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Belief in covid conspiracy theories linked to greater egotism
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"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.”" I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions? | |||
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"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.” I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions?" Indeed. Based in my own, clearly subjective, experience with conspiracy theorists, I would say there is some truth in what the authors are claiming. But with this being entirely self reported, to me, undermines the findings somewhat. | |||
"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.” I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions? Indeed. Based in my own, clearly subjective, experience with conspiracy theorists, I would say there is some truth in what the authors are claiming. But with this being entirely self reported, to me, undermines the findings somewhat. " Maybe. I'm not sure how else you'd be able to answer the question. I absolutely agree that there are limitations with self reporting - but how else do you uncover someone's inner beliefs? | |||
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"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.” I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions? Indeed. Based in my own, clearly subjective, experience with conspiracy theorists, I would say there is some truth in what the authors are claiming. But with this being entirely self reported, to me, undermines the findings somewhat. Maybe. I'm not sure how else you'd be able to answer the question. I absolutely agree that there are limitations with self reporting - but how else do you uncover someone's inner beliefs?" Hmmm probably only through long term observational behavioural studies (ie over time when people revert to natural behaviour patterns) | |||
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"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.” I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions? Indeed. Based in my own, clearly subjective, experience with conspiracy theorists, I would say there is some truth in what the authors are claiming. But with this being entirely self reported, to me, undermines the findings somewhat. Maybe. I'm not sure how else you'd be able to answer the question. I absolutely agree that there are limitations with self reporting - but how else do you uncover someone's inner beliefs? Hmmm probably only through long term observational behavioural studies (ie over time when people revert to natural behaviour patterns)" How do we know what a behaviour indicates on the inside, and how long would it take to get the information? I'm not trying to be hyper critical - it's more, I'm interested in how we answer questions. Do we dismiss this because it's less than perfect, or do we take it on board while looking further for other data points? | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were" I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it." This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it." I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy?" Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation." Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified." Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies." I think we have made progress lol | |||
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"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies." Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy." Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess. | |||
"Conspiracy theories are a way for idiots to think that they are intellectuals. They cherry pick certain facts or questions, and then build a whole false narrative about them to prove their own paranoia. " Maybe so yet... https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/true-government-conspiracies-2013-12%3famp | |||
"Ah the old “this is just a sensationalist theory that we cannot actually prove but it will get the authors noticed get out of jail caveat...” “The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa.” I'm not sure what research methodology could be used to answer these kinds of questions? Indeed. Based in my own, clearly subjective, experience with conspiracy theorists, I would say there is some truth in what the authors are claiming. But with this being entirely self reported, to me, undermines the findings somewhat. Maybe. I'm not sure how else you'd be able to answer the question. I absolutely agree that there are limitations with self reporting - but how else do you uncover someone's inner beliefs? Hmmm probably only through long term observational behavioural studies (ie over time when people revert to natural behaviour patterns) How do we know what a behaviour indicates on the inside, and how long would it take to get the information? I'm not trying to be hyper critical - it's more, I'm interested in how we answer questions. Do we dismiss this because it's less than perfect, or do we take it on board while looking further for other data points?" I am confused by your first point? “Behavioural” studies do not only look at physical behaviour! Obviously it will depend on methodology but personality traits (such as egotism) start to be displayed over time once subjects relax into natural patterns and forget they are being observed. A crude but obvious example are reality TV shows like Big Brother. Everyone goes in with a game plan but over time their true personality starts to be revealed. