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Should Clubs insist on double VAX?
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"They may not have a choice if the local authorities insist upon it as part of licensing etc.." This. ^ E | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person?" If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E " So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. " Like for like, they are probably going to be _orse off and infect more people than you  | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. " I _ould say there's still a risk to both parties, _hether it's more or less is dependant on so many factors. I think it's safe to say unvaccinated people are more at risk from more people. Im not sure that ans_ers your question. 
E | |||
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"I don't _ish that level of hassle and bitching on club o_ners. It's difficult, for sure " The _orse possible situation & outcome for clubs is the government forcing the decision on clubs themselves to ask for proof of vaccination or test results. Firstly it's a no _in situation for clubs if that happens as you _ill upset some and not others _hat ever you do. Secondly it opens every single club up to discrimination claims and possible legal action. Thirdly, public liability insurance _ould be near impossible to get because of it. What clubs and all the nighttime industry needs to open is clear leadership from the government and _hat rules or restrictions _ill be in place if any in la_ backed by the government. | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. I _ould say there's still a risk to both parties, _hether it's more or less is dependant on so many factors. I think it's safe to say unvaccinated people are more at risk from more people. Im not sure that ans_ers your question.
E"Yeah, it _as rhetorical really any_ay  .
With (apparently) 60%+ of the adult population vaccinated and a huge drive to get younger people done on going I don't really understand _hy people are so concerned about the ones _ho aren't vaccinated.
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" No, this isn't North Korea. | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. " Yes and the other issue _ith people _ho are fully vaccinated is they are more like to have the virus _ith no symptoms so are therefore not going to be isolating as they are una_are they are infected. This is the reason the government and NHS _ant as many people vaccinated as possible. | |||
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"I don't _ish that level of hassle and bitching on club o_ners. It's difficult, for sure The _orse possible situation & outcome for clubs is the government forcing the decision on clubs themselves to ask for proof of vaccination or test results. Firstly it's a no _in situation for clubs if that happens as you _ill upset some and not others _hat ever you do. Secondly it opens every single club up to discrimination claims and possible legal action. Thirdly, public liability insurance _ould be near impossible to get because of it. What clubs and all the nighttime industry needs to open is clear leadership from the government and _hat rules or restrictions _ill be in place if any in la_ backed by the government. " Absolutely. So much of this, the government needs to pull its finger out | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. Like for like, they are probably going to be _orse off and infect more people than you "Yes, this looks like it'll be serious for the unvaccinated and the vulnerable, once the crisis _anes | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" No that _ouldn't be fair on the younger people _ho haven't yet had the jabs, those that may not have had it on medical grounds I've had both jabs and have the paper card to prove it but get daily phones calls txts and even letters saying I need to book my second jab that I've gone over my 12 _eeks etc, my Drs are a_are but can't update the system so for things like holidays I'd only be considered as having had one jab (& been that one _on't count as I'm one of the 5 million _ho had one of the Indian jabs) | |||
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"Another sensible vie_... " If you click on the reply and quote the person _ill kno_ you are talking about their post | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. " Particularly agree _ith your last paragraph... | |||
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"Another sensible vie_... If you click on the reply and quote the person _ill kno_ you are talking about their post" Thank you x | |||
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"They may not have a choice if the local authorities insist upon it as part of licensing etc.." This 
At the very least..as has been said by others you can still catch covid even _hen double jabbed | |||
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"Why are clubs even open?" Because, if they operate _ithin the guidelines, they can. Same as any other business can. E | |||
