FabSwingers.com > Forums > Virus > People not willing to vaccinate
People not willing to vaccinate
Jump to: Newest in thread
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
 | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It’s oxygen they don’t have for the Covid If they had oxygen they would be fine But the Indian gov sold there oxygen to country’s who where been hit harder at the time The death rate in India is very low compared to the population This is our government trying to scare us again lol don’t believe them Look up your own information The BBC ARE LIRES " India did cash in on covid a big percentage of vaccine is produced there and have taken huge orders from other countries, UK is talking about delaying 5 million doses that were on order for India to vaccinate themselves but with they're population it's a drop in the ocean. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I understand the OP perfectly well." You would  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"This forum gets crazier by the day." True... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? " I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Not all people that are refusing a vaccine are covid deniers. Some are just scared, personally I think they are wrong and haven't done their research and assessed the risk properly, but I do believe in personal choice. If some doesn't want the vaccine fine what I don't like is people spreading absolute guff on social media or wherever to justify that decision. " I think that the majority aren't deniers but are unwilling for a range of reasons. This post is a curiosity about those who have been unwilling to vaccinate here to date, upon their position should they get to India, as posted earlier. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Not all people that are refusing a vaccine are covid deniers. Some are just scared, personally I think they are wrong and haven't done their research and assessed the risk properly, but I do believe in personal choice. If some doesn't want the vaccine fine what I don't like is people spreading absolute guff on social media or wherever to justify that decision. I think that the majority aren't deniers but are unwilling for a range of reasons. This post is a curiosity about those who have been unwilling to vaccinate here to date, upon their position should they get to India, as posted earlier. " why would they go to India. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? " It's a simple proposition, as detailed above. If someone wants a different topic, they could start a new thread. Go to India, for stated reasons, (notwithstanding all of the whatabout this, that etc.) do you vaccinate before relocation? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Not all people that are refusing a vaccine are covid deniers. Some are just scared, personally I think they are wrong and haven't done their research and assessed the risk properly, but I do believe in personal choice. If some doesn't want the vaccine fine what I don't like is people spreading absolute guff on social media or wherever to justify that decision. I think that the majority aren't deniers but are unwilling for a range of reasons. This post is a curiosity about those who have been unwilling to vaccinate here to date, upon their position should they get to India, as posted earlier. why would they go to India." any body seeing going to india as a punishment really needs to go it's beautiful and if the op really wants some one to go because they haven't been vaccinated to work with the locals you really wouldn't have to you can pay a team of locals to do that for you for around £3 each per day while you sit on your sun lounger enjoying what India has to offer I'm genuinely thinking about not getting vaccinated now just to have my name put in the hat to win this amazing trip. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? It's a simple proposition, as detailed above. If someone wants a different topic, they could start a new thread. Go to India, for stated reasons, (notwithstanding all of the whatabout this, that etc.) do you vaccinate before relocation? " It wasn’t a simple proposition! It was unclear as to why ..... now you’ve added “do you vaccinate before relocation” if you want to suggest that people start a new topic start your thread with some context! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Not all people that are refusing a vaccine are covid deniers. Some are just scared, personally I think they are wrong and haven't done their research and assessed the risk properly, but I do believe in personal choice. If some doesn't want the vaccine fine what I don't like is people spreading absolute guff on social media or wherever to justify that decision. I think that the majority aren't deniers but are unwilling for a range of reasons. This post is a curiosity about those who have been unwilling to vaccinate here to date, upon their position should they get to India, as posted earlier. why would they go to India. any body seeing going to india as a punishment really needs to go it's beautiful and if the op really wants some one to go because they haven't been vaccinated to work with the locals you really wouldn't have to you can pay a team of locals to do that for you for around £3 each per day while you sit on your sun lounger enjoying what India has to offer I'm genuinely thinking about not getting vaccinated now just to have my name put in the hat to win this amazing trip. " My question was more based on the idea of supporting families and cremations being some sort of punishment ... not the going to India | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Why would they be relocated to India "I think its a hypothetical question. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Why would they be relocated to India
I think its a hypothetical question. "I would say a word beginning with r and I dont mean rhetorical | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? It's a simple proposition, as detailed above. If someone wants a different topic, they could start a new thread. Go to India, for stated reasons, (notwithstanding all of the whatabout this, that etc.) do you vaccinate before relocation? " i get what you are trying to do (maybe) but people make their decisions based on their current circumstances totally hypothetical, not likely to ever happen change in circumstances isn’t likely to make anyone rethink because it such an out there never going to happen scenario if the situation in india became apparent in the uk that might be a more realistic situation that would make people reconsider but with the level of vaccination we are building up its only likely that would happen if a new vaccine resistant strain came about in which case the vaccine is defunkt and therefore so is the question and i say all of this as someone who will be first in queue for my jab when they hit my age group | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? It's a simple proposition, as detailed above. If someone wants a different topic, they could start a new thread. Go to India, for stated reasons, (notwithstanding all of the whatabout this, that etc.) do you vaccinate before relocation? i get what you are trying to do (maybe) but people make their decisions based on their current circumstances totally hypothetical, not likely to ever happen change in circumstances isn’t likely to make anyone rethink because it such an out there never going to happen scenario if the situation in india became apparent in the uk that might be a more realistic situation that would make people reconsider but with the level of vaccination we are building up its only likely that would happen if a new vaccine resistant strain came about in which case the vaccine is defunkt and therefore so is the question and i say all of this as someone who will be first in queue for my jab when they hit my age group " Thing is... We were in the situation India is in not very long ago... Reporting thousands of deaths a day... Health systems close to collapse.. And... Trying not to be a jonah but... Its not impossible we would return to that situation. Here's hoping not. But we have a long way to go on this journey yet. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I’d question why I’d been relocated and though consider myself quite good at empathy and setting fires would think a language barrier may be an issue. Op, why would I be relocated? Why would I have to do these tasks in which I’m unskilled? Are these punishments? It's a simple proposition, as detailed above. If someone wants a different topic, they could start a new thread. Go to India, for stated reasons, (notwithstanding all of the whatabout this, that etc.) do you vaccinate before relocation? i get what you are trying to do (maybe) but people make their decisions based on their current circumstances totally hypothetical, not likely to ever happen change in circumstances isn’t likely to make anyone rethink because it such an out there never going to happen scenario if the situation in india became apparent in the uk that might be a more realistic situation that would make people reconsider but with the level of vaccination we are building up its only likely that would happen if a new vaccine resistant strain came about in which case the vaccine is defunkt and therefore so is the question and i say all of this as someone who will be first in queue for my jab when they hit my age group Thing is... We were in the situation India is in not very long ago... Reporting thousands of deaths a day... Health systems close to collapse.. And... Trying not to be a jonah but... Its not impossible we would return to that situation. Here's hoping not. But we have a long way to go on this journey yet. " i agree we were in bad shape but not as bad as india , unless i missed the part where we needed mass cremations i also agree that we could end up in a bad position again if we open too much too fast but i dont think we could get to the peak again because of the success of the vaccine programme which is still progressing and only ever improving unless of course we end up with a vaccine resistant strain of course and then its back to square one  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Why would they be relocated to India
I think its a hypothetical question.
