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Rejecting the vaccine
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future  | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Amazing what you can find out on Facebook these days. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Your covid/vaccine/communist government posts get more funny by the day. Thanks, really brings a smile to my face.  | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Nope... it just dropped back down again.  | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again. " | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again. "I may have howled out loud at that response! | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " News being suppressed...... But somehow a couple on a swingers site are fully aware and have all the details. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit." Such self righteous smugness. Amazing Sir !!! | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future "Out of interest. What science are they listening too? Is it the likelihood of a 16 year old catching and having bad symptoms / dying from covid? Compared to the likelihood of a side effect. Or are we still using scientific terms like "rare" "unusual" "small". It's been authorised for use...and that's all well and good. But let's see a bit of precise detail about why it's necessary rather than these bullyboy blandishments that science says it's safe and we think it's a good thing. We must have that info right? So as an example..(numbers made up) Chances of a 16 year old having long covid or hospitalisation from covid 1 in 100000 Chances of a 16 year old having a serious reaction to vaccine... 1 in 200000. An infected 16 yera old would normally infect 10 other people.. A vaccinated 16 year old would infect 5 other people. An informed decision can now be made. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future
Out of interest. What science are they listening too? Is it the likelihood of a 16 year old catching and having bad symptoms / dying from covid? Compared to the likelihood of a side effect. Or are we still using scientific terms like "rare" "unusual" "small".
It's been authorised for use...and that's all well and good. But let's see a bit of precise detail about why it's necessary rather than these bullyboy blandishments that science says it's safe and we think it's a good thing. We must have that info right?
So as an example..(numbers made up)
Chances of a 16 year old having long covid or hospitalisation from covid 1 in 100000
Chances of a 16 year old having a serious reaction to vaccine... 1 in 200000.
An infected 16 yera old would normally infect 10 other people..
A vaccinated 16 year old would infect 5 other people.
An informed decision can now be made. "I have no idea what sources they're listening to. The sources I'm listening to (virologists, an immunologist, and an infectious disease doctor, in the main) suggest that the vaccination is much lower risk - even when only considering themselves - than Covid. The most recent figure I heard was 1 in 25 children suffer long Covid (although I appreciate that that phenomenon remains poorly defined) while 1 in 100k suffer side effects lasting up to two days (myocarditis related) from the vaccination. (I appreciate that it's a moveable feast because this is all fairly new) | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Nope, not true, a nonsense spread by those who can not comprehend the yellow card system. | |||
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"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community. There they were quickly silenced, but now have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots. Umberto Eco " I love a bit of Umberto Eco. Foucault's Pendulum obviously, but the most recent I enjoyed was Baudolino - apt in a way, with its unreliable narrator telling an unbelievable story. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again.
I may have howled out loud at that response! " | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future
Out of interest. What science are they listening too? Is it the likelihood of a 16 year old catching and having bad symptoms / dying from covid? Compared to the likelihood of a side effect. Or are we still using scientific terms like "rare" "unusual" "small".
It's been authorised for use...and that's all well and good. But let's see a bit of precise detail about why it's necessary rather than these bullyboy blandishments that science says it's safe and we think it's a good thing. We must have that info right?
So as an example..(numbers made up)
Chances of a 16 year old having long covid or hospitalisation from covid 1 in 100000
Chances of a 16 year old having a serious reaction to vaccine... 1 in 200000.
An infected 16 yera old would normally infect 10 other people..
A vaccinated 16 year old would infect 5 other people.
An informed decision can now be made.
I have no idea what sources they're listening to. The sources I'm listening to (virologists, an immunologist, and an infectious disease doctor, in the main) suggest that the vaccination is much lower risk - even when only considering themselves - than Covid.
The most recent figure I heard was 1 in 25 children suffer long Covid (although I appreciate that that phenomenon remains poorly defined) while 1 in 100k suffer side effects lasting up to two days (myocarditis related) from the vaccination. (I appreciate that it's a moveable feast because this is all fairly new)"There we go again with the science... "much lower"... That's a non defined immeasurable non Scientific measure. If they know its lower... They will have taken a Comoaritive..so how much lower.... Just tell us. They have it... They must have it .. So just tell us. As for 1 in 25 having long covid.... Let's for the sake of argument say that's backed up by a peer reviewed scientific study.... But the 25 will be infected.? So to have a proper comparison we need to know the number of 16 year olds who are infected AND develop long covid or serious symptoms. At the moment infection numbers for all age groups are something like.... 275 per 100000. (source gov covid daily report). So let's say for the sake of argument 10 per cent of all infections are 16 year olds... (that's very generous)... So that would be 27.5 per 100000. And 1 in 25 infected 16 year olds develop long covid (to the best of our knowledge) which roughly is 1 in 100k 16 year olds. Which is the same number as the side effect number you mention. The numbers should be made public and people can "use the science" to make an informed decision rather than be bullied by the uninformed hysteria. | |||
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"There is no definite number. There are studies, and there's the best data available, and there's the interpretation of the data. People are doing the best they can to figure this out. It's not black and white, very little is. This is all very new, scientifically, and people are demanding incredible precision at speed. Numbers will change as we know more, and as the definition and understanding of long Covid (and mechanisms of vaccine induced myocarditis) change. It's also interesting that you assume that an unvaccinated teenager will escape catching Covid - that seems pretty unlikely to me, particularly with lack of mitigation in English schools. So it's not "one in 25 out of those infected", it's "one in 25 suffer for six+ weeks or one in 100k suffer for up to two days. Pick one" Yes these numbers will change, yes there's uncertainty, but that's how science works. That's how we get at the truth - not inventing a "fact" because people demand it. Hang on a minute. Let's just do a quick sanity check on those numbers... Youre saying 1 in 25 16 year olds will catch covid and have long covid symptoms. 1 in 25 is equivalent to 4000 per 100k.(which is the way gov publish infection stats per 100k) That's actually 15 times bigger than all infections for all age groups. Given that currently infection rates are 275 per 100k across the UK. " Err. I think you misunderstand. If a child catches Covid, they have a 1 in 25 chance of developing long Covid. So if 2500 kids catch Covid, if these figures are representative, 100 will suffer symptoms for at least six weeks. If 25000000 children catch Covid, a million will suffer symptoms for at least six weeks. If 2500 kids get vaccinated, it's unlikely any will have any serious side effects. If 25 million kids are vaccinated, 250 will suffer symptoms up to 2 days. If a child is not vaccinated, there's very little to stop them getting Covid. Which group is safer to be in? | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit." On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again. "And you just won this thread  | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”?" Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"!" Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? | |||
