FabSwingers.com > Forums > Virus > Am I really alone in my thoughts?
Am I really alone in my thoughts?
Jump to: Newest in thread
 |
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
There is a huge condemnation of people "breaking" the rules. Rightly so buuuuuut, in doing so I believe we're achieving population immunity at a much reduced spread
I also believe that the govt is monitoring it and will put us on full lockdown should numbers be too high.
Your thoughts... |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *abs..Woman
over a year ago
.. |
You can achieve it without people breaking the rules. Naturally people are going to work, keyworkers etc, schools are open, it has plenty of opportunity to spread I think. The problem with lots of people breaking the rules is that the numbers could swell rapidly and we all know what that means. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
As much as I agree with population immunity I dont necessarily agree with breaking the rules.
Do we bend them? Yes, most people will. Ie. I probably go to the shop more often than I should but for me the mental health aspect of this is huge so it's a slight bend in the rules. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"You can achieve it without people breaking the rules. Naturally people are going to work, keyworkers etc, schools are open, it has plenty of opportunity to spread I think. The problem with lots of people breaking the rules is that the numbers could swell rapidly and we all know what that means. "
Absolutely, which is why the govt stresses the rules.
I also feel that, as reports earlier stated 20(-30),000 troops are ready to aid the NHS and police. Obviously many are assisting conversions of buildings into makeshift hospitals. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth "
I think they are assuming most of us are going to get it. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth "
Completely agree here. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth "
Exactly. And I think it's better to have a majority compliant than enforcement.
I just wish people wouldn't be so vehement in their condemnation. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth
I think they are assuming most of us are going to get it."
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
"
True if we just use lockdown it will rise again and again, not sure we can afford to keep going into lockdown. You can't beat a virus by hiding from it, you have to kill it or catch it. That's nature and if people think sitting at home is going to beat it think again. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"As much as I agree with population immunity I dont necessarily agree with breaking the rules.
Do we bend them? Yes, most people will. Ie. I probably go to the shop more often than I should but for me the mental health aspect of this is huge so it's a slight bend in the rules."
Understandable. I actually enjoyed my trip for food shopping  .
I think what we should primarily respect, is the shielding of the most vulnerable - those who will have to wait for a vaccine. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
I think people are not taking the lockdown for real. The traffic around here is like the rush hours, never heard so may cars on the move at the same time here.Two young couples with little kids loaded up their cars with buckets an spades an off they all went. I wonder how many more doing the same.So much for a slow release. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"As much as I agree with population immunity I dont necessarily agree with breaking the rules.
Do we bend them? Yes, most people will. Ie. I probably go to the shop more often than I should but for me the mental health aspect of this is huge so it's a slight bend in the rules.
Understandable. I actually enjoyed my trip for food shopping .
I think what we should primarily respect, is the shielding of the most vulnerable - those who will have to wait for a vaccine. "
Honestly, if it was just me I had to worry about then I'd take the chance but with secondary transmission it becomes much more complicated |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it? "
To put it succinctly, the immune system produces antigens and killer (B) cells to fight subsequent exposures to any pathogen (ie a disease causing microbe) so the theory is yes. But less face it, the human body is extremely complex. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago
Beyond the shadows. |
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
"
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
"
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem "
Source? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one. "
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem "
And you know this how? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it? "
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem "
*********************
May I ask you the source of this great news?
Eva  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it. "
Source of both please. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
"
Immunity isn’t fully understood. So 2 is actually a maybe. Reinfection is a concern. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago
Beyond the shadows. |
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one.
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
"
Most things comes with side effects. I might decide to cross the road the side effect of that is I might get knocked down by a car but I usually mitigate that risk by looking left and right before I cross the road. The alternative to not taking the vaccine when its available is that when you get the virus you may be fine or you may develop complications and not be fine, so there’s risks either way.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one.
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
Most things comes with side effects. I might decide to cross the road the side effect of that is I might get knocked down by a car but I usually mitigate that risk by looking left and right before I cross the road. The alternative to not taking the vaccine when its available is that when you get the virus you may be fine or you may develop complications and not be fine, so there’s risks either way.
"
But you can't mitigate any risks taking medicine or vaccines. I mean I'm not against them but the crossing the road analogy is just ridiculous |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?"
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry . |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
"
For how long?
No shops, no food, no nothing for potentially month after month after month...
Is that your solution, starve the population to death before the virus wipes us out.
Thankfully we have people making policy that are using common sense  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one.
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
Most things comes with side effects. I might decide to cross the road the side effect of that is I might get knocked down by a car but I usually mitigate that risk by looking left and right before I cross the road. The alternative to not taking the vaccine when its available is that when you get the virus you may be fine or you may develop complications and not be fine, so there’s risks either way.
"
I doubt that initially it will be universally available. It will be those highly vulnerable people first. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry . "
Please, take no offence to the fact that I'm not inclined to believe this. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem "
I'm kinda hoping if someone creates a vaccine the drug code will be released to every country so they can build their own production and distribution networks. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Bill Gates and his super rich mates are pushing for mass forced vaccination I wonder why?