I would say a word beginning with r and I dont mean rhetorical "Agreed  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It's a question for those currently unwilling to have the vaccine. If you are to be put into India, to help those family and friends who have lost someone to the virus, eith emotional and practical support, such as with cremations, would you have the vaccine? " No. I'd rather it go to somebody more needing of it and in a more vulnerable catagory. For the majority of people covid is not a lethal or deadly illness. There is nothing wrong or unusual about healthy, low risk individuals being sceptical or concerned regarding side effects from a brand new vaccine for a brand new disease. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse?" This is an excellent point. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse?" But wouldn’t they help their own country then instead of being flown to India to help | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? " Burn my passport | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse? This is an excellent point." You think it’s an excellent post. To me slightly less ridiculous than the op. Opinions eh. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What if you were relocated to the Starship Enterprise....ridiculous post " Id be fine with that, the transporter can filter out diseases | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse? This is an excellent point. You think it’s an excellent post. To me slightly less ridiculous than the op. Opinions eh." Excellent post.. Perhaps the dhocking scenes may make those over here, re- evaluate their destiny on the road to enlightenment | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse? This is an excellent point. You think it’s an excellent post. To me slightly less ridiculous than the op. Opinions eh. Excellent post.. Perhaps the dhocking scenes may make those over here, re- evaluate their destiny on the road to enlightenment " Agreed.. Very realistic suggestion.. If not overseas then at home working to help the NHS out and thus needing to be tested regularly too which helps everyone | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"You can not force someone to have a vaccine they do want or punish them for not having it Their body their choice some people who are antivax are that way because of a previous bad experience And as much as we are told it's tested and safe unless you can see into the future no one can know long term effects of something that hasn't been tested long term Its not like there has never been mistake with medication being tested as safe for it turn out not to such as morning sickness tablets that left babies being born deformed And as for ppl not helping with the battle have you missed everyone's battles for the last year the vaccine is part of the solution not the battle and if you are vaccinated with a vaccine you trust so much your safe And as for send unvaccinated ppl to India yeah just send unprotected ppl to get Ill and put more pressure on the already struggling medical system genius idea" What about simply just getting everyone agree to be tested to rejoin society again.. Would that be reasonable and fair? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse? This is an excellent point. You think it’s an excellent post. To me slightly less ridiculous than the op. Opinions eh. Excellent post.. Perhaps the dhocking scenes may make those over here, re- evaluate their destiny on the road to enlightenment Agreed.. Very realistic suggestion.. If not overseas then at home working to help the NHS out and thus needing to be tested regularly too which helps everyone " Well lucky for all the unvaccinated they won’t be forced to help. Bloody stupid idea. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " Spot on  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " Mic drop | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies?" Population of 1.3bn.. a few million spare western doses will not go far! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It’s oxygen they don’t have for the Covid If they had oxygen they would be fine But the Indian gov sold there oxygen to country’s who where been hit harder at the time The death rate in India is very low compared to the population This is our government trying to scare us again lol don’t believe them Look up your own information The BBC ARE LIRES " The death rate is low in India because most have already died before the are of a Covid susceptible age. Average age in UK is 40. In India it is just 26. Cases in India are doubling every 2 weeks they will continue to so for many more weeks maybe months. Covid has barely started on India! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " Applause clap hands emoji!!!! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I would prefer that my vaccine shot went to someone in India, so im not going to have my vaccination until india"s situation improves dramatically. It may be an empty gesture but there you are " Gesture is very kind but you personally will never have that choice! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse? This is an excellent point. You think it’s an excellent post. To me slightly less ridiculous than the op. Opinions eh. Excellent post.. Perhaps the dhocking scenes may make those over here, re- evaluate their destiny on the road to enlightenment Agreed.. Very realistic suggestion.. If not overseas then at home working to help the NHS out and thus needing to be tested regularly too which helps everyone Well lucky for all the unvaccinated they won’t be forced to help. Bloody stupid idea. " And you say that because? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. "  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " So yes you do have a right not to get vaccinated.. However, here's the sticky bit.. You say ' let others do the same' I'd argue that's exactly what people are doing.. Looking after their health and the health of others. We have a duty of care to each other don't we? Not to harm each other or cause injury.. And I Would say that's why people are getting a bit irked across the board.. And that is now pretty m ch a stale mate.. I disagree with you and you disagree with me. Both claiming its our right.. Blah blah blah However, there is one thing that we should all agree on.. Need to agree on I would say and that's testing. You can't tell me getting tested is something we should all have a choice about? Again I will cite my previous point.. It is a safeguarding issue. We a need and have a right to know who we are near when we go out and whether that person has been tested /can prove Covid free . Surely that's now the key to open up the world for us all again.. So by all means refuse the vaccine on whatever grounds you like.. But refuse to be tested based on your rights my body my choice etc etc and I'm afraid ai won't agree with you.. that situation changes everything about wanting to look after each other just a bit.. doesn't it? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " Thank you for your wisdom! Holier than Jesus vaccine bullies are in full force everywhere you turn all more than ready to cut everyone with an opinion different than their own to shreds. So much for being kind... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Oh dear, this site and it’s members has lost its direction and purpose " It's not changed too much in much of the last 15 years or so, though the past year has been a struggle for everyone, with sexual restrictions. Our hearts go out now, to those unfortunate people in places like India, Brazil etc, where they're facing a continued explosion in the virus's havoc. We've faced our own troubled history with it but are now more fortunate due coming out of it, than our brothers and sisters in those countries. The leaders of both India and Brazil have let their people down. It's so very sad to see unnecessary, tragedy. At least many of us would make a difference for the better for them, if possible. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
Plus if I was to be vaccinated say I’m 90% immune for 6 months, I have to keep being vaccinated for the rest of my life. Even in that time I can still catch covid and pass it on?
