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Anti vaccination
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it" Don't know if anti but had first and 8 weeks on still have side effects so getting more worried about 2nd as at this rate will still be having side effects when second is due ? | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. " Covid 2 weeks with a cold not to bad. Vaccine joint pain carpal tunnel damage. Sick ness now on Prochlorperazine 3 times a day. Oh and hot and cold and head ackes. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. " What have you based this opinion on? | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it" I have no problem with vaccines, I was researching which one to take when it became apparent that not only were there too many unanswered questions about them, but that the questions themselves were actively being suppressed and discussions censored. As the viability of low risk treatments became more and more apparent I decided to wait for longer term study results, see how the balance of risk panned out in practice.  | |||
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"I'm curious about what is got to do with you? " got to do with who...or does an opinion not count these days unless your vaccinated  | |||
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"I'm curious about what is got to do with you? got to do with who...or does an opinion not count these days unless your vaccinated "I was referring to the OP. Or in fact anyone who questions why someone does not have a vaccine. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. What have you based this opinion on? " Personal experience had covid in February and for me it we like a bad cold. However the vaccine I am having lots of side effects with. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. " Sorry to hear your dad is also struggling what problems is he having | |||
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"Simple, globally Hundreds of thousands haven’t died from the jab. " True... but if you wanted to play devil's advocate the flip side of that statement is millions have had covid worldwide and haven't died from it and most weren't hospitalised either. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. Sorry to hear your dad is also struggling what problems is he having " Lost energy, has struggled with joint pain. Headaches... 5 weeks and counting, he has not improved. Its affecting his mobility. Thanks for asking. | |||
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"I'm curious about what is got to do with you? got to do with who...or does an opinion not count these days unless your vaccinated
I was referring to the OP. Or in fact anyone who questions why someone does not have a vaccine.
"Because some people are interested in other points of view. Learning new things may make them change their mind. Both ways. Is learning new things bad? | |||
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"I'm curious about what is got to do with you? got to do with who...or does an opinion not count these days unless your vaccinated
I was referring to the OP. Or in fact anyone who questions why someone does not have a vaccine.
"The forum would be a pretty boring place if people weren’t willing to ask and answer questions | |||
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"Simple, globally Hundreds of thousands haven’t died from the jab. True... but if you wanted to play devil's advocate the flip side of that statement is millions have had covid worldwide and haven't died from it and most weren't hospitalised either." It is a numbers game, there is no propaganda government conspiracies. Media and other sources takes things out of context for their own agendas. 0.001% of people in the uk die of blood clots through the year naturally. Roughy 0.0001% have dies of blood clots after having the jab. so you are at least 10x more likely to die of blood clots naturally - simples. This of course is medical journal propaganda. The majority of people who die of covid dir of blood clots. Especially younger groups stand more chance of dying in a road RTI than jab, but would that stop you driving. The majority of people seriously ill in hospital with covid currently are the ones that didn't have the jab when it was offered it is Russian roulette like life itself, you have to decide how many bullets you put in the cylinder before you pull the trigger. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. Sorry to hear your dad is also struggling what problems is he having Lost energy, has struggled with joint pain. Headaches... 5 weeks and counting, he has not improved. Its affecting his mobility. Thanks for asking. " I'm the same 8 weeks on also ask him if he feels ( travel sick ) I have now since the jab was ok for the first 10 days. It's the second I'm worried about.oh I'm 53 | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. Sorry to hear your dad is also struggling what problems is he having Lost energy, has struggled with joint pain. Headaches... 5 weeks and counting, he has not improved. Its affecting his mobility. Thanks for asking. I'm the same 8 weeks on also ask him if he feels ( travel sick ) I have now since the jab was ok for the first 10 days. It's the second I'm worried about.oh I'm 53 " He has had two jabs. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. Sorry to hear your dad is also struggling what problems is he having Lost energy, has struggled with joint pain. Headaches... 5 weeks and counting, he has not improved. Its affecting his mobility. Thanks for asking. I'm the same 8 weeks on also ask him if he feels ( travel sick ) I have now since the jab was ok for the first 10 days. It's the second I'm worried about.oh I'm 53 He has had two jabs. " I feel for him hope he gets better soon thanks for sharing good to know I'm knot on my own. Even if it is uncommon. | |||
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"Suppose we have 2 scientists: Scientist A overstates the effectiveness of the vaccines and dismisses any consideration of side effects. Government supports scientist A, media reports claim. No backlash. Scientist B claims vaccines may not be as safe as we’re encouraged to believe. Also questions the value in taking them for someone young, fit and healthy. There’s backlash, media reports backlash. New words are created to discredit scientist B and anyone who is inclined to follow their chain of thought. People may be misled to think Scientist A is right & B is wrong. The real argument should be that both A and B exaggerated their claims. Those who spoke out against Scientist B’s claims feel like they did the right thing by fact checking. However Scientist A’s claims remain unchecked, and are held as sacrosanct. I don’t know what the solution is but my vaccine and health status are my business and nobody else’s. I will arrive at my own conclusions and do what I feel is best for me. As we are still in the relatively early days of this disease and vaccinations no decision can be, or can claim to be 100% correct. " Spot on. Everyone needs to respect others opinions. | |||
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"Suppose we have 2 scientists: Scientist A overstates the effectiveness of the vaccines and dismisses any consideration of side effects. Government supports scientist A, media reports claim. No backlash. Scientist B claims vaccines may not be as safe as we’re encouraged to believe. Also questions the value in taking them for someone young, fit and healthy. There’s backlash, media reports backlash. New words are created to discredit scientist B and anyone who is inclined to follow their chain of thought. People may be misled to think Scientist A is right & B is wrong. The real argument should be that both A and B exaggerated their claims. Those who spoke out against Scientist B’s claims feel like they did the right thing by fact checking. However Scientist A’s claims remain unchecked, and are held as sacrosanct. I don’t know what the solution is but my vaccine and health status are my business and nobody else’s. I will arrive at my own conclusions and do what I feel is best for me. As we are still in the relatively early days of this disease and vaccinations no decision can be, or can claim to be 100% correct. " I agree with this. Unfortunately the people supporting scientist B often use ridiculous theories to back them up. It discredits them. There needs to be discussion from both A and B. | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep? "
Reviews are pointless, much like veris. | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep?
