FabSwingers.com > Forums > Swinging Support and Advice > Ladies, has swinging been detrimental to you?
Ladies, has swinging been detrimental to you?
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too" Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship? | |||
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"Definitely made me more jaded about relationships due to the amount of attached people on here or couples where one is sneakily a little more active than the other. However, I probably don’t have the best perspective as I was already jaded before Fab and don’t generally believe in monogamy anyway. " But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging? | |||
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 easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
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"Definitely made me more jaded about relationships due to the amount of attached people on here or couples where one is sneakily a little more active than the other. However, I probably don’t have the best perspective as I was already jaded before Fab and don’t generally believe in monogamy anyway. " - same | |||
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"No. Why would you think swinging would be more detrimental to us women than to men? For those women who enjoy swinging our appetites and interests are on the whole little different to those of men, so you wouldn't expect the outcomes to be very different. " Wowww, how did I not notice until now that this topic was started by a man? Suddenly this whole thread has a very creepy tinge of sexism and intrusiveness. OP, why are you specifically interested in opening the floor to women when you aren’t one? | |||
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"No. Why would you think swinging would be more detrimental to us women than to men? For those women who enjoy swinging our appetites and interests are on the whole little different to those of men, so you wouldn't expect the outcomes to be very different. Wowww, how did I not notice until now that this topic was started by a man? Suddenly this whole thread has a very creepy tinge of sexism and intrusiveness. OP, why are you specifically interested in opening the floor to women when you aren’t one? "  | |||
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"But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging?" You realise large numbers of us are *in* relationships right? I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone who wasn't 100% happy with who they were in a relationship with. That person is poly and kinky and while I have a partner who doesn't swing, it has never stopped me from being true to who I am... Asking this, to me, could say a lot about the OPs views on swinging... The original post and follow up questions, to me, seem like fundamentally the OP has some subconscious bias about women who are on swingers sites... The asking about having a relationship outside of swinging makes me think the OP doesn't see swinging as something to be done in a relationship - but is somehow worried that if a woman has been on fab she somehow can't keep it in her pants. *Sigh* another day where yet again it all boils down to... The patriarchy has fucked us all folx, all of us. | |||
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"But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging? You realise large numbers of us are *in* relationships right? I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone who wasn't 100% happy with who they were in a relationship with. That person is poly and kinky and while I have a partner who doesn't swing, it has never stopped me from being true to who I am... Asking this, to me, could say a lot about the OPs views on swinging... The original post and follow up questions, to me, seem like fundamentally the OP has some subconscious bias about women who are on swingers sites... The asking about having a relationship outside of swinging makes me think the OP doesn't see swinging as something to be done in a relationship - but is somehow worried that if a woman has been on fab she somehow can't keep it in her pants. *Sigh* another day where yet again it all boils down to... The patriarchy has fucked us all folx, all of us. " Yes. What's good for the goose is apparently not good for the gander. (And then people wonder why women don't do things like this) | |||
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"Yes. What's good for the goose is apparently not good for the gander. (And then people wonder why women don't do things like this)" Or wonder why we call out slut shaming and the hypocrisy that can occur on here. | |||
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"But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging? You realise large numbers of us are *in* relationships right? I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone who wasn't 100% happy with who they were in a relationship with. That person is poly and kinky and while I have a partner who doesn't swing, it has never stopped me from being true to who I am... Asking this, to me, could say a lot about the OPs views on swinging... The original post and follow up questions, to me, seem like fundamentally the OP has some subconscious bias about women who are on swingers sites... The asking about having a relationship outside of swinging makes me think the OP doesn't see swinging as something to be done in a relationship - but is somehow worried that if a woman has been on fab she somehow can't keep it in her pants. *Sigh* another day where yet again it all boils down to... The patriarchy has fucked us all folx, all of us. " I did find that the OP is directed at women rather odd | |||
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"Yes. What's good for the goose is apparently not good for the gander. (And then people wonder why women don't do things like this) Or wonder why we call out slut shaming and the hypocrisy that can occur on here. " Well. Obviously that's because we're mean. | |||
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"But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging? You realise large numbers of us are *in* relationships right? I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone who wasn't 100% happy with who they were in a relationship with. That person is poly and kinky and while I have a partner who doesn't swing, it has never stopped me from being true to who I am... Asking this, to me, could say a lot about the OPs views on swinging... The original post and follow up questions, to me, seem like fundamentally the OP has some subconscious bias about women who are on swingers sites... The asking about having a relationship outside of swinging makes me think the OP doesn't see swinging as something to be done in a relationship - but is somehow worried that if a woman has been on fab she somehow can't keep it in her pants. *Sigh* another day where yet again it all boils down to... The patriarchy has fucked us all folx, all of us. " I totally agree with you that the questions were heavily from a mono perspective, and probably only directed or applying to non-partnered women. I assume this is because that is the demographic the OP is primarily interested in. Not sure though where you and others read his own condescension, criticism, or slut-shaming misogyny in what he wrote. I expect we all here agree that women -still- face way more scrutiny and criticism for being sexually adventurous than men do, so his observations and questions are unfortunately still very relevant. Don't shoot the messenger? I also think the stakes (both in terms of opportunities and difficulties) are entirely different for single, mono-inclined people than it is for those in established CNM relationships, it's just a different ball game altogether. | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now " This. Put me right off men. | |||
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"We feel swinging is more about using each other physically rather than anything rewarding emotionally However it has improved our relationship Much stronger x" I agree. But I am more interesting in hearing whether women feel it has re-wired them to want more than a traditional relationship provides and has affected their ability to pair bond and form monogamous relationships with no issues. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
"This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality. Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation la from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world. | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now " What hook-up sites and the hook-up culture has done for men is make sex very accessible to them. So unless a woman is offering something really unique than what most women offer, and the man is ready to settle down for a relationship, I fear women have their work cut out. Men want relationships, to answer your question. But men are also wired as territorial beings, so for most men, a sexually liberated women is often the last woman they are looking for, for a relationship. Caveat: it won’t be every man, but a huge number think this way. | |||
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"No. Why would you think swinging would be more detrimental to us women than to men? For those women who enjoy swinging our appetites and interests are on the whole little different to those of men, so you wouldn't expect the outcomes to be very different. " I don’t think and didn’t say it’s more detrimental to women more than men. But my question was directed at women, since I do know that it’s detrimental to men. A lot of men will say that the explosion in the availability of sex without jumping through a lot of hoops means there is no need to really try in securing, or staying, in relationships. And it also distracts men from staying focused on growing and building. But again this doesn’t apply to ALL men. | |||