I’m not a conspiracy theorist just talking from personal experience  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I’ll donate my 2 vaccines to India, don’t see why I have to go there to help burn bodies because of a personal choice not to get vaccinated? I’ve had covid twice and would rather have it than a common cold, I’m willing to take precautions to protect the vulnerable and have done all along I’m mindful of others beliefs and risk to the virus. I’d personally rather stay healthy and fit and let my immune system deal with a virus that is so minor most people show no symptoms and have to get tested to find out they have it? I’ve got natural anti bodies and have been less ill actually having covid than everybody I know my age that’s had the vaccine and it’s completely written them off
Plus if I was to be vaccinated say I’m 90% immune for 6 months, I have to keep being vaccinated for the rest of my life. Even in that time I can still catch covid and pass it on?
I’m not a conspiracy theorist just talking from personal experience "Don't think you can actually donate your vaccine as it's on order or here already depending on age, India is one of the biggest producers of vaccines in the world and have profited from huge orders from other countries unless the Indian government change the way they administer the vaccine there is little point. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It’s oxygen they don’t have for the Covid If they had oxygen they would be fine But the Indian gov sold there oxygen to country’s who where been hit harder at the time The death rate in India is very low compared to the population This is our government trying to scare us again lol don’t believe them Look up your own information The BBC ARE LIRES " You hate the truth then grow up | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"BBC are the pravda of the UK...if I want to vaccinate..I will an if I dont...I bloody well wont !!! Mr" Then if you don't or won't.. I very much hope you don't expect to get the same freedoms as the people who did? And at the very least you agree to be tested before you mix with people who are Covid free? If not then I'm afraid that's just wrong given everything the world has been put through. We are set for changes and like it or not Covid 'proof' of some sort is absolutely going to have an impact on us all | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Been on the news that 129 people did not bother to turn up for their 2nd jabs in the Darlington area yesterday. Apparently this is being followed up and they are all going to be contacted to see why they didn't go. I hope this is not a sign of things to come " Of course it is The booking cost taxpayers £ The person could have passed away naturally or due to complications with first jab? We have to accept everyone now on this experiment is a scientific subject.. Victims of a lot of statistical analysis at all times.. So yes naturally things like non attendees will be followed up on.. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I’ll donate my 2 vaccines to India, don’t see why I have to go there to help burn bodies because of a personal choice not to get vaccinated? I’ve had covid twice and would rather have it than a common cold, I’m willing to take precautions to protect the vulnerable and have done all along I’m mindful of others beliefs and risk to the virus. I’d personally rather stay healthy and fit and let my immune system deal with a virus that is so minor most people show no symptoms and have to get tested to find out they have it? I’ve got natural anti bodies and have been less ill actually having covid than everybody I know my age that’s had the vaccine and it’s completely written them off
Plus if I was to be vaccinated say I’m 90% immune for 6 months, I have to keep being vaccinated for the rest of my life. Even in that time I can still catch covid and pass it on?
I’m not a conspiracy theorist just talking from personal experience "You say you are healthy and fit? Yet have caught Covid twice? Hmm *scratches chin | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. Thank you for your wisdom! Holier than Jesus vaccine bullies are in full force everywhere you turn all more than ready to cut everyone with an opinion different than their own to shreds. So much for being kind... " Not sure how this is either kind or unkind? People's decisions can be respected either way as can their right to be able to make that decision.. It doesn't follow people have to approve of it or hold back their feelings about it.. This really isn't an 'everyone wins and everyone nice to each other ' world they teach in school unfortunately | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies  neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I’ll donate my 2 vaccines to India, don’t see why I have to go there to help burn bodies because of a personal choice not to get vaccinated? I’ve had covid twice and would rather have it than a common cold, I’m willing to take precautions to protect the vulnerable and have done all along I’m mindful of others beliefs and risk to the virus. I’d personally rather stay healthy and fit and let my immune system deal with a virus that is so minor most people show no symptoms and have to get tested to find out they have it? I’ve got natural anti bodies and have been less ill actually having covid than everybody I know my age that’s had the vaccine and it’s completely written them off
Plus if I was to be vaccinated say I’m 90% immune for 6 months, I have to keep being vaccinated for the rest of my life. Even in that time I can still catch covid and pass it on?
I’m not a conspiracy theorist just talking from personal experience
You say you are healthy and fit? Yet have caught Covid twice?
