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Welsh sheep and the idiocy of Brexit Britain
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I don't think they care I'm afraid. We are constantly told by brexiteers it's not about the economy, it's about the principle of Britain being our own country again.
I've tried to stop worrying about it tbh as it gets to the point that it's pointless fretting over it.
Que Sera. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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People dont care about the economy. They do care about their jobs. That said ppl dont always join tbe dots.my feel is honds employees in swindon are no less brexit. Even tho they protest sbout honda sacking them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Sending sheep to far away lands Doesn't sound very environmentally friendly.
Aren't farmers custodians of the countryside.??
Didn't most of these farmers vote leave.Surely they knew what they were voting for.
No more handouts or subsidies .No more bailouts!  |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone? |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless."
I would check your facts before calling people clueless nothing to do with the eu trade agreement. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
I would check your facts before calling people clueless nothing to do with the eu trade agreement."
well... actually costa.... this time they might just have a point...
as the europe editor of that left wing commie rag, the telegraph (hang on... isn't that the paper Bojo wrote for) pointed out... the deal with japan works out for exports of 52 million pounds of lamb over 5 years...
that works out at 10.4 million per year....
the uk export lamb figures to the EU.... roughly about £400 million pounds per year...
so yeah, i think we may be in a position to question these statements... and others made by people in high places in the last few days....
dominic raab claiming that a trade deal will be easier to negoiate after you blow up the old one you have been working on for years and you tell them to stuff it and go to no deal for example..... |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
I would check your facts before calling people clueless nothing to do with the eu trade agreement.
well... actually costa.... this time they might just have a point...
as the europe editor of that left wing commie rag, the telegraph (hang on... isn't that the paper Bojo wrote for) pointed out... the deal with japan works out for exports of 52 million pounds of lamb over 5 years...
that works out at 10.4 million per year....
the uk export lamb figures to the EU.... roughly about £400 million pounds per year...
so yeah, i think we may be in a position to question these statements... and others made by people in high places in the last few days....
dominic raab claiming that a trade deal will be easier to negoiate after you blow up the old one you have been working on for years and you tell them to stuff it and go to no deal for example....."
Not questioning the figures _abio questioning the jump on the bandwagon without checking the facts . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?"
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment.. |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu."
That’s the spirit.
Fuck you farmers, sort your own shit out. We want Brexit and you can go bleat to the Govt about how unfair it is.
Utter cunts those farmers. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu.
That’s the spirit.
Fuck you farmers, sort your own shit out. We want Brexit and you can go bleat to the Govt about how unfair it is.
Utter cunts those farmers."
Im not saying that but if you feel that way well you are entitled to your opinion.Im saying nz and oz still have farmers after we had to ditch them when joining the eu. |
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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu.
That’s the spirit.
Fuck you farmers, sort your own shit out. We want Brexit and you can go bleat to the Govt about how unfair it is.
Utter cunts those farmers.Im not saying that but if you feel that way well you are entitled to your opinion.Im saying nz and oz still have farmers after we had to ditch them when joining the eu."
And New Zealand lamb farmers lost their subsidies in 1985.
They've adapted to produce a quality product more efficiently and have seen no drop in export demand. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu.
That’s the spirit.
Fuck you farmers, sort your own shit out. We want Brexit and you can go bleat to the Govt about how unfair it is.
Utter cunts those farmers.Im not saying that but if you feel that way well you are entitled to your opinion.Im saying nz and oz still have farmers after we had to ditch them when joining the eu."
What do you mean by ditched them? |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
This encapsulates the madness of Brexit.
The UK Government is going to pay farmers in Wales (subsidies) to produce meat they cannot sell, and then pay them again to purchase the unsold stock.
How peculiarly socialist.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu.
Not when the tariff barrier is 40%"
It's just a few tweeks to duty rates that cancel themselves out at world level a prominent Brexit supporter informed us on here a while back so there's nothing to worry about  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Afaik we don't yet have a trade deal with japan. Wto tarriffs are 38.5%... And in 2017 increases this to 50% to safeguard.