We must tread carefully and make sure we know what they are pumping into us, and not just jump in for the quick fix. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
This herd immunity thing is all very good, but getting it is going to cost lives.
I have absolutely no intention of becoming a statistic so I'm not going to play that game and will stay put for as long as it takes. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It’s not just to buy us time staff wise, there are only a limited amount of ventilators. If everyone got Ill now many would die because they wouldn’t get the breathing support they need and other medications and equipment, if it’s slower, the equipment can be reused and more people have a chance of surviving. It really is more like pneumonia than a common cold, sadly the people the virus is available to is the people we need. I just hope we don’t run out of key workers. Especially the trained/skilled ones, that’s when we will be In trouble. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"This herd immunity thing is all very good, but getting it is going to cost lives.
I have absolutely no intention of becoming a statistic so I'm not going to play that game and will stay put for as long as it takes."
If you're staying put how are you going to get all of those essentials? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *obka3Couple
over a year ago
bournemouth |
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
For how long?
No shops, no food, no nothing for potentially month after month after month...
Is that your solution, starve the population to death before the virus wipes us out.
Thankfully we have people making policy that are using common sense "
Also no power no water or sewage, no food production , I would estimate nearly 20% of workers are still hard at it, the nhs is nearly 1.5 million on its own nearly 7% of the work force. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
For how long?
No shops, no food, no nothing for potentially month after month after month...
Is that your solution, starve the population to death before the virus wipes us out.
Thankfully we have people making policy that are using common sense "
How long do you think the emergency services would work knowing their families were stuck at home with no electricity, water, gas, food and phones/intenet etc!
Not really a solution but more of a problem!
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The queue to the fish shop is unbelievable....yes I know it's Good Friday but theres hardly 2ft between them ffs  "
Ive just kifted out two large whiting fillets. Caught off Looe back end of last autumn. Frozen within hours of me catching....got more in freezer!! |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry . "
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
I think further stringent measures would simply be like other countries have done, needing a "permission slip". No daily exercises, no dog walking, shopping locally etc. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. "
I'd be more concerned about lack of rigorous testing of new vaccines. And lack of rigorous testing of existing medications on this actual virus so success rate can be established. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. "
Do you not think they have been working none stop on a vaccine since this virus came out ?
It’s more than likely being produced now as we speak
Imagine if they put it out on the 10pm news the minute they made the break thru
Can you imagine the annomosity it would cause
I’m sure it will be announced once supply’s and access is in place |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. "
They have a vaccine it's under trials now try watching the news, waiting release soon as it's passed. This was said by a government medical adviser. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it.
Source of both please. "
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/health/coronavirus-immunity-antibodies.html
nature.com articles /s41591-020-0819-2
jamanetwork.com/journals /jama/fullarticle/2762452
cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective /2020/03/study-highlights-ease-spread-covid-19-viruses
sciencespeaksblog immune-survivors-of-covid-19-protective-antibody-for-treatment-and-prophylaxis/
A search engine will show links to plasma from recovered patients being used to fight the infection.
The amount of the virus you have been exposed to may be a factor in whether you develop immunity
You'll have to delete the spaces for the links to work |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. "
Maybe they should have informed you first
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Bill Gates and his super rich mates are pushing for mass forced vaccination I wonder why?
We must tread carefully and make sure we know what they are pumping into us, and not just jump in for the quick fix. "
You can tread as carefully as you want, but once a vaccine becomes available I'll be having the shot. I'd rather take my chances with that than the virus.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Bill Gates and his super rich mates are pushing for mass forced vaccination I wonder why?
We must tread carefully and make sure we know what they are pumping into us, and not just jump in for the quick fix.
You can tread as carefully as you want, but once a vaccine becomes available I'll be having the shot. I'd rather take my chances with that than the virus.
"
One more sheep for the dip |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"This herd immunity thing is all very good, but getting it is going to cost lives.
I have absolutely no intention of becoming a statistic so I'm not going to play that game and will stay put for as long as it takes.
If you're staying put how are you going to get all of those essentials?"
I pwrhaps have a different perspective on what is considered essential.
I live quite a simple lifestyle so what I have will last several months, anything I run out of I'll do without. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *litterbabeWoman
over a year ago
hiding from cock pics. |
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva. "
it must be true as its on social media. Source Facebook |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
It's way too early to say there's a vaccination with absolute certainty.
• They only started trials in the past few weeks. It will take at least months of testing after the 1st wave and subsequent waves of trials.
• Tests for antibodies after infection have shown they are weak and short lived the body hasn't been able to build viable antibodies which is why there is reinfection occurrences.
• the pharmaceutical companies have to prove its majority of success with minimal side effects from the trials before innoculating the public
So for a vaccine that works it will be months. They still haven't produced a successful vaccine for SARS yet and it's been years of trying.
The body fails to build quality antibodies against this virus. The antibodies for SARS last only a couple of years. Which is lower average compared to other antibodies whereas covid 19 it's less than months barely weeks.
How do you vaccinate when the body cannot produce antibodies that protect in the long term?
