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Should the UK donate vaccines to the poorer Nations?
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." Yes they should donate ..... | |||
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"Are we not already signed up to the COVAX scheme?" Yes we are | |||
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"Are we not already signed up to the COVAX scheme? Yes we are" Thought so, cheers.. | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ"  | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. " I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though." All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." I see no benefit in a token gesture... Let's put our own mask on first, then let's help the EU and our immediate neighbours, then let's help everyone else in an effective way. I'm no expert but I'm pretty sure the benefits of the vaccine are only truly felt when a large percentage of the population have received it. What is the benefit of 1% of the population receiving it. Target hot spots and vaccinate them all. Then move on. Sending 10million doses to 3 billion people is just for political benefit. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. I see no benefit in a token gesture... Let's put our own mask on first, then let's help the EU and our immediate neighbours, then let's help everyone else in an effective way. I'm no expert but I'm pretty sure the benefits of the vaccine are only truly felt when a large percentage of the population have received it. What is the benefit of 1% of the population receiving it. Target hot spots and vaccinate them all. Then move on. Sending 10million doses to 3 billion people is just for political benefit. " Blimey I agree with you  | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. " Very thoughtful of you. You made my day with this comment. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? " What makes you think it won’t? | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. " This.. A the way *applauds | |||
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"In short, it should forecast our level of need, possibly on a pessimistic basis, and share a fair amount of whatever else we can afford to provide for nations in dire straights. Though it reads through some articles that the worst nations in terms of COVID-19 struggles are having issues with logistical issues as much as quantify of vaccines. I won’t get started on the nations with leaders who are denying the vaccine is the best way forward "For sure. Hopefully when it's safe enough we can donate volunteer time as well | |||
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"In short, it should forecast our level of need, possibly on a pessimistic basis, and share a fair amount of whatever else we can afford to provide for nations in dire straights. Though it reads through some articles that the worst nations in terms of COVID-19 struggles are having issues with logistical issues as much as quantify of vaccines. I won’t get started on the nations with leaders who are denying the vaccine is the best way forward
For sure. Hopefully when it's safe enough we can donate volunteer time as well"100%. I think that world, once safe, has a big part of helping rebuild the rest of the UK. I’ve been doing a bit of support for others but I feel like people will need a lot of face to face support when it’s in a space safer for all. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." In short yes, Brazil is in a desperate situation at the moment with the P1 strain. They need help otherwise their problem will eventually become ours. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. In short yes, Brazil is in a desperate situation at the moment with the P1 strain. They need help otherwise their problem will eventually become ours." Unfortunately we (as in the UK) cannot get rid of their President. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." Agreed and when we have a surplus to go poorer countries NOT the EU | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. In short yes, Brazil is in a desperate situation at the moment with the P1 strain. They need help otherwise their problem will eventually become ours. Unfortunately we (as in the UK) cannot get rid of their President." Sure. But I believe that some regions of Brazil have ruled that vaccines can be mandated, which indicates that the areas (provinces, states? Don't know) have some autonomy from central government. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. In short yes, Brazil is in a desperate situation at the moment with the P1 strain. They need help otherwise their problem will eventually become ours." Brazil is a corrupt nation not a poor country so a dilemma for me | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here" Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?  | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here" It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t? "Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me "Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care. | |||
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" It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. " Exactly this. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. " Try telling that to a local family that are currently watching over their son who is at deaths door with covid. Yes it's a global issue but there are issues closer to home to address first. From a political perspective we can only control our own roll out. We can't burden the guilt for other governments, ineptitude and corrupt infrastructure. Nor is it right to try and make people feel guilty for their luck | |||
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"Only when our own are fully vaccinated " So you're cool with a vaccine resistant strain developing elsewhere because we haven't helped others? The virus doesn't give a shit if you're British or not - it'll spread and adapt. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. Try telling that to a local family that are currently watching over their son who is at deaths door with covid. Yes it's a global issue but there are issues closer to home to address first. From a political perspective we can only control our own roll out. We can't burden the guilt for other governments, ineptitude and corrupt infrastructure. Nor is it right to try and make people feel guilty for their luck" You’re allowed your opinion as I am mine. If people feel guilty that’s their look out no one can make you feel anything. For me it’s about recognising how lucky we are in this country ... once all our vulnerable are vaccinated then a healthy something 20 year old waiting an extra month would have relatively low consequences and be life or death to an elderly person in another country. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care. "Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities"It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run. "Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens | |||
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" It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. Exactly this. " But what if we stop tomorrow here, send all the vaccine we have elsewhere.. Given the 'Kent' mutation is running rife elsewhere now, it's possible than if we stop vaccination now then in several weeks another will as you say mutate and crack on.. It's not going to happen that we look after others before our own, no matter how honourable or well intentioned the sentiment.. For any government it would be suicide, to carry on the furlough till when? The economy stalled further as cases rise.. We do not live in an equal world as I know you know personally, we have levels of infant mortality and medicine apartheid pre covid which will still be here post covid.. So yes we aren't all safe till we are all safe but there's no way will it be any different, it certainly wouldn't if it were the other way round.. It's human nature, not the nicest trait nor the only one we have.. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens"If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens
If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation. "Like was said further up about 55% have had there 1st jab so that meens 45% havent had there 1st shot.seems as they now starting on peeps 2ndjabs before everyone has had there 1st at some point there is gona be a shortage of appointment so cant see how they gona keep going at there current rate.let me guess youalreadyhadat least one shot? | |||
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" It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. Exactly this. But what if we stop tomorrow here, send all the vaccine we have elsewhere.. Given the 'Kent' mutation is running rife elsewhere now, it's possible than if we stop vaccination now then in several weeks another will as you say mutate and crack on.. It's not going to happen that we look after others before our own, no matter how honourable or well intentioned the sentiment.. For any government it would be suicide, to carry on the furlough till when? The economy stalled further as cases rise.. We do not live in an equal world as I know you know personally, we have levels of infant mortality and medicine apartheid pre covid which will still be here post covid.. So yes we aren't all safe till we are all safe but there's no way will it be any different, it certainly wouldn't if it were the other way round.. It's human nature, not the nicest trait nor the only one we have.." I don't think anyone is suggesting giving up on vaccination in the UK. But slightly slower vaccination here might have a greater benefit if given elsewhere. Is (invented numbers for sake of argument) a 2% loss in benefit to the UK worth a 10% gain in (random country) Ghana? Both in terms of personal suffering, but also slowing the development of a Ghana variant? | |||
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" It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. Exactly this. But what if we stop tomorrow here, send all the vaccine we have elsewhere.. Given the 'Kent' mutation is running rife elsewhere now, it's possible than if we stop vaccination now then in several weeks another will as you say mutate and crack on.. It's not going to happen that we look after others before our own, no matter how honourable or well intentioned the sentiment.. For any government it would be suicide, to carry on the furlough till when? The economy stalled further as cases rise.. We do not live in an equal world as I know you know personally, we have levels of infant mortality and medicine apartheid pre covid which will still be here post covid.. So yes we aren't all safe till we are all safe but there's no way will it be any different, it certainly wouldn't if it were the other way round.. It's human nature, not the nicest trait nor the only one we have.. I don't think anyone is suggesting giving up on vaccination in the UK. But slightly slower vaccination here might have a greater benefit if given elsewhere. Is (invented numbers for sake of argument) a 2% loss in benefit to the UK worth a 10% gain in (random country) Ghana? Both in terms of personal suffering, but also slowing the development of a Ghana variant?" Ta for the clarification, of course a system on the numbers stated would be beneficial both for the citizens of whichever country received the vaccine and on a more global perspective with growth and mutations etc but it will never happen.. Perhaps I'm too cynical in my age but the political fall out regardless of which party we had would negate it.. When we do start shipping vaccines it will be with some golden mop haired buffoon larging it on camera.. | |||
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"Are we not already signed up to the COVAX scheme?" I think that the WHO and other charities are pushing for an earlier release though, rather than waiting until we have completed our mass vaccination. Cal | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens
If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation.
