FabSwingers.com > Forums > Virus > Should schools stay closed until Easter?

Should schools stay closed until Easter?

By *exy_Horny OP Couple over a year ago

Leigh

We think they should. They are high risk settings for the transmission of viruses, as evidenced by the back to school colds everyone gets in normal years.

If schools were told to close, and were instructed to provide online teaching this could be planned for. As it is, it will be more disruptive to be in and out of school at short notice when the inevitable positive covid test results come in.

The online teaching should be done properly this time. There is no reason a full live timetable can't be taught via a suitable streaming platform.

Online provision at our daughter's school has been pretty useless so far. No live teaching at all. Only recently have the teachers been recording snippets of lessons, even then there is no consistency of platform. It is as if each teacher has Googled to find the best software, and come up with a different answer.

In the Summer term, a small amount of homework was set (took our daughter about 2 days to complete each week) but so many parents of the lazy layabouts who couldn't be bothered to learn complained that their little darlings couldn't cope with the "stress" of the amount of homework, and it was affecting their "mental health" that the school halved the amount of homework set. Our daughter repeatedly requested extra work, sometimes she got it, mostly she didn't.

For those who will, no doubt, defend the lazy - children of key workers, and vulnerable children should be in school anyway. This will help most of the ones who can't afford suitable IT for the homework. The few who are not in that group who are still struggling should also be allowed to go to school. The rest should just get on with it - most people have phones, and a Raspberry Pi 400 computer kit at £93 will also be adequate.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I agree. Schools should be closed and as many people as possible should be furloughed until enough of the population have been given the vaccine. If that takes until Easter, so be it. If it is the only way to get Covid under control, and it increasingly looks like that may be the case, and if it gets us back to pre-covid normality then bring it on and get it done.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Well done to your daughter for coping so well. Unfortunately children aren't made with cookie cutters, a fact you might want to consider before you go branding those that didn't cope well as layabouts or lazy or having in inverted commas mental health problems

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No they shouldn't, students and school kids should be part of the first sets of vaccinations, alongside the vulnerable and Frontline. This year has put a huge hole in millions of educations, educations which will help prop up this country down the line, any more disruptions will just make it worse. Schools are designed to be places of education, no matter how good the laptops and tablets are, kids aren't in the frame of mind to truly learn at home, it's not where their brain is programmed to learn.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If kids were to stay at home , would they stay inside or go outside and mix ?? I know most would be outside mixing , so it would make zero difference, there would be accidents that need the hospitals to look after there breaks and cuts etc , so no , kids should be in schools learning

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

And as if fully grown adults are calling children lazy layabouts.

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

let's frame it another way. why should schools remain open?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 03/01/21 11:47:26]

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By *ty31Man over a year ago

NW London

I think that schools should be shut for January and the time used to devise a better way of bringing students back safely.

It's become obvious that many kids aren't getting quality education without physically being in school and it's also become obvious that school buildings alone don't have the capacity required not to become covid hotspots.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

So not really closing schools then if the children of key workers are in; plus vulnerable children, who decides what the criteria is for vulnerable ? Add to that those that can’t afford the suitable equipment and IT infrastructure for that to run properly. I’d estimate that would be half of an average school.

For those saying they can’t open until the kids are vaccinated, one flaw in that plan the under 16s aren’t receiving the vaccine as it hasn’t been tested or approved for that age group.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Because that is where children are conditioned to learn, the home education thing will not work anywhere near as well. Them not being at school has a huge impact on their futures and the future of the country. This is why people get so frustrated at the measures being taken because most of them will have a devastating impact on the future of the nation after covid, so we will move from disaster into many more. Vaccinate the most mobile and most vulnerable side by side...

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By *ild_oatsMan over a year ago

the land of saints & sinners

School should remain open. Education is a key life skill and any absence hiders the growth and development and the life chances of the young people in this country otherwise we will end up with a lost generation.

Over 4 million families are in food poverty in the uk. These families are also in digital poverty as well and do not the access to the resources or the knowledge the OP suggests.

Schools provide far more than just education they also provide pastoral care to vulnerable children in our society.

As well as valuable social interaction that help that children need with their development.

Also not everything can be taught online.

So schools should remain open ....end of.. !!!!

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By *arkinberksMan over a year ago

Ascot

There are several issues with closing schools and relying on online teaching, just as there are with keeping schools open. For me the biggest problems are that closing schools means working parents have to source childcare or not work. If the parents are key workers that reduces the number of people available to treat the pandemic, thus we saw schools having to open for the children of key workers. If you have to open the school then where is the difference between having 3-5 children in a year group or 30 ? You should still be preventing mixing across age groups and staff should not mix either. The bigger issue is that it is very difficult to enforce segregation. Sure, you may be able to do something at school, but you can do nothing about the journey to and from school. Now consider the issue with siblings at different schools. If one of them is in a class where another child reports with covid, that class is suspended, but that doesn’t prevent a younger child from going to their school and potentially carrying the infection there. So is the answer online teaching? It has worked in countries like Australia. Thing is that the delivery mechanisms for online teaching rely on a computer and reasonable broadband access. In 2020 12% of households did not own a computer and 5%had no internet access. Large parts of the UK suffer from slow internet speeds because of the copper wire infrastructure that historically has been used by telecoms. Replacing this with fibre optic cabling is a mammoth task and unlikely to be completed. How do you deliver online teaching to siblings of different ages simultaneously, particularly if there is only one computer in the household? Is the expectation that schools will provide the requisite hardware for this ? Sure, you can provide recorded lessons, but that means losing the pupil teacher interaction.

The bottom line is that there is no magic solution. If you keep schools open because you need to keep the economy going, you have to accept that you are creating a situation for the spread of the virus. If you close schools, well, actually you can’t because that removes a proportion of your key workers. Moreover, you then reduce your workforce as parents are unable to secure childcare. It really is that simple

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"School should remain open. Education is a key life skill and any absence hiders the growth and development and the life chances of the young people in this country otherwise we will end up with a lost generation.

Over 4 million families are in food poverty in the uk. These families are also in digital poverty as well and do not the access to the resources or the knowledge the OP suggests.

Schools provide far more than just education they also provide pastoral care to vulnerable children in our society.

As well as valuable social interaction that help that children need with their development.

Also not everything can be taught online.

So schools should remain open ....end of.. !!!!"

I think you’ll find your opinion is not the one that will prevail

I’m sure schools would love you to volunteer if you think they’re safe.

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

the need for education and the mechanics of how education is delivered are being mixed up during this debate.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS over a year ago

Central

As none of the vaccines have been tested for safety or efficacy on children, we have to keep them free of the virus by other means. They can pass it to staff and family, if together, as well as each other. They may not produce much virus to pass on, if without symptoms.

The big logistical problems of having them all at home, are parents who need to work, some of them from home but not all. It would probably take time to coordinate lesson creation and computer distribution. It's not a ready made solution for now.

