FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Threat of no deal strategy
Threat of no deal strategy
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By *oghunter33 OP Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
Many times in the past one or two years it was argued by Brexit hardliners that taking no deal of the table will leave the UK in a weaker position negotiating a Brexit deal.
The new government seem to persue a threat strategy of no deal with the EU for renegotiating. So far there's no sign of it bearing any fruit, the EU budging on the backstop or reopening negotiation but widening further the division in the UK itself and also the trench between the UK and the EU27.
Will we witness a poker game to the bitter end or a reasoning to communicate rather than divide further? Or is it all a set up to blame the EU for failure of preventing a no deal brexit? |
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I listened to Gove on the news tonight, saying it was the EU not willing to talk. It's the UK that voted to leave. So I don't blame he EU as they are in the driving seat. And Boris with his Tory arrogant attitude that this Tory cabinet all through. |
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"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K.."
Future generations will judge them harshly but sadly the sheep who cannot think critically today will fall for it. |
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"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K.."
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies. |
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The backstop IS the UK's proposal to the EU27 to allow the UK to withdraw from the EU WITHOUT BREAKING the Good Friday Agreement.
BoJo's position is that he is withdrawing from the EU and BREAKING the Good Friday Agreement and it is the EU's fault. I seem to remember (from my modern and military history) a certain Herr Hitler breaking similar legally binding international agreements and claiming it was the other co-signatories who were to blame, I expect that the results for BoJo and the British people will be similar to those for Hitler. The question is will BoJo back down or will he roll the dice? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament. |
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"EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament. "
Remember it is only HM Government that can recall parliament and BoJo is already exploring ways he can prorogue (dismiss) parliament in order to force a no deal brexit through without parliaments agreement. Of course the last time that was done was in 1642 by Charles 1, sparking the English Civil War which concluded on January 30th 1649 with his beheading on a scaffold erected outside the Mansion House on Whitehall. Maybe someone should remind BoJo (and his mates) of what happened to the last man who circumvented parliament to get what he wanted |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament.
Remember it is only HM Government that can recall parliament and BoJo is already exploring ways he can prorogue (dismiss) parliament in order to force a no deal brexit through without parliaments agreement. Of course the last time that was done was in 1642 by Charles 1, sparking the English Civil War which concluded on January 30th 1649 with his beheading on a scaffold erected outside the Mansion House on Whitehall. Maybe someone should remind BoJo (and his mates) of what happened to the last man who circumvented parliament to get what he wanted"
Oh get real not talking about recalling parliament, but none on the news or having any say. Why because most are not even in this country, but first to cry that they being left out. Still as long as they are having a good rest, everything is ok ffs. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. "
IMO the UK has to find a new position. Say what it wants not just what it wants.
But back to the OP, has having no deal on the table helped move the dual the way many have suggested? To date, no. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. "
The ERG has made clear it won't vote for ANY agreement with the EU.
They are the ones driving Britain over the cliff. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The correct way would have been to go to the EU the following week and say, soz my lot have voted out, not what I would have done but hey ho, were leaving in six months once we've prepared to do so, if you wanna chat about a trade agreement, you know where I am.
Chow  |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. "
again... lets try this
the "Backstop" was never proposed by the EU... it was proposed by the UK government to comply with the Good Friday agreement
so whats the proposal Bojo has to comply with the GFA? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Called it, we're now entering the "it's the EU's fault" phase, something Brexiters said would never happen. We hold all the cards though right? Europe will be begging us for a deal right?  |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"The correct way would have been to go to the EU the following week and say, soz my lot have voted out, not what I would have done but hey ho, were leaving in six months once we've prepared to do so, if you wanna chat about a trade agreement, you know where I am.
Chow "
That is what a child might have done.
The real world is slightly more complicated. |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. "
How many times does it need explaining?
"Just walking away" will not in any way, shape or form help the UK in the short, medium or long term.
Right now as members, we retain at least some leverage but once we walk away and voluntarily put ourselves into a weaker position - any leverage that there might have been evaporates. The UK cannot afford to not have a trade deal with the EU because they are our closest neighbours - but no trade deal will be discussed until the underlying principles of a withdrawal agreement have been agreed. The more desperate we become - the more one-sided the future negotiation becomes.
Let's be brutally honest here. "Walking Away" is a cataclysmic failure of British politics and Negotiation. It is an admission of complete failure in the hope (and nothing more) that something might happen in the future.
This country will have failed to negotiate a Withdrawal Agreement with a friendly bloc who will remain our closest neighbours and trading partners. What fucking hope is there going to be of negotiating beneficial trade agreements with hostile nations?
NONE
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away.
again... lets try this
the "Backstop" was never proposed by the EU... it was proposed by the UK government to comply with the Good Friday agreement
so whats the proposal Bojo has to comply with the GFA?"
.
They'll have to find a solution that fits both the republic and the North.
Devolve border control and customs to the northern Irish assembly and get the parliament back up and running, offer Northern Ireland British overseers territory status where there in charge of there own borders but have freedom to travel between the two parties.
As far as most people in the UK are concerned it's a local issue between the island of Ireland anyway. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament.
Remember it is only HM Government that can recall parliament and BoJo is already exploring ways he can prorogue (dismiss) parliament in order to force a no deal brexit through without parliaments agreement. Of course the last time that was done was in 1642 by Charles 1, sparking the English Civil War which concluded on January 30th 1649 with his beheading on a scaffold erected outside the Mansion House on Whitehall. Maybe someone should remind BoJo (and his mates) of what happened to the last man who circumvented parliament to get what he wanted"
Didn't John Major do it last? |
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"EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament.
Remember it is only HM Government that can recall parliament and BoJo is already exploring ways he can prorogue (dismiss) parliament in order to force a no deal brexit through without parliaments agreement. Of course the last time that was done was in 1642 by Charles 1, sparking the English Civil War which concluded on January 30th 1649 with his beheading on a scaffold erected outside the Mansion House on Whitehall. Maybe someone should remind BoJo (and his mates) of what happened to the last man who circumvented parliament to get what he wanted
Didn't John Major do it last? "
He did, although some on here spin it differently. |
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By *andm288Couple
over a year ago
oxford |
"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies."
I suppose all of us 17.4 million that voted to leave a corrupt un elected beauracy are thick and didn’t know what we were voting for ? |
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By *andm288Couple
over a year ago
oxford |
It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
|
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
"
 |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
"
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically. |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically. "
Other views are allowed ...
|
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
"
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it. |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it."
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right |
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By *oghunter33 OP Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
The funny thing is that the British are very much loved accross Europe not because they're a financially contributing member but for their humour, for their multicultural society, for their democratic standards, etc. Unfortunately the image has suffered a lot and trying to blackm@il the EU27 with a no deal threat isn't going to work. I'd love to know how the UK would react if the set of cards would be swapped around. Proroguing the parliament is in my opinion a rather undemocratic move and a unworthy process for a proud democratic nation like the UK to go through. |
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"
Question: who was the last PM to prorogue Parliament?
Answer: John Major
"
Not what I asked, but wrong in any case.
I suspect you are referring to the accusation that John Major called a snap general election and prorogued parliament a day early to bury a damming parliamentary standards report into Neil Hamilton selling parliamentary access to Muhammad Fahad which was the'cash for questions'scandal.
Now let me point out the facts for you.