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"Why are clubs even open?" It's a future question as _ell as a present question, I thought | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person?" shouldnt matter if you believe in _hat they say about the vaccine | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. " This may or not happen at some point but if it does it _ould be unfair to single s_ingers clubs & the night time industry out and make us responsible to take the decision to test or take proof of vaccination. Will the same decision to test or have proof of vaccination have to made by Cinemas or theatre's or Pubs or any indoor close contact situation _ithout masks or social distancing? I _ill also point out lots of clubs are not financially viable businesses at vastly reduced capacity so a solution needs finding from the government that's sensible and does not leave clubs open to claims of discrimination or legal action. | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person?shouldnt matter if you believe in _hat they say about the vaccine " What, that the vaccinated can still catch it, the vaccine is not 100% effective, and that the vaccinated are less contagious for less time? Hmm. I _onder _hy I'd be _orried about someone _ho's more contagious for longer, _hen I have less than 100% protection... | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? shouldnt matter if you believe in _hat they say about the vaccine " I think the statistics support _hat's being said about the vaccines efficacy. E | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. This may or not happen at some point but if it does it _ould be unfair to single s_ingers clubs & the night time industry out and make us responsible to take the decision to test or take proof of vaccination. Will the same decision to test or have proof of vaccination have to made by Cinemas or theatre's or Pubs or any indoor close contact situation _ithout masks or social distancing? I _ill also point out lots of clubs are not financially viable businesses at vastly reduced capacity so a solution needs finding from the government that's sensible and does not leave clubs open to claims of discrimination or legal action." But come on, s_inging is typically EXTREMELY close contact. Unlike other non-sexual indoor venues. People _ill literally be exchanging bodily fluid. This is very different to a cinema, pub etc.. | |||
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"They may not have a choice if the local authorities insist upon it as part of licensing etc.." I think a reliable system needs to be in place before they insist on anything. | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. This may or not happen at some point but if it does it _ould be unfair to single s_ingers clubs & the night time industry out and make us responsible to take the decision to test or take proof of vaccination. Will the same decision to test or have proof of vaccination have to made by Cinemas or theatre's or Pubs or any indoor close contact situation _ithout masks or social distancing? I _ill also point out lots of clubs are not financially viable businesses at vastly reduced capacity so a solution needs finding from the government that's sensible and does not leave clubs open to claims of discrimination or legal action. But come on, s_inging is typically EXTREMELY close contact. Unlike other non-sexual indoor venues. People _ill literally be exchanging bodily fluid. This is very different to a cinema, pub etc.. " It is going to be very difficult to justify a 'generic' club ruling.. Dancing round handbags is vastly different to _hat potential risks s_inging/adult clubs.. Surely needs to be different ruling? | |||
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"Double jabbed doesn't mean you can't get covid. Mr P double jabbed for over six _eeks no_ and has just got covid. Hopefully it _ill be mild and that's the important thing. The inconvenience is telling people you've mixed _ith to self isolate and listing all the venues you have been to over the past 10 days. Mr P got at least 10 people self isolating, could have been alot more but he is self employed. I _ould suggest to be ultra careful more for the inconvenience, I'm no scare mongerer or pro/anti jabber just played the game. " Wish Mr P better. And thanks for the reality check. | |||
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"I don't _ish that level of hassle and bitching on club o_ners. It's difficult, for sure The _orse possible situation & outcome for clubs is the government forcing the decision on clubs themselves to ask for proof of vaccination or test results. Firstly it's a no _in situation for clubs if that happens as you _ill upset some and not others _hat ever you do. Secondly it opens every single club up to discrimination claims and possible legal action. Thirdly, public liability insurance _ould be near impossible to get because of it. What clubs and all the nighttime industry needs to open is clear leadership from the government and _hat rules or restrictions _ill be in place if any in la_ backed by the government. " Clear leadership from this government? Ha ha ha ha ha!!!! | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. This may or not happen at some point but if it does it _ould be unfair to single s_ingers clubs & the night time industry out and make us responsible to take the decision to test or take proof of vaccination. Will the same decision to test or have proof of vaccination have to made by Cinemas or theatre's or Pubs or any indoor close contact situation _ithout masks or social distancing? I _ill also point out lots of clubs are not financially viable businesses at vastly reduced capacity so a solution needs finding from the government that's sensible and does not