A raspberry pi would only be suitable for those with other equipment but is probably too difficult for the majority of families. Online learning is also not as good as in person.

Do we have the evidence to keep them from school? I don't think we do at present. We should evaluate the need though.

Johnson is talking about tighter changes possibly in come and this may be amongst them.

We’ve spent £22 billions on private testing and tracing which is not working. This service must be get to work, to halt the spread. It's the elephant in the room

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

I think ..... Move to online for January to see what happens then blended learning one week on one week off making classes of 15 so social distancing is possible until vaccinations have been rolled out to the wider community - school staff should be prioritised for the vaccine and also allowed to wear masks.

I have no experience in how secondary works so I won’t pass my opinion on about something I know nothing about

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By *tace 309TV/TS over a year ago

durham

The trouble with the, suggestion of closing schools, till Easter is the virus, will still be here and will be for some time, after that Vaccine or not. Normality or New normality will not suddenly start up then.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"As none of the vaccines have been tested for safety or efficacy on children, we have to keep them free of the virus by other means. They can pass it to staff and family, if together, as well as each other. They may not produce much virus to pass on, if without symptoms.

A raspberry pi would only be suitable for those with other equipment but is probably too difficult for the majority of families. Online learning is also not as good as in person.

Do we have the evidence to keep them from school? I don't think we do at present. We should evaluate the need though.

Johnson is talking about tighter changes possibly in come and this may be amongst them.

We’ve spent £22 billions on private testing and tracing which is not working. This service must be get to work, to halt the spread. It's the elephant in the room "

The issue is they spread it ... around 33% of staff were isolating before Christmas - the lateral flow tests don’t work and have been removed. The issue is the spread to staff and the community. If schools open next week (and it now looks unlikely) the new variant will mean not enough staff anyway.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"The trouble with the, suggestion of closing schools, till Easter is the virus, will still be here and will be for some time, after that Vaccine or not. Normality or New normality will not suddenly start up then. "

Then we need to roll out blended learning the government promised tech to families who need it then dodnt provide it. This is now coming up for a year and Bojo has done nothing.

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By *aralewisCouple over a year ago

South Yorkshire

No they shouldn’t

And the economy she be back up and running the most valuable should be vaccinated and take extra care

The virus isn’t going anywhere even if we was all locked inside for weeks and month

Coz virus mutates so the new strain now covid 20

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"If kids were to stay at home , would they stay inside or go outside and mix ?? I know most would be outside mixing , so it would make zero difference, there would be accidents that need the hospitals to look after there breaks and cuts etc , so no , kids should be in schools learning "

If they’re out and about fine the parents - simple

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

Is there any evidence yet that primary schools are spreading the virus and causing hospital admissions? I mean evidence and not supposition that because kids spread germs therefore schools should be closed.?

And im not for one moment saying it Never happens in primary schools, simply that in terms of risk... Is it high, medium or low risk that primary school kids spread symptomatic infection that lead to hospitalisations?

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

Will be interesting when the secondary schools return week of the 18th and the results of the mass testing, how many of the school population test positive. Along with the five day testing if someone in your bubble tests positive after that. It may give a clearer picture of whether school is the problem or not.

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By *hrista BellendWoman over a year ago

surrounded by twinkly lights

Schools should be open, we are all spreading it in all aspects of life so why penalise one group. You may as well do a national lockdown again with a curfew added

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Is there any evidence yet that primary schools are spreading the virus and causing hospital admissions? I mean evidence and not supposition that because kids spread germs therefore schools should be closed.?

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts. "

Logic.

The virus is spread by close contact hence social distancing.

Trying to keep primary school children ., distanced is about as successful as holding an eel with lubricated hands.

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By *hrista BellendWoman over a year ago

surrounded by twinkly lights

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts.

Logic.

The virus is spread by close contact hence social distancing.

Trying to keep primary school children ., distanced is about as successful as holding an eel with lubricated hands."

Try adding the groups of teens that are in the parks night after night to that

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By *az080378Woman over a year ago

Cromer

From what I've read about the new strain is that they are under the impression it spreads more in children, maybe they have decided against that now though I personally feel we should go back to the conditions of the first lock down at least until infection and death rates get right back down

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By *ust some cock suckerMan over a year ago

Preston

Over 4 million families are in food poverty in the uk. These families are also in digital poverty as well and do not the access to the resources or the knowledge the OP suggests.

Schools provide far more than just education they also provide pastoral care to vulnerable children in our society.

As well as valuable social interaction that help that children need with their development.

Also not everything can be taught online.

So schools should remain open ....end of.. !!!!"

I agreed with what you put apart from you totally wrecked your post with your last two words.

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By *estivalMan over a year ago

borehamwood

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue."

as far as im aware kids wint be getting vaccine as it not been trialed on them so thats not gona work

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts.

Logic.

The virus is spread by close contact hence social distancing.

Trying to keep primary school children ., distanced is about as successful as holding an eel with lubricated hands."

It's not that simple though is it. Biologically and physiologically there is some evedidence that young children are not as predisposed to catch and spread this virus... There are some much more Informed folks on here than me but I have read some science about t cell and immune system response in children which supports early evidence that you g children are unlikely to catch, have symptoms and spread it as easily as mature people.

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By *limmatureguyMan over a year ago

Tonbridge

If the schools are closed then the children should do the year again. What is the point of moving on to the next year if you haven't finished the current year.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts.

Logic.

The virus is spread by close contact hence social distancing.

Trying to keep primary school children ., distanced is about as successful as holding an eel with lubricated hands.

Try adding the groups of teens that are in the parks night after night to that"

Or the adults queuing to get their pints of beer from the pub then just hang about to drink it or go to the park for a party

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By *exy_Horny OP Couple over a year ago

Leigh

We should clarify that our original post related to secondary schools. Primary schools are more tricky due to childcare etc. but properly brought up secondary school children should not need parental supervision during the day.

We also covered the IT issues in the original post. The Raspberry Pi we suggested comes as a complete kit with everything built into the keyboard. Only needs a TV or monitor. The older units may be difficult but this one is not.

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

Schools won’t open on Monday ....

It’s not about the risk to the children it’s about who they’ll spread it to. We all know children are low risk - schools had to create a serious online provision for September which is now being rolled out in tier 4 hotpot areas so none of the faff of last time but - lesson 1 - link and do it 9.30-10 etc etc and then work to be submitted at the end of day or week. This is exactly what’s needed. Then in two weeks see where we are. People chose to ignore the rules so this is what is now needed. You reap what you sew

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"If the schools are closed then the children should do the year again. What is the point of moving on to the next year if you haven't finished the current year. "

That won’t work as there is a whole raft of four year olds needing to start. This is the perfect opportunity to overhaul the curriculum I keep hearing ‘behind’ ... behind what? Is it a race ..... just adjust what is being taught and make the curriculum relevant not just about teaching to test. Here’s a revolutionary thought why not actually listen to teachers

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Will be interesting when the secondary schools return week of the 18th and the results of the mass testing, how many of the school population test positive. Along with the five day testing if someone in your bubble tests positive after that. It may give a clearer picture of whether school is the problem or not. "

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"We should clarify that our original post related to secondary schools. Primary schools are more tricky due to childcare etc. but properly brought up secondary school children should not need parental supervision during the day.