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"No it's been difficult at times as in finding couples and that 4 way attraction.But it has helped our physical relationship enormously and we have done & had many adventures that we possibly would not of had. It has actually been a good thing for us." We massive agree with this. Finding mutual couple attraction is one of the hardest parts but it also does wonders for our personal physical relationship. It helps if you can really trust and open up to your partner/hubby because then you can discuss any questions/queries or feeling that arise to make sure your on the same page and just having a mutually good time. | |||
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"No. Why would you think swinging would be more detrimental to us women than to men? For those women who enjoy swinging our appetites and interests are on the whole little different to those of men, so you wouldn't expect the outcomes to be very different. Wowww, how did I not notice until now that this topic was started by a man? Suddenly this whole thread has a very creepy tinge of sexism and intrusiveness. OP, why are you specifically interested in opening the floor to women when you aren’t one? " Because I am genuinely interested in how women feel about the scene. How else can I have a genuine relationship (sexual, relationship and platonic) with a woman, if I don’t make the effort to understand how they see things. I do understand that a lot of women are jaded from experiences on here, but don’t tar us all with the same brush and lobby insults at us. We aren’t all creeps looking to take advantage of you. Keep an open mind. | |||
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"I (Mrs) came into the scene quite sexually liberated but inexperienced and defo kinky but experienced after a 15 yr vanilla relationship. The swing scene helped me enjoy sex for me- to seek experiences for me. I initially thought it would boost my self confidence. On one hand it has made me more comfortable to be les clothed or nakey in certain settings but not more comfy with myself. Some times it has made me feel like 'any hole is a goal' at clubs. So not helped the self esteem. But then I found J (Mr) though the swing scene and as soppy it sounds I know he fancies the pants off me. He also loves seeing me be fucked - and despite that happening- he fucks me like no other. The connection we have is behind anything I could have hoped or dreamed for. " Thanks for sharing. I think a lot of men, myself included, also question what we are doing in clubs, when we are surrounded by the “any dick is sleazy” mentality. It does de-personalize the interactions you may have sometimes. | |||
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"I (Mrs) came into the scene quite sexually liberated but inexperienced and defo kinky but experienced after a 15 yr vanilla relationship. The swing scene helped me enjoy sex for me- to seek experiences for me. I initially thought it would boost my self confidence. On one hand it has made me more comfortable to be les clothed or nakey in certain settings but not more comfy with myself. Some times it has made me feel like 'any hole is a goal' at clubs. So not helped the self esteem. But then I found J (Mr) though the swing scene and as soppy it sounds I know he fancies the pants off me. He also loves seeing me be fucked - and despite that happening- he fucks me like no other. The connection we have is behind anything I could have hoped or dreamed for. " Thanks for sharing. I think a lot of men, myself included, also question what we are doing in clubs, when we are surrounded by the “any dick is sleazy” mentality. It does de-personalize the interactions you may have sometimes. | |||
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"But do you think you’d be able to ever have a vanilla relationship outside of swinging? You realise large numbers of us are *in* relationships right? I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with someone who wasn't 100% happy with who they were in a relationship with. That person is poly and kinky and while I have a partner who doesn't swing, it has never stopped me from being true to who I am... Asking this, to me, could say a lot about the OPs views on swinging... The original post and follow up questions, to me, seem like fundamentally the OP has some subconscious bias about women who are on swingers sites... The asking about having a relationship outside of swinging makes me think the OP doesn't see swinging as something to be done in a relationship - but is somehow worried that if a woman has been on fab she somehow can't keep it in her pants. *Sigh* another day where yet again it all boils down to... The patriarchy has fucked us all folx, all of us. I totally agree with you that the questions were heavily from a mono perspective, and probably only directed or applying to non-partnered women. I assume this is because that is the demographic the OP is primarily interested in. Not sure though where you and others read his own condescension, criticism, or slut-shaming misogyny in what he wrote. I expect we all here agree that women -still- face way more scrutiny and criticism for being sexually adventurous than men do, so his observations and questions are unfortunately still very relevant. Don't shoot the messenger? I also think the stakes (both in terms of opportunities and difficulties) are entirely different for single, mono-inclined people than it is for those in established CNM relationships, it's just a different ball game altogether." Thank you. My post is not to criticise, condemn or judge. I like the scene and respect the right of everyone to a healthy sexy life however they choose to pursue it. My post was merely to understand how women, single and in relationships, feel about the scene and whether it has been detrimental. As a man, I understand men generally, but how else am I going to understand women if I don’t attempt to engage and ask questions. I understand that some women don’t like men, or are jaded towards men, but do we just retreat into our echo chambers or speak frankly. | |||
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"We often hear the term - swinging is not for everyone. For the women on here, let’s have a honest and open discussion with hopefully no judgment. Do you think swinging has been detrimental to you on a psychological and relationship level? Do you think it has harmed your chances of having a monogamous relationship as you may always think the grass is greener, or made it harder for men to take you seriously, or the often adverse interactions from men that you get on the scene has made you very jaded and as such very hard for you to let your guard down when the right man comes along. Interested to hear your thoughts and hope it remains a non-judgmental space! Floor is open…… " For me I use swinging as a way to scratch an itch when I’m single, I’m not interested in making friends on here, there are a couple of people that have transferred over to real life friends but that is as far as it goes. I don’t use the site as a method for chatting away and meeting people, I go clubs and parties have my fun and then switch it off and get back to real life and I keep my ‘fab’ life and real life very separate. What I have learnt from my time on here on and off the last 10+ years is that I don’t want a swinging relationship although seems to be what a lot of the guys tell me they want on here, like someone else said above they are monogamous when dating, same for me. Swinging / fab is just a place for NSA and nothing further as far as I’m concerned. I would never date a guy from fab (having done so in the past and got burned) and I still like to think I would give a none swinger guy the benefit of the doubt but the number of attached and married men on here that I personally know cheating on their wives is extremely high makes me wonder if I would be so generous or would I think they are the same as a ‘fab guy’ - I’ll have to come back to that when I decide to date again so that’s probably the only possible detrimental effect for me. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation la from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world."Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking"It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes. The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more. Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
"Not sure if that's wanting more, that's about having standards and needing attraction to who you meet. Which I'd think runs over into real life too. I think fit, hot attractive men, also want relationships. I'm very confused about what you're saying to be honest. It 100% hasn't affected my view of anything. I'd just prefer to meet people who are sexually open on fab and not. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation la from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world."That last paragraph is one of the most pompous and ill-informed I have read on Fab. I'm so pleased that you're here OP to mansplain exactly how we dim women feel, and how we are mistaken about attention and hence have "unnecessary expectations". | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation la from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
That last paragraph is one of the most pompous and ill-informed I have read on Fab. I'm so pleased that you're here OP to mansplain exactly how we dim women feel, and how we are mistaken about attention and hence have "unnecessary expectations". "
The same person is on another thread talking about how older women on here want gentlemen because they’ve had bad experiences from men in their youth, but being a gentleman towards younger women doesn’t ever work apparently and hence men should “tailor their messages according to how nature has structured things.” Move over, Andrew Tate… 
OP, you don’t speak for women and creating nakedly sexist threads disguised as well meaning conversation is vile. If you take issue with the fact women have expectations you feel they are undeserving of, perhaps you should create a thread to ask why the men you hold on such a high pedestal deign to grace us with their company. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation la from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