Wonder how attractive tbis is compared to the eu... |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"Im sure all the farmers will find new markets just like New Zealand and Australia did after we sold them down the river when we joined the eu.
That’s the spirit.
Fuck you farmers, sort your own shit out. We want Brexit and you can go bleat to the Govt about how unfair it is.
Utter cunts those farmers.Im not saying that but if you feel that way well you are entitled to your opinion.Im saying nz and oz still have farmers after we had to ditch them when joining the eu."
Two things. the NZ and Aussie farmers had no say in what the UK did. The UK was a Sovereign state and its own farmers were important. In this case, these are our very own farmers who we are about to shaft. This is self inflicted "fuck you" politics.
Secondly, and just as an aside - have we stopped importing NZ lamb? |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
My mistake on the EU/Japan angle.
This is the BBC explanation:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49164496
The fundamental issue unchanged though - losing the EU market is literally lambs to the slaughter.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless."
.
A quick Google on this subject shows that we exported 89,000 tones in 2017 (not exclusively to the EU mind) and imported 81,000 tonnes (again not exclusively EU) I hardly see why you'd have to cull 40% of your stock based on those figures?.
Apart from that weren't you only last month telling us we all had to give up red meat to save the planet from global disaster?, if that's the case this is obviously a dying industry. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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40% of lamb is exported. Feels like this has (incorrectky imo) been converted to a 40% cull.
I imagine the suggestion is a lot of exports is done under an fta or another. Ans lamb is price sensitive that a 40% tarriff kills those markets.
A few leaps of faith in there tho. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"40% of lamb is exported. Feels like this has (incorrectky imo) been converted to a 40% cull.
I imagine the suggestion is a lot of exports is done under an fta or another. Ans lamb is price sensitive that a 40% tarriff kills those markets.
A few leaps of faith in there tho. "
.
Were negative 8000 tonnes on the UK market, that's a 4% cull if you couldn't manage to export that 8000 tonnes anywhere in the world at all. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"40% of lamb is exported. Feels like this has (incorrectky imo) been converted to a 40% cull.
I imagine the suggestion is a lot of exports is done under an fta or another. Ans lamb is price sensitive that a 40% tarriff kills those markets.
A few leaps of faith in there tho. .
Were negative 8000 tonnes on the UK market, that's a 4% cull if you couldn't manage to export that 8000 tonnes anywhere in the world at all."
Does that also mean we rwplace all imports with welsh lamb? Im guessing that means a drop in price. And that assumes we can like for like. Is lamb seasonal? Do we import different cuts tjan we export.
I dont disagree 40% feels wrong. Im just guessing there are reasons why we import and export as we do... |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
this is probably a better explanation... it comes from the "beef and lamb matters" blog (via the guardian)
"A question we’re often asked though is, ‘if we’re self sufficient, why does the UK import so much sheep meat?’ The reasons are numerous and complex but can broadly split into four areas – historic, market, seasonal and economic.
The UK has been importing New Zealand sheep meat for 130 years, with unrestricted imports until 1973 when the UK joined the European Economic Community (EEC). At the time, the UK was only circa 40 per cent self sufficient. To give it some context, prior to joining the EEC, the UK took the vast majority of New Zealand’s lamb exports – 86 per cent in 1970. Today the UK takes around 20 per cent and in 2012 China overtook the UK as the primary destination for New Zealand lamb.
From 1972 to 1999, the UK sheep flock grew from 27.9 million head to 44.7 million head, with the UK’s self sufficiency rate increasing to 95 per cent to coincide with increasing production. Increasing production drove rising UK export volumes and, despite a fall in the 2000s, today the UK exports around 100,000 tonnes.
However, while the UK market is technically self-sufficient, it is not functionally self sufficient. The UK demands a larger volume of higher end cuts such as legs and chops, while UK exports consist mainly of carcases and a large proportion of low value cuts to emerging markets." |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"40% of lamb is exported. Feels like this has