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"So the science is not yet precise enough but we are expected to believe and trust the science.? That's not a strong argument. I've had my. Jabs by the way so I'm not anti vaxx. But I am chellenging the current hysteria that seems to say everybody must be jabbed just because we say so... When a compelling case has not yet been made public, and when that is pointed out... People fall back on yeah but its all new so how can scientists possibly know. They either know and have a compelling case or they don't and are guessing. " This isn't a guess. It's data. It's not complete data, but if you want complete data then we should throw out 99% of what we think we know. Vaccines are shit, but so are cars, bacon, flying - everything has uncertainty. This is (one example I remember off the top of my head) one set of data of people using the best methods, checked by others who know what they're talking about. There are others. They'll be collated. In years we'll know more and be more certain, but never fully certain. We don't have years. We could be sentencing kids to a lifetime of disability by hemming and hawing. Vaccine long term effects almost exclusively emerge within two months - plenty of kids have been jabbed that long. Virus side effects can lurk for decades - shingles, or the explosion of Parkinson's following the 1918 pandemic. If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it?" did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”?" I'm sorry you've not seen the countless instances of the other camp doing it. | |||
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"Toxic debates need a vaccine " Why is this toxic? Since when has people having difference of opinion beeb toxic? | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. " I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again. "Blame their lack of an improved 4g signal | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? " I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. | |||
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"Has the experimental injection been thoroughly tested? Not at all! The FDA vaccines and related biological products advisory committee decided to approve this experimental vaccine for emergency use only. Those that are supposed to keep you safe felt in unnecessary to see how the jab affects your brain, kidneys, lungs, liver or heart! No studies were done to see how the injection reacts with other drugs you make be taking! No toxicity studies were done on a single dose! No toxicokinetic studies have been performed with the vaccine to see how these chemical react once they get into your body No Genotoxicity studies were done to see if any of the vaccine chemicals damage your DNA No carcinogenicity studies were done to determine wether these substances in the vaccines cause cancer! They have no idea if the vaccines are safe for pregnant woman! No studies were done to see how the vaccines affect prenatal and post natal develop in mums or new borns No studies were done to find out what happens when couples get the injections and any subsequent children they may have also received the shot! Look at all these No’s! I’m sorry but a trial on a few thousand people for several months doesn’t give me much and many on millions of people worldwide total amount confidence " And you learned of this information from where? | |||
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"Has the experimental injection been thoroughly tested? Not at all! The FDA vaccines and related biological products advisory committee decided to approve this experimental vaccine for emergency use only. Those that are supposed to keep you safe felt in unnecessary to see how the jab affects your brain, kidneys, lungs, liver or heart! No studies were done to see how the injection reacts with other drugs you make be taking! No toxicity studies were done on a single dose! No toxicokinetic studies have been performed with the vaccine to see how these chemical react once they get into your body No Genotoxicity studies were done to see if any of the vaccine chemicals damage your DNA No carcinogenicity studies were done to determine wether these substances in the vaccines cause cancer! They have no idea if the vaccines are safe for pregnant woman! No studies were done to see how the vaccines affect prenatal and post natal develop in mums or new borns No studies were done to find out what happens when couples get the injections and any subsequent children they may have also received the shot! Look at all these No’s! I’m sorry but a trial on a few thousand people for several months doesn’t give me much and many on millions of people worldwide total confidence " You'll be delighted to know that Pfizer - the vaccine being discussed in kids - is set for full FDA approval next month. The same FDA that has phase 4 trials of Pfizer (the icky and nefarious and scary "post marketing safety monitoring") until 2023. That's cited a lot. I'm sure given how much people trust the FDA to show how icky and nefarious the vaccine is, they'll not be wildly inconsistent and will concede that the vaccine is, indeed, regarded as safe 
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/fda-aiming-give-final-approval-pfizer-vaccine-by-early-next-month-ny-times-2021-08-03/ | |||
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"People who are either vaccinated or non vaccinated can die from Covid 19. Its not a miracle cure its just lowers the chance of you being crucially ill from Covid 19. I wish there was a vaccine for these toxic debates. " I think the vaccine for these as you say are facts. .. Accurate facts. And not emotion or judgement. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant." And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? | |||
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"So the science is not yet precise enough but we are expected to believe and trust the science.? That's not a strong argument. I've had my. Jabs by the way so I'm not anti vaxx. But I am chellenging the current hysteria that seems to say everybody must be jabbed just because we say so... When a compelling case has not yet been made public, and when that is pointed out... People fall back on yeah but its all new so how can scientists possibly know. They either know and have a compelling case or they don't and are guessing. This isn't a guess. It's data. It's not complete data, but if you want complete data then we should throw out 99% of what we think we know. Vaccines are shit, but so are cars, bacon, flying - everything has uncertainty. This is (one example I remember off the top of my head) one set of data of people using the best methods, checked by others who know what they're talking about. There are others. They'll be collated. In years we'll know more and be more certain, but never fully certain. We don't have years. We could be sentencing kids to a lifetime of disability by hemming and hawing. Vaccine long term effects almost exclusively emerge within two months - plenty of kids have been jabbed that long. Virus side effects can lurk for decades - shingles, or the explosion of Parkinson's following the 1918 pandemic. If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. " Nope... Not ever suggested certainty. What I've said is... For scientists to use terms like "lower" "small risk" "almost hardly ever" is just to sell a story. For them to establish a position that "a is lower than b" then they must have at some point seen some facts. So let's see the facts. What is a and what is b? That's all. Let's not use words and inflate them because a scientist said lower. Just tell us how much lower and tell us honestly what you know to be true and what is still being worked on. It's not hard. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Nope... it just dropped back down again.
I may have howled out loud at that response! "As did I.  | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”?" Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future
Out of interest. What science are they listening too? Is it the likelihood of a 16 year old catching and having bad symptoms / dying from covid? Compared to the likelihood of a side effect. Or are we still using scientific terms like "rare" "unusual" "small".
It's been authorised for use...and that's all well and good. But let's see a bit of precise detail about why it's necessary rather than these bullyboy blandishments that science says it's safe and we think it's a good thing. We must have that info right?
So as an example..(numbers made up)
Chances of a 16 year old having long covid or hospitalisation from covid 1 in 100000
Chances of a 16 year old having a serious reaction to vaccine... 1 in 200000.
An infected 16 yera old would normally infect 10 other people..
A vaccinated 16 year old would infect 5 other people.
An informed decision can now be made.
I have no idea what sources they're listening to. The sources I'm listening to (virologists, an immunologist, and an infectious disease doctor, in the main) suggest that the vaccination is much lower risk - even when only considering themselves - than Covid.
The most recent figure I heard was 1 in 25 children suffer long Covid (although I appreciate that that phenomenon remains poorly defined) while 1 in 100k suffer side effects lasting up to two days (myocarditis related) from the vaccination. (I appreciate that it's a moveable feast because this is all fairly new)
There we go again with the science... "much lower"... That's a non defined immeasurable non Scientific measure. If they know its lower... They will have taken a Comoaritive..so how much lower.... Just tell us. They have it... They must have it
.. So just tell us.
As for 1 in 25 having long covid.... Let's for the sake of argument say that's backed up by a peer reviewed scientific study.... But the 25 will be infected.? So to have a proper comparison we need to know the number of 16 year olds who are infected AND develop long covid or serious symptoms. At the moment infection numbers for all age groups are something like.... 275 per 100000. (source gov covid daily report).
So let's say for the sake of argument 10 per cent of all infections are 16 year olds... (that's very generous)... So that would be 27.5 per 100000.
And 1 in 25 infected 16 year olds develop long covid (to the best of our knowledge) which roughly is 1 in 100k 16 year olds. Which is the same number as the side effect number you mention.