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess." And yet you were saying that in funding government corruption, we're all complicit? Which is it? Are we all to blame or not? I've never chosen blanket indiscriminate kindness. I don't think it serves anyone. By being kind to conspiracy theorists, we're being unkind to their victims. | |||
"COVID-19 has become one of the defining global events of the decade. It has affected more lives than nearly any other phenomenon of the 20th century, and has become critically embedded in many nations’ culture and psyche. It is also a largely negative phenomenon, one which is still not well understood (by laypersons and scientists alike) and shrouded in misinformation. It is thus a perfect breeding ground for conspiracy theories, of which there is no shortage. To better understand the relation between COVID-19 conspiracy theories and one of the fulcrums upon which human behaviors hinges—concern for oneself versus concern for others—researchers from Australia, Italy, France and Germany collected data from 4245 participants in eight nations (the authors’ countries of origin, plus the Netherlands, Spain, the UK and the USA). Their results are published in the European Journal of Social Psychology. As the authors note, it is a well-documented phenomenon that conspiracy theorists tend to demonstrate greater concern, alienation, mistrust and anger. “What is unclear is the extent to which this concern, alienation, mistrust and anger is focused on collective versus personal welfare.” That is, are conspiracy theorists benevolently concerned for their neighbors’ safety or primarily concerned for their own (even at the expense of others’)? The authors defined two main elements of self- vs. other-focused concern for wellbeing. First, the kinds of behaviors individuals engaged in: hand-washing is both self- and other-protecting, while stockpiling is clearly selfishly motivated. Second, greater concern that “I will die” vs. “someone close to me will die.” The authors measured, in addition to these behaviors and concerns, belief in general and specific conspiracy theories regarding COVID-19. The results of the study demonstrate that individuals who hold conspiracy theories about COVID-19 are more likely to be motivated by self-concern, even to the detriment of their neighbors. Conspiracy theorists were, in general, more likely to practice hoarding, (predictably) less likely to endorse vaccination, and less concerned with the welfare of those close to them. This lack of concern partly mediated the aforementioned behaviors. The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa. Science and history tell us that vaccination is an effective weapon in the war against viral infection, as are prosocial behaviors like social-distancing and mask-wearing. Understanding why such significant portions of the world’s population acts contrary to these truths will be critical in curbing such behaviors on a large scale and effectively terminating the current global pandemic. The study, “To what extent are conspiracy theorists concerned for self versus others? A COVID-19 test case“, was authored by Matthew J. Hornsey, Cassandra M. Chapman, Belen Alvarez, Sarah Bentley, Bruno Gabriel Salvador Casara, Charlie R. Crimston, Octavia Ionescu, Henning Krug, Hema Preya Selvanathan, Niklas K. Steffens, and Jolanda Jetten." More rubbish and people get payed to come up with this garbage very sad | |||
 . Anyone undermining the solid scientific evidence to promote their own little selfish agendas, is a substantial danger to the wellbeing of decent society and should be treated as such.
They do need to be understood and appropriate restrictions put in place, as would be done if they were terrorists seeking to achieve the same level of harm.
Obviously foreign states also invest in creating and promoting these conspiracies, with our citizens being used as their puppets. They typically will see themselves as thoroughly independent-minded and thinking but the reality can be the exact opposite. Being against the government here but doing exactly what some foreign government wants them to do - you couldn't make it up
Many of them seem less competent in being able to understand the scientific method and basic research evidence - so accept instead some half baked twaddle peddled by others with a social media following.
