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An Alternative View
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I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?  "
Yes
Alot of people has suffered immeasurably. People that have put their whole lives into their businesses. People that havent been able to go to funerals of their loved ones
But without doctors and nurses, we are all screwed |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?
Yes
Alot of people has suffered immeasurably. People that have put their whole lives into their businesses. People that havent been able to go to funerals of their loved ones
But without doctors and nurses, we are all screwed"
Of course the NHS requires staff. Of course the NHS is severely underfunded.
I'm struggling to understand what the OP's alternative view means. Should we just say "fuck it, paddle your own canoe"? |
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Yep, the less people who are in for covid the more likely I can be treated if I have an accident...... It's not just protecting the NHS is about protecting the service we may need.
So sorry to near about your friend, this is not how a hero should have ended up, the whole situation is just terrible..  |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
"
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ? |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ?"
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked ! |
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?
Yes
Alot of people has suffered immeasurably. People that have put their whole lives into their businesses. People that havent been able to go to funerals of their loved ones
But without doctors and nurses, we are all screwed
Of course the NHS requires staff. Of course the NHS is severely underfunded.
I'm struggling to understand what the OP's alternative view means. Should we just say "fuck it, paddle your own canoe"?"
Is it underfunded or are we just paying a load of pen-pushers and Trust board members too much money that could be used to fund the frontline ? |
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?
Yes
Alot of people has suffered immeasurably. People that have put their whole lives into their businesses. People that havent been able to go to funerals of their loved ones
But without doctors and nurses, we are all screwed
Of course the NHS requires staff. Of course the NHS is severely underfunded.
I'm struggling to understand what the OP's alternative view means. Should we just say "fuck it, paddle your own canoe"?
Is it underfunded or are we just paying a load of pen-pushers and Trust board members too much money that could be used to fund the frontline ?"
If they hadn’t kept cutting the pay of the staff and giving them huge tax bills over the last decade then maybe a lot of them may not have quit to go elsewhere
When you’ve been in power for a decade you have no right to blame the previous lot for anything really - it’s all on your own head |
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"Thank you for reading this party political broadcast for the Conservative party.
Personally I would have Johnson, Gove and Hancock shot, not sure that’s allowed ?"
Haha wish it were ... they’re responsible for this total balls up |
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"So in practical terms, what does your alternative view mean? What do you suggest?"
Stop decisions being made by Gove, Hancock and Carrie Symonds (Boris is a useless and couldn’t make a decision to save his fat arse life) with an input from SAGE and now NERVTAG (which has obviously being used to incorporate that scum Ferguson back into things) and a committee formed using a range of scientists and economic brain to have a balance view to lockdown decisions and not a blinkered one ! |
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"
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs"
It hasn't though, has it.
If that was the government's approach it would have not done 'eat out to help out' - purely an economic measure. You can argue whether or not it was a good idea, but that alone shows that it wasn't protecting the NHS 'at all costs'
It also began encouraging people back to work in the summer and lifted lockdown generally.
It has also refused to close schools. Again, can debate those decisions as right or wrong but it's s clearly not protecting the NHS.
And finally can note that if it was 'NHS at all cost' they would have done PPE and track and trace properly and not given big contracts to their mates who often didn't deliver.
But yes, the problem was the last Labour government over 10 years ago. Poor old Tories, powerless to actually do anything in ten years.  |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
"
Look at the structure of where the staff are, don’t look at the hospitals, they are short of staff without doubt, especially in some area. Where the excess fat in the system is around things like the CCG’s management of the Heathcare market place artificially created where GP’s allegedly purchase services for there patients and then cascade the money down the acute and other providers. All sectors have had money drained from them we used to have much better resilience and planning for emergency’s, spare accommodation, stores or equipment etc but these all have fallen by the wayside in the name of cost savings, then look at the last few years sars, bird flu Etc all came and went and the eye was taken off the policy ball to account for such things.
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?
Yes
Alot of people has suffered immeasurably. People that have put their whole lives into their businesses. People that havent been able to go to funerals of their loved ones
But without doctors and nurses, we are all screwed
Of course the NHS requires staff. Of course the NHS is severely underfunded.
I'm struggling to understand what the OP's alternative view means. Should we just say "fuck it, paddle your own canoe"?
Is it underfunded or are we just paying a load of pen-pushers and Trust board members too much money that could be used to fund the frontline ?"
Look to the CCG’s for the true drains on the system, most Trusts actually do a not to bad job for the money and private equivalents pay more do deliver the same |
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"Are we not trying to protect our NHS's ability to treat patients? To provide medical care for the public?
Is it underfunded or are we just paying a load of pen-pushers and Trust board members too much money that could be used to fund the frontline ?