That last paragraph is one of the most pompous and ill-informed I have read on Fab. I'm so pleased that you're here OP to mansplain exactly how we dim women feel, and how we are mistaken about attention and hence have "unnecessary expectations". "
Us silly women can't see through trickery on Fab at all!  | |||
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship?" I'm not monogamous, never have been. I knew that before I knew what swinging was. I do find men find it hard to accept me as I am. Which is a shame, not that I'm looking for a proper relationship | |||
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship? I'm not monogamous, never have been. I knew that before I knew what swinging was. I do find men find it hard to accept me as I am. Which is a shame, not that I'm looking for a proper relationship " Yes. I won't be "fixed" by the right penis, etc. And if you can't imagine sharing a woman, keep walking | |||
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship? I'm not monogamous, never have been. I knew that before I knew what swinging was. I do find men find it hard to accept me as I am. Which is a shame, not that I'm looking for a proper relationship Yes. I won't be "fixed" by the right penis, etc. And if you can't imagine sharing a woman, keep walking" yeah I like having intimacy and close relationships with fwb but I don't want to be with just one person. I'd have one primary person for the right person.. I'd rather have someone that would also have fun with others too. But I am me.. and no matter how strong my feelings or how amazing in bed.. I'd still want to have the freedom to be sexual with others | |||
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The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men. | |||
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"My chances of having a successful monogamous relationship was always zero. That structure doesn't make me happy. I've never wanted marriage or children, or to feel entirely responsible for someone else's happiness, or have anyone spend time with me purely out of habit or convenience rather than because they actively choose to spend that time with me specifically. Swinging hasn't damaged me. I have always been this way inclined. And there's nothing wrong with that
The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men."Ooh well spotted | |||
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"We often hear the term - swinging is not for everyone. For the women on here, let’s have a honest and open discussion with hopefully no judgment. Do you think swinging has been detrimental to you on a psychological and relationship level? Do you think it has harmed your chances of having a monogamous relationship as you may always think the grass is greener, or made it harder for men to take you seriously, or the often adverse interactions from men that you get on the scene has made you very jaded and as such very hard for you to let your guard down when the right man comes along. Interested to hear your thoughts and hope it remains a non-judgmental space! Floor is open…… " First of all.... why on this green earth would the answer to these questions be different for a woman than a man? Actually.. it's not even firstly. THAT'S THE ONLY FUCKING QUESTION. I'm not a fan of sexism. 
.. Mrs. | |||
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"The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men." Ah but our wombs retain the DNA from all the men... Even if we use condoms - or some other nonsense | |||
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"The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men. Ah but our wombs retain the DNA from all the men... Even if we use condoms - or some other nonsense " We're delicate little flowers and men rampage over us and this is our fault because reasons | |||
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"The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men. Ah but our wombs retain the DNA from all the men... Even if we use condoms - or some other nonsense We're delicate little flowers and men rampage over us and this is our fault because reasons" Exactly. Men who fuck around are obviously still perfectly capable of having normal relationships afterwards of course. But us ovary bearers? We get fucking ruined if we let more than 3 people ever get inside us. Forever just for the scrap heap. Sob. | |||
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too" Perfect example of the woman I'm looking for. Sadly too few and too far between. | |||
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" I agree. But I am more interesting in hearing whether women feel it has re-wired them to want more than a traditional relationship provides and has affected their ability to pair bond and form monogamous relationships with no issues." You clearly are acting in bad faith here. You're asking a loaded question and expecting a certain answer. This appears broadly anti women and when challenged you sealion with the "I'm just trying to have a debate" card. | |||
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"The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men. Ah but our wombs retain the DNA from all the men... Even if we use condoms - or some other nonsense We're delicate little flowers and men rampage over us and this is our fault because reasons Exactly. Men who fuck around are obviously still perfectly capable of having normal relationships afterwards of course. But us ovary bearers? We get fucking ruined if we let more than 3 people ever get inside us. Forever just for the scrap heap. Sob." It never shrinks back.  | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship?" No it’s just made me realise what I want and have the confidence to not settle or make too many compromises | |||
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"My chances of having a successful monogamous relationship was always zero. That structure doesn't make me happy. I've never wanted marriage or children, or to feel entirely responsible for someone else's happiness, or have anyone spend time with me purely out of habit or convenience rather than because they actively choose to spend that time with me specifically. Swinging hasn't damaged me. I have always been this way inclined. And there's nothing wrong with that
The idea that too many sexual partners somehow prevents a woman from being able to 'pair bond' is a particularly gross mgtow theory that magically doesn't apply to men." And props to the other women on the thread pointing out nonmonogamy is their default/natural state and not some distortion of their feminine imperative.
OP do you identify as one of the men who are "naturally territorial"? 
Re. Pair bonding, just a handful of decades ago women were dependent on men financially and legally - having no alternative sure is binding. Today reluctance of people to commit has more to do with the rise of individualism and putting one's own goals&development first, because they can afford to - both men and women do this. I really doubt reluctance to commit is cos women fucked a couple men out of their league and now are confused about it | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now What hook-up sites and the hook-up culture has done for men is make sex very accessible to them. So unless a woman is offering something really unique than what most women offer, and the man is ready to settle down for a relationship, I fear women have their work cut out. Men want relationships, to answer your question. But men are also wired as territorial beings, so for most men, a sexually liberated women is often the last woman they are looking for, for a relationship. Caveat: it won’t be every man, but a huge number think this way. " Agree .. although as much as there is sex everywhere .. it's isn't really that much more 'accessible' physically. I'd say it's even more look but don't touch now thank ever before. A lot of what goes on on this site and others is very much a kind of reality porn and actually not what most men want in a relationship . (Key word most, not all) | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. " What questions exactly? The bit where he states 'made it harder for men to take you seriously' That's absolutely bollocks and indicative of someone who isn't very open minded at all. Signed....Mr | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. " | |||
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"We often hear the term - swinging is not for everyone. For the women on here, let’s have a honest and open discussion with hopefully no judgment. Do you think swinging has been detrimental to you on a psychological and relationship level? Do you think it has harmed your chances of having a monogamous relationship as you may always think the grass is greener, or made it harder for men to take you seriously, or the often adverse interactions from men that you get on the scene has made you very jaded and as such very hard for you to let your guard down when the right man comes along. Interested to hear your thoughts and hope it remains a non-judgmental space! Floor is open…… " So. I’m a swinger: I don’t want a monogamous relationship. If I did, I wouldn’t be a swinger. You seem to have a flawed assumption that that’s a goal and for a lot of us, it isn’t. I’m also not straight Through swinging I have met a hell of a lot of dickheads with grabby hands, just like I have everywhere else. I’ve also met a hell of a lot of wonderful gentlemen who - like me - think there’s a bit more to life than a white picket fence. The respect and consideration that the good single guys - the ones who understand and value consent and autonomy and my choices - show me is downright healing and restores my faith in humanity. | |||
