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worst recession for 300 years
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By *lan157Man
over a year ago
a village near Haywards Heath in East Sussex |
"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?
"
What is your point? No one wants a recession by choice. The impact will have to be mitigated |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?"
May we ask what your point is please?
We are struggling to understand the point you are trying to make. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?"
What's your point?
You seem to have been against lockdown from the beginning. Over 350 have died again today...and all you seem to harp on about is bloody money for ducks sake  |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?
What's your point?
You seem to have been against lockdown from the beginning. Over 350 have died again today...and all you seem to harp on about is bloody money for ducks sake "
money allows people to buy healthy food |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?
What's your point?
You seem to have been against lockdown from the beginning. Over 350 have died again today...and all you seem to harp on about is bloody money for ducks sake
money allows people to buy healthy food"
Tell that to the hundreds queueing up for kfc and Maccy D's |
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?"
It is what it is and we are were we are, you clearly disagree with the lockdown and that's fine but the option of letting the virus run rife by not locking down at all could have resulted in tens of thousands more dead..
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
I'm not sure whatvtge global economic situation was like in the early 18th century but 300 years sounds like an exaggeration... |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
You have made a statement without a question?
Or at least we are all struggling to understand your question
Are you suggesting....the cost of the worst recession in 300 years does not justify the health of the nation and 50,000 lives?
Seems to be another let's take newspaper headline and turn it into a shitpost....
The country has taken on massive borrowing and the economy has been broken for 3 months it doesn't take a genius to see that's economically bad
And politically no politician will come out and say sorry guys it's costs to much to our economy to safe your granny so pensioners are gonna die and you are paying more taxes to pay for this cluster fuck we mismanaged.
Unless your name is Donald Trump but look how his policies have gone dow. He makes Tehran look like Disney land |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?
You have made a statement without a question?
Or at least we are all struggling to understand your question
Are you suggesting....the cost of the worst recession in 300 years does not justify the health of the nation and 50,000 lives?
Seems to be another let's take newspaper headline and turn it into a shitpost....
The country has taken on massive borrowing and the economy has been broken for 3 months it doesn't take a genius to see that's economically bad
And politically no politician will come out and say sorry guys it's costs to much to our economy to safe your granny so pensioners are gonna die and you are paying more taxes to pay for this cluster fuck we mismanaged.
Unless your name is Donald Trump but look how his policies have gone dow. He makes Tehran look like Disney land"
that seemed to be the response to the 1968-69 hong kong flu pandemic which killed 80,000 in the uk |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility |
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility"
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?
It is what it is and we are were we are, you clearly disagree with the lockdown and that's fine but the option of letting the virus run rife by not locking down at all could have resulted in tens of thousands more dead..
"
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..? "
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly |
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly"
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok. |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok. "
It's got to be better than locking everyone down |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?
You have made a statement without a question?
Or at least we are all struggling to understand your question
Are you suggesting....the cost of the worst recession in 300 years does not justify the health of the nation and 50,000 lives?
Seems to be another let's take newspaper headline and turn it into a shitpost....
The country has taken on massive borrowing and the economy has been broken for 3 months it doesn't take a genius to see that's economically bad
And politically no politician will come out and say sorry guys it's costs to much to our economy to safe your granny so pensioners are gonna die and you are paying more taxes to pay for this cluster fuck we mismanaged.
Unless your name is Donald Trump but look how his policies have gone dow. He makes Tehran look like Disney land"
from the green arrow i would say its exactly what he is inferring but prefers the vague clickbait headline approach to just saying what he means ... followed by asking people to pluck incredibly difficult and variable future statistical modelling out of either thin air or their asses then draw conclusions for him |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok.
It's got to be better than locking everyone down"
what outcome would you like OP? shall we get a loan of the docs time machine and stick you at the head of the government in January, see how it all works out then come back to the thread and compare notes? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok.
It's got to be better than locking everyone down"
Isn't that part of the idea behind track and trace? If it actually gets up and running.... |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok.
It's got to be better than locking everyone down
what outcome would you like OP? shall we get a loan of the docs time machine and stick you at the head of the government in January, see how it all works out then come back to the thread and compare notes? "
Primer is a very good time travel film |
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By *etsome OP Man
over a year ago
birmingham |
"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok.
It's got to be better than locking everyone down
Isn't that part of the idea behind track and trace? If it actually gets up and running...."
Can't see it working. Sounds like they aren't getting many calls |
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly
How long for?
What about all those that will die even though they think they are going to be ok.
It's got to be better than locking everyone down"
So at risk people locked down indefinitely, people dying who thought it would not affect them and all just to make you feel better - staggering |
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?
I'm not sure whatvtge global economic situation was like in the early 18th century but 300 years sounds like an exaggeration..."
My thoughts too.
Was trying to picture explaining an economic recession to a working family 300 years ago.
Can't get my head around that picture.  |
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"I'm just wondering if what is happening to the global economy could lead to famine in some parts of the world? I know they are not mentioning it on the msm - but that doesn't mean it's not a possibility
Sadly famine is too common, what would you have done differently..?
I would have locked down the at risk groups and the elderly"
I agree, and earlier across the board too..
But that is two groups who are not without being too assumptive not the main producers of gdp..
Is that all you would've done because if so its a bit at odds with what you've been saying.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Yes uk is heading for a recession, it was already going to happen with brexit but covid is speeding it up as well."
The brexiters will no daubt blame covid and not brexit for it.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think there will be a lot of hidden deaths as a result of a lockdown as people dont have access to testing like cancer screening but it probably never be spoken of. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think there will be a lot of hidden deaths as a result of a lockdown as people dont have access to testing like cancer screening but it probably never be spoken of."
No doubt there will be...but the lockdown was needed to prevent the deaths we knew would come from covid.
If we had locked down 2 weeks earlier it most likely would have saved around 20000 deaths. But yeah I'm well aware that people will die due to it and not from it |
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What's your specific calculation op? Have you submitted a Freedom of Information request for their calculations to the government?
Borrowing costs are about the lowest they have ever been. This should be a recession with a faster recovery than typically, as it was caused by the virus, rather than subprime mortgages and the financial sector out of control etc. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Yes uk is heading for a recession, it was already going to happen with brexit but covid is speeding it up as well."
some parts of Europe were already heading into recession too before the virus, the uk was actually in a slightly better place financially than some of our EU friends before the virus hit, now we are all in the shit.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
Be honest, Bojo was going to fuck everything up anyway with his severely badly/unplanned Brexit. If anything the virus gives him an excuse for later life.
Oh i would have done wonderful things for the UK (England/mainly the south) if corona virus had not hit.
He may have said, if able to string a sentence together. |
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"What would the figure be how many wouldve died if we didn't lockdown would it be much higher "
WHO early reports indicated that overall mobidity from covid-19 could be approximately 3%. Analysis from the larger population sample of New York gives a rate of about 1.5%. The experience of Italy shows that if hospitals become overwhelmed, the death rate increases due to patients who might be able to recover with treatment not receiving that treatment.