Like was said further up about 55% have had there 1st jab so that meens 45% havent had there 1st shot.seems as they now starting on peeps 2ndjabs before everyone has had there 1st at some point there is gona be a shortage of appointment so cant see how they gona keep going at there current rate.let me guess youalreadyhadat least one shot?"The first jab/2nd jab is a non argument. If the roll out were to continue ensuring everyone got their 1st jab before issuing the 2nd jab, all it would do is put us back to square one, as all the elderly/clinically vunerable that have had their 1st jab would be at risk of antibodies lessening outside the 12 week timeframe and then becoming vunerable again and the risk to the NHS emerging again. | |||
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"Look not for the worst to guide your policies, unless you are happy with being amongst the shit. It's a global problem and we will remain subject to the conditions overseas, if you want to look at it from a purely selfishly driven perspective. We've had more vaccines out of Europe than we've sent to those 27 countries. Of course we should include sending vaccines out, rather than just a me, me, me approach. " Yes but when the vaccination programme has been in many peoples eyes a success this far, a light amongst the gloom and pitch black of many errors a party such as we have in power is highly unlikely to score what will be spun as a bit of an own goal in changing tack now.. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens
If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation.
Like was said further up about 55% have had there 1st jab so that meens 45% havent had there 1st shot.seems as they now starting on peeps 2ndjabs before everyone has had there 1st at some point there is gona be a shortage of appointment so cant see how they gona keep going at there current rate.let me guess youalreadyhadat least one shot?
The first jab/2nd jab is a non argument. If the roll out were to continue ensuring everyone got their 1st jab before issuing the 2nd jab, all it would do is put us back to square one, as all the elderly/clinically vunerable that have had their 1st jab would be at risk of antibodies lessening outside the 12 week timeframe and then becoming vunerable again and the risk to the NHS emerging again."Think u may have misunderstood what i was saying.the poster seemed to think we are nearing heard immunity.seems as 45% aint had there first shot yet id say we no where near it yet.now we starting on 2ndshots for peeps im guessing those getting there first shot are gona have to wait a while yet because there are 20 odd million who need a second shot.was trying to point out i dont think they will be able to keep up with the numbers being vaxxed like they have so far.i wasnt suggesting putting of peeps second shot until everyone has had there first | |||
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"Look not for the worst to guide your policies, unless you are happy with being amongst the shit. It's a global problem and we will remain subject to the conditions overseas, if you want to look at it from a purely selfishly driven perspective. We've had more vaccines out of Europe than we've sent to those 27 countries. Of course we should include sending vaccines out, rather than just a me, me, me approach. Yes but when the vaccination programme has been in many peoples eyes a success this far, a light amongst the gloom and pitch black of many errors a party such as we have in power is highly unlikely to score what will be spun as a bit of an own goal in changing tack now.." I agree | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens
If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation.
Like was said further up about 55% have had there 1st jab so that meens 45% havent had there 1st shot.seems as they now starting on peeps 2ndjabs before everyone has had there 1st at some point there is gona be a shortage of appointment so cant see how they gona keep going at there current rate.let me guess youalreadyhadat least one shot?
The first jab/2nd jab is a non argument. If the roll out were to continue ensuring everyone got their 1st jab before issuing the 2nd jab, all it would do is put us back to square one, as all the elderly/clinically vunerable that have had their 1st jab would be at risk of antibodies lessening outside the 12 week timeframe and then becoming vunerable again and the risk to the NHS emerging again.
Think u may have misunderstood what i was saying.the poster seemed to think we are nearing heard immunity.seems as 45% aint had there first shot yet id say we no where near it yet.now we starting on 2ndshots for peeps im guessing those getting there first shot are gona have to wait a while yet because there are 20 odd million who need a second shot.was trying to point out i dont think they will be able to keep up with the numbers being vaxxed like they have so far.i wasnt suggesting putting of peeps second shot until everyone has had there first"Ahh got you, my apologies | |||
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"A bit presumptuous that other nations and countries can’t take care of themselves." As in acquiring or making their own vaccine ? | |||
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"A bit presumptuous that other nations and countries can’t take care of themselves." Sadly history of quite a few of the third world countries shows that multiple factors dictate this: Wealth/destitute Corrupt governments pocketing monies donated Logistics of actual roll out Falsification of infection reporting. Etc etc etc These countries are going to need outside help in the way of vaccines, distribution, monitoring etc. | |||
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"Even being utterly selfish about it, this isn't over until the world is protected. Poor countries are reservoirs of variant, production without the vaccines or means to stop infection. Of course we should donate." There will never be 100% vaccine coverage, reservoirs will always remain. Should we share surplus vaccine yes but let’s remember in many poorer countries most people don’t reach an age which makes them susceptible to serious Covid.. a £50 Covid vaccine probably will not extend the life of the recipient but £50 invested in food, antibiotics or sanitation would! | |||
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"Even being utterly selfish about it, this isn't over until the world is protected. Poor countries are reservoirs of variant, production without the vaccines or means to stop infection. Of course we should donate. There will never be 100% vaccine coverage, reservoirs will always remain. Should we share surplus vaccine yes but let’s remember in many poorer countries most people don’t reach an age which makes them susceptible to serious Covid.. a £50 Covid vaccine probably will not extend the life of the recipient but £50 invested in food, antibiotics or sanitation would!" No, but people with Covid with the sniffles are a risk of creating variants which destroy the global vaccine efforts. Even if you don't care about the effects of the pandemic beyond your local community - it still makes sense to squash this thing. | |||
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"Even being utterly selfish about it, this isn't over until the world is protected. Poor countries are reservoirs of variant, production without the vaccines or means to stop infection. Of course we should donate. There will never be 100% vaccine coverage, reservoirs will always remain. Should we share surplus vaccine yes but let’s remember in many poorer countries most people don’t reach an age which makes them susceptible to serious Covid.. a £50 Covid vaccine probably will not extend the life of the recipient but £50 invested in food, antibiotics or sanitation would! No, but people with Covid with the sniffles are a risk of creating variants which destroy the global vaccine efforts. Even if you don't care about the effects of the pandemic beyond your local community - it still makes sense to squash this thing."