Firstly parliament is prorogued every year usually in March for a week or 2 before the State Opening of Parliament. It is also prorogued when a general election is called. So your claim that the last time parliament was prorogued was in 1997 is clearly wrong. Secondly, when Major prorogued parliament it was for the legitimate purpose of holding a general election and although dubious ethically it was not to directly subvert the will of parliament. thirdly I will point out that both Hamilton (the cause of the scandal) and Major (the PM) were Tories and the election was called because a judgment was made that calling the election would cause less damage to the Tories that allowing the report to be aired in parliament.
This time BoJo, his fellow brexiteers and the ERG are not proposing calling a snap election as they no longer have that power due to the fixed term parliament act. What they are proposing is to prorogue parliament and keep it shut down until after the 31st October, thus forcing us out of the EU not only without the consent of parliament, but against its express instructions. To the best of my knowledge the last man to do that was Charles 1st.
Finally I will point out that the 'cash for questions' scandal came close to breaking the Tory party in 97 and I suspect that will look like a childrens tea party when compared to the bloodbath facing the Tories if it does turn out to be as bad for the country as many think, especially if BoJo forces us out without the support of parliament.
Guess that's why BoJo, Gove, JRM and all the rest have moved their businesses and money out of the country prior to brexit. |
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"
Question: who was the last PM to prorogue Parliament?
Answer: John Major
Not what I asked, but wrong in any case.
I suspect you are referring to the accusation that John Major called a snap general election and prorogued parliament a day early to bury a damming parliamentary standards report into Neil Hamilton selling parliamentary access to Muhammad Fahad which was the'cash for questions'scandal.
Now let me point out the facts for you.
Firstly parliament is prorogued every year usually in March for a week or 2 before the State Opening of Parliament. It is also prorogued when a general election is called. So your claim that the last time parliament was prorogued was in 1997 is clearly wrong. Secondly, when Major prorogued parliament it was for the legitimate purpose of holding a general election and although dubious ethically it was not to directly subvert the will of parliament. thirdly I will point out that both Hamilton (the cause of the scandal) and Major (the PM) were Tories and the election was called because a judgment was made that calling the election would cause less damage to the Tories that allowing the report to be aired in parliament.
This time BoJo, his fellow brexiteers and the ERG are not proposing calling a snap election as they no longer have that power due to the fixed term parliament act. What they are proposing is to prorogue parliament and keep it shut down until after the 31st October, thus forcing us out of the EU not only without the consent of parliament, but against its express instructions. To the best of my knowledge the last man to do that was Charles 1st.
Finally I will point out that the 'cash for questions' scandal came close to breaking the Tory party in 97 and I suspect that will look like a childrens tea party when compared to the bloodbath facing the Tories if it does turn out to be as bad for the country as many think, especially if BoJo forces us out without the support of parliament.
Guess that's why BoJo, Gove, JRM and all the rest have moved their businesses and money out of the country prior to brexit."
Interesting |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it."
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
"
Yes it costs us money to be in the eu. As we're finding it also costs a lot to be out of it. And that's before any inflationary increases from tarriffs or knocks on tax receipts from lower gdp (even leavers seem to be conceding theres some hit coming especially under no deal.)
Yes the eu export more than we do. But you don't just look at the chips on the table to see which player is sweating the most, you look at what is left behind. We have 40% of our chips down. They have something like 8%. Sure its bigger in pound amounts. But they have deeper pockets.
And finally you can be proud and vote remain. But pride doth butter no parsnips. If attitude is all it takes, one wonders why we didn't just take a more positive attitude to being in the eu. It's a nice sentiment. But singing ones national anthem loudest doesn't overcome a lack of ability. |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Future generations will judge them harshly but sadly the sheep who cannot think critically today will fall for it."
For doing what was asked by the people,even if Brexit is a disaster that is not the point they have to fullfill the will of the people and take us out |
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"For doing what was asked by the people,even if Brexit is a disaster that is not the point they have to fullfill the will of the people and take us out"
You are either badly misinformed or deliberately misrepresenting the sworn duty of an MP. |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"For doing what was asked by the people,even if Brexit is a disaster that is not the point they have to fullfill the will of the people and take us out
You are either badly misinformed or deliberately misrepresenting the sworn duty of an MP."
I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For doing what was asked by the people,even if Brexit is a disaster that is not the point they have to fullfill the will of the people and take us out
You are either badly misinformed or deliberately misrepresenting the sworn duty of an MP.I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main"
In this instance, if the will of the people is so easily twisted to serve the already rich and powerful, at the expense of those who voted for Brexit. Then what's the point of upholding it? |
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"I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main"
You may not think so but I am stating fact. Every MP, be they members of The Commons or Lords has to take an oath of office before taking their seat in parliament. That oath is very clear and it does not mention the electorate at all. Fact is it is an MP's sworn duty to be faithful and bear true allegiance to The Crown (state). Like it or not if an MP votes against their conscience to appease their electorate they break that oath.
|
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right "
No, the facts do. |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do."
You haven’t presented any facts |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol"
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening? |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main
You may not think so but I am stating fact. Every MP, be they members of The Commons or Lords has to take an oath of office before taking their seat in parliament. That oath is very clear and it does not mention the electorate at all. Fact is it is an MP's sworn duty to be faithful and bear true allegiance to The Crown (state). Like it or not if an MP votes against their conscience to appease their electorate they break that oath.
"
I disagree with your interpretation,many do |
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"I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main
You may not think so but I am stating fact. Every MP, be they members of The Commons or Lords has to take an oath of office before taking their seat in parliament. That oath is very clear and it does not mention the electorate at all. Fact is it is an MP's sworn duty to be faithful and bear true allegiance to The Crown (state). Like it or not if an MP votes against their conscience to appease their electorate they break that oath.
I disagree with your interpretation,many do"
Do you also disagree with maths and physics? |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do.
You haven’t presented any facts"
This will be good, she will state she’s given you many facts and your stupid not to of seen them |
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or View forums list | |
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do.
You haven’t presented any facts
This will be good, she will state she’s given you many facts and your stupid not to of seen them "
She's a he. Thanks for demonstrating one of my points.
How's this for a fact.
Leave voters are generally less educated. That doesn't directly correlate with being less intelligent but it's makes you wonder. |
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or View forums list | |
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?"
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here |
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"I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main
You may not think so but I am stating fact. Every MP, be they members of The Commons or Lords has to take an oath of office before taking their seat in parliament. That oath is very clear and it does not mention the electorate at all. Fact is it is an MP's sworn duty to be faithful and bear true allegiance to The Crown (state). Like it or not if an MP votes against their conscience to appease their electorate they break that oath.
"
Likewise, when the electorate vote in a democratic way such as they did to leave the EU, I don’t imagine for one minute they thought that whatever the outcome of their vote, it wouldn’t be exercised because MPs didn’t want to break this oath.
Are we really to believe that we will be governed according to the personal belief of an MP and not by a democratic decision we made?
It seems that way with your interpretation! |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do.
You haven’t presented any facts
This will be good, she will state she’s given you many facts and your stupid not to of seen them
She's a he. Thanks for demonstrating one of my points.
How's this for a fact.
Leave voters are generally less educated. That doesn't directly correlate with being less intelligent but it's makes you wonder."
?? How does that demonstrate one of your points ??
“ leave voters are generally less educated “
Ok I guess you got something to prove that fact with ?? |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I do not think so in this circumstance I am correct of course it is being twisted by self serving polititions who are ordinary elected people in the main
You may not think so but I am stating fact. Every MP, be they members of The Commons or Lords has to take an oath of office before taking their seat in parliament. That oath is very clear and it does not mention the electorate at all. Fact is it is an MP's sworn duty to be faithful and bear true allegiance to The Crown (state). Like it or not if an MP votes against their conscience to appease their electorate they break that oath.