Reviews are pointless, much like veris. "Exactly, we are not machines or clones of each other. I posted after my first jab as the following day the pain from the injuries (I have constant niggly pain everyday) from a thirty year old bike accident stopped me in my tracks, apparently some other bikers had similar issues with old injuries while others had nothing. S | |||
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"Suppose we have 2 scientists: Scientist A overstates the effectiveness of the vaccines and dismisses any consideration of side effects. Government supports scientist A, media reports claim. No backlash. Scientist B claims vaccines may not be as safe as we’re encouraged to believe. Also questions the value in taking them for someone young, fit and healthy. There’s backlash, media reports backlash. New words are created to discredit scientist B and anyone who is inclined to follow their chain of thought. People may be misled to think Scientist A is right & B is wrong. The real argument should be that both A and B exaggerated their claims. Those who spoke out against Scientist B’s claims feel like they did the right thing by fact checking. However Scientist A’s claims remain unchecked, and are held as sacrosanct. I don’t know what the solution is but my vaccine and health status are my business and nobody else’s. I will arrive at my own conclusions and do what I feel is best for me. As we are still in the relatively early days of this disease and vaccinations no decision can be, or can claim to be 100% correct. " Yes, that's about the size of it. And there is a gagging order on the media too. They are not allowed to question A or interview B, so genuine questions are never asked or answered, no depth or nuance allowed, no investigative journalism (remember that!!) just the Orwellian chorus. | |||
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"Suppose we have 2 scientists: Scientist A overstates the effectiveness of the vaccines and dismisses any consideration of side effects. Government supports scientist A, media reports claim. No backlash. Scientist B claims vaccines may not be as safe as we’re encouraged to believe. Also questions the value in taking them for someone young, fit and healthy. There’s backlash, media reports backlash. New words are created to discredit scientist B and anyone who is inclined to follow their chain of thought. People may be misled to think Scientist A is right & B is wrong. The real argument should be that both A and B exaggerated their claims. Those who spoke out against Scientist B’s claims feel like they did the right thing by fact checking. However Scientist A’s claims remain unchecked, and are held as sacrosanct. I don’t know what the solution is but my vaccine and health status are my business and nobody else’s. I will arrive at my own conclusions and do what I feel is best for me. As we are still in the relatively early days of this disease and vaccinations no decision can be, or can claim to be 100% correct. " The problem with such a scenario is there are those that would back scientist B because a government is backing A and try convince other they should also back B - so in the the end they could be potentially endangering peoples lives because of their own agenda. Hence the point that certain groups of people are highlighting and over stating blood clots due to vaccines because it suits their own narratives and agendas despite empirical medical evidence to the contrary as to the risks. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. " Simply wrong , think you read too many rediculous internet conspiracy theories. Btw man did land on the moon | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Suppose we have 2 scientists: Scientist A overstates the effectiveness of the vaccines and dismisses any consideration of side effects. Government supports scientist A, media reports claim. No backlash. Scientist B claims vaccines may not be as safe as we’re encouraged to believe. Also questions the value in taking them for someone young, fit and healthy. There’s backlash, media reports backlash. New words are created to discredit scientist B and anyone who is inclined to follow their chain of thought. People may be misled to think Scientist A is right & B is wrong. The real argument should be that both A and B exaggerated their claims. Those who spoke out against Scientist B’s claims feel like they did the right thing by fact checking. However Scientist A’s claims remain unchecked, and are held as sacrosanct. I don’t know what the solution is but my vaccine and health status are my business and nobody else’s. I will arrive at my own conclusions and do what I feel is best for me. As we are still in the relatively early days of this disease and vaccinations no decision can be, or can claim to be 100% correct. " Fair comment | |||
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"Anecdotal evidence, like much on Fab, but we have both been vaccinated, as have our children and most, if not all of our friends and if you call a sore arm where a needle went in a side effect then that's been the worst of it. Regarding Covid however we have friends and family who were very ill with it during pre vaccination days and one (42year old) is struggling with long covid and two are dead. This is our experience, not opinions, and everyone has different experiences. " I couldn't agree more... I had covid last year and fully recovered. Have friends who had covid all fully recovered. Don't know anyone with long covid or who died. In terms of vaccines - family with zero reactions, family with nasty reactions also personally know 2 people seriously affected with AZ jab one of whom still in hospital after 3 weeks with life threatening blood clots. It is all relative... Most people who contract Covid will NOT die BUT some will Most people who contract Covid will NOT get long covid BUT some will Most people who have the vaccine will NOT get serious side effects BUT some will Most people who have the vaccine will NOT die BUT some will. The key issue is trying to suggest that there is a single one size fits all solution to Covid because there isn't. | |||
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"Anecdotal evidence, like much on Fab, but we have both been vaccinated, as have our children and most, if not all of our friends and if you call a sore arm where a needle went in a side effect then that's been the worst of it. Regarding Covid however we have friends and family who were very ill with it during pre vaccination days and one (42year old) is struggling with long covid and two are dead. This is our experience, not opinions, and everyone has different experiences. I couldn't agree more... I had covid last year and fully recovered. Have friends who had covid all fully recovered. Don't know anyone with long covid or who died. In terms of vaccines - family with zero reactions, family with nasty reactions also personally know 2 people seriously affected with AZ jab one of whom still in hospital after 3 weeks with life threatening blood clots. It is all relative... Most people who contract Covid will NOT die BUT some will Most people who contract Covid will NOT get long covid BUT some will Most people who have the vaccine will NOT get serious side effects BUT some will Most people who have the vaccine will NOT die BUT some will. The key issue is trying to suggest that there is a single one size fits all solution to Covid because there isn't." You are of course correct but you have to compare all the above with numbers in each group. The elephant in the room is without vaccines everyone would eventually get covid and with death rate of around 0.7% that is a lot of deaths eventually. The other thing is without vaccine the alternative is lockdown and I think pretty much every one is sick of them. | |||
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"I'm not 'anti-vax' and I've had all my vaccines as a child and my son has had all his (getting some now due to delays, meningitis, dip, HPV etc) But I'm not getting this one yet. I'd rather find out what the long term plan is re annual vaccines, boosters, whether it's applicable to all or just the vulnerable etc. I'm not rushing into it " Yup, there's a new task force too: "Eddie Gray appointed chair of Antivirals Taskforce Eddie will be responsible for leading the work of the Taskforce and achieving its objective of having antiviral treatments ready for deployment by autumn 2021. The Antivirals Taskforce was launched by the government in April 2021 to identify treatments for UK patients who have been exposed to COVID-19 to stop the infection spreading and speed up recovery time. The Taskforce will search for the most promising novel antiviral medicines that can be taken at home and will support their development through clinical trials to ensure they can be rapidly rolled out to patients as early as the autumn." Well I'm disturbed by the word 'novel' but better late than never, this is the first thing that should've been done IMO, people MUST be treated before they deteriorate. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. " Points you raise - 1. The vaccines were to help us to get back to normal. They are 1 of the 2 options that we have - it's restrictions or vaccines. 2. The effects of vaccines. They help to stop you getting infected and to reduce the severity of the disease, including stopping deaths. They also reduce the infections that you’ll pass on to others - fewer people will catch it as a result. 4. Honesty of the people at the top. We vote them in and have to put up with them. The points you raise that they have given, that vaccines will reduce the impact on society, infection severity and levels hold true. Your father having been jabbed and thinking he's totally safe, is 1 of poor education about the vaccines. They currently protect against known variants. Future mutations may not be protected against, hence the reason to reduce infection levels as much as possible, to reduce the chances of such mutations happening. As with many vaccines, protection isn't always lifelong. A simple combined flu and covid jab may be all that's needed to retain a country that's protected. We didn't follow the leads of places like Australia and New Zealand, with very strong border controls, until very late. We've still had almost 2 million people who don't reside her enter the UK since the start of the current lockdown. Leaders are certainly not telling the full truth but we get what we are stuck with. We can individually do what we can to protect ourselves and others. The restrictions and the vaccines have helped to make the country safer, as people have done their part and followed the guidance. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. " With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now "Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/ This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well . | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/
This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well . "Same here I am a full time carer for my mum and due to this I am the biggest risk to her as I am the one that does all the shopping and goes out when she needs things , she has already lost a leg to dieabities and a third of her lung to cancer I am sure as hell not going to risk her catching this bloody virus. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/
This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well . "No one forgets that but some people don’t want to have a vaccine when ultimately it doesn’t benefit them really as they are fit and healthy. Why would someone put total strangers in front of there own well-being. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/
This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well . "I protect myself *and* others. Win win. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now "This is a very nieve and selfish reasoning. Footballers atheletes drop dead at the high of their fitness. One of the features of the virus it convinces the immune system it doesn't exist until it has done what it wanted to. It may not kill you but you may in turn pass it on to 1000s of others who die. Unfortunately it is these kinds of attitudes put us where we were. | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep?
Reviews are pointless, much like veris.
Exactly, we are not machines or clones of each other. I posted after my first jab as the following day the pain from the injuries (I have constant niggly pain everyday) from a thirty year old bike accident stopped me in my tracks, apparently some other bikers had similar issues with old injuries while others had nothing.
S"Ex rugby guy and yes its like all the old damage coming back in one hit Thanks for your in put | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
This is a very nieve and selfish reasoning. Footballers atheletes drop dead at the high of their fitness. One of the features of the virus it convinces the immune system it doesn't exist until it has done what it wanted to. It may not kill you but you may in turn pass it on to 1000s of others who die.