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"We often hear the term - swinging is not for everyone. For the women on here, let’s have a honest and open discussion with hopefully no judgment. Do you think swinging has been detrimental to you on a psychological and relationship level? Do you think it has harmed your chances of having a monogamous relationship as you may always think the grass is greener, or made it harder for men to take you seriously, or the often adverse interactions from men that you get on the scene has made you very jaded and as such very hard for you to let your guard down when the right man comes along. Interested to hear your thoughts and hope it remains a non-judgmental space! Floor is open…… So. I’m a swinger: I don’t want a monogamous relationship. If I did, I wouldn’t be a swinger. You seem to have a flawed assumption that that’s a goal and for a lot of us, it isn’t. I’m also not straight Through swinging I have met a hell of a lot of dickheads with grabby hands, just like I have everywhere else. I’ve also met a hell of a lot of wonderful gentlemen who - like me - think there’s a bit more to life than a white picket fence. The respect and consideration that the good single guys - the ones who understand and value consent and autonomy and my choices - show me is downright healing and restores my faith in humanity. " | |||
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And for anyone interested, the actual real science behind people who enjoy NSA sex is called 'sociosexuality' and people can be either 'restricted' or 'unrestricted'. I'm definitely the latter. Nothing to do with my emotional wellbeing or ability to have healthy relationships, I just love sex. | |||
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"I’ve only been swinging as a single but tried monogamy recently and it was too hard. Would quite like to find that “someone” but they’d have to be happy to share - as I would be too Do you think swinging has contributed to the difficulty you’ve had trying a monogamous relationship? No it’s just made me realise what I want and have the confidence to not settle or make too many compromises" Glad to hear it. | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
- I get what you’re saying, I’ll leave it there "Thank you for understanding. | |||
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"“Do you think it has harmed your chances of having a monogamous relationship as you may always think the grass is greener” No, from a grass is greener perspective. But yes, from the standpoint that it solidified for me that any relationship would need to at least allow me access to sexually connect with women, preferably with my man enthusiastically enjoying with me. I spent too many years not being able to explore that part of my sexuality to be willing to put it back in a box. But no, when I pair bond I pair bond, any sexual/kink fun we consensually invite in to our relationship has zero bearing on that bond, and if it no longer enhanced it we would stop. “or made it harder for men to take you seriously” There are always going to be men and women who only have the capacity for sexual explorations outside of a relationship, so from that respect, yes, I suppose so. It made the compatible dating pool smaller. And let’s face it, the levels of honest communication with your partner and, possibly even more importantly, with yourself, required to maintain a relationship that is ethically non monogamous would rule out a large portion of the population too. I understand why this question is here and I think it’s valid, despite it ruffling some feathers. But for me, I knew myself well enough to know that compatibility is key. “or the often adverse interactions from men that you get on the scene” Absolutely not, thankfully. As a singleton I was fussy, within a relationship we are both fussy. I wouldn’t have entertained the idea of choosing a life partner who didn’t know their worth. As a single lady on here I developed a couple of FWB friendships and would swing together in that way, and I guess that ultimately showed me how I personally wanted a future (now current, lol) relationship dynamic to be. While on here as a single lady, I very quickly learned to ignore the idiots and take no notice of the sycophants, and only really engaged in “hook ups” in a club environment and a shared dynamic. That for me led to almost universally positive interactions (my only negative ones coming from couples, not single men). I think fab can be a pretty brutal place for all demographics for very different reasons, so I guess from that respect I suppose it engenders a somewhat hard skin, and a healthy (or unhealthy, depending on your viewpoint!) detachment in early interactions. I could expand on that further but feel I’ve probably mused enough for now! " Thank you for your musings. I agree that some of the positive takeaways of the scene is you learn very quickly to cut down on the noise and focus on what you seek. You learn a lot about yourself and actively look for what is good for you. Glad to hear you found a great partner to navigate the scene with. | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now What hook-up sites and the hook-up culture has done for men is make sex very accessible to them. So unless a woman is offering something really unique than what most women offer, and the man is ready to settle down for a relationship, I fear women have their work cut out. Men want relationships, to answer your question. But men are also wired as territorial beings, so for most men, a sexually liberated women is often the last woman they are looking for, for a relationship. Caveat: it won’t be every man, but a huge number think this way. Agree .. although as much as there is sex everywhere .. it's isn't really that much more 'accessible' physically. I'd say it's even more look but don't touch now thank ever before. A lot of what goes on on this site and others is very much a kind of reality porn and actually not what most men want in a relationship . (Key word most, not all) " Agree. I missed that vital point that as much as there is sex everywhere, it’s not the case for majority of single men. Yeah, most men tend to want only monogamous relationships. | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. " I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
"No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you. | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you. "Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too. And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended. | |||
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"No it's been difficult at times as in finding couples and that 4 way attraction.But it has helped our physical relationship enormously and we have done & had many adventures that we possibly would not of had. It has actually been a good thing for us." Yes we fully agree with you on that one!! After a lot of disappointments (miss match) we found that a 4 way attraction very difficult to achieve. For some strange reason we felt that the female : female bond was often the difficult part to achieve?? As such we decided on MMF meets, which we found, much easier to bond. | |||
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"yeah, most men tend to want only monogamous relationships." Looks at all the non-monogamous men in her life (and not just the ones she's in a relationship with). Hmm, I think you're generalising about men way too much here. You're clearly used to your own echo chamber, which seemingly has some wildly opposing views on sex, fidelity and monogamy to many of the people on the forum... Having seen at the very start of your profile, you, quite rightly calling out racist tropes - have you ever thought that maybe when women are calling out the mysogeny in your replies, you should listen? | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended."Well, frankly, maybe it should mean something? Life’s too short for devils advocacy, or monogamy. | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended." | |||
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"yeah, most men tend to want only monogamous relationships. Looks at all the non-monogamous men in her life (and not just the ones she's in a relationship with). Hmm, I think you're generalising about men way too much here. You're clearly used to your own echo chamber, which seemingly has some wildly opposing views on sex, fidelity and monogamy to many of the people on the forum... Having seen at the very start of your profile, you, quite rightly calling out racist tropes - have you ever thought that maybe when women are calling out the mysogeny in your replies, you should listen? " What does ‘calling out racist tropes’ have to do with anything to do with this thread? Is he not entitled to do a thread independent of that? | |||
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"yeah, most men tend to want only monogamous relationships. Looks at all the non-monogamous men in her life (and not just the ones she's in a relationship with). Hmm, I think you're generalising about men way too much here. You're clearly used to your own echo chamber, which seemingly has some wildly opposing views on sex, fidelity and monogamy to many of the people on the forum... Having seen at the very start of your profile, you, quite rightly calling out racist tropes - have you ever thought that maybe when women are calling out the mysogeny in your replies, you should listen? What does ‘calling out racist tropes’ have to do with anything to do with this thread? Is he not entitled to do a thread independent of that? "As a *mostly* (there is non-caucasion blood in the family on one side of unknown location) if a POC tells me something is racist. I stfu and listen to them, appreciate what they have to say, learn and grow. I mentioned it because women are pointing out the mysoginistic background to the OPs generalisations of both men and women and rather than listening the OP is both doubling down, and saying we've resorted to name calling and insults. | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended.
Well, frankly, maybe it should mean something? Life’s too short for devils advocacy, or monogamy. "No, it doesn’t. I don’t recall mentioning monogamy, or any of the insults being thrown my way. If people have to insult me to make their point, then they have lost the debate. And I don’t have to engage anyone who insults me cos their feelings are hurt. | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended.