This all suggests that if the epidemic had been allowed to continue exponential spread with no lockdown, the number of deaths in the UK would have been a minimum of 700,000 up to a maximum of 3 million. At least twenty times more than the current official death count. |
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
Worst recession in 300 years.
I'm no historian or economist but think we've had a couple of wars slightly sooner than 300 years ago and my understanding is wars can cause a slight dip in the economy, but maybe wrong. |
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By *estivalMan
over a year ago
borehamwood |
"Yes uk is heading for a recession, it was already going to happen with brexit but covid is speeding it up as well.The brexiters will no daubt blame covid and not brexit for it."
im not a leaver or remainer shag but christ do you have to shoehorn brexit into most threads.you know it brings out the nutters from both sides |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Yes uk is heading for a recession, it was already going to happen with brexit but covid is speeding it up as well.The brexiters will no daubt blame covid and not brexit for it.
im not a leaver or remainer shag but christ do you have to shoehorn brexit into most threads.you know it brings out the nutters from both sides"
yeah he sure hasn't got over it and his prediction it won't happen.  |
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At a guess, 300 years ago is roughly the time the Bank of England began as England’s central bank, so the suggestion is the worst recession since records began.
Still not sure I believe it though, given the small matter of two world wars in that time, with a massive pandemic immediately after the first one! |
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No idea about 300 years, I wasn't around and I don't know if comparisons can be made
It will be the worst in 15 years for sure, but the recovery will come very quickly in comparison as this one is based on a necessary world shutdown with an appetite for recovery whereas the last one was based on gross incompetence and greed leading to a fear of investment.
The UK is unlikely to see any recovery whatsoever this year or maybe next as whose going to pump money into manufacturing until the damage of brexit is seen. |
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If this turns into a worldwide depression could be very dangerous, don’t forget that the Second World War came about through depression in Germany ,when people become desperate who knows where that leads to |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
Lots of talk on here about a recovery being v shaped and fast.
Let me clarify....stock markets will recover quickly. They already have. That's because the us, which is the global benchmark currency has literally said they will print an endless supply of money to get out of this.
Have a look at us stock markets whilst the country is burning....they are going up.
But stock markets are not the economy. The UK economy had not even recovered from the 08 crisis before this hit. Whilst the stock markets soared
There are number of geo political issues at play.all to in depth for a swinging site.
But don't believe the hype train. Standards of living have been depressed for years and will be even more after this.
We haven't even got back to an 08 standards of living |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Lots of talk on here about a recovery being v shaped and fast.
Let me clarify....stock markets will recover quickly. They already have. That's because the us, which is the global benchmark currency has literally said they will print an endless supply of money to get out of this.
Have a look at us stock markets whilst the country is burning....they are going up.
But stock markets are not the economy. The UK economy had not even recovered from the 08 crisis before this hit. Whilst the stock markets soared
There are number of geo political issues at play.all to in depth for a swinging site.
But don't believe the hype train. Standards of living have been depressed for years and will be even more after this.
We haven't even got back to an 08 standards of living "
stock markets dont = economy, but standard of living does?  ok then
stock markets are an input to the economy ... standard of living is an output (both impacted by wider factors than economics)
don’t pretend to be educating people while spouting total misleading information |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"No idea about 300 years, I wasn't around and I don't know if comparisons can be made
It will be the worst in 15 years for sure, but the recovery will come very quickly in comparison as this one is based on a necessary world shutdown with an appetite for recovery whereas the last one was based on gross incompetence and greed leading to a fear of investment.
The UK is unlikely to see any recovery whatsoever this year or maybe next as whose going to pump money into manufacturing until the damage of brexit is seen."
The company I work for are a global manufacturing company and have been investing plenty in the business over the last couple of yrs and is set to continue, not all trade is with the EU you know, for my company the EU market is our smallest, the US, china, Canada, Australia and Africa are bigger markets for us with far more growth potential than the EU. |
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Well its the governments fault...all of it the sad loss of life the recession business shut down the job losses the debt everything because our government sat on their backsides ignoring the situation having that well it wont get here blatant attitude instead of acting fast in january and shutting off the uk a virus cannot spread if you contain it and that what they didnt do they let it into the country and did nothing until it was too late i caught it 8 weeks of crap that i never want again and im trying to get my physical strength back now nearly there... yep afraid these days the worlds ran by a bunch of ego power made self centred cretins..... nothing changed in history then... maybe we should start a new party ...the lifestyle party should be a blast |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds"
i never said it did ... i said it was an input ... of which there are many
i just said your suggestion that the economy can and should be deciphered from peoples standard of living was total garbage |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
its the worst health impact since 1666  |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds
i never said it did ... i said it was an input ... of which there are many
i just said your suggestion that the economy can and should be deciphered from peoples standard of living was total garbage "
You infered it
And nor did I say economy should be measured by peoples standard of living
I said an standard of livings are directly affected by an economy.
Booming economy =great standards of living
Poor economy =poor standards of living
That's why after 08 everyone's standard of living declined.
The stock market boomed but the economy did not
Which relates back to my original posts.
This is all basic economics.if you want to argue with accepted principles and facts, not my opinions I'll leave you to it.
It's ok to be educated by someone even if you don't like them or what they say. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds
i never said it did ... i said it was an input ... of which there are many
i just said your suggestion that the economy can and should be deciphered from peoples standard of living was total garbage
You infered it
And nor did I say economy should be measured by peoples standard of living
I said an standard of livings are directly affected by an economy.
Booming economy =great standards of living
Poor economy =poor standards of living
That's why after 08 everyone's standard of living declined.
The stock market boomed but the economy did not
Which relates back to my original posts.
This is all basic economics.if you want to argue with accepted principles and facts, not my opinions I'll leave you to it.
It's ok to be educated by someone even if you don't like them or what they say."
you said stock markets are not the economy, don’t believe the hype, the standard of living will not return for a long time
you literally implied the standard of living is how to measure the economy
i also don’t know you from adam so no idea where you got the impression that i don’t like you
if you only want to debate facts you shouldn’t try to “educate people” with opinion |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds
i never said it did ... i said it was an input ... of which there are many
i just said your suggestion that the economy can and should be deciphered from peoples standard of living was total garbage
You infered it
And nor did I say economy should be measured by peoples standard of living
I said an standard of livings are directly affected by an economy.
Booming economy =great standards of living
Poor economy =poor standards of living
That's why after 08 everyone's standard of living declined.
The stock market boomed but the economy did not
Which relates back to my original posts.
This is all basic economics.if you want to argue with accepted principles and facts, not my opinions I'll leave you to it.
It's ok to be educated by someone even if you don't like them or what they say.
you said stock markets are not the economy, don’t believe the hype, the standard of living will not return for a long time
you literally implied the standard of living is how to measure the economy
i also don’t know you from adam so no idea where you got the impression that i don’t like you
if you only want to debate facts you shouldn’t try to “educate people” with opinion "
I didn't imply
You made your own interpretation
If you want question anything I right feel free to message me.im happy to clarify my points
I actually do know what I'm talking about and am happy in most cases to help people.
