut gears within tolerance. You're worried about them being able to make cheese smaller?
I'm not worried about it,it already happened! "
as someone who dedicated over a decade of my life to this stuff, it's amazing how many people are worried about it.
I find it interesting, but people get really anxious about stuff they can't change. Not like, does X like me or not, but thousands of years ago, a thing happened. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?"
Hmm did they have cheese!
I think you are onto something here |
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"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?
Hmm did they have cheese!
I think you are onto something here
they definitely had cheese. lol"
It's interesting to think how cheese making came about, and bread making?!! |
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By *yesgreenMan
over a year ago
north and south |
"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?
Hmm did they have cheese!
I think you are onto something here
they definitely had cheese. lol
It's interesting to think how cheese making came about, and bread making?!!"
Dry fucking teasing us men |
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"Did they have cheese graters in ancient Greece?
Is it facesitting on someone with a beard?
Hmm did they have cheese!
I think you are onto something here
they definitely had cheese. lol
It's interesting to think how cheese making came about, and bread making?!!Dry fucking teasing us men "
now I'm imagining trying to make cheese out of smegma and I am done eating today.
that rotten fish thingy from Pompeii was bad enough ta |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you 
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!"
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse "
Ancient Greek sex toys then!? |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse
Ancient Greek sex toys then!?"
I only really know about the leather dildos. For what it's worth they would only have been used by women, because (contrary to popular belief) the Greeks had a lot of hangups around sex with guys. I can only think of one reference to sex that might have been anal (it's vague), but it was with a woman to prevent pregnancy, because said pregnancy was the subject of a pretty catastrophic oracle. |
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"They had släves for everything in those days, including grating cheese. Probably. "
Yes. But it doesn't answer the question of what the sex act is.
And delegating the sex to the help seems a bit sad |
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"Urban Dictionary may have it
"Grating the cheese
The act of performing oral sex on a woman with a yest infection.
I was grating the cheese on this girl and after I needed a breath mint, bad""
I don't think that's the tone Aristophanes was going for, unless he was into projectile puke in the theatre |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse
Ancient Greek sex toys then!?
I only really know about the leather dildos. For what it's worth they would only have been used by women, because (contrary to popular belief) the Greeks had a lot of hangups around sex with guys. I can only think of one reference to sex that might have been anal (it's vague), but it was with a woman to prevent pregnancy, because said pregnancy was the subject of a pretty catastrophic oracle."
It's amazing they got to the 21st century!!! |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse
Ancient Greek sex toys then!?
I only really know about the leather dildos. For what it's worth they would only have been used by women, because (contrary to popular belief) the Greeks had a lot of hangups around sex with guys. I can only think of one reference to sex that might have been anal (it's vague), but it was with a woman to prevent pregnancy, because said pregnancy was the subject of a pretty catastrophic oracle.
It's amazing they got to the 21st century!!!"
haha! I suspect that there was some revisionism in said oracle.
very convenient that the nearby priestess or goat tripping balls will predict a break in the democracy that is going on a PR blitz. (no that's not an even handed description of the world in Herodotus, don't come for me, I'm shit talking ) |
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"I have nothing to add, but I bloody love this, Swing. It's lovely to read you
Mrs TMN x
I'm a nerd. Sorry not sorry
Can we go back to history of cheese making!
The history of food is a bit outside my wheelhouse
Ancient Greek sex toys then!?
I only really know about the leather dildos. For what it's worth they would only have been used by women, because (contrary to popular belief) the Greeks had a lot of hangups around sex with guys. I can only think of one reference to sex that might have been anal (it's vague), but it was with a woman to prevent pregnancy, because said pregnancy was the subject of a pretty catastrophic oracle.
It's amazing they got to the 21st century!!!
haha! I suspect that there was some revisionism in said oracle.
very convenient that the nearby priestess or goat tripping balls will predict a break in the democracy that is going on a PR blitz. (no that's not an even handed description of the world in Herodotus, don't come for me, I'm shit talking )"
Here's a fun thing...
If clocks had been invented in the southern hemisphere the hands would go round the opposite way! |
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I found this...
Lioness" is a sexual position. A scholium on the line says s??µa d? ?st?? ?????st?? ?a? ?ta?????? (it is a licentious and whorish position).[4] The ancient cheese-grater "was a knife with a bronze or ivory handle, [on which] it was customary to carve all sorts of animal figures, some indeed couching upon the handle, but others standing upright, and touching the handle only with their feet." |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's clearly a variation on prone bone and doggy, crouched really low. The cheese grater reference comes from the friction burns caused by thick matted pubes scrping along the flesh like velcro. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It's clearly a variation on prone bone and doggy, crouched really low. The cheese grater reference comes from the friction burns caused by thick matted pubes scrping along the flesh like velcro."
If only you'd waited, you wouldn't have made a tit of yourself. |
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"I found this...
Lioness" is a sexual position. A scholium on the line says s??µa d? ?st?? ?????st?? ?a? ?ta?????? (it is a licentious and whorish position).[4] The ancient cheese-grater "was a knife with a bronze or ivory handle, [on which] it was customary to carve all sorts of animal figures, some indeed couching upon the handle, but others standing upright, and touching the handle only with their feet.""
Scholia are sometimes suspect, but it's definitely a possibility. |
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"In the Aristophanic play Lysistrata, the women mourn the fact that they're on a sex strike, and, in particular, that they can no longer perform the move "the lioness on the cheese grater"
This has stumped scholars for centuries.
Fabbers: what sex move is this?"
Got to be an S&M thing. |
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"It's clearly a variation on prone bone and doggy, crouched really low. The cheese grater reference comes from the friction burns caused by thick matted pubes scrping along the flesh like velcro."
I wasn't genuinely expecting a scholarly mystery of generations to be solved on a swinging site.
Nor do I think it's actually likely that that would be the case.
I just thought it was entertaining? |
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