If they hadn’t kept cutting the pay of the staff and giving them huge tax bills over the last decade then maybe a lot of them may not have quit to go elsewhere
When you’ve been in power for a decade you have no right to blame the previous lot for anything really - it’s all on your own head "
too many pen pushers me thinks - but not that annual allowance tax charge on their pension bollocks again. ive done the maths (it's my job) they still end up better off - unpleasant and not as great as benefit as before but still up on the deal |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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However we are where we are, no matter how we got there. So again, OP, even with your new committee idea, how will we ensure the NHS is not overwhelmed and able to treat patients? |
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I do my part and protect the NHS because I would hope to know that If I were in a serious car accident I am not going to be treated in an ambulance, I can lose my job and home but these can be replaced, my life cannot.
We can blame all of government as much as we like but at the end of the day the only people responsible for spreading this virus is us... |
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"However we are where we are, no matter how we got there. So again, OP, even with your new committee idea, how will we ensure the NHS is not overwhelmed and able to treat patients?"
Firstly I would not have allowed the NHS to send approximately 20,000 people it treated back to care home environments to die. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"However we are where we are, no matter how we got there. So again, OP, even with your new committee idea, how will we ensure the NHS is not overwhelmed and able to treat patients?
Firstly I would not have allowed the NHS to send approximately 20,000 people it treated back to care home environments to die."
But that's not now. We can all be wise in hindsight. What will we do in the here and now to ensure our hospitals can still treat patients? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's ok OP...the green arrow tells me that you don't think that "grannies in their 90s who've had their lives" aren't worth saving. So I'm surprised you're worried about what happened in the care homes  |
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As an ex nhs worker i fully support the medical staff and volunteers who are working very very hard to protect the public, but i must also agree with the op. Far too many clerical staff and not enough medical. If the clerical staff in the nhs were reduced we could have more icu beds and staff. Why do you need a
ward manager when you have a sister or matron as well.
Why do you need assistants or deputies for anyone when in other industries people are expected to step up to cover others jobs when it is more nurses and doctors we need.
Successive governments have all underfunded the NHS. But i also think we should get rid of NHS wales,scotland and ireland and have just one NHs with no trusts (but thats the devolved goverments for you). You have cheif medical officers in all home nations when one would do. Also i feel that care homes should be publily owned and people should only be charged a set fee for thei type of care (full nursing or just residential) not the "think of a number and double it" fees private care homes charge some 5? hotels are cheeper.
But hey ho that is just my opinion |
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"As an ex nhs worker i fully support the medical staff and volunteers who are working very very hard to protect the public, but i must also agree with the op. Far too many clerical staff and not enough medical. If the clerical staff in the nhs were reduced we could have more icu beds and staff. Why do you need a
ward manager when you have a sister or matron as well.
Why do you need assistants or deputies for anyone when in other industries people are expected to step up to cover others jobs when it is more nurses and doctors we need.
Successive governments have all underfunded the NHS. But i also think we should get rid of NHS wales,scotland and ireland and have just one NHs with no trusts (but thats the devolved goverments for you). You have cheif medical officers in all home nations when one would do. Also i feel that care homes should be publily owned and people should only be charged a set fee for thei type of care (full nursing or just residential) not the "think of a number and double it" fees private care homes charge some 5? hotels are cheeper.
But hey ho that is just my opinion "
Thank you for your comments, appreciated.
For what it’s worth, apart from someone who works actually within the NHS we’ve probably had more to do with the NHS than anyone on this forum, probably 150 visits, inpatient and outpatient in the last 30 years including 6 months on a ward with two weeks of that in a coma in ICU.
What I’ve noticed is the amount of support staff that’s suddenly appeared, I won’t name the hospital that we are currently under but there is actually a ‘Director of Surveys’ for want of a better title than breezes around the outpatient clinic, having you complete two survey forms every time you visit, it’s a specialist hospital and for the life of me I haven’t a clue what purpose she serves, pushing bits of paper obviously when her salary could probably pay for two nurses - that’s the bollocks that pisses me off ! |
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"Careful OP... you’ve dared to question or critique the cult of the NHS... youre in for it now !"
My mother died in a hospital near to us that had its A&E service reduced because of all the scandals, I won’t name it but you can probably guess which one.
She went in for a routine treatment and while she was in there contracted flu and died.
At the inquest we were told that it was an ‘occupational hazard’ or words to that effect that patients contract illnesses whilst in hospitals, she was 71.
There was 50,000 excess flu deaths that year, I don’t remember the country being brought to its knees with lockdowns that year.