The more research done on this, the better  | |||
"Conspiracy theories are a way for idiots to think that they are intellectuals. They cherry pick certain facts or questions, and then build a whole false narrative about them to prove their own paranoia. Maybe so yet... https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/true-government-conspiracies-2013-12%3famp" These are all USA examples. Obviously it's likely that there are "secret" events that occurred in the UK, but the link provided is not UK examples. | |||
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"Anyone see that show on netflix behind the curve? It was very interesting and good to see how people that believe in conspiracies think. They spent 20k on a lazer gyroscope to prove there was no rotation (obviously they proved there was) not happy they altered the experiment and still proved it. Think they blamed "heaven rays" on interfering (I'd need to watch it again) Then carried out another experiment where they shot a lazer between 2 holes at same height from far distance. Didnt go through both holes due to curvature. They would believe what people say in YouTube videos but not science. Maybe and quite rightly they question things but some of them are weird like lizard people. If people believe in conspiracies crack on, lizard people, flat earth, hollow earth, moon is a projection crack on. But people that are anti vaxxers (I'm not talking about people questioning risk vs benefit of covid) but people that refuse mmr due to autism or other vaccines as its Bill Gates chipping people then it moves from being your own thing to affecting people around you" Yes. Personal choice is great for I want a red car not a blue car. It's not so great for I want to drive my car on the wrong side of the road | |||
"Anyone see that show on netflix behind the curve? It was very interesting and good to see how people that believe in conspiracies think. They spent 20k on a lazer gyroscope to prove there was no rotation (obviously they proved there was) not happy they altered the experiment and still proved it. Think they blamed "heaven rays" on interfering (I'd need to watch it again) Then carried out another experiment where they shot a lazer between 2 holes at same height from far distance. Didnt go through both holes due to curvature. They would believe what people say in YouTube videos but not science. Maybe and quite rightly they question things but some of them are weird like lizard people. If people believe in conspiracies crack on, lizard people, flat earth, hollow earth, moon is a projection crack on. But people that are anti vaxxers (I'm not talking about people questioning risk vs benefit of covid) but people that refuse mmr due to autism or other vaccines as its Bill Gates chipping people then it moves from being your own thing to affecting people around you Yes. Personal choice is great for I want a red car not a blue car. It's not so great for I want to drive my car on the wrong side of the road " Well according to most of the world us Brits and you Aussies fo drive on the wrong side of the road  | |||
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"Anyone see that show on netflix behind the curve? It was very interesting and good to see how people that believe in conspiracies think. They spent 20k on a lazer gyroscope to prove there was no rotation (obviously they proved there was) not happy they altered the experiment and still proved it. Think they blamed "heaven rays" on interfering (I'd need to watch it again) Then carried out another experiment where they shot a lazer between 2 holes at same height from far distance. Didnt go through both holes due to curvature. They would believe what people say in YouTube videos but not science. Maybe and quite rightly they question things but some of them are weird like lizard people. If people believe in conspiracies crack on, lizard people, flat earth, hollow earth, moon is a projection crack on. But people that are anti vaxxers (I'm not talking about people questioning risk vs benefit of covid) but people that refuse mmr due to autism or other vaccines as its Bill Gates chipping people then it moves from being your own thing to affecting people around you Yes. Personal choice is great for I want a red car not a blue car. It's not so great for I want to drive my car on the wrong side of the road Well according to most of the world us Brits and you Aussies fo drive on the wrong side of the road "Sure 
But if most of the world decided to drive on the right side of the road in Britain and Australia, we're within our rights to think badly of them! | |||
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"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess. And yet you were saying that in funding government corruption, we're all complicit? Which is it? Are we all to blame or not? I've never chosen blanket indiscriminate kindness. I don't think it serves anyone. By being kind to conspiracy theorists, we're being unkind to their victims." I appreciate our back and forth here. We are all to blame and not. I think I am losing you to justification. I find life is best when I am being kind In the moment not using cruel to be kind as a justification. I think from more than one angle so can come across with conflicting views. As you say it’s not so black and white. I have my views as a father, husband, son, plumber, philosopher, you get the point I hope. My opinion changes depending on the part of myself I am representing In at that time. You seem to have contempt for conspiracy theorist. You know that some conspiracy have been proven surely. That doesn’t