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Seminal study on the effects of Covid on the immune system
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-35638-y
Apologies to admin for posting links but this is an important study.
Bottom line- Covid is seriously messing with our immune systems and repeated infection are definitely not desirable.
It challenges the idea if we can truly live with this virus
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe."
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? |
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio?"
So what is your solution OP? Hide away put life on hold ?? Either way covid isn't going away anytime soon so living with it is the only way to live life  |
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I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. |
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"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. "
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio?
So what is your solution OP? Hide away put life on hold ?? Either way covid isn't going away anytime soon so living with it is the only way to live life "
Solutions
Not lockdown but more stringent NPI’s such as mandatory masking when Covid levels are high, improving ventilation… to be fair other countries realise this and have kept cases lower. Therapeutics will become available in time but they are only in development at the moment.
What needs to realised is that the lack of any NPI’s at the moment is economically unsustainable in the long term. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground.
"
Agree, you don’t need more lockdowns just using simple NPI’s to reduce transmission rates particularly indoors and during the winter. |
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"https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-35638-y
Apologies to admin for posting links but this is an important study.
Bottom line- Covid is seriously messing with our immune systems and repeated infection are definitely not desirable.
It challenges the idea if we can truly live with this virus"
Careful now! Don't go posting good sense in the virus forum. The denialists will be upset. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. "
Agreed. The classic ‘false dichotomy.’ Where someone presents an idea, or holds a view, where it’s either/or.
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio?"
High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-022-35638-y
Apologies to admin for posting links but this is an important study.
Bottom line- Covid is seriously messing with our immune systems and repeated infection are definitely not desirable.
It challenges the idea if we can truly live with this virus
Careful now! Don't go posting good sense in the virus forum. The denialists will be upset. "
To be fair - there is very little mention in the mainstream media about it- even the BBC are starting to call Covid ‘
Seasonal Illness’ .
This is a brilliant read in the BMJ
https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2021/09/13/covid-19-and-the-new-merchants-of-doubt/
With so much misinformation about - it really has impacted on public health strategies
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. "
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. "
You are talking about mortality not morbidity. I agree mortality rates have greatly decreased but morbidity rates are still high - 2.3 million people with LC and increasing linearly with each wave by 3-400 K.
Project forward 3-5 years….. if nothing changes …. You are looking at 5-6 million with LC
This is what , aside from the human impact of each case of LC which is horrifying, is utterly economically unsustainable at the current growth of LC cases - through increased welfare payments and loss to the workforce.
Covid is maiming far more than it’s killing. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. "
As mentioned in the BMJ link- it’s those who want make masking a wedge issue, those who are the facilitators of misinformation…. they are the firestarters clouding the debate with misinformation….. and they are the ones who benefit. |
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By *aussageMan
over a year ago
Stalbridge |
Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face. |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face."
A normal mask doesn't give the wearer much protection, but they slow down infection to others. For which there is tonnes of evidence and the science is pretty basic on why they work in reducing infection but I am guessing you just ignore it. So masks do have an effect on infection rate. |
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"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk."
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times. |
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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago
Peterborough |
Give people their freedom?
Yes?
But FFS, if you're ill and infectious stay home and stop spreading lurgy. A toilet cubicle is not a phone kiosk, nor is it an internet cafe. Flush your shit, don't watch or like other peoples' online
This disgusting lack of hygiene is why Covid took hold.You can't hold a phone and wash your hand at the same time.
Basic hygiene, there is no swipe and wipe app called iPoo'd!
Cover mouths, when suffering with respiratory infections.
It ain't rocket peeps.  |
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By *aussageMan
over a year ago
Stalbridge |
"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk.
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times."
Basic or not the science never supported mask mandates. The issue has been looked at for 30+ years in people medical professionals, people trained in the proper fitting and timely disposal of masks. Cloth masks in most of the studies have negative efficacy because their filtration rate is close to zero and they get wet and contaminated very quickly. Imagine a petri dish of bacteria growing on a cloth strapped to your face. They are actually an infection risk. Surgical masks have giant gaps around the nose and other places. They are supposed to be strictly single use.
The way the general public were using masks, or reusing them and putting their grubby hands all over them is akin to reusing the same piece of toilet paper day after day and trying to stay clean. Biologically they are filthy. The whole thing was just an exercise in the absurd.