Im not happy about hostile shitposting. The forums seemed to invaded with Twitter twats all ranting lately and its shame.
I often have my opinion informed or even changed by people on here who know more about a topic than I do.
There are thousands of article about the stock market not being the economy (because hint, it isn't)
I think this is clearest presentation https://youtu.be/0ECqDaPjjV0
Or you can listen to the 3 ex chancellors of the UK agree with points I made for over 2hrs
https://youtu.be/oeWFruYa600
I hope this clarifies my "education" for you. There was a time when you had to spend thousands in tuition for this kind of information now it's free...people want to argue with it.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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So the stock market has needed a correction for sometime now. Forget about everything you read it’s all bull shit. Bears and bulls always need to make money. This is how the markets work. Only 3 people make money in markets.
Bulls - they make money when the life looks good. That does not mean the market gives value vs the index
Bears - they look for stocks that are over valued. If you’re bored look at market capital vs balance sheets
Then you have the MM’s the market makers that’s the real money makers. If you win big they make money. If you lose they make money.
This recession will be the shortest lived recession in history. |
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?
Worst recession in 300 years.
I'm no historian or economist but think we've had a couple of wars slightly sooner than 300 years ago and my understanding is wars can cause a slight dip in the economy, but maybe wrong. "
I think the UK finished paying for the Lend-Lease loans incurred during WWII in the noughties. That is a lot of years.
After Chancellor Osborne's austerity measures we now have a chancellor who seems to have an open hand with money, much of it borrowed. I don't begrudge helping people as must have happened (apart from the greedy super-rich getting loans paid to BVI holding companies,etc.) there are many needy people. I think we will have very large debt problem when these loans have to be repaid and I don't see much hope for the unfortunates who will have no proper income in future. We could expect a period like the late 1940's though without the income from manufacturing and commonwealth. I don't see any reduction in taxation for thee and me even if it isn't income tax. (Unless you are a non-dom moneybags with a pied-à-terre in Mayfair or similar).
Rant Over, just hoping that it will get back to normal, whatever that is, very soon!
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"So the stock market has needed a correction for sometime now. Forget about everything you read it’s all bull shit. Bears and bulls always need to make money. This is how the markets work. Only 3 people make money in markets.
Bulls - they make money when the life looks good. That does not mean the market gives value vs the index
Bears - they look for stocks that are over valued. If you’re bored look at market capital vs balance sheets
Then you have the MM’s the market makers that’s the real money makers. If you win big they make money. If you lose they make money.
This recession will be the shortest lived recession in history. "
Yes, the City will not go short and keep the artificial money go round happening. With automated buying and selling it must ease the lot of traders these days! Hedge funds selling short in a falling market benefits whom? Pension funds? High net worth individuals? But what is all this artifice based on? Who is really generating wealth? I think that answer is China and other nations who exploit their workforce or irreplaceable natural resources.
Incidentally I worked in the City over the 'Big Bang' period (and Black Friday too) but the champagne flowed freely then. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I’m a bull, always have been. Pump it full of steroids and blag the shit out of it!
But all my bigger gains have been from a bull market.
I kind of miss it! Also who never made money after the crash in 08. You had DT making gains of 300% who never knew about waves or anything |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"I’m a bull, always have been. Pump it full of steroids and blag the shit out of it!
But all my bigger gains have been from a bull market.
I kind of miss it! Also who never made money after the crash in 08. You had DT making gains of 300% who never knew about waves or anything "
Are you sure you are on the right website....
This sounds like something of r/wallstreetbets
If bear runs were longer then bull runs the market would have a negative number?
Your previous analogy of markets sounds more like a sports betting book
Sure you can run your money like that if want massive exposure.
But its not how institutional investing is done.
I actually timed both of these crashes.
This one was obvious to see, the opec deal collapsed with Russia and Saudi gor into a dick measuring contest over dead dino juice.1 week before that markets where already pulling back due to covid in italy.
Oil is the largest commodity assets class when its prices gets fucked markets always pull back.
Then you had mynski moment and the whole global economy shit its pants.
But hey as you said (stonks) go up when daddy Powell makes the the money printer go beer only one way to go
You seem to be happy with your results...so each to their own |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If you think a stock market correlates an economy you don't understand the basic principles of capitalism.
A bond market has a closer correlation to an economy because the primary source of the economic borrowing a nation use to fund economic growth.
And the stock market has inverse relationship to bonds
i never said it did ... i said it was an input ... of which there are many
i just said your suggestion that the economy can and should be deciphered from peoples standard of living was total garbage
You infered it
And nor did I say economy should be measured by peoples standard of living
I said an standard of livings are directly affected by an economy.
Booming economy =great standards of living
Poor economy =poor standards of living
That's why after 08 everyone's standard of living declined.
The stock market boomed but the economy did not
Which relates back to my original posts.
This is all basic economics.if you want to argue with accepted principles and facts, not my opinions I'll leave you to it.
It's ok to be educated by someone even if you don't like them or what they say.
you said stock markets are not the economy, don’t believe the hype, the standard of living will not return for a long time
you literally implied the standard of living is how to measure the economy
i also don’t know you from adam so no idea where you got the impression that i don’t like you
if you only want to debate facts you shouldn’t try to “educate people” with opinion
I didn't imply
You made your own interpretation
If you want question anything I right feel free to message me.im happy to clarify my points
I actually do know what I'm talking about and am happy in most cases to help people.
Im not happy about hostile shitposting. The forums seemed to invaded with Twitter twats all ranting lately and its shame.
I often have my opinion informed or even changed by people on here who know more about a topic than I do.
There are thousands of article about the stock market not being the economy (because hint, it isn't)
I think this is clearest presentation https://youtu.be/0ECqDaPjjV0
Or you can listen to the 3 ex chancellors of the UK agree with points I made for over 2hrs
https://youtu.be/oeWFruYa600
I hope this clarifies my "education" for you. There was a time when you had to spend thousands in tuition for this kind of information now it's free...people want to argue with it.
"
oh ok , so you can read my post and tell me i inferred something, but people cant read yours and suggest something is implied... bit of a double standard but i assume thats because you believe you are the only person with any intelligence or education around here so different rules apply to you 
you have also misread my post twice now because it suited your point so i will go for 3rd time lucky and then leave it be
i am well aware that stock market DOES NOT equal economy ... it is however ONE OF MANY inputs |
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"No idea about 300 years, I wasn't around and I don't know if comparisons can be made
It will be the worst in 15 years for sure, but the recovery will come very quickly in comparison as this one is based on a necessary world shutdown with an appetite for recovery whereas the last one was based on gross incompetence and greed leading to a fear of investment.
The UK is unlikely to see any recovery whatsoever this year or maybe next as whose going to pump money into manufacturing until the damage of brexit is seen. The company I work for are a global manufacturing company and have been investing plenty in the business over the last couple of yrs and is set to continue, not all trade is with the EU you know, for my company the EU market is our smallest, the US, china, Canada, Australia and Africa are bigger markets for us with far more growth potential than the EU. "
You might be one of the lucky people, how many can say that.