Likewise, when the electorate vote in a democratic way such as they did to leave the EU, I don’t imagine for one minute they thought that whatever the outcome of their vote, it wouldn’t be exercised because MPs didn’t want to break this oath.
Are we really to believe that we will be governed according to the personal belief of an MP and not by a democratic decision we made?
It seems that way with your interpretation!"
It was an advisory referendum.
We are leaving the EU.
Brexit has proven once and for all the democratic is a sham and an illusion. |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
"
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum . |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum . "
This. Is. Amazing.
It's really interesting to see how far detached some people are from the reality of the world around them.
People often asked, "what needs to happen before leavers will see that they're wrong".
From a purely scientific or phycological perfective it's interesting to see how far this will go. |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here"
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
.... |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do.
You haven’t presented any facts
This will be good, she will state she’s given you many facts and your stupid not to of seen them
She's a he. Thanks for demonstrating one of my points.
How's this for a fact.
Leave voters are generally less educated. That doesn't directly correlate with being less intelligent but it's makes you wonder.
?? How does that demonstrate one of your points ??
“ leave voters are generally less educated “
Ok I guess you got something to prove that fact with ?? "
It's been discussed on many threads. |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
...."
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
It is because of delusional fantasy like this that we are in the place where we are right now. It is the very epitome of exceptionalism for no reason other than Britishness.
Continued delusional fantasy like this will not make things better - it will make things much, much worse simply because your denial of the realities of the world is blinded by your own righteous indignation.
It is very easy to stir up Nationalism fervour amongst those who are unable or unwilling to think critically.
Other views are allowed ...
You have every right to be dillusional. And we every right to call you out for it.
Yes
Still doesn’t make you right
No, the facts do.
You haven’t presented any facts
This will be good, she will state she’s given you many facts and your stupid not to of seen them
She's a he. Thanks for demonstrating one of my points.
How's this for a fact.
Leave voters are generally less educated. That doesn't directly correlate with being less intelligent but it's makes you wonder.
?? How does that demonstrate one of your points ??
“ leave voters are generally less educated “
Ok I guess you got something to prove that fact with ??
It's been discussed on many threads."
So that’s a no then, again no facts lol |
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|
By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
hey.... pats back!!!! lets see what rambling he adds to the convo....
" Hi. A great post . The voice of reality."
oooh... thats just mean you found another loony to subscribe to your lunacy isn't it...
"No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK."
... with more red tape... and higher overheads......with fewer oppotunities to get best value deals...
"The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms. "
"different" terms meaning more expensive terms..... gotcha!!!
"On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart. "
nope... and its this sort of jingoistic shit that got us into this mess in the first place
"Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that. "
your right.... like that fool who would get a better deal buying the house overall as a "collective"... but still wants to buy it alone at a more expensive rate...
my god that person would be stupid!
"At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum . "
... or pushing the lemmings over the cliff.....
so.... hows "pravda" these days..... |
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"hey.... pats back!!!! lets see what rambling he adds to the convo....
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality.
oooh... thats just mean you found another loony to subscribe to your lunacy isn't it...
No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK.
... with more red tape... and higher overheads......with fewer oppotunities to get best value deals...
The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
"different" terms meaning more expensive terms..... gotcha!!!
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
nope... and its this sort of jingoistic shit that got us into this mess in the first place
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
your right.... like that fool who would get a better deal buying the house overall as a "collective"... but still wants to buy it alone at a more expensive rate...
my god that person would be stupid!
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum .
... or pushing the lemmings over the cliff.....
so.... hows "pravda" these days....."
Shit if your taking the piss out of someone and you feel superior ,, wow this pat must be gutted |
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"I disagree with your interpretation,many do"
Then you disagree with settled law. You may also believe that the world is flat and was created 10,000 years ago, many do, they are also wrong.
By the way, I will remind you that one of the reasons put forward by the leave campaign was to return power to parliament, not to the PM and government. However we now find the people who led that campaign are now demanding that parliament be ignored. As for those who say MP's should do as they are told, that is not nor has it ever been how parliament works. It is the duty of MP's to do the best for the country, if we (the electorate) don't like the job they do in our name it is up to us to vote them out of office at the next general election.
One final point, if the referendum had been a legally binding plebiscite then the result would have been voided by the courts on the grounds of fraud, but it was not therefore they do not have the power to void the result and it is a decision for parliament (that is what the judges in the supreme court said).
Everyone should be asking themselves why these Tory politicians are so determined to force us out of the EU while at the same time transferring their businesses and wealth out of the UK and into countries remaining in the EU? The only logical answer I can come up with is they are all betting against the UK and have their chubby little money-grubbing fingers firmly pressed down on the scales to ensure they win at our expense. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. "
Here here, I cannot wait for everything to become cheaper once we add tarrifs to all imports and exports  |
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"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum . "
Different name, same utter tripe.... |
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|
By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
"
What a daft thing to say.
A buyer and a seller who cannot agree walk away with what they started with.
Not so here.
The UK is already living in the house. You seem to think being out on the streets will be a preferable outcome.
How very silly.
|
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|
By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Costa back with his lies, sadly we can't post memes on here so I'll just do the text...
"How many times do we have to teach you this lesson, Old Man?"
 "
What lies would they be? please elaborate and what lesson are you teaching? your post makes no sense whatsoever. |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum . "
Expand on best? I'm intrigued what can be better than no tarrifs and no friction. |
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|
By *ild_oatsMan
over a year ago
the land of saints & sinners |
"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies.
I suppose all of us 17.4 million that voted to leave a corrupt un elected beauracy are thick and didn’t know what we were voting for ?"
Which bit of the EU is unelected...
MEP’s ? - You vote for them
Council of Ministers ? - Heads of member governments (You voted in General election)
EU commission? - Proposed by Council of Ministers - Voted in by the MEP’s (who you elected)
As opposed to any UK government commission- directly appointed by the government of the day. I wonder where the democratic deficit lies.... ?
Most people who come up with these statements don’t on the whole understand how the EU works.
I’m not advocating leave or remain you just need to understand something before making inaccurate comments.
|
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It appears that this thread is full of Remainers
Let’s not forget the money that we send the EU
Not the bullshit 350 million a week
Let’s not forget we import more off them then they do off us
If trade negotiations are down professionally then I can’t see a major problem
Granted their may be a bump or two for the next six months
But we are Great Britain stand up and be proud of your country
Hi. A great post . The voice of reality. No deal simply means the best possible trading relationship for the UK. The EU will still be our closest trading partners and we will simply carry on trading with them, but on different terms.
On a simplistic basis those who support no deal are UK citizens who have their countries best interest at heart.
Can you imagine trying to buy a house and telling the buyer that you would buy it regardless. Only a fool would do that.
At least we now have a cabinet who are putting the interests of the electorate first and fulfilling the results of the referendum .
Expand on best? I'm intrigued what can be better than no tarrifs and no friction. "
Tarrifs and barriers makes everything cheaper and easier, didn't you know that lol
They may be advocating the unilateral removal of over 80% of tarrifs but that is a serious lack of judgement as other countries would have no need to negotiate a trade deal with us if we're already giving everything away for free. |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies.
I suppose all of us 17.4 million that voted to leave a corrupt un elected beauracy are thick and didn’t know what we were voting for ?