Well, frankly, maybe it should mean something? Life’s too short for devils advocacy, or monogamy.
No, it doesn’t.
I don’t recall mentioning monogamy, or any of the insults being thrown my way.
If people have to insult me to make their point, then they have lost the debate.
And I don’t have to engage anyone who insults me cos their feelings are hurt. "It was in, literally, your first message on this thread. Do you even proofread? | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended.
Well, frankly, maybe it should mean something? Life’s too short for devils advocacy, or monogamy.
No, it doesn’t.
I don’t recall mentioning monogamy, or any of the insults being thrown my way.
If people have to insult me to make their point, then they have lost the debate.
And I don’t have to engage anyone who insults me cos their feelings are hurt.
It was in, literally, your first message on this thread. Do you even proofread?
"It was a question to the wider community, and not a statement. Maybe you should focus on the context of what I write a bit more, instead of being condescending. | |||
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"OP, I would never date vanilla again! I had too much judgement in my 20's and 30's while being vanilla but liberated. Swinging isn't perfect, nothing is. But I stand a better chance of meeting like minded open individuals on here than a dating site. " Yeah, I agree it’s not perfect but at least there’s a greater chance of honesty from the beginning. | |||
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"Single lady here!! The scene has helped my self confidence for sure! It’s helped me learn about about myself sexually, turning my fantasies into reality! Have met some lovely people in clubs, I feel safer in clubs than on socials, I have not had the best experience with socials where the men are too full on over a coffee haha! Most of my vanilla friends know I’m on the scene and long term my dream is to be a hot wife!" It’s nice to have that in the open with your vanilla friends. A lot of swingers have to keep it under wraps. How are the men too full on, during socials? Lol. Too much over-familiarity, too soon? | |||
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"Every man telling you that you are sexy just because they want a shag. Makes you never believe it again.. from anyone" I agree with that! | |||
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"Such an interesting thread.. I think OP you have touch a few raw nerves but tbh I think many men do have the same questions and curiosity about this place and the women they may meet from here. Call it what you like, but there's nothing bad in that. Basically boils down to men from Mars women from Venus .. who'd have thought ??! .. each to their own. I certainly have, Judd gong by all the comments and insults
But it’s Fab, and you have to have a tough hide.
No, you don’t. Just take people as you find them and ask questions instead of making assumptions. It causes a lot less upset and makes a lot less people shout at you.
Actually, I think I do, lol. Are you going to “shout” at me for that too.
And it doesn’t mean anything when strangers online “shout” at me, cos it doesn’t mean anything in the grand scheme of things. I asked questions, which ruffled feathers and people saw fit to call me names. The world hasn’t ended.
Well, frankly, maybe it should mean something? Life’s too short for devils advocacy, or monogamy.
No, it doesn’t.
I don’t recall mentioning monogamy, or any of the insults being thrown my way.
If people have to insult me to make their point, then they have lost the debate.
And I don’t have to engage anyone who insults me cos their feelings are hurt.
It was in, literally, your first message on this thread. Do you even proofread?
"Yes. "monogamous relationship" and "the right man" coming along. If "the right man" comes along, he can fuck off. I ain't interested. | |||
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"Every man telling you that you are sexy just because they want a shag. Makes you never believe it again.. from anyone" Also this! | |||
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"Single lady here!! The scene has helped my self confidence for sure! It’s helped me learn about about myself sexually, turning my fantasies into reality! Have met some lovely people in clubs, I feel safer in clubs than on socials, I have not had the best experience with socials where the men are too full on over a coffee haha! Most of my vanilla friends know I’m on the scene and long term my dream is to be a hot wife! It’s nice to have that in the open with your vanilla friends. A lot of swingers have to keep it under wraps. How are the men too full on, during socials? Lol. Too much over-familiarity, too soon?" Bad social info: How much time do you have! The worse one turned up 10mins not excuses then looked me up and down and said yeah I’ll fuck you! Then said I will message you later! In Starbucks I kid you not! | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
"Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do? | |||
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"For the most part no But it has defo make me a feel like men are a little gross (not all of them obviously) - Becoming abusive when you say you're not interested - telling thing(usually lies) they think you want to hear - just being desperate in general - oh and how can I forget the entitlement, so many men think that because they've sent a woman a message, regardless of the content, that the woman should be grateful and automatically open her legs for them I know that not all men, either in real life, or on here are like that. I'm fully aware, but it just seems slto be such a large majority that it kind of puts me off men a little bit " Definitely understand. It does seem that standards and rules of engagement have worsened on Fab, that’s for sure. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Single lady here!! The scene has helped my self confidence for sure! It’s helped me learn about about myself sexually, turning my fantasies into reality! Have met some lovely people in clubs, I feel safer in clubs than on socials, I have not had the best experience with socials where the men are too full on over a coffee haha! Most of my vanilla friends know I’m on the scene and long term my dream is to be a hot wife! It’s nice to have that in the open with your vanilla friends. A lot of swingers have to keep it under wraps. How are the men too full on, during socials? Lol. Too much over-familiarity, too soon? Bad social info: How much time do you have! The worse one turned up 10mins not excuses then looked me up and down and said yeah I’ll fuck you! Then said I will message you later! In Starbucks I kid you not! " Wow, don’t know what to say to that. That is seriously ***** up.  | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?"Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”. Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men. However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
"What's your definition of a "high standard" ? | |||
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"For the most part no But it has defo make me a feel like men are a little gross (not all of them obviously) - Becoming abusive when you say you're not interested - telling thing(usually lies) they think you want to hear - just being desperate in general - oh and how can I forget the entitlement, so many men think that because they've sent a woman a message, regardless of the content, that the woman should be grateful and automatically open her legs for them I know that not all men, either in real life, or on here are like that. I'm fully aware, but it just seems slto be such a large majority that it kind of puts me off men a little bit " | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now " Same here. I am interested in more conventional dating and finding something more meaningful. I'm not necessarily identifiable from my profile so getting wildly different approaches from the same person on here and on an app just makes me so distrustful of men's intentions | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ? "Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc. Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs. | |||
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"It hasn't been detrimental at all. But, what I will say, is that we have enjoyed our experience so far, but it has strengthend in a way our trust in each other in ways we wouldn't have had the opportunity too outside of FAB." Do you think it may, on average, have a positive effect for couples than singles? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs."OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved? | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now Same here. I am interested in more conventional dating and finding something more meaningful. I'm not necessarily identifiable from my profile so getting wildly different approaches from the same person on here and on an app just makes me so distrustful of men's intentions" Hmmm, that’s really interesting to read. For a lot of people, once the genie of seining is out of the box, it’s very hard to put it back in and go to conventional dating. Would you be open to finding something meaningful via conventional dating and then trying swinging together as a couple? Or you’d be happy to close the door on the scene, if the partner you find wants to be only conventional? | |||
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"It’s made me question men and the hook up culture. Most on Tinder are on here. Question is, do men want relationships anymore? In the real world I’m more cynical now Same here. I am interested in more conventional dating and finding something more meaningful. I'm not necessarily identifiable from my profile so getting wildly different approaches from the same person on here and on an app just makes me so distrustful of men's intentions" You're on here, presumably wanting 'used', judging by your username. I'm sure you have a different approach to a conventional dating site. Why would a man, acting in the same way make you distrustful of their intentions? Horses for courses. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved? "In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc. See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples | |||
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"For singles, sorry to say, for most it will just be sex. There's nothing to share with someone you're close too. As a couple, I thoroughly enjoy the experience of honesty, trust, the learning about each other sexually. So, definitely more positive for couples." | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples"When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself. Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves? | |||