Unfortunately it is these kinds of attitudes put us where we were. "Footballers and Athletes dying at the height of their fitness. have you got a link to these reported deaths. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
This is a very nieve and selfish reasoning. Footballers atheletes drop dead at the high of their fitness. One of the features of the virus it convinces the immune system it doesn't exist until it has done what it wanted to. It may not kill you but you may in turn pass it on to 1000s of others who die.
Unfortunately it is these kinds of attitudes put us where we were.
Footballers and Athletes dying at the height of their fitness.
have you got a link to these reported deaths."Why? Since when have facts in these forums got in the way of a good conspiracy theory or anti vaccine rhetoric. There are currently many seriosly ill in hospital who thought attitudes like these, there are also many more probably seriously ill in hospital because people who have these attitudes. If you want to play Russian roulette with your life that's up to you. I'm thinking of the others that had Russian roulette played for them and didn't have a choice. I wish you remain fit and healthy  | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep?
Reviews are pointless, much like veris.
Exactly, we are not machines or clones of each other. I posted after my first jab as the following day the pain from the injuries (I have constant niggly pain everyday) from a thirty year old bike accident stopped me in my tracks, apparently some other bikers had similar issues with old injuries while others had nothing.
S"I remember you posting about that. Are you doing better now? | |||
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"It important to state that i am not Anti vaccine due to the need to eradicate diseases such as smallpox, however im very against vaccine programmes being run by big pharma, for profit. I believe vaccine programmes should be dealt with by the state using goverment scientists and goverment facilities, either that or vaccine programmes are legally a non-profit operation businesses can apply to run." Did I no miss something is the vaccination program not being run by the state via the NHS with is funded by the state? Are AZ not producing vaccine non profit and supported by the state? Produced in government funded facilities in the UK | |||
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"It important to state that i am not Anti vaccine due to the need to eradicate diseases such as smallpox, however im very against vaccine programmes being run by big pharma, for profit. I believe vaccine programmes should be dealt with by the state using goverment scientists and goverment facilities, either that or vaccine programmes are legally a non-profit operation businesses can apply to run. Did I not miss something is the vaccination program not being run by the state via the NHS with is funded by the state? Are AZ not producing vaccine non profit and supported by the state? Produced in government funded facilities in the UK " Oh and AZ was government developed by Oxford University scientists using government funding. AZ | |||
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"No jab, no job. Simples. (Unless you have a proven medical need to not get vaccinated.) " Legal minefield although my cursory glance at the commentary suggests that the stance is changing | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/
This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well .
No one forgets that but some people don’t want to have a vaccine when ultimately it doesn’t benefit them really as they are fit and healthy.
Why would someone put total strangers in front of there own well-being. "I do/would in lots of aspects of my life .. Isn't that what makes us different from when we were savages? | |||
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"You can't sue the companies if something goes wrong, and low and behold things are going wrong, I will wait and let the, I'm sorry to say this, gullible guinea pigs take it first and see what happens, and if you want to chip in with the Indian variant I know someone who works at the airport and said that people flying in from there, are not told to self isolate, no testing, I've also worked all the way through this no mask no problems I'm glad to say my immune system is awesome Best vaccination ever, oh and keep sanitising yourselves to death melting your livers, kidneys, so on and so forth do your research into this please oh and take care love ya!" Yep you just keep spreading it around lets hope you don't pass it on to someone you love, but you just mite be OK  | |||
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"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Quarantine the sick not the healthy and etc. No one wants to die but life must go on and draconian methods such as vaccine passports will furather reduce our freedoms which are being eroded right under our nose." The many? Currently are about about 70% vaccinated..so indeed the needs of the many does actually outweigh the few might be more apt I would say? | |||
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"You can't sue the companies if something goes wrong, and low and behold things are going wrong, I will wait and let the, I'm sorry to say this, gullible guinea pigs take it first and see what happens, and if you want to chip in with the Indian variant I know someone who works at the airport and said that people flying in from there, are not told to self isolate, no testing, I've also worked all the way through this no mask no problems I'm glad to say my immune system is awesome Best vaccination ever, oh and keep sanitising yourselves to death melting your livers, kidneys, so on and so forth do your research into this please oh and take care love ya!" Glad your health is fine.. The problem is other peoples not yours..thats why people are having the jab..go on ask them! Also I would be careful..this time next year no jab no job will be how it is particularly for anyone self employed or a tradesman.. | |||
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"You can't sue the companies if something goes wrong, and low and behold things are going wrong, I will wait and let the, I'm sorry to say this, gullible guinea pigs take it first and see what happens, and if you want to chip in with the Indian variant I know someone who works at the airport and said that people flying in from there, are not told to self isolate, no testing, I've also worked all the way through this no mask no problems I'm glad to say my immune system is awesome Best vaccination ever, oh and keep sanitising yourselves to death melting your livers, kidneys, so on and so forth do your research into this please oh and take care love ya! Glad your health is fine.. The problem is other peoples not yours..thats why people are having the jab..go on ask them! Also I would be careful..this time next year no jab no job will be how it is particularly for anyone self employed or a tradesman.. " Can't beat a bit of fascism to force people into thing's too soothe your fears , eh | |||
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"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Quarantine the sick not the healthy and etc. No one wants to die but life must go on and draconian methods such as vaccine passports will furather reduce our freedoms which are being eroded right under our nose." The cowards will always preach 'compassion' whilst happily tossing your rights away unfortunately | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep?
Reviews are pointless, much like veris.
Exactly, we are not machines or clones of each other. I posted after my first jab as the following day the pain from the injuries (I have constant niggly pain everyday) from a thirty year old bike accident stopped me in my tracks, apparently some other bikers had similar issues with old injuries while others had nothing.
S
I remember you posting about that. Are you doing better now? "Yes, all fine here, no longterm effects. Stopped me doing anything at all for a day or so & gradually eased off over the next few days. Will be prepared for it with the second jab though ?? S | |||
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"You can't sue the companies if something goes wrong, and low and behold things are going wrong, I will wait and let the, I'm sorry to say this, gullible guinea pigs take it first and see what happens, and if you want to chip in with the Indian variant I know someone who works at the airport and said that people flying in from there, are not told to self isolate, no testing, I've also worked all the way through this no mask no problems I'm glad to say my immune system is awesome Best vaccination ever, oh and keep sanitising yourselves to death melting your livers, kidneys, so on and so forth do your research into this please oh and take care love ya! Glad your health is fine.. The problem is other peoples not yours..thats why people are having the jab..go on ask them! Also I would be careful..this time next year no jab no job will be how it is particularly for anyone self employed or a tradesman.. " Don’t think that’s going to be true for everyone as I know a company that have already told their self employed staff & on the books staff they don’t care if they have had the jab as it’s not up to them so just to keep social distancing and get on with your work. | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. With you on this. If you are healthy with no underlying conditions there is nothing to worry about and no need for experimental so called vaccines
When you have your metabolism running at 100% you just do not fall prey the viruses, or at least I do not and haven't for as long as I can remember now
Are you forgetting 90% of the reason to have the vaccine is because you don't know you already have it and could pass it on to someone?/
This is not about protecting yourself..its about protecting others..so unless you are tested regularly you can not say you are safe and couldn't pass it on to someone weaker in health or vulnerable..thats why I have had had my jab.. And why I believe anyone in good conscience ought to as well .
No one forgets that but some people don’t want to have a vaccine when ultimately it doesn’t benefit them really as they are fit and healthy.
Why would someone put total strangers in front of there own well-being.