mean we should give them too much of a platform but we shouldn’t dismiss them either as they do some good and shaming them is dangerous. Better to breakdown things point by point to show when the logic strays. And in the process you own bias can be challenged (unless you already know everything to be known) | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess. And yet you were saying that in funding government corruption, we're all complicit? Which is it? Are we all to blame or not? I've never chosen blanket indiscriminate kindness. I don't think it serves anyone. By being kind to conspiracy theorists, we're being unkind to their victims. I appreciate our back and forth here. We are all to blame and not. I think I am losing you to justification. I find life is best when I am being kind In the moment not using cruel to be kind as a justification. I think from more than one angle so can come across with conflicting views. As you say it’s not so black and white. I have my views as a father, husband, son, plumber, philosopher, you get the point I hope. My opinion changes depending on the part of myself I am representing In at that time. You seem to have contempt for conspiracy theorist. You know that some conspiracy have been proven surely. That doesn’t mean we should give them too much of a platform but we shouldn’t dismiss them either as they do some good and shaming them is dangerous. Better to breakdown things point by point to show when the logic strays. And in the process you own bias can be challenged (unless you already know everything to be known) " Yes, I have contempt for conspiracy theorists. I make no apologies for that. You can't logic someone out of a position they didn't logic themselves into, and so my effort is wasted. I'm better off sharing resources with those who are trying to learn, and helping future generations understand critical thinking. | |||
"Conspiracy theories are a way for idiots to think that they are intellectuals. They cherry pick certain facts or questions, and then build a whole false narrative about them to prove their own paranoia. Maybe so yet... https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/true-government-conspiracies-2013-12%3famp These are all USA examples. Obviously it's likely that there are "secret" events that occurred in the UK, but the link provided is not UK examples." I really accept your point here. My point was not to focus regions as much as focus on the blanket shutting down of all conspiracies as incorrect by governments and media When history tells a different story. I find the truth is often found in the lighter conspiracies like Ed snowdon Or the great reset rather than lizard people and illuminati. Personally I have some unfortunate history of abuse by individuals In positions Of authority so I have a bias to mistrust. Conspiracies seem to target people like me so I have compassion for those that get sucked in. It’s like trauma bonding when these group form. Shaming will only Strengthen their bias. If you want people to think collectively (Vaccines) then we need to start leading by example in giving these people some compassion. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess. And yet you were saying that in funding government corruption, we're all complicit? Which is it? Are we all to blame or not? I've never chosen blanket indiscriminate kindness. I don't think it serves anyone. By being kind to conspiracy theorists, we're being unkind to their victims. I appreciate our back and forth here. We are all to blame and not. I think I am losing you to justification. I find life is best when I am being kind In the moment not using cruel to be kind as a justification. I think from more than one angle so can come across with conflicting views. As you say it’s not so black and white. I have my views as a father, husband, son, plumber, philosopher, you get the point I hope. My opinion changes depending on the part of myself I am representing In at that time. You seem to have contempt for conspiracy theorist. You know that some conspiracy have been proven surely. That doesn’t mean we should give them too much of a platform but we shouldn’t dismiss them either as they do some good and shaming them is dangerous. Better to breakdown things point by point to show when the logic strays. And in the process you own bias can be challenged (unless you already know everything to be known) Yes, I have contempt for conspiracy theorists. I make no apologies for that. You can't logic someone out of a position they didn't logic themselves into, and so my effort is wasted. I'm better off sharing resources with those who are trying to learn, and helping future generations understand critical thinking." I agree with most of that. Apart from I think they did logic themselves into their position and you can logic them out (if you Mentally flexible enough). You just have to attend to the correct level of thought and help with pointing to resources on improving critical thinking skills. | |||