A lot of UK trade agreements with non EU cointries are done through EU agreements which must be re negotiated by Boris and his crew before December. |
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The economy will have to change, we cannot continue in our current capitalist state.
Printing money - for one it's imaginary...it only works because it's believed in much like god's to religion. Secondly money doesn't actually make the world turn or work...the world continues without money or economies...very man made things.
More to the reason why we're heading to a recession is not only the effects of covid but to that of environmental issues, resources are depleting fast including fresh water and fertile soil......those we need to live more than some piece of nonsense that companies tell us we need.
As for those left behind, well, we already have these situations globally in many areas but here's a local example: in Scotland ...single mother, father no we're to be seen, parents either not around or in vunurable category & schools are off until August and will be part time in Scotland when they return, not furloughed because she's on a 0 hrs or some other company rouge to avoid taxes and fling folk away as they please. how is she meant to make a living?
Remember, there's always folk worse off than yourself. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The US reported today a reduction in unemployment rate for month of May...jobless reduced by 2.5 million...
I think America's lost it's mind. Good news if you're in heaven apparently."
'US President Donald Trump has been condemned by his Democratic challenger Joe Biden for invoking George Floyd's name as he touted US jobs figures.
Mr Trump said Mr Floyd, an unarmed black man who died in police custody in Minneapolis, is "looking down" and "saying this is a great day".'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-52941258 |
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"The US reported today a reduction in unemployment rate for month of May...jobless reduced by 2.5 million...
I think America's lost it's mind. Good news if you're in heaven apparently.
'US President Donald Trump has been condemned by his Democratic challenger Joe Biden for invoking George Floyd's name as he touted US jobs figures.
Mr Trump said Mr Floyd, an unarmed black man who died in police custody in Minneapolis, is "looking down" and "saying this is a great day".'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-52941258"
It's surreal isn't it. I can't believe what we're all witnessing. Could you have stood behind him while he said that? |
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What did people really think was going to happen if you shut down a whole economy for a disease with an Infection Fatality Rate similar to flu?
The boss of the UK's largest recruitment firm, Reed, has said he fears current trends suggest far more people are going to lose their jobs because of the coronavirus crisis.
James Reed predicted the unemployment rate could reach 15%, meaning five million people could be out of work.
He said recent job cuts by firms were "perhaps just the tip of the iceberg".
Reed has seen job advertisements drop by two-thirds, while applications per job are rising.
This week Bentley, Aston Martin, car dealership Lookers and engineering giant Rolls-Royce have all announced job cuts. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The US reported today a reduction in unemployment rate for month of May...jobless reduced by 2.5 million...
I think America's lost it's mind. Good news if you're in heaven apparently.
'US President Donald Trump has been condemned by his Democratic challenger Joe Biden for invoking George Floyd's name as he touted US jobs figures.
Mr Trump said Mr Floyd, an unarmed black man who died in police custody in Minneapolis, is "looking down" and "saying this is a great day".'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-52941258
It's surreal isn't it. I can't believe what we're all witnessing. Could you have stood behind him while he said that? "
People can't understand how Hitler got so many followers.... 
It saddens me that Trump still has supporters. Very surreal. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"What did people really think was going to happen if you shut down a whole economy for a disease with an Infection Fatality Rate similar to flu?
The boss of the UK's largest recruitment firm, Reed, has said he fears current trends suggest far more people are going to lose their jobs because of the coronavirus crisis.
James Reed predicted the unemployment rate could reach 15%, meaning five million people could be out of work.
He said recent job cuts by firms were "perhaps just the tip of the iceberg".
Reed has seen job advertisements drop by two-thirds, while applications per job are rising.
This week Bentley, Aston Martin, car dealership Lookers and engineering giant Rolls-Royce have all announced job cuts."
Reeds advertising rate is shit because Reed the company is shit
As for all the other big recruitment firms. Most of them have not diversified despite the country needing mass employment changes since 2008.
The sector is now dominated by niche recruitment firms and job board websites undercutting reeds business model.
I'm not surprised aston Martin and Bentley are laying of workings.
Do you think there will be ques for luxury cars at least for the next 2 years?
Aston Martin has also committed to and f1 program so it's new main shareholder can bank roll his sons f1 career. (Now that's a sugar daddy)
Rolls Royce have laid of workers from its aviation business because...nobody is flying planes and carriers are moth balling planes and trying to rollback plane orders. The aviation world is fucked for at least 2 years. There is a global oversupply of planes.
The truth is nobody knows where the economy is heading or how the new economic landscape will look. Just like it was in 08 and after every major crash.
What is sure. Mankind will recover and there will be new employment maybe in new fields and new sectors but it will come.
When the industrial revolution in the 1900s took jobs from workers in country what happened?
The economy changed and people went to work in factories in the cities.
I'm not saying the future will be better. I'm saying...at least there will be a future. |
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"The US reported today a reduction in unemployment rate for month of May...jobless reduced by 2.5 million...
I think America's lost it's mind. Good news if you're in heaven apparently.
'US President Donald Trump has been condemned by his Democratic challenger Joe Biden for invoking George Floyd's name as he touted US jobs figures.
Mr Trump said Mr Floyd, an unarmed black man who died in police custody in Minneapolis, is "looking down" and "saying this is a great day".'
www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/world-us-canada-52941258
It's surreal isn't it. I can't believe what we're all witnessing. Could you have stood behind him while he said that?
People can't understand how Hitler got so many followers....
It saddens me that Trump still has supporters. Very surreal. "
When I watched it last night I wondered how his advisors could have stood there supporting him. I'd rather be out of a job than sell my soul like that.
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Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
"
Pre industrial times ?
No thanks. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
Pre industrial times ?
No thanks."
I see the arguments being made to
"Go back" all the time to different economic points in history.
Economies don't go back...they go fforward. They innovate and grow thats the basis of capitalism.
Who wants to give up their office job to pick fruit?
The agricultural industry needs to innovate and not grow into mega corporations and just pull all the natural resources out the ground.
But actually create sustainable farming models that work and give people what they want |
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"Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
Pre industrial times ?
No thanks.
I see the arguments being made to
"Go back" all the time to different economic points in history.
Economies don't go back...they go fforward. They innovate and grow thats the basis of capitalism.
Who wants to give up their office job to pick fruit?
The agricultural industry needs to innovate and not grow into mega corporations and just pull all the natural resources out the ground.
But actually create sustainable farming models that work and give people what they want "
Capitalism is to die! It has ramped up not only climate change but also took away the balance between nature & death. It doesn't care for anything else but humans and the eco systems don't work like that.
People are sick because they are not outside, where humans are meant to be.
farming is sick because of the need for machinery & chemicals to replace what humans once did manually, there is no bio-diverisity in fields and the soil is dying. Set aside land at the edge of fields is not enough.
Fresh water is sick because of farming & it's chemicals plus all the other capitalist bullshit industries like fashion & plastic.
Oceans are sick with plastic waste and acidity levels are rising meaning shellfish, can't grow a shell.