I do/would in lots of aspects of my life .. Isn't that what makes us different from when we were savages? "So do I in other aspects of my life... doesn’t mean I will do it in every aspect of my life. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it" its called FREEE WILL | |||
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"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. Quarantine the sick not the healthy and etc. No one wants to die but life must go on and draconian methods such as vaccine passports will furather reduce our freedoms which are being eroded right under our nose. The cowards will always preach 'compassion' whilst happily tossing your rights away, unfortunately" So to be clear are you saying that you aren't concerned about passing on the virus to someone who may not be as resilient as you? and that's the reason you are refusing to do anything to reduce the spread .. even to the point of not masking up ? hmm | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL " Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. " There are plenty of people who don’t give a crap about if the handyman is vaccinated or not. You moaning in a pub about someone who’s unvaccinated in there... How will you know? Will you be going around asking every member? and if the pub/place doesn’t have a policy in place then they won’t do anything about it. Are you really going to be enjoying a nice meal out but be more worried about sally across the room who may or may not be vaccinated. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. " Good points made... but just a couple of things: A negative PCR test or Lateral Flow test doesn't guarantee Covid Free - it just means you were "probably" Covid Free at the time of the test. So you may have Covid but have insufficient viral load at point of test. Also double jabbed does not mean Covid Free either - just means less likely to pass it on or have severe illness. However some of patients in Bolton Hospital have been doubled jabbed. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. There are plenty of people who don’t give a crap about if the handyman is vaccinated or not. You moaning in a pub about someone who’s unvaccinated in there... How will you know? Will you be going around asking every member? and if the pub/place doesn’t have a policy in place then they won’t do anything about it. Are you really going to be enjoying a nice meal out but be more worried about sally across the room who may or may not be vaccinated. " | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. " I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that "what??? | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that what???"I got a jab. I can't get a vaccine passport. My second jab is on Wednesday. I still can't get a vaccine passport. I'm on a phase 3 clinical trial. They don't count | |||
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"When your looking to buy something or have a service supplied you generally look for reviewers be they written or word of mouth. Generally people are more likely to give a bad review than a good one. If your happy with what you have then great, if your pissed off then you want to take it out on someone or something. For example most bad car reviews are because you have the one thats got the problems or the bad after sales service or the shit salesman. All the other folk who are happy just get on with the life with no grief. Same with the vaccine. So far i have had no problems after both jabs. If someone asks about reactions they seem surprised and it seems almost churlish to mention what felt like someone had punched me hard on the arm as it was not really painful. If i had some awful reaction no doubt i would be bleating about it. Does that make me a sheep?
Reviews are pointless, much like veris.
Exactly, we are not machines or clones of each other. I posted after my first jab as the following day the pain from the injuries (I have constant niggly pain everyday) from a thirty year old bike accident stopped me in my tracks, apparently some other bikers had similar issues with old injuries while others had nothing.
S
I remember you posting about that. Are you doing better now?
Yes, all fine here, no longterm effects. Stopped me doing anything at all for a day or so & gradually eased off over the next few days.
Will be prepared for it with the second jab though ??
S"Good news. Hopefully the 2nd will be less of an issue. | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that what???
I got a jab. I can't get a vaccine passport. My second jab is on Wednesday. I still can't get a vaccine passport.
I'm on a phase 3 clinical trial. They don't count"everyone will need a passport to do anything. | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that what???
I got a jab. I can't get a vaccine passport. My second jab is on Wednesday. I still can't get a vaccine passport.
I'm on a phase 3 clinical trial. They don't counteveryone will need a passport to do anything. "Maybe. I don't care right now. I'm getting vaccinated | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. " Yep..you are either with us or ultimately going to suffer in some way or another. That's just the direction the world is going in anyway.. Modern day luddites frankly don't stand a chance ! | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. " This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. " Is it like the pleasure done? See Frankie sang about that in the eighties, was it a clue..? | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way" Sorry..but I can't see how you can even think 'very few people will think the same way?'/ I suggest from my experience they do think the same way..just a lot of the other people assume they don't maybe? | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way Sorry..but I can't see how you can even think 'very few people will think the same way?'/ I suggest from my experience they do think the same way..just a lot of the other people assume they don't maybe? " You cannot live your life in that way worrying about who is around you. You will drive yourself mad and waste your life, which is precious | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. What have you based this opinion on? Personal experience had covid in February and for me it we like a bad cold. However the vaccine I am having lots of side effects with." My question was for the man I posted. Also, have you sought medical attention? | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. " You do realise pretty much everything you do can already be tracked? We really aren't that interesting, the powers that be don't want to know that on Thursday at 9am you go and do your aldi shop, come home and have a wank then watch reruns of come dine with me. They don't care. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. Good points made... but just a couple of things: A negative PCR test or Lateral Flow test doesn't guarantee Covid Free - it just means you were "probably" Covid Free at the time of the test. So you may have Covid but have insufficient viral load at point of test. Also double jabbed does not mean Covid Free either - just means less likely to pass it on or have severe illness. However some of patients in Bolton Hospital have been doubled jabbed." 5 have had both jabs, the rest are people who have had only one jab or have refused the vaccine. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way Sorry..but I can't see how you can even think 'very few people will think the same way?'/ I suggest from my experience they do think the same way..just a lot of the other people assume they don't maybe? You cannot live your life in that way worrying about who is around you. You will drive yourself mad and waste your life, which is precious" I agree and that's why people are saying there is relative safety in numbers..which will stop people being as worried..obviously there will be concerns but not as much maybe? | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way Sorry..but I can't see how you can even think 'very few people will think the same way?'/ I suggest from my experience they do think the same way..just a lot of the other people assume they don't maybe? You cannot live your life in that way worrying about who is around you. You will drive yourself mad and waste your life, which is precious I agree and that's why people are saying there is relative safety in numbers..which will stop people being as worried..obviously there will be concerns but not as much maybe?" I do not know. The vaccine scares me and I just do not trust what the public are being told about it. The side effects and deaths linked to it are in my mind unacceptable. Life is precious yet the vaccine does not do much to preserve it in many cases | |||
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"The side effects and deaths linked to it are in my mind unacceptable. Life is precious yet the vaccine does not do much to preserve it in many cases " I wonder what your thoughts about pregnancy are given that statistically far more women die of pregnancy related blood clots than vaccine side effects? Stop having children? or hey just ban sex altogether Same goes for dying in a car accident, 60 in a Million chance of that and weve had what 7 in 35 million for the vaccines? Ban cars? Yes it is a new vaccine, it is a new disease that without control will continue to mutate and flare up like a wild fire, at the moment the fatality rate is low but that can change if we dont nip it in the bud and get control. | |||
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"The side effects and deaths linked to it are in my mind unacceptable. Life is precious yet the vaccine does not do much to preserve it in many cases I wonder what your thoughts about pregnancy are given that statistically far more women die of pregnancy related blood clots than vaccine side effects? Stop having children? or hey just ban sex altogether Same goes for dying in a car accident, 60 in a Million chance of that and weve had what 7 in 35 million for the vaccines? Ban cars? Yes it is a new vaccine, it is a new disease that without control will continue to mutate and flare up like a wild fire, at the moment the fatality rate is low but that can change if we dont nip it in the bud and get control." You can not compare as it’s not like for like | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. This statement sounds ridiculous. I am glad very few people will think in the same way Sorry..but I can't see how you can even think 'very few people will think the same way?'/ I suggest from my experience they do think the same way..just a lot of the other people assume they don't maybe? You cannot live your life in that way worrying about who is around you. You will drive yourself mad and waste your life, which is precious I agree and that's why people are saying there is relative safety in numbers..which will stop people being as worried..obviously there will be concerns but not as much maybe? I do not know. The vaccine scares me and I just do not trust what the public are being told about it. The side effects and deaths linked to it are in my mind unacceptable. Life is precious yet the vaccine does not do much to preserve it in many cases " The figures from Jan to now totally refute that.. | |||
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"Heck just had a nasty thought if the vaccine ends up killing us all the survival of the human race will be left to a few obnoxious know it all told you so anti's" I'll be dead, I'm not worried  | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that what???
I got a jab. I can't get a vaccine passport. My second jab is on Wednesday. I still can't get a vaccine passport.
I'm on a phase 3 clinical trial. They don't count"Well done you and thanks for your in put in to the chat's | |||
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"Everyone who's been jabbed will now line up for the passport ID to prove your jabbed and allowed more freedom, well this was the plan all along. Track and trace IDs so the government knows everything that you do, this was all documented 5 years ago well done sheep ?? . ID papers by the back door and you all let it happen, talking of linking them to you work and bank accounts we are all fucked. Welcome to the new world order. I'm on a vaccine trial, which can't be translated into vaccine passports. I'm sneaky like that what???