Hmm *scratches chin "The healthy and fit can’t contract a virus? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Maybe if I wasn’t healthy and fit I would of caught it more than twice
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population "Can't believe you say you would rather catch covid than be vaccinated. We have had several family members that's died from Covid. The side effects are a small price to pay | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I personally think it's quite selfish not to get the vaccination. Why on earth would they want to risk their and other people's health like that? Surely a few side effects from the vaccination is a small price to pay rather than catch Covid? X" One's chances of being one of the people who die, or go blind, or lose a child may be small, but they exist, and you have no idea what the longterm consequences may be, they are as yet unknown. For some the price may be small, for others not so. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Maybe if I wasn’t healthy and fit I would of caught it more than twice
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population "You are making the same mistake as lots.. It isn't about you, how healthy or fit you are.. You can still pass it in to someone else not fit and not healthy.. So it will do them much more damage than it does you Tha vaccine is about protecting other people not necessarily ourselves.. That's why people should agree to take it if they physically can.. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Maybe if I wasn’t healthy and fit I would of caught it more than twice
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population "So you're saying the side-effects of the covid vaccine are worse than the effects of covid itself!? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? " Really OP. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Maybe if I wasn’t healthy and fit I would of caught it more than twice
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population
So you're saying the side-effects of the covid vaccine are worse than the effects of covid itself!? "Sometimes, yes as its well known that 86% of people who get covid don't even have any symptoms at all. Percentage of those who are young, not obese or in any other way vulnerable is even higher. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What if you were relocated to the Starship Enterprise....ridiculous post "
Spot on mate
I come in here everyday just to amuse myself with the ‘ridiculousness’
I think we should call people out who are guilty of buying a corned beef pasty from a supermarket and not Greggs too  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. " Excellent post. Re: conscientious objectors - sadly they were not universally respected. In many cases they were victimised and ostracised by others in society, called unpatriotic or traitor. Sound familiar? It is quite apparent that there are many people trying to find ways to shame others who are vaccine hesitant. I get people disputing anti-vax conspiracy theories but many people who have not yet decided to have the vaccine(s) are basing that on the lack of understanding around possible long term side effects (not short term). Naturally there cannot be any long term data but therein lies the problem and basis for concerns. People often say “ah but look at all these other successful vaccines” and yes that is indeed true. In ALL cases we have long term studies and data to understand long term side effects. The last time a vaccine was rushed through was for Swine Flu. This included mandatory vaccination for many NHS workers. This resulted in hundreds (possibly thousands) developing narcolepsy. In Ireland there were even worse side effects identified (look it up). So while every time someone brings up thalidomide and that is shot down by those saying “that was 50 years ago” and “not a vaccine” there are in fact other more recent more relevant examples for why people have a right to be hesitant. Being hesitant does not mean you will never have it. In fact I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of hesitant people are longing for the data to prove long term safety and nil side effects and will rush out to have it then! But trying to shame people who are right to have concerns and questions about what they put in their body is patently wrong. Help them, educate them, point them towards substantiated data/research that can allay their fears and concerns. But for God’s sake stop trying to vilify them! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. So yes you do have a right not to get vaccinated.. However, here's the sticky bit.. You say ' let others do the same' I'd argue that's exactly what people are doing.. Looking after their health and the health of others. We have a duty of care to each other don't we? Not to harm each other or cause injury.. And I Would say that's why people are getting a bit irked across the board.. And that is now pretty m ch a stale mate.. I disagree with you and you disagree with me. Both claiming its our right.. Blah blah blah However, there is one thing that we should all agree on.. Need to agree on I would say and that's testing. You can't tell me getting tested is something we should all have a choice about? Again I will cite my previous point.. It is a safeguarding issue. We a need and have a right to know who we are near when we go out and whether that person has been tested /can prove Covid free . Surely that's now the key to open up the world for us all again.. So by all means refuse the vaccine on whatever grounds you like.. But refuse to be tested based on your rights my body my choice etc etc and I'm afraid ai won't agree with you.. that situation changes everything about wanting to look after each other just a bit.. doesn't it? " 1. Are people refusing to be tested? Can you point me to that evidence please as it is not something I have heard or recognise. 2. While they are better than nothing the PCR tests are not that accurate (may have this wrong so happy to be corrected but isn’t it like only 66% accurate?) 3. If 2 is correct then that means we could have a lot of false positives and, worse, a lot of false negatives. The former is an inconvenience (and may impact livelihoods). The latter means people could be going around spreading in blissful ignorance. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" its well known that 86% of people who get covid don't even have any symptoms at all. Percentage of those who are young, not obese or in any other way vulnerable is even higher. " Is this a well known fact ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"It's a well known fact that 92.9999999 per cent of posts with percentages in are made up Chelsea at the 7 11. " I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs "Please could you state your peer reviewed source | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"During wartime there were people known as conscientious objectors who refused to fight because of their personal belief. However these people instead were made to perform other duties such as stretcher carrying on the battlefield, they did not get to sit the war out and then reap all the benefits without any of the sacrifice. The underlying principle beneath the OP's question is whether it is right during the current worldwide war against an invisible enemy, that some should be allowed the privilege of enjoying the results of the battle when they flat out refuse to help the effort even by taking a tiny painless prick in the arm? If they won't help by being vaccinated, then they ought to help in some other way. Conscientious objectors were forced to take their place on the battlefield without the benefit of a weapon because they believed weapons are wrong; should anti vaxxers should similarly be forced to do their part in helping with covid victims and their relatives, foregoing the benefit of being armed with the vaccine that they refuse?" No effort, many health professionals are declining vaccination and continuing to work. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs
Please could you state your peer reviewed source "There’s this bloke called Gary down the pub (garden) who seems to know his stuff! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies?" Waiting for the Indian fat cat business types to support their own country. Hope the owners of Jaguar landrover and Tata Steel etc are doing there but? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? Waiting for the Indian fat cat business types to support their own country. Hope the owners of Jaguar landrover and Tata Steel etc are doing there but?" Bit | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs
Please could you state your peer reviewed source
There’s this bloke called Gary down the pub (garden) who seems to know his stuff!" so it's definitely a true scientific fact then | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs
Please could you state your peer reviewed source
There’s this bloke called Gary down the pub (garden) who seems to know his stuff!
so it's definitely a true scientific fact then "Well yeah! Duh!