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK."

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests "

Testing is going ahead in our school on return.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all "

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests

Testing is going ahead in our school on return. "
interesting ....... all the data I have says schools cannot manage it. Lack of volunteers etc etc. I hope it does happen it seems the only way forward

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

There's a lot of sabre rattling but I wonder how much if any of it is backed up by real facts.

Logic.

The virus is spread by close contact hence social distancing.

Trying to keep primary school children ., distanced is about as successful as holding an eel with lubricated hands.

Your first two propositions are correct however if there are no visible symptoms its not possible to prove no spread.

Is what appears fairly obvious its that close contact in large groups spreads it quicker and further

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it."

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ?

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests

Testing is going ahead in our school on return. interesting ....... all the data I have says schools cannot manage it. Lack of volunteers etc etc. I hope it does happen it seems the only way forward "

We were asked to volunteer before Christmas and they got more than they needed.

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By *uliette500Woman over a year ago

Hull

"No they shouldn't, students and school kids should be part of the first sets of vaccinations, alongside the vulnerable and Frontline. This year has put a huge hole in millions of educations, educations which will help prop up this country down the line, any more disruptions will just make it worse. Schools are designed to be places of education, no matter how good the laptops and tablets are, kids aren't in the frame of mind to truly learn at home, it's not where their brain is programmed to learn. "

There is not yet a vaccine available for children.

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

"Here’s a revolutionary thought why not actually listen to teachers "

the logic of this is lost on governments who send GP's off to strike international trade agreements, televison producers to plan transport strategy & infrastructure and of course 3rd tier journalists to run countries.

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

Testing is going ahead in my secondary school as well

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ? "

I thought we were talking about when home learning you said not all could do that independently so abs online tutor would be perfect here

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By *eet The FlintstonesCouple over a year ago

Southampton

Put it this way, if I had a school age child then they are not going back to school full Stop. No person in government or in science can say its fully safe and we are now talking about in a few months the worse could be over. Nobody knows long time what damage this virus could do. I got it in March and I'm still not fully right. Why risk more deaths.

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By *ild_oatsMan over a year ago

the land of saints & sinners

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK."

This is a very simplistic view and fails to address the digital poverty that exists in this country, you may class the Raspberry Pi as low cost solution. Even this is unaffordable to many.

I can provide examples of 6 form pupils who cannot afford the the scientific calculator that is required for Maths A levels.

Schools provide far more than just education even at secondary and 6 form levels.

If you want a disenfranchised and a lost generation and storing up social problems for the future then closing schools is the best way to go....

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ?

I thought we were talking about when home learning you said not all could do that independently so abs online tutor would be perfect here "

I was on about home schooling and the OP’s suggestion secondary school children don’t need assistance.

To provide a private tutor to all those with learning difficulties would be a mammoth task in itself. A lot of those children are already struggling with being different and then to separate them from their class studies with private tutoring I feel would just add to that.

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By *ee And MikeCouple over a year ago

Cannock

We started this pandemic back in March with a lockdown of three weeks to ‘flatten the curve’ and protect the NHS, schools were closed and never opened again until September.

I’m so glad our children are out of education and working, we have friends with three children and they don’t have three laptops or broadband suitable to stream live lessons all at once.

I work in a construction related industry and have spent the lockdowns carrying out surveys in live hospital environments with nothing more than my sleeves rolled up, a mask on and use of sanitiser.

Personally, I think we have to shield the vulnerable and elderly and try and work our way through this with all the social distancing measures in place.

As for Furlough, it might artificially keep jobs at the moment but each month goes by with a lot of businesses on reduced incomes then more businesses will not survive.

My main concern is that everyone keeps saying the vaccine is our salvation and whilst it will be can the country continue with restrictions for the next 7 months until it’s rolled out ?

I don’t have answers but I see the country crumbling day by day and it’s going to take some strong leadership to pull us out of the hole we will find ourselves in when Furlough does end.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I don’t have answers but I see the country crumbling day by day and it’s going to take some strong leadership to pull us out of the hole we will find ourselves in when Furlough does end.

Am generally loathe to use WW2 references however Boris is a great admirer of Churchill but he does not have the ruthless necessary streak that Churchill had.

Churchill sacrificed the people of Coventry for what he believed the greater good when he knew the Nazis were going to carpet bomb the city.

Boris has’nt got that in him to do that.

Am not saying its an admirable quality but leaders sometimes have to do things which are not admirable and they have to be accountable for.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ?

I thought we were talking about when home learning you said not all could do that independently so abs online tutor would be perfect here

I was on about home schooling and the OP’s suggestion secondary school children don’t need assistance.

So children with abs EHCP in secondary school don’t qualify under vulnerable pupils then? In primary those children have been in throughout and still should be in. Special schools are also remaining open.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

That's something that should be a top priority then

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests

Testing is going ahead in our school on return. interesting ....... all the data I have says schools cannot manage it. Lack of volunteers etc etc. I hope it does happen it seems the only way forward

We were asked to volunteer before Christmas and they got more than they needed. "

That’s great!!! Woefully lacking in my area

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By *ee And MikeCouple over a year ago

Cannock

I don’t have answers but I see the country crumbling day by day and it’s going to take some strong leadership to pull us out of the hole we will find ourselves in when Furlough does end.

Am generally loathe to use WW2 references however Boris is a great admirer of Churchill but he does not have the ruthless necessary streak that Churchill had.

Churchill sacrificed the people of Coventry for what he believed the greater good when he knew the Nazis were going to carpet bomb the city.

Boris has’nt got that in him to do that.

Am not saying its an admirable quality but leaders sometimes have to do things which are not admirable and they have to be accountable for.

I wonder what the irreparable damage will be when this is over ?

Anything over 4 million unemployed and the country will take some serious leadership to turn it around.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

As I understand it lateral flow testing has been withdrawn due to its inaccuracy and last of people to administer and oversee the tests

Testing is going ahead in our school on return. interesting ....... all the data I have says schools cannot manage it. Lack of volunteers etc etc. I hope it does happen it seems the only way forward

We were asked to volunteer before Christmas and they got more than they needed.

That’s great!!! Woefully lacking in my area

That’s a shame, this was a direct request from the school to the parents.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ?

I thought we were talking about when home learning you said not all could do that independently so abs online tutor would be perfect here

I was on about home schooling and the OP’s suggestion secondary school children don’t need assistance.