More needs to be done finding people who have better antibodies in order to manipulate them in others it's the only way besides forcing the body to produce the antibodies multiple times hoping it makes stronger ones to combat the virus and praying the virus doesn't continue to rapidly mutate. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"This herd immunity thing is all very good, but getting it is going to cost lives.
I have absolutely no intention of becoming a statistic so I'm not going to play that game and will stay put for as long as it takes.
If you're staying put how are you going to get all of those essentials?
I pwrhaps have a different perspective on what is considered essential.
I live quite a simple lifestyle so what I have will last several months, anything I run out of I'll do without."
Does this include food? Because if it does include food I'd be inclined to ask why you have stockpiled such essentials. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *litterbabeWoman
over a year ago
hiding from cock pics. |
"There is a huge condemnation of people "breaking" the rules. Rightly so buuuuuut, in doing so I believe we're achieving population immunity at a much reduced spread
I also believe that the govt is monitoring it and will put us on full lockdown should numbers be too high.
Your thoughts... "
I agree, and as you said on another thread, I think it is part of their strategy. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Bill Gates and his super rich mates are pushing for mass forced vaccination I wonder why?
We must tread carefully and make sure we know what they are pumping into us, and not just jump in for the quick fix.
You can tread as carefully as you want, but once a vaccine becomes available I'll be having the shot. I'd rather take my chances with that than the virus.
One more sheep for the dip "
Whatever. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth
Exactly. And I think it's better to have a majority compliant than enforcement.
I just wish people wouldn't be so vehement in their condemnation. "
This is my stance
I agree with the rules
I'd like people to stick to them
I know some will bend them
And some will completely disregard them
I not only do not condone those who completely disregard the rules I think they need education and a punishment
However the grey area between. the vehement aggression projected is worrying in itself
We could be in this months
John who bought his wife an Easter egg does not deserve the venom
Nor does Sarah running in her deserted local woods that she drove 10 minutes to to avoid all people
These are weird times but some rhetoric from all positions can be a bit unsettling????
I'm for making lock down as comfortable as practicable whilst keeping infection rates manageable and PREDICTABLE and needless deaths
Suicide , poor medicine access , ventilator over subscription ,services not maintained
For example no mot
Sounds great will prevent infections very good
However at least one person will die from a brake pipe failing etc
Lock down is a balancing act
It has dangers in itself
Holier than thou finger wagging is hmmm
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"There is a huge condemnation of people "breaking" the rules. Rightly so buuuuuut, in doing so I believe we're achieving population immunity at a much reduced spread
I also believe that the govt is monitoring it and will put us on full lockdown should numbers be too high.
Your thoughts...
I agree, and as you said on another thread, I think it is part of their strategy. "
Awww someone took note  , thank you .
In days before the lockdown, the measures included being told to stay away from pubs, clubs etc but they didn't tell these same business to close. IMO, the govt knew pockets of individuals wouldn't listen but I don't think they thought the numbers would be so high and hence shortly followed it up with orders to close these businesses.
Now it doesn't matter what political allegiance you have, the government is made up of some highly intelligent people, these occurrences would have been proposed. They also sought advice from behavioural specialists.
Having these opinions and then reading others', especially how the govt has acted and should have acted, I find quite humorous.
Apologies if that hurts  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"
Does this include food? Because if it does include food I'd be inclined to ask why you have stockpiled such essentials."
Of course it includes food.
Stockpiled is such an emotive term isn't it?
I live alone and have a bog standard small chest freezer which has nothing in it that isn't easily available and in plentiful supply.
I eat one meal a day, I don't comfort eat inbetween and only cook what I can eat to prevent wastage.
That's not stockpiling, that's the way I've always lived. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"There is a huge condemnation of people "breaking" the rules. Rightly so buuuuuut, in doing so I believe we're achieving population immunity at a much reduced spread
I also believe that the govt is monitoring it and will put us on full lockdown should numbers be too high.
Your thoughts...
I agree, and as you said on another thread, I think it is part of their strategy.
Awww someone took note , thank you .
In days before the lockdown, the measures included being told to stay away from pubs, clubs etc but they didn't tell these same business to close. IMO, the govt knew pockets of individuals wouldn't listen but I don't think they thought the numbers would be so high and hence shortly followed it up with orders to close these businesses.
Now it doesn't matter what political allegiance you have, the government is made up of some highly intelligent people, these occurrences would have been proposed. They also sought advice from behavioural specialists.
Having these opinions and then reading others', especially how the govt has acted and should have acted, I find quite humorous.
Apologies if that hurts "
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The queue to the fish shop is unbelievable....yes I know it's Good Friday but theres hardly 2ft between them ffs
Ive just kifted out two large whiting fillets. Caught off Looe back end of last autumn. Frozen within hours of me catching....got more in freezer!!"
I'll make do with my tesco finest cod fillets that are frozen at sea thanks |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth
Exactly. And I think it's better to have a majority compliant than enforcement.
I just wish people wouldn't be so vehement in their condemnation.