Which bit of the EU is unelected...
MEP’s ? - You vote for them
Council of Ministers ? - Heads of member governments (You voted in General election)
EU commission? - Proposed by Council of Ministers - Voted in by the MEP’s (who you elected)
As opposed to any UK government commission- directly appointed by the government of the day. I wonder where the democratic deficit lies.... ?
Most people who come up with these statements don’t on the whole understand how the EU works.
I’m not advocating leave or remain you just need to understand something before making inaccurate comments.
"
The people who drone on with this unelected bullshit don't look past media headline snippets  |
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"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies.
I suppose all of us 17.4 million that voted to leave a corrupt un elected beauracy are thick and didn’t know what we were voting for ?
Which bit of the EU is unelected...
MEP’s ? - You vote for them
Council of Ministers ? - Heads of member governments (You voted in General election)
EU commission? - Proposed by Council of Ministers - Voted in by the MEP’s (who you elected)
As opposed to any UK government commission- directly appointed by the government of the day. I wonder where the democratic deficit lies.... ?
Most people who come up with these statements don’t on the whole understand how the EU works.
I’m not advocating leave or remain you just need to understand something before making inaccurate comments.
The people who drone on with this unelected bullshit don't look past media headline snippets "
And those who do look past the snippets are shocked to find It’s all true  |
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"EU, MEPs and most of our MPs well all labour MPs anyway are all on holiday. So things must be ok and nothing to worry about, if there was our so call MPs would be dealing with it.
Got to laugh at our so called parliament.
Remember it is only HM Government that can recall parliament and BoJo is already exploring ways he can prorogue (dismiss) parliament in order to force a no deal brexit through without parliaments agreement. Of course the last time that was done was in 1642 by Charles 1, sparking the English Civil War which concluded on January 30th 1649 with his beheading on a scaffold erected outside the Mansion House on Whitehall. Maybe someone should remind BoJo (and his mates) of what happened to the last man who circumvented parliament to get what he wanted"
Or even Cromwell in1655.
Maybe he see s himself as a modern Cromwell. |
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"Or even Cromwell in1655.
Maybe he see s himself as a modern Cromwell. "
i had forgotten that little bit of history. Thanks for the reminder. You may well be right and if so it explains why he has such a hard-on for restarting the sectarian troubles in NI and forcing those European Catholics out of England and if it does cause the NHS to collapse all the better it can be sold off to those hard working puritan exiles in the American colonies. "They know how to treat the golliwogs, piccaninnies with watermelon smiles and Muslim women who look like bank-robbers and letterboxes! And we can play wiff-waff 'On the road to Mandalay'...
Appologies to any who feel offended or insulted by the above, I am reminding us all of exactly who our Prime Minister is and things he has said in public, on the record, while in high public office. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
The agricultural expert commented: ‘Northern Ireland is more than self-sufficient, certainly where dairy and beef is concerned. We as part of the UK, feed the rest of the UK. But the n****r in the wood pile would be imports…’
Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2019/08/08/bbc-guest-used-n-word-discussing-impact-brexit-farmers-10540295/?ito=amp-more-item-1?ito=cbshare |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"They’ve already started blaming the EU. You only have to listen to Goves latest comments.
You’d think it was the EU that decided to leave the U.K..
Yep. This. Nobody's fault but those who voted Leave; who, as we are constantly reminded, knew what they were voting for.
Which means the government should stop looking for someone else to blame and lay the responsibility where it actually lies.
I suppose all of us 17.4 million that voted to leave a corrupt un elected beauracy are thick and didn’t know what we were voting for ?
Which bit of the EU is unelected...
MEP’s ? - You vote for them
Council of Ministers ? - Heads of member governments (You voted in General election)
EU commission? - Proposed by Council of Ministers - Voted in by the MEP’s (who you elected)
As opposed to any UK government commission- directly appointed by the government of the day. I wonder where the democratic deficit lies.... ?
Most people who come up with these statements don’t on the whole understand how the EU works.
I’m not advocating leave or remain you just need to understand something before making inaccurate comments.
The people who drone on with this unelected bullshit don't look past media headline snippets
And those who do look past the snippets are shocked to find It’s all true "
I'd love to hear your explanation then |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate "
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour. |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour."
Lol really lol
Well judging by the first part it sounds like I’m talking to the pretty one again, and that you may of had a drink tonight
No you said your proof that trump was racist was because and I quote “ How about you start with his relatively recent comments about Mexicans being rapi$ts and work back from there. “ and I showed you the whole comment and explained how it wasn’t racist ,, my stance wasn’t so that proves he isn’t racist ,, it was more about that particular comment wasn’t racist and that you were wrong, and you were
I asking if you had anything else to try and prove he was racist and that’s when you started getting stroppy
Feel free to go over the thread again to see but it might be worth waiting till the morning |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour.
Lol really lol
Well judging by the first part it sounds like I’m talking to the pretty one again, and that you may of had a drink tonight
No you said your proof that trump was racist was because and I quote “ How about you start with his relatively recent comments about Mexicans being rapi$ts and work back from there. “ and I showed you the whole comment and explained how it wasn’t racist ,, my stance wasn’t so that proves he isn’t racist ,, it was more about that particular comment wasn’t racist and that you were wrong, and you were
I asking if you had anything else to try and prove he was racist and that’s when you started getting stroppy
Feel free to go over the thread again to see but it might be worth waiting till the morning "
Ha. Who's the pretty one?
And I have plenty more but as I also pointed out previously you'd swear black was white so why waste my time explaining your errors? |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour.
Lol really lol
Well judging by the first part it sounds like I’m talking to the pretty one again, and that you may of had a drink tonight
No you said your proof that trump was racist was because and I quote “ How about you start with his relatively recent comments about Mexicans being rapi$ts and work back from there. “ and I showed you the whole comment and explained how it wasn’t racist ,, my stance wasn’t so that proves he isn’t racist ,, it was more about that particular comment wasn’t racist and that you were wrong, and you were
I asking if you had anything else to try and prove he was racist and that’s when you started getting stroppy
Feel free to go over the thread again to see but it might be worth waiting till the morning
Ha. Who's the pretty one?
And I have plenty more but as I also pointed out previously you'd swear black was white so why waste my time explaining your errors?"
Lol not the one with the brains obviously
I said if you can provide a fact that he is I will change my mind, but I haven’t seen one yet and the one you mentioned certainly wasn’t so until you do I’ve no reason to think he is
Love not hate |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour.
Lol really lol
Well judging by the first part it sounds like I’m talking to the pretty one again, and that you may of had a drink tonight
No you said your proof that trump was racist was because and I quote “ How about you start with his relatively recent comments about Mexicans being rapi$ts and work back from there. “ and I showed you the whole comment and explained how it wasn’t racist ,, my stance wasn’t so that proves he isn’t racist ,, it was more about that particular comment wasn’t racist and that you were wrong, and you were
I asking if you had anything else to try and prove he was racist and that’s when you started getting stroppy
Feel free to go over the thread again to see but it might be worth waiting till the morning
Ha. Who's the pretty one?
And I have plenty more but as I also pointed out previously you'd swear black was white so why waste my time explaining your errors?
Lol not the one with the brains obviously
I said if you can provide a fact that he is I will change my mind, but I haven’t seen one yet and the one you mentioned certainly wasn’t so until you do I’ve no reason to think he is
Love not hate"
So, you were saying women are less intelligent then.
You know, not only are leave voters generally less educated there does seem to be strong correlation between both these things AND being sexist and a racist fan.