I don’t know to be honest. I know two of my lad’s mates are under SENS programmes and they have been at home each time the other children are.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

A shit load unemployed, far fewer employers, so government paid community work schemes will probably be created, kids of all education ages will have essentially lost a year of their learning, the country will probably have tanked entirely into a new financial depression until the EU offers us a life raft and invites us back at the cost of scrapping the pound and taking the Euro and joining the EU military agenda. And a 10s of millions of people will be devastated for generations due to financial reasons...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

We still think secondary schools should shut as it is less disruptive than not knowing whether the school is open or not from day to day.

If the closures are until after the summer, tbat would also be OK.

That’s a big assumption that secondary children do not need supervision or assistance to learn, what about those with learning difficulties. One solution does not fit all

This is where the government should pay for online private tutors to assist those who need it.

So when would the children fit this into their school day or are they segregated and given private lessons ?

I thought we were talking about when home learning you said not all could do that independently so abs online tutor would be perfect here

I was on about home schooling and the OP’s suggestion secondary school children don’t need assistance.

I don’t know to be honest. I know two of my lad’s mates are under SENS programmes and they have been at home each time the other children are. "

My daughter has severe learning difficulties, she went to a special school. She is now at college and is due to go back Tuesday. I was offered the option to send her to college during the first lockdown but kept her home. She did learn a little at home but on the whole it is very difficult to teach her anything outside of the learning settings.

I think the government is best placed to decide if schools and colleges can stay open. I think personally that it could go either way. If the virus situation worsens they may shut again. Tougher measures are being considered apparently. I don't think at this point they should be shut until Easter though. X

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By *uietlykinkymeWoman over a year ago

kinky land

Boris Johnston said schools will be open this morning.

Primary school text me this afternoon to say 'following union advice school will only be partially reopening to key worker children, more information to follow once plans are in place'

Less than 18 hours before my son should be returning to his primary and I have no clue what's going to happen.

My youngest daughter at least knows she'll be virtually at collage from Tuesday. We're not even in tier 4

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By *exy_Horny OP Couple over a year ago

Leigh

"Less than 18 hours before my son should be returning to his primary and I have no clue what's going to happen.

Exactly our point.

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By *T_LEECouple (MM) over a year ago

near you

The vaccination program is huge . In theory yes just vaccinate everyone. In practice its a huge process which will take 6 months plus.

Around 1 in 4 weeks at work we end up with someones child being isolated.

The schools are putting us in danger

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By *eet The FlintstonesCouple over a year ago

Southampton

Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Boris Johnston said schools will be open this morning.

Primary school text me this afternoon to say 'following union advice school will only be partially reopening to key worker children, more information to follow once plans are in place'

Less than 18 hours before my son should be returning to his primary and I have no clue what's going to happen.

My youngest daughter at least knows she'll be virtually at collage from Tuesday. We're not even in tier 4

School have said school is open to keyworker and vulnerable only they are going against government advice abs supported by Union and local councils. What more do you need to know?

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx "

I think you’ll find unions have stepped in rbis time .... primary school teachers are being advised not to attend the workplace due to section 44 of their employment contract bound by employment law

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx "

Imagine contacting a child minding agency and they sent round Boris, Hancock or Gove

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By *limmatureguyMan over a year ago

Tonbridge

"If the schools are closed then the children should do the year again. What is the point of moving on to the next year if you haven't finished the current year.

Education builds year on year. If you don't learn and understand the concepts taught during the year you won't be able to learn the concepts taught the next year.

Add to that the cancelling of exams that demonstrate that the student actually learnt anything and you will end up with students arriving at university practically unable to read or write.

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

I think it’s really important they go back, they have lost so much already. I feel for them I really do

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By *uietlykinkymeWoman over a year ago

kinky land

"Boris Johnston said schools will be open this morning.

Primary school text me this afternoon to say 'following union advice school will only be partially reopening to key worker children, more information to follow once plans are in place'

Less than 18 hours before my son should be returning to his primary and I have no clue what's going to happen.

My youngest daughter at least knows she'll be virtually at collage from Tuesday. We're not even in tier 4

School have said school is open to keyworker and vulnerable only they are going against government advice abs supported by Union and local councils. What more do you need to know? "

Liverpool council and Birmingham council have said they will support their head teachers.

Our local council has not said anything as yet. So is my son off tomorrow? Is he off for a week? 2 weeks? As I said I have no clue what's going to happen.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I'm not saying vaccinate everyone, I'm saying vaccinate the ones that may spread it the most and the ones most vulnerable to it first. Then the rest.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations?

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"If the schools are closed then the children should do the year again. What is the point of moving on to the next year if you haven't finished the current year.

Education builds year on year. If you don't learn and understand the concepts taught during the year you won't be able to learn the concepts taught the next year.

Add to that the cancelling of exams that demonstrate that the student actually learnt anything and you will end up with students arriving at university practically unable to read or write."

Rightie ho ... you didn’t read or didn’t understand what I wrote as that has nothing whatsoever to do with my point.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations? "
.

Less children means less mixing and able to socially distance. Last time round roughly 10% of children attended under vulnerable/ key worker. Loads of space to minimise contact

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations? .

Less children means less mixing and able to socially distance. Last time round roughly 10% of children attended under vulnerable/ key worker. Loads of space to minimise contact"

I understand that, if they are using a regulation to stop teachers attending then surely it applies to all teachers and therefore none should attend

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By *an hjCouple over a year ago

Stowmarket

"let's frame it another way. why should schools remain open?"

Because they simply provide child care for those going to work, not ideal, but a fact.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations? .

Less children means less mixing and able to socially distance. Last time round roughly 10% of children attended under vulnerable/ key worker. Loads of space to minimise contact

I understand that, if they are using a regulation to stop teachers attending then surely it applies to all teachers and therefore none should attend "

No the regulation is surrounding safety - if there is 10% of the usual children attending that affects safety. Therefore section 44 won’t apply - like saying it’s safe have 3 people in a shop but not 30.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"let's frame it another way. why should schools remain open?

Because they simply provide child care for those going to work, not ideal, but a fact."

That’s what isn’t right schools are for education not childcare - I don’t know many jobs that only operate within school hours so childcare is a cop out. Who do you know that works 9.30-2.30 term time only?

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations? .

Less children means less mixing and able to socially distance. Last time round roughly 10% of children attended under vulnerable/ key worker. Loads of space to minimise contact

I understand that, if they are using a regulation to stop teachers attending then surely it applies to all teachers and therefore none should attend

Ok thanks for the explanation

Personally, I think the schools should reopen around end of January, if they stay closed then I’d like to see the takeaway pubs stopped and more crackdown on those out and about when they shouldn’t be. Close of one section of society then do it to all, the children can’t mix with their peers then neither should the adults.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Teachers for one.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

definitely get them back. have you seen how bored they look getting dragged round b&q.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Plus most school hours range from between 8.30 and half 3, if someone works 9 to 5 then they have less to get covered. School allows parents to work more hours and pay out less for childcare etc. It's just the way it is.