The numbers should be made public and people can "use the science" to make an informed decision rather than be bullied by the uninformed hysteria. "I think you will find that your arithmetic is incorrect and misleading. According to ONS figures there are approximately 1.5 million 16 year olds in the UK. Your calculation appears to show that only 1 in 100,000 16 year olds will develop long covid. This equates to no more than 15 cases of long covid in the entire UK 16 year old population. I think you may find that there are already more than that within this age group that have had serious symptoms caused by covid. Also you manage to make the error of saying that because the current infection rate is 275 in 100k, and assuming 10% of all infections are in 16 year olds, that this means that only approx 25 out of every 100k 16 year olds will ever get covid, and hence only 1 in 100k will get long covid. The obvious fallacy is that the 275 in 100k refers only to the number infected TODAY! You would be perfectly correct if covid only started yesterday and would be over tomorrow. In fact though, it is a continuing epidemic, every day some number are recovering and some others are contracting the infection. The current indications are that other than some miraculous event, the epidemic will continue until every person in the UK has either been vaccinated or has had covid delta or some even more dangerous variant. Indeed many are saying that "we need to just live with it". This implies that sooner or later every single 16 year old will contract covid unless vaccinated. Even if only 1 in a 100 went on to develop serious covid symptoms for at least 2 days (a massive underestimate based on current knowledge), this is 1000 times more prevalence than the 1 in 100k suffering 2 day illness from vaccination. So doing the sums properly: total number of 16 year olds with two day symptoms from vaccination followed by complete recovery (assuming complete vaccination in the age group) = 15. Total number of 16 year olds with two day or greater symptoms from covid, some of whom may never recover (assuming zero vaccination in the age group) = 15,000. QED: kids need to get vaccinated. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now!" So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? | |||
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"So the science is not yet precise enough but we are expected to believe and trust the science.? That's not a strong argument. I've had my. Jabs by the way so I'm not anti vaxx. But I am chellenging the current hysteria that seems to say everybody must be jabbed just because we say so... When a compelling case has not yet been made public, and when that is pointed out... People fall back on yeah but its all new so how can scientists possibly know. They either know and have a compelling case or they don't and are guessing. This isn't a guess. It's data. It's not complete data, but if you want complete data then we should throw out 99% of what we think we know. Vaccines are shit, but so are cars, bacon, flying - everything has uncertainty. This is (one example I remember off the top of my head) one set of data of people using the best methods, checked by others who know what they're talking about. There are others. They'll be collated. In years we'll know more and be more certain, but never fully certain. We don't have years. We could be sentencing kids to a lifetime of disability by hemming and hawing. Vaccine long term effects almost exclusively emerge within two months - plenty of kids have been jabbed that long. Virus side effects can lurk for decades - shingles, or the explosion of Parkinson's following the 1918 pandemic. If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. Nope... Not ever suggested certainty. What I've said is... For scientists to use terms like "lower" "small risk" "almost hardly ever" is just to sell a story. For them to establish a position that "a is lower than b" then they must have at some point seen some facts. So let's see the facts. What is a and what is b? That's all. Let's not use words and inflate them because a scientist said lower. Just tell us how much lower and tell us honestly what you know to be true and what is still being worked on. It's not hard. " So you're saying the science is bad because of the way I'm communicating what I remember from the discussion of a paper? C'mon, that's silly. There's papers, the papers have data. That data will be interpreted in the paper and by their peers. I don't know what language they'll use in their discussion, if they couch it, or why. They might well do. The ubiquitous "further study is needed". The fact that a woman on a swinging site communicated it in a particular way has no bearing on that. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste?" Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on." Exactly! | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on." Thank you. Glad you agree | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Exactly!" You on the other hand still can’t admit it can you? Shows what you think | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Thank you. Glad you agree "What I dont agree with is jumping on somebody just because they point something out to you and then making assumptions about that persons character because as I have said that is exceptionally unpleasant. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Exactly! You on the other hand still can’t admit it can you? Shows what you think "Stop it I am getting really upset because you have just chosen to target me and make assumptions. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Thank you. Glad you agree
What I dont agree with is jumping on somebody just because they point something out to you and then making assumptions about that persons character because as I have said that is exceptionally unpleasant."Just accept it. Own it. You think making a joke about the death a supposed antivaxxer is acceptable. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Exactly! You on the other hand still can’t admit it can you? Shows what you think
Stop it I am getting really upset because you have just chosen to target me and make assumptions."You replied to me first! | |||
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"God, give it a rest ppl. If you’ve had it and you wanted it great. If you haven’t and you don’t want it great. Stop discussing other ppls choiced and get on with your lives. What I do believe in is medical freedom. Stop preaching the vaccine onto ppl who do not want it. " This.. | |||
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" If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. " In which case when you keep saying you are following the science and trust it, surely you can understand that there will be some following the science and not trusting it as you say it isn't certain | |||
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"God, give it a rest ppl. If you’ve had it and you wanted it great. If you haven’t and you don’t want it great. Stop discussing other ppls choiced and get on with your lives. What I do believe in is medical freedom. Stop preaching the vaccine onto ppl who do not want it. " Seems to me this thread has mostly been discussion of a joke in poor taste and discussion of data. If that doesn't interest you, I'm sorry, but I'm sure you can find other worthwhile discussion elsewhere | |||
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" If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. In which case when you keep saying you are following the science and trust it, surely you can understand that there will be some following the science and not trusting it as you say it isn't certain" Sure. It's the best we can do with the best we know. | |||
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"Toxic debates need a vaccine Why is this toxic? Since when has people having difference of opinion beeb toxic?" There has been many many threads that turned toxic , you must have noticed them | |||
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"Toxic debates need a vaccine Why is this toxic? Since when has people having difference of opinion beeb toxic? There has been many many threads that turned toxic , you must have noticed them" Yes of course I have. I just think often the word toxic is used in the wrong context. To me toxic means something that is poisonous and dangerous so my point is as long as somebody isnt spreading false information I don't see People disagreeing as toxic. | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”?" Could I draw your attention to that exact previous thread where the posts by some included: "Yawn" - which seems to me to be making great light of the entire continuing pandemic. And your very own "New variant o’clock already? Remarkable!" - in response to the possibility that there may already be a variant that could render all the vaccinations and other precautionary measures so far useless. Turning the pandemic into a joke is by definition denigrating every single death, disability, sacrifice, and heart ache that has occurred so far. | |||
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" If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. In which case when you keep saying you are following the science and trust it, surely you can understand that there will be some following the science and not trusting it as you say it isn't certain" I think you said what I was trying to say.. But in a million less words... | |||
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"God, give it a rest ppl. If you’ve had it and you wanted it great. If you haven’t and you don’t want it great. Stop discussing other ppls choiced and get on with your lives. What I do believe in is medical freedom. Stop preaching the vaccine onto ppl who do not want it. Seems to me this thread has mostly been discussion of a joke in poor taste and discussion of data. If that doesn't interest you, I'm sorry, but I'm sure you can find other worthwhile discussion elsewhere" Which isn't what the OP was about but for some people including you it always end up this way | |||
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" If you want certainty, we don't have it. I'm sorry if you see that as a failure in science. It isn't. In which case when you keep saying you are following the science and trust it, surely you can understand that there will be some following the science and not trusting it as you say it isn't certain I think you said what I was trying to say.. But in a million less words..." I am a lazy typer | |||