This is my stance
I agree with the rules
I'd like people to stick to them
I know some will bend them
And some will completely disregard them
I not only do not condone those who completely disregard the rules I think they need education and a punishment
However the grey area between. the vehement aggression projected is worrying in itself
We could be in this months
John who bought his wife an Easter egg does not deserve the venom
Nor does Sarah running in her deserted local woods that she drove 10 minutes to to avoid all people
These are weird times but some rhetoric from all positions can be a bit unsettling????
I'm for making lock down as comfortable as practicable whilst keeping infection rates manageable and PREDICTABLE and needless deaths
Suicide , poor medicine access , ventilator over subscription ,services not maintained
For example no mot
Sounds great will prevent infections very good
However at least one person will die from a brake pipe failing etc
Lock down is a balancing act
It has dangers in itself
Holier than thou finger wagging is hmmm
"
As with quite a few of your posts, you bring to the table valid points.
I do hope you don't think I'm finger wagging  . (a) people on here can be so aggressive towards others on here and on the outside but one loses an argument when name-calling begins. I would like to see more empathy. I for one have mentioned educating of, and then fining people for successive infringements. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it.
Source of both please.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/health/coronavirus-immunity-antibodies.html
nature.com articles /s41591-020-0819-2
jamanetwork.com/journals /jama/fullarticle/2762452
cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective /2020/03/study-highlights-ease-spread-covid-19-viruses
sciencespeaksblog immune-survivors-of-covid-19-protective-antibody-for-treatment-and-prophylaxis/
A search engine will show links to plasma from recovered patients being used to fight the infection.
The amount of the virus you have been exposed to may be a factor in whether you develop immunity
You'll have to delete the spaces for the links to work"
I'll look at some of them later, thanks. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"If the government were 100% serious there would be no working apart from emergency services
I think the plan is to have the virus slowly released so a limited impact on NHS, immunity by stealth
Exactly. And I think it's better to have a majority compliant than enforcement.
I just wish people wouldn't be so vehement in their condemnation.
This is my stance
I agree with the rules
I'd like people to stick to them
I know some will bend them
And some will completely disregard them
I not only do not condone those who completely disregard the rules I think they need education and a punishment
However the grey area between. the vehement aggression projected is worrying in itself
We could be in this months
John who bought his wife an Easter egg does not deserve the venom
Nor does Sarah running in her deserted local woods that she drove 10 minutes to to avoid all people
These are weird times but some rhetoric from all positions can be a bit unsettling????
I'm for making lock down as comfortable as practicable whilst keeping infection rates manageable and PREDICTABLE and needless deaths
Suicide , poor medicine access , ventilator over subscription ,services not maintained
For example no mot
Sounds great will prevent infections very good
However at least one person will die from a brake pipe failing etc
Lock down is a balancing act
It has dangers in itself
Holier than thou finger wagging is hmmm
As with quite a few of your posts, you bring to the table valid points.
I do hope you don't think I'm finger wagging . (a) people on here can be so aggressive towards others on here and on the outside but one loses an argument when name-calling begins. I would like to see more empathy. I for one have mentioned educating of, and then fining people for successive infringements. "
My (b) is errrrrmmmmm forgotten  . The result of a brain infection |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
To put it succinctly, the immune system produces antigens and killer (B) cells to fight subsequent exposures to any pathogen (ie a disease causing microbe) so the theory is yes. But less face it, the human body is extremely complex. "
Yeah I agree, we can only try and apply logic and hope its right.
I had swine flu in 2009 and I'm Convinced my immune system is stronger, I've not had the flu since, any cold I get never lasts more than a day or 2 and never gets to a point where I can't function. However I did think I had the flu last December, first time I've not been able to shake it in 2 days.... I'm not one for Conspiracies, so could have been just the flu and my flu immunity has outlived its life span, or I had something in December that my body didn't recognise and couldn't fight off as well it has in the past... I guess I'll never really know |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *HaRiFMan
over a year ago
Beyond the shadows. |
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one.
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
Most things comes with side effects. I might decide to cross the road the side effect of that is I might get knocked down by a car but I usually mitigate that risk by looking left and right before I cross the road. The alternative to not taking the vaccine when its available is that when you get the virus you may be fine or you may develop complications and not be fine, so there’s risks either way.
But you can't mitigate any risks taking medicine or vaccines. I mean I'm not against them but the crossing the road analogy is just ridiculous "
The mitigation is done when it’s developed via clinical trials which is why it takes so long (Now before you say it I know it doesn’t reduce all risks). Also you can reduce some of the risks of side effects when taking medication for example If you take Ramipril the leaflet that comes with the medication advises not to drink grapefruit juice so you don’t drink Grapefruit juice. Theres a risk either way be it small or large in what ever we decide to do so weigh up the information available and do what you think is best for you. But anyways I’m probably digressing from the original topic so I’ll leave it at that. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
Source?"
It was discussed in a panorama documentary earlier this week. However, it’s a synthetic vaccine developed from the data China released to scientists. It can be produced quickly once they are sure it works... therein lies the wait until it’s gone through clinical trials and is licenced |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Ultimately it would be better for the nation's health than having to vaccinate billions of people worldwide. As medications do not come without side-effects.