And to top it off infection rates plunged after people stopped wearing them. That wasn't supposed to happen according to the talking heads. |
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. "
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk.
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times.
Basic or not the science never supported mask mandates. The issue has been looked at for 30+ years in people medical professionals, people trained in the proper fitting and timely disposal of masks. Cloth masks in most of the studies have negative efficacy because their filtration rate is close to zero and they get wet and contaminated very quickly. Imagine a petri dish of bacteria growing on a cloth strapped to your face. They are actually an infection risk. Surgical masks have giant gaps around the nose and other places. They are supposed to be strictly single use.
The way the general public were using masks, or reusing them and putting their grubby hands all over them is akin to reusing the same piece of toilet paper day after day and trying to stay clean. Biologically they are filthy. The whole thing was just an exercise in the absurd.
And to top it off infection rates plunged after people stopped wearing them. That wasn't supposed to happen according to the talking heads."
Masking ( with appropriate masks) does reduce infection rate and not everyone is reusing masks.
More testing would help.
Improve ventilation
And other NPI’s
Again a better clearer public health message- it certainly was not very clear about masking from the start |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk.
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times."
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. "
That's my point exactly. Who is being afraid? And Who isn't getting on with living?
The fact that it's being discussed shouldn't be equated with fear or terror or not living. It's a grown up thing to do amongst grown ups who choose to do so isn't it? |
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living.
That's my point exactly. Who is being afraid? And Who isn't getting on with living?
The fact that it's being discussed shouldn't be equated with fear or terror or not living. It's a grown up thing to do amongst grown ups who choose to do so isn't it? "
You'd think.
It's concerning data, but that doesn't imply anything about the behaviour of those discussing it. |
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"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk.
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times.
Basic or not the science never supported mask mandates. The issue has been looked at for 30+ years in people medical professionals, people trained in the proper fitting and timely disposal of masks. Cloth masks in most of the studies have negative efficacy because their filtration rate is close to zero and they get wet and contaminated very quickly. Imagine a petri dish of bacteria growing on a cloth strapped to your face. They are actually an infection risk. Surgical masks have giant gaps around the nose and other places. They are supposed to be strictly single use.
The way the general public were using masks, or reusing them and putting their grubby hands all over them is akin to reusing the same piece of toilet paper day after day and trying to stay clean. Biologically they are filthy. The whole thing was just an exercise in the absurd.
And to top it off infection rates plunged after people stopped wearing them. That wasn't supposed to happen according to the talking heads."
The level of understanding of basic science and statistics is truly alarming in the UK.
Or perhaps its just naivety.
Or perhaps its just 'trolling' for who knows what reasons.
After a long vaccination campaign, months of lockdowns, restriction on movement, many non essential workers on furlough, we finally re-emerge into the light. Restrictions are lifted and mask wearing comes to an end. And you manage to conclude that it's the ending of mask wearing that has brought this about....!
Wow, better get that message out to health care workers and medical personnel who are still facing the problems of Covid infections (and many other nasties) every day.
The human race is truly doomed.
And not because of Covid!!! |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living.
That's my point exactly. Who is being afraid? And Who isn't getting on with living?
The fact that it's being discussed shouldn't be equated with fear or terror or not living. It's a grown up thing to do amongst grown ups who choose to do so isn't it? "
It’s nothing to do with fear and unfortunately unless we choose huge economic consequences we don’t have a choice either |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. "
that's slightly miss representative. The covid numbers factor in all the steps taken to reduce deaths. And even then it's almost 2x more deadly than the next two other infectious diseases combined.
Also, your maths relies on good data. China has 4 deaths p million , India has 400, and US 3,000. UK is also about 3,000 p MiL. So yr 8m could easily be 20+m.
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. that's slightly miss representative. The covid numbers factor in all the steps taken to reduce deaths. And even then it's almost 2x more deadly than the next two other infectious diseases combined.
Also, your maths relies on good data. China has 4 deaths p million , India has 400, and US 3,000. UK is also about 3,000 p MiL. So yr 8m could easily be 20+m.
"
But fundamental error one, this person is talking about mortality while arguing that morbidity isn't a problem.
They're not the same thing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. that's slightly miss representative. The covid numbers factor in all the steps taken to reduce deaths. And even then it's almost 2x more deadly than the next two other infectious diseases combined.