Deforestation - capitalism again....the constant need & want for more, with no thought or care for any other creatures or their homes, food & water sources.
Oil - OMG oil, it has destroyed many water sources, food sources and caused so much pollution that it directly links to every problem we face in the world today.
Modern medicine - failure to care about any other species other than ourselves, test all on animals just to check it's safe first, components for vaccines and medicines need to be pulled from somewhere, they don't just come from thin air.
Obesity crisis - hmm don't more anywhere near what a human is designed to, eats food stuffed with man made nonsense to make it taste better, multiple medical issues & the cure is not in pills from big pharma who are liked to oil & only make money when folk are Ill.....
There is enough money in the world to correct and solve all the problems...problem is it is in the hands of the greedy few.
And don't give me it about sanitation & housing quality.....ancient civilizations knew how to manage these.
Capitalism doesn't work, it never did...merely an illusion of human progress and will be the downfall of we don't change. Wake up & don't be fooled by it. |
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"Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
Pre industrial times ?
No thanks.
I see the arguments being made to
"Go back" all the time to different economic points in history.
Economies don't go back...they go fforward. They innovate and grow thats the basis of capitalism.
Who wants to give up their office job to pick fruit?
The agricultural industry needs to innovate and not grow into mega corporations and just pull all the natural resources out the ground.
But actually create sustainable farming models that work and give people what they want
Capitalism is to die! It has ramped up not only climate change but also took away the balance between nature & death. It doesn't care for anything else but humans and the eco systems don't work like that.
People are sick because they are not outside, where humans are meant to be.
farming is sick because of the need for machinery & chemicals to replace what humans once did manually, there is no bio-diverisity in fields and the soil is dying. Set aside land at the edge of fields is not enough.
Fresh water is sick because of farming & it's chemicals plus all the other capitalist bullshit industries like fashion & plastic.
Oceans are sick with plastic waste and acidity levels are rising meaning shellfish, can't grow a shell.
Deforestation - capitalism again....the constant need & want for more, with no thought or care for any other creatures or their homes, food & water sources.
Oil - OMG oil, it has destroyed many water sources, food sources and caused so much pollution that it directly links to every problem we face in the world today.
Modern medicine - failure to care about any other species other than ourselves, test all on animals just to check it's safe first, components for vaccines and medicines need to be pulled from somewhere, they don't just come from thin air.
Obesity crisis - hmm don't more anywhere near what a human is designed to, eats food stuffed with man made nonsense to make it taste better, multiple medical issues & the cure is not in pills from big pharma who are liked to oil & only make money when folk are Ill.....
There is enough money in the world to correct and solve all the problems...problem is it is in the hands of the greedy few.
And don't give me it about sanitation & housing quality.....ancient civilizations knew how to manage these.
Capitalism doesn't work, it never did...merely an illusion of human progress and will be the downfall of we don't change. Wake up & don't be fooled by it. "
What a novel concept
I'll pass though |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Reed has-been struggling since last year with all the brexit uncertainty, Covid-19 made it worse.
The whole economy needs to change back to something more like pee industrial times...food farms are screaming for pickers....to the point they've had to fly in workers from abroad because even the boots that applied...most left. Food is vital resource, planes are not.
Aviation was already under threat with climate change & they know it, especially which the damning reports during corona showing how clear & clean the air can be without non essential industries ruining the place.
This will be long felt & everyone is gonna have to change, the evidence is becoming clearer each day that humans are in big trouble.
3 different weather patterns for the weekend yesterday all from same channel....they are losing the ability to predict and food sources need steady weather patterns.
Pre industrial times ?
No thanks.
I see the arguments being made to
"Go back" all the time to different economic points in history.
Economies don't go back...they go fforward. They innovate and grow thats the basis of capitalism.
Who wants to give up their office job to pick fruit?
The agricultural industry needs to innovate and not grow into mega corporations and just pull all the natural resources out the ground.
But actually create sustainable farming models that work and give people what they want
Capitalism is to die! It has ramped up not only climate change but also took away the balance between nature & death. It doesn't care for anything else but humans and the eco systems don't work like that.
People are sick because they are not outside, where humans are meant to be.
farming is sick because of the need for machinery & chemicals to replace what humans once did manually, there is no bio-diverisity in fields and the soil is dying. Set aside land at the edge of fields is not enough.
Fresh water is sick because of farming & it's chemicals plus all the other capitalist bullshit industries like fashion & plastic.
Oceans are sick with plastic waste and acidity levels are rising meaning shellfish, can't grow a shell.
Deforestation - capitalism again....the constant need & want for more, with no thought or care for any other creatures or their homes, food & water sources.
Oil - OMG oil, it has destroyed many water sources, food sources and caused so much pollution that it directly links to every problem we face in the world today.
Modern medicine - failure to care about any other species other than ourselves, test all on animals just to check it's safe first, components for vaccines and medicines need to be pulled from somewhere, they don't just come from thin air.
Obesity crisis - hmm don't more anywhere near what a human is designed to, eats food stuffed with man made nonsense to make it taste better, multiple medical issues & the cure is not in pills from big pharma who are liked to oil & only make money when folk are Ill.....
There is enough money in the world to correct and solve all the problems...problem is it is in the hands of the greedy few.
And don't give me it about sanitation & housing quality.....ancient civilizations knew how to manage these.
Capitalism doesn't work, it never did...merely an illusion of human progress and will be the downfall of we don't change. Wake up & don't be fooled by it. "
just wondering what device you are using to post this? wouldn’t be one that was invented, developed and sold as part of capitalism a capitalist market would it? |
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not when you buy second hand or refurbished. I rarely buy brand new products so no i'm not drawn in my the capitalist world.
I don't buy into marketing ploys of needing the latest things or upgrading every few years or need to have this fashion or that house etc.
i don't buy what I don't need, I repair, refurbish and replace with second hand anywhere I can.
my devices are at least 5 years old, none of the smart nonsense other than my phone which allows me to deny all permissions.
never bought a new car or one that isn't at least 10 years old, parts are the only new things and don't drive often...way under the 12k average per year and repair myself with mostly hand tools.
food I buy what i can't grow/keep & grow my own, compost food waste too.
plastic - I avoid as much as possible, take my own tap water in a bottle and a travel tea cup and recycle as much as possible.
these days internet & a device to access it are mandatory, even for the simplest of things like job searches and applications.
cinemas, pubs, entertainment venues etc are not a regular thing maybe once or twice a year.
electricity - scotland is at least 80% renewables now and i switch almost everything off at the plug (standby still uses 60% power) when its not being used so there's no large usage there either.
so no I largely don't follow a capitalist life.
We're not going to get a choice when capitalism collapses under it's own weight, everything has an end and capitalism in now.
I would like to have clean air, clean water and soil instead of dirt or desert for my life & that of my children's, thank you.
lets see who can say they are trying their best to combat climate change...6 yrs and counting down before the co2 max is reached. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
cinemas, pubs, entertainment venues etc are not a regular thing maybe once or twice a year.
. "
That's a rather boring existence.