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By *0shadesOfFilthMan over a year ago

nearby

Doubt they will open

Another 55000 cases today, 320,000 in the last week and uk up to 5th on the globe for infections. This not looking good.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Im not sure, but I think that there was some kind of government initiative that every child in the countery was given a laptop,and those who were in most need were also give free wireless internet in the last lockdown, zoom has also proved to be a very effective platform for online teaching.

I am with you on this, schools should stay closed and kids can be taught from home

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Sad to say I think it's down to us the parents. If you think it's safe well. I would hate to be in that position but I know what I would do xxx

So what about keyworkers children are they not opening for them either as against regulations? .

Less children means less mixing and able to socially distance. Last time round roughly 10% of children attended under vulnerable/ key worker. Loads of space to minimise contact

I understand that, if they are using a regulation to stop teachers attending then surely it applies to all teachers and therefore none should attend

Ok thanks for the explanation

I think end of January too then we will know where we are.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Teachers for one. "

Are you talking about working hours if so then no directed time for teachers is usually 8.15-4.30 - in reality usually about 10 hours a day. I most days work 12-13

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Teachers for one. "

Teachers work longer hours than that. Our school they are in at 7.45 and finish at 17.15, that was pre covid.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Plus most school hours range from between 8.30 and half 3, if someone works 9 to 5 then they have less to get covered. School allows parents to work more hours and pay out less for childcare etc. It's just the way it is. "

Then if you’re worried about childcare that’s totally different to education. Education in the long run won’t suffer and childcare isn’t the responsibility of teachers

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Im not sure, but I think that there was some kind of government initiative that every child in the countery was given a laptop,and those who were in most need were also give free wireless internet in the last lockdown, zoom has also proved to be a very effective platform for online teaching.

I am with you on this, schools should stay closed and kids can be taught from home

Nice words, reality is different

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"We think they should. They are high risk settings for the transmission of viruses, as evidenced by the back to school colds everyone gets in normal years.

The online teaching should be done properly this time. There is no reason a full live timetable can't be taught via a suitable streaming platform.

Ridiculous

Do you actually work in education?

Kids need to be in school, being taught on site.

I do and I’m not even going to go into the reasons on here about why they should be in school !!

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By *ichaelangelaCouple over a year ago

notts

I'm a bus driver that only does school runs, take them there in the morning, take them home in the afternoon,

the school i do has 18 different buses to do this every weekday.

The school puts in loads of effort to keep the pupils in bubbles etc, then mix em all up and send them home on the buses. and this is after they have all been mixed on the way to school.

so funny to watch the teachers put them into bubbles as they get off the bus in the morning

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By *losguygl3Man over a year ago

Gloucester

Educationally, yes.

Me having to home school them again?

God No! No! No! No!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Then if you’re worried about childcare that’s totally different to education. Education in the long run won’t suffer and childcare isn’t the responsibility of teachers "

How can you say that in the long run education will not suffer? The damage to some pupils has already happened and can’t be changed.

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By *exy_Horny OP Couple over a year ago

Leigh

"Ridiculous

Do you actually work in education?

Kids need to be in school, being taught on site.

I do and I’m not even going to go into the reasons on here about why they should be in school !"

Please do enlighten us. One of us does work in a school, the other in industry.

From the industrial perspective the office is open if people need to use it. Some struggle with working from home due to either personality or circumstances. Office occupancy is about 25%. I have not been there since March. Company productivity is higher than last year, even though home working was implemented at short notice.

That occupancy level increases safety and would be similar to school occupancy from the groups suggested in our original post.

Nothing us gained, in our opinion, by physically going to school.

We were going to comment on the working hours and childcare posts but teachers have already done so. The teachers we know work long hours doing a difficult job, made more difficult by a lack of respect for them from the general public. Child minders they are not.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"We think they should. They are high risk settings for the transmission of viruses, as evidenced by the back to school colds everyone gets in normal years.

The online teaching should be done properly this time. There is no reason a full live timetable can't be taught via a suitable streaming platform.

Ridiculous

Do you actually work in education?

Kids need to be in school, being taught on site.

I do and I’m not even going to go into the reasons on here about why they should be in school !!"

I’m a teacher I’d like to know what warrants face to face in these circumstances? We all know the best quality education comes from being in school but these are ‘extraordinary times’ - 33% of teaching staff are CV or CEV - I think more than 25% children had to self isolate last term. Tell me why all of this pales into insignificance.

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By *andAukCouple over a year ago

leeds

We're no teachers and the last time our 8 year old had to isolate just before Christmas due to our child minder testing positive, the online teaching was very poor. It appeared to be some generic stuff and not linked with what they'd been learning in school.

We're both also deemed as essential or permitted workers so wouldn't just be able to take time away. I was furloughed the first time until the business put safety measures in place. The companies stance is they now won't furlough anyone further. The Mrs has never been furloughed as they are classed as essential workers. Yes we could request time off for a dependent, but that is only deemed as short term support which three to four months certainly isn't. If schools close so does our childminder. Even if she remained open, five days care would cost us around £800 per month and would hit us very hard financially.

So the closing of schools really wouldn't be good for us.

If everyone just stuck to the rules there would be no need. If people stopped mixing, stopped their kids playing out with friends and kept them in the class bubbles that they're in chances of infection would be very low.

I still feel that quick testing is a good way forward to get things moving and reduce the spread. Test the kids and teachers in a morning, companies test their employees at the start of every shift and random street testing in the city centres all would help.

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

Face to face in the classroom is the only effective way to educate. Online lessons do not have the same impact, engagement or attendance. In school / college with precautions is needed. The children / students have suffered enough.

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

Rapid testing is now available and will be happening from tomorrow so what’s the issue? Yes I am a teacher btw

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Face to face in the classroom is the only effective way to educate. Online lessons do not have the same impact, engagement or attendance. In school / college with precautions is needed. The children / students have suffered enough. "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

At the moment it’s what’s called Hokey Cokey schooling .....

You send the pupils in

You kick them out

In out in out

Mess them all about

Boris has a wobbler as the doubts creep in

Thats what its all about

(Altogether now)

Oh Hokey Cokey

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By *yn drwgMan over a year ago

Camarthen

Why would you vaccinate children, the vaccine won't stop you having covid it will give you antibodies that reduces the effects of covid, I would vaccinate any children that has any other conditions but teacher's, classroom assistants, all staff involved with school rather than children. There is no evidence yet that the vaccine will stop you spreading the virus.

Schools need to be open for children's wellbeing.