Also, your maths relies on good data. China has 4 deaths p million , India has 400, and US 3,000. UK is also about 3,000 p MiL. So yr 8m could easily be 20+m.
But fundamental error one, this person is talking about mortality while arguing that morbidity isn't a problem.
They're not the same thing."
their numbers tie up (ish) with WHO mortality. I'm assuming they meant mortality but either mistyped or don't know there is a difference. |
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"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio? High morbidity rates. Nonsense. There is a population of just over 8B on the planet. 1% of this population is 80M. Officially on WHO stats just short of 8M deaths from, with,by Covid have occurred. So 10% of 1% of the whole population has died or alternatively 99.90% did not die. For some comparisons and again I base my stats on WHO figures 1M die each year from HIV and another 1.5M die from TB each year. Thats 5M over two years. But we don't lie awake at night worrying about these deaths and we don't highlight these deaths in the media or have lockdowns. Covid is not the gigantic killer its portrayed as . Its long since time we stopped being afraid and just got on with living. that's slightly miss representative. The covid numbers factor in all the steps taken to reduce deaths. And even then it's almost 2x more deadly than the next two other infectious diseases combined.
Also, your maths relies on good data. China has 4 deaths p million , India has 400, and US 3,000. UK is also about 3,000 p MiL. So yr 8m could easily be 20+m.
But fundamental error one, this person is talking about mortality while arguing that morbidity isn't a problem.
They're not the same thing. their numbers tie up (ish) with WHO mortality. I'm assuming they meant mortality but either mistyped or don't know there is a difference. "
I think it's a crucial difference that needs to be clarified to understand the potential scale of the problem.
I also find it's a difference that's often conflated in these discussions - that only X are dying, so Y developing long term health problems is impossible.
It's not. And although it's a nice sleight of hand to undermine the evidence, we shouldn't let it slide. |
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"Infection rates only went down after mask mandates ended in the uk.
You can't correlate that too many variables and also lags in any data. The highest infection rate was when there was no mask mandate march/april 2020. It really is very very basic science why masks slow infection. It has been explained on here many many times.
Basic or not the science never supported mask mandates. The issue has been looked at for 30+ years in people medical professionals, people trained in the proper fitting and timely disposal of masks. Cloth masks in most of the studies have negative efficacy because their filtration rate is close to zero and they get wet and contaminated very quickly. Imagine a petri dish of bacteria growing on a cloth strapped to your face. They are actually an infection risk. Surgical masks have giant gaps around the nose and other places. They are supposed to be strictly single use.
The way the general public were using masks, or reusing them and putting their grubby hands all over them is akin to reusing the same piece of toilet paper day after day and trying to stay clean. Biologically they are filthy. The whole thing was just an exercise in the absurd.
And to top it off infection rates plunged after people stopped wearing them. That wasn't supposed to happen according to the talking heads."
The infection rates were dropping for about 2 to 3 weeks prior to the mask mandate stopping on 27th January they continued to drop for 2 weeks after that they then spiked to an all time high for a couple of weeks before gradually dropping off. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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When is self diagnosis acceptable. When both vaers and Long Covid stats are both backed up by it then both sets of stats should be treated with the same caution, unless you’ve got a dog in the fight it appears. |
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"When is self diagnosis acceptable. When both vaers and Long Covid stats are both backed up by it then both sets of stats should be treated with the same caution, unless you’ve got a dog in the fight it appears."
This study looks at the alteration of myeloid cells.
How would one self diagnose that? |
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By *I TwoCouple
over a year ago
PDI 12-26th Nov 24 |
"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face."
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol |
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By *tud8614Man
over a year ago
south west |
Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare. |
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"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare."
The people hospitalised by RSV in Sweden in 2021 and 2022 are sure interesting... |
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"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare."
Your point around the general health, lifestyle, inactivity and demographic of population is very significant. And as you say... Not even being talked about let alone addressed. |
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"I love the way these degenerate into binary for those who choose to ignore. It's either carry on and ignore it, make no behavioural changes, don't wash hands or consider others, survival of the fittest when Ill. Or... Youre a yellow chicken cowering behind a sofa and hiding from life. There doesn't seem any nuance or ability to find any reasonably balanced ground. "
Voice of reason. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare."
Long Covid- doesn’t discriminate, most patients in the Uk were fit, healthy, 40-50 years of age and active. Even subclinical infections ( only picked up by testing) have triggered LC. So unfortunately, whilst definitely needed, helping the demographic with ill health that you have mentioned- is not going to have a huge impact on Covid morbidity |
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"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare.
