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Vaccine and the rise in cases
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We are seeing a rise in cases in large parts of the country, all the talk and the news is looking like a no go for June 21st, even some suggesting more restrictions again.
My question with over 60 million doses given here in the UK what's the point then if we are still going to persist with lockdowns and restrictions despite a high level of vaccine take up. Eve tally we are going to have to live with some levels of covid, just like we do with a number of viruses. There is only so much e eryone can take. |
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We think about this similar,if vaccinations not help,what is point doing this,waste of money.
We need to back to live ,even with some level of new cases,we cant be under restrictions for next 2,5 maybe 10 years,virus will never gone |
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"We think about this similar,if vaccinations not help,what is point doing this,waste of money.
We need to back to live ,even with some level of new cases,we cant be under restrictions for next 2,5 maybe 10 years,virus will never gone"
At the moment there is no plan b if vaccines stop working, thankfully they are working at the moment. If they stop working in the future then if we open then eventually everyone will get covid at least once and probably most more than once. Death rates are currently 0.7 to 0.8% of people who catch covid. That would mean a UK death rate of over half million. Obviously if a lot people catch it at the same time them the bus can't cope and the death rate goes up. May be even up to 3% death rate like it was at the beginning pandemic, |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We are seeing a rise in cases in large parts of the country, all the talk and the news is looking like a no go for June 21st, even some suggesting more restrictions again.
My question with over 60 million doses given here in the UK what's the point then if we are still going to persist with lockdowns and restrictions despite a high level of vaccine take up. Eve tally we are going to have to live with some levels of covid, just like we do with a number of viruses. There is only so much e eryone can take. "
Its actually just approaching 40 million first doses given. In the past two weeks just over half of 30 - 39 year olds have received a first dose.
There are still a lot of people to take up the vaccine.
The majority of hospitalisation from Covid are now in the under 50’s so its fairly obvious to see that the vaccine is working as the groups that were most susceptible to the virus are not having so many infections or deaths.
There has been an outbreak in Canterbury (my area) and it centres around the University (see the pattern) and is (according to local talk) due to returning students particularly from abroad (Canterbury has a very large fee paying overseas student population).
If hospitalisations start to rapidly rise then June 21st may be a no go but i doubt the Government will do so unless absolutely necessary and probably when its to late. |
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"
There has been an outbreak in Canterbury (my area) and it centres around the University (see the pattern) and is (according to local talk) due to returning students particularly from abroad (Canterbury has a very large fee paying overseas student population).
"
Why would students return from overseas for a couple of weeks of online exams before the end of the academic year? My son hasn't even gone back from Leeds to Sheffield. |
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"
There has been an outbreak in Canterbury (my area) and it centres around the University (see the pattern) and is (according to local talk) due to returning students particularly from abroad (Canterbury has a very large fee paying overseas student population).
Why would students return from overseas for a couple of weeks of online exams before the end of the academic year? My son hasn't even gone back from Leeds to Sheffield. "
Some of ours have come back since 17 May. The visa rules have been amended so that if renewal is required before the next academic year, it can be done from the UK rather than having to return to the country of origin. I think students a) what to get away from home and b) are concerned about future changes to the red list so are coming while it's possible and just staying here all summer.
Universities have been told that from September, there will be no flexibility to allow students to study online from overseas, unless they have applied specifically for a distance learning course. Most UK university courses are not distance learning under normal circumstances. If students cannot arrive by 27 September to take up face to face study (for example, due to their country being on the red list) then they will have to try and defer (unis not doing this at the moment) or withdraw from their place.
Several universities I am aware of have stated no distance learning option will be available in September for students who cannot travel. |
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"
There has been an outbreak in Canterbury (my area) and it centres around the University (see the pattern) and is (according to local talk) due to returning students particularly from abroad (Canterbury has a very large fee paying overseas student population).
Why would students return from overseas for a couple of weeks of online exams before the end of the academic year? My son hasn't even gone back from Leeds to Sheffield.
Some of ours have come back since 17 May. The visa rules have been amended so that if renewal is required before the next academic year, it can be done from the UK rather than having to return to the country of origin. I think students a) what to get away from home and b) are concerned about future changes to the red list so are coming while it's possible and just staying here all summer.
Universities have been told that from September, there will be no flexibility to allow students to study online from overseas, unless they have applied specifically for a distance learning course. Most UK university courses are not distance learning under normal circumstances. If students cannot arrive by 27 September to take up face to face study (for example, due to their country being on the red list) then they will have to try and defer (unis not doing this at the moment) or withdraw from their place.
Several universities I am aware of have stated no distance learning option will be available in September for students who cannot travel."
That's an incredibly difficult place some students will be put in |
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By *D835Man
over a year ago
London |
"We are seeing a rise in cases in large parts of the country, all the talk and the news is looking like a no go for June 21st, even some suggesting more restrictions again.