I got a jab. I can't get a vaccine passport. My second jab is on Wednesday. I still can't get a vaccine passport.
I'm on a phase 3 clinical trial. They don't count
Well done you and thanks for your in put in to the chat's "Of course. Hope you get answers soon | |||
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"Heck just had a nasty thought if the vaccine ends up killing us all the survival of the human race will be left to a few obnoxious know it all told you so anti's" at least we will all be dead and won't have to lisen to them going on about it | |||
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"im not against it. only thing i can say from experience is my mum's health has been very bad since she had the jab. she lost a lot of weight, her appetite went and started sleeping all day. she became so weak she ended up collapsing and breaking her hip. she was rushed to hospital but her condition was so bad they didnt operate for a week and in the end injected her in the sine to do the operation. she spent a month in there and even though she is now home she remains in bed and doesnt do anything. i dont know if there is a connection but all this happened after the covid jab. " I'm 8 weeks from first jab. lost appetite and did feel travel sick in till I was proscribed Prochlorperazine for it. also pain in joints, dizzy spells and head ackes so I would class me like your mum with siptoms. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it" Why ? | |||
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"Heck just had a nasty thought if the vaccine ends up killing us all the survival of the human race will be left to a few obnoxious know it all told you so anti's at least we will all be dead and won't have to lisen to them going on about it " | |||
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"im not against it. only thing i can say from experience is my mum's health has been very bad since she had the jab. she lost a lot of weight, her appetite went and started sleeping all day. she became so weak she ended up collapsing and breaking her hip. she was rushed to hospital but her condition was so bad they didnt operate for a week and in the end injected her in the sine to do the operation. she spent a month in there and even though she is now home she remains in bed and doesnt do anything. i dont know if there is a connection but all this happened after the covid jab. I'm 8 weeks from first jab. lost appetite and did feel travel sick in till I was proscribed Prochlorperazine for it. also pain in joints, dizzy spells and head ackes so I would class me like your mum with siptoms." the sad thing is my mum's life is finished now. she stays in bed, thats it. wasting away. i have carers that are costing a fortune visiting her each day plus i tend to her in the evening when i get back from work. i cannot say for sure the covid jab was responsible, i have no way of proving this. all i know is since she had it, things changed. maybe she was too weak in the first place. | |||
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"You can't sue the companies if something goes wrong, and low and behold things are going wrong, I will wait and let the, I'm sorry to say this, gullible guinea pigs take it first and see what happens, and if you want to chip in with the Indian variant I know someone who works at the airport and said that people flying in from there, are not told to self isolate, no testing, I've also worked all the way through this no mask no problems I'm glad to say my immune system is awesome Best vaccination ever, oh and keep sanitising yourselves to death melting your livers, kidneys, so on and so forth do your research into this please oh and take care love ya! Glad your health is fine.. The problem is other peoples not yours..thats why people are having the jab..go on ask them! Also I would be careful..this time next year no jab no job will be how it is particularly for anyone self employed or a tradesman.. Can't beat a bit of fascism to force people into thing's too soothe your fears , eh" It's frightening how ready some people are to turn on their fellow man....maybe there is some mind control in that jab after all! | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... " You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free and neither will most people after the Summer. Additionally, I will object most strongly if anyone who has not been tested is allowed into the same pub, club, restaurant as me .. I'm sure they will be some places who turn a blind eye but I wont be going to them and they will be few and far between. It all very well crying ' free will' but that applies to everyone doesn't it? and in so much as you have the right to refuse something other people have the right to refuse you, your business, custom etc in turn just about everywhere People really need to start having a word with themselves because this ' Free will' will hopefully be seen by everyone as the best way to ' free' society back up again. Just a case of exercising common sense and considering this is for the greater good. Good points made... but just a couple of things: A negative PCR test or Lateral Flow test doesn't guarantee Covid Free - it just means you were "probably" Covid Free at the time of the test. So you may have Covid but have insufficient viral load at point of test. Also double jabbed does not mean Covid Free either - just means less likely to pass it on or have severe illness. However some of patients in Bolton Hospital have been doubled jabbed." Exactly. So much brainwashing around.... | |||
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"im not against it. only thing i can say from experience is my mum's health has been very bad since she had the jab. she lost a lot of weight, her appetite went and started sleeping all day. she became so weak she ended up collapsing and breaking her hip. she was rushed to hospital but her condition was so bad they didnt operate for a week and in the end injected her in the sine to do the operation. she spent a month in there and even though she is now home she remains in bed and doesnt do anything. i dont know if there is a connection but all this happened after the covid jab. I'm 8 weeks from first jab. lost appetite and did feel travel sick in till I was proscribed Prochlorperazine for it. also pain in joints, dizzy spells and head ackes so I would class me like your mum with siptoms. the sad thing is my mum's life is finished now. she stays in bed, thats it. wasting away. i have carers that are costing a fortune visiting her each day plus i tend to her in the evening when i get back from work. i cannot say for sure the covid jab was responsible, i have no way of proving this. all i know is since she had it, things changed. maybe she was too weak in the first place." One has to wonder what the adverse event numbers would look like if all such events 'within 28 days of a vaccine' were without fail recorded as they were for 'within 28 days of a positive PCR test' deaths. Horrendous, from what I am hearing, I have a feeling the balance of risk would change dramatically. | |||
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"im not against it. only thing i can say from experience is my mum's health has been very bad since she had the jab. she lost a lot of weight, her appetite went and started sleeping all day. she became so weak she ended up collapsing and breaking her hip. she was rushed to hospital but her condition was so bad they didnt operate for a week and in the end injected her in the sine to do the operation. she spent a month in there and even though she is now home she remains in bed and doesnt do anything. i dont know if there is a connection but all this happened after the covid jab. I'm 8 weeks from first jab. lost appetite and did feel travel sick in till I was proscribed Prochlorperazine for it. also pain in joints, dizzy spells and head ackes so I would class me like your mum with siptoms. the sad thing is my mum's life is finished now. she stays in bed, thats it. wasting away. i have carers that are costing a fortune visiting her each day plus i tend to her in the evening when i get back from work. i cannot say for sure the covid jab was responsible, i have no way of proving this. all i know is since she had it, things changed. maybe she was too weak in the first place. One has to wonder what the adverse event numbers would look like if all such events 'within 28 days of a vaccine' were without fail recorded as they were for 'within 28 days of a positive PCR test' deaths. Horrendous, from what I am hearing, I have a feeling the balance of risk would change dramatically." mum fell ill around 48 hours after the jab. i remember i was having dinner with her and she wanted to lie down as she had a bad headache. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free." I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know? | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else...." No, it hasn't. Less likely maybe, but it does not prevent transmission. | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know?" Whoah there Willy that most certainly has NOT been proven. The data is starting to indicate that (possibly due to less severe illness in those vaccinated who still get covid thus producing a lower viral load) the vaccines are reducing transmission. NOT that “you won’t pass it on”. That is dangerous misinformation that could lull people into a false sense of security! | |||