I am only here once I would like to enjoy my time on earth thank you. |
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"not when you buy second hand or refurbished. I rarely buy brand new products so no i'm not drawn in my the capitalist world.
I don't buy into marketing ploys of needing the latest things or upgrading every few years or need to have this fashion or that house etc.
i don't buy what I don't need, I repair, refurbish and replace with second hand anywhere I can.
my devices are at least 5 years old, none of the smart nonsense other than my phone which allows me to deny all permissions.
never bought a new car or one that isn't at least 10 years old, parts are the only new things and don't drive often...way under the 12k average per year and repair myself with mostly hand tools.
food I buy what i can't grow/keep & grow my own, compost food waste too.
plastic - I avoid as much as possible, take my own tap water in a bottle and a travel tea cup and recycle as much as possible.
these days internet & a device to access it are mandatory, even for the simplest of things like job searches and applications.
cinemas, pubs, entertainment venues etc are not a regular thing maybe once or twice a year.
electricity - scotland is at least 80% renewables now and i switch almost everything off at the plug (standby still uses 60% power) when its not being used so there's no large usage there either.
so no I largely don't follow a capitalist life.
We're not going to get a choice when capitalism collapses under it's own weight, everything has an end and capitalism in now.
I would like to have clean air, clean water and soil instead of dirt or desert for my life & that of my children's, thank you.
lets see who can say they are trying their best to combat climate change...6 yrs and counting down before the co2 max is reached. "
How can anyone be "proud" to drive a car that probably pollutes more than ten modern vehicles, and old tech uses more electricity
Standby uses 60% power ... lmao
I'm afraid you may be deluded or something worse but you're entitled to your opinion I suppose, good luck with it |
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It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!! "
It is a scary to imagine what it will be like for future generations if this goes on much longer. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!! "
Peter Hitchens is alone in his opinions because they belong in a pat century.
Even his own brother didn't agree with him.
The UK government is no where near to collapse. They recently raised money through a bond issue and it was over subscribed.
Is the UK economy in a bad way..yes
Is the country broke...no
Thee are lots of ways to raise recenue. Most are politically favorable given bojos approval rating is lower than a pregnant belly I don't expect he'll be make bold choices.
Just more populus crap that supports the wealthy and keeps the lower classes at each others throats |
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It won't just be a matter as to how the statistics are compiled or publicised.... Real unemployment will be on a scale greater than that of the Depression in the 1930s, and the consequences just as dire, without even considering the possibility of war..
The only chance we have (if it's not already too late) is to end this imprisonment of the population NOW, and end the so-called "social" distancing - it is, on the contrary ANTI-SOCIAL.
All we need do is maintain normal good hygiene and good manners! |
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By *s.KerryTV/TS
over a year ago
Blackpool |
"It won't just be a matter as to how the statistics are compiled or publicised.... Real unemployment will be on a scale greater than that of the Depression in the 1930s, and the consequences just as dire, without even considering the possibility of war..
The only chance we have (if it's not already too late) is to end this imprisonment of the population NOW, and end the so-called "social" distancing - it is, on the contrary ANTI-SOCIAL.
All we need do is maintain normal good hygiene and good manners! "
So, despite all the evidence to the contrary, you're advocating going back to normality? |
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How can we measure against the economy of 300 years ago? Our metrics have changed and been refined even in the past 40 years.
But yes, a recession will potentially have a massive impact on people’s physical and mental health. It will need an interventionist government to address these issues which I can’t see happening. And as so often it will be the poor who are hit worst. |
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"It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!! "
Those, like yourself, here who advocate for a full return to your 'normality' refer to project fear, yet that is also what you are creating.
You provide no evidence and data,just rhetoric that only plays project fear at loud blast.
That isn't enough to be evaluated seriously. |
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By *s.KerryTV/TS
over a year ago
Blackpool |
"In a word, YES!
The "cure" is almost certainly more destructive than the virus! "
Tell that to the families of those that have lost their loved ones! The callous attitude of some people beggars belief in my opinion... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?
What's your point?
You seem to have been against lockdown from the beginning. Over 350 have died again today...and all you seem to harp on about is bloody money for ducks sake
money allows people to buy healthy food"
While others stockpiled loo roll I bought seeds |
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On the contrary - it does not take an economics professor to work out what happens when a country is unable to fund its public services.... you want evidence: I humbly offer oil-rich Venezuela as an example. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"In a word, YES!
The "cure" is almost certainly more destructive than the virus! "
"almost certainly" are you an epidemiologist or economist?
These are you opinions and that all the world has right now. Opinions.
It doesn't mean you can't have them but its does not make them facts because peter Hitchens wrote about in his column.
Nobody knows where the economy will be in 6-12 months that's why central banks are flooding trillions of dollars at them.
The us unemployment numbers shocked everyone last week being lower than expected.
You seem steadfast in your opinion though. My moto is plan for the worst hope for the best. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In a word, YES!
The "cure" is almost certainly more destructive than the virus!
"almost certainly" are you an epidemiologist or economist?
These are you opinions and that all the world has right now. Opinions.
It doesn't mean you can't have them but its does not make them facts because peter Hitchens wrote about in his column.
Nobody knows where the economy will be in 6-12 months that's why central banks are flooding trillions of dollars at them.
The us unemployment numbers shocked everyone last week being lower than expected.
You seem steadfast in your opinion though. My moto is plan for the worst hope for the best."
As Newcastle fans we do that a lot.
Plan for the worst and hope for the best. |
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An economist, actually.
If I recall, the epidemiologists got the AIDS forecasts in Africa spectacularly wrong, and whilst I don't pretend to have the powers of fortune-tellers, I submit that economists tend to have a greater grip on reality than most, despite their failure to be 100% right 100 % of the time. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"An economist, actually.
If I recall, the epidemiologists got the AIDS forecasts in Africa spectacularly wrong, and whilst I don't pretend to have the powers of fortune-tellers, I submit that economists tend to have a greater grip on reality than most, despite their failure to be 100% right 100 % of the time. "
I have economics degree and career in finance.
So I'm interested what is the basis of for you analysis? As others have said all we see is rhetoric.
You are entitled to your opinion but that does not make them facts |
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By *s.KerryTV/TS
over a year ago
Blackpool |
"Me too - 25 years in insurance.... I spent my working life in underwriting - risk assessment! "
So please enlighten us just how you risk assessed your earlier statement saying we should immediately resume normality? |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Me too - 25 years in insurance.... I spent my working life in underwriting - risk assessment! "
We have a lot of over lap then.
I have also been an underwriter, financial and insurance.
My experience of people in the industry is over opinionated people who don't under understand the job is not to eliminate risk.
But to price risk accordingly
So I ask you again. You believe your opinion is right and that your prerogative. But what is your analysis? |
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"It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!! "
The gmnt has just spunked hundreds of millions on a train
We wont run out of money. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Again, may I refer you to Venezuela for the evidence you seek "
Venezuela is a banana republic...
The UK is an establish economy that is not reliant on one sole export.
hardly the great economic analysis and insight I was expecting from you.