Long Covid- doesn’t discriminate, most patients in the Uk were fit, healthy, 40-50 years of age and active. Even subclinical infections ( only picked up by testing) have triggered LC. So unfortunately, whilst definitely needed, helping the demographic with ill health that you have mentioned- is not going to have a huge impact on Covid morbidity "
For most of these is it long covid or hypochondria? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It is the biggest transfer of wealth from the working class to the rich...... sorry super rich ever.
Example,
Wolf of Wall Street, "ho no there has been a computer hack 50 million has been taken by hackers the investors have all lost their money"
Scene cut to hack companies CEO, getting on a private plane to a corrupt banker with..... the missing money.
Anyone see anything in that, spark a memory maybe.
"Ever think we are being conned?" Jonny Rotten. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It is the biggest transfer of wealth from the working class to the rich...... sorry super rich ever.
Example,
Wolf of Wall Street, "ho no there has been a computer hack 50 million has been taken by hackers the investors have all lost their money"
Scene cut to hack companies CEO, getting on a private plane to a corrupt banker with..... the missing money.
Anyone see anything in that, spark a memory maybe.
"Ever think we are being conned?" Jonny Rotten."
What Johnny Rotten actually said was 'ever feel like you've been cheated?' 1978 winter land concert USA.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It is the biggest transfer of wealth from the working class to the rich...... sorry super rich ever.
Example,
Wolf of Wall Street, "ho no there has been a computer hack 50 million has been taken by hackers the investors have all lost their money"
Scene cut to hack companies CEO, getting on a private plane to a corrupt banker with..... the missing money.
Anyone see anything in that, spark a memory maybe.
"Ever think we are being conned?" Jonny Rotten.
What Johnny Rotten actually said was 'ever feel like you've been cheated?' 1978 winter land concert USA. "
You got the meaning |
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"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) "
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book) |
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By *I TwoCouple
over a year ago
PDI 12-26th Nov 24 |
"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking)
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book) "
Good grief, things are bad when Sweden is dragged into it again lol |
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"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking)
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book) "
Do they have just eat and deliveroo... The proponents of Heart health delivered to your door.? |
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"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking)
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book)
Good grief, things are bad when Sweden is dragged into it again lol"
I notice they never pick a comparable country to Sweden like Norway or Finland. |
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"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking)
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book)
Good grief, things are bad when Sweden is dragged into it again lol
I notice they never pick a comparable country to Sweden like Norway or Finland."
Indeed.
Or the huge RSV waves in Sweden. I thought they'd have reduced or no immunity debt because they didn't lock down. |
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By *aussageMan
over a year ago
Stalbridge |
"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol"
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions. |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions. "
What were the politics? |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions.
What were the politics? "
Politics were involved all the decisions and so they should be. If you went with science would have been harsher lockdowns and mandates. You have consider human behavior which is where politics can come in. No mask mandate in the beginning was political yes, they needed the limited amount of masks for the health services. The decision to end the mask mandate earlier than science wanted to was political too. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare.
Long Covid- doesn’t discriminate, most patients in the Uk were fit, healthy, 40-50 years of age and active. Even subclinical infections ( only picked up by testing) have triggered LC. So unfortunately, whilst definitely needed, helping the demographic with ill health that you have mentioned- is not going to have a huge impact on Covid morbidity
For most of these is it long covid or hypochondria?"
Following from a previous thread Prof Iwasaki’s work shows a strong correlation between clinical signs and biochemical/ haematological markers of LC. It is being refined but unfortunately most of these patients do not have hypochondria. LC is treated as an occupational risk in the US not a psychological disorder .
Many LC suffers probably have Covid virus at very low replicating rates in various tissues and it is currently a very hot topic of debate with regard to organ donation because they has been documented cases of recipient infections through organ donation even though the donor screened negative on PCR.
So whilst more is being discovered- it is a physiological rather than psychological process- while we continue to think we can ‘live’ with this virus- LC suffers continuously battle with Covid in them( albeit at low levels- but still pathological)
|
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Face coverings work in certain settings but only to a point, as the virus mutates to become more infectious the effectiveness has dropped off massively.
The underlying reason for high death rates in the UK, US and certain other countries compared to, for example Sweden, is the underlying health and lifestyle of the population.