I don’t see how as the vaccine may probably be some weakened form of the virus to allow us to develop immunity without it killing us. But anyhow the virus as it is comes with side effects too death being a big one.
Do you never read the information leaflet that comes with medications and vaccines. There are side-effects.
Most things comes with side effects. I might decide to cross the road the side effect of that is I might get knocked down by a car but I usually mitigate that risk by looking left and right before I cross the road. The alternative to not taking the vaccine when its available is that when you get the virus you may be fine or you may develop complications and not be fine, so there’s risks either way.
But you can't mitigate any risks taking medicine or vaccines. I mean I'm not against them but the crossing the road analogy is just ridiculous
The mitigation is done when it’s developed via clinical trials which is why it takes so long (Now before you say it I know it doesn’t reduce all risks). Also you can reduce some of the risks of side effects when taking medication for example If you take Ramipril the leaflet that comes with the medication advises not to drink grapefruit juice so you don’t drink Grapefruit juice. Theres a risk either way be it small or large in what ever we decide to do so weigh up the information available and do what you think is best for you. But anyways I’m probably digressing from the original topic so I’ll leave it at that. "
I'm aware of the mitigation taking place during the trial phase.
I was just pointing out that it's not a personal mitigation as in crossing the road so I personally think the comparison is ridiculous.
Anyway, I still feel that we are a long way off having a vaccine that will be available |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I don't think there is a vaccine per se, I think there are other medications that are safe for human use for other things (such as malaria medications) that have shown positive signs against the virus, but by design, has not been liscenced for other things, because its only been trialed for malaria..... Getting a safe vaccine or medication out for human use is, I'm assuming, a very complicated thing with a lot of red tape and testing.... Its not finding a vaccine that's the problem, I'm sure scientists have already found things that probably kill the virus, it's finding the right thing that works in the hosts body and doesn't kill or permanently damage the host carrying the virus, by working out the dose etc.... That's the balancing act that takes the most time, because making the vaccine safe is the most important part, and the only way to do that, is with clinical trails that take ages to set up and run.... Which is why we won't have a safe vaccine anytime soon.
I'm not a medical person at all, so any medical professionals are welcome to correct me.... This is just me applying logic to the Information that's already out there |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
********************
Well, I know a chap who says he knows fellow who swears the MI5 have cloned Colonel Blimp and sent him to fetch Lord Lucan from a secret underground facility in South Tasmania..........
Honestly......(?!)
Eva.
I'd be more concerned about lack of rigorous testing of new vaccines. And lack of rigorous testing of existing medications on this actual virus so success rate can be established. "
Absolutely this can anyone believe what comes out of the USA at present with a president who thinks all will be back to normal in a few weeks! US citizens are gonna have a big wake up call soon |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry . "
Nudge, nudge. Wink, wink. Say no more son. Say. no. more.
Whilst we’re at it, can you have a word and find out what the fuck happened to Shergar?
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Let's face it, there's only two solutions to this global pandemic, and it's not eradication of the virus.
1. Production of a vaccine.
2. Population immunity to get the virus levels Dow to yearly manageable levels. AND thereafter, a vaccine.
They have found a vaccine and it works on humans
Not been announced yet as production and distribution is a huge problem
And you know this how?
I can only say I no somebody who lives in America and is a director of a big pharmaceutical company
That’s all I can say sorry .
Nudge, nudge. Wink, wink. Say no more son. Say. no. more.
Whilst we’re at it, can you have a word and find out what the fuck happened to Shergar?
"
Safeways lasagne ready meal..thats all im saying.  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
Heres food for thought
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/04/how-long-do-vaccines-last-surprising-answers-may-help-protect-people-longer
Its an interesting read and not too complex.
I do personally think with the covid 19 the human body needs to be exposed multiple times in order to build strong enough immunity. With the live virus this cant be the case as many people who recovered the 1st time with no antibodies after and later reinfected died. The body was possibly too weak from its exposure from the 1st time around and the lack of antibodies made short work for the virus to overwhelm the body
The body needs to build strong antibodies but will synthetic vaccines work when the antibodies fall short with the real virus. Successfully creating an inactivated vaccine or attenuated vaccine with repeated doses over a few months could build strong enough antibodies. Such as the way we vaccinate against hepatitis B. Followed by booster shots every 5 years if they are required due to waning antibodies.
To know if it will work will take months even years of testing.
There is no guarantee that the antibodies produced will work for long term though without discovering and understanding why antibodies against this virus are so weak to begin with and why in many have none present in the blood after only weeks post infection.
Going have to be patient and understand a vaccine isnt right around the corner and the implications for vulnerable people will be for the long term. Remember theres no successful SARS vaccine still this could quite possibly mean there wont be for covid 19 which will have larger implications for the many given the current circumstances even healthy individuals with no known conditions have died it isnt just a killer of vulnerable people. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it.
Source of both please.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/health/coronavirus-immunity-antibodies.html
nature.com articles /s41591-020-0819-2
jamanetwork.com/journals /jama/fullarticle/2762452
cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective /2020/03/study-highlights-ease-spread-covid-19-viruses
sciencespeaksblog immune-survivors-of-covid-19-protective-antibody-for-treatment-and-prophylaxis/
A search engine will show links to plasma from recovered patients being used to fight the infection.