Any other prejudices you wanna share? |
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"
Good to see your still acting maturely and open to debate as always lol
Oh hello. The last time we spoke you were calling women stupid and apologising for racists.
Should I expect the same this evening?
Lol wrong again I was saying one of you were not women and who were the racists ? You never gave any facts ,, this does by the looks of it seem to be your trait on here
What you said in the Race Hate thread was:
'Hang on as your a couple am I now talking to the pretty one as opposed to the brainier ( term used very loosely) from the other day'
In other words 'the woman must be stupid'.
And Trump was the racist you were apologising for.
....
Lol so your purely guessing I meant the woman was the pretty one and not the brains?? Sounds a little sexist to me, but that’s up to you I guess
And I’m not apologising for trump or anyone, you said he was racist, I asked you what facts you had to back it up and you had none
If I remember you tried to say that trump said that all Mexicans are rapi$!s and I proved to you that wasn’t what he said then you started getting all funny and defensive
Please love not hate
iven your profile lists you as a straight male I'm pretty sure you who you were referring to as the less intelligent one.
And no, I never said Trump said all Mexicans were r*apists. Your stance was that because he didn't say that proved he wasn't racist.
At that point I didn't get defensive I just decided two could play at that game and mirrored your own behaviour.
Lol really lol
Well judging by the first part it sounds like I’m talking to the pretty one again, and that you may of had a drink tonight
No you said your proof that trump was racist was because and I quote “ How about you start with his relatively recent comments about Mexicans being rapi$ts and work back from there. “ and I showed you the whole comment and explained how it wasn’t racist ,, my stance wasn’t so that proves he isn’t racist ,, it was more about that particular comment wasn’t racist and that you were wrong, and you were
I asking if you had anything else to try and prove he was racist and that’s when you started getting stroppy
Feel free to go over the thread again to see but it might be worth waiting till the morning
Ha. Who's the pretty one?
And I have plenty more but as I also pointed out previously you'd swear black was white so why waste my time explaining your errors?
Lol not the one with the brains obviously
I said if you can provide a fact that he is I will change my mind, but I haven’t seen one yet and the one you mentioned certainly wasn’t so until you do I’ve no reason to think he is
Love not hate
So, you were saying women are less intelligent then.
You know, not only are leave voters generally less educated there does seem to be strong correlation between both these things AND being sexist and a racist fan.
Any other prejudices you wanna share?"
Lol that’s your MO all over lol 3 statements / accusations and none of them backed with facts or proof , I wondering if you know how debating works , your not very good at this are you ?
And who said women are less intelligent? Maybe the male is the pretty one, but it’s certainly not someone intelligent I’m talking to now
Love not hate |
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"so whats the answer? the uk parliament wont vote for the withdrawal agreement with the backstop in it (voted down 3 times) and the eu wont change it.If either side is not willing to talk then thats it no need for blame just walk away. "
The answer is simple.
Just cancel article 50.
|
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Throw the DUP under the bus and sign up to a backstop for NI only.
It's an insurance policy for the Belfast Agreement, one that only comes into play if the rest of the UK begins to diverge from the single market after the 2-year transition and no alternative arrangement for NI has been found.
Unfortunately, it has been weaponized by the extremists on the Tory benches whose sole objective is to sever all links with our neighbours. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Throw the DUP under the bus and sign up to a backstop for NI only.
It's an insurance policy for the Belfast Agreement, one that only comes into play if the rest of the UK begins to diverge from the single market after the 2-year transition and no alternative arrangement for NI has been found.
Unfortunately, it has been weaponized by the extremists on the Tory benches whose sole objective is to sever all links with our neighbours."
As far as NI is concerned the DUP have the most MPs and anyone who believes in democracy will follow their decisions and guidance. The residents of NI are very loyal to the UK and do not wish to be treated any differently to the rest of the UK.
It is interesting to note that you want to throw the DUP under a bus .
|
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Lol the people of NI voted to stay in the EU. The backstop is consistent with that and the GFA.
The DUP are the ones who want neither. Dump them in a shitpile where those maggots belong. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Lol the people of NI voted to stay in the EU. The backstop is consistent with that and the GFA.
The DUP are the ones who want neither. Dump them in a shitpile where those maggots belong."
I bet you would not dare say that to the face of any DUP MP. At least the DUP are representing the interests of the residents of Northern Ireland . In addition they secured an extra £2 billion of funding for every resident of NI. At least they are putting people first. Even Sinn Fein were pleased with the additional contribution . |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Lol the people of NI voted to stay in the EU. The backstop is consistent with that and the GFA.
The DUP are the ones who want neither. Dump them in a shitpile where those maggots belong."
Celtic supporter who hates the dup why dont you just come out and be honest? 1/2 of your posts are not political at all they are based on religious bias. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Which statement is untrue?
The DUP opposed the Good Friday Agreement.
The DUP opposed the backstop.
Neither.
The DUP has this Government by the short and curlies.
Meanwhile, the wishes of the majority in NI are sidelined because of a grubby bribe given by Mrs May to the political wing of loyalist terrorists.
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It's an interesting question.
Do DUPs represent
1) the will of those who voted for them?
2) the will of their constituencies?
3) the will of NI?
4) the will of the UK?
5) whatever they said in their manifesto.
6) none of the above. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"1/2 of your posts are not political at all they are based on religious bias.
What religion do you think I am?
What posts are you referring to?
"
Any time you mention the dup the derogatory terms you use and a celtic supporter dont take einstien to work that out im surprised i didnt notice before.Now im comfortable discussing politics with people of opposing views but when it comes to religion or race i dont want to get involved as to easy to be misunderstood. |
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We import more than we export to the EU.
The Irish PM admits that a "No Deal" BREXIT will harm his country.
The EU themselves admitted there is a way of having electronic customs checks without a "hard" border.
Whilst it isn't going to go smoothly, I think that the EU (or at least the industries therein) risk far more of a bumpy ride than we do, and so I think that pressure will be bought to bear on Macron, Merkel etc to soften their stance.
Its just a waiting game whilst they figure out how to do it without losing face.
Bottom line, they wanted to "punish" us for daring to think we could leave, to stop other countries thinking it was a good idea.....I think they will have to re-think that. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Whose wife is gonna be angrier if they lose... The guy with £10,000 on the table and £12,000 in his bank... Or the guy with £12k on then table and £120k in the bank. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"1/2 of your posts are not political at all they are based on religious bias.
What religion do you think I am?
What posts are you referring to?
Any time you mention the dup the derogatory terms you use and a celtic supporter dont take einstien to work that out im surprised i didnt notice before.Now im comfortable discussing politics with people of opposing views but when it comes to religion or race i dont want to get involved as to easy to be misunderstood. "
Aha!
Likes Glasgow Celtic, dislikes the DUP?
Must by a pope worshipper.
Hmmm, as prejudices go, that's really dumb, that's really misunderstood.
Wanna try again at showing your ignorance?
|
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"We import more than we export to the EU.
The Irish PM admits that a "No Deal" BREXIT will harm his country.
The EU themselves admitted there is a way of having electronic customs checks without a "hard" border.
Whilst it isn't going to go smoothly, I think that the EU (or at least the industries therein) risk far more of a bumpy ride than we do, and so I think that pressure will be bought to bear on Macron, Merkel etc to soften their stance.
Its just a waiting game whilst they figure out how to do it without losing face.
Bottom line, they wanted to "punish" us for daring to think we could leave, to stop other countries thinking it was a good idea.....I think they will have to re-think that."