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By *uited staffs guyMan over a year ago

staffordshire

Schools have already been closed for 2 and a half weeks - it’s making absolutely no difference to cases - if anything they’ve got up since they’ve been closed

At least if they’re tested regularly at school we’ll have a better idea about cases and can isolate better

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I believe we're at the point where schools need to close again, but I say that with a very heavy heart.

I have two secondary school age children who will not be back in school til February at the earliest (we're in Northern Ireland). There are currently no plans for testing in schools here.

My 15 year old is an exceptional student who absolutely crumbled mentally during the first lockdown period of remote learning. When I told her that she'd be learning remotely again for a month she cried hard and it broke my heart. We've put some strategies in place to try and make things more manageable and only time will tell if they work. Given the difficulties she faced last time I'll also liaise with her year head and I'm grateful that I know her school will support her. I also know that this won't be the case for many pupils at other schools for a myriad of reasons.

There is nothing that can replace face to face learning and all the benefits being in schools offer. Sadly though, I think closing schools is now a necessary evil.

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By *ee And MikeCouple over a year ago

Cannock

If schools are going to be closed then all children need to locked down in their own homes !

We are in Tier 4 and saw at least 4 groups of children today (on our walk with the dog) playing together in groups of at least 6 at the local park, I’m assuming they weren’t all from the same family.

There is no point in people banging on about transmission of the virus at school if they are then closed and they still play together and take the virus home.

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By *rincess PhoenixWoman over a year ago

Southampton

I have family and friends who are teachers and they set school work online using something called Seesaw and tried to check in on their pupils every week BUT they got a lot of parents refusing to answer the phone and sending their children outside to play all day and not making their children do the schoolwork. There is only so much they can do if the children and parents refuse to engage they cannot make them

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"If schools are going to be closed then all children need to locked down in their own homes !

There is no point in people banging on about transmission of the virus at school if they are then closed and they still play together and take the virus home."

Make sure you do the same with the adults then !

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By *hatawasteMan over a year ago

stafford

I believe they should yes! However, the government appears to have dropped the ball here.

In order to shut everywhere that will I think only work if everyone is being compensated for the loss of earnings?

At the moment a lot of people are entitled to and claiming the furlough/self-employed grant.

There is, of course, a lot of people who are not allowed to have support from the government. So naturally, these people still have to be able to work somehow.

So unless the government is able to/ willing to compensate everyone who is going to lose money any idea of a shutdown and people sticking to rules is never going to happen I fear.

That though is absolutely what we need to be doing or this thing is never going to go away

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By *exy_Horny OP Couple over a year ago

Leigh

"I have family and friends who are teachers and they set school work online using something called Seesaw and tried to check in on their pupils every week BUT they got a lot of parents refusing to answer the phone and sending their children outside to play all day and not making their children do the schoolwork. There is only so much they can do if the children and parents refuse to engage they cannot make them "

These children and parents are the "lazy layabouts" from our original post

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By *loppysuckerMan over a year ago

birmingham

Vulnerable generally means children with special educational needs, whether that be physical or cognitive. It also included children who are looked after, children who have adverse conditions at home or those who are at more risk at home than they would be in school

"So not really closing schools then if the children of key workers are in; plus vulnerable children, who decides what the criteria is for vulnerable ? Add to that those that can’t afford the suitable equipment and IT infrastructure for that to run properly. I’d estimate that would be half of an average school.

For those saying they can’t open until the kids are vaccinated, one flaw in that plan the under 16s aren’t receiving the vaccine as it hasn’t been tested or approved for that age group.

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By *ungblackbullMan over a year ago

scotland

"No they shouldn’t

And the economy she be back up and running the most valuable should be vaccinated and take extra care

The virus isn’t going anywhere even if we was all locked inside for weeks and month

Coz virus mutates so the new strain now covid 20

Which new strain? The virus has mutated thousands of times.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Schools have already been closed for 2 and a half weeks - it’s making absolutely no difference to cases - if anything they’ve got up since they’ve been closed

At least if they’re tested regularly at school we’ll have a better idea about cases and can isolate better "

Exactly this. Lots of assumptions that school is bad for spreading the infection. There needs to be a bit more evidence before we trash pupils exam years... Again.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Vulnerable generally means children with special educational needs, whether that be physical or cognitive. It also included children who are looked after, children who have adverse conditions at home or those who are at more risk at home than they would be in school

For those saying they can’t open until the kids are vaccinated, one flaw in that plan the under 16s aren’t receiving the vaccine as it hasn’t been tested or approved for that age group.

So as I thought those that are known by social services already or where a parent has admitted they are struggling. Too many children aren’t picked up with the situations you mention.

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By *allySlinkyWoman over a year ago

Leeds

I think after front line NHS, teachers should be next in line for vaccination

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

That's not what you said in the original post, you said the children were lazy layabouts.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I believe we're at the point where schools need to close again, but I say that with a very heavy heart.

I have two secondary school age children who will not be back in school til February at the earliest (we're in Northern Ireland). There are currently no plans for testing in schools here.

There is nothing that can replace face to face learning and all the benefits being in schools offer. Sadly though, I think closing schools is now a necessary evil."

I agree with you entirely and I feel for your daughter and understand what she is going through. My son and daughter were effected by their exams being cancelled last year. My son is meant to be living the student lifestyle at uni this year, but has not had a single face to face lesson. I am doing all I can to keep his spirits high, as I am with my daughter who has started her A levels this year, but they are both angry and depressed that their education is being damaged and risks them not getting the qualifications they are capable of.

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By *orthern StarsCouple over a year ago

Durham

Absolutely not. Children's education matters, and how on earth are parents meant to work from home as well as do home schooling. The pressure being put on parents is very high, and its leading to so many people having serious mental health problems. Closing schools is not the answer at all.

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By *ob198XaMan over a year ago

teleford

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue."

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

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By *HELONDONCOUPLECouple over a year ago

london

"Teachers for one.

Teachers work longer hours than that. Our school they are in at 7.45 and finish at 17.15, that was pre covid. "

That’s good our teachers are in at 7 and work till 630 ish

Classes were dropping like flies before Xmas so coming back now is deff not a good idea

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

I don’t know any teacher who was at work that long tbh

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By *anshee99Woman over a year ago

all over

Absolutely not.

They are our future.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

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By *orthern StarsCouple over a year ago

Durham

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ... "

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?"

Exactly, they can’t. Closing schools is ridiculous

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"I don’t know any teacher who was at work that long tbh "

I do know someone who is at work at 7 and leaves at 5.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?

Exactly, they can’t. Closing schools is ridiculous

How does a teacher keep five year olds away from each other and themself so that virus is not potentially spread?

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Absolutely not. Children's education matters, and how on earth are parents meant to work from home as well as do home schooling. The pressure being put on parents is very high, and its leading to so many people having serious mental health problems. Closing schools is not the answer at all."

Asking teachers to work in not safe environments with no PPE and no social distancing is putting extreme pressure on teachers and it’s leading to so many people having serious mental health problems. Keeping schools open when they are unsafe is not the answer at all.