It’s all about virus suppression and reducing the chances of even more virulent strains. It is completely out of control in Brazil- the perfect conditions for a chance mutation. P1 at the moment is responding to some vaccines but how long before it picks up a another mutation or two to escape vaccines. We probably cannot wait for us to become immune before helping them
Helping them ultimately helps us in the long run | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? What makes you think it won’t? " Vaccines sent to Africa are more likely to end up in the arms of local warlords, the Army, political friends and various thugs. Look at The Ethiopian war atrocities this week for example. Same goes for Burma, Yemen etc etc Brazil I’ve no idea tbh, they’ve had some corruption trials but I’ve no idea where the truth lies, one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter etc etc | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here It’s a global issue virus will mutate globally not just here ... a mutation over the other side of the world today will get to the UK eventually. Everyone needs to be vaccinated starting with the most vulnerable ... regardless of which country you were lucky to be born in. Try telling that to a local family that are currently watching over their son who is at deaths door with covid. Yes it's a global issue but there are issues closer to home to address first. From a political perspective we can only control our own roll out. We can't burden the guilt for other governments, ineptitude and corrupt infrastructure. Nor is it right to try and make people feel guilty for their luck You’re allowed your opinion as I am mine. If people feel guilty that’s their look out no one can make you feel anything. For me it’s about recognising how lucky we are in this country ... once all our vulnerable are vaccinated then a healthy something 20 year old waiting an extra month would have relatively low consequences and be life or death to an elderly person in another country. " There are plenty of us in our 30s and 40s with health issues but not "clinically vunerable" who are key workers who have went to work everyday supporting high risk venerable clients at a risk to ourselves every working day since March 2020. I have lost a very good friend and a work colleague to covid who like me have not yet been vaccinated. Both were in their 30s and would like me still be waiting for the vaccine currently. So no sorry once all the UK adult population have A, had the chance to have both jabs, B, we reach herd immunity at 80% vaccinated (only because of point A) C, Due to A and B lockdowns can end and our economy start to truly bouce back Then we as well are planning anyway distribute all our surplus vaccines to those who need them most globally. A UK who is fully vaccinated, with herd immunity and with a fully open economy can do far more to help other nations finacially (like covax) than if we pause our vaccine role out now and start sending it abroad. Swing you often say lets not fail at the final hurdle with the finish line so close in reference to rule breakers...I believe that same principle applies here. KJ | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. " I make no apologies for my vaccination that I’ve already received, but I had no idea about donating to fund the program in other countries so thank you for highlighting this. I would have happily funded the cost of my own vaccination to ease the strain, but actually this seems like an even better concept. I’ll be doing that this afternoon once I’ve had a look at the details and letting others know too! | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? What makes you think it won’t? Vaccines sent to Africa are more likely to end up in the arms of local warlords, the Army, political friends and various thugs. Look at The Ethiopian war atrocities this week for example. Same goes for Burma, Yemen etc etc Brazil I’ve no idea tbh, they’ve had some corruption trials but I’ve no idea where the truth lies, one mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter etc etc " At the risk of being shot down in flames, then it doesn’t matter who gets the jab, as long as everyone gets the chance, morally, corrupt people etc shouldn’t be ahead of an 80 year old, but the virus does not make moral judgements it infects, sometimes it kills, sometimes it doesn’t. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I make no apologies for my vaccination that I’ve already received, but I had no idea about donating to fund the program in other countries so thank you for highlighting this. I would have happily funded the cost of my own vaccination to ease the strain, but actually this seems like an even better concept. I’ll be doing that this afternoon once I’ve had a look at the details and letting others know too!" Certainly an amazing way to give back isn’t it.... | |||
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"We have already donated vaccines to poorer nations. We are one of the worlds biggest donor to the covax scheme $750million, and our government (and the tax payer) have invested heavily in the development of a vaccine that’s being sold at cost price to the whole world, at a loss of profit ranging between £21billion and £42billion (depending on if they sold it at £15 - £30 a dose). That’s more than the combined covax donations of every country in the world. We’ve done more than any other nation in the - and that’s not including our world leading drug trials which have found two treatments. I love the U.K., it makes me sad to see how much bad press we get when we do genuinely amazing things. But it seems like nothing is ever good enough x" | |||
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"We have already donated vaccines to poorer nations. We are one of the worlds biggest donor to the covax scheme $750million, and our government (and the tax payer) have invested heavily in the development of a vaccine that’s being sold at cost price to the whole world, at a loss of profit ranging between £21billion and £42billion (depending on if they sold it at £15 - £30 a dose). That’s more than the combined covax donations of every country in the world. We’ve done more than any other nation in the - and that’s not including our world leading drug trials which have found two treatments. I love the U.K., it makes me sad to see how much bad press we get when we do genuinely amazing things. But it seems like nothing is ever good enough x" I didn’t know the figures were so high I couldn’t find any - where did you get them from. Actually amazing amounts donated already in that case. | |||
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"We have already donated vaccines to poorer nations. We are one of the worlds biggest donor to the covax scheme $750million, and our government (and the tax payer) have invested heavily in the development of a vaccine that’s being sold at cost price to the whole world, at a loss of profit ranging between £21billion and £42billion (depending on if they sold it at £15 - £30 a dose). That’s more than the combined covax donations of every country in the world. We’ve done more than any other nation in the - and that’s not including our world leading drug trials which have found two treatments. I love the U.K., it makes me sad to see how much bad press we get when we do genuinely amazing things. But it seems like nothing is ever good enough x "Here here
Yet European countries who all 28 combined together didn't donate as much as the UK did to covax have been found stockpiling vaccines and not actually using them, partly due to E.U leaders behaviour reducing people's confidence in the Oxford vaccine and because many E.U nations infrastructure to delivery vaccines is not yet fully set up.