Are you going to stop buying products from EU countries?
If not, I do not understand your logic. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"1/2 of your posts are not political at all they are based on religious bias.
What religion do you think I am?
What posts are you referring to?
Any time you mention the dup the derogatory terms you use and a celtic supporter dont take einstien to work that out im surprised i didnt notice before.Now im comfortable discussing politics with people of opposing views but when it comes to religion or race i dont want to get involved as to easy to be misunderstood.
Aha!
Likes Glasgow Celtic, dislikes the DUP?
Must by a pope worshipper.
Hmmm, as prejudices go, that's really dumb, that's really misunderstood.
Wanna try again at showing your ignorance?
"
Your posts are not a dislike of the dup the rhetoric you use is hate so yes i do think that. |
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"We import more than we export to the EU.
The Irish PM admits that a "No Deal" BREXIT will harm his country.
The EU themselves admitted there is a way of having electronic customs checks without a "hard" border.
Whilst it isn't going to go smoothly, I think that the EU (or at least the industries therein) risk far more of a bumpy ride than we do, and so I think that pressure will be bought to bear on Macron, Merkel etc to soften their stance.
Its just a waiting game whilst they figure out how to do it without losing face.
Bottom line, they wanted to "punish" us for daring to think we could leave, to stop other countries thinking it was a good idea.....I think they will have to re-think that.
Are you going to stop buying products from EU countries?
If not, I do not understand your logic."
One word... Tariffs.
If they decide to play silly buggers, we ramp up tariffs on their goods coming in.
Sure, they will do the same to us, but as we import more than we export then they will suffer more.
EU business will soon make their feelings known to the EU politicians. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"I'll happily state I find the DUP to be poison in the political discourse.
I'll happily state, too, your sectarian prejudice is just that.
"
I told you i dont have sectarian predudice thats why you dont find me posting on those threads but i spent too many years working in scotland not to recognize it. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"
One word... Tariffs.
"
The UK Government has declared that 85 per cent of goods coming into the UK after Brexit will be tariff free.
It appears the UK Government is more worried about inflation getting out of hand here than indulging in a trade war with neighbours . . . who happen to be 10 times our size, btw.
If your gonna pick a fight, pick one you can win.
|
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"I'll happily state I find the DUP to be poison in the political discourse.
I'll happily state, too, your sectarian prejudice is just that.
I told you i dont have sectarian predudice thats why you dont find me posting on those threads but i spent too many years working in scotland not to recognize it."
Let me put it this way.
Only one contributor keeps bringing up religion on this thread.
To smear another contributor.
And it's not me.
|
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"I'll happily state I find the DUP to be poison in the political discourse.
I'll happily state, too, your sectarian prejudice is just that.
I told you i dont have sectarian predudice thats why you dont find me posting on those threads but i spent too many years working in scotland not to recognize it.
Let me put it this way.
Only one contributor keeps bringing up religion on this thread.
To smear another contributor.
And it's not me.
"
|
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"
One word... Tariffs.
If they decide to play silly buggers, we ramp up tariffs on their goods coming in.
Sure, they will do the same to us, but as we import more than we export then they will suffer more.
EU business will soon make their feelings known to the EU politicians."
thanks for showing the complete lack of understanding of how the WTO tariff rules work....
if you were to ramp up tariffs for one country then you would have to ramp up tariffs for all countries!!!
between that and the almost parity of the pound against the euro... against tell me who suffers most
the answer to that is the common man in the street!!! |
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"Lol the people of NI voted to stay in the EU. The backstop is consistent with that and the GFA.
The DUP are the ones who want neither. Dump them in a shitpile where those maggots belong."
I find a slight inconsistency in both sides of the BREXIT argument when it comes to Northern Ireland.
The Leave side argue that we should ignore the MPs in Parliament when it comes to BREXIT and only go by Leaves interpretation of the 'will of the people' as expressed in the 2016 referendum. However, when it comes to Northern Ireland and a possible border on the island of Ireland suddenly the 'will of the people' of Northern Ireland as expressed in the 2016 referendum and the 1998 GFA referendum no longer matters and we should only listen to their democratically elected representatives (mostly the DUP). Remainers seem to argue the two opposite positions on the same issue. Both are inconsistent. Either you believe in a parliamentary, representative democracy or you don't. You can't choose the democracy you want depending on how likely that particular version of democracy is going to get the result you want.
I personally believe in representative, parliamentary democracy and that the true will of all the people of the UK is reflected and represented solely and wholy by Parliament alone. Because of this I absolutely believe that the duly elected representatives of the people, sitting in parliament, should always be listened to and that no other democratic process, especially referendum and plebiscites, has more legitimacy or is a better representative of the true 'will of ALL the people' than Parliament. In this regard, much as I disagree with them and what they say and stand for, we cannot disregard the voices of the DUP's elected MPs when it comes to the aspects of BREXIT that directly effect Northern Ireland. The people's representatives in Parliament must be heard and must ultimately be aloud to decide this whole BREXIT issue themselves. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I largely agree with the above, but am not sure I wholeyvagree with the idea the DUP are the majority voice for the Irish border. While part of the union, other than devolved matters, we have one parliament. Decisions made about the NI border can affect all borders. So sure, DUP can more strongly represent Irish views, and snp Scottish. But that doesn't mean they have a casting vote on UK wide issues. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
There are 18 constituencies in Northern Ireland. The DUP hold 10.
The DUP opposed the Good Friday Agreement and campaigned for Brexit.
It seems obvious to me the DUP sees Brexit as an opportunity to drive a wedge into the objectives of the GFA and consolidate the position of unionists within the British state.
Were it not for Mrs May's disastrous election call in 2017, which made her a captive of the extremists in her own party and the DUP, the original Withdrawal Agreement may well have scraped through Parliament, safeguarding the GFA and implementing Brexit in a way that was consistent with the majority opinion in NI (remain).
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"There are 18 constituencies in Northern Ireland. The DUP hold 10.
The DUP opposed the Good Friday Agreement and campaigned for Brexit.
It seems obvious to me the DUP sees Brexit as an opportunity to drive a wedge into the objectives of the GFA and consolidate the position of unionists within the British state.
Were it not for Mrs May's disastrous election call in 2017, which made her a captive of the extremists in her own party and the DUP, the original Withdrawal Agreement may well have scraped through Parliament, safeguarding the GFA and implementing Brexit in a way that was consistent with the majority opinion in NI (remain).
"
However the referendum was not for individual countries, it was for the UK as a whole. The citizens of NI are quite happy to accept the result of the referendum and in any event wish to remain aligned with the UK.
The GFA is probably irrelevant now and is only being used as a tactic to obstruct Brexit.
The DUP represent the interests of the citizens of NI. To state the blatantly obvious that is why they were elected . |
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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
"There are 18 constituencies in Northern Ireland. The DUP hold 10.
The DUP opposed the Good Friday Agreement and campaigned for Brexit.
It seems obvious to me the DUP sees Brexit as an opportunity to drive a wedge into the objectives of the GFA and consolidate the position of unionists within the British state.
Were it not for Mrs May's disastrous election call in 2017, which made her a captive of the extremists in her own party and the DUP, the original Withdrawal Agreement may well have scraped through Parliament, safeguarding the GFA and implementing Brexit in a way that was consistent with the majority opinion in NI (remain).
However the referendum was not for individual countries, it was for the UK as a whole. The citizens of NI are quite happy to accept the result of the referendum and in any event wish to remain aligned with the UK.