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"I’m sick of everywhere I go this debate is happening. No one has any say in other ppls choices. At the end of the day the data means nothing. When it comes to your medical rights it is that persons RIGHT to make their choice. So no debate should be necessary. This site is the last place I though would be rambling on about this shit. " I agree to a certain extent however to say others people's choices have nothing to do with anyone else isn't true. Other people's choices often have consequences intended or otherwise for of the people. Of course people can decide if they want a vaccine or not it's just when false information is being spread it becomes dangerous. | |||
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"Since they are pushing this experimental injection on us an an emergency that must mean there are no other safer and effective treatments for Covid-19? Wrong! Many doctors worldwide have found safe, inexpensive and effective treatment that work very well in treating people with COVID-19 like IVERMECTIN that’s been used safely for more than 30 years, but the government hasn’t openly supported the use of this effective treatment that could save the life’s of many! In fact there are other therapies like HYDOXYCHLOROQUIN, VITAMIN D,C AND ZINC that doctors have proven to be safe and effective in treating COVID-19 patients but the government or PHE has not openly publicised this why?? Why Is the government silencing doctors and ignoring effective alternative treatment? Critical voices from Doctors’s, scientist, nurses and other health care professionals are being censored? because if we already have effective treatment against COVID-19 which actually we do that would make an very expensive experimental injection more unnecessary! Wouldn’t it? That would not suit their agenda! " The data on those treatments are pretty thin. HCQ has been studied extensively. Ivermectin is currently in two large studies, so, we'll see. If they work - held to the same standards as vaccines, of course, we wouldn't want double standards - then great. If not, then not. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Yes, I did see the unfortunate hashtag on Twitter "leave our kids alone". A bunch of adults trying to tell people on the brink of adulthood that they can't make their own decisions. The teenagers are responding and saying they want to be vaccinated. The education system must be doing ok. They're listening to the science, not the crazed screaming of grifters on the internet. There's hope for the future " | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Could I draw your attention to that exact previous thread where the posts by some included: "Yawn" - which seems to me to be making great light of the entire continuing pandemic. And your very own "New variant o’clock already? Remarkable!" - in response to the possibility that there may already be a variant that could render all the vaccinations and other precautionary measures so far useless. Turning the pandemic into a joke is by definition denigrating every single death, disability, sacrifice, and heart ache that has occurred so far." Neither of those are directed at the deaths of anyone. Well certainly not my comments anyway. This virus is constantly mutating. Every variant should be concerning, not just the ones the media want to use to run their next fear factor story. Which is where the subject of my joke lay. Apologies if you were offended. | |||
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"Ok back to the OP" | |||
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"To the OP, sadly there has been a good few people lately who have been in Hospital wishing they had had the vaccine, by which time it is too late. I personally blame the messaging from the expert scientists at the start of all this who told younger people that if they get it, it will be mild, it turns out the were not so expert at their craft and didn't know enough about the virus to know that for certain. The virus seems very random and can hit anyone badly" Yes, I agree. The messaging has been very poor. And as I said at the top, I feel for his family. | |||
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"To the OP, sadly there has been a good few people lately who have been in Hospital wishing they had had the vaccine, by which time it is too late. I personally blame the messaging from the expert scientists at the start of all this who told younger people that if they get it, it will be mild, it turns out the were not so expert at their craft and didn't know enough about the virus to know that for certain. The virus seems very random and can hit anyone badly " I might change that to...the "expert" advice from the Scientists was poor as it seems they were wrong | |||
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"To the OP, sadly there has been a good few people lately who have been in Hospital wishing they had had the vaccine, by which time it is too late. I personally blame the messaging from the expert scientists at the start of all this who told younger people that if they get it, it will be mild, it turns out the were not so expert at their craft and didn't know enough about the virus to know that for certain. The virus seems very random and can hit anyone badly" Agreement. Not so sure about all expert scientists, but certainly the ones wheeled out by our government to present the governments policy. Possibly a failure of other virologists and epidemilogists to be louder in sounding the note of caution; although throughout there has been a large degree of media and government castigation of those who raised greater warnings, warnings which for the most part have turned out to be fully justified. | |||
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"Has the experimental injection been thoroughly tested? Not at all! The FDA vaccines and related biological products advisory committee decided to approve this experimental vaccine for emergency use only. Those that are supposed to keep you safe felt in unnecessary to see how the jab affects your brain, kidneys, lungs, liver or heart! No studies were done to see how the injection reacts with other drugs you make be taking! No toxicity studies were done on a single dose! No toxicokinetic studies have been performed with the vaccine to see how these chemical react once they get into your body No Genotoxicity studies were done to see if any of the vaccine chemicals damage your DNA No carcinogenicity studies were done to determine wether these substances in the vaccines cause cancer! They have no idea if the vaccines are safe for pregnant woman! No studies were done to see how the vaccines affect prenatal and post natal develop in mums or new borns No studies were done to find out what happens when couples get the injections and any subsequent children they may have also received the shot! Look at all these No’s! I’m sorry but a trial on a few thousand people for several months doesn’t give me much and many on millions of people worldwide total confidence You'll be delighted to know that Pfizer - the vaccine being discussed in kids - is set for full FDA approval next month. The same FDA that has phase 4 trials of Pfizer (the icky and nefarious and scary "post marketing safety monitoring") until 2023. That's cited a lot. I'm sure given how much people trust the FDA to show how icky and nefarious the vaccine is, they'll not be wildly inconsistent and will concede that the vaccine is, indeed, regarded as safe
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/fda-aiming-give-final-approval-pfizer-vaccine-by-early-next-month-ny-times-2021-08-03/"Strange how when I mentioned the FDA in another post I got shot down! Your exact words were: You do know that the FDA isn't anything to do with the UK, don't you? | |||
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"Tragic... but I can't help feeling human average intelligence just rose a tiny bit. On a previous post, people who refused to be vaccinated were being accused of laughing at the deaths of others. I called it out and said I hadn’t witnessed anyone making light of any deaths. I stand corrected. Here it is. Except... where is the outrage? Or are these kind of jokes acceptable because they’re at the expense of someone who was an “antivaxxer”? Sorry but not sure where you've been if you don't think people have made light of deaths because you see comments all the time on these types of threads "well it's only the old or sick that are dying"! Oh so this is still ok because someone else said the old and sick are dying and I didn’t see it? did I say that? No I didn't! I said that you are wrong if you believe that this is the 1st time people have made light of the deaths because you are wrong. I didn’t say it was the first time someone’s death has been light of, I said it was the first time I’d witnessed someone doing it. I’m not a moderator and don’t check every post. Anyone making jokes about death should called out and castigated. Two wrongs don’t make a right but the fact you seem more concerned about my comments than the quoted joke shows your mindset as well then doesn’t it? I didn't say it did make it right I was just pointing out that you are wrong that others haven't made light. Please stop making assumptions because its not pleasant. And like I said, I said I haven’t evidence of people making light of deaths. It’s probably happened loads. Hence Polly Chromatic’s comments yesterday about shame on people who make light of deaths. At the time I hadn’t seen anyone doing it but I must admit I suppose I wasn’t really looking for it, since then I’ve seen the above comment making light of a death which no one really seems to mind. Unless you condemn those comments also? Or are you just going to continue with the “other people makes those jokes too”? Can you stop now please. If you properly read what I have said I didn't say any of it was OK so please just stop now! So do you agree that above the joke was in very poor taste? Yes. It was. It's why I skimmed over it. It's not as though that obviates any of the other stuff that goes on. Thank you. Glad you agree
What I dont agree with is jumping on somebody just because they point something out to you and then making assumptions about that persons character because as I have said that is exceptionally unpleasant.