Germany ‘violates’ EU joint vaccine scheme by buying 30 million extra doses.
Italy has blocked 250,000 doses of coronavirus vaccine from being flown to Australia.
The UK is absolutely leading the way in terms of helping the world in comparison to our critical Neighbours, we bought more vaccines than we need to avoid putting all our eggs in one basket a la France and have already committed to donating all the unused vaccines at zero cost.
We can't win even with some of our people sadly.
KJ | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " We’re primarily going to vaccinate our 25 year olds not for their own sake, but for the sake of our own vulnerable people. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." Of course, just shows what we have become when we have to even ask questions like this....... | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ" This. | |||
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"We have already donated vaccines to poorer nations. We are one of the worlds biggest donor to the covax scheme $750million, and our government (and the tax payer) have invested heavily in the development of a vaccine that’s being sold at cost price to the whole world, at a loss of profit ranging between £21billion and £42billion (depending on if they sold it at £15 - £30 a dose). That’s more than the combined covax donations of every country in the world. We’ve done more than any other nation in the - and that’s not including our world leading drug trials which have found two treatments. I love the U.K., it makes me sad to see how much bad press we get when we do genuinely amazing things. But it seems like nothing is ever good enough x" | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ" You really ought to fact check before putting up misinformation. EU has donated 350m to covax | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ You really ought to fact check before putting up misinformation. EU has donated 350m to covax " What fact are you questioning? As far as I see the poster said the UK on its own has donated more than all the EU combined. You say the EU contributions is 350 million where as the UK has donated over 500 million | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? " I was working overseas about 10 years ago and we knew vaguely about containers of cereal coming into the country as aid in sacks stamped US Aid. Now we all know the pesky little leaders of these African nations have little sticky fingers and tend to be a tad bent. Enjoying the finer things in life, like bullet proof fleets of Mercedes and overseas villas with tacky gold plated taps and well stocked slush funds, we tend to shrug and say can't really do much. But on this occasion the locals were getting on on the act, not only thieving the sacks but flogging the contents from roadside tables about 500m from the port. I'm going to be very silly and suggest if we give aid there should be EU or other multi national group to oversee the dishing up. To just send goods or vaccines is just asking for trouble. A great way to judge a country is to use the dead dog rule. When you land and transiting to your accommodation or workplace, when you see a dead dog on the roadside, see how long it takes to be removed, it's a great measure of the Country you are working. Happily, it's been many years since it was a person lying by the roadside, so maybe grateful for small mercies. | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ You really ought to fact check before putting up misinformation. EU has donated 350m to covax What fact are you questioning? As far as I see the poster said the UK on its own has donated more than all the EU combined. You say the EU contributions is 350 million where as the UK has donated over 500 million" The EU has made donations and individual EU countries have also donated...e.g Germany 1.2bn....a lot more than the UK. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. Of course, just shows what we have become when we have to even ask questions like this......." We don't need to ask this question. As has already been explained further up. We are leading the way in hoping other nations. Its just some people are preoccupied with slagging us off. | |||
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"Some countries already have variants. How effective will the vaccines be in these situations? " I listened to a podcast today that said that no variant so far has lost effectiveness against T cell immunity. (B cell is what's most widely measured) It will still help, it will still slow things down, and it'll all add up in slowing down new variants. (Alternatively, the UK has been almost entirely taken over by B.1.1.7, also known as the Kent or UK variant. Is vaccinating the UK less useful?) | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on. Of course, just shows what we have become when we have to even ask questions like this....... We don't need to ask this question. As has already been explained further up. We are leading the way in hoping other nations. Its just some people are preoccupied with slagging us off. " I took it as an open question. Should we do this, yes/no. Not yay or boo Boris etc. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? I was working overseas about 10 years ago and we knew vaguely about containers of cereal coming into the country as aid in sacks stamped US Aid. Now we all know the pesky little leaders of these African nations have little sticky fingers and tend to be a tad bent. Enjoying the finer things in life, like bullet proof fleets of Mercedes and overseas villas with tacky gold plated taps and well stocked slush funds, we tend to shrug and say can't really do much. But on this occasion the locals were getting on on the act, not only thieving the sacks but flogging the contents from roadside tables about 500m from the port. I'm going to be very silly and suggest if we give aid there should be EU or other multi national group to oversee the dishing up. To just send goods or vaccines is just asking for trouble. A great way to judge a country is to use the dead dog rule. When you land and transiting to your accommodation or workplace, when you see a dead dog on the roadside, see how long it takes to be removed, it's a great measure of the Country you are working. Happily, it's been many years since it was a person lying by the roadside, so maybe grateful for small mercies. " TBf making a bit on the side is not really limited to 3rd world countries. | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ You really ought to fact check before putting up misinformation. EU has donated 350m to covax " The fact that it has to be turneded into some cock measuring contest at all,is completely infantile. | |||
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"Some countries already have variants. How effective will the vaccines be in these situations? I listened to a podcast today that said that no variant so far has lost effectiveness against T cell immunity. (B cell is what's most widely measured) It will still help, it will still slow things down, and it'll all add up in slowing down new variants. (Alternatively, the UK has been almost entirely taken over by B.1.1.7, also known as the Kent or UK variant. Is vaccinating the UK less useful?)" The vaccine is fully effective against the Kent variant | |||
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"Some countries already have variants. How effective will the vaccines be in these situations? I listened to a podcast today that said that no variant so far has lost effectiveness against T cell immunity. (B cell is what's most widely measured) It will still help, it will still slow things down, and it'll all add up in slowing down new variants. (Alternatively, the UK has been almost entirely taken over by B.1.1.7, also known as the Kent or UK variant. Is vaccinating the UK less useful?) The vaccine is fully effective against the Kent variant " One, you said variants. B.1.1.7 is a variant. Two, which vaccine? | |||