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By *ools and the brainCouple over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

I haven't read the entire thread,but I work in school's alot of them daily and one of the biggest issues has been staffing once teacher's are off isolating or their children.

Most schools are already running on a skeleton staff due to cutbacks.

So just like hospitals and police and fire stations it doesn't take an awful lot of sickness to mean that they cannot operate effectively.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?"

Well a teacher manages 30 odd so surely parents can manage one. No?

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By *HELONDONCOUPLECouple over a year ago

london

Ok. So they go back to school and in the 1st week 5 classes get sent home it was more before Xmas but just using this figure, that is now 150 children that have to isolate and not able to go out anywhere, single parent can’t go shopping because they have to look after the child

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

We have PPE, students sit one to a table, surfaces are wiped down, students wear masks as do the teachers?

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ... "

Blended learning makes the most sense especially for primary - projects can easily be set for the home week.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids."

Exactly my point earlier. I mean if there is fact based evidence that a) they are indeed the source of the spread and B) they can explain why the rates have gone crazy in the last 2 weeks whilst schools have actually been closed... Then perhaps its the right move but I don't believe any such facts exist yet. I mean if its evidence based then by all means.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

We have PPE, students sit one to a table, surfaces are wiped down, students wear masks as do the teachers?

Sigh - in primary we don’t.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"I don’t know any teacher who was at work that long tbh "

Our school days are 8.25 - 16.00, add to either side of that breakfast club, after school clubs, homework room, the school was officially open from 08.00 - 17.00 everyday.

With covid those hours haven’t reduced as the school start times for the years are staggered, add to that travel time and more work when they get home.

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?

Well a teacher manages 30 odd so surely parents can manage one. No? "

Not whilst trying to hold down a full time job, no

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

We have PPE, students sit one to a table, surfaces are wiped down, students wear masks as do the teachers?

Sigh - in primary we don’t. "

It’s easy to implement

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Ok. So they go back to school and in the 1st week 5 classes get sent home it was more before Xmas but just using this figure, that is now 150 children that have to isolate and not able to go out anywhere, single parent can’t go shopping because they have to look after the child "

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

Why would you assume schools DONT spread it, if any place that is poorly ventilated and crowded and contains multiple households is a hot bed of transmission then why wouldn’t schools be? There is no data ... anyone who bought into conspiracy might think the government had an agenda to suppress the data.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

We have PPE, students sit one to a table, surfaces are wiped down, students wear masks as do the teachers?

Sigh - in primary we don’t.

It’s easy to implement "

There isn’t room to sd 32 children in my classroom. Students won’t wear masks as they’re under 11 teachers are not allowed them. I wish we had the protection secondary schools have.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve. "

And the continuity of provision for the kids education doing the Hokey Cokey? Teachers cannot deliver abs individualised curriculum for 30 odd pupils (or hundreds in secondary) thats the hard one to solve.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

*an

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve. "

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

*25% sorry nails too long to type

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

I can’t understand any teacher / lecturer not wanting their pupils / students back in their place of education? Schools are operating with doors and windows open, hand sanitising, wiping down or surfaces, PPE etc? There must be a way to open the schools safely so the children don’t continue to suffer any more than they already have?

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By *ools and the brainCouple over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

"I can’t understand any teacher / lecturer not wanting their pupils / students back in their place of education? Schools are operating with doors and windows open, hand sanitising, wiping down or surfaces, PPE etc? There must be a way to open the schools safely so the children don’t continue to suffer any more than they already have? "

Like I said previously I work in many schools daily from primary to secondary, special education centres and behavioural units, the lengths that they have been going to ,to keep them open and operational has been bordering on a miracle and I doubt they get any thanks for this.

Do they( teachers) not deserve to get the same level of protection as everyone else?

I think so,I have three teachers in my family and the stress levels they have been under since the start of lockdown has been immense I'm surprised that teaches aren't suffering nervous breakdowns.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

Yes there is and no one wants schools closed but they have to be safe. From what I hear secondary are far safer and have more room and obviously the children are older. Primary I have 8 children around two desks it takes 35 mins for my class to wash their hands in two sinks - we ran out of soap and towels the week before Christmas. Primary children literally lick each other and cannot comprehend social distancing and these aren’t even the tiny ones. Ripped through my school in December children asymptomatic staff abs parents dropping like flies.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

I'm not assuming they do or don't spread it. But the biology and physiology of children and virus transmission is different. So equally I'm not assuming that children are the same as adults. Assumptions are not sensible in this pandemic.

It would seem from this small forum that not all schools are poorly ventilated, poorly trained and prepared, no PPE, no parental support, and so on. Some seem to be able to maintain social distancing, use best practise sanitising, ventilate class rooms etc. Surely those should be allowed to continue?

I agree if schools are unsafe then they mustn't be used. But after 9 months of this it's surprising that schools aren't better prepared. How long do they need? To offer some kind of education.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

The way to do it is spend money ..... more sinks, more staff and smaller class sizes prefab buildings - Bojo won’t do it. Would cost an eye watering amount but hey no more than the failed track and trace. Didn’t Tesco spend billlions to make their stores covid safe and I’d guess there is as many Tesco’s as there are schools. The government hasn’t given any extra budget to make schools safer up until now

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By *hickennchipsWoman over a year ago

up above the streets and houses

I feel very protected in my setting and as a teacher I feel like that we have it right

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

I agree if schools are unsafe then they mustn't be used. But after 9 months of this it's surprising that schools aren't better prepared. How long do they need? To offer some kind of education. "

Schools cannot be better prepared with no money..... schools find out these changes the same day everyone else does. Literally 2 days warning to change the way we deliver education in March. This time we found out two days ago that this term was online to start so that’s a massive four days warning. Schools are already operating on a skeleton staff due to budget cuts they can’t even afford the extra hand soap to account for extra washing. This could change with money but ther government won’t spend it

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families. "

I don't understand. Are you saying that getting essential shopping is not possible for 25% of school parents.? I think it may be challenging for some. But I'd be mind blown if there are many who can't online shop, or request help from someone else. Not saying it's easy bit it's solvable and we need to be looking at ways to solve problems rather than reasons for not looking for solutions.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"I feel very protected in my setting and as a teacher I feel like that we have it right

"
well I’m glad for you and that’s great but you shouldn’t judge people who don’t - many thousands of primary teachers don’t feel safe at all - surely solidarity is what’s needed.

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority. "

What I’m saying is yo yo ing in and out of school is the worst possible solution.

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By *orthern StarsCouple over a year ago

Durham

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

There is but the government won’t do it so we are all buggered really.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

[Removed by poster at 03/01/21 20:12:28]

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority. "

I’ll answer that as a single parent with no family or friends near. I’ve had to go into isolation once as my kids school closed in its entirety on a Sunday evening, food shop to be done on the Monday whilst he was at school. I immediately went online and managed to get a slot for the following evening, great; then they cancelled it one hour before, the next available slot was 10 days later. I had no choice but to break isolation and go shopping late at night and leave my child at home on their own.