"I was curious to see if the ones shouting "steeple!!" are doing it because they worry about our safety. Or they just want things back to the way they were I'm sure there's a combination of factors going on. Distrust of authority being behind most of it. This seems spot on to me. Distrust.... and we have been dealing with distrust as a society by shaming it. I don't think it's so black and white. Doesn't coddling people who believe fact free nonsense give them legitimacy? Whilst I don’t believe In Conspiracies I cant say some of the arguments are fact free. They use a lot of facts to build there conspiracy Arguments that you can check out yourself. But the deeper you go the more logic starts getting stretched. The prey on mistrust of authority. Including Critical Thinking In Schools and adult workshops will help us all Protect from misinformation. Ok, hyperbole. Sure. They use some facts, some legitimate questions. But then take that a long way beyond what's justified. Yes I agree but that doesn’t mean that some of the facts and legitimate questions should be ignored just because they are Associated with conspiracies. Didn't say they should be. Again, this isn't binary. I don't think coddling conspiracy theorists is an effective use of time or energy, and giving them attention gives them legitimacy. Maybe so yet this leaves parts of society behind. And a strong society is a integrated society. In the long run this attitude will come back to bite you.... i guess just like not achieving herd immunity. Be kind is the only way out of our mess. And yet you were saying that in funding government corruption, we're all complicit? Which is it? Are we all to blame or not? I've never chosen blanket indiscriminate kindness. I don't think it serves anyone. By being kind to conspiracy theorists, we're being unkind to their victims. I appreciate our back and forth here. We are all to blame and not. I think I am losing you to justification. I find life is best when I am being kind In the moment not using cruel to be kind as a justification. I think from more than one angle so can come across with conflicting views. As you say it’s not so black and white. I have my views as a father, husband, son, plumber, philosopher, you get the point I hope. My opinion changes depending on the part of myself I am representing In at that time. You seem to have contempt for conspiracy theorist. You know that some conspiracy have been proven surely. That doesn’t mean we should give them too much of a platform but we shouldn’t dismiss them either as they do some good and shaming them is dangerous. Better to breakdown things point by point to show when the logic strays. And in the process you own bias can be challenged (unless you already know everything to be known) Yes, I have contempt for conspiracy theorists. I make no apologies for that. You can't logic someone out of a position they didn't logic themselves into, and so my effort is wasted. I'm better off sharing resources with those who are trying to learn, and helping future generations understand critical thinking. I agree with most of that. Apart from I think they did logic themselves into their position and you can logic them out (if you Mentally flexible enough). You just have to attend to the correct level of thought and help with pointing to resources on improving critical thinking skills." I don't see any logic there, and it's not a good use of my energy. | |||
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"From my long experience, conspiracy theorists tend to be people with co-existing limited intelligence and distorted cognition. They have a tendency to focus on minor issues, inflate the importance of these and ignore or discount the most obvious answers. Those who have organic brain dysfunctions have difficulty in formulating an accurate assessment of cause and effect; those with personality disorders have rigid cognitive processing functions. Those who have both are doubly disadvantaged. The internet has multiple beneficial functions, but it also allows crackpots and nutcases to spread their distorted viewpoints to a wider audience that had been the case before 1999." Hmm. I'm not sure all believers in conspiracy theories are of limited intelligence. Cognitive dissonance is a hell of a drug, and moderate to high intelligence can make that rabbit hole harder to escape | |||
"COVID-19 has become one of the defining global events of the decade. It has affected more lives than nearly any other phenomenon of the 20th century, and has become critically embedded in many nations’ culture and psyche. It is also a largely negative phenomenon, one which is still not well understood (by laypersons and scientists alike) and shrouded in misinformation. It is thus a perfect breeding ground for conspiracy theories, of which there is no shortage. To better understand the relation between COVID-19 conspiracy theories and one of the fulcrums upon which human behaviors hinges—concern for oneself versus concern for others—researchers from Australia, Italy, France and Germany collected data from 4245 participants in eight nations (the authors’ countries of origin, plus the Netherlands, Spain, the UK and the USA). Their results are published in the European Journal of Social Psychology. As the authors note, it is a well-documented phenomenon that conspiracy theorists tend to demonstrate greater concern, alienation, mistrust and anger. “What is unclear is the extent to which this concern, alienation, mistrust and anger is focused on collective versus personal welfare.” That is, are conspiracy theorists benevolently concerned for their neighbors’ safety or primarily concerned for their own (even at the expense of others’)? The authors defined two main elements of self- vs. other-focused concern for wellbeing. First, the kinds of behaviors individuals engaged in: hand-washing is both self- and other-protecting, while stockpiling is clearly selfishly motivated. Second, greater concern that “I will die” vs. “someone close to me will die.” The authors measured, in addition to these behaviors and concerns, belief in general and specific conspiracy theories regarding COVID-19. The results of the study demonstrate that individuals who hold conspiracy theories about COVID-19 