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" As one of the biggest donors to Covax (who programme to provide vaccines to poorer countries) the little UK already donated more money than ALL 28 European countries combined! On top that we have agreed to provide surplus vaccines i.e. all the ones left over AFTER all the adults in the UK have had both jobs. I am absolutely with the goverment on this issue sorry. Also its funny that a lot of the people that are saying we should donate our vaccines now (long before all of the UK has had the chance to have both jabs) are those who have had their jabs!! Sorry but that's the epitome of selfishness. It's a classic I've had mine so I'm alright Jack and I can now be part of the virtue signalling going on. No just no sorry but there's millions of us going to work in the UK (not sat safe at home) who risk getting the virus due to the nature of our jobs every day and are desperate to get the vaccine and be protected! KJ You really ought to fact check before putting up misinformation. EU has donated 350m to covax The fact that it has to be turneded into some cock measuring contest at all,is completely infantile." Agreed | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. What makes you think it would get in the arm of an 80 year old African? I was working overseas about 10 years ago and we knew vaguely about containers of cereal coming into the country as aid in sacks stamped US Aid. Now we all know the pesky little leaders of these African nations have little sticky fingers and tend to be a tad bent. Enjoying the finer things in life, like bullet proof fleets of Mercedes and overseas villas with tacky gold plated taps and well stocked slush funds, we tend to shrug and say can't really do much. But on this occasion the locals were getting on on the act, not only thieving the sacks but flogging the contents from roadside tables about 500m from the port. I'm going to be very silly and suggest if we give aid there should be EU or other multi national group to oversee the dishing up. To just send goods or vaccines is just asking for trouble. A great way to judge a country is to use the dead dog rule. When you land and transiting to your accommodation or workplace, when you see a dead dog on the roadside, see how long it takes to be removed, it's a great measure of the Country you are working. Happily, it's been many years since it was a person lying by the roadside, so maybe grateful for small mercies. TBf making a bit on the side is not really limited to 3rd world countries." Usually, 1st world, bit more subtle but corruption is not my specialist area. | |||
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"Its a bit like the toilet roll/pasta problem and everyone grabbing at things so they were ok themselves. It wasnt a thing that started in this country and we saw how quickly it spread so until all the world is protected nobody is really are they. We can sit quaking on our island clutching our two vaccined arms and copiuos amounts of loo roll, but it wont be keeping anything from your door if other countries aren't protected too. It would be like doing Manchester but not Birmingham, and Manchester thinking they were safe. One world. Act like it. " Amen. | |||
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"I'm not saying the UK is being bad. If the question is, should we donate vaccines? The answer is yes." I think every single response in this thread to that straight forward question is yes we absolutely should. Not 1 poster disputes that. What people are saying is no to the media pressure to pause our vacinne programme right now because "over 50s and clinically venerable are done" and donate the planned vaccines to go out in the UK from now until the end of the july. That's what this thread is about and what people are disputing. I've lost a friend and a colleague both to covid who wouldn't like me have had the vaccine yet because its not yet moved to people in their 40s and 30s with more low risk health issues. Like me they worked every working day and then some since March 20 in high risk enviroments. Both tragically have left young children behind. Happy to share the local new links (if allowed) if you want to read about them. Point is we have given 55% of adults the 1st jab and much less 2 jabs we are not out of the woods and no where near 80% with 2 jabs needed for herd immunity. The UK needs all adults to have had the chance of both jabs, herd immunity reach, lockdowns removed and the economy as fully open as possible. Then and only then are we in the best position to help the rest of the world. We have already said all surplus vaccines owned by UK will be donated for starters. KJ | |||
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"I'm not saying the UK is being bad. If the question is, should we donate vaccines? The answer is yes. I think every single response in this thread to that straight forward question is yes we absolutely should. Not 1 poster disputes that. What people are saying is no to the media pressure to pause our vacinne programme right now because "over 50s and clinically venerable are done" and donate the planned vaccines to go out in the UK from now until the end of the july. That's what this thread is about and what people are disputing. I've lost a friend and a colleague both to covid who wouldn't like me have had the vaccine yet because its not yet moved to people in their 40s and 30s with more low risk health issues. Like me they worked every working day and then some since March 20 in high risk enviroments. Both tragically have left young children behind. Happy to share the local new links (if allowed) if you want to read about them. Point is we have given 55% of adults the 1st jab and much less 2 jabs we are not out of the woods and no where near 80% with 2 jabs needed for herd immunity. The UK needs all adults to have had the chance of both jabs, herd immunity reach, lockdowns removed and the economy as fully open as possible. Then and only then are we in the best position to help the rest of the world. We have already said all surplus vaccines owned by UK will be donated for starters. KJ " Tbh, I'm not up on what's being said in the media, I'm not paying attention. I think it's possible that greater good could be done, globally, with more equitable access. Which isn't stop rollout in the UK, it's perhaps slow it. That would cause some harm in the UK, undoubtedly, but it might cause greater benefit elsewhere. It's a utilitarian calculation which doesn't prioritise this country over any others. (And recognises that global access helps us too) I appreciate that you've lost people, and I'm sorry. | |||
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"I'm not saying the UK is being bad. If the question is, should we donate vaccines? The answer is yes. I think every single response in this thread to that straight forward question is yes we absolutely should. Not 1 poster disputes that. What people are saying is no to the media pressure to pause our vacinne programme right now because "over 50s and clinically venerable are done" and donate the planned vaccines to go out in the UK from now until the end of the july. That's what this thread is about and what people are disputing. I've lost a friend and a colleague both to covid who wouldn't like me have had the vaccine yet because its not yet moved to people in their 40s and 30s with more low risk health issues. Like me they worked every working day and then some since March 20 in high risk enviroments. Both tragically have left young children behind. Happy to share the local new links (if allowed) if you want to read about them. Point is we have given 55% of adults the 1st jab and much less 2 jabs we are not out of the woods and no where near 80% with 2 jabs needed for herd immunity. The UK needs all adults to have had the chance of both jabs, herd immunity reach, lockdowns removed and the economy as fully open as possible. Then and only then are we in the best position to help the rest of the world. We have already said all surplus vaccines owned by UK will be donated for starters. KJ Tbh, I'm not up on what's being said in the media, I'm not paying attention. I think it's possible that greater good could be done, globally, with more equitable access. Which isn't stop rollout in the UK, it's perhaps slow it. That would cause some harm in the UK, undoubtedly, but it might cause greater benefit elsewhere. It's a utilitarian calculation which doesn't prioritise this country over any others. (And recognises that global access helps us too) I appreciate that you've lost people, and I'm sorry. " Thank you. I think its an ideal of a world we just don't live in sadly. I don't think this goverment will slow our programme down to give vaccines marked for UK adults to other nations. We are desperate for the roadmap out of lockdown to succeed and whilst tight we are still on schedule currently. Pausing our vaccine roll out (what's been asked for in certain circles) is highly likely to compromise it. Most people I know are either at the wits end or have sacked the rules off (mostly both tbf). If this proposal happened then all the good work done in the UK would be undone very quickly. KJ | |||
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"The one thing people are missing in all of this is that Africa is a continent. A continent with roughly 20 times the population of the U.K. and despite that the U.K. has about 50% more recorded deaths than Africa. The reason for this is because the average age of people in the U.K. is double that of Africa and as Covid principally kills older people we have been hit far worse. As someone as said above we will be vaccinating young people to protect the elderly. With regard to mutations, if half the population are left unvaccinated in this country, then a new alienating is just as likely to happen in this country as anywhere else as we’ve seen from the Kent variant. We really are doing more than our fair share to help others by exporting the capability for other regions to manufacture the AZ vaccine, donating huge sums of money and in due course vaccines." Great post and some pertinent points. Kj | |||