I’m not criticising the NHS but everyone seems to gloss over the fact that it’s funded by tax payers yet it seems untouchable for criticism !
You have to separate the general incompetence of the tax payer funded NHS from the great work of the doctors snd nurses otherwise it becomes an emotional subject ! |
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"Careful OP... you’ve dared to question or critique the cult of the NHS... youre in for it now !
My mother died in a hospital near to us that had its A&E service reduced because of all the scandals, I won’t name it but you can probably guess which one.
She went in for a routine treatment and while she was in there contracted flu and died.
At the inquest we were told that it was an ‘occupational hazard’ or words to that effect that patients contract illnesses whilst in hospitals, she was 71.
There was 50,000 excess flu deaths that year, I don’t remember the country being brought to its knees with lockdowns that year.
I’m not criticising the NHS but everyone seems to gloss over the fact that it’s funded by tax payers yet it seems untouchable for criticism !
You have to separate the general incompetence of the tax payer funded NHS from the great work of the doctors snd nurses otherwise it becomes an emotional subject !"
It only appears to be incompetent to people who provide false information like you. There hasn’t been 50,000 excess flu deaths for at least 40 years. Yes all large organisations have issues, often thrust upon them by the latest political whim. The NHS provides, in the vast majority of cases, an effective and efficient service given its funding.
Someone mentioned above the post of survey officer, it made me smile, because doctors have to submit a customer service to the GMC, not through choice, but they have to ask say someone who they may have just told that they only have months to live, and then say how have I done today. |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ?
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !"
If no measures had been taken we would not have thousands of new Covid patients each day it would be 10s of thousands. No healthcare system in the world could be funded to cope with such a surge. The situation is not unique to the UK. |
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"Careful OP... you’ve dared to question or critique the cult of the NHS... youre in for it now !
My mother died in a hospital near to us that had its A&E service reduced because of all the scandals, I won’t name it but you can probably guess which one.
She went in for a routine treatment and while she was in there contracted flu and died.
At the inquest we were told that it was an ‘occupational hazard’ or words to that effect that patients contract illnesses whilst in hospitals, she was 71.
There was 50,000 excess flu deaths that year, I don’t remember the country being brought to its knees with lockdowns that year.
I’m not criticising the NHS but everyone seems to gloss over the fact that it’s funded by tax payers yet it seems untouchable for criticism !
You have to separate the general incompetence of the tax payer funded NHS from the great work of the doctors snd nurses otherwise it becomes an emotional subject !
It only appears to be incompetent to people who provide false information like you. There hasn’t been 50,000 excess flu deaths for at least 40 years. Yes all large organisations have issues, often thrust upon them by the latest political whim. The NHS provides, in the vast majority of cases, an effective and efficient service given its funding.
Someone mentioned above the post of survey officer, it made me smile, because doctors have to submit a customer service to the GMC, not through choice, but they have to ask say someone who they may have just told that they only have months to live, and then say how have I done today."
The ONS reported over 50,000 excess deaths attributed to flu and cold as recent as the winter of 2017/18, it’s only their website. |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ?
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !
If no measures had been taken we would not have thousands of new Covid patients each day it would be 10s of thousands. No healthcare system in the world could be funded to cope with such a surge. The situation is not unique to the UK."
If you read all the expert reports, they claim we had similar 50,000 cases a day in the first wave as we do now, it’s just there was no mass testing in April like we have now. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
"
Mr here. I think you are confusing what the NHS is. Like it is just another employer that needs to be saved from bankruptcy. The NHS is our entire health care system. Protecting the NHS is ensuring the health and well being of us all. |
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"Careful OP... you’ve dared to question or critique the cult of the NHS... youre in for it now !
My mother died in a hospital near to us that had its A&E service reduced because of all the scandals, I won’t name it but you can probably guess which one.
She went in for a routine treatment and while she was in there contracted flu and died.
At the inquest we were told that it was an ‘occupational hazard’ or words to that effect that patients contract illnesses whilst in hospitals, she was 71.
There was 50,000 excess flu deaths that year, I don’t remember the country being brought to its knees with lockdowns that year.
I’m not criticising the NHS but everyone seems to gloss over the fact that it’s funded by tax payers yet it seems untouchable for criticism !
You have to separate the general incompetence of the tax payer funded NHS from the great work of the doctors snd nurses otherwise it becomes an emotional subject !
It only appears to be incompetent to people who provide false information like you. There hasn’t been 50,000 excess flu deaths for at least 40 years. Yes all large organisations have issues, often thrust upon them by the latest political whim. The NHS provides, in the vast majority of cases, an effective and efficient service given its funding.
Someone mentioned above the post of survey officer, it made me smile, because doctors have to submit a customer service to the GMC, not through choice, but they have to ask say someone who they may have just told that they only have months to live, and then say how have I done today.