So it’s not as simple as you think

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By *orthern StarsCouple over a year ago

Durham

"Closed. Surely at these days and age they can organise some online classes.. or maybe reduce the time in classes to maybe twice a week so they can maybe take in turns ...

How does a parent get a 5 year old to sit and do online classes all day whilst they try to work from home and keep their job?

Well a teacher manages 30 odd so surely parents can manage one. No? "
no the parent can't. They have their full time job to do.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority.

So it’s not as simple as you think "

10 days!! That's rubbish OK... So not all ideas are perfect. So it's really tricky for some and I can only imagine the emotions of leaving little kids home alone to get essential shopping.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority.

So it’s not as simple as you think

10 days!! That's rubbish OK... So not all ideas are perfect. So it's really tricky for some and I can only imagine the emotions of leaving little kids home alone to get essential shopping. "

That’s been the norm since this all started in relation to deliveries.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

I agree if schools are unsafe then they mustn't be used. But after 9 months of this it's surprising that schools aren't better prepared. How long do they need? To offer some kind of education.

Yes and no... I mean the need for extra sanitising, ventilation, PPE, flow for ingress and egress have been known for 9 months now. So that hasn't changed overnight. Other stuff does because it has to because we are in a national emergency and sometimes we have to think on our feet.

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By *HELONDONCOUPLECouple over a year ago

london

Also a school in a little town or village in the middle of the county side with 180 children = 30 per class, year 1-6 it could poss work with staggering the day, now pick a school in London with a 1,000 kids it’s so different

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

I agree if schools are unsafe then they mustn't be used. But after 9 months of this it's surprising that schools aren't better prepared. How long do they need? To offer some kind of education.

So your boss in the government and they won’t make the necessary changes ... yet the government insists other work places make the necessary changes. See why teachers are so pissed off? If a pub tried to cram as many people in as the government are doing with schools they’d be fined. Yes the government has had 9 months and has done nothing .... it’s literally Gavs job to sort this and he hasn’t.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"Also a school in a little town or village in the middle of the county side with 180 children = 30 per class, year 1-6 it could poss work with staggering the day, now pick a school in London with a 1,000 kids it’s so different "

The size of the school shouldn’t effect staggered starts / finish, lunch / break times. We are a school in London and have managed it

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By *HELONDONCOUPLECouple over a year ago

london

That’s just the kids now you have the parents to drop them off and pick them up it’s worse than going to a football match

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

I'm sure we can manage to get food to someone in need? Online shopping? Neighbours? Friends? Of all problems, that one is relatively easy to solve.

Considering 45% of children live in single parent households this isn’t ‘someone’ it’s thousands of families.

We have many problems to solve. And one solution isn't going to fit for all people. But just because a small percentage of people may struggle should not stop trying to solve it for the majority.

So it’s not as simple as you think "

That’s horrible luckily not happened to me (yet?) I’ve heard this happen to so many - it’s just awful.

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By *HELONDONCOUPLECouple over a year ago

london

The size of the school shouldn’t effect staggered starts / finish, lunch / break times. We are a school in London and have managed it "

No I am saying to open up is possible when you have 180 or 1000 it’s a lot harder to do

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

"That’s just the kids now you have the parents to drop them off and pick them up it’s worse than going to a football match"

I’m talking secondary not primary school

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

The size of the school shouldn’t effect staggered starts / finish, lunch / break times. We are a school in London and have managed it

No I am saying to open up is possible when you have 180 or 1000 it’s a lot harder to do"

Not really as the more pupils the more entrances and bugger the school - my sons primary has 5 different entrances one form entry school likely to have one

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By *oncupiscence73Woman over a year ago

South

Haha bigger ... or maybe bugger is more fitting

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By *ickerMan over a year ago

Preston

I don't know why grey can't put online learning on tv. There are 100s of channels on sky but they could put a 2 hour lesson in the morning and a 2 hour lesson in the afternoon. They could put a different age group per channel. Monday to Friday. The curriculum is national so it would be useful.

For example on sky they could go,

Channel 501 reception

Channel 502 year 1.

So on and continue.

If you have 2 children. The first lesson 8am - 10am and repeated 10am - 12pm. Second lesson 1pm -3pm. Repeated 3pm - 5pm. This way you can just change channel to the right age group and swap them over.

Its obviously more difficult with more children but you can record things and play back. I would not open schools until after Easter. We need to get this virus under control now. We have a vaccine but seem to be getting worse.

I absolutely hate wearing masks as well. I Don't see the benefit apart from the NHS who are using full face masks and aprons. They are changing gloves all the time and wearing aprons. Its impossible for the general public to do this. There are people who won't wash there hands after having a piss or a shit.

Anyway back to the schools and colleges. We have to think of other ways at the moment otherwise we are going to have the thick generation come through. Its a shame because the teachers now are a lot better than I had 20 years ago.

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman over a year ago

On a mooch

The size of the school shouldn’t effect staggered starts / finish, lunch / break times. We are a school in London and have managed it

No I am saying to open up is possible when you have 180 or 1000 it’s a lot harder to do"

Yes it’s harder space wise, but it is possible. Maybe just lucky how my school has achieved it and the buildings design helps with that.

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

Exactly, one rule does not work for all. But I'm sure there's a huge amount of good will to make it work.. In each school. And 9 months in I'm sure some schools have cooked up some brilliant and safe solutions that work for them and their parents and pupils.

Stronger together.

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By *orthern StarsCouple over a year ago

Durham

What about people who don't have a reliable internet signal? How are online lessons meant to work then?

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By *ackformore100Man over a year ago

Tin town

"Assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits for the virus surely it would be worth a phased return with pupils being vaccinated as they do.

So class xxxx from year xxxx would be told to return and as they come into school they get vaccinated (yes i know there is a shortage of qualified vaccinators).

Also of education is seen as that high a priority then surely teachers should be being vaccinated now well at the head of the queue.

Why are you assuming schools are one of the main spreading conduits? I don’t believe there is any data backing that up, certainly not in the case of primary kids.

I agree if schools are unsafe then they mustn't be used. But after 9 months of this it's surprising that schools aren't better prepared. How long do they need? To offer some kind of education.

Sure but the d of e pays head teacher and teachers to do the job. They've also had 9 months to solve some of the problems. And many of them have done so. Brilliantly. And some haven't. For many reasons I'm sure. But why is it that some schools and teachers are able to adapt and others are not? The pub analogy doesn't really work as its target audience is adults and commercial enterprise, and schools are children who respond differently to viral infections.

Now, in all of this debate.. Nobody seems to be highlighting universities who are once again getting away with taking money under false pretences

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)