[for avoidance of doubt for anyone reading this I am joking] | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? Waiting for the Indian fat cat business types to support their own country. Hope the owners of Jaguar landrover and Tata Steel etc are doing there but? Bit" Don’t hold your breathe - most of them took advantage of the UK Govt delay to imposing quarantine rules on flights from India and rocked up over here. Just ask Rishi Sunak’s billionaire father-in-law called Imal Ritjak. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" I think you will find that is 92.9999998 but I am splitting hairs
Please could you state your peer reviewed source
There’s this bloke called Gary down the pub (garden) who seems to know his stuff!" | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"So anyone that decides to take additional risks in life, by say, having many sexual partners, or engaging in kink; should be forced to work in wards treating people with sexually transmitted diseases, or impact accidents? Or with victim support groups? Smokers are forced to work on wards with patients requiring lung transplant? Alcoholics forced to work in liver failure sectors? Or we could accept that we are all human beings, with the right to assess our own choices/risks and we could respect that? Also during world war 2 conscientious objectors volunteered to join the forces and volunteered as medics or support staff. Being a conscientious objector didn't stop them being drafted, it was respected and legally protected, even within war time. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean someone didn't already go through lockdowns, personal loss or find themselves unemployed/homeless or otherwise negatively impacted. Refusing a vaccine doesn't mean that they, their children and probably their grandchildren will not have to pay for the vaccines/lockdowns and all other costs either. Do what you do to protect yourselves and allow others the freedom to do the same. Excellent post. Re: conscientious objectors - sadly they were not universally respected. In many cases they were victimised and ostracised by others in society, called unpatriotic or traitor. Sound familiar? It is quite apparent that there are many people trying to find ways to shame others who are vaccine hesitant. I get people disputing anti-vax conspiracy theories but many people who have not yet decided to have the vaccine(s) are basing that on the lack of understanding around possible long term side effects (not short term). Naturally there cannot be any long term data but therein lies the problem and basis for concerns. People often say “ah but look at all these other successful vaccines” and yes that is indeed true. In ALL cases we have long term studies and data to understand long term side effects. The last time a vaccine was rushed through was for Swine Flu. This included mandatory vaccination for many NHS workers. This resulted in hundreds (possibly thousands) developing narcolepsy. In Ireland there were even worse side effects identified (look it up). So while every time someone brings up thalidomide and that is shot down by those saying “that was 50 years ago” and “not a vaccine” there are in fact other more recent more relevant examples for why people have a right to be hesitant. Being hesitant does not mean you will never have it. In fact I would hazard a guess that the vast majority of hesitant people are longing for the data to prove long term safety and nil side effects and will rush out to have it then! But trying to shame people who are right to have concerns and questions about what they put in their body is patently wrong. Help them, educate them, point them towards substantiated data/research that can allay their fears and concerns. But for God’s sake stop trying to vilify them! " ^^Very much this^^ And I had my second jab yesterday and typing one handed, and not for the usual reason. My left arm is aching like a bitch again....lol | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? " there seems to be a misconception that india is a 3rd world country when their economy figures would say otherwise why should other countries sacrifice their vaccine to a corrupt govt already choosing not to help themselves , why do we assume sending our supply would make the situation better? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? " I'm reading the words, but they don't make sense. Why on earth would I relocate to India.  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? I'm reading the words, but they don't make sense. Why on earth would I relocate to India. "It's a bit like the highland clearances Forced eviction of inhabitants of the Highlands and western islands of Scotland, beginning in the mid-to-late 18th century and continuing intermittently into the mid-19th century. The removals cleared the land of people primarily to allow for the introduction of sheep pastoralism. Baa | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? there seems to be a misconception that india is a 3rd world country when their economy figures would say otherwise why should other countries sacrifice their vaccine to a corrupt govt already choosing not to help themselves , why do we assume sending our supply would make the situation better? " You make a good point. There seems a general perception that India hasn't progressed over the last century. Its convenient and flabby thinking. That said... There's no harm in helping a friend in need... However rich or poor they may be. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? there seems to be a misconception that india is a 3rd world country when their economy figures would say otherwise why should other countries sacrifice their vaccine to a corrupt govt already choosing not to help themselves , why do we assume sending our supply would make the situation better? You make a good point. There seems a general perception that India hasn't progressed over the last century. Its convenient and flabby thinking. That said... There's no harm in helping a friend in need... However rich or poor they may be. " The caste system is still very much a thing in India. Be interesting to see Covid impact by caste related demographics. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Why would they be relocated to India "You cannot be relocated unwillingly,lol. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? " i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"350k new cases yesterday. 4200 deaths. Reflect on that a moment. " Horrendous | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it" Whilst I am a big supporter of choice, there a many who don't want to be vaccinated due to some antivax propaganda they've seen on Facebook or similar. The reason that it should matter to EVERYONE that as many people as possible do get vaccinated is: The more unvaccinated people there are, the longer the virus will be able to infect people and continue to mutate. If one of these mutations happens to create a strain that is not compatible with the existing vaccines, then we are right back where we started from, needing new vaccines & restrictions. Cal | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it Whilst I am a big supporter of choice, there a many who don't want to be vaccinated due to some antivax propaganda they've seen on Facebook or similar. The reason that it should matter to EVERYONE that as many people as possible do get vaccinated is: The more unvaccinated people there are, the longer the virus will be able to infect people and continue to mutate. If one of these mutations happens to create a strain that is not compatible with the existing vaccines, then we are right back where we started from, needing new vaccines & restrictions. Cal"
Plus - the vaccine will probably work for me. But not all medicines work for all people. And some people can't have it. And the more people who don't have it, the more chance the virus will mutate to a point where it can't protect us.
There's a little flexibility in the system, let's save it for those who need it, rather than those who don't want to play their part. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? there seems to be a misconception that india is a 3rd world country when their economy figures would say otherwise why should other countries sacrifice their vaccine to a corrupt govt already choosing not to help themselves , why do we assume sending our supply would make the situation better? You make a good point. There seems a general perception that India hasn't progressed over the last century. Its convenient and flabby thinking. That said... There's no harm in helping a friend in need... However rich or poor they may be. " well i think we already have in terms of oxygen and ventilators etc where it was an immediate supply issue , but i don’t think their lack of vaccine rollout is a supply issue is it? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Surely it would be easier to relocate extra vaccine and medical equipments to India (and other developing nations) instead of rich first world countries gobbling up the supplies? there seems to be a misconception that india is a 3rd world country when their economy figures would say otherwise why should other countries sacrifice their vaccine to a corrupt govt already choosing not to help themselves , why do we assume sending our supply would make the situation better? You make a good point. There seems a general perception that India hasn't progressed over the last century. Its convenient and flabby thinking. That said... There's no harm in helping a friend in need... However rich or poor they may be. well i think we already have in terms of oxygen and ventilators etc where it was an immediate supply issue , but i don’t think their lack of vaccine rollout is a supply issue is it? " I have no idea why their vaccine program is not yet working well. I don't know much about India demographics or geography or politics. Just that it's a big country with a big population and currently in strife. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I understand the OP perfectly well. You would " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
I put that here to highlight how hateful you sound.