The ONS reported over 50,000 excess deaths attributed to flu and cold as recent as the winter of 2017/18, it’s only their website."
Try reading it it says flu and cold weather not a cold. It included approx 20, 000 from cardiac illnesses, the rest was flu and pneumonia combined. The average flu deaths per annum is about 10,000, controlled largely by vaccines.. without a major intervention like lockdowns, in the absence of a vaccine, we’d be seeing over 10,000 deaths a week, rather than a year. That’s why we have lockdown for COVID but not the flu. |
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"Careful OP... you’ve dared to question or critique the cult of the NHS... youre in for it now !
My mother died in a hospital near to us that had its A&E service reduced because of all the scandals, I won’t name it but you can probably guess which one.
She went in for a routine treatment and while she was in there contracted flu and died.
At the inquest we were told that it was an ‘occupational hazard’ or words to that effect that patients contract illnesses whilst in hospitals, she was 71.
There was 50,000 excess flu deaths that year, I don’t remember the country being brought to its knees with lockdowns that year.
I’m not criticising the NHS but everyone seems to gloss over the fact that it’s funded by tax payers yet it seems untouchable for criticism !
You have to separate the general incompetence of the tax payer funded NHS from the great work of the doctors snd nurses otherwise it becomes an emotional subject !
It only appears to be incompetent to people who provide false information like you. There hasn’t been 50,000 excess flu deaths for at least 40 years. Yes all large organisations have issues, often thrust upon them by the latest political whim. The NHS provides, in the vast majority of cases, an effective and efficient service given its funding.
Someone mentioned above the post of survey officer, it made me smile, because doctors have to submit a customer service to the GMC, not through choice, but they have to ask say someone who they may have just told that they only have months to live, and then say how have I done today.
The ONS reported over 50,000 excess deaths attributed to flu and cold as recent as the winter of 2017/18, it’s only their website."
Wrong...You, like Sir Rocco Forte, misunderstand the ONS.
The chart in that article with ONS as source might help you out...
https://www.bbc.com/news/54735702
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Support the NHS by not voting Tory. They never invest in it.
People who enabled the 80 seat majority of a man sacked from a newspaper for lying have enabled a situation of incompetence leading our country at the worst time.
I hope they all are proud of their votes |
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"Support the NHS by not voting Tory. They never invest in it.
People who enabled the 80 seat majority of a man sacked from a newspaper for lying have enabled a situation of incompetence leading our country at the worst time.
I hope they all are proud of their votes "
I think they all thought Brexit was the most important thing in the world, that was another fook up ! |
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The focus on the NHS is only because it is the main way that we have of saving many lives and preventing many more from serious health damage. It's not just because it's 1 incredible institution. It's a means to an end.
The claims about the types of increased jjobs prior to 2010 are nonsense. The records are freely available and should be referred to, rather than resorting to inaccurate picture painting. Why's the NHS been so in need of being strengthened? Alongside a growing elderly population, investment was cut in real terms for 10 years. They ignored epidemic readiness testing results that showed we weren't ready. Some of the politicians were happy to cheer cuts to nurses pay, at the same time. OP mentions thousands of vacancies for nurses etc but there should be no wonderment about the reasons.
It's a devastating year for everyone. We have to have a working health service that can cope with the worst points. It's always winter, due to the seasonal influences. It should be fit and proper for the best of times too, which it hasn't been due to under funding that we voted for. It's a foundation stone of our society, supporting the most vulnerable, as also our care services should too. They're of course a focal point for us during an epidemic emergency situation. And good leadership helps to ensure that the other essential aspects of our world are fit and proper for good life too. Rose tinted spectacles aren't needed to appreciate the fundamental nesds of a civilised life and how our NHS people have been outstanding over the past year. So many have given up much, including many who gave their lives, so that we rest easier at night. We have to look at ourselves and what we value, ensuring that we get future investments made for the common good and decency of our part in the world |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ?
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !
If no measures had been taken we would not have thousands of new Covid patients each day it would be 10s of thousands. No healthcare system in the world could be funded to cope with such a surge. The situation is not unique to the UK.
If you read all the expert reports, they claim we had similar 50,000 cases a day in the first wave as we do now, it’s just there was no mass testing in April like we have now."
And I don’t disagree with that conclusion but restrictions put in place then pulled the case numbers down so we did not go on to see 100,000, 200,000, 400,000 cases per day. |
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"Support the NHS by not voting Tory. They never invest in it.
People who enabled the 80 seat majority of a man sacked from a newspaper for lying have enabled a situation of incompetence leading our country at the worst time.