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"Its a bit like the toilet roll/pasta problem and everyone grabbing at things so they were ok themselves. It wasnt a thing that started in this country and we saw how quickly it spread so until all the world is protected nobody is really are they. We can sit quaking on our island clutching our two vaccined arms and copiuos amounts of loo roll, but it wont be keeping anything from your door if other countries aren't protected too. It would be like doing Manchester but not Birmingham, and Manchester thinking they were safe. One world. Act like it. " Spot on | |||
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"If we were a poor country, would they help? Like fuck" But we are NOT and they ARE; and we do help in many things through charities and international aid, so yes we should be part of COVAX, and a big part of it and help in anyway we can. WHY you ask, because we can and we should and because we have the humanity that many people and countries do not. Do we really help others in the hope that we will get something in return, or because it is the right thing to do. | |||
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"I'm not saying the UK is being bad. If the question is, should we donate vaccines? The answer is yes. I think every single response in this thread to that straight forward question is yes we absolutely should. Not 1 poster disputes that. What people are saying is no to the media pressure to pause our vacinne programme right now because "over 50s and clinically venerable are done" and donate the planned vaccines to go out in the UK from now until the end of the july. That's what this thread is about and what people are disputing. I've lost a friend and a colleague both to covid who wouldn't like me have had the vaccine yet because its not yet moved to people in their 40s and 30s with more low risk health issues. Like me they worked every working day and then some since March 20 in high risk enviroments. Both tragically have left young children behind. Happy to share the local new links (if allowed) if you want to read about them. Point is we have given 55% of adults the 1st jab and much less 2 jabs we are not out of the woods and no where near 80% with 2 jabs needed for herd immunity. The UK needs all adults to have had the chance of both jabs, herd immunity reach, lockdowns removed and the economy as fully open as possible. Then and only then are we in the best position to help the rest of the world. We have already said all surplus vaccines owned by UK will be donated for starters. KJ Tbh, I'm not up on what's being said in the media, I'm not paying attention. I think it's possible that greater good could be done, globally, with more equitable access. Which isn't stop rollout in the UK, it's perhaps slow it. That would cause some harm in the UK, undoubtedly, but it might cause greater benefit elsewhere. It's a utilitarian calculation which doesn't prioritise this country over any others. (And recognises that global access helps us too) I appreciate that you've lost people, and I'm sorry. Thank you. I think its an ideal of a world we just don't live in sadly. I don't think this goverment will slow our programme down to give vaccines marked for UK adults to other nations. We are desperate for the roadmap out of lockdown to succeed and whilst tight we are still on schedule currently. Pausing our vaccine roll out (what's been asked for in certain circles) is highly likely to compromise it. Most people I know are either at the wits end or have sacked the rules off (mostly both tbf). If this proposal happened then all the good work done in the UK would be undone very quickly. KJ " I'm talking about what I think should happen, not what I think will happen. And this is in a world where people behave as I do - I'm at my wit's end, but that isn't going to stop me protecting people. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. " Possibly in the days before global travel etc, notwithstanding the current lack of travel etc but the interconnectivity is so much higher than even twenty years ago.. As things open up so does the increase in contact, ditto transmission.. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. " True, but your neighbour who you do see may well see her son in law who is a truck driver who meets a truck driver from Spain who has a grandma who knows some one who is a friend of the person 1000 miles away ... and so it goes on, and this is how it all started in the first place. | |||
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"The one thing people are missing in all of this is that Africa is a continent. A continent with roughly 20 times the population of the U.K. and despite that the U.K. has about 50% more recorded deaths than Africa. The reason for this is because the average age of people in the U.K. is double that of Africa and as Covid principally kills older people we have been hit far worse. As someone as said above we will be vaccinating young people to protect the elderly. With regard to mutations, if half the population are left unvaccinated in this country, then a new alienating is just as likely to happen in this country as anywhere else as we’ve seen from the Kent variant. We really are doing more than our fair share to help others by exporting the capability for other regions to manufacture the AZ vaccine, donating huge sums of money and in due course vaccines." | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " Yes and no. The vaccine isn’t a guarantee you won’t get or spread it. Mrs is on the shielded list and I know we’re not going to feel safe for her until 70/80% of the nation is vaccinated to severely risk chance of her picking it up. The vaccine makes her safer, not immune. Every person who has it makes us safer as a whole and ultimately is like or house in order first. That said I’m absolutely in agreement about us donating a surplus too, but I don’t want that to come at a cost of our own. I’m aware some of this is selfish but we have really found this year taxing, a move to normality is something f we are insanely desperate for right now for reasons I shan’t go in to here. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. " I cannot fathom directing charity towards first world countries during an international crisis. The idea boggles my mind. | |||
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"Urgh ..... this thread is so depressing. " ... I love your photos  | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " Until the adult population has been done its unlikely the uk will come out of lockdown. Deepening the already bad financial crisis and increasing government debt as furlough needs to go on for longer. As for donating money for the vaccine, that's not going to help right now when the issue is a lack of supply. | |||
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"If we were a poor country, would they help? Like fuck" And which of the worlds wealthy countries have not been part of the theft of asstets from the poorer ones? The poor countries are poor because the British Empire took their gold, gems, people, oil and anything else of value leaving them with nothing. | |||
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"If we were a poor country, would they help? Like fuck And which of the worlds wealthy countries have not been part of the theft of asstets from the poorer ones? The poor countries are poor because the British Empire took their gold, gems, people, oil and anything else of value leaving them with nothing. " No it isnt | |||
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"Imho, not only UK but other nations should sponsor poor countries " Over seas budget is 15 billion | |||