The amount of the virus you have been exposed to may be a factor in whether you develop immunity
You'll have to delete the spaces for the links to work
I'll look at some of them later, thanks. "
You state you're contagious after you get over it. After reading the Munich study, your assertions aren't stated. What is stated is after symptoms have gone. At this stage (2nd/3rd week of viral testing) identifies "neutralising antibodies". Basically this asserts the immune system (which causes most of the symptoms due to its process) is doing its job hence symptoms no longer prevalent, but it hasn't finished its job. In other words, the virus is not yet completely over (hence still contagious).
It was interesting to read about inactive virus in the stools which they assert means replication of the virus in the intestines. This would explain why some people were getting diarrhoea.
Of course with such a small number in the study, the study needs replicating with a larger cohort.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it.
Source of both please.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/health/coronavirus-immunity-antibodies.html
nature.com articles /s41591-020-0819-2
jamanetwork.com/journals /jama/fullarticle/2762452
cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective /2020/03/study-highlights-ease-spread-covid-19-viruses
sciencespeaksblog immune-survivors-of-covid-19-protective-antibody-for-treatment-and-prophylaxis/
A search engine will show links to plasma from recovered patients being used to fight the infection.
The amount of the virus you have been exposed to may be a factor in whether you develop immunity
You'll have to delete the spaces for the links to work
I'll look at some of them later, thanks.
You state you're contagious after you get over it. After reading the Munich study, your assertions aren't stated. What is stated is after symptoms have gone. At this stage (2nd/3rd week of viral testing) identifies "neutralising antibodies". Basically this asserts the immune system (which causes most of the symptoms due to its process) is doing its job hence symptoms no longer prevalent, but it hasn't finished its job. In other words, the virus is not yet completely over (hence still contagious).
It was interesting to read about inactive virus in the stools which they assert means replication of the virus in the intestines. This would explain why some people were getting diarrhoea.
Of course with such a small number in the study, the study needs replicating with a larger cohort.
"
And what do you mean about qualified immunity? I know about innate and adaptive (and these have different terms, that I cannot recall). |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
People stop watching TV it washed up your brains people... We don't have any epidemi...! It's not black dath or Malari it's just a typ of flu what we already had many difrent types chicken flu was the last and also by TV said that is epidemic. Governments just do natural selection. The biggest amount of died is in age 65+ or children who's immunologic system doesn't produce anty body's so by that they have eliminated not so small amount of people for whom the governments spends most of the money |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Been on the news people sitting in their garden have been told to stay inside and also police making sure people are not buying non essential items. People need to realise if they do as they are told this will go quicker |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"People stop watching TV it washed up your brains people... We don't have any epidemi...! It's not black dath or Malari it's just a typ of flu what we already had many difrent types chicken flu was the last and also by TV said that is epidemic. Governments just do natural selection. The biggest amount of died is in age 65+ or children who's immunologic system doesn't produce anty body's so by that they have eliminated not so small amount of people for whom the governments spends most of the money"
Bless |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"People stop watching TV it washed up your brains people... We don't have any epidemi...! It's not black dath or Malari it's just a typ of flu what we already had many difrent types chicken flu was the last and also by TV said that is epidemic. Governments just do natural selection. The biggest amount of died is in age 65+ or children who's immunologic system doesn't produce anty body's so by that they have eliminated not so small amount of people for whom the governments spends most of the money"
Is your tin foil hat comfy? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
The government didn't plan properly and/or took the wrong decisions and planned for the wrong thing too.
Herd inmunity was their priority goal, announced in March. This had probably been held as the goal for some time.
We can move from here in several ways. Comprehensive testing is vital. Total isolation of anyone positive is vital as is tracing and testing their contacts, with appropriate isolation.
We just have to get the testing kit and infrastructure in place. Alongside the PPE kit that the government didn't order from January.
It would be slow, ramping up tests to 1 million per week asap. Much human labour can be directed for testing and contact tracing, whilst people aren't working.
The job is much, much bigger just because the government decided to go for the dangerous herd immunity experiment, against WHO advice, whilst this virus can quickly spread through thousands of people, so that the job now is so much harder. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Heres food for thought
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/04/how-long-do-vaccines-last-surprising-answers-may-help-protect-people-longer
Its an interesting read and not too complex.
I do personally think with the covid 19 the human body needs to be exposed multiple times in order to build strong enough immunity. With the live virus this cant be the case as many people who recovered the 1st time with no antibodies after and later reinfected died. The body was possibly too weak from its exposure from the 1st time around and the lack of antibodies made short work for the virus to overwhelm the body
The body needs to build strong antibodies but will synthetic vaccines work when the antibodies fall short with the real virus. Successfully creating an inactivated vaccine or attenuated vaccine with repeated doses over a few months could build strong enough antibodies. Such as the way we vaccinate against hepatitis B. Followed by booster shots every 5 years if they are required due to waning antibodies.