I hope they all are proud of their votes "
Meanwhile adults understand we protect the NHS by voting conservative, they know we can’t fund an NHS when labour fks up the economy as they always do |
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"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
"
Brilliant post so well said |
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"i couldn't disagree more with the standpoint taken in the OP.
You're being kind calling it a standpoint, I think its just a late night rant."
i also don't see the point of you attacking the poster for writing their opinion either. |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"i couldn't disagree more with the standpoint taken in the OP.
You're being kind calling it a standpoint, I think its just a late night rant.
i also don't see the point of you attacking the poster for writing their opinion either."
You really think my post is a personal attack? Ok then. |
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"i couldn't disagree more with the standpoint taken in the OP.
You're being kind calling it a standpoint, I think its just a late night rant.
i also don't see the point of you attacking the poster for writing their opinion either.
You really think my post is a personal attack? Ok then."
there is a clear difference between an attack on a persons written opinion and a personal attack. i didn't mention the later. |
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"Support the NHS by not voting Tory. They never invest in it.
People who enabled the 80 seat majority of a man sacked from a newspaper for lying have enabled a situation of incompetence leading our country at the worst time.
I hope they all are proud of their votes "
The hospital in balan port talbot was built under a labour government and private money. when it was being built everyone knew it would be to small and not fit for purpose. There was no way would it be able to replace the old neath hospital port talbot hospital neath annex cimla and groeswen. The majority of these were sold off for housing ? But it still went ahead and after being built they realised there was no childrens ward or staff accommodation ( they had to built later) at an extra cost . Andthe local nhs is still paying for a hospital that would make a great shoppimg centre
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"Support the NHS by not voting Tory. They never invest in it.
People who enabled the 80 seat majority of a man sacked from a newspaper for lying have enabled a situation of incompetence leading our country at the worst time.
I hope they all are proud of their votes
The hospital in balan port talbot was built under a labour government and private money. when it was being built everyone knew it would be to small and not fit for purpose. There was no way would it be able to replace the old neath hospital port talbot hospital neath annex cimla and groeswen. The majority of these were sold off for housing ? But it still went ahead and after being built they realised there was no childrens ward or staff accommodation ( they had to built later) at an extra cost . Andthe local nhs is still paying for a hospital that would make a great shoppimg centre
"
have you worked there? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !"
I think in times of stress and pressure it’s very easy to look to others and presume they are getting preferential treatment, that they are somehow more favoured or indeed better off than yourself or others scenarios.
The reality is within the NHS we probably feel help, measures, lockdowns etc have all come too late, we’ve had too little help etc. Whether that’s timing or the arrival of PPE, equipment, medicine etc. I too have lost a friend and colleague and it’s hard not to blame the system for the risks she was exposed too.
The reality is within the current climate there’s a middle ground between economy and health being taken by the government. In Manchester we’ve seen and suffered because of it since October.
I see both sides, my hospital is a war zone. We knew it would be and prayed for tougher restrictions weeks before they came, we have suffered that delay ever since. I also have friends, business owners, canal street haunts who have all been crushed by the lockdown. It’s a no win as a scenario.
Both sides of this fence are crap, sadly the right balance is probably being taken currently which is to keep healthcare just below breaking point to allow at least some business and education to continue.
It’s all important stuff, I feel sympathy for everyone in whatever camp in truth and my only thought really is we all need to remember we are all suffering and to be kind and sympathetic to each other.
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"I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !
I think in times of stress and pressure it’s very easy to look to others and presume they are getting preferential treatment, that they are somehow more favoured or indeed better off than yourself or others scenarios.
The reality is within the NHS we probably feel help, measures, lockdowns etc have all come too late, we’ve had too little help etc. Whether that’s timing or the arrival of PPE, equipment, medicine etc. I too have lost a friend and colleague and it’s hard not to blame the system for the risks she was exposed too.
The reality is within the current climate there’s a middle ground between economy and health being taken by the government. In Manchester we’ve seen and suffered because of it since October.
I see both sides, my hospital is a war zone. We knew it would be and prayed for tougher restrictions weeks before they came, we have suffered that delay ever since. I also have friends, business owners, canal street haunts who have all been crushed by the lockdown. It’s a no win as a scenario.
Both sides of this fence are crap, sadly the right balance is probably being taken currently which is to keep healthcare just below breaking point to allow at least some business and education to continue.
It’s all important stuff, I feel sympathy for everyone in whatever camp in truth and my only thought really is we all need to remember we are all suffering and to be kind and sympathetic to each other.
"
Jesus Charli another outstanding post you always seem to know exactly what to say and in the right way.