I'll counter it with the last 3 ex UK chancellors breaking down the UK economy for you.
https://youtu.be/oeWFruYa600 |
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Whether or not Venezuela is a "banana Republic" - a derogatory term if ever I saw one - or an oil-based economy, is hardly the point though is it...only the RESULTS of mismanagement, which I contend, are plain for all to see.
|
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"
cinemas, pubs, entertainment venues etc are not a regular thing maybe once or twice a year.
That's a rather boring existence.
I am only here once I would like to enjoy my time on earth thank you."
How is not giving my hard earned money to over priced entertainment services boring? It's smart.
That just shows you don't know how to enjoy life without someone else entertaining you, I do.
Your thought pattern is exactly the problem, "screw it, I'm gonna do it because I can regardless of cost to others...." that's if you even know what the costs maybe (BTW I'm not taking money). |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Whether or not Venezuela is a "banana Republic" - a derogatory term if ever I saw one - or an oil-based economy, is hardly the point though is it...only the RESULTS of mismanagement, which I contend, are plain for all to see.
"
A banana republic is recognized economic term.
I suggest you stop worry about the government and ask for a refund for your economic degree if you are so worried about the recession.
I and others have asked you for the basis of your opinions and you have provided none.
Again you are entitled to an opinion but maybe get an informed one from across the spectrum rather than what Hitchens is dribbling on about and why England isn't like when he grew up.
If you want some really cognitive dissonance watch him debate his brother. |
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"
How can anyone be "proud" to drive a car that probably pollutes more than ten modern vehicles, and old tech uses more electricity
Standby uses 60% power ... lmao
I'm afraid you may be deluded or something worse but you're entitled to your opinion I suppose, good luck with it "
Deluded, nope.
My cars are Japanese so they have an egr system as standard which recirculated exhaust gases through the engine & lowers them, it's mandatory in Japan for co2 & nox to be measured & regulated and has been since the late 80's
have hydrogen bubblers in them to lower emissions again
I keep them in good working order - lowers them again
Don't actually drive that much maybe 6000 per annum if your lucky - so I'm way below most people's car usage and I won't travel stupid miles to get to work like alot of folk do (Manchester to London for example) so that lowers them again.
The mileage my cars have done is way way below average for their years.
Oh yes, I do have more than 1 car, can only drove one at once though, they can't all pollute at once.
I can bet my electricity usage is less than yours even with old tech. Standby does use alot of energy & yes it's 60%, chargers plugged in but with no device attached to charge also continue to pull energy.
Just switch off what your not using...pretty simple.
Go watch dirty streaming and see how much a 2 sec vid actually costs the environment.
I also plant trees, veg & flowers so I'm carbon neutral. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I don't think the world had recessions in 1720 AD, so the worst one in three centuries sounds like scaremongering.
Did this come from the BBC/Sky/C4 News/Guardian/Independent/New European axis by any chance? |
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"
How can anyone be "proud" to drive a car that probably pollutes more than ten modern vehicles, and old tech uses more electricity
Standby uses 60% power ... lmao
I'm afraid you may be deluded or something worse but you're entitled to your opinion I suppose, good luck with it
Deluded, nope.
My cars are Japanese so they have an egr system as standard which recirculated exhaust gases through the engine & lowers them, it's mandatory in Japan for co2 & nox to be measured & regulated and has been since the late 80's
have hydrogen bubblers in them to lower emissions again
I keep them in good working order - lowers them again
Don't actually drive that much maybe 6000 per annum if your lucky - so I'm way below most people's car usage and I won't travel stupid miles to get to work like alot of folk do (Manchester to London for example) so that lowers them again.
The mileage my cars have done is way way below average for their years.
Oh yes, I do have more than 1 car, can only drove one at once though, they can't all pollute at once.
I can bet my electricity usage is less than yours even with old tech. Standby does use alot of energy & yes it's 60%, chargers plugged in but with no device attached to charge also continue to pull energy.
Just switch off what your not using...pretty simple.
Go watch dirty streaming and see how much a 2 sec vid actually costs the environment.
I also plant trees, veg & flowers so I'm carbon neutral. "
Lol |
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The fact that it is, indeed, a recognised term, does not make it less derogatory, of course!
Failed States fail for a variety of underlying reasons, but there is a common thread in most cases of, in effect, paying themselves, in terms of the provision of services for their populace, more than their economy can sustain. The term "cutting one's cloth" springs to mind, and that isn't Economics, that is reasonable commonsense.
Of course, there can be a "chicken and egg" debate, which is why I have no desire to debate Economic Theory.... it gets tiresome, as you are doubtless aware! |
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"It is perfectly obvious, to anyone prepared to give it a little bit of real thought, what your point is, and I, for one, wholeheartedly agree.
Those on here who complain that some of us are putting the Economy and western civilisation above loss of life, real, imagined or exaggerated, have really allowed the new Project Fear to cloud their judgment..... Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?
The devastation which we are bringing upon ourselves is too great to fully comprehend.
Peter Hitchens seems to be a lone voice....
We, or to be more precise, our children will have to face unimagined hardship!!
Those, like yourself, here who advocate for a full return to your 'normality' refer to project fear, yet that is also what you are creating.
You provide no evidence and data,just rhetoric that only plays project fear at loud blast.
That isn't enough to be evaluated seriously. "
Still nowt! You couldn't make it up, it's that farcical |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"The fact that it is, indeed, a recognised term, does not make it less derogatory, of course!
Failed States fail for a variety of underlying reasons, but there is a common thread in most cases of, in effect, paying themselves, in terms of the provision of services for their populace, more than their economy can sustain. The term "cutting one's cloth" springs to mind, and that isn't Economics, that is reasonable commonsense.
Of course, there can be a "chicken and egg" debate, which is why I have no desire to debate Economic Theory.... it gets tiresome, as you are doubtless aware! "
For someone who doesn't want to debate your doing a lot to justify your point.
You are describing the economy like it's a company balance sheet.
Yes it takes a balance approached but your argument is slowly shifting from it has to be one way only and job losses WILL HAPPEN to well actually their is two sides to the argument.
This is conservative economic theory. They say there is no money for public spending but as soon as a crisis hits the "magic money tree" appears.
Instead of attempt to argue with me an weaken your position further. Read around what I am saying and expand your view.
I don't discredit your opinion but I don't think anyone can say with conviction "THIS AND ONLY THIS WILL HAPPEN"
The economy is an recession and each recession is unique we have never seen anything like this in modern times |
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"Who, I wonder, will be the first to complain about the cessation of all public services (the NHS, Defence, Education for example) because the Government, whoever it may be, has virtually no tax income to fund the said services?"
Nobody need complain; if the government taxes the fuck out of the likes of you, to pay for it all. They can increase your council tax. They can tax your pension even further. They'll only need to do it for the few years that they transform the economy from what it was, into what it needs to be, creating new jobs in the process.
Why not do all that? You got away largely unscathed by "Austerity"; where the poor and vulnerable had spending on them slashed, so that you could pay lower taxes and that your house would maintain most of its over-inflated price.