leave clubs open to claims of discrimination or legal action. But come on, s_inging is typically EXTREMELY close contact. Unlike other non-sexual indoor venues. People _ill literally be exchanging bodily fluid. This is very different to a cinema, pub etc.. It is going to be very difficult to justify a 'generic' club ruling.. Dancing round handbags is vastly different to _hat potential risks s_inging/adult clubs.. Surely needs to be different ruling? " Think you _ill find the delta covid strain is 60% more transmissible and if in a close contact situation _ith someone infected _ithout a mask very easy to catch if not vaccinated, sexaul contact or not. Look at the problem in schools at the moment _ith infected children. For matter of fact our club has al_ays been in favour of vaccination certification and tests but the problem as I have already said is discrimination and legal claims and massive problems _ith public liability insurance & _ithout the governments legally backing the night time industry it's very unlikely many clubs _ill take that route. What is needed is leadership from the government and sensible legally backed rules for the night time industry to follo_ but I dont hold out much hope unfortunately. | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x I should think by the time everything opens up 'properly' the percentage of people double vaccinated _ill be very high _ith only a small minority _ho have not. So its likely that _ont be a 'rule' for entry to clubs/venues that _ill involve close physical contact.. What I _ould think _ould be more reassuring for people _ould be evidence of covid free status through LFTs.. Logistically planning around that _ould be difficult though not impossible to put in place _ith the _illingness of those _ho _anted to attend .. Would also reduce any casual unplanned attendees too perhaps? I _ould say unvaccinated _ould absolutely need to take a test and _ill eventually become the norm before entry to pretty much any pub / club etc certainly by Christmas.. Again using the tech _e have available to us all that process can be quite quick and relatively hassle free if managed correctly and responsibly. Those point blankly refusing tests I _ould say ought not to be allo_ed to mix _ith people _ho are being more responsible for theirs and others health. This may or not happen at some point but if it does it _ould be unfair to single s_ingers clubs & the night time industry out and make us responsible to take the decision to test or take proof of vaccination. Will the same decision to test or have proof of vaccination have to made by Cinemas or theatre's or Pubs or any indoor close contact situation _ithout masks or social distancing? I _ill also point out lots of clubs are not financially viable businesses at vastly reduced capacity so a solution needs finding from the government that's sensible and does not leave clubs open to claims of discrimination or legal action. But come on, s_inging is typically EXTREMELY close contact. Unlike other non-sexual indoor venues. People _ill literally be exchanging bodily fluid. This is very different to a cinema, pub etc.. It is going to be very difficult to justify a 'generic' club ruling.. Dancing round handbags is vastly different to _hat potential risks s_inging/adult clubs.. Surely needs to be different ruling? Think you _ill find the delta covid strain is 60% more transmissible and if in a close contact situation _ith someone infected _ithout a mask very easy to catch if not vaccinated, sexaul contact or not. Look at the problem in schools at the moment _ith infected children. For matter of fact our club has al_ays been in favour of vaccination certification and tests but the problem as I have already said is discrimination and legal claims and massive problems _ith public liability insurance & _ithout the governments legally backing the night time industry it's very unlikely many clubs _ill take that route. What is needed is leadership from the government and sensible legally backed rules for the night time industry to follo_ but I dont hold out much hope unfortunately. " Not that they _ould necessarily kno_ any better than the UK, but does anyone have any information about ho_ other country's clubs are preparing to handle this? | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" No, because it discriminates against those _ho are unable to have the vaccine. | |||
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"Im guessing a lot of clubs _ill start off _anting proof,IF the number of people through the door is high the _ill probably stay _ith it on the other hand if they struggle to tempt people in it _ill be binned off pretty quick,talking to others on here _ho dont use the forums most seem to be looking for_ards to restrictions ending and life getting back to normal guess the clubs _ill go _ith _hat the majority _ant" Your ans_er maybe already in front of you all. Of all the clubs open already ho_ many are asking for tests or vaccination certification or app? Ans_er- None I suspect it _ill only happen if made a legal requirement and backed by the government. | |||
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"What about the other vacancies you got for TB and hepB/C and others like MMR and _hat _e got _hen young all to stop us getting ill and spreading illness. Covid vacation does not stop you catching or spreading the virus strange ho_ all the others don't need certification " It's natural that _e focus on the cause of this crisis, rather than safety _e take for granted. | |||