Thank you |
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The pandemic has revealed how much as a nation we rely on people who are poorly rewarded for the job they do. It also highlights how many of these people are foreign workers and who would not be allowed in to the country under the proposed immigration legislation. It is highly ironic that the UK government is embarking on a publicity campaign to recruit more NHS, emergency services and prison staff right now. Could it be that these areas are facing shortages as a direct result of the Brexit arrangements ? Are Johnson and his party about to have massive egg on face as they have to face the twin fallout from muddled government handling of the pandemic and incompetence over the impact of leaving the EU ? It is arguable that the impact of Covid in the UK could have been minimized had the NHS had more front line staff. It is a testimony to their resilience that the death toll has not been higher. But hindsight is always 20-20. What is dismaying is the general lack of learning from experience. Government has failed to provide consistent firm direction and people have become less observant of the guidelines in place. The sole bright spot in all this has been the willingness of some to cooperate to find a vaccine that will at least go some way to mitigate the future impact. |
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"Thank you for reading this party political broadcast for the Conservative party.
Personally I would have Johnson, Gove and Hancock shot, not sure that’s allowed ?"
And who would you replace them with. Be realistic |
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"have you worked there?"
Not worked there myself. But a close family member was involved in the setting up and the transfer from neath to the new hospital. Have however spent many visits there and it is more like a shopping centre in waiting than a hospital even down to the glass lifts
Think once this pandemic is over there should be an inquiry into where all the money from consecutive governments has gone in the NHS. For starters it was stated at the beginning that the uk government gave 470 million to the welsh government for its covid responce where has that gone.
Read a report from 2016 that wales needed 52 icu beds per 500k population. The latest figues i can find is we actually have 5.6 per 100k. If my maths serve me right that is 28 per 500k. So even before covid wales had under half the icu beds required for our population and that is down to the welsh assembly.
How many beds could have been provided with the money spend to build the sennedd ???? |
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"
"have you worked there?"
Not worked there myself. But a close family member was involved in the setting up and the transfer from neath to the new hospital. Have however spent many visits there and it is more like a shopping centre in waiting than a hospital even down to the glass lifts
Think once this pandemic is over there should be an inquiry into where all the money from consecutive governments has gone in the NHS. For starters it was stated at the beginning that the uk government gave 470 million to the welsh government for its covid responce where has that gone.
Read a report from 2016 that wales needed 52 icu beds per 500k population. The latest figues i can find is we actually have 5.6 per 100k. If my maths serve me right that is 28 per 500k. So even before covid wales had under half the icu beds required for our population and that is down to the welsh assembly.
How many beds could have been provided with the money spend to build the sennedd ????"
If you work on the ‘coal face’ for the NHS as a doctor or nurse then you must be pulling your hair out every day with the lack of recruitment !
The NHS spent £10 billion on an IT system that didn’t work properly,
As for the Labour Party being the supporters of the NHS, didn’t they lose 25,000 beds under their last administration ?
Although ‘Full Fact’ say it was nearer 26,000
https://fullfact.org/health/number-hospital-beds-falling/
It does matter who is in power they alway let the NHS down ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If you work on the ‘coal face’ for the NHS as a doctor or nurse then you must be pulling your hair out every day with the lack of recruitment !
The NHS spent £10 billion on an IT system that didn’t work properly,
As for the Labour Party being the supporters of the NHS, didn’t they lose 25,000 beds under their last administration ?
Although ‘Full Fact’ say it was nearer 26,000
https://fullfact.org/health/number-hospital-beds-falling/
It does matter who is in power they alway let the NHS down !"
I don’t think that’s true, I think the NHS appreciates the gravity of the situation, the difficulty of training and as such manages with what we have.
Within this “pandemic”, the virus is actually the issue... we shouldn’t forget that and start blaming anyone but ourselves for the issues it’s created |
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"Thank you for reading this party political broadcast for the Conservative party.
Personally I would have Johnson, Gove and Hancock shot, not sure that’s allowed ?
And who would you replace them with. Be realistic "
The problem is 40 years of neglect, it’s like an old house that’s falling apart, do you keep patching it up or knock it down and start afresh.
It was similar with schools some years ago, look at some of the brand spanking new academy buildings now !
Perhaps the NHS should be funded regionally rather than nationally and trusts amalgamated to provide a vast range of services per area.
Something needs to change as the NHS falls over ever winter with flu anyway, this pandemic has just highlighted the shortcomings to a greater degree ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I have read various posts on here from people who work in the healthcare sector and whilst I appreciate this virus is real I am starting to get fed up of being guilt tripped into ‘protecting the NHS’. Every year it ‘fall over’ with the flu, something obviously isn’t right with it even though it’s the 5th largest employer in the world.