The GFA is probably irrelevant now and is only being used as a tactic to obstruct Brexit.
The DUP represent the interests of the citizens of NI. To state the blatantly obvious that is why they were elected . "
Again, to be technically correct, only 35% of the eligible vote in NI voted to Remain.
So its also correct to say that NI didn't vote to Remain. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
However the referendum was not for individual countries, it was for the UK as a whole. The citizens of NI are quite happy to accept the result of the referendum and in any event wish to remain aligned with the UK.
The GFA is probably irrelevant now and is only being used as a tactic to obstruct Brexit.
The DUP represent the interests of the citizens of NI. To state the blatantly obvious that is why they were elected . "
I think with even the most basic undertaking of research you'd find that the majority of the voting public in Northern Ireland voted to remain in the EU.
44.2% of people in Northern Ireland voted to leave the EU, while 55.8% voted to remain.
The 2 main political parties in Northern Ireland have polar opposite views on the union.
The DUP supports the union and Sinn Féin does not.
The DUP have the majority on that platform alone most probably and Brexit is of second importance as long as Brexit upholds The Good Friday Agreement.
So no I do not think "The GFA is probably irrelevant" as you put it and I do not think the majority of Northern Ireland people would agree with you either. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"There are 18 constituencies in Northern Ireland. The DUP hold 10.
The DUP opposed the Good Friday Agreement and campaigned for Brexit.
It seems obvious to me the DUP sees Brexit as an opportunity to drive a wedge into the objectives of the GFA and consolidate the position of unionists within the British state.
Were it not for Mrs May's disastrous election call in 2017, which made her a captive of the extremists in her own party and the DUP, the original Withdrawal Agreement may well have scraped through Parliament, safeguarding the GFA and implementing Brexit in a way that was consistent with the majority opinion in NI (remain).
However the referendum was not for individual countries, it was for the UK as a whole. The citizens of NI are quite happy to accept the result of the referendum and in any event wish to remain aligned with the UK.
The GFA is probably irrelevant now and is only being used as a tactic to obstruct Brexit.
The DUP represent the interests of the citizens of NI. To state the blatantly obvious that is why they were elected . "
DUP are elected to represent the constituencies who vote them in. They are not elected to be the voice for NI. As you say they are part of the UK (when it comes to our democratic processes)
So of the gfa is dead, why have no brexiteers suggested a hard border. All sides have the gfa and its implications in mind. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
It is patently obvious the DUP is pursuing a policy on Brexit that is contrary to majority opinion in Northern Ireland.
The public voted to Remain, but the DUP insists on making them leave, and in a way that drives a wedge between the unionist and republican communities.
History will not judge them kindly, I fear |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I think 4 of the 10 aren't even carrying out the will of their constituencies.
While i suspect dup are even more loyal than Labour, if Labour MP's should be worried about their seats (as many a leave voice says) the same holds here... |
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I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA."
It guess it depends on weather the UK's continued access to the single market and or customs union is part of the Good Friday Agreement. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It is patently obvious the DUP is pursuing a policy on Brexit that is contrary to majority opinion in Northern Ireland.
The public voted to Remain, but the DUP insists on making them leave, and in a way that drives a wedge between the unionist and republican communities.
History will not judge them kindly, I fear "
The DUP are only representative of approx 50% of the population of Northern Ireland. The other 50% wouldn't vote for them under any circumstances, so they do not give a shit about their votes. The 50% they represent are more likely to be leave voters.
As much as I am loathed to be seen to be defending the DUP. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA."
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
"
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for |
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"
“Elections belong to the people. It’s their decision. If they decide to turn their back on the fire and burn their behinds, then they will just have to sit on their blisters.”"
But they voted for the GFA, they voted for there to be no borders, for the freedom of movement with the republic to be a primary concern, even if that means special administration processes brought in.
So in essence the UK voted for the backstop and brexit. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for "
I know this is being sarcastic. But really we knew what a cluster fuck Brexit would, and people didn't care. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for
I know this is being sarcastic. But really we knew what a cluster fuck Brexit would, and people didn't care."
They said anything potentially bad about Brexit was just project fear and scaremongering and they knew exactly what they voted for so whatever happens if we Brexit then leavers knew about it and are happy with it |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for
I know this is being sarcastic. But really we knew what a cluster fuck Brexit would, and people didn't care."
Dead right it will be better for this country long term.No deal is a bit of a bummer but we will get over it and become stronger. |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"It is patently obvious the DUP is pursuing a policy on Brexit that is contrary to majority opinion in Northern Ireland.
The public voted to Remain, but the DUP insists on making them leave, and in a way that drives a wedge between the unionist and republican communities.
History will not judge them kindly, I fear "
No it wint but the Irish problem is there anyway and will not go away |
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"I largely agree with the above, but am not sure I wholeyvagree with the idea the DUP are the majority voice for the Irish border. While part of the union, other than devolved matters, we have one parliament. Decisions made about the NI border can affect all borders. So sure, DUP can more strongly represent Irish views, and snp Scottish. But that doesn't mean they have a casting vote on UK wide issues. "
I'm definitely not saying that any one party should have a casting or only vote or say on any issue. I am saying that all MPs as group are the best representation of the true will of all the people and none of them should be ignored in favour of some other supposed representation of the people's will.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I remember that the EU was not going to give Greece any further bailouts. Absolutely positively not.
Until they did right at the last minute when it looked like they might have to kick Greece out of the Euro.
What it really boils down to is which side is likely to blink first.
It was recently revealed that Theresa May NEVER once mentioned any possibility of us leaving without a deal to the EU - which is why we were offered such a shit deal.
The EU have taken their hard line about the withdrawal agreement ever since it was first rejected by parliament on the assumption that Theresa may have somehow got it through and are continuing with this approavh in the hope that Boris will give in and because of the stalemate in parliament caused by the undemocratic remain MP's.
The truth is that they still hope that we'll change our minds and cancel the whole thing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for
I know this is being sarcastic. But really we knew what a cluster fuck Brexit would, and people didn't care.Dead right it will be better for this country long term.No deal is a bit of a bummer but we will get over it and become stronger."
I'm not sure where you're getting that from. UK will be poorer and worse off in every way in our life times. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I'm guessing that if we leave with no deal then the uk will not put a hard border up, they will simply ask for companies to declare what they they are sending across the border. It will then be the EU to instructing Ireland to put up a hard border to satisfy their single market integrity. So it will be the EU that is breaking the GFA.
The only people who will believe that a hard border in Ireland will have been caused by anyone other than those who voted for Brexit are . . . well, the people who voted for Brexit.
Everything that goes wrong with Brexit will be blamed on someone else, not those who are responsible for it.
Whatever happens with Brexit it's exactly what the leavers voted for
I know this is being sarcastic. But really we knew what a cluster fuck Brexit would, and people didn't care.Dead right it will be better for this country long term.No deal is a bit of a bummer but we will get over it and become stronger.
I'm not sure where you're getting that from. UK will be poorer and worse off in every way in our life times."
Oh I dunno. I think in about 40 years we will have got over it. Some of us will still be around |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
The myth persists in the UK that German car-makers will rescue Britain from a Brexit fiasco.
I read today that Mrs Markel quickly reached an understanding with her car-makers after the 2016 referendum.
The UK accounts for 20 per cent of German cars sold in the EU.
The industry agreed not to pester her about the 20 per cent if she prioritised keeping the 80 per cent intact.
That was the basic deal.