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"Gut instinct is yes, 100% unequivocally assist less fortunate nations. It's a worldwide pandemic, and pockets of transmission that are not dealt with provide more opportunity for the virus to mutate. But that is not exactly true, is it ? Inoculation, last time I looked, does not prevent you from catching the virus or passing it on. You can still shed. All it does is prime your immune system to hopefully mount a more effective response. Brazil's population is 211 million (2019) UK is 66.6 million (2019) So putting aside the argument that inoculation stops the virus dead in its tracks (it doesn't), the only thing left that it does do is reduce the chance of death if affected. It saves lives. Look at the numbers again : Brazil's population is 211 million (2019) UK is 66.6 million (2019) From a purely statistical viewpoint, where is the greater risk to life ? Where can the greater good be employed to affect as many positive outcomes possible ?" Why do people keep spreading false information about vaccines not stopping you catching a virus or spreading it? That’s totally untrue, and I’ve seen it repeated many times. Smallpox is gone because of vaccines. Even with covid, the vaccine will neutralise the virus in 70%-95% of people so they never actually get infected (original variant and depending on vaccine brand). Of those few that get infected, it stops 60% of them spreading it. So don’t be so confident with your false information. | |||
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"Imho, not only UK but other nations should sponsor poor countries Over seas budget is 15 billion" It was in 2018-2019. 2019-2020 was 10 billion. This year is lower again. I’m not sure what your point is but government spending was 851 billion in 2019-2020, so overseas aid was just under 1.2% of the total budget. | |||
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" In short yes, Brazil is in a desperate situation at the moment with the P1 strain. They need help otherwise their problem will eventually become ours." The vaccine works against the P1 strain so it won’t become our problem. It shouldn’t have been their problem either - Brazil is a relatively wealthy nation and they have more than enough resource to have tackled the virus. Their president told people it’s a flu and he didn’t invest in inoculation or prevention, and it’s younger citizens are no longer following rules - even going as far as to physically attack politicians who impose local lockdowns. Leading to a 613% increase in cases among the young. Brazil also rejected vaccine offers from the U.K. and the USA. Opting instead to take assistance from China and Russia, for political reasons. These things are not as black and white as people in this thread are making out. It seems some people have strong opinions about things that they aren’t very informed about. I think we could all benefit from reading up on things a lot more and double checking before saying something is right or wrong. [The final comment isn’t aimed at the person I’m quoting. Just a general observation from what I’ve read all the way through the thread ] | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. No sense in a 25 yr old getting it here before an 80 yr old in africa? We keep hearing unless a certain amount of peeps are jabbed here it will be pointless as more chance of mutations if enough aint vaxed so yea its more important to get everyone here done first.your usualy very vocal about people not wanting to be jabbed but now saying an older person in another country is more deserving than a 25 yr old here Yes of course an 80 year old should be a priority over a 25 year old ..... are your saying they shouldn’t?
Not until everyone here has been offerd it here first no.sorry but sort ourown shit out first before we start helping everyone else.does that make me heartless in your eyes yea probably but that really aint of any concern to me
Yup ... totally. But hey you have the ability to wash your hands and sit in a centrally heated house. What does an 80 year old with no healthcare system or clean water matter to you eh - you don’t care.
Im more concerned with the country i live in first and foremost once everyone here has had it i have no problem dishingout to rest of world. So no the rest of the world at the momment isnt high on my list of priorities
It will be when a vaccine resistant strain has developed internationally and we are back to square one. Herd immunity is the only way to stop this - we have 55% of adults with first vaccine now and an immeasurable additional percentage with infection induced immunity. Countries where community transmission is still rampant if a global effort isn’t made then this will go on forever. ‘UK first’ attitude is counter productive in the long run.
Yet you seem to put a hold on vaxxing a certainage group here to vaxothers elsewhere so by your reasoning that leaves a group of peeps in our own borders that could be a risk of mutations happening.it all well and good helping the restof the world but sometimes you need to get your own house in order first before helping others.shit happens
If we have reached herd immunity and I think we aren’t far off once all our first doses have had second then there will be very little community transmission which will mean significantly less possibility of mutation. "Sounds like you're agreeing with vaccinate our own first, and then donate. I read somewhere that over (might have been Van Tam or Whitty that said it in a press conference) that 70% of the population needs to be vaccinated to get herd immunity. The maths is quite easy to do... 68 Million population 15 Million under 18s Plus 2 Million that can't have the vaccine. 70% of the population is about 47 Million....out of 51 Million that can have the vaccine. So it's obvious that to achieve herd immunity, all age groups that can have the vaccine actually need to be vaccinated. | |||
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"Gut instinct is yes, 100% unequivocally assist less fortunate nations. It's a worldwide pandemic, and pockets of transmission that are not dealt with provide more opportunity for the virus to mutate. But that is not exactly true, is it ? Inoculation, last time I looked, does not prevent you from catching the virus or passing it on. You can still shed. All it does is prime your immune system to hopefully mount a more effective response. Brazil's population is 211 million (2019) UK is 66.6 million (2019) So putting aside the argument that inoculation stops the virus dead in its tracks (it doesn't), the only thing left that it does do is reduce the chance of death if affected. It saves lives. Look at the numbers again : Brazil's population is 211 million (2019) UK is 66.6 million (2019) From a purely statistical viewpoint, where is the greater risk to life ? Where can the greater good be employed to affect as many positive outcomes possible ? Why do people keep spreading false information about vaccines not stopping you catching a virus or spreading it? That’s totally untrue, and I’ve seen it repeated many times. Smallpox is gone because of vaccines. Even with covid, the vaccine will neutralise the virus in 70%-95% of people so they never actually get infected (original variant and depending on vaccine brand). Of those few that get infected, it stops 60% of them spreading it. So don’t be so confident with your false information. " | |||
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"Yea donate once we have done everyone here.keep hearing about shortages are about to happen here so now wouldnt be a great time to start sharing itwith others" ^^^^^^^ Look after yourselves first. Ye are doing an excellent job of mass vaccinating and ye have to be admired. #Uk Ye are way ahead of any other Country. | |||
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"Yea donate once we have done everyone here.keep hearing about shortages are about to happen here so now wouldnt be a great time to start sharing itwith others ^^^^^^^ Look after yourselves first. Ye are doing an excellent job of mass vaccinating and ye have to be admired. #Uk Ye are way ahead of any other Country. " *Way ahead with vaccine administration...Well Done. Defo to be admired | |||
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"Can somebody please remind me which countries are going out of their way to help us as it always seems to be going one way " Well as I recall gernany donated ventilators to us in the early part of the crises. If we need support from 3rd world countries, its not really a huge glowing reference of where we are as a country. | |||
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"Imho, not only UK but other nations should sponsor poor countries " Fairly sure they do. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. Possibly in the days before global travel etc, notwithstanding the current lack of travel etc but the interconnectivity is so much higher than even twenty years ago.. As things open up so does the increase in contact, ditto transmission.." Absolutely agree. Its just manage the higher risks first. And then the lower risks when you have time / capacity. Eg.... There are more visitors from France than there are from say Chile.? We are too small and insignificant to fix the worlds problems but we can help the world's problems by making our part of the world as covid free and safe as possible and therefore not take it somewhere else. I'm also of the opinion that travel is the reason for this problem. So the solution lies in changing our travel behaviours... Not just carrying on as if nothing has happened. So whether that means less travel, changing check in and exit procedures, changing travel documents etc... Something has to change or we will be right back here with another virus or variant as quick as you like. | |||