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"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples"I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do."I think women in countries like this one have more choices, and some men have had to be shocked out of being complacent. No, you're not guaranteed a wife who'll put up with anything because she needs a father or husband to not starve to death. How sad for you, etc. (I did say "some men", everyone calm down) | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves? "Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc. See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do. I think women in countries like this one have more choices, and some men have had to be shocked out of being complacent. No, you're not guaranteed a wife who'll put up with anything because she needs a father or husband to not starve to death. How sad for you, etc. (I did say "some men", everyone calm down)" I'm also confused about what's happening to all the women who don't partner up with above average men, there's not an unlimited supply of them. Are they swishing about waiting for one to become free? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
"If women can't find what they're looking for, then they'll re-evaluate. But that's up to them and their experience. Some women find that it's easier to be alone. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do."Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc. See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do. I think women in countries like this one have more choices, and some men have had to be shocked out of being complacent. No, you're not guaranteed a wife who'll put up with anything because she needs a father or husband to not starve to death. How sad for you, etc. (I did say "some men", everyone calm down) I'm also confused about what's happening to all the women who don't partner up with above average men, there's not an unlimited supply of them. Are they swishing about waiting for one to become free?" It does seem to be a problem without a great deal of evidence behind it. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
"I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc. See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do. Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture." The things you talk about are multifactorial and aren't just to do with uppity women. Lower birthrates and higher rates of divorce, for example, can be linked to educating women and giving them options to get them away from dangerous relationships. Less spread of vaccine preventable disease, so you don't have to have as many spare children hoping one or two live to adulthood unscathed. But I'm afraid if you ask me to choose between "society" and settling for a man who doesn't meet my standards, then society can burn. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
" In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc. See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do. I think women in countries like this one have more choices, and some men have had to be shocked out of being complacent. No, you're not guaranteed a wife who'll put up with anything because she needs a father or husband to not starve to death. How sad for you, etc. (I did say "some men", everyone calm down) I'm also confused about what's happening to all the women who don't partner up with above average men, there's not an unlimited supply of them. Are they swishing about waiting for one to become free? It does seem to be a problem without a great deal of evidence behind it." Very good question. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do.
Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture."My observation isn't anecdotal. It's actual first hand observation. Are your statements backed by anything more than your observation? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely."I fear it's another round of "there are so many men on Fab that unworthy women can go out with Greek gods and that's so unfair and it makes unworthy women think they're amazing when they're not" I know damn well I'm not all that. But even if there were only people beneath my threshold or below and I was horny as hell... I'll read a book, ta | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely."Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t. But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely. Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t. But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need. " So it's a societal problem and we can't blame women for the breakdown of society? Good to know. As you were, ladies | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do.
Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture.
My observation isn't anecdotal. It's actual first hand observation.
Are your statements backed by anything more than your observation? "Actual first-hand experience is anecdotal. It’s just your experience and not based on what’s generally happening. I listed a number of countries where these issues are cropping up. Look them up. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do.
Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture.
My observation isn't anecdotal. It's actual first hand observation.
Are your statements backed by anything more than your observation?
Actual first-hand experience is anecdotal. It’s just your experience and not based on what’s generally happening.
I listed a number of countries where these issues are cropping up. Look them up."To what extent have you controlled for other factors involved in societal trends, or are you conflating them all? Sociological research is necessarily multifactorial. (Feminism, changes in laws around violence and divorce, education, birth control, China's former One Child Policy and the preference in China for boys, etc) And even if it is a result of "unrealistic expectations" (as a social scientist you'd be expected to define your terms), don't the concepts of autonomy and consent override societal trends? If you're going to allude to research, best not make it sloppy. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely.
Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t.
But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need.
"In some cultures maybe, where money is involved,.arranged marriages etc. But I'm not attracted to people based on what society says I should be attracted to, in fact probably the opposite. I really don't think actual attraction works the way you describe. Arranged marriages maybe and some people might be looking for someone with money, that has little to do with attraction x | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
I find this statement at odds with my observations of every day life. I really wish women would apply the high standards that many think they do.
Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture.
My observation isn't anecdotal. It's actual first hand observation.
Are your statements backed by anything more than your observation?
Actual first-hand experience is anecdotal. It’s just your experience and not based on what’s generally happening.
I listed a number of countries where these issues are cropping up. Look them up.
To what extent have you controlled for other factors involved in societal trends, or are you conflating them all?
Sociological research is necessarily multifactorial. (Feminism, changes in laws around violence and divorce, education, birth control, China's former One Child Policy and the preference in China for boys, etc)
And even if it is a result of "unrealistic expectations" (as a social scientist you'd be expected to define your terms), don't the concepts of autonomy and consent override societal trends?
If you're going to allude to research, best not make it sloppy. "Ha!
I am glad my comment has got you to look at anything beyond your anecdotal evidence of first-hand observation.
At least I have gotten you to come out from that.
Yes, sociological research results are often always based on multiple factors. But that doesn’t mean, that one of those factors can’t be taken seriously cos it happens to be just one of the factors. Are there countries where there is a struggle for women to find men due to multi-faceted factors? Yes. Are one of the factors due to men checking out completely? Yes.
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"But I'm afraid if you ask me to choose between "society" and settling for a man who doesn't meet my standards, then society can burn. "
Yes. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely.
Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t.
But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need.
In some cultures maybe, where money is involved,.arranged marriages etc. But I'm not attracted to people based on what society says I should be attracted to, in fact probably the opposite. I really don't think actual attraction works the way you describe. Arranged marriages maybe and some people might be looking for someone with money, that has little to do with attraction x"What drives the attraction then? What are the things that will make you notice and be attracted to someone if you first see them? People tend to be attracted to people with attributes that are natural (height, body type, features) and societal based (job type, income, assets etc.). Society even influences what natural attributes people get attracted to. Like in some cultures a gap in the tooth is seen as attractive, and in some not so attractive. A couple of decades back, a big bum on a woman wasn't the first choice in Western societies, but now it’s all the rage. What changed? Societal conditioning. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"Well your observation is anecdotal, and not reflective of the wider picture. My observation isn't anecdotal. It's actual first hand observation. Are your statements backed by anything more than your observation? Actual first-hand experience is anecdotal. It’s just your experience and not based on what’s generally happening. I listed a number of countries where these issues are cropping up. Look them up. To what extent have you controlled for other factors involved in societal trends, or are you conflating them all? Sociological research is necessarily multifactorial. (Feminism, changes in laws around violence and divorce, education, birth control, China's former One Child Policy and the preference in China for boys, etc) And even if it is a result of "unrealistic expectations" (as a social scientist you'd be expected to define your terms), don't the concepts of autonomy and consent override societal trends? If you're going to allude to research, best not make it sloppy. Ha!