are more likely to be motivated by self-concern, even to the detriment of their neighbors. Conspiracy theorists were, in general, more likely to practice hoarding, (predictably) less likely to endorse vaccination, and less concerned with the welfare of those close to them. This lack of concern partly mediated the aforementioned behaviors. The authors note some limitations: data was drawn from Western, industrialized nations, was entirely self-reported, and is correlational in nature, so no claims can be made about whether egotism drives conspiracy theories or vice versa. Science and history tell us that vaccination is an effective weapon in the war against viral infection, as are prosocial behaviors like social-distancing and mask-wearing. Understanding why such significant portions of the world’s population acts contrary to these truths will be critical in curbing such behaviors on a large scale and effectively terminating the current global pandemic. The study, “To what extent are conspiracy theorists concerned for self versus others? A COVID-19 test case“, was authored by Matthew J. Hornsey, Cassandra M. Chapman, Belen Alvarez, Sarah Bentley, Bruno Gabriel Salvador Casara, Charlie R. Crimston, Octavia Ionescu, Henning Krug, Hema Preya Selvanathan, Niklas K. Steffens, and Jolanda Jetten." Isn’t it best we just term them “a bunch of c&n£s” and leave them to their sad little existence? | |||
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"Conspiracy theories are a way for idiots to think that they are intellectuals. They cherry pick certain facts or questions, and then build a whole false narrative about them to prove their own paranoia. Maybe so yet... https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/true-government-conspiracies-2013-12%3famp These are all USA examples. Obviously it's likely that there are "secret" events that occurred in the UK, but the link provided is not UK examples. I really accept your point here. My point was not to focus regions as much as focus on the blanket shutting down of all conspiracies as incorrect by governments and media When history tells a different story. I find the truth is often found in the lighter conspiracies like Ed snowdon Or the great reset rather than lizard people and illuminati. Personally I have some unfortunate history of abuse by individuals In positions Of authority so I have a bias to mistrust. Conspiracies seem to target people like me so I have compassion for those that get sucked in. It’s like trauma bonding when these group form. Shaming will only Strengthen their bias. If you want people to think collectively (Vaccines) then we need to start leading by example in giving these people some compassion." I ran out of compassion when my conspiracy theorist mother's actions lead to the unnecessary deaths of my grandfather and her husband, due to Covid. I'm less concerned about her husband, he wasn't a pleasant person and he was also a denier/conspiracy theorist, but my grandfather was an innocent party, who died all alone, gasping for his breath. No, I cannot forgive or overlook that and it's not for want of trying to try and move her away from the conspiracies. If you can name a conspiracy theory, she subscribes to it. | |||
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"To label anyone with worries about taking the vaccine as stupid or any other chosen insult is frankly disgusting and childish" The OP is about conspiracy theorists. Not people with genuine worries/questions. They are not the same thing. | |||
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"Shaming conspiracy is exactly what they want.....sorry can’t not laugh saying that. Whilst there are lots of Ridiculous conspiracies out there It’s a fact that some Do turn out to be true. To shame anyone who refuses the main stream Narrative is a dangerous game which Can lead to blanket obedience and a tyrants wet dream. Better to put the conspiracy on The table and pick them apart With honest critical thinking to help those with vulnerable minds that still get a vote. Read some history before judging. Learn to spot propaganda... it’s everywhere If I was wanting to cover up a conspiracy and had the Resources needed I would pay marketing companies to come up with loads ridiculous Lizard people Style conspiracies. Then I would point out how ridiculous conspiracy theories are and how only idiots follow them. Manipulating you lot would be so easy lol." Ok | |||
"Shaming conspiracy is exactly what they want.....sorry can’t not laugh saying that. Whilst there are lots of Ridiculous conspiracies out there It’s a fact that some Do turn out to be true. To shame anyone who refuses the main stream Narrative is a dangerous game which Can lead to blanket obedience and a tyrants wet dream. Better to put the conspiracy on The table and pick them apart With honest critical thinking to help those with vulnerable minds that still get a vote. Read some history before judging. Learn to spot propaganda... it’s everywhere If I was wanting to cover up a conspiracy and had the Resources needed I would pay marketing companies to come up with loads ridiculous Lizard people Style conspiracies. Then I would point out how ridiculous conspiracy theories are and how only idiots follow them. Manipulating you lot would be so easy lol." Agreed. Disinformation campaigns are used to help discredit people and (conspiracy) theories that get too close to the truth. Of course lizard men, illuminati and Bill Gates microchips in vaccines are complete bollocks but amongst those are others that have more credence. | |||
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