To know if it will work will take months even years of testing.
There is no guarantee that the antibodies produced will work for long term though without discovering and understanding why antibodies against this virus are so weak to begin with and why in many have none present in the blood after only weeks post infection.
Going have to be patient and understand a vaccine isnt right around the corner and the implications for vulnerable people will be for the long term. Remember theres no successful SARS vaccine still this could quite possibly mean there wont be for covid 19 which will have larger implications for the many given the current circumstances even healthy individuals with no known conditions have died it isnt just a killer of vulnerable people."
There are still some uncertainties around the virus and our responses to it. Any vaccine will have to be tested for safety and effectiveness before approval - the dosing requirements will be part of this. We hope that they produce an effective vaccine, as you state but manufacture of hundreds of millions of doses won't be quick. Maybe they don't find one and we just have to eradicate it in each country. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
I wouldn't be surprised if a vaccine pops out of the woodwork sooner than expected.
They (China) new about this virus in 2018 published a paper on it in March 2019 open to the world to read. Event 201 in October was the warning. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"I wouldn't be surprised if a vaccine pops out of the woodwork sooner than expected.
They (China) new about this virus in 2018 published a paper on it in March 2019 open to the world to read. Event 201 in October was the warning."
Source please. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"Do we actually even know that you have immunity once you've had it?
No and yes. There is a few different takes on this. The best thinking is there is qualified immunity. IE You can have immunity in certain contexts but not others
Its also compounded by the fact that you are still contagious for a period after you get over it.
Source of both please.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/25/health/coronavirus-immunity-antibodies.html
nature.com articles /s41591-020-0819-2
jamanetwork.com/journals /jama/fullarticle/2762452
cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective /2020/03/study-highlights-ease-spread-covid-19-viruses
sciencespeaksblog immune-survivors-of-covid-19-protective-antibody-for-treatment-and-prophylaxis/
A search engine will show links to plasma from recovered patients being used to fight the infection.
The amount of the virus you have been exposed to may be a factor in whether you develop immunity
You'll have to delete the spaces for the links to work
I'll look at some of them later, thanks.
You state you're contagious after you get over it. After reading the Munich study, your assertions aren't stated. What is stated is after symptoms have gone. At this stage (2nd/3rd week of viral testing) identifies "neutralising antibodies". Basically this asserts the immune system (which causes most of the symptoms due to its process) is doing its job hence symptoms no longer prevalent, but it hasn't finished its job. In other words, the virus is not yet completely over (hence still contagious).
It was interesting to read about inactive virus in the stools which they assert means replication of the virus in the intestines. This would explain why some people were getting diarrhoea.
Of course with such a small number in the study, the study needs replicating with a larger cohort.
"
From Jama article I cited:
Four patients with COVID-19 who met criteria for hospital discharge or discontinuation of quarantine in China (absence of clinical symptoms and radiological abnormalities and 2 negative RT-PCR test results) had positive RT-PCR test results 5 to 13 days later. These findings suggest that at least a proportion of recovered patients still may be virus carriers. Although no family members were infected, all reported patients were medical professionals and took special care during home quarantine. Current criteria for hospital discharge or discontinuation of quarantine and continued patient management may need to be reevaluated. Although false-negative RT-PCR test results could have occurred as suggested by a previous study,6 2 consecutively negative RT-PCR test results plus evidence from clinical characteristics and chest CT findings suggested that the 4 patients qualified for hospital discharge or discontinuation of quarantine.
The study was limited to a small number of patients with mild or moderate infection. Further studies should follow up patients who are not health care professionals and who have more severe infection after hospital discharge or discontinuation of quarantine. Longitudinal studies on a larger cohort would help to understand the prognosis of the disease.
When I used the expression qualified immunity it was that people who recovered from covid 19 had immunity subject to certain qualification, which I understand is similar to people that contracted and recovered from MERS. As to the what the exact qualifications are, I don't think thats fully clear yet. A few weeks ago there was a suggestions that it was related to blood type, this week I have read some sources that suggests it may be related to the initial viral load. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Been on the news people sitting in their garden have been told to stay inside and also police making sure people are not buying non essential items. People need to realise if they do as they are told this will go quicker "
The first incident, the police apologised for their officer getting it wrong and Cambridge police, made the officer remove the tweet about the non essentials aisle in a supermarket.
I get the impression that some people think that we have to live as miserably as possible through this. I for one will take as much joy as I can within the guidelines. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Heres food for thought
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/04/how-long-do-vaccines-last-surprising-answers-may-help-protect-people-longer
Its an interesting read and not too complex.
I do personally think with the covid 19 the human body needs to be exposed multiple times in order to build strong enough immunity. With the live virus this cant be the case as many people who recovered the 1st time with no antibodies after and later reinfected died. The body was possibly too weak from its exposure from the 1st time around and the lack of antibodies made short work for the virus to overwhelm the body
The body needs to build strong antibodies but will synthetic vaccines work when the antibodies fall short with the real virus. Successfully creating an inactivated vaccine or attenuated vaccine with repeated doses over a few months could build strong enough antibodies. Such as the way we vaccinate against hepatitis B. Followed by booster shots every 5 years if they are required due to waning antibodies.