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking) population.
Until the underlying issues are tackled (and they won't be as no politician has the guts to do what's needed to do it) the issue remains.
To the poster who mentioned Polio. We don't love with Polio because it was eradicated by vaccination programs. The problem is the amount of false information, which mainly started from the fake MMR scare.
Long Covid- doesn’t discriminate, most patients in the Uk were fit, healthy, 40-50 years of age and active. Even subclinical infections ( only picked up by testing) have triggered LC. So unfortunately, whilst definitely needed, helping the demographic with ill health that you have mentioned- is not going to have a huge impact on Covid morbidity
For most of these is it long covid or hypochondria?
Following from a previous thread Prof Iwasaki’s work shows a strong correlation between clinical signs and biochemical/ haematological markers of LC. It is being refined but unfortunately most of these patients do not have hypochondria. LC is treated as an occupational risk in the US not a psychological disorder .
Many LC suffers probably have Covid virus at very low replicating rates in various tissues and it is currently a very hot topic of debate with regard to organ donation because they has been documented cases of recipient infections through organ donation even though the donor screened negative on PCR.
So whilst more is being discovered- it is a physiological rather than psychological process- while we continue to think we can ‘live’ with this virus- LC suffers continuously battle with Covid in them( albeit at low levels- but still pathological)
"
Foot notes- without belittling hypochondria- at least it is a treatable condition for many- whereas LC has no known treatment so far. |
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By *hagTonightMan
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"Yes we could, just like any other ones that we have had, there are more viruses than stars in the universe.
But this and other studies show Covid has a high morbidity rate - do we live with similar high morbidity rate viruses eg Polio?
So what is your solution OP? Hide away put life on hold ?? Either way covid isn't going away anytime soon so living with it is the only way to live life "
Yes, one could question those studies. I will continue like I did before, business as usual |
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"
Sweden did not lock down and has escaped the levels of morbidity due to a younger,yes, but also much healthier (broadly speaking)
Sweden actually has an older population than the UK, the median age in years being 41.1 and ours being 40.2. (Source: 2020 figures from CIA World Fact Book)
Do they have just eat and deliveroo... The proponents of Heart health delivered to your door.? "
I am sure you could Google it. My point was about age. If people are going to make assertions using something as black and white as the relative age of different populations as part of their evidence, I believe they should be factually accurate. I happened to know that the UK has a younger population than many of our European neighbours, which was a surprise to me when I found out, hence I noticed this error. I have come to the conclusion, arguing about vaccines and Covid is fun but essentially pointless. We all make decisions. Mine was to get vaccinated and trust there is no great global conspiracy. I don’t care what others do. |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions.
What were the politics?
Politics were involved all the decisions and so they should be. If you went with science would have been harsher lockdowns and mandates. You have consider human behavior which is where politics can come in. No mask mandate in the beginning was political yes, they needed the limited amount of masks for the health services. The decision to end the mask mandate earlier than science wanted to was political too. "
What politics were driving the mask mandates? |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions.
What were the politics?
Politics were involved all the decisions and so they should be. If you went with science would have been harsher lockdowns and mandates. You have consider human behavior which is where politics can come in. No mask mandate in the beginning was political yes, they needed the limited amount of masks for the health services. The decision to end the mask mandate earlier than science wanted to was political too.
What politics were driving the mask mandates? "
It was popular with the public to end the mask mandate earlier than the science was saying. That was a political decision. |
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"Mandatory masking? Only n95 or greater masks statically offer any protection. The rest is simply virtue signalling, or a visual symbol that shows your obedience to the state.
Mask mandates had almost no impact on infection rates anywhere. But this should come as no surprise since cloth masks don't really filter anything and surgical masks usually aren't that well fitted around the face.
You say that dispite having been presented with the results of several independent verified studies into the effectiveness of face coverings repeatedly over the last two years.
It's as if you prefer religion over science lol
At the end of the pandemic Dr fauci said if you wanted protection you should be wearing an n95 mask. But it has to be well fitted. Strapping any random piece of cloth to your face will do nothing.
Well this is no surprise, this is what 30+ years of scientific literate before the pandemic said. It was politics not science driving these mask mandates decisions.
What were the politics?