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"im not against it. only thing i can say from experience is my mum's health has been very bad since she had the jab. she lost a lot of weight, her appetite went and started sleeping all day. she became so weak she ended up collapsing and breaking her hip. she was rushed to hospital but her condition was so bad they didnt operate for a week and in the end injected her in the sine to do the operation. she spent a month in there and even though she is now home she remains in bed and doesnt do anything. i dont know if there is a connection but all this happened after the covid jab. I'm 8 weeks from first jab. lost appetite and did feel travel sick in till I was proscribed Prochlorperazine for it. also pain in joints, dizzy spells and head ackes so I would class me like your mum with siptoms. the sad thing is my mum's life is finished now. she stays in bed, thats it. wasting away. i have carers that are costing a fortune visiting her each day plus i tend to her in the evening when i get back from work. i cannot say for sure the covid jab was responsible, i have no way of proving this. all i know is since she had it, things changed. maybe she was too weak in the first place. One has to wonder what the adverse event numbers would look like if all such events 'within 28 days of a vaccine' were without fail recorded as they were for 'within 28 days of a positive PCR test' deaths. Horrendous, from what I am hearing, I have a feeling the balance of risk would change dramatically. mum fell ill around 48 hours after the jab. i remember i was having dinner with her and she wanted to lie down as she had a bad headache. " I'm so sorry. Some say the headaches are indicative of the spike proteins affecting the lining of the blood vessels - there is a lot more to learn about these vaccines. | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know? Whoah there Willy that most certainly has NOT been proven. The data is starting to indicate that (possibly due to less severe illness in those vaccinated who still get covid thus producing a lower viral load) the vaccines are reducing transmission. NOT that “you won’t pass it on”. That is dangerous misinformation that could lull people into a false sense of security! " I think the data is firming up on that front. (Note caveat - I think) | |||
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"Risk of serious vaccine side effects is just as bad as getting covid if not most likely worse. Change my mind. Covid 2 weeks with a cold not to bad. Vaccine joint pain carpal tunnel damage. Sick ness now on Prochlorperazine 3 times a day. Oh and hot and cold and head ackes. " Yes I've had both vaccines second one 4 weeks ago! And the joint pain is still with me massively regretting the jabs! I originally said I wasent having it but family persuaded me to because of my age plus having asthma and diabetes! Ohh well shall have to grin and bear it! Slap on the votorol! X | |||
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"The current covid mortality rate to date is 2% of cases IF you believe the published numbers... Now why would I take the jab if I have 98% chance of recovery and the jab decreases those chances by only providing 95% protection.... 3% worse off taking the jab... Am I missing something here?" Erm yes, you're doing the maths wrong. Look at at more as 2% in serious danger from the virus, somewhat more than that in danger of long covid effects. That's at least 1 million people in the UK. The 95% protection would mean that only 5% of the 2% are still in danger, so approximately 0.1%, equating to about 50,000 people. But because those 50,000 will be scattered all over the UK, and the virus will no longer be in mass circulation, the chances of those 50,000 people even coming into contact with a carrier are reduced. So in fact, out of those 50,000 it could be down to only 500, or 50, or 5 or maybe even no deaths. Because of a vaccine that gives protection to 19 out of every 20 people, an epidemic can be reduced to being a rare disease. _This_ is what is meant by herd immunity through vaccination. | |||
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"The current covid mortality rate to date is 2% of cases IF you believe the published numbers... Now why would I take the jab if I have 98% chance of recovery and the jab decreases those chances by only providing 95% protection.... 3% worse off taking the jab... Am I missing something here?" The jab has a 95% chance of stopping you suffering severe covid symptoms that could lead to hospitalization and lasting damage to your body the mortality rate is the percentage of cases that die from covid and doesn't include those that are left with lasting issues caused by it, for instance my fit and healthy brother had covid mid last year and has been left with heart palpitations but isn't dead so doesn't count towards the mortality rate percentage because he survived fortunately, if he had been vaccinated at the time he would have had a 95% chance of suffering little to no symptoms or lasting issues. | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know? Whoah there Willy that most certainly has NOT been proven. The data is starting to indicate that (possibly due to less severe illness in those vaccinated who still get covid thus producing a lower viral load) the vaccines are reducing transmission. NOT that “you won’t pass it on”. That is dangerous misinformation that could lull people into a false sense of security! " Erm no .it isn't! Either that or the information myself and the other people getting vaccinated this week by a doctor was false? ..I think not! | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know? Whoah there Willy that most certainly has NOT been proven. The data is starting to indicate that (possibly due to less severe illness in those vaccinated who still get covid thus producing a lower viral load) the vaccines are reducing transmission. NOT that “you won’t pass it on”. That is dangerous misinformation that could lull people into a false sense of security! Erm no .it isn't! Either that or the information myself and the other people getting vaccinated this week by a doctor was false? ..I think not!" The situation is evolving - I think we began with an abundance of caution in the evidence we were presented with, if I understand what I've heard correctly. | |||
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" So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it its called FREEE WILL Absolutely .. However, that will carry implications. 'Handyman' Pete is going to be a bit stuck for business I would say? I don't let anyone into my home unless they can prove Covid free... You do realise you can still catch and transmit Covid after vaccination?? You cannot guarantee they are Covid free. I have already said this..still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else. And you yourself will be able to fight it better of you do get it.. We have to Stand firm on testing though..everyone has to get tested and be able to prove what results they got. Otherwise how do we know? Whoah there Willy that most certainly has NOT been proven. The data is starting to indicate that (possibly due to less severe illness in those vaccinated who still get covid thus producing a lower viral load) the vaccines are reducing transmission. NOT that “you won’t pass it on”. That is dangerous misinformation that could lull people into a false sense of security! Erm no .it isn't! Either that or the information myself and the other people getting vaccinated this week by a doctor was false? ..I think not!" As is standard practice in these forums please can you provide your source to peer reviewed, legitimate, published evidence. Thanks. | |||
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"There are so many people with stories to tell. However the press/gov are suppressing them to just get people to take a vaccine. This worries us. Tell us the truth. Remember the reason why we were told to take the vaccine was to get back to normal. Remember that back to normal. The vaccine will not do that. It helps.... Helps..... Reduce the effects of covid if you get it. Covid that you have a 98.whatever chance of recovering from. We need people at the top to be honest and tell us the truth. I do not trust them. How many more jabs do we need? My father has been struggling since his jabs thinking that's him free to do what he wants.now they want this to be given to the kids. Points you raise - 1. The vaccines were to help us to get back to normal. They are 1 of the 2 options that we have - it's restrictions or vaccines. 2. The effects of vaccines. They help to stop you getting infected and to reduce the severity of the disease, including stopping deaths. They also reduce the infections that you’ll pass on to others - fewer people will catch it as a result. 4. Honesty of the people at the top. We vote them in and have to put up with them. The points you raise that they have given, that vaccines will reduce the impact on society, infection severity and levels hold true. Your father having been jabbed and thinking he's totally safe, is 1 of poor education about the vaccines. They currently protect against known variants. Future mutations may not be protected against, hence the reason to reduce infection levels as much as possible, to reduce the chances of such mutations happening. As with many vaccines, protection isn't always lifelong. A simple combined flu and covid jab may be all that's needed to retain a country that's protected. We didn't follow the leads of places like Australia and New Zealand, with very strong border controls, until very late. We've still had almost 2 million people who don't reside her enter the UK since the start of the current lockdown. Leaders are certainly not telling the full truth but we get what we are stuck with. We can individually do what we can to protect ourselves and others. The restrictions and the vaccines have helped to make the country safer, as people have done their part and followed the guidance. " Struggle to agree with you. You contradicted yourself so many times and assumed about my father. Firstly, because the vaccines are not immunity we will pass them on. As you said yourself varients will come along. Therefore restrictions or vaccines cannot be the choice. It will be vaccinations and restrictions. Tmfir that very reason you yourself stated. Israel and Chile are well along the vaccination path, however look at Chile. If people at the top stopped and actually thought about a plan to communicate to the population then maybe we would have realistic ideas about what our lives would be going forward. Example, the vaccine will get us back to normal. This was stated God knows how many times. Till a vaccine is found. Not, these vaccinations will help surpress effects and slow down spread. It will not stop you catching or passing it on. These are facts that we should have been told. We were given the sales man patter Borders we still do not have control of the borders. Never have. The truth is individual countries within the EU itself have better controls. We are heading off on holiday just like last year and this should not have been allowed. We should have stayed within the country if it was deemed risky. But no the government sold it to us that deaths were low cases small we can travel, with full knowledge that flights were coming in from India. Trust in our government is absolutely vital. They are acting light medicine doctors and second car sales people. My father simply followed the rules that you spoke of. Poor education....he followed the barrative of mainstream news and the government. That I find disrespectful. A man followed the rules, now needs another third jab is poorly educated in the subject because he followed the advice from the government and the narrative. Shame on you for that one. | |||