I am glad my comment has got you to look at anything beyond your anecdotal evidence of first-hand observation.
At least I have gotten you to come out from that.
Yes, sociological research results are often always based on multiple factors. But that doesn’t mean, that one of those factors can’t be taken seriously cos it happens to be just one of the factors. Are there countries where there is a struggle for women to find men due to multi-faceted factors? Yes. Are one of the factors due to men checking out completely? Yes.
"I apologise if my knowledge of broader social issues is able to be confused with taking your point seriously. In order to work out how seriously we should take issues, we need to know how much each one is a factor in the particular issue (control for confounders), and weigh them against societal priorities. I don't know exactly how it all unfolds, but my lay opinion of men checking out is that men should get therapy and work on themselves. And autonomy and equality are worth it. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"In all honesty I have never come across as much pompous unscientific pseudobabble as there has been in this thread. Real sociologists will be turning in their grave, while Andrew Tate will be grinning from ear to ear. " "Women on this site get sex they don't deserve and Nice Guys get left behind"... plus some babble. I mean, OK. Have a wank? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"I wish some of my daughter's friends would apply these high standards. Some of the men they've ended up with who have subsequently left them for a better option or treat them like dirt haven't had the memo." I think there are many myths that people tell themselves to justify what they perceive. That women are far too picky is one of them. (And it seems to be perpetuated by groups that have incredibly high standards of women, like, some think we expire at 25. At the ripe old age of 37 - ripe like brie probably - I should be grateful etc. yeah nah) The world is changing and society struggles to catch up. But a lot of ideas about relationships persist, including being 'nice' as a woman, putting up with things you shouldn't. (I suspect this is a holdover from when women literally needed a man to not starve, but some ideas in popular culture are a bit hard to exterminate) | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"In all honesty I have never come across as much pompous unscientific pseudobabble as there has been in this thread. Real sociologists will be turning in their grave, while Andrew Tate will be grinning from ear to ear. " That’s fine. You are entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine. As for the rest, water off a duck’s back. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples"So women should put their standards, which they're entitled to have, to one side just so that men can find wives? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
"But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic? "I've found in the last couple of years that I've been all but completely unable to find what I'm looking for on Fab. The way I see it, this is a me problem, not an anyone else problem. I have a wank. I don't inflict my demands on anyone else. Problem solved. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely.
Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t.
But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need.
In some cultures maybe, where money is involved,.arranged marriages etc. But I'm not attracted to people based on what society says I should be attracted to, in fact probably the opposite. I really don't think actual attraction works the way you describe. Arranged marriages maybe and some people might be looking for someone with money, that has little to do with attraction x
What drives the attraction then?
What are the things that will make you notice and be attracted to someone if you first see them?
People tend to be attracted to people with attributes that are natural (height, body type, features) and societal based (job type, income, assets etc.).
Society even influences what natural attributes people get attracted to. Like in some cultures a gap in the tooth is seen as attractive, and in some not so attractive. A couple of decades back, a big bum on a woman wasn't the first choice in Western societies, but now it’s all the rage. What changed? Societal conditioning. "You make it.sound like people don't have their own minds. And attraction is something you feel or don't feel when you meet someone. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic? "And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic? Because I am a man? I don't get your question. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
"Why are a woman's expectations able to be judged by anyone but her? What I want should be judged by the standards of what it brings me in my life. A man's judgement on my expectations is about as important to me as trends in footwear in Peru. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
I feel you make this far more complex than it actually is. There's attraction or there isn't. People have what they like or don't, I'm not sure what these expectations you refer to are. People generally don't say oh you'll do. It's about connection surely.
Yeah, there is attraction and there isn’t.
But what fuels the attraction (the initial hurdle) in the first place? It’s the things that society programmes us to think we need.
In some cultures maybe, where money is involved,.arranged marriages etc. But I'm not attracted to people based on what society says I should be attracted to, in fact probably the opposite. I really don't think actual attraction works the way you describe. Arranged marriages maybe and some people might be looking for someone with money, that has little to do with attraction x
What drives the attraction then?
What are the things that will make you notice and be attracted to someone if you first see them?
People tend to be attracted to people with attributes that are natural (height, body type, features) and societal based (job type, income, assets etc.).
Society even influences what natural attributes people get attracted to. Like in some cultures a gap in the tooth is seen as attractive, and in some not so attractive. A couple of decades back, a big bum on a woman wasn't the first choice in Western societies, but now it’s all the rage. What changed? Societal conditioning.
You make it.sound like people don't have their own minds. And attraction is something you feel or don't feel when you meet someone. "We are all influenced by the society we live in, and that includes facets of what we are attracted to. We can't pretend otherwise. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic? Because I am a man? I don't get your question. " What makes them unrealistic? They have decided that they would rather be alone or just have casual relationships unless someone they consider worth giving that up for comes along. The choice to be alone is better than the choice to be with someone that doesn't bring you joy. Though, to be fair, it does seem many are still willing to settle for mediocrity over loneliness. What part of that is unrealistic? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
"Of course you can say your own expectations are unrealistic, but you do not have the knowledge, the insights nor the experience to claim that other peoples expectations are unrealistic. You may think they are, but you do not know. It is both arrogant and insulting to claim you do. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic? Because I am a man? I don't get your question. What makes them unrealistic? They have decided that they would rather be alone or just have casual relationships unless someone they consider worth giving that up for comes along. The choice to be alone is better than the choice to be with someone that doesn't bring you joy. Though, to be fair, it does seem many are still willing to settle for mediocrity over loneliness. What part of that is unrealistic?" I think the implicit assumption is that it has to be 'fair'. That what women want has to relate to how many men want relationships. A woman needs a man like a fish needs a bicycle, etc. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
Why are a woman's expectations able to be judged by anyone but her?
What I want should be judged by the standards of what it brings me in my life.
A man's judgement on my expectations is about as important to me as trends in footwear in Peru.
"Because people don't live in a vacuum. We all get judged, or judge, in one way or another, as social beings, for what we look like, do or say. Being judged doesn't mean you can't do what you want, you can. You also have the choice of not taking that seriously, which I think is fantastic. But let's not pretend that what you do will not be judged. To say anyone's expectations, including a woman's, can only be judged by her is ignoring reality. It is impossible. You can shoot the messenger or insult me if you want, but that's a fact. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
Why are a woman's expectations able to be judged by anyone but her?
What I want should be judged by the standards of what it brings me in my life.
A man's judgement on my expectations is about as important to me as trends in footwear in Peru.
Because people don't live in a vacuum. We all get judged, or judge, in one way or another, as social beings, for what we look like, do or say.
Being judged doesn't mean you can't do what you want, you can. You also have the choice of not taking that seriously, which I think is fantastic.
But let's not pretend that what you do will not be judged.
To say anyone's expectations, including a woman's, can only be judged by her is ignoring reality. It is impossible.