Just accept it. Own it. You think making a joke about the death a supposed antivaxxer is acceptable. "I'd just like to point out that I wasn't joking. Seriously though - it's a serious point. Part of the reason we're all still in this pickle is the preponderance of utter stupidity amongst those who are gullible and hubristic enough to believe that reading and regurgitating a load of populist memes on social media counts as 'research' and, as such, carries equal veracity to decades of scientific research by countless scientists who have devoted their entire working lives to it. Suddenly we're supposed to accept the online 'research' of someone who barely scraped a D in GCSE in food science knows more about virology, epidemiology and biochemistry than the whole peer reviewed body of scientific knowledge... really?.. what a puffed up load of stupidity. You can want to bowdlerise my point all you like, but the facts of the science are out there - and if you die having also endangered others because you think you know better then don't ask me to cry for you. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Whilst it is true that many people die regardless of being vaccinated, it is NOT true that many people are dying BECAUSE of being jabbed. In fact it has been proven many times that the Covid vaccines have already saved millions of lived around the world, and just a simple look at a graph of covid deaths or hospitalizations shows without a doubt that both are falling as the number of vaccines rise. Cal | |||
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"No matter how some people try to twist the matter up in knots, it's a v simple issue. It is far, far, far safer to get a Covid Vaccine than to get Covid without any sort of protection whatsoever. Please get a vaccine. Protect your life. And protect the lives of others around you." No, this is very simple.... People have a choice wether to have the vaccine or not. This is a free country not a government/public run dictatorship. My son has not had the vaccine, I will NOT tell him or persuade him to do so. It's very sad that people who have not taken the vaccine have died. It's not for public opinion to force people to have it though. | |||
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"People have a choice over taking the vaccine or not. He made his choice. This is only being made news worthy as a further tactic to convince people to take it. " Yhe family have decided that his avoidable death should not have been in vain. It is his sister especially who is wanting to educate others who may be ignorant, like her brother, of the risks to healthier younger people. | |||
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"Has the experimental injection been thoroughly tested? Not at all! The FDA vaccines and related biological products advisory committee decided to approve this experimental vaccine for emergency use only. Those that are supposed to keep you safe felt in unnecessary to see how the jab affects your brain, kidneys, lungs, liver or heart! No studies were done to see how the injection reacts with other drugs you make be taking! No toxicity studies were done on a single dose! No toxicokinetic studies have been performed with the vaccine to see how these chemical react once they get into your body No Genotoxicity studies were done to see if any of the vaccine chemicals damage your DNA No carcinogenicity studies were done to determine wether these substances in the vaccines cause cancer! They have no idea if the vaccines are safe for pregnant woman! No studies were done to see how the vaccines affect prenatal and post natal develop in mums or new borns No studies were done to find out what happens when couples get the injections and any subsequent children they may have also received the shot! Look at all these No’s! I’m sorry but a trial on a few thousand people for several months doesn’t give me much and many on millions of people worldwide total confidence " That's probabiy why you're not involved in the vaccine research. Hundreds of thousands of people were within the clinical trialsx with good safety and outstanding efficacy results. Several billion people have been vaccinated now, with outcomes that support their use. Thousands of deaths have been prevented, just in the UK. Looking for spurious tests that you know aren't standard, is a strawman, at best. The MHRA has approved these vaccines having studied the good data. Memes sent out by antivax groups aren't helpful and can cause deaths and disabilities | |||
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"Fitness enthusiast, 42, who rejected vaccine, dies of Covid. A “fit and healthy” 42-year-old who loved climbing mountains and lifting weights has died of Covid-19 after refusing to get vaccinated, leaving his twin sister and mother heartbroken. The two women warned others not to think they are invulnerable to the dangers of the virus. " Can I see more information on this. I'd like to do my own research. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Who to believe? Thousands and thousands of highly-qualified scientists and medics.. Or thousands of mainly nameless fruit-and-nutcases on the internet. Difficult question.. Fortunately, the theory of Darwinian evolution advises that the ones not taking meds/vaccines/advice, will eventually become extinct. #sorted | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Who to believe? Thousands and thousands of highly-qualified scientists and medics.. Or thousands of mainly nameless fruit-and-nutcases on the internet. Difficult question.. Fortunately, the theory of Darwinian evolution advises that the ones not taking meds/vaccines/advice, will eventually become extinct. #sorted" Yes I remember when we found the weapons of mass distruction after bombing the crap out of country on the basis of experts. I am not anti if you want to take it do. But it is rather odd how the media is not reporting the mass demos of thousands of people in London.. And not reporting the deaths of vaccinated people only those of non. And how all of a sudden the young are at risk. Reason for cases droping is its summer same as why cases of flu drop. Remember before covid the news every winter would be how hospitals struggling with flu patients. The vaccine will not be free for ever and you will need to take it every year. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Who to believe? Thousands and thousands of highly-qualified scientists and medics.. Or thousands of mainly nameless fruit-and-nutcases on the internet. Difficult question.. Fortunately, the theory of Darwinian evolution advises that the ones not taking meds/vaccines/advice, will eventually become extinct. #sorted" Look at the government's own numbers. | |||
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"Has the experimental injection been thoroughly tested? Not at all! The FDA vaccines and related biological products advisory committee decided to approve this experimental vaccine for emergency use only. Those that are supposed to keep you safe felt in unnecessary to see how the jab affects your brain, kidneys, lungs, liver or heart! No studies were done to see how the injection reacts with other drugs you make be taking! No toxicity studies were done on a single dose! No toxicokinetic studies have been performed with the vaccine to see how these chemical react once they get into your body No Genotoxicity studies were done to see if any of the vaccine chemicals damage your DNA No carcinogenicity studies were done to determine wether these substances in the vaccines cause cancer! They have no idea if the vaccines are safe for pregnant woman! No studies were done to see how the vaccines affect prenatal and post natal develop in mums or new borns No studies were done to find out what happens when couples get the injections and any subsequent children they may have also received the shot! Look at all these No’s! I’m sorry but a trial on a few thousand people for several months doesn’t give me much and many on millions of people worldwide total confidence You'll be delighted to know that Pfizer - the vaccine being discussed in kids - is set for full FDA approval next month. The same FDA that has phase 4 trials of Pfizer (the icky and nefarious and scary "post marketing safety monitoring") until 2023. That's cited a lot. I'm sure given how much people trust the FDA to show how icky and nefarious the vaccine is, they'll not be wildly inconsistent and will concede that the vaccine is, indeed, regarded as safe
https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/fda-aiming-give-final-approval-pfizer-vaccine-by-early-next-month-ny-times-2021-08-03/
Strange how when I mentioned the FDA in another post I got shot down! Your exact words were:
You do know that the FDA isn't anything to do with the UK, don't you?
"Context is everything, isn't it? While the other post was about UK approval, hence my post, the post I was replying to was about all the reasons the vaccine is terrible. A significant number of the criminal lies that people spread about the vaccines derive from misreading of the FDA and CDC, making them very very relevant regardless of where you live. Trial vaccine? Misreading of FDA. PCR is wrong? Misreading of CDC. Not a vaccine? A cherrypicking of American law. And as a result of these lies - and perhaps miscommunication about the risks of Covid - a healthy man has died when he could have been vaccinated. Which is awful. | |||
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"Any death is awful. I assume you have seen the yellow card ongoing goverment report that gives data on people in the UK that have died from complications from taking the vaccine. Oddly these deaths are not reported in the media and its more than just one death. Google it... Yellow card covid report " Have. I've also seen the issues with passive reporting systems, and how they can be gamed to make a situation look far worse than it is. Like, in the US version, the flu shot that turned someone into the Incredible Hulk. Or the hilarious death of a two year old who died in the Pfizer vaccine trial. Why hilarious? Have I revealed how evil I truly am? No. The "death" occurred before the trial started and thus by definition someone lied and no toddler has died. Nice job crackpots (the people who did this). Real clever. I don't know to what extent the UK system is similarly exploited by charlatans, but it wouldn't surprise me. Quality of data is crucial. | |||