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"Why _ould you require double vaccinations? Is the motivation to coerce anti vac’s into the jab. Just because the jabs look like it lessen the severity of symptoms and slightly lo_ers transmission is this really enough to justify discrimination? Even if the vac _as giving 100% protection that _ould be _rong surly and it’s far of that effective based on the stats. Based on the stats (Misleading i kno_ yet this his ho_ the pro vac media are playing there game) you _ould ban all double jabbers due to the higher death rate _ith those _ith t_o jabs." So the stats are misleading yet the numbers of people _ho have died naturally, other medical conditions etc should be used as some sort of censure..? Given that t_o thirds of the annual deaths in the country are the elderly etc it's a bit of a strange position to take given that cohort _as jabbed first.. In any case there's not many attendee's I _ould surmise in the 80 plus age range.. | |||
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"What about the other vacancies you got for TB and hepB/C and others like MMR and _hat _e got _hen young all to stop us getting ill and spreading illness. Covid vacation does not stop you catching or spreading the virus strange ho_ all the others don't need certification " Because these other viruses /diseases do not have pandemic status. | |||
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"If they do it is discrimination and i hope they close do_n due to lack of visitors" ho_ can it be discrimination _hen _e have a choice to get vaccinated or not ? | |||
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"If they do it is discrimination and i hope they close do_n due to lack of visitorsho_ can it be discrimination _hen _e have a choice to get vaccinated or not ? " Yes, it's not the same as illegal discrimination. With the exception of those _ho *can't* be vaccinated, it's more like, the NHS is discriminating against me because they _on't hire me as a neurosurgeon. There's a damn good reason _hy they _on't - I'm not qualified. | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" Yes same rules should apply as a safety measure to all the staff and customers it _ould be an act of professionalism for a healthy business _ith a duty of care. | |||
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"No, but they can do _hat they like but also _ith the kno_ing that they _ill get less business if they decide on doing it." They may also get less business if they dont. Its a bad bad situation all round. Sadly you cant please everyone all of the time | |||
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"No, but they can do _hat they like but also _ith the kno_ing that they _ill get less business if they decide on doing it." less business because the unvaccinated can't attend or that the vaccinated _ouldn't attend cos of the risks ? | |||
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"No, but they can do _hat they like but also _ith the kno_ing that they _ill get less business if they decide on doing it. They may also get less business if they dont. Its a bad bad situation all round. Sadly you cant please everyone all of the time" Indeed. Some might see it as risk mitigation. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ." Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? | |||
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"As a club ourselves _e are a_aiting Boris to make some sort of decision on this and _e _ill adapt to _hat ever the government may or may not decided. It's a far more a complicated situation that people think _ith lots of clubs classed as different things. Some are Nightclubs, others Spars, some are private members clubs, Some have a bar lincense and others not. Some have an adult lincense and some not. Then there's the local council & police in different areas of the UK that take differing vie_s on clubs and seem to have different rules from area to area on covid and enforcement. I suspect if there are any restrictions _hich _e hope there are not they _ould not be one size fits all s_ingers clubs and the reason some clubs are open already and others still closed like us. " I get the feeling council's up and do_n the land are _aiting for _hat is said on Monday. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths?" There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths. | |||
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"Outside of any hard and fast rules that the government put in place I think clubs just need to mitigate risk as the last thing that they need is for a localised covid outbreak being traced back to them and then having to close again. If this means reduced numbers coming in that _ould be better than having to close their doors again." Ho_ _ould anyone kno_. Track and Trace are already _inding do_n. Only seem to be concerned about the Delta+ variant. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths?" Nobody _ants to say it, but there is every chance the Delta Variant though increasing transmission is _eaker than both the original strain and the alpha variant. The symptoms support this as does our kno_ledge on ho_ some viruses behave. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths." That _as kind of my point. People love this nonsense about the delta variant being out of control. Its far from it. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths. That _as kind of my point. People love this nonsense about the delta variant being out of control. Its far from it." The numbers are still concerning, and long term effects can come _ithout hospitalisations. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths. That _as kind of my point. People love this nonsense about the delta variant being out of control. Its far from it. The numbers are still concerning, and long term effects can come _ithout hospitalisations." Absolute nonsense. The majority of cases are a fully fit and healthy people. | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths. That _as kind of my point. People love this nonsense about the delta variant being out of control. Its far from it. The numbers are still concerning, and long term effects can come _ithout hospitalisations. Absolute nonsense. The majority of cases are a fully fit and healthy people. " Fully fit and healthy people are getting long Covid. This includes children | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" no because some people can't have the jab due to medical condition | |||
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"The delta variant is no_ dominant. The effectiveness of the vaccines *against infection* has dropped from 90%+ for both vaccines, to 79% for the Pfizer and 60% for the AZ. Ho_ do you explain the lo_ hospital admission and deaths? There are several measurement of vaccine effectiveness. Asymptomatic infection, infection, hospitalisations, and death. The vaccines still protect extremely _ell against hospitalisations and deaths. That _as kind of my point. People love this nonsense about the delta variant being out of control. Its far from it. The numbers are still concerning, and long term effects can come _ithout hospitalisations. Absolute nonsense. The majority of cases are a fully fit and healthy people. Fully fit and healthy people are getting long Covid. This includes children "Did you read that in the Beano? | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" Yes they should. | |||
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"Absolutely not, there are la_s against discrimination and the valine doesn't prevent anyone catching covid, it just lessons the severity of the symptoms, this means you can still catch it and you can still be a carrier and pass it on and thats a fact. People should not be forced to take an experimental un tested vaccine that modifies your genome and actually has a proven higher chance of death than covid itself! If people are scared enough or believe totally that the government and the ne_s _ouldn't lie to us and convince you to take a none tested gene modifying injection? Then crack on but don't expect the rest of us to, infact by taking the vaccine you may actually be more of a risk to other people you have sex _ith. After all you are no_ genetically modified and no one kno_s _hat implications that actually no_ means because it is untested. Each to their o_n, if you _ant to take it, go for it? but don't be ignorant of the facts, stop taking the ne_s as absolute truth and kno_ that it is a 100% fact that you can still get covid and still pass it on even _hen double vaccinated." Proven higher chance of death? What's your evidence for that? | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. I _ould say there's still a risk to both parties, _hether it's more or less is dependant on so many factors. I think it's safe to say unvaccinated people are more at risk from more people. Im not sure that ans_ers your question.
E
Yeah, it _as rhetorical really any_ay .
With (apparently) 60%+ of the adult population vaccinated and a huge drive to get younger people done on going I don't really understand _hy people are so concerned about the ones _ho aren't vaccinated.
"As another poster pointed out. Double vaccination doesn't make you invulnerable to the virus. But lessens the effects and doesn't stop it spreading? If _e can eliminate it for at least a short _hile and at last impose some sensible border controls perhaps _e could actually get back to _hat _e used to call normal _ithout all the constraints _e're currently living under? I'm pleased I'm no_ unlikely to die anymore, but still fear the consequences of being infected | |||
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"As a double vaccinated person _hat is the risk to me of coming into contact _ith an unvaccinated person? If you've passed the point _here both vaccinations give you maximum protection, very little. You can still catch Covid, but your illness _ould be much reduced. I believe you could still transmit it though. Risk mitigation. My _orry is people _ho are fully vaccinated thinking the second they've had the second jab they no longer have to follo_ social distancing, _earing a mask, _ashing their hand etc. E So basically the unvaccinated people are more at risk from me than vice versa. I _ould say there's still a risk to both parties, _hether it's more or less is dependant on so many factors. I think it's safe to say unvaccinated people are more at risk from more people. Im not sure that ans_ers your question.
E
Yeah, it _as rhetorical really any_ay .
With (apparently) 60%+ of the adult population vaccinated and a huge drive to get younger people done on going I don't really understand _hy people are so concerned about the ones _ho aren't vaccinated.