My question with over 60 million doses given here in the UK what's the point then if we are still going to persist with lockdowns and restrictions despite a high level of vaccine take up. Eve tally we are going to have to live with some levels of covid, just like we do with a number of viruses. There is only so much e eryone can take. "
".......My question with over 60 million doses given here in the UK....."
----------------------------------
Only 24 Million have received both doses ( Not 60 million)
Some people who have received just one dose of the vaccine are still ending up in hospital.
We will start learning to live with the virus when whole adult population has been offered both doses. |
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We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over |
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By *hagTonightMan
over a year ago
From the land of haribos. |
"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over "
This and I want to add to everyone to research about the vaccine, dont just listen to one source  |
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We've just booked in our 2nd vaccine shots so i suspect thats more the issue.
A lot of people are still not fully dosed so hopefully, full vaccination will help.
Like everyone, we just want our lives back. |
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"We've just booked in our 2nd vaccine shots so i suspect thats more the issue.
A lot of people are still not fully dosed so hopefully, full vaccination will help.
Like everyone, we just want our lives back."
Yup |
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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago
Dudley |
"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over "
They never said it would stop you catching it or passing it on, they always told us it would help prevent death and serious illness, luckily the vaccines have proved that they do help stop transmission.
The vaccine will help get us back to normal if people accept it when offered.
The majority of deaths and hospitalisations are now in the age groups that are unvaccinated and people only partially vaccinated or people that have refused the vaccine.
Stop spreading bullshit that is EASILY disproven. |
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"Vaccines are efficient once pretty much everyone is vaccinated otherwise there's always cases.
A simple example is how many people are diagnosed with smallpox each year? "
Another example - measles outbreaks. They happen when full vaccination falls below a certain number. |
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It's a choice of restrictions or vaccinations to reduce the levels of infection.
Easing of restrictions shouldn't happen until the data suggests it's right. The right types and. Degree of restrictions should be created according to the conditions out there. |
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"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over
They never said it would stop you catching it or passing it on, they always told us it would help prevent death and serious illness, luckily the vaccines have proved that they do help stop transmission.
The vaccine will help get us back to normal if people accept it when offered.
The majority of deaths and hospitalisations are now in the age groups that are unvaccinated and people only partially vaccinated or people that have refused the vaccine.
Stop spreading bullshit that is EASILY disproven."
Bullshit is it. I have proof... Every government presentation prevaccine was to get us back to normal. Once the vaccine came along the continued that narrative. They n slowly the narrative changed to what you state.
I'm not spreading bullshit. This is fact.
You are indeed spreading bullshit. These vaccines do not stop the spread, fact. Indeed this very morning nicola sturgeon has tweeted questioning the vaccines effectiveness.
|
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"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over
They never said it would stop you catching it or passing it on, they always told us it would help prevent death and serious illness, luckily the vaccines have proved that they do help stop transmission.
The vaccine will help get us back to normal if people accept it when offered.
The majority of deaths and hospitalisations are now in the age groups that are unvaccinated and people only partially vaccinated or people that have refused the vaccine.
Stop spreading bullshit that is EASILY disproven."
https://youtu.be/rRorkvmRhBo
Straight from the horses mouth. |
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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago
Wiltshire and London |
"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over
They never said it would stop you catching it or passing it on, they always told us it would help prevent death and serious illness, luckily the vaccines have proved that they do help stop transmission.
The vaccine will help get us back to normal if people accept it when offered.
The majority of deaths and hospitalisations are now in the age groups that are unvaccinated and people only partially vaccinated or people that have refused the vaccine.
Stop spreading bullshit that is EASILY disproven."
|
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I hate to say it but we have some why stupid people commenting on here.
To suggest the vaccine isn’t working is ridiculous - we had 60,000 cases of Covid daily a few months ago , now we have around 3,000. Deaths from Covid were in the hundreds per day, yesterday there were six.
To date around 40M people have had the first vaccination (less are fully vaccinated) so that obviously means that well over a third of the population have no protection from Covid as they haven’t been vaccinated.
It’s very obvious that while so many are still not vaccinated the virus is still going to spread to some extent and the Indian variant which clearly transmits more easily than previous versions is the cause of the increase. Also the vast majority of those catching the virus now are those who are not vaccinated.
It’s clear from some of the opinions on here that those against the vaccine were clearly hoping that those among us who were prepared to be vaccinated we’re going to eradicate the virus on their behalf - this clearly isn’t going to be the case and they are now the ones at most risk. |
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I'm not questioning the vaccine or it effectiveness, just the effectiveness of giving everyone the vaccine then keeping restrictions. I understand not everyone has had a both doses, but a high percentage of protection comes from one dose and even higher after the second. The 60million number was all over the news last weekend, in total doses given out. A large percentage of the unvaccinated will be under 18s at the moment.