Politics were involved all the decisions and so they should be. If you went with science would have been harsher lockdowns and mandates. You have consider human behavior which is where politics can come in. No mask mandate in the beginning was political yes, they needed the limited amount of masks for the health services. The decision to end the mask mandate earlier than science wanted to was political too.
What politics were driving the mask mandates? "
Decisions which were in part political in nature:
Where do we mandate masks? (Masks were first mandated on public transport, which affected a smaller group. People really got mad when it was extended to shops)
What does it mean to mandate (or, how do exemptions work)?
What age groups are required to mask? (Why 11+? In some countries it was 2+)
What kind of masks are acceptable? (In some parts of Europe there was an FFP2 minimum)
And more besides. Part of the decision making process was about what they believed people would accept or what they believed would be least unpopular. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Did you actually read the paper? It has nothing to do with immunity - it suggests a link between CV19 and increased risk of blood clots. Which we know about. It’s not seminal in any sense of the word and certainly says nothing about repeat infections… |
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"Did you actually read the paper? It has nothing to do with immunity - it suggests a link between CV19 and increased risk of blood clots. Which we know about. It’s not seminal in any sense of the word and certainly says nothing about repeat infections…"
Did you read the paper? It has everything to do with immunity, and is seminal in that it explains the mechanisms for the immune system being seriously fucked by covid. Of course, it isn't written for laymen to read - you do have to understand a lot of polysyllabic words and know something about how science works, otherwise the paper is just random noise... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals… |
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…"
If you actually read the paper past the abstract... To quote just a couple of phrases...
"Monocytes are blood-circulating, phagocytic, innate immune leukocytes with important functions in pathogen sensing, and innate and adaptive immune response activation during viral infection."
"Moreover, in agreement with the altered HLA and costimulatory receptor profile of COVID-19 monocytes, we observed an impairment in their capacity to activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ and CD8+ T cells (Supplementary Fig. 2). Thus, CD14+ monocytes from both mild and moderate COVID-19 patients were able to efficiently activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD8+ T cells upon UV-inactivated SARS-CoV-2 stimulation. However, only CD14+ monocytes from healthy individuals were able to trigger the activation of SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ T cells."
Or in other words, covid fucks with monocytes, monocytes are important to the immune system, hence covid fucks with the immune system.
Whether the details of the mechanism are precisely as per this paper, or if this description is only part of the picture, we have the clearly observable effect on the global population. More people are getting sick and dying of minor or previously rare illnesses than they were two years ago.
Here's the kicker though. If I'm wrong and am being too cautious in my current behaviour, in a couple of years I'll be forced to admit I've been a bit of a tit and missed out on going to a few parties and stuff. But if you're wrong and are not being cautious enough in your current behaviour, in a couple of years you'll be seriously disabled or dead and be permanently missing out on going to parties and stuff. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Well, I’ve never tested positive for covid so perhaps I’ll be ok. It’s a fair bet though - you say the world will end (as, by your logic, the majority of the world’s population will be disabled in a few years (something no infective agent has ever done)) and I say the population will hold.
See you in 2026? |
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"Well-paid. Covid is nowirse than the flu and all this scare mongering is getting tiresome this post has no place on a fuck site"
And yet, here you are posting on a thread in the Virus forum.
If the subject bores you, just avoid it. *Adulting 101.
Best get rid of politics, biking, camping and games while your at it by your logic.
Winston
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…
If you actually read the paper past the abstract... To quote just a couple of phrases...
"Monocytes are blood-circulating, phagocytic, innate immune leukocytes with important functions in pathogen sensing, and innate and adaptive immune response activation during viral infection."
"Moreover, in agreement with the altered HLA and costimulatory receptor profile of COVID-19 monocytes, we observed an impairment in their capacity to activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ and CD8+ T cells (Supplementary Fig. 2). Thus, CD14+ monocytes from both mild and moderate COVID-19 patients were able to efficiently activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD8+ T cells upon UV-inactivated SARS-CoV-2 stimulation. However, only CD14+ monocytes from healthy individuals were able to trigger the activation of SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ T cells."
Or in other words, covid fucks with monocytes, monocytes are important to the immune system, hence covid fucks with the immune system.
Whether the details of the mechanism are precisely as per this paper, or if this description is only part of the picture, we have the clearly observable effect on the global population. More people are getting sick and dying of minor or previously rare illnesses than they were two years ago.