You can shoot the messenger or insult me if you want, but that's a fact. "I think you misunderstand or are trying to be deliberately obtuse to try to get one over me. If my expectations are unrealistic, what are they unrealistic for? I set my own goals for what I want in my life. The people I choose to meet or not and the standards I set are against the goals I have in my life. I don't set my expectations or goals on the basis of what other people think of me. People will have opinions. I don't give a single solitary fuck and they don't change the metrics I choose for goals in my life and how I attain them. People will judge - have views, gossip, etc. Only I am able to determine if my expectations are worthy - and yes, that's another form of judgement. Conflating the two is obviously silly. If someone is so weak willed that they'd determine their life partner and/ or goals in life by "people might talk" then maybe they should work on themselves. I sense a theme here. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
Of course you can say your own expectations are unrealistic, but you do not have the knowledge, the insights nor the experience to claim that other peoples expectations are unrealistic. You may think they are, but you do not know. It is both arrogant and insulting to claim you do. "It's ironic that you say what I am saying is arrogant and insulting but in the same breath, you tell me what I should say and not say. And how do you know what I have or don't have to say it? That is actual arrogance to me. Who said I, or anyone, can't say a lot of women's expectations are unrealistic? A lot of women's expectations are unrealistic, that is true. You can insult me all you want or use belittling language, but like I said it doesn't mean anything to me. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
Why are a woman's expectations able to be judged by anyone but her?
What I want should be judged by the standards of what it brings me in my life.
A man's judgement on my expectations is about as important to me as trends in footwear in Peru.
Because people don't live in a vacuum. We all get judged, or judge, in one way or another, as social beings, for what we look like, do or say.
Being judged doesn't mean you can't do what you want, you can. You also have the choice of not taking that seriously, which I think is fantastic.
But let's not pretend that what you do will not be judged.
To say anyone's expectations, including a woman's, can only be judged by her is ignoring reality. It is impossible.
You can shoot the messenger or insult me if you want, but that's a fact. "You're very keen and determined to claim that your opinions are "facts" and "reality". Facts must be supported by evidence or they're little more than supposition. You provide no evidence for any of your "facts". | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
"No not because you're a man, I'm genuinely asking a question. A woman's (or anyones) expectations are no ones business but their own Who is anyone to judge someone and say their expectations are unrealistic and they need to lower their standards. Why should they lower them? To please you? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
"No, I’ve loved it. I’ve enjoyed the clubs and party scene and it’s a fun and safer way to have NSA sex whilst I’m not in a relationship. I’ve made some of the best friends that I have girls weekends or trips with. My relationships are monogamous. I have no interest in swinging with a man I’m dating. I’m clear about that and don’t feel in any way I’m missing out. I think the only thing I can say negatively about fab (not swinging) was when I was early twenties it’s an easy way to get attention and feel good about yourself when “real life” issues are affecting you. For me fab and real life are separate and it’s good to remember that If you use it as a way of zoning out or dealing with somethings easy to get wrapped up in compliments and attention.
This is really interesting. I do wonder if people in general use Fab as a coping mechanism from the harsh realities of life and sometimes let it filter into their reality.
Often, women tend to mistake sexual (and Fab) attention for actual interest from men if they are looking for a relationship. And that sets unnecessary expectation from women in reality, which makes it harder to find in the real world.
Oh dear, that is such a generalisation to assume women on here want more from men. I suspect if most did this isn't where they'd be looking
It’s not an assumption, it’s the truth. Women in general do want more from men on Fab - great body, tall, good looking, big cock, intelligent, sweet, strong, etc etc. Lots of women’s profiles ask for a convo of these attributes.
The point is, you might get this if it’s about sex. But it’s hard to attain this if you want a relationship, and often when women get this at a sexual level (on Fab or not), their expectations for a relationship increase to reflect these attributes as a basic, which is unrealistic in real life cos those men just wanted sex from them, and not more.
Again, not ALL women do this, just in case someone comes to say, not all women.
Men are also very welcome to have standards for the women they meet so why are you making this a thing that only women do?
Some men have standards for the women they meet, of course. But your point is a bit “whataboutism”.
Just because i am talking about women in that post doesn’t mean I am making it a thing that only women do have standards and not men.
However, let’s be honest, women tend to have more high standards for the men they want to meet or be with. I am not saying anything here that is new.
What's your definition of a "high standard" ?
Excelling in all aspects - social, sexual, career, emotionally intelligent, looks, etc etc.
Hopefully we don’t need to branch off into this as that would be splitting hairs.
OK and if a woman wants this standard how does that affect anyone but the woman involved?
In addition to the women, it affects men too and ripples across society as a whole. If standards are unrealistically (and I mean just that) high, then a lot of average men don’t find wives and partners, populations dwindle, relationships break down quickly over things that don’t matter in the grand scheme of life, etc.
See China, South Korea and even Western Europe and the US as examples
When I wasn't attracting any interest from potential partners when I was younger, I was told to work on myself.
Funny how when men can't attract any interest, it's not their fault and they need to be given what they want lest society fall apart
Maybe men should work on themselves?
Of course they should work on themselves, but if you are against unrealistic expectations, then working on yourself may not make a difference.
But who are you to say any expectation is unrealistic?
And why shouldn't I be able to say some expectations are unrealistic?
Because I am a man? I don't get your question.
Why are a woman's expectations able to be judged by anyone but her?
What I want should be judged by the standards of what it brings me in my life.
A man's judgement on my expectations is about as important to me as trends in footwear in Peru.
Because people don't live in a vacuum. We all get judged, or judge, in one way or another, as social beings, for what we look like, do or say.
Being judged doesn't mean you can't do what you want, you can. You also have the choice of not taking that seriously, which I think is fantastic.
But let's not pretend that what you do will not be judged.
To say anyone's expectations, including a woman's, can only be judged by her is ignoring reality. It is impossible.
You can shoot the messenger or insult me if you want, but that's a fact.
I think you misunderstand or are trying to be deliberately obtuse to try to get one over me.
If my expectations are unrealistic, what are they unrealistic for?
I set my own goals for what I want in my life. The people I choose to meet or not and the standards I set are against the goals I have in my life. I don't set my expectations or goals on the basis of what other people think of me.
People will have opinions. I don't give a single solitary fuck and they don't change the metrics I choose for goals in my life and how I attain them.
People will judge - have views, gossip, etc.
Only I am able to determine if my expectations are worthy - and yes, that's another form of judgement.
Conflating the two is obviously silly.
If someone is so weak willed that they'd determine their life partner and/ or goals in life by "people might talk" then maybe they should work on themselves. I sense a theme here."On the contrary, you are the one who seems to misunderstand me. You have the freedom of choice and will to set your expectations, want what you want and deem what is worthy to you. Who is disputing that? No one. And it's good you don't care about people's opinions, nor set your goals and expectations on what people think. There's no dispute there. I don't even see where you think there is. My point is simple - people and society form opinions about others and judge others. We can't change this, that's as old as people have been around. There's no theme here. Noone has said "do what we tell you cos you will be judged". You seem to think that solely on your own. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) | |||