Despite all the delusional claims of the Brextremists, there is no sign of any change.
Mrs Merkel met the CEO of Daimler last month. 40 min meeting ran for more than hour and Brexit was not even raised.
I think the Brexiteers need to look elsewhere for a lifeboat. |
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"If your talking about German economy ( and eurozone) best check today’s figures
German economy shrank by .1% last quarter. UK shrank by 2%."
Uk last shrank 2012
Germany last shrank nov 2018
Uk growth forecast for the year 1.4%
German growth forecast for the year 0.4%
It’s not a competition ! |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Did you see the Brexit objectives agreed by the Council of Ministers after receiving the Article 50 notice?
The key one was preserving the integrity of the single market.
That is why this idea the UK could keep the benefits of the single market without any of the costs was a hopeless delusion.
It is the same delusion about German car-makers, that because the UK buys 20 per cent of their output they would agree to something that risked wrecking the other 80 per cent.
They won't, they haven't and there is no sign of them doing so. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"I disagree
A disorderly exit would damage German (and eurozone) exports "
Yes, it will. But not nearly as much as Brexit contagion leading to the collapse of the single market.
Do I jeopardise 20 per cent of my order book or 100 per cent of my order book?
Hmmm, let me think . . . |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"I remember that the EU was not going to give Greece any further bailouts. Absolutely positively not.
Until they did right at the last minute when it looked like they might have to kick Greece out of the Euro.
What it really boils down to is which side is likely to blink first.
It was recently revealed that Theresa May NEVER once mentioned any possibility of us leaving without a deal to the EU - which is why we were offered such a shit deal.
The EU have taken their hard line about the withdrawal agreement ever since it was first rejected by parliament on the assumption that Theresa may have somehow got it through and are continuing with this approavh in the hope that Boris will give in and because of the stalemate in parliament caused by the undemocratic remain MP's.
The truth is that they still hope that we'll change our minds and cancel the whole thing."
This is the world that we live in.
The previous incarnation of this very same Conservative Govt legitimately and lawfully negotiated the United Kingdom's orderly exit from the European Union.
It can be argued now that Theresa May should have played it differently (in fact many people did criticise the way that she played this out). Ultimately though, the responsibility for signing this mutually negotiated and manifesto aligned Withdrawal Agreement was this Conservative Government.
It is completely INSANE that the Government is now saying that this same Government (albeit wearing different clothes) did not do the right thing and so we need to start all over again.
NO - Take responsibility for what has been agreed. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"I remember that the EU was not going to give Greece any further bailouts. Absolutely positively not.
Until they did right at the last minute when it looked like they might have to kick Greece out of the Euro.
What it really boils down to is which side is likely to blink first.
It was recently revealed that Theresa May NEVER once mentioned any possibility of us leaving without a deal to the EU - which is why we were offered such a shit deal.
The EU have taken their hard line about the withdrawal agreement ever since it was first rejected by parliament on the assumption that Theresa may have somehow got it through and are continuing with this approavh in the hope that Boris will give in and because of the stalemate in parliament caused by the undemocratic remain MP's.
The truth is that they still hope that we'll change our minds and cancel the whole thing.
This is the world that we live in.
The previous incarnation of this very same Conservative Govt legitimately and lawfully negotiated the United Kingdom's orderly exit from the European Union.
It can be argued now that Theresa May should have played it differently (in fact many people did criticise the way that she played this out). Ultimately though, the responsibility for signing this mutually negotiated and manifesto aligned Withdrawal Agreement was this Conservative Government.
It is completely INSANE that the Government is now saying that this same Government (albeit wearing different clothes) did not do the right thing and so we need to start all over again.
NO - Take responsibility for what has been agreed. "
Do you think when a managing director gets replaced for poor judgment that they replace them with someone who pursues the same policy? thats INSANE. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"I remember that the EU was not going to give Greece any further bailouts. Absolutely positively not.
Until they did right at the last minute when it looked like they might have to kick Greece out of the Euro.
What it really boils down to is which side is likely to blink first.
It was recently revealed that Theresa May NEVER once mentioned any possibility of us leaving without a deal to the EU - which is why we were offered such a shit deal.
The EU have taken their hard line about the withdrawal agreement ever since it was first rejected by parliament on the assumption that Theresa may have somehow got it through and are continuing with this approavh in the hope that Boris will give in and because of the stalemate in parliament caused by the undemocratic remain MP's.
The truth is that they still hope that we'll change our minds and cancel the whole thing.
This is the world that we live in.
The previous incarnation of this very same Conservative Govt legitimately and lawfully negotiated the United Kingdom's orderly exit from the European Union.
It can be argued now that Theresa May should have played it differently (in fact many people did criticise the way that she played this out). Ultimately though, the responsibility for signing this mutually negotiated and manifesto aligned Withdrawal Agreement was this Conservative Government.
It is completely INSANE that the Government is now saying that this same Government (albeit wearing different clothes) did not do the right thing and so we need to start all over again.
NO - Take responsibility for what has been agreed. "
Do you think when a managing director gets replaced for poor judgment that they replace them with someone who pursues the same policy? thats INSANE. |
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Did the leavers vote to poorer? I do not so.
I keep hearing about the will of the people a d the democracy being bandied about like snowflakes.
We have an unwritten constitution, one of about 3 or 4 countries to do so, this means that the word democracy is not and should be taken literally.
We are in what is called a Parliamentary democracy, which means the will of the people is advisory only, and it will be Parliament who decides what is best for our country.
So we do not have democracy as people think we have and it has been such since the glourious recolution of 1688.
In our we have the the three rule:
The Golden Rule
The Literal Rule
The Ambigious Rule
It is how Parliament implement and apply any acts of Parliament.
Since Mt Johnson has come into power the pound has dropped like a stone in water, great economist that he is, but all those MP's will be fine with no deal because they are millonaires, it will not affect them, in fact they will make a fortune by a run on the pound and have moved thier buisness interests abroad to protect themselves, even Mr Farage has got duel national citizenship for his children, by getting German passports for his children, so they have the benefit of being part of Europe, great man that he is
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By *oghunter33 OP Woman
over a year ago
on the hill NordWest of |
"I remember that the EU was not going to give Greece any further bailouts. Absolutely positively not.
Until they did right at the last minute when it looked like they might have to kick Greece out of the Euro.
What it really boils down to is which side is likely to blink first.
It was recently revealed that Theresa May NEVER once mentioned any possibility of us leaving without a deal to the EU - which is why we were offered such a shit deal.
The EU have taken their hard line about the withdrawal agreement ever since it was first rejected by parliament on the assumption that Theresa may have somehow got it through and are continuing with this approavh in the hope that Boris will give in and because of the stalemate in parliament caused by the undemocratic remain MP's.
The truth is that they still hope that we'll change our minds and cancel the whole thing."
The situation of Greece after the crash and its bailouts is in no way comparable to Brexit. Back then it wasn't about Greece and who wins the poker game, it was simply to safe the Euro, there was way way more at stake there is with Brexit.
Don't think the EU27 are highly impressed with the no deal threat, and this strategy won't result in a last minute deal to the UKs taste. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"I disagree
A disorderly exit would damage German (and eurozone) exports "
you're right.... german GDP was down 0.1% of GDP last quarter...
remember though last week... the UK GDP was down 0.3%
so lets not push the "they need us more" narrative quite yet...
the UK are playing a very dangerous game of russian roulette... except it's not the brexiteer MP's who stand to lose.... its going to be the common folk out there! |
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