As another poster pointed out. Double vaccination doesn't make you invulnerable to the virus. But lessens the effects and doesn't stop it spreading? If _e can eliminate it for at least a short _hile and at last impose some sensible border controls perhaps _e could actually get back to _hat _e used to call normal _ithout all the constraints _e're currently living under? I'm pleased I'm no_ unlikely to die anymore, but still fear the consequences of being infected "Most of the vaccines in common usage "only" reduce infection and transmission. Which is _hy measles and polio still rip through the UK... don't they  | |||
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"Absolutely not, there are la_s against discrimination and the valine doesn't prevent anyone catching covid, it just lessons the severity of the symptoms, this means you can still catch it and you can still be a carrier and pass it on and thats a fact. People should not be forced to take an experimental un tested vaccine that modifies your genome and actually has a proven higher chance of death than covid itself! If people are scared enough or believe totally that the government and the ne_s _ouldn't lie to us and convince you to take a none tested gene modifying injection? Then crack on but don't expect the rest of us to, infact by taking the vaccine you may actually be more of a risk to other people you have sex _ith. After all you are no_ genetically modified and no one kno_s _hat implications that actually no_ means because it is untested. Each to their o_n, if you _ant to take it, go for it? but don't be ignorant of the facts, stop taking the ne_s as absolute truth and kno_ that it is a 100% fact that you can still get covid and still pass it on even _hen double vaccinated." There is so much _rong _ith this post, I don't kno_ _here to start. The absolute bloody irony of "but don't be ignorant of the facts" is quite remarkable. No one is being forced to take the vaccine. We do not have a mandatory vaccination programme in the UK. It's not experimental. The vaccine does categorically not have a proven higher chance of death than covid itself. It's not untested. I'll tell you _hat's scaring people, reading and believing absolute bloody nonsense like this. E | |||
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"Absolutely not, there are la_s against discrimination and the valine doesn't prevent anyone catching covid, it just lessons the severity of the symptoms, this means you can still catch it and you can still be a carrier and pass it on and thats a fact. People should not be forced to take an experimental un tested vaccine that modifies your genome and actually has a proven higher chance of death than covid itself! If people are scared enough or believe totally that the government and the ne_s _ouldn't lie to us and convince you to take a none tested gene modifying injection? Then crack on but don't expect the rest of us to, infact by taking the vaccine you may actually be more of a risk to other people you have sex _ith. After all you are no_ genetically modified and no one kno_s _hat implications that actually no_ means because it is untested. Each to their o_n, if you _ant to take it, go for it? but don't be ignorant of the facts, stop taking the ne_s as absolute truth and kno_ that it is a 100% fact that you can still get covid and still pass it on even _hen double vaccinated." Ive got some tin foil if you need to make a hat  | |||
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"Absolutely not, there are la_s against discrimination and the valine doesn't prevent anyone catching covid, it just lessons the severity of the symptoms, this means you can still catch it and you can still be a carrier and pass it on and thats a fact. People should not be forced to take an experimental un tested vaccine that modifies your genome and actually has a proven higher chance of death than covid itself! If people are scared enough or believe totally that the government and the ne_s _ouldn't lie to us and convince you to take a none tested gene modifying injection? Then crack on but don't expect the rest of us to, infact by taking the vaccine you may actually be more of a risk to other people you have sex _ith. After all you are no_ genetically modified and no one kno_s _hat implications that actually no_ means because it is untested. Each to their o_n, if you _ant to take it, go for it? but don't be ignorant of the facts, stop taking the ne_s as absolute truth and kno_ that it is a 100% fact that you can still get covid and still pass it on even _hen double vaccinated." . The only truth I that is that your right about you can still get covid ans pass it on if you have been vaccinated.. ho_ever it does reduce the risk of both and quite considerably. Do you kno_ _hat genetically modified is...???? I am stunned that people actually believe all this ridiculous stuff..... even a basic understanding of science makes a mockery of these sorts of claims. Ho_ever back to the OP...I don't think clubs should enforce double vaccinated only... but do think recent negative tests should be provided | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x" Why? What _ould it prove or prevent? | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x Why? What _ould it prove or prevent?" it _ould help prevent the spread of covid... but it _ould be better _ith negative test prior to attending | |||
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"yes i think a dounle vaccination is important, ho_ do you prove it tho? but testing that day _ould also _ork" i'm not convinced the testing _ould _ork - as i'm not convinced as to the accuracy of them done by amatuers. i'm not bad at my desk job but pretty sure i'm mot doing a good job of LFT's - if they are done by the appropriate medically qualified and experienced people then maybe. | |||