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"Any death is awful. I assume you have seen the yellow card ongoing goverment report that gives data on people in the UK that have died from complications from taking the vaccine. Oddly these deaths are not reported in the media and its more than just one death. Google it... Yellow card covid report " Anyone can report anything on the yellow card website. Its a suggestions box full of some helpful stuff no doubt but dont go there for accurate numbers. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Who to believe? Thousands and thousands of highly-qualified scientists and medics.. Or thousands of mainly nameless fruit-and-nutcases on the internet. Difficult question.. Fortunately, the theory of Darwinian evolution advises that the ones not taking meds/vaccines/advice, will eventually become extinct. #sorted ====== Yes I remember when we found the weapons of mass distruction after bombing the crap out of country on the basis of experts. I am not anti if you want to take it do. But it is rather odd how the media is not reporting the mass demos of thousands of people in London.. And not reporting the deaths of vaccinated people only those of non. And how all of a sudden the young are at risk. Reason for cases droping is its summer same as why cases of flu drop. Remember before covid the news every winter would be how hospitals struggling with flu patients. The vaccine will not be free for ever and you will need to take it every year. " Utter nonsense. The 'dodgy dossier' that 'sexed up' the so-called intel about WMDs in Iraq was manipulated by politicians and civil servants under duress from those politicians. The actual intel provided by the actual experts stated quite explicitly that there was no evidence of WMDs... so please don't try to rewrite history to suit your narrative. Really, do you honestly think those of us who witnessed it don't remember what happened? As for the covid protests, a few thousand ill-informed protesters regurgitating the contents of their favourite FB memes hardly constitutes a credible body scientific opinion... and neither does the fictional drivel about unreported vaccinated mass deaths. Just because David Icke or Alex Jones or Hatie Cockpins gibber on about them in their drooling twitter or InfoWar rants doesn't mean it's actual fact... don't be so gullible. And how come the young are suddenly at risk?.. you ask. Well, it has something to do with genetic mutation, which is more likely to occur in a retrovirus than in just about any other life form on the planet. That's how viruses mutate and change and evolve... and don't underestimate how quickly and easily it can happen. Maybe get a grip and read an actual scientific publication on the subject instead of drivelling meme-speak. Seriously, being so egregiously ill-informed is not harmless when it comes to this subject, especially when other idiots are only too willing to join in too... gibbering down our capital's street in their thousands. Fuck sake - what ever happened to our education system?!  | |||
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"No matter how some people try to twist the matter up in knots, it's a v simple issue. It is far, far, far safer to get a Covid Vaccine than to get Covid without any sort of protection whatsoever. Please get a vaccine. Protect your life. And protect the lives of others around you. No, this is very simple.... People have a choice wether to have the vaccine or not. This is a free country not a government/public run dictatorship. My son has not had the vaccine, I will NOT tell him or persuade him to do so. It's very sad that people who have not taken the vaccine have died. It's not for public opinion to force people to have it though. " I'm afraid you don't seem to understand how large scale vaccination programs work. They're effective when enough of the population gets vaccinated. If lots of people choose not to bother, they're risking the lives of others. And even if your son (hopefully) won't get seriously ill without a vaccine, he still has a far better chance of avoiding any lasting damage if he's vaccinated. So you really should try to convince your son to get vaccinated. It would benefit him and others. | |||
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"And yes sciencetist are now collecting data and it will only be in years from now that we see the true pros and cons of the global vaccine role out. For now not even the experts can predict that. And listening to media hype.. Well if you are above the age of 40 you should know better. " Avoid the media and hype and stick to just the credible research evidence that is available via reputable sources. As for the pros and cons of the vaccines - I think it's extremely clear already. We have just 2 tools to stop the virus from destroying lives and our society - restrictions or vaccines. Take your pick. Many have complained, demonstrated and constantly harangued about restrictions. Others about vaccines. Probably some of them about both. Many thousands of lives here have already been saved by vaccines and restrictions. A much larger volume of people have had the potential of very severe illness prevented, as well as long covid. Large numbers of people have suffered severe financial impacts. Who do you want to suffer? What steps have you taken to help to reduce the level of suffering in the country? It's vaccines and restrictions that we have available as tools to improve conditions - there aren't magical spells that will do it. | |||
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"It's a shame ge died but you can't make decisions on outliers The evidence and statistics are clear regarding the survival rate of the disease at his age and to point to the odd one out as a reason to dictate policy to the majority is ridiculous It's like saying because people die in car accidents that aren't their fault you'll never drive again just to be safe You paint people amejo choose not to take this particular vaccine as selfish, yet you're the people who expect others to fall in line for your protection, which is selfishness and narcissism at it's finest You paint it as 'protecting others' but you never cared before when people died of other diseases, you only developed this compassion when you were at risk I could dig to the pit's of hell and still not find a place low enough to point at abd say that you're beneath even this level of contempt" Currently 20% of people in hospital with covid are under 35. I don't know about the rest of your post but wanted to highlight the problems that we're facing with younger people. There are also thousands of children identified with long covid. | |||
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"Lies he had asthma they put it down to covid " He didn't die from asthma though had experienced it in the past, as millions have. | |||
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"No matter how some people try to twist the matter up in knots, it's a v simple issue. It is far, far, far safer to get a Covid Vaccine than to get Covid without any sort of protection whatsoever. Please get a vaccine. Protect your life. And protect the lives of others around you. No, this is very simple.... People have a choice wether to have the vaccine or not. This is a free country not a government/public run dictatorship. My son has not had the vaccine, I will NOT tell him or persuade him to do so. It's very sad that people who have not taken the vaccine have died. It's not for public opinion to force people to have it though. I'm afraid you don't seem to understand how large scale vaccination programs work. They're effective when enough of the population gets vaccinated. If lots of people choose not to bother, they're risking the lives of others. And even if your son (hopefully) won't get seriously ill without a vaccine, he still has a far better chance of avoiding any lasting damage if he's vaccinated. So you really should try to convince your son to get vaccinated. It would benefit him and others." And that's an opinion and mine is... Provide some proper scientific data that says how likely it is that a teenager is going to catch and to suffer from serious symptoms. Is it 1 in 10...? 1 in a million..? How many teenagers are currently in hospital as a result of covid? Just provide a bit of credible data and I'm sure others will buy into the message. But just repeating the same words doesn't move the debate forward and is at risk of entrenching positions. And further.. Is it even a problem.? How many youngsters have been able to book and have both vaccines yet? Mine have got another month before they can have their second jab. We could find that if we actually offer it to people that they will have it anyway. | |||
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"It's a shame ge died but you can't make decisions on outliers The evidence and statistics are clear regarding the survival rate of the disease at his age and to point to the odd one out as a reason to dictate policy to the majority is ridiculous It's like saying because people die in car accidents that aren't their fault you'll never drive again just to be safe You paint people amejo choose not to take this particular vaccine as selfish, yet you're the people who expect others to fall in line for your protection, which is selfishness and narcissism at it's finest You paint it as 'protecting others' but you never cared before when people died of other diseases, you only developed this compassion when you were at risk I could dig to the pit's of hell and still not find a place low enough to point at abd say that you're beneath even this level of contempt Currently 20% of people in hospital with covid are under 35. I don't know about the rest of your post but wanted to highlight the problems that we're facing with younger people. There are also thousands of children identified with long covid. " And you take the fact that 1 fifth of the population in hospital are under 35 as a problem? Is it not a perfect example of take a number and make up a story? It means that 80 percent of the people in hospital with covid are over 35... Which number is 4 times bigger than the other? I'll help you... Its the ones who are over 35....if you were going to spend time money and energy messaging a demographic for better health... Which age group would you target? Under 35s who are 20 percent it over 35s who are 80 per cent of those in hospital with covid. Long Covid... Absolutely agree... But we need to be careful to read the numbers properly. | |||
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"Lies he had asthma they put it down to covid " https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid It doesn't say he did Another one today, a bit older than him but thought he wouldn't get it bad either https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9864347/Covid-sufferer-says-virus-afraid-vlog-days-died-disease.html?ito=social-twitter_mailonline | |||
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"No matter how some people try to twist the matter up in knots, it's a v simple issue. It is far, far, far safer to get a Covid Vaccine than to get Covid without any sort of protection whatsoever. Please get a vaccine. Protect your life. And protect the lives of others around you. No, this is very simple.... People have a choice wether to have the vaccine or not. This is a free country not a government/public run dictatorship. My son has not had the vaccine, I will NOT tell him or persuade him to do so. It's very sad that people who have not taken the vaccine have died. It's not for public opinion to force people to have it though. I'm afraid you don't seem to understand how large scale vaccination programs work. They're effective when enough of the population gets vaccinated. If lots of people choose not to bother, they're risking the lives of others. And even if your son (hopefully) won't get seriously ill without a vaccine, he still has a far better chance of avoiding any lasting damage if he's vaccinated. So you really should try to convince your son to get vaccinated. It would benefit him and others. And that's an opinion and mine is... Provide some proper scientific data that says how likely it is that a teenager is going to catch and to suffer from serious symptoms. Is it 1 in 10...? 1 in a million..? How many teenagers are currently in hospital as a result of covid? Just provide a bit of credible data and I'm sure others will buy into the message. But just repeating the same words doesn't move the debate forward and is at risk of entrenching positions. And further.. Is it even a problem.? How many youngsters have been able to book and have both vaccines yet? Mine have got another month before they can have their second jab. We could find that if we actually offer it to people that they will have it anyway. " This is such low level thinking Give me the science that wearing a seat belt is safer than not! Well we have the studies to show that your much less likely…. No! I want the exact numbers. I want down to the decimal point how much safer it is! They must know Well it’s not something you can get that exact with. We have multiple studies showing that people who wear seat belts…. So you don’t have the science!? They’re just making rough estimates? Well no, it’s a cumulative effect of multiple studies, meta analysis, real world data, and we can say with confidence that wearing a seat belt …. No! I need exact numbers! Show me the science! 