Here's the kicker though. If I'm wrong and am being too cautious in my current behaviour, in a couple of years I'll be forced to admit I've been a bit of a tit and missed out on going to a few parties and stuff. But if you're wrong and are not being cautious enough in your current behaviour, in a couple of years you'll be seriously disabled or dead and be permanently missing out on going to parties and stuff."
If that's the case then you'll still be missing out on parties cause covid is going nowhere. Just means I'll have had a few years of fun before the wheels fall off.
|
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…"
Winston |
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…
If you actually read the paper past the abstract... To quote just a couple of phrases...
"Monocytes are blood-circulating, phagocytic, innate immune leukocytes with important functions in pathogen sensing, and innate and adaptive immune response activation during viral infection."
"Moreover, in agreement with the altered HLA and costimulatory receptor profile of COVID-19 monocytes, we observed an impairment in their capacity to activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ and CD8+ T cells (Supplementary Fig. 2). Thus, CD14+ monocytes from both mild and moderate COVID-19 patients were able to efficiently activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD8+ T cells upon UV-inactivated SARS-CoV-2 stimulation. However, only CD14+ monocytes from healthy individuals were able to trigger the activation of SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ T cells."
Or in other words, covid fucks with monocytes, monocytes are important to the immune system, hence covid fucks with the immune system.
Whether the details of the mechanism are precisely as per this paper, or if this description is only part of the picture, we have the clearly observable effect on the global population. More people are getting sick and dying of minor or previously rare illnesses than they were two years ago.
Here's the kicker though. If I'm wrong and am being too cautious in my current behaviour, in a couple of years I'll be forced to admit I've been a bit of a tit and missed out on going to a few parties and stuff. But if you're wrong and are not being cautious enough in your current behaviour, in a couple of years you'll be seriously disabled or dead and be permanently missing out on going to parties and stuff.If that's the case then you'll still be missing out on parties cause covid is going nowhere. Just means I'll have had a few years of fun before the wheels fall off.
"
Like most other diseases in history, covid will get under control once all the stupid have died off. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…"
Please explain how Monocytes have nothing to do with our immunity . I certainly would’nt live without them. |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"TBF the paper doesn't tell us much more than we already know.
It makes a good read but so do many other papers but thanks for your posting."
TBF- novels can be a good read, scientific papers are often turgid and mind boggling with statistics - and this paper is no different.
However it’s their conclusions that have huge ramifications. But I wouldn’t call it a good read. |
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"The jab has killed over hundred thousand people so far and maimed many more, just because some people have had it and are ok for now doesn't mean this experimental jab is safe !! "
Nope. Not even close to true.
Over 100,000 killed by "the" jab is abject nonsense.
Start with "the" jab (singular) and move on from there.
Winston |
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"The jab has killed over hundred thousand people so far and maimed many more, just because some people have had it and are ok for now doesn't mean this experimental jab is safe !!
Nope. Not even close to true.
Over 100,000 killed by "the" jab is abject nonsense.
Start with "the" jab (singular) and move on from there.
Winston "
We need to bring back the expression "so wrong, it's not even wrong" |
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"TBF the paper doesn't tell us much more than we already know.
It makes a good read but so do many other papers but thanks for your posting.
TBF- novels can be a good read, scientific papers are often turgid and mind boggling with statistics - and this paper is no different.
However it’s their conclusions that have huge ramifications. But I wouldn’t call it a good read. "
Thanks for your reply.
Maybe good was a wrong word but I found it interesting.
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…
If you actually read the paper past the abstract... To quote just a couple of phrases...
"Monocytes are blood-circulating, phagocytic, innate immune leukocytes with important functions in pathogen sensing, and innate and adaptive immune response activation during viral infection."
"Moreover, in agreement with the altered HLA and costimulatory receptor profile of COVID-19 monocytes, we observed an impairment in their capacity to activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ and CD8+ T cells (Supplementary Fig. 2). Thus, CD14+ monocytes from both mild and moderate COVID-19 patients were able to efficiently activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD8+ T cells upon UV-inactivated SARS-CoV-2 stimulation. However, only CD14+ monocytes from healthy individuals were able to trigger the activation of SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ T cells."
Or in other words, covid fucks with monocytes, monocytes are important to the immune system, hence covid fucks with the immune system.