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"I'm not anti-vaccine. I have no issue with those that opt to take the new experimental shots. I am anti being pressured / forced to take something experimental against my will for a pathogen that poses little threat to me. I am anti being villainised for having a differing opinion on the prevailing narrative. I'm anti being called selfish and irresponsible for not bowing to group think. I'm anti being labelled stupid and ignorant for having well founded reservations. People who spout this know nothing about me and the scientific literature i've also read to reach my conclusion." It's the tin foil hat people spoiling it for everyone. Questions *should* be asked. People *should* be allowed to make decisions on their own bodies. I think that because some people are spouting very ridiculous things (everywhere, not just on the forums), it makes anyone who merely questions things look crazy. That's a bad place to be. | |||
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"I'm not anti-vaccine. I have no issue with those that opt to take the new experimental shots. I am anti being pressured / forced to take something experimental against my will for a pathogen that poses little threat to me. I am anti being villainised for having a differing opinion on the prevailing narrative. I'm anti being called selfish and irresponsible for not bowing to group think. I'm anti being labelled stupid and ignorant for having well founded reservations. People who spout this know nothing about me and the scientific literature i've also read to reach my conclusion." | |||
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"I wouldn’t say I’m anti vaccine But they still collecting data on So if anyone says it’s 100% safe it’s a lie And if it was so safe you can’t sue anyone if anything goes wrong My only thing is how come all other vaccine takes from 5 years up wards to make sure it’s safe long term this one 10 month " Yup, this. It's everyone's choice to take that RISK if they think it is a lower risk than them catching Covid, but they have no right to be self-righteous about it, they could even have made the wrong choice. | |||
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"I'm not anti-vaccine. I have no issue with those that opt to take the new experimental shots. I am anti being pressured / forced to take something experimental against my will for a pathogen that poses little threat to me. I am anti being villainised for having a differing opinion on the prevailing narrative. I'm anti being called selfish and irresponsible for not bowing to group think. I'm anti being labelled stupid and ignorant for having well founded reservations. People who spout this know nothing about me and the scientific literature i've also read to reach my conclusion. It's the tin foil hat people spoiling it for everyone. Questions *should* be asked. People *should* be allowed to make decisions on their own bodies. I think that because some people are spouting very ridiculous things (everywhere, not just on the forums), it makes anyone who merely questions things look crazy. That's a bad place to be. " | |||
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"My vaccine status is my business and i respect people's right to choose. " Amen to that. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ?" i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait." For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait." I’m not having it because 1 it doesn’t stop you getting it 2 it’s doesn’t stop you transmitting it In my eyes it’s pointless | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed!" I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers" How are there answers? How can ANYONE in the world possibly know, without doubt, about any long term side effects of previously unused MRNA technology? They can't, they can only hypothesise. Some people would prefer to err on the side of caution when it comes to people "guessing" about their long term health. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers How are there answers? How can ANYONE in the world possibly know, without doubt, about any long term side effects of previously unused MRNA technology? They can't, they can only hypothesise. Some people would prefer to err on the side of caution when it comes to people "guessing" about their long term health. " | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers How are there answers? How can ANYONE in the world possibly know, without doubt, about any long term side effects of previously unused MRNA technology? They can't, they can only hypothesise. Some people would prefer to err on the side of caution when it comes to people "guessing" about their long term health. " The question was "how was it developed on a compressed timeline", not "how do you know MRNA vaccines are safe". As to the former, we have clear, definitive, unassailable answers. Because it happened | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers" (You know this but for the conversation) Indeed there are answers re compressed timeline for development and testing including (not limited to): 1) Money and resources thrown at it meaning they could avoid lengthy delays at each stage applying for funding or identifying and recruiting suitable test subjects (they were awash with them). 2) They collapsed/run stages 1-3 concurrently (I still have some concerns about that as a methodology but freely admit I am no expert whatsoever - just for most types of research you take learnings from each stage to adjust and inform the next stage to reduce variables). 3) All the vaccines have been authorised under emergency powers for specific purposes and are NOT licensed for “marketing” ie full usage. 4) The current roll out to the public IS the stage 4 trial. 5) There has not been substantial research into the interaction between the vaccines and other drugs people may be on (insufficient time) - happy to be corrected* on this as that may now have been addressed. 6) There is not (nor could there be) any data on long term side effects. In these forums we have been told that normally long term side effects become apparent within 2 months. AFAIK nobody could answer me when I asked how that could be reflected in terms of fertility concerns? *should say I am very happy to be (politely) corrected on anything I say. I am not a scientist or virologist. I am just someone with a few braincells who has done some (proper) research since this all started and knows more about viruses and vaccines then I did 18mths ago! | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers (You know this but for the conversation) Indeed there are answers re compressed timeline for development and testing including (not limited to): 1) Money and resources thrown at it meaning they could avoid lengthy delays at each stage applying for funding or identifying and recruiting suitable test subjects (they were awash with them). 2) They collapsed/run stages 1-3 concurrently (I still have some concerns about that as a methodology but freely admit I am no expert whatsoever - just for most types of research you take learnings from each stage to adjust and inform the next stage to reduce variables). 3) All the vaccines have been authorised under emergency powers for specific purposes and are NOT licensed for “marketing” ie full usage. 4) The current roll out to the public IS the stage 4 trial. 5) There has not been substantial research into the interaction between the vaccines and other drugs people may be on (insufficient time) - happy to be corrected* on this as that may now have been addressed. 6) There is not (nor could there be) any data on long term side effects. In these forums we have been told that normally long term side effects become apparent within 2 months. AFAIK nobody could answer me when I asked how that could be reflected in terms of fertility concerns? *should say I am very happy to be (politely) corrected on anything I say. I am not a scientist or virologist. I am just someone with a few braincells who has done some (proper) research since this all started and knows more about viruses and vaccines then I did 18mths ago! " As I've said - I have the equivalent of a GCSE in science, so same. Steep learning curve
But the question of the timeline - money, resources, producing vaccines before we knew they'd work, wealth of volunteers, fast tracking administration, etc.
Long term effects/fertility - of course I don't know, but if the pre-eminent experts say that all side effects emerge within two months, we're well past that. And I know trial participants have fallen pregnant and had healthy babies during and after the trial (and into post trial monitoring).