My point is, when we or the majority will have had the vaccine are these restrictions going to stay, as we're looking like the 21st June easing is in doubt over a relatively small number of cases and if you believe some media these cases of hospitalised people are people that so are of vaccine age but have not yet had it for whatever reason.
We are looking at more turmoil over people not getting vaccinated constantly passing covid around. |
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"I'm not questioning the vaccine or it effectiveness, just the effectiveness of giving everyone the vaccine then keeping restrictions. I understand not everyone has had a both doses, but a high percentage of protection comes from one dose and even higher after the second. The 60million number was all over the news last weekend, in total doses given out. A large percentage of the unvaccinated will be under 18s at the moment.
My point is, when we or the majority will have had the vaccine are these restrictions going to stay, as we're looking like the 21st June easing is in doubt over a relatively small number of cases and if you believe some media these cases of hospitalised people are people that so are of vaccine age but have not yet had it for whatever reason.
We are looking at more turmoil over people not getting vaccinated constantly passing covid around. "
Cost/benefit analysis. How bad might the harm be?
Death is not the only poor outcome to consider, nor the only one with lingering effects.
That's what the government needs to consider. (Along with political, economic, other concerns) |
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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago
Wiltshire and London |
"we're looking like the 21st June easing is in doubt over a relatively small number of cases "
I'd bet that Johnson is willing to take a gamble on that "relatively small number", and equally that if he does, it won't stay small given the number still unvaccinated. |
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"we're looking like the 21st June easing is in doubt over a relatively small number of cases
I'd bet that Johnson is willing to take a gamble on that "relatively small number", and equally that if he does, it won't stay small given the number still unvaccinated."
Yes, I agree |
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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago
Wiltshire and London |
"
Death is not the only poor outcome to consider, nor the only one with lingering effects.
That's what the government needs to consider. (Along with political, economic, other concerns)"
This lot will put political concerns at the top of the list. |
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"I hate to say it but we have some why stupid people commenting on here.
To suggest the vaccine isn’t working is ridiculous - we had 60,000 cases of Covid daily a few months ago , now we have around 3,000. Deaths from Covid were in the hundreds per day, yesterday there were six.
To date around 40M people have had the first vaccination (less are fully vaccinated) so that obviously means that well over a third of the population have no protection from Covid as they haven’t been vaccinated.
It’s very obvious that while so many are still not vaccinated the virus is still going to spread to some extent and the Indian variant which clearly transmits more easily than previous versions is the cause of the increase. Also the vast majority of those catching the virus now are those who are not vaccinated.
It’s clear from some of the opinions on here that those against the vaccine were clearly hoping that those among us who were prepared to be vaccinated we’re going to eradicate the virus on their behalf - this clearly isn’t going to be the case and they are now the ones at most risk."
*Applause* |
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By *eeleyWoman
over a year ago
Dudley |
"We were told that to get back to normal that we had to get vaccinated.
We are now told that people can travel abroad if they can prove that they have had a vaccination.
This is bonkers.... We were sold a pup by the medicine doctors... The vaccinations provide assistance in reducing the effects of the virus. It does not stop you catching or spreading it.
The government have made the population take a vaccination on false pretenses.
For vax or not, everyone must agree that this is the case. We were told umpteen times that to get back to normal we had to get vaccinated.
The problem now is the government cannot turn round and say, em see that vacci e we got you to take so that we can get back to normal. Well it kind of will not... Sorry. Once in the vaccine cannot be taken out. Medicine Dr's the lot of them.
Stay safe rant over
They never said it would stop you catching it or passing it on, they always told us it would help prevent death and serious illness, luckily the vaccines have proved that they do help stop transmission.
The vaccine will help get us back to normal if people accept it when offered.
The majority of deaths and hospitalisations are now in the age groups that are unvaccinated and people only partially vaccinated or people that have refused the vaccine.
Stop spreading bullshit that is EASILY disproven.
Bullshit is it. I have proof... Every government presentation prevaccine was to get us back to normal. Once the vaccine came along the continued that narrative. They n slowly the narrative changed to what you state.
I'm not spreading bullshit. This is fact.
You are indeed spreading bullshit. These vaccines do not stop the spread, fact. Indeed this very morning nicola sturgeon has tweeted questioning the vaccines effectiveness.
"
Are the restrictions not easing gradually? They didn't say as soon as you are vaccinated you can do whatever you like, you have either misunderstood or are looking for a reason to be pissed off.
Most of us understand perfectly well that vaccination only works when a high percentage of people get vaccinated.