Whether the details of the mechanism are precisely as per this paper, or if this description is only part of the picture, we have the clearly observable effect on the global population. More people are getting sick and dying of minor or previously rare illnesses than they were two years ago.
Here's the kicker though. If I'm wrong and am being too cautious in my current behaviour, in a couple of years I'll be forced to admit I've been a bit of a tit and missed out on going to a few parties and stuff. But if you're wrong and are not being cautious enough in your current behaviour, in a couple of years you'll be seriously disabled or dead and be permanently missing out on going to parties and stuff.If that's the case then you'll still be missing out on parties cause covid is going nowhere. Just means I'll have had a few years of fun before the wheels fall off.
Like most other diseases in history, covid will get under control once all the stupid have died off."
Yes, cause intelligence level is a guide to how your body fights off a virus. I don't feel as bad now for all those deaths in the UK. Must just be the idiots. I'd keep isolating if I was you, clearly at risk  |
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"Ok, the title of the paper is Transcriptional reprogramming from innate immune functions to a pro-thrombotic signature by monocytes in COVID-19. The abstract details the altered expression of monocyte proteins to lead to a pro-thrombotic state. This has nothing to do with immunity! And I know how to read a paper and peer review for a number of high IF journals…
If you actually read the paper past the abstract... To quote just a couple of phrases...
"Monocytes are blood-circulating, phagocytic, innate immune leukocytes with important functions in pathogen sensing, and innate and adaptive immune response activation during viral infection."
"Moreover, in agreement with the altered HLA and costimulatory receptor profile of COVID-19 monocytes, we observed an impairment in their capacity to activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ and CD8+ T cells (Supplementary Fig. 2). Thus, CD14+ monocytes from both mild and moderate COVID-19 patients were able to efficiently activate SARS-CoV-2-specific CD8+ T cells upon UV-inactivated SARS-CoV-2 stimulation. However, only CD14+ monocytes from healthy individuals were able to trigger the activation of SARS-CoV-2-specific CD4+ T cells."
Or in other words, covid fucks with monocytes, monocytes are important to the immune system, hence covid fucks with the immune system.
Whether the details of the mechanism are precisely as per this paper, or if this description is only part of the picture, we have the clearly observable effect on the global population. More people are getting sick and dying of minor or previously rare illnesses than they were two years ago.
Here's the kicker though. If I'm wrong and am being too cautious in my current behaviour, in a couple of years I'll be forced to admit I've been a bit of a tit and missed out on going to a few parties and stuff. But if you're wrong and are not being cautious enough in your current behaviour, in a couple of years you'll be seriously disabled or dead and be permanently missing out on going to parties and stuff.If that's the case then you'll still be missing out on parties cause covid is going nowhere. Just means I'll have had a few years of fun before the wheels fall off.
Like most other diseases in history, covid will get under control once all the stupid have died off.Yes, cause intelligence level is a guide to how your body fights off a virus. I don't feel as bad now for all those deaths in the UK. Must just be the idiots. I'd keep isolating if I was you, clearly at risk "
Stupidity is a guide to how the individual doesn't bother with simple protective measures to avoid exposure to diseases in the first place. Although all deaths are tragic, I am getting so that I don't feel as bad now for those that deliberately ignored all health advice. They were idiots. I'm going to keep interacting with other people, but just use a little common sense to avoid being at risk |
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You can follow every precaution short of locking yourself in a bubble and still end up with covid so your logic about it being "stupid people" doesnt track, attitudes like that are why this topic is so divisive and is no different to loons claiming its the 5g causing it. You do you though  |
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"https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-.
This is a brilliant read in the BMJ
https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2021/09/13/covid-19-and-the-new-merchants-of-doubt/
With so much misinformation about - it really has impacted on public health strategies
"
No ulterior motives from the author's honestly.....
Competing interests: GY has received research funding from Gavi, the Vaccine Alliance (Gavi) and the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation |
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By *orset.J OP Man
over a year ago
Weymouth |
"https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-.
This is a brilliant read in the BMJ
https://blogs.bmj.com/bmj/2021/09/13/covid-19-and-the-new-merchants-of-doubt/
With so much misinformation about - it really has impacted on public health strategies
No ulterior motives from the author's honestly.....
Competing interests: GY has received research funding from Gavi, the Vaccine Alliance (Gavi) and the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation"
Are you suggesting it was wrong of the BMJ to publish this, can you point to anything which is factually incorrect. |
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