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"If we were a poor country, would they help? Like fuck And which of the worlds wealthy countries have not been part of the theft of asstets from the poorer ones? The poor countries are poor because the British Empire took their gold, gems, people, oil and anything else of value leaving them with nothing. " Lol where did you get that gem from. Venezuela has the world's biggest proven oil reserves, 304 billion barrels. Botswana and the DRC have the second and third biggest diamond reserves. South Africa has the third largest gold mined reserves. Ask their leaders what the fuck they are doing with all that wealth. Buying Ferraris mainly. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. True, but your neighbour who you do see may well see her son in law who is a truck driver who meets a truck driver from Spain who has a grandma who knows some one who is a friend of the person 1000 miles away ... and so it goes on, and this is how it all started in the first place. " I get the point you are trying to make... There are lots of "collisions" but again I reiterate... The chain of events that you mentioned is much less likely to happen than me encountering someone in a supermarket locally. Therefore in terms of managing the risk and probability I would address the higher risk higher probability events first and the less likely later. | |||
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"If we were a poor country, would they help? Like fuck And which of the worlds wealthy countries have not been part of the theft of asstets from the poorer ones? The poor countries are poor because the British Empire took their gold, gems, people, oil and anything else of value leaving them with nothing. " Oh dear. More research required I feel. | |||
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"The Government is being urged to donate vaccines to poorer nations. The Government has said it will share future surplus when available. As there is an apparent imminent shortage i would say that the Governments stance is the right one and i seriously doubt many other Nations will share vaccine until their own Nations are done, Italy being a prime example with already having a supply stashed away. Once everyone in the UK who wants the vaccine has had their two doses and other vaccines come online then yes donate to countries who cannot supply their own people though i do fear that their will be profiteering and scamming going on." Yes, If they UK can ensure they actually get to those who are needing them. I was in Djibouti in 80's and the donated US grain was guarded by dodgy lookers who drove Mercs. I doubt much of it got to the adjoining countries who needed it. | |||
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"Even being utterly selfish about it, this isn't over until the world is protected. Poor countries are reservoirs of variant, production without the vaccines or means to stop infection. Of course we should donate." Well said, even looking at it selfishly there are good reasons to donate | |||
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"South Africa has the third largest gold mined reserves. Ask their leaders what the fuck they are doing with all that wealth. " The majority of South Africa's gold assets are owned by global conglomerates, many originating in ownership from the UK and Europe. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. " Agreed! X | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. Agreed! X" Did you know... (I didn't till I looked it up) average lifespan for males is 62 and females 65 in Africa. | |||
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"Imagine having no healthcare system, no home, no clean water and no ability for hand hygiene. Imagine watching the fifth wealthiest nation who have the ability to sit on their arse abs watch Netflix in centrally heated homes while you watch your mum drown due to lungs filling up. Total lack of human empathy ..... no wonder the Torys keep getting in. What did Boris say? ‘Greed and capitalism’ Ps you can donate the cost of your jab to Covax independently once you’ve had it or £48 will see ten people vaccinated - you know from the price of a family takeaway. I want to think like this but as you say imagine your mum. I want her protected first. So i am with the majority and say make sure the uk and ireland have been vaccinated first. Love the idea of donating though. All our vulnerable have been done ...... I totally get that this needs to happen first (mainly as Boris has fucked up so badly we need it more) but after that? A healthy 25 year old in the uk gets it before an 80 year olds in Africa? There is no sense or humanity in that decision. Agreed! X" Agreed too! Prioritised on vulnerability rather than location is how it should be! However I expect maybe impossible to put in place. | |||
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"Just a thought on the "nobody's safe until we are all safe" comments... I'm not convinced. If my neighbour isn't safe... The chance of me encountering her is... Quite high. If its somebody 10000 miles away who is never going to travel. The chance of me encountering them is very small. In terms of managing our own risk. Its us and then those most likely to visit.... So EU. Possibly in the days before global travel etc, notwithstanding the current lack of travel etc but the interconnectivity is so much higher than even twenty years ago.. As things open up so does the increase in contact, ditto transmission.. Absolutely agree. Its just manage the higher risks first. And then the lower risks when you have time / capacity. Eg.... There are more visitors from France than there are from say Chile.? We are too small and insignificant to fix the worlds problems but we can help the world's problems by making our part of the world as covid free and safe as possible and therefore not take it somewhere else. I'm also of the opinion that travel is the reason for this problem. So the solution lies in changing our travel behaviours... Not just carrying on as if nothing has happened. So whether that means less travel, changing check in and exit procedures, changing travel documents etc... Something has to change or we will be right back here with another virus or variant as quick as you like. " All pretty much true. Will we cancel our foreign holidays, nope. Will we cut down using our 4 x 4's to take the kids to school, when getting out of the house an hour earlier and walking with them is better in may ways, nope. Will we stop buying loads of toilet rolls for no logical reason, nope. Will we stop buying stuff wrapped in non recyclable packaging to send a message to producers, nope. Basically, most of us to a certain extent just talk a good fight. Me included. Best leave it to others then we can slag them off for not listening to what we never said in the first instance. So is life. | |||
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"It’s about time other countries fucked off tbh, can’t even vaccinate our own population but we’re being encouraged to donate to others already, feed the world was over 30 years ago and they still can’t achieve the skills/brains to build farms and houses near a river " Wow | |||
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"It’s about time other countries fucked off tbh, can’t even vaccinate our own population but we’re being encouraged to donate to others already, feed the world was over 30 years ago and they still can’t achieve the skills/brains to build farms and houses near a river " Ohh my! | |||
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"It’s about time other countries fucked off tbh, can’t even vaccinate our own population but we’re being encouraged to donate to others already, feed the world was over 30 years ago and they still can’t achieve the skills/brains to build farms and houses near a river " Says the folks from Blackpool, that thriving metropolis! | |||
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"It’s about time other countries fucked off tbh, can’t even vaccinate our own population but we’re being encouraged to donate to others already, feed the world was over 30 years ago and they still can’t achieve the skills/brains to build farms and houses near a river " Would’nt it be nice to help countries experiencing surges against the B117 strain? The world would be in a lot better position if the B117 strain did not exist. Not doing enough virus suppression in this country allowed this strain to take off last year- I think exporting vaccine to affect countries is the least we can do. | |||
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