To know if it will work will take months even years of testing.
There is no guarantee that the antibodies produced will work for long term though without discovering and understanding why antibodies against this virus are so weak to begin with and why in many have none present in the blood after only weeks post infection.
Going have to be patient and understand a vaccine isnt right around the corner and the implications for vulnerable people will be for the long term. Remember theres no successful SARS vaccine still this could quite possibly mean there wont be for covid 19 which will have larger implications for the many given the current circumstances even healthy individuals with no known conditions have died it isnt just a killer of vulnerable people."
Until they can weaken the virus so it won't attach to human lung tissue a vaccine may not be created, I think we forget that the coronavirus causes corvid19 that then develops into serious pneumonia and sepsis, lots and lots of things for the vulnerable people to overcome, if those people can get to hospital and receive vital resorces then they have a higher chance for survival.
1.5 million vulnerable in the uk, we need to keep slowing it down. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"As much as I agree with population immunity I dont necessarily agree with breaking the rules.
Do we bend them? Yes, most people will. Ie. I probably go to the shop more often than I should but for me the mental health aspect of this is huge so it's a slight bend in the rules.
Understandable. I actually enjoyed my trip for food shopping .
I think what we should primarily respect, is the shielding of the most vulnerable - those who will have to wait for a vaccine. "
How could you enjoy it?. Again a prime example of human behaviour, we queue outside and as soon as inside, everyone just doing their own thing. Which I find incredibly stressful. I'd also not be taking a vaccine, having possibly already had this 4 months ago. So we're not all sat in hope of a miracle vaccination I know that for certain.
Its uncertainty that's the main drag, not having an end date understandably causing mass speculation...again only being human. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Heres food for thought
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/04/how-long-do-vaccines-last-surprising-answers-may-help-protect-people-longer
Its an interesting read and not too complex.
I do personally think with the covid 19 the human body needs to be exposed multiple times in order to build strong enough immunity. With the live virus this cant be the case as many people who recovered the 1st time with no antibodies after and later reinfected died. The body was possibly too weak from its exposure from the 1st time around and the lack of antibodies made short work for the virus to overwhelm the body
The body needs to build strong antibodies but will synthetic vaccines work when the antibodies fall short with the real virus. Successfully creating an inactivated vaccine or attenuated vaccine with repeated doses over a few months could build strong enough antibodies. Such as the way we vaccinate against hepatitis B. Followed by booster shots every 5 years if they are required due to waning antibodies.
To know if it will work will take months even years of testing.
There is no guarantee that the antibodies produced will work for long term though without discovering and understanding why antibodies against this virus are so weak to begin with and why in many have none present in the blood after only weeks post infection.
Going have to be patient and understand a vaccine isnt right around the corner and the implications for vulnerable people will be for the long term. Remember theres no successful SARS vaccine still this could quite possibly mean there wont be for covid 19 which will have larger implications for the many given the current circumstances even healthy individuals with no known conditions have died it isnt just a killer of vulnerable people.
Until they can weaken the virus so it won't attach to human lung tissue a vaccine may not be created, I think we forget that the coronavirus causes corvid19 that then develops into serious pneumonia and sepsis, lots and lots of things for the vulnerable people to overcome, if those people can get to hospital and receive vital resorces then they have a higher chance for survival.
1.5 million vulnerable in the uk, we need to keep slowing it down."
This isn't happening either.
My grandma is in a care home and they've been virus free for 4 weeks. Until this Thursday!...a chap got moved there from the local hospital!, following a heart attack and has a confirmed diagnosis of it...the best bit being CONTRACTED in the hospital. So not what's even greater, reduced numbers in staff. So in turn my nans home of the last 3 years now becomes a ticking morgue  all the rainbows in the world doesn't prevent that happening....human error will always win out. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"People stop watching TV it washed up your brains people... We don't have any epidemi...! It's not black dath or Malari it's just a typ of flu what we already had many difrent types chicken flu was the last and also by TV said that is epidemic. Governments just do natural selection. The biggest amount of died is in age 65+ or children who's immunologic system doesn't produce anty body's so by that they have eliminated not so small amount of people for whom the governments spends most of the money
Bless "
Ignorance is bliss as they say |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"As much as I agree with population immunity I dont necessarily agree with breaking the rules.
Do we bend them? Yes, most people will. Ie. I probably go to the shop more often than I should but for me the mental health aspect of this is huge so it's a slight bend in the rules.
Understandable. I actually enjoyed my trip for food shopping .
I think what we should primarily respect, is the shielding of the most vulnerable - those who will have to wait for a vaccine.
How could you enjoy it?. Again a prime example of human behaviour, we queue outside and as soon as inside, everyone just doing their own thing. Which I find incredibly stressful. I'd also not be taking a vaccine, having possibly already had this 4 months ago. So we're not all sat in hope of a miracle vaccination I know that for certain.
Its uncertainty that's the main drag, not having an end date understandably causing mass speculation...again only being human."
Interaction with other human beings. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
» Add a new message to this topic