There's a lot of unknowns and I appreciate that. But there's also a difference, sometimes, between "I don't know" and "I'll throw every objection at the wall to make my opponents look stupid". (I'm not commenting on any specific person using any specific technique)
All I'm saying is, if we hear "I don't know", then we can share information, which might help empower people (And I know that I may not be the person to do it, because - despite my actual family experience of a life threatening vaccine reaction - my reputation is what it is) | |||
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"I think for many people this is or has become such an emotive subject that logic or simple “facts” are actually insufficient. Some people are simply very worried or even downright scared. Nothing anyone else says is really going to change that. The only things that will are time (to provide a growing body of evidence that gives them more confidence) or a personal/family experience that makes things more “real”." Agreed. But... I follow the evidence - and if a question is asked and I think I have a grasp of the answer, I'll answer it. | |||
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"I think for many people this is or has become such an emotive subject that logic or simple “facts” are actually insufficient. Some people are simply very worried or even downright scared. Nothing anyone else says is really going to change that. The only things that will are time (to provide a growing body of evidence that gives them more confidence) or a personal/family experience that makes things more “real”. Agreed. But... I follow the evidence - and if a question is asked and I think I have a grasp of the answer, I'll answer it." Sometimes scientists with concrete evidence get dismissed...RIP Dr David Kelly. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers How are there answers? How can ANYONE in the world possibly know, without doubt, about any long term side effects of previously unused MRNA technology? They can't, they can only hypothesise. Some people would prefer to err on the side of caution when it comes to people "guessing" about their long term health. The question was "how was it developed on a compressed timeline", not "how do you know MRNA vaccines are safe". As to the former, we have clear, definitive, unassailable answers. Because it happened "I picked out the "how is it safe" part in the question...and responded that it can't be possible to *know* if it's safe because any possible long term effects are not known. Mrna technology has been around since the 1990's, so it hasn't really been developed as something completely new in a compressed timeline...these particular versions of that technology have been approved for emergency use in a compressed timeline. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. For pretty much anything else in life people would say “sounds sensible” but it seems that is no longer allowed! I know damn well I'm not the one to answer the question, but if it's a question - how can it be safe given the normal timeline? - there are answers How are there answers? How can ANYONE in the world possibly know, without doubt, about any long term side effects of previously unused MRNA technology? They can't, they can only hypothesise. Some people would prefer to err on the side of caution when it comes to people "guessing" about their long term health. The question was "how was it developed on a compressed timeline", not "how do you know MRNA vaccines are safe". As to the former, we have clear, definitive, unassailable answers. Because it happened
I picked out the "how is it safe" part in the question...and responded that it can't be possible to *know* if it's safe because any possible long term effects are not known. Mrna technology has been around since the 1990's, so it hasn't really been developed as something completely new in a compressed timeline...these particular versions of that technology have been approved for emergency use in a compressed timeline. "So you attacked my answer to a question I wasn't answering? That seems counterproductive. | |||
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"I didn't attack anything. I asked a question in response to how I interpreted your question, and stated my opinion on the matter. I thought that was how debating works, but happy to be corrected by anyone who's more knowledgeable on the subject of debating "Well, you need to start with defining your terms and not sliding outside them. As the question I was answering was about the timing of the process and reassurances of safety in that - which are the same for both the mRNA vaccines, the adenovirus vectored vaccines, the attenuated whole virus trial I'm on, the Novavax nanoparticle vaccine and others - you might want to deal with the topic rather than change it. Hope this helps | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it" Bit like poking a bear this question. In the end does it matter, the facts are out there, take up is high, if some choose not to then let them be. Most of the risk is now for them as herd immunity for a disease like measles is 95%. We are well over that in the key age groups 65+ and just under it in the 50-65s. Give it a few weeks and the lower age groups will also catch this up, so why worry about the few with doubts. It not like a few swingers will convince them if the majority of the scientific community can't. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it Bit like poking a bear this question. In the end does it matter, the facts are out there, take up is high, if some choose not to then let them be. Most of the risk is now for them as herd immunity for a disease like measles is 95%. We are well over that in the key age groups 65+ and just under it in the 50-65s. Give it a few weeks and the lower age groups will also catch this up, so why worry about the few with doubts. It not like a few swingers will convince them if the majority of the scientific community can't. " The herd are standing up, and it's glorious
My second jab is Wednesday  | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. I’m not having it because 1 it doesn’t stop you getting it 2 it’s doesn’t stop you transmitting it In my eyes it’s pointless" You forgot 3 You are a good percentage better at not transmitting the virus to other people if you have both jabs..and also if you get the virus your body is better equipped to able to fight it. Source National Geographic.. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it Bit like poking a bear this question. In the end does it matter, the facts are out there, take up is high, if some choose not to then let them be. Most of the risk is now for them as herd immunity for a disease like measles is 95%. We are well over that in the key age groups 65+ and just under it in the 50-65s. Give it a few weeks and the lower age groups will also catch this up, so why worry about the few with doubts. It not like a few swingers will convince them if the majority of the scientific community can't. The herd are standing up, and it's glorious
My second jab is Wednesday "I'm surprised you haven't hired a stretch limo to the clinic. | |||
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"So any anti vaccination people here? Curious to know why you are against it Bit like poking a bear this question. In the end does it matter, the facts are out there, take up is high, if some choose not to then let them be. Most of the risk is now for them as herd immunity for a disease like measles is 95%. We are well over that in the key age groups 65+ and just under it in the 50-65s. Give it a few weeks and the lower age groups will also catch this up, so why worry about the few with doubts. It not like a few swingers will convince them if the majority of the scientific community can't. The herd are standing up, and it's glorious
My second jab is Wednesday
I'm surprised you haven't hired a stretch limo to the clinic."Tram will do just fine
Got better things to spend my big pharma payment on | |||
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"I’m happy to explain my reasons for not getting the covid vaccination. I’ve had all other vaccines as have had my kids just to make clear I’m not against vaccines, just this one. In 2005 I had an operation which involved pelvic mesh and was approved by the MHRA and was meant to be the ‘gold standard’ for treatment. Forward on 13 years and I’m having the mesh removed as it has eroded into my vagina. To let you understand this pelvic mesh is made from polypropylene, they same plastic that you use in every day life for lots of things. This had been approved but every subsequent change to the mesh didn’t require further testing and was automatically approved. It shrinks, twists, cuts into organs, causes nerve damage, etc. Think of a doormat on grass after a few weeks. Thousands of women have been left with serious life changing injuries due to this including permanent catheters, colostomies, paralysis, incontinence, unable to have sex as sometimes vaginas are stitched up or surgery has left it too painful for them to have sex. So my issue is with the approval process and lack of transparency. So far I’ve heard of issues with periods starting earlier or later and being heavier, even post menopausal women have reported having a period; rashes that take a few days to disappear, flare up of herpes, to name but a few. Everyone should be reporting side effects on the MHRA’s yellow card scheme. On 21 May 21 a radio presenter in Manchester died from blood clots following the Astra Zeneca vaccine! " It is not known if the vaccine she received had anything to do with the covid vaccine and is being investigated. We have no idea if they are related. | |||
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"A lot of the people who are anti lockdown or restrictions are also reluctant to take any vaccine. It strikes me that these people want others (normally the most vulnerable) to take all the risks so they don't have to but also don't want any of the consequences of their choices. " Quite. | |||
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"A lot of the people who are anti lockdown or restrictions are also reluctant to take any vaccine. It strikes me that these people want others (normally the most vulnerable) to take all the risks so they don't have to but also don't want any of the consequences of their choices. " Sometimes people make themselves vulnerable...how would you rate your fitness between 1-10. | |||
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"i am Not anti vax, I am just waiting a bit before i get it Why ? i am waiting to see what lobgish term side effects ot may have. i dont plan on travelling ou the coubtry, so i am in no rush like some. Also i dont feel that these vaccones have been properly tested, definitely not in respect to long term side effects. so I am happy to wait. I’m not having it because 1 it doesn’t stop you getting it 2 it’s doesn’t stop you transmitting it In my eyes it’s pointless You forgot 3 You are a good percentage better at not transmitting the virus to other people if you have both jabs..and also if you get the virus your body is better equipped to able to fight it. Source National Geographic.." Whoah there Willy. Further up you stated... “still has been proved if you do have the vaccination you won't pass it on to anyone else” That was a definitive statement that I took issue with as unproven but you didn’t retract. I guess you now saying in this post (to someone else) that... “You are a good percentage better at not transmitting the virus to other people if you have both jabs” Is about as close to a retraction as I’m gonna get
Don’t worry I won’t hold you to an apology | |||
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"A lot of the people who are anti lockdown or restrictions are also reluctant to take any vaccine. It strikes me that these people want others (normally the most vulnerable) to take all the risks so they don't have to but also don't want any of the consequences of their choices. Sometimes people make themselves vulnerable...how would you rate your fitness between 1-10." About seven. Lockdown has done a number on me. How much would you blame my relative who nearly died from a flu jab (their work told them to get it) for being medically vulnerable? Or my grandparent in their 90s? | |||
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"No jab, no job. Simples. (Unless you have a proven medical need to not get vaccinated.) " Do what happens if lots go to no job I know others at the hospital that have not had it. | |||
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"No jab, no job. Simples. (Unless you have a proven medical need to not get vaccinated.) Do what happens if lots go to no job I know others at the hospital that have not had it. " I hope it never comes to that. I really do. | |||
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