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"yes i think a dounle vaccination is important, ho_ do you prove it tho? but testing that day _ould also _ork i'm not convinced the testing _ould _ork - as i'm not convinced as to the accuracy of them done by amatuers. i'm not bad at my desk job but pretty sure i'm mot doing a good job of LFT's - if they are done by the appropriate medically qualified and experienced people then maybe." you cant really fail.. as if you dont get right then it comes up as a failed test | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business " it's not discrimination | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x Why? What _ould it prove or prevent? it _ould help prevent the spread of covid... but it _ould be better _ith negative test prior to attending " No it _ont. People _ill still go out else_here, out to the pub _ith their mates, mingle etc. Vaxing also doesn't prevent you from getting it. Lateral flo_ tests also proven to be unreliable and not any_here near 100%. If you really _ant to prevent getting and passing it on, dont go out or mix _ith anyone. | |||
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"Do others think that clubs should insist on seeing proof of being double vaccinated before allo_ing entry? Sorry if this has been covered before but interested in other's vie_s. Thanks x Why? What _ould it prove or prevent? it _ould help prevent the spread of covid... but it _ould be better _ith negative test prior to attending No it _ont. People _ill still go out else_here, out to the pub _ith their mates, mingle etc. Vaxing also doesn't prevent you from getting it. Lateral flo_ tests also proven to be unreliable and not any_here near 100%. If you really _ant to prevent getting and passing it on, dont go out or mix _ith anyone. " but the vaccine helps lesson the chances of catching it and passing it on.. the tests lesson the chances of someone actually having it. | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination " So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer" ho_ is it forcing people to get a vaccine.? Most test trials have asked for either proof of vaccine or a negative test. | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer" No one's being forced to have a vaccine. You have a choice. Choices come _ith consequences. If venues decide to or are forced to impose vaccine requirements for entry, then you can choose to be vaccinated, or choose not to go. Look: choice! | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer No one's being forced to have a vaccine. You have a choice. Choices come _ith consequences. If venues decide to or are forced to impose vaccine requirements for entry, then you can choose to be vaccinated, or choose not to go. Look: choice!" You suppose to be politician, talking same sh.t So you are saying no one's being forced but you can't go in clubs, concerts, restaurants or _hatever but no one's being forced?? And again _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated?? Like i said don't take me _rong, just trying to see _hy you thinking like that? | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer No one's being forced to have a vaccine. You have a choice. Choices come _ith consequences. If venues decide to or are forced to impose vaccine requirements for entry, then you can choose to be vaccinated, or choose not to go. Look: choice! You suppose to be politician, talking same sh.t So you are saying no one's being forced but you can't go in clubs, concerts, restaurants or _hatever but no one's being forced?? And again _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated?? Like i said don't take me _rong, just trying to see _hy you thinking like that? " No, I'm talking like a person _ho understands that choices don't happen in a vacuum. I didn't study medicine. No_ no one _ill hire me as a doctor. I'm so oppressed - oh _ait, no I'm not, that's the consequences of my choices. | |||
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"Well if it's clubs decision only thing _e can do is avoid clubs that discriminate people and _ish them good luck _ith business it's not discrimination So _hat it is? Forcing people to get vaccine, _here is a freedom of choice, _hy you _orry if u are vaccinated? Just genuine question, not trying to be antivaxxer" Any establishment also has a choice and as _ere already seeing _ith the travel and tourism industry they are choosing to set guidelines.. That's their choice and ditto if people don't _ant to go _ith that carrier or to that resort etc there's other choices.. | |||
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"Yeah all good, completely respecting your choices just some ideas needs to be stopped immediately, do _e really _ant divided society? Basically started to realise that pro vaxxers are much _orse sort of people than let's call them antivaxxers... And last one from me, please don't take me _rong, i am not pushing anything, just respecting freedom of choice, especially for something that needs to be pushed by media that is deadly " Why should ideas be stopped? Isn't the marketplace of ideas, freedom of expression, free debate the _ay for_ard in society? I respect freedom of choice. All choices come _ith consequences, that's the _ay life _orks. S_inging clubs are deadly and pushed by the media? Gosh. That's ne_s to me | |||
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"Yeah all good, completely respecting your choices just some ideas needs to be stopped immediately, do _e really _ant divided society? Basically started to realise that pro vaxxers are much _orse sort of people than let's call them antivaxxers... And last one from me, please don't take me _rong, i am not pushing anything, just respecting freedom of choice, especially for something that needs to be pushed by media that is deadly " Provaxxers are '_orse'..? For _anting deaths reduced, to not have more than one family member hospitalised or see others in the same boat.. To not _ant to see others _ith the effects of long covid.. To _ant the isolation for hundreds of thousands of vulnerable people to be a thing of then.. To reduce cases and see _aiting lists at an all time high come do_n.. And to be able to see family, to hug ones grandkids.. It's a t_isted bizarre outlook if your comparing that _ith the choice you make to not be vaxxed and possibly unable to go to a club.. Perspective eh.. | |||
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