Oh and the video you posted actually doesn't prove your point so I have no idea why you'd post it. |
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Nicola Sturgeon has not Tweeted to question the effectiveness of vaccines. Just had a little look at her Twitter page and I found this Tweet:
"It is absolutely the case that the key question for
@scotgov now (and I’m sure governments elsewhere too) is whether & to what extent vaccines are breaking the link between cases & serious illness. Evidence so far is encouraging but we need to monitor.."
All she's saying is we need to collate the evidence of the extent to which vaccines break the link between cases and serious illness (usually measured by a need for hospital admission). She did not say the vaccines are ineffective.
Her Tweet was in response to someone else, who shared the following data, which suggests that the vaccines DO break the link between the disease and serious illness:
"What does the data tell us so far?
Take the wk/ending May 18*:
- There were 1,964 cases; hospital admissions averaged 9.6 per day; ICU 0.3 per day....
....When we had a similar number of cases as the second wave took off - 1,993 in the week ending Sept 22 (pre-Kent variant) - we were averaging 22.1 hospital admissions per day (ie. more than twice as many) and 1.1 ICU per day (more than three times as many)" |
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Vacsiens are not perfect protection.the virus is constantly changing .to be fully protected you would need 6 boosters every year and the number of boosters would go up as new strains keep evolving.  |
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By *andKBCouple
over a year ago
Plymouth |
From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
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"From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
"
Yes, most of the issue for the moment is in the partially or unvaccinated. |
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By *andKBCouple
over a year ago
Plymouth |
"From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
Yes, most of the issue for the moment is in the partially or unvaccinated."
Unfortunately this is going to cause problems for a while then, whilst people are still refusing the vaccine. I know there will be a small percentage of people who genuinely can't have it.
I work with autistic people and people with learning disabilities. Some have massive fears of needles and challenging behaviours. Discussions are being made about ethical solutions to this. And of course some people with blood cancers, etc. |
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"From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
Yes, most of the issue for the moment is in the partially or unvaccinated.
Unfortunately this is going to cause problems for a while then, whilst people are still refusing the vaccine. I know there will be a small percentage of people who genuinely can't have it.
I work with autistic people and people with learning disabilities. Some have massive fears of needles and challenging behaviours. Discussions are being made about ethical solutions to this. And of course some people with blood cancers, etc."
Yes.
Those who can't, or where there are disabilities... Fuck. I want them to be protected by the rest of us. You know? This is why choice matters, because some people can't choose, and need our protection. |
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By *andKBCouple
over a year ago
Plymouth |
"From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
Yes, most of the issue for the moment is in the partially or unvaccinated.
Unfortunately this is going to cause problems for a while then, whilst people are still refusing the vaccine. I know there will be a small percentage of people who genuinely can't have it.
I work with autistic people and people with learning disabilities. Some have massive fears of needles and challenging behaviours. Discussions are being made about ethical solutions to this. And of course some people with blood cancers, etc.
Yes.
Those who can't, or where there are disabilities... Fuck. I want them to be protected by the rest of us. You know? This is why choice matters, because some people can't choose, and need our protection."
I couldn't agree more on this point!
I work in care and I got vaccinated in the first week to protect not only myself but others around me. |
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"From what I've read and researched the increase in cases is amongst the younger generation who have yet to be vaccinated and those refusing to be vaccinated.
The first 4 people who were said to have died in the UK from the Indian variant. Were all eligible for the vaccine but had declined it.
Yes, most of the issue for the moment is in the partially or unvaccinated.
Unfortunately this is going to cause problems for a while then, whilst people are still refusing the vaccine. I know there will be a small percentage of people who genuinely can't have it.
I work with autistic people and people with learning disabilities. Some have massive fears of needles and challenging behaviours. Discussions are being made about ethical solutions to this. And of course some people with blood cancers, etc.
Yes.
Those who can't, or where there are disabilities... Fuck. I want them to be protected by the rest of us. You know? This is why choice matters, because some people can't choose, and need our protection.
I couldn't agree more on this point!
I work in care and I got vaccinated in the first week to protect not only myself but others around me. "
I volunteer with the elderly and jumped at every trial I could to get vaccinated as soon as possible.
They got jabbed before me, but I know that older immune systems don't respond as well.
I hope to form part a protective shield around those who need the protection. (Because that's how vaccines work, and it increasingly seems these ones work too) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Even though the deaths are very low, they lag behind the number of cases by about 3 to 4 weeks so the big test will be if the hospitalisations and deaths go up fast by that time. |
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By *andR510Couple
over a year ago
St Neots/Wisbech |
Anyone else remember why we had to have lockdowns ?
As I recall it was to stop the NHS from being overwhelmed, the vast majority of which being the the elderly and "at risk".
We currently stand at 24 million being fully vaccinated which is the entire number (plus some) of those we were protecting.
Who are we protecting now ? |
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