Thats like saying send you to Australia, as you wear glasses/black/disabled.
I defend your right to say it, because I believe in free speech, as well as freedom of choice.
im assuming your saying that due to some fear you have.
You also realise per head of population (1.2 BILLION) India have nowhere near as many "Covid associated" deaths as the UK & their health system is very poor & extreme poverty the majority of the country has?
I recommend you tdo some research yourself (I know its hard work, but the BSS & fact checkers when you check up on them are generally not reliable.
Turn of the TV & let the fear go.
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"if your willing to vaccine, why not be relocated to India, to help them, as your "immune"
I put that here to highlight how hateful you sound.
Thats like saying send you to Australia, as you wear glasses/black/disabled.
I defend your right to say it, because I believe in free speech, as well as freedom of choice.
im assuming your saying that due to some fear you have.
You also realise per head of population (1.2 BILLION) India have nowhere near as many "Covid associated" deaths as the UK & their health system is very poor & extreme poverty the majority of the country has?
I recommend you tdo some research yourself (I know its hard work, but the BSS & fact checkers when you check up on them are generally not reliable.
Turn of the TV & let the fear go.
"What on earth are you going on about? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it" | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it Well said
" | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"This forum gets crazier by the day. True... " Very true | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol " I don't think "lol" is an appropriate comment | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"This forum gets crazier by the day. True... Very true" Full of very strange people | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol I don't think "lol" is an appropriate comment" Ditto.. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol " True, Putin says there no problem with coronovirus in Russia, maybe go there instead, must be true right | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol I don't think "lol" is an appropriate comment" It's a pretty shocking comment too | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Not all people that are refusing a vaccine are covid deniers. Some are just scared, personally I think they are wrong and haven't done their research and assessed the risk properly, but I do believe in personal choice. If some doesn't want the vaccine fine what I don't like is people spreading absolute guff on social media or wherever to justify that decision. I think that the majority aren't deniers but are unwilling for a range of reasons. This post is a curiosity about those who have been unwilling to vaccinate here to date, upon their position should they get to India, as posted earlier. why would they go to India." To work in a call centre? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol " Good grief | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it" Well said | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I'm not willing to vaccinate and why would I give a fuck about India lol " Now that is some straight up honesty right there. Rightly or wrongly you have to respect a person that picks a side and belief view openly . | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"If you are unwilling to vaccinate, what would you do if you were to be relocated to India, to help with families' victims emotionally, cremations etc? i think people who want to judge anyone for not wanting to have jab should Mind there own buissness and get on with there life If you had jab and believe in it why are you worried about any one who dont have it you suposed to be protected ??? Or don't you realy trust in it Well said " | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others...." do you have a source for this? since when did we start forcing people to get vaccinations privately when we have the nhs? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others...." Boris hasn't said anything of the sort. Also the covid vaccines used in the UK have all been licensed. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others.... do you have a source for this? since when did we start forcing people to get vaccinations privately when we have the nhs? " This was mentioned by Boris on one of the updates some while ago I'm talking months ago and advised whilst the opportunity is available take it after that it wouldn't be available free as treatment as it is now | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others.... Boris hasn't said anything of the sort. Also the covid vaccines used in the UK have all been licensed." Well All I can say on this topic you either missed it or didn't hear it being said I wouldn't personal say something that wasn't said | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others.... Boris hasn't said anything of the sort. Also the covid vaccines used in the UK have all been licensed. Well All I can say on this topic you either missed it or didn't hear it being said I wouldn't personal say something that wasn't said " It's not on Google or any other search engine I can find. If Boris had said anything resembling that it would have been all over the news. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others.... Boris hasn't said anything of the sort. Also the covid vaccines used in the UK have all been licensed. Well All I can say on this topic you either missed it or didn't hear it being said I wouldn't personal say something that wasn't said It's not on Google or any other search engine I can find. If Boris had said anything resembling that it would have been all over the news." It was on one of the public updates announced advising people to take the advantage of getting the vaccine when it was offered to them I'm sorry that I'm unable to recall the exact date when this happened so couldn't say if it was this year or last but seemed like he felt very strong about his words because even at that time and after I've always wondered what the fee/cost would've been it might have been at the time when it was announced that people are too remain in hotels after coming back from holiday when this was announced or it was before | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others...." ** I've never read anything to quote that Boris stated any such thing. The NHS have repeatedly made it very clear that if you decline the vaccine now and change your mind, get in touch and you will be vaccinated. Our NHS treat all, it's never going to ask whether you declined a vaccine or not. It's not about scaring or forcing people to take vaccines but always being open and available to vaccinate. That's not just covid that's true for MMR and all the vaccines offered. You don't keep or gain trust of people by forcing or coercing. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"There are certainly don't intelligence deniers in this thread. " Some. Fucking autocorrect and this forum not allowing edits. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Maybe if I wasn’t healthy and fit I would of caught it more than twice
First time no symptoms at all and the second time I ached at the most - the point I’m getting at is I feel worse when I have a cold or in fact a hangover. I get some people die who aren’t so lucky to be healthy and I’m not saying being fit and healthy stops you catching COVID or in fact any virus or infection. But it helps fight off and suffer less.
The wonders of nature and the human body have blessed us with a immune system which in 99.2% of people helps overcome covid, do we really need to vaccinate the whole British population when the majority don’t or won’t know they have covid and needed to be tested to know they have it? Can’t we just shield, protect and vaccinate the ones at risk
and let the rest get on with normal life? Almost 2 years of being locked up being able to do nothing people are suffering more from the effects of lockdown and missing other diagnoses and treatment?
Certainly if you’re low risk, have anti bodies from a recent infection and are able to make your own informed decision (I know it’s unheard of and frowned upon these day) you shouldn’t be judged and “sent to India to burn bodies” like the OP suggested and lots of people seem to tell you that you HAVE to be vaccinated?