The reason they can’t cope is because they are 58,000 to 86,000 doctors and nurses short (depending on which article you read), yet during the Labour administration they added approximately 150,000 staff to the NHS staff roster, mostly in administrative posts, I’m sure some will defend that but to me it was creation of jobs just for the sake of it.
Next week I will be burying a former work colleague of mine who took his own life after losing his business that he started two years ago that supplied prepared foods to pubs and restaurants, constant lockdowns destroyed it as his customer orders dwindled to around 5%.
This was a guy that survived being bombed by the Argentinians on HMS Sheffield during the Falklands Conflict.
I fully support the doctors and nurses during this pandemic but this country seems to think the NHS is the only thing that matters, there are other people who’s lives that this pandemic is destroying and let’s not forget that the NHS is funded by us tax payers with about 20% of our taxes each year going to fund it.
Let’s support the NHS but let’s not become one-eyed to think it’s the only thing that matters in this country, the media are the worst for pushing this !
Firstly, condolences for the loss of your friend ..
Secondly what are you suggesting ?
I think the governments approach has been ‘protect the NHS’ at all costs, the damage to the economy as a result of that is being hidden by the furlough scheme at the moment, we could have 4 or 5 million unemployed this time next year and for those that thing the NHS is under-funded at the moment then it will get only much worse with less tax revenues in the system.
Personally, I think if you mention economy it’s classed as a dirty word but without a stable one we real are fucked !"
I think I know what you're trying to say, but putting bluntly. An economy will recover with healthy people and a health system to support them. A healtht economy will so due to but not solely by healthy people.
Another very big factor in all of this is it's not just us. Every economy is struggling and has undergone a form of recession.
This is not to sound unsympathetic in anyway but every year many face hardship and many go under for varying reasons. To pin everything on the economy might be ignoring some simple things that keep and maintain it. |
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"
"have you worked there?"
Not worked there myself. But a close family member was involved in the setting up and the transfer from neath to the new hospital. Have however spent many visits there and it is more like a shopping centre in waiting than a hospital even down to the glass lifts
Think once this pandemic is over there should be an inquiry into where all the money from consecutive governments has gone in the NHS. For starters it was stated at the beginning that the uk government gave 470 million to the welsh government for its covid responce where has that gone.
Read a report from 2016 that wales needed 52 icu beds per 500k population. The latest figues i can find is we actually have 5.6 per 100k. If my maths serve me right that is 28 per 500k. So even before covid wales had under half the icu beds required for our population and that is down to the welsh assembly.
How many beds could have been provided with the money spend to build the sennedd ????
If you work on the ‘coal face’ for the NHS as a doctor or nurse then you must be pulling your hair out every day with the lack of recruitment !
The NHS spent £10 billion on an IT system that didn’t work properly,
As for the Labour Party being the supporters of the NHS, didn’t they lose 25,000 beds under their last administration ?
Although ‘Full Fact’ say it was nearer 26,000
https://fullfact.org/health/number-hospital-beds-falling/
It does matter who is in power they alway let the NHS down !"
Every political party has used the NHS as something to point score from since almost day one, if they would just leave us alone to do what’s needed instead of inventing change for change sake often before the pervious lot of change has even been fully tested or implemented we might be able to get on a do the job better, PFI was never good, it kicked the fan down the road of the capital investment and makes private industry a lot of money, it does however deliver a building that’s kept at a required standard. A lot of the pen pushing is that demanded by government.
I would also say that extensive emergency planning and capacity used to be in place but guess what gets cut when it’s politically unthinkable not to recruit a nurse? You can’t have cake and eat it, someone needs to decide what they want from a health service, it needs to be well managed and effective, it’s not always so, you could go down the American route and who would want that, may as well go back to the workhouse system that the NHS is largely built on where the worthy poor and those who can pay get treated and the rest well they are fucked,
I have wondered since day one of the governments plan to help pay for all this is to allow as many old, long term sick, disabled and those in care say to die so as to reduce the burden of social care on the state. I wonder if they will publish what the savings are so far, it was quite clear on the run up before this happened they couldn’t afford it, it must be a lot less now. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Thank you for reading this party political broadcast for the Conservative party.
Personally I would have Johnson, Gove and Hancock shot, not sure that’s allowed ?
And who would you replace them with. Be realistic
The problem is 40 years of neglect, it’s like an old house that’s falling apart, do you keep patching it up or knock it down and start afresh.
It was similar with schools some years ago, look at some of the brand spanking new academy buildings now !
Perhaps the NHS should be funded regionally rather than nationally and trusts amalgamated to provide a vast range of services per area.