It's your turn to cough up - the poor already did and they have no money left.
Just because you don't like change, doesn't mean it's not an option. There's more than one way to run a successful economy - not just the one that suits you. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
The reason this will be a particularly challenging recession is that it’s world wide and the fact that the biggest economies are now at loggerheads. Add into the mix Brexit, and it’s looking like a challenging time for the uk |
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Rather than taxation, treasury bonds (a fixed term investment) could raise funds but...
I wonder what the Standard & Poors rating of UK Economy will be after Covid19.
Who would want to buy UK Treasury bonds even if they would go cheap after this insanity? Resource rich countries might get a bargain (even if developed economies are using far less for the time being) and in future pull the strings like OPEC did to the world economy 50 years ago.
Equity markets will be depressed for some time which will have an effect on savings and investments, possibly on pension funds (which scares me).
How about a command economy? A Roosevelt style 'New Deal'?
Enough rambling. 'We're all Doomed'
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"It will be what it will be...
what if it's worse than the morbidity rate of covid-19?
What's your point?
You seem to have been against lockdown from the beginning. Over 350 have died again today...and all you seem to harp on about is bloody money for ducks sake
money allows people to buy healthy food
Tell that to the hundreds queueing up for kfc and Maccy D's"
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Ye gods - "taxing the fuck out of the likes of you..."
By what divine means have you been able to assess my own situation?
I wish I had your omnipotence...!
For your information, I neither own my own house nor ever have done;I am retired and get by on less than £1500 per month, with only PIP and state pension from the State. |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Rather than taxation, treasury bonds (a fixed term investment) could raise funds but...
I wonder what the Standard & Poors rating of UK Economy will be after Covid19.
Who would want to buy UK Treasury bonds even if they would go cheap after this insanity? Resource rich countries might get a bargain (even if developed economies are using far less for the time being) and in future pull the strings like OPEC did to the world economy 50 years ago.
Equity markets will be depressed for some time which will have an effect on savings and investments, possibly on pension funds (which scares me).
How about a command economy? A Roosevelt style 'New Deal'?
Enough rambling. 'We're all Doomed'
"
Everything you have said is the complete opposite of how every major economy you have mentioned will react.
UK bonds are over subscribe
And taxation is used to pay back the interest on this borrowing not
The recent crash in oil price to negative figures show opec has an abundant resource the world does need in the same volume it once did. Opec plus is done. These countries have left it to late to diversify away from the (banana republic) economies
Equity markets are though the roof and almost back to pre covid levels
All whilst America burns whith the scent of civil war in the air.
Markets can stay irrational
Longer than most people can stay solvent
Once again nobody knows where this all heading past the next quarter results |
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By *s.KerryTV/TS
over a year ago
Blackpool |
"Ye gods - "taxing the fuck out of the likes of you..."
By what divine means have you been able to assess my own situation?
I wish I had your omnipotence...!
For your information, I neither own my own house nor ever have done;I am retired and get by on less than £1500 per month, with only PIP and state pension from the State. "
You have still however not answered any questions put to you over how you formed this opinion you originally stated? |
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Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business |
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"Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business"
I'm sure someone will explain that? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business
I'm sure someone will explain that?"
I will drink whatever he is d*unk on |
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
This post is bring out all the nut jobs and crazy conspiracy theories without anyone asking.
Or comments about the economy with no understanding what the economy is how it is driven
I prefer to educate than mock so before we get more comments about the economy being run my demonic lizard people.
A break down of what an economy actually is for those who are interested
https://youtu.be/PHe0bXAIuk0 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
Yep, many Suicides. |
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"Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business"
I think what is meant is:
Red button = nuke war & with so many nuke nations it'd be done in a blink of an eye with long lasting major effects.
Covid-19 - I'm presuming this is in reference to the suspected lab escapism.
The queen - is not state funded for the most part, their money comes from tourism, speeches etc so the queen is in just as much of a state as many businesses and she can no longer demand it from her citizens.
No idea about the case unless it's that she's from German routes not British therefore not a true British monarch or along those lines.
Police - what we see as "public services" are no long "public services" they are Ltd, corporations or charities by law so they are businesses in their own right.
I think, could be entirely wrong.
full stops & commas would help with the reading |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business
I think what is meant is:
Red button = nuke war & with so many nuke nations it'd be done in a blink of an eye with long lasting major effects.
Covid-19 - I'm presuming this is in reference to the suspected lab escapism.
The queen - is not state funded for the most part, their money comes from tourism, speeches etc so the queen is in just as much of a state as many businesses and she can no longer demand it from her citizens.
No idea about the case unless it's that she's from German routes not British therefore not a true British monarch or along those lines.
Police - what we see as "public services" are no long "public services" they are Ltd, corporations or charities by law so they are businesses in their own right.
I think, could be entirely wrong.
full stops & commas would help with the reading "
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By *arksxMan
over a year ago
Leicester / London |
"Usually Wars reset the clock and wipe the slate clean Second World War 19 million people died of starvation World War III red Buttons no more world covid-19 now they call coronavirus because the scientists say they're missing 6 important tests this is just the common cold but what a clever way to avoid World War III the countries bankrupt a queen isn't the Queen you can only be a queen through blood that's been lost case law John Anthony Hill 2011 and I could keep going on and on look at all the top police don't wear uniforms anymore more it's all business
I think what is meant is:
Red button = nuke war & with so many nuke nations it'd be done in a blink of an eye with long lasting major effects.
Covid-19 - I'm presuming this is in reference to the suspected lab escapism.
The queen - is not state funded for the most part, their money comes from tourism, speeches etc so the queen is in just as much of a state as many businesses and she can no longer demand it from her citizens.
No idea about the case unless it's that she's from German routes not British therefore not a true British monarch or along those lines.
Police - what we see as "public services" are no long "public services" they are Ltd, corporations or charities by law so they are businesses in their own right.
I think, could be entirely wrong.
full stops & commas would help with the reading "
I disagree with pretty much everything in your own posts but fuck me
How did work all that...there must be some kind of conspiracy code I don't know how to read
10/10 |
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You just don't see it the way I do, I'm good at big scale/small scale & puzzles...a-z via m,d,t,l etc first..I see links everywhere, can't help it.
Usually I'm projecting what's needed on mass scale, many don't want to believe climate change or can't see how their "small actions" cause big events.....billions of people doing the same and butterfly effect. because it's too big to comprehend as real, like trying to explain the quantum theory to most I suppose.
This one is what's already happening at least in theory or suspicion. |
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"Wrong forum in my opinion for this topic
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I'm not sure there's much solid content or theme. There's certainly a general lack of evidence and sound reasoning from the leads. The left-field way out there thinking, I guess I can call it thinking, traversing the weird and wonderful, is reminiscent of an infection upon another |
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
"And" what are you saying that we should have just carried on as normal and the death toll would have been in the hundreds of thousands, it is what it is. |
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"if we are in for a global recession - and the recession in the uk is the worst for 300 years - has anyone calculated the health impacts of such a recession?"
i have |
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