I’d rather carry on catching covid than feel the side effects I’ve witnessed first hand of the vaccinations. Say I was vaccinated and came in to contact with someone with covid, I still need to isolate, I can still catch it and I can still pass it on
It’s on the TV, radio and even fabswingers people telling you that you NEED to be vaccinated, but does EVERYONE really? I don’t think so personally, that doesn’t make me need to be sent to India to burn bodies neither do I think the ones who insist on vaccinations need to be sent there to vaccinate the Indian population Can't believe you say you would rather catch covid than be vaccinated. We have had several family members that's died from Covid. The side effects are a small price to pay"Sorry to hear that but surely it’s your family members that needed to be vaccinated then and not me? I’ve had covid twice and would happily have it again, I have more antibodies than someone with 2 vaccines yet your telling me I must be vaccinated because your family members died and if not I should be shipped out to India to burn bodies against my own will? Crazy. You can wear a mask, you can get vaccinated, you can stay at home and shield if your at risk from covid. I’m more than happy to respect 2m social distancing if that will make you feel better. It’s my choice to get vaccinated or not. Let me know how the trial program ends in 2023 and I’ll think about then. And by the way, your vaccine lasts less time than antibodies from a recent infection, you can still spread covid and you can still catch it. Vaccinate and shield/protect the vulnerable and let’s get back to normal life and decent summer | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all." Then we'd perpetuate a lot of illness | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. Then we'd perpetuate a lot of illness "Only if the government don’t comply. Then we can all see who the selfish Really are. Or they clean up there acts and are politics and Broke. Trust gets addressed and healed followed by everyone gets vaccinated. With the amount of mistrust it should help stop the perpetuating of illness. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all." I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. Then we'd perpetuate a lot of illness
Only if the government don’t comply. Then we can all see who the selfish Really are. Or they clean up there acts and are politics and Broke. Trust gets addressed and healed followed by everyone gets vaccinated.
With the amount of mistrust it should help stop the perpetuating of illness."Uh. No. I'm not going to hold the health of the vulnerable ransom to politicians behaving decently. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Bottom line is as Boris stated once all those who wish to receive the vaccine have it won't be offered free after that it will cost you similar to receiving private treatment, I understand people views as it's not been licensed but if known for the serious and no serious side effects would you still have the vaccine or do without and gamble life or death and still expect treatment from the NHS if caught the virus I think should be refused due to might be others who for medical reasons are unable to be vaccinated and said person infecting others.... ** I've never read anything to quote that Boris stated any such thing. The NHS have repeatedly made it very clear that if you decline the vaccine now and change your mind, get in touch and you will be vaccinated. Our NHS treat all, it's never going to ask whether you declined a vaccine or not. It's not about scaring or forcing people to take vaccines but always being open and available to vaccinate. That's not just covid that's true for MMR and all the vaccines offered. You don't keep or gain trust of people by forcing or coercing." I totally understand your point but this is why I found it strange when Boris stated later on it wouldn't be available free if declined before I just wish I could recall when it was said so others could see | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... " Fair point. Whilst I am teaseing a bit I do think what’s being referred to a “conspiracy” problem is really a trust issue. Media have a lot to answer for as this is one reason trust in government is low yet we can’t expect media to not report on corruption (causing more mistrust). We allow to many people to enter positions of authority that hold a deep desire for power of over others whilst holding very little self power. This causes too much abuse which is the main cause of Mistrust in authority and hence conspiracies theorists. Until Society find compassion for these conspiracies theorists and help them heal by addressing the root cause they are not going away. Shame is not going to work here. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. Then we'd perpetuate a lot of illness
Only if the government don’t comply. Then we can all see who the selfish Really are. Or they clean up there acts and are politics and Broke. Trust gets addressed and healed followed by everyone gets vaccinated.
With the amount of mistrust it should help stop the perpetuating of illness.
Uh. No. I'm not going to hold the health of the vulnerable ransom to politicians behaving decently."How selfish | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... " We need our politicians to be honest. That’s a good start. I like your point though. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. Then we'd perpetuate a lot of illness
Only if the government don’t comply. Then we can all see who the selfish Really are. Or they clean up there acts and are politics and Broke. Trust gets addressed and healed followed by everyone gets vaccinated.
With the amount of mistrust it should help stop the perpetuating of illness.
Uh. No. I'm not going to hold the health of the vulnerable ransom to politicians behaving decently.
How selfish "Ok  | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... We need our politicians to be honest. That’s a good start. I like your point though." So what can you do about it? It's all well and good pointing fingers at others and saying what they need to do. But the truth of the matter is we only have control over what we do. Id also suggest "honest politician" is an oxymoron when our societies values are in the main inherently selfish and led by monetary values / measures. If our society were "honest" is it reasonable to expect products of that society to work in a system that corrupts to be more than everyone else? And remain "honest" (whatever that word actually means?)... This on a forum board on a website which is full of dishonesty about relationship status, smoking, weight, verifications, height, age, sentiment etc... | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... We need our politicians to be honest. That’s a good start. I like your point though. So what can you do about it? It's all well and good pointing fingers at others and saying what they need to do. But the truth of the matter is we only have control over what we do. Id also suggest "honest politician" is an oxymoron when our societies values are in the main inherently selfish and led by monetary values / measures. If our society were "honest" is it reasonable to expect products of that society to work in a system that corrupts to be more than everyone else? And remain "honest" (whatever that word actually means?)... This on a forum board on a website which is full of dishonesty about relationship status, smoking, weight, verifications, height, age, sentiment etc... " Sounds like the virus is doing us all a favour ??????? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... We need our politicians to be honest. That’s a good start. I like your point though. So what can you do about it? It's all well and good pointing fingers at others and saying what they need to do. But the truth of the matter is we only have control over what we do. Id also suggest "honest politician" is an oxymoron when our societies values are in the main inherently selfish and led by monetary values / measures. If our society were "honest" is it reasonable to expect products of that society to work in a system that corrupts to be more than everyone else? And remain "honest" (whatever that word actually means?)... This on a forum board on a website which is full of dishonesty about relationship status, smoking, weight, verifications, height, age, sentiment etc... Sounds like the virus is doing us all a favour ???????" Oooh good point. It made us a little kinder and thoughtful for a while didn't it? About 6 weeks and then people seemed to get bored of thinking of others. I think on reflection it's just embedded the unfairness of haves and have nots. It's been an opportunity fot everyone to reflect and make changes... And some have.. And that is brilliant. But in the main... The refrain is... I'm going to look after me and mine and fuck everyone else. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"What would happen is we all stood together and refused the vaccine in a Gandhi style huger protest until government became fully transparent with the tax loopholes for the super rich shut down and basically cleanup of corruption (No more private funding or donations to government, Shut down party politics, House of Lords to be elected, All the things that are common sense in making a fairer society). Then you would be selfish to get vaccinated until trust was regained for all. I'm not sure a vaccine for a global pandemic is in anyway linked to reform of democratic process, govt and all things that some of us consider are wrong with the world. Perhaps we could link it to... Until all rapists are captured and punished... Or all people driving without tax and mot and insurance are caught and corrected or... All students get a fair and good education... We need our politicians to be honest. That’s a good start. I like your point though. So what can you do about it? It's all well and good pointing fingers at others and saying what they need to do. But the truth of the matter is we only have control over what we do. Id also suggest "honest politician" is an oxymoron when our societies values are in the main inherently selfish and led by monetary values / measures. If our society were "honest" is it reasonable to expect products of that society to work in a system that corrupts to be more than everyone else? And remain "honest" (whatever that word actually means?)... This on a forum board on a website which is full of dishonesty about relationship status, smoking, weight, verifications, height, age, sentiment etc... Sounds like the virus is doing us all a favour ???????" Do we really need this kind of cost, harming all sorts of innocent people? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
| |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence." So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice?" As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"1. Are people refusing to be tested? Can you point me to that evidence please as it is not something I have heard or recognise. 2. While they are better than nothing the PCR tests are not that accurate (may have this wrong so happy to be corrected but isn’t it like only 66% accurate?) 3. If 2 is correct then that means we could have a lot of false positives and, worse, a lot of false negatives. The former is an inconvenience (and may impact livelihoods). The latter means people could be going around spreading in blissful ignorance. " Lava testing is biased in results to ensure that a false negative is extremely unlikely, that mechanism is actually the reason why it has a higher false positive rate than traditional swab tests. lateral flow is used in reality as an early warning flag, as someone working in a healthcare environment I can confirm the outcome of a positive Lava test is to alert the user they need to be properly tested and to stay away from an environment where they could transmit the virus that they ‘may’ be carrying. I deal with a number of infection measures at work, this includes staff infection rates, vistor and patient infection rates. What I can confirm is since its introduction LAVA tests have proved invaluable, our comparison between then and now in the figures clearly shows as frontlines carers we are far safer, our non covid patients are also massively safer whilst they are treated or resident. This argument that a day off work to test cripples the economy is bollocks, in the alternative world where people crack on and ignore ‘potential positives’ you then end up with localised spread within the workplace, a more widespread illness or perhaps even as we have sadly had over the past 16 months a colleague either lose their life or be forced from the workplace with long term sickness. That’s a far worst impact on livelihoods. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands." What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice?" I suggest we all act like grow ups and change. Take personal responsibility for ourselves and stop justifying the harm We do. Before we act ask “is this kind” and resit justifications. We all tolerate so much in our politics and we dont have too. It’s not hard to create a list of things that can change that 99% of the country would agree with yet the focus is alway on what splits us 50/50 whilst the obvious this to correct are ignored (For example tax evasion via trusts and offshore accounts. Also the lack of transparency ). | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice?" Mankind survived for 300,000 years without government for the majority of it and yet enough food was found for us to exist now. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice? I suggest we all act like grow ups and change. Take personal responsibility for ourselves and stop justifying the harm We do. Before we act ask “is this kind” and resit justifications. We all tolerate so much in our politics and we dont have too. It’s not hard to create a list of things that can change that 99% of the country would agree with yet the focus is alway on what splits us 50/50 whilst the obvious this to correct are ignored (For example tax evasion via trusts and offshore accounts. Also the lack of transparency )." So we're allowed to buy food, and live within society? That's a relief. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice? I suggest we all act like grow ups and change. Take personal responsibility for ourselves and stop justifying the harm We do. Before we act ask “is this kind” and resit justifications. We all tolerate so much in our politics and we dont have too. It’s not hard to create a list of things that can change that 99% of the country would agree with yet the focus is alway on what splits us 50/50 whilst the obvious this to correct are ignored (For example tax evasion via trusts and offshore accounts. Also the lack of transparency ). So we're allowed to buy food, and live within society? That's a relief." Of course you’re allowed. Just be aware of what your financing and be ok with that. Maybe think for a moment on shaming others whilst you have blood indirectly on your own hands. It’s ok not to be perfect?? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Only the kids are innocent in our society. You just have to pay your tax to lose your innocence or buy a product from a non innocent company. You only have to fund non Innocence behaviour to lose your innocence. So buying a chocolate bar makes you as bad as providing inappropriate PPE or refusing to investigate miscarriages of justice? As bad... not In my opinion. Just as paying a hitman to kill for you is not as bad as killing them with your own hands. What do you suggest people do, then? Who need food to survive but don't like government injustice? I suggest we all act like grow ups and change. Take personal responsibility for ourselves and stop justifying the harm We do. Before we act ask “is this kind” and resit justifications. We all tolerate so much in our politics and we dont have too. It’s not hard to create a list of things that can change that 99% of the country would agree with yet the focus is alway on what splits us 50/50 whilst the obvious this to correct are ignored (For example tax evasion via trusts and offshore accounts. Also the lack of transparency ). So we're allowed to buy food, and live within society? That's a relief. Of course you’re allowed. Just be aware of what your financing and be ok with that. Maybe think for a moment on shaming others whilst you have blood indirectly on your own hands. It’s ok not to be perfect?? " There's no pure ethics within capitalism. I'm aware of this. I don't think "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" works here. Harms and culpability are relative - some deliberate, some inadvertent or indirect. Most of us are just doing the best we can, and if only the perfect can work on changing the world, then we should all give up. I'm not giving up. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