It’s out there buddy. The vaccine has an incredibly low rate of side effects. Much lower than the risk associated with covid.
There’s also data to show the vaccine helps decrease the chance you’ll spread it. So it’s protects you, and the people around you. | |||
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"No matter how some people try to twist the matter up in knots, it's a v simple issue. It is far, far, far safer to get a Covid Vaccine than to get Covid without any sort of protection whatsoever. Please get a vaccine. Protect your life. And protect the lives of others around you. No, this is very simple.... People have a choice wether to have the vaccine or not. This is a free country not a government/public run dictatorship. My son has not had the vaccine, I will NOT tell him or persuade him to do so. It's very sad that people who have not taken the vaccine have died. It's not for public opinion to force people to have it though. I'm afraid you don't seem to understand how large scale vaccination programs work. They're effective when enough of the population gets vaccinated. If lots of people choose not to bother, they're risking the lives of others. And even if your son (hopefully) won't get seriously ill without a vaccine, he still has a far better chance of avoiding any lasting damage if he's vaccinated. So you really should try to convince your son to get vaccinated. It would benefit him and others. And that's an opinion and mine is... Provide some proper scientific data that says how likely it is that a teenager is going to catch and to suffer from serious symptoms. Is it 1 in 10...? 1 in a million..? How many teenagers are currently in hospital as a result of covid? Just provide a bit of credible data and I'm sure others will buy into the message. But just repeating the same words doesn't move the debate forward and is at risk of entrenching positions. And further.. Is it even a problem.? How many youngsters have been able to book and have both vaccines yet? Mine have got another month before they can have their second jab. We could find that if we actually offer it to people that they will have it anyway. This is such low level thinking Give me the science that wearing a seat belt is safer than not! Well we have the studies to show that your much less likely…. No! I want the exact numbers. I want down to the decimal point how much safer it is! They must know Well it’s not something you can get that exact with. We have multiple studies showing that people who wear seat belts…. So you don’t have the science!? They’re just making rough estimates? Well no, it’s a cumulative effect of multiple studies, meta analysis, real world data, and we can say with confidence that wearing a seat belt …. No! I need exact numbers! Show me the science!
It’s out there buddy. The vaccine has an incredibly low rate of side effects. Much lower than the risk associated with covid.
There’s also data to show the vaccine helps decrease the chance you’ll spread it. So it’s protects you, and the people around you."So if you keep saying the same things it becomes a fact? I'm not asking for an exact anything. I'm saying that we can see real numbers for patients in hospital with covid. But as one example.. when it comes to age demographics we see a one line split... Below age 35. It's not a hard or difficult question to ask, nor any sinister intent. I'm just challenging the narrative that keeps being repeated...now I'm fine for adults but draw the line at kids. The line being... Just provide some of the evidence. It obviously exists as you said there are multiple studies. Don't forget until 2 months ago... Kids were safe, never caught it and didn't need to worry. Apparently. | |||
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"Lies he had asthma they put it down to covid https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid It doesn't say he did Another one today, a bit older than him but thought he wouldn't get it bad either https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9864347/Covid-sufferer-says-virus-afraid-vlog-days-died-disease.html?ito=social-twitter_mailonline" Lying wankers scare monging get people have vaccine | |||
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"It has to be a generation thing surely? At school I was vaccinated several times against things like polio, diptheria etc. and probably measles as a baby. Guess what? It worked! As maybe I would not be here to argue the toss. Vaccination is one of the greatest human advances of all time. It has saved literally billions of lives on this planet. Sadly, the internet has arrived and many young-ish people believe the sad conspiracy theories. If you don't have any medical reason not to be vaccinated, for God's sake just get a bloody jab and let's get this plague under control." The inventors of the very first vaccines must be rolling in their graves and crying after reading the nonsense that's trotted out. E | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. " Give over | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over " So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? " A silly comparison. When someone indulges in swinging, they are accepting the risk of STDs. If you don't want to run the risk, opt out of swinging. How can someone opt out of everyday life in order to avoid covid? | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? A silly comparison. When someone indulges in swinging, they are accepting the risk of STDs. If you don't want to run the risk, opt out of swinging. How can someone opt out of everyday life in order to avoid covid? " As its a swinging website I would have thought it was in the interest of all to ensure you are tested and vaccinated.. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? A silly comparison. When someone indulges in swinging, they are accepting the risk of STDs. If you don't want to run the risk, opt out of swinging. How can someone opt out of everyday life in order to avoid covid? " So are you saying you have sex with multiple people and don't get tested??? + | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? A silly comparison. When someone indulges in swinging, they are accepting the risk of STDs. If you don't want to run the risk, opt out of swinging. How can someone opt out of everyday life in order to avoid covid? " When someone declines to take the covid vaccine they also accept the risks. | |||
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"Many thousands dying after getting the jabs, mostly news being suppressed. Now going after our children. Give over So as swingers I assume we all have our hep and HPV Vaccinations? As we are being responsible citizens? A silly comparison. When someone indulges in swinging, they are accepting the risk of STDs. If you don't want to run the risk, opt out of swinging. How can someone opt out of everyday life in order to avoid covid? When someone declines to take the covid vaccine they also accept the risks. " The problem is many that refuse the vaccination dont except the risk because they dont see any. You often see people give reasons as to why they won't have it and a lot of the time people say because they are low risk and don't have any illnesses and are young so not at risk. | |||
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"It has to be a generation thing surely? At school I was vaccinated several times against things like polio, diptheria etc. and probably measles as a baby. Guess what? It worked! As maybe I would not be here to argue the toss. Vaccination is one of the greatest human advances of all time. It has saved literally billions of lives on this planet. Sadly, the internet has arrived and many young-ish people believe the sad conspiracy theories. If you don't have any medical reason not to be vaccinated, for God's sake just get a bloody jab and let's get this plague under control." Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either | |||
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"Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either "And you see that as something to boast about? | |||
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"Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either
And you see that as something to boast about?"No its just a fact.. You will never get 100% vaccination. So it's great we have vaccinated such a large percentage of the population but its impossible to get 100% Not sure where you got me boasting about it from but I appreciate how the written word can be read depending on a person's emotional state of mind x | |||
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"Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either
And you see that as something to boast about?
No its just a fact.. You will never get 100% vaccination.
So it's great we have vaccinated such a large percentage of the population but its impossible to get 100%
Not sure where you got me boasting about it from but I appreciate how the written word can be read depending on a person's emotional state of mind x"Thats true. I think the problem is that Normally if someone chooses not take a vaccine it doesn't really impact anyone else really but if we see a spike in the Winter and not enough people have been vaccinated it could impact all of us. | |||
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"Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either
And you see that as something to boast about?
No its just a fact.. You will never get 100% vaccination.
So it's great we have vaccinated such a large percentage of the population but its impossible to get 100%
Not sure where you got me boasting about it from but I appreciate how the written word can be read depending on a person's emotional state of mind x"I think it was the little fluttering eyelash emoji but I was mistaken so I’m sorry for snapping. Back in the day most people did get vaccinated though, enough to make a real difference when it came to things like measles, alas even measles is making a comeback and killing kids due to anti-vaxxers. | |||
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"Guess what.. Not everyone took those vaccines either
And you see that as something to boast about?
No its just a fact.. You will never get 100% vaccination.
So it's great we have vaccinated such a large percentage of the population but its impossible to get 100%
Not sure where you got me boasting about it from but I appreciate how the written word can be read depending on a person's emotional state of mind x
Thats true.
I think the problem is that Normally if someone chooses not take a vaccine it doesn't really impact anyone else really but if we see a spike in the Winter and not enough people have been vaccinated it could impact all of us. "Yes. It's not just about the individual. I got my rubella vaccine because I don't want other people to suffer. It's mostly a disease which causes issues in foetuses. I have no plans or desire to have children - it's not about me. | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? " No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. " Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two  | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two "Would it not be better to get tested after you had the vaccination to see if it worked like they do with other vaccinations? | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two "No not at all! | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two
Would it not be better to get tested after you had the vaccination to see if it worked like they do with other vaccinations?
"What vaccines do they do this with? | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two
Would it not be better to get tested after you had the vaccination to see if it worked like they do with other vaccinations?
"This isn't a thing in general. You get the jab and go on your way. | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two "Best analogy I’ve heard yet | |||
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"HPV... HEP... you know the ones swingers should be getting to keep themselves safe and others.. " I'm vaccinated against HPV. I got my three shots and went on my merry way. | |||
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"HPV... HEP... you know the ones swingers should be getting to keep themselves safe and others.. " What? I dont think you understand how the HPV vaccine works. It is only really effective if you have it before you are sexually active and considering the majority of people that are now old enough to be swingers were not old enough to have received the vaccine before they became sexually active. | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two
Would it not be better to get tested after you had the vaccination to see if it worked like they do with other vaccinations?
What vaccines do they do this with?"I had to have my rubella, varicella and tuberculosis immunity checked. This was for work purposes granted but it was tested. I was part of the siren study for covid antibody longevity also | |||
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"Sorry can anyone tell me how long the vaccine protects you for.. Would I need to take it for all my life or just once and if all my life is it once a year or every 6 months or only at winter time? No nobody can tell you because we don't know. The mass rollout of the vaccine globally has been for less than a year so no nobody can tell you for definite yet. Oh so you mean it's like an experimental thing... A bit like a dodgy pill you buy in a club.. Has it kicked in yet.. Dunno mate let's take two
Would it not be better to get tested after you had the vaccination to see if it worked like they do with other vaccinations?
What vaccines do they do this with?
I had to have my rubella, varicella and tuberculosis immunity checked. This was for work purposes granted but it was tested.
I was part of the siren study for covid antibody longevity also "Exactly you are tested after to see if you have immunity. Also you can get tested to see if you already carry covid immunity but it's easier/cheaper to jab the poplutaion on mass. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance" Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance" Yes this is true the Mrna usage was prohibited for decades. There is a reason it was prohibited. However it is a neat way of vaccine production and the usage is endless. The production of lab grown meat is one of these new areas that is using the technology... Imagine no more killing animals.. We can grow the meat in a lab. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E" Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Yes this is true the Mrna usage was prohibited for decades. There is a reason it was prohibited. However it is a neat way of vaccine production and the usage is endless. The production of lab grown meat is one of these new areas that is using the technology... Imagine no more killing animals.. We can grow the meat in a lab. " Mmm... Man made meat, what could possibly go wrong Lol. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline." Unfortunately it's not nonsense.. Please do research Mrna technology history. Now we are allowed to use this tech there will be some major technological advances so it not all bad... Just learn what it is for your own knowledge.. I mean remember when cigarettes were healthy... | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. Unfortunately it's not nonsense.. Please do research Mrna technology history. Now we are allowed to use this tech there will be some major technological advances so it not all bad... Just learn what it is for your own knowledge.. I mean remember when cigarettes were healthy... " I have done, thank you. "Bad things have happened therefore the vaccines are terrible" is also not a credible argument. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. Unfortunately it's not nonsense.. Please do research Mrna technology history. Now we are allowed to use this tech there will be some major technological advances so it not all bad... Just learn what it is for your own knowledge.. I mean remember when cigarettes were healthy... I have done, thank you. "Bad things have happened therefore the vaccines are terrible" is also not a credible argument. " Completely agree..but it is always good to have a debate that is tolerant of others views rather than ramming it to the counter argument in a toxic manner. | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. Unfortunately it's not nonsense.. Please do research Mrna technology history. Now we are allowed to use this tech there will be some major technological advances so it not all bad... Just learn what it is for your own knowledge.. I mean remember when cigarettes were healthy... I have done, thank you. "Bad things have happened therefore the vaccines are terrible" is also not a credible argument. Completely agree..but it is always good to have a debate that is tolerant of others views rather than ramming it to the counter argument in a toxic manner. " I'm sorry you feel that that happens. | |||
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"Lies he had asthma they put it down to covid https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid It doesn't say he did Another one today, a bit older than him but thought he wouldn't get it bad either https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9864347/Covid-sufferer-says-virus-afraid-vlog-days-died-disease.html?ito=social-twitter_mailonline Lying wankers scare monging get people have vaccine " The people who died or their family talking about their relative who has died? | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline." In what way is it nonsense? You sound very sure. Are you really as sure as you sound? | |||
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"The fact is no one knows of this is good or bad... As its an experimental drug.. All we know is for now it seems to be reducing deaths.. Let's hope it works out well for everyone. And whilst we are so keen on ours and other health... Get your beautiful bums to the gum clinic or order a test kit from them and test for STI's please. " Lots of people including swingers take responsibility with their sexual health but I am not getting your argument There is a difference between having sex with others and keeping it contained between you if you catch anything to spreading Covid to lots of people who then pass it onto lots of other people and potentially could kill them | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. In what way is it nonsense? You sound very sure. Are you really as sure as you sound?" I'm aware of research protocol and the way it's been spun to scare people. It's nonsense because it's deliberately misleading. The animals did not die because of the vaccination or an infection, they died because that's what the protocol demanded. I'm... sorry I can confidently say things that disagree with misinformation? (Not sorry) | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. In what way is it nonsense? You sound very sure. Are you really as sure as you sound? I'm aware of research protocol and the way it's been spun to scare people. It's nonsense because it's deliberately misleading. The animals did not die because of the vaccination or an infection, they died because that's what the protocol demanded. I'm... sorry I can confidently say things that disagree with misinformation? (Not sorry)" And of the subsequent Oxford Recovery Group's obfuscation...as reported in the Daily Telegraph? | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. In what way is it nonsense? You sound very sure. Are you really as sure as you sound? I'm aware of research protocol and the way it's been spun to scare people. It's nonsense because it's deliberately misleading. The animals did not die because of the vaccination or an infection, they died because that's what the protocol demanded. I'm... sorry I can confidently say things that disagree with misinformation? (Not sorry) And of the subsequent Oxford Recovery Group's obfuscation...as reported in the Daily Telegraph?" *Shrug* | |||
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"A lot of people on here are confident that the media is giving them the whole message. So how many ordinary people in the street knew that: mRNA vaccines were, for over 2 decades, tested on lab animals. The subjects initially gained antibodies...but ALL later died having met SARS-CoV-1. My point isn't the safeness or otherwise of vaccines...my point is that there is an official narrative and people need to know how they are being manipulated. Don't attack people when you don't know all the facts. Show some tolerance Not wholly correct. Animals that are used in medical research are euthenased, this has been the protocol for many years now. E Yes, it's this kind of misleading nonsense that makes credibility decline. In what way is it nonsense? You sound very sure. Are you really as sure as you sound? I'm aware of research protocol and the way it's been spun to scare people. It's nonsense because it's deliberately misleading. The animals did not die because of the vaccination or an infection, they died because that's what the protocol demanded. I'm... sorry I can confidently say things that disagree with misinformation? (Not sorry) And of the subsequent Oxford Recovery Group's obfuscation...as reported in the Daily Telegraph? *Shrug*" In the UK, a trial of the vaccine in rhesus macaque monkeys did not stop the animals from catching the virus. Half were injected with Oxford Recovery’s Astrazeneca’s formulation, half weren’t. All the injected macaques died; the infected but not injected survived | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