Something needs to change as the NHS falls over ever winter with flu anyway, this pandemic has just highlighted the shortcomings to a greater degree !"
It's not worked here in NI. What's happened is consultants have dictated locality of funding and development. Few want to work away from the newest and latest equipment, so regional places have closed and mist of it is now centralised in and around Belfast, leaving many without the necessary services locally.
Im not convinced of the effectiveness of all of these new Academy buildings either. Buildings don't make better education.
There's an NHS equipment storage unit nearby where unused and old equipment goes to. The volume of brand new equipment still in original wrapping would make you cry. Reason I was given is that if not used inside 5 years it's disposed off. Budgeting needs a shake up in the way it's allocated and cannot be carried over IMO. |
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Lots of good points and ideas. And glad to see everyone is supporting the front line staff and care workers. Think it is time the boards of directors and administrators where held publically responsible for the short commings of their trusts and hospital failings. Maybe then there might be a few less trying to justify salaries of over and above that of the uk priminister. If you live in wales try to find an upto date figure for icu beds in wales. Every page i went to diverted me to corona virus and how busy the hospitals are . As i stated earlier the newest figures i could find dated to a paper published in 2016. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If the politicians cared about the NHS it would have been properly funded "
yes and ran more efficiently, I worked for the NHS in the 80s, when thatchers government introduced more managers etc not front line staff. I saw plush offices yet struggled to find a blanket for patients |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It wouldnt matter how much money the NHS had, it wouldnt be enough. I worked for them, the most inefficient, bureaucratic and wasteful organisation I have ever come across. Tragic that we have 1.8m people in health care and cant manage. The Government are scared to challenge the sainted NHS so the monolith doesnt change.
There are lots of great people, some awful ones and a lot of jobsworths. Needs someone to sort |
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I think its time we called for a peoples review of our health service. Carried out by truely independant people( if there is such a thing)
Time some of the NHS non medical staff justified their roles and also true figures need to be published of how much waist there is within the health service. Out of date medication, supplies and equipment and as listed earlier computer systems. I also think her in wales that certain items should not be available with a free prescription things like paracetamol, cough medicine and ibuproven as you can get then in supermarkets at less than 50p- £1 a pack or bottle
Also repeat precripions should be better scrutinised. Not just filled month after month after month with no visit to a doctor. But that should also be down to the patient who re orders medication they don't take anymore |
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"It wouldnt matter how much money the NHS had, it wouldnt be enough. I worked for them, the most inefficient, bureaucratic and wasteful organisation I have ever come across. Tragic that we have 1.8m people in health care and cant manage. The Government are scared to challenge the sainted NHS so the monolith doesnt change.
There are lots of great people, some awful ones and a lot of jobsworths. Needs someone to sort"
I’m glad you said that as my post seems to have stirred up the ‘NHS is god and untouchable’ replies !
Like I said earlier in the post, our NHS is the 5th largest employer in the world but falls over almost every winter, surely that must tell everyone something that how badly it’s managed !
It has some great people working for it but it eats money like it’s going out of fashion. |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"It wouldnt matter how much money the NHS had, it wouldnt be enough. I worked for them, the most inefficient, bureaucratic and wasteful organisation I have ever come across. Tragic that we have 1.8m people in health care and cant manage. The Government are scared to challenge the sainted NHS so the monolith doesnt change.
There are lots of great people, some awful ones and a lot of jobsworths. Needs someone to sort
I’m glad you said that as my post seems to have stirred up the ‘NHS is god and untouchable’ replies !
Like I said earlier in the post, our NHS is the 5th largest employer in the world but falls over almost every winter, surely that must tell everyone something that how badly it’s managed !
It has some great people working for it but it eats money like it’s going out of fashion."
It will take me a while to find the study but it found the NHS provided the best value for money relative to other countries |
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"It wouldnt matter how much money the NHS had, it wouldnt be enough. I worked for them, the most inefficient, bureaucratic and wasteful organisation I have ever come across. Tragic that we have 1.8m people in health care and cant manage. The Government are scared to challenge the sainted NHS so the monolith doesnt change.
There are lots of great people, some awful ones and a lot of jobsworths. Needs someone to sort
I’m glad you said that as my post seems to have stirred up the ‘NHS is god and untouchable’ replies !
Like I said earlier in the post, our NHS is the 5th largest employer in the world but falls over almost every winter, surely that must tell everyone something that how badly it’s managed !
It has some great people working for it but it eats money like it’s going out of fashion.
It will take me a while to find the study but it found the NHS provided the best value for money relative to other countries"
You may be right, but seeing as we have the lowest beds per capita in Europe I think that’s a more reasonable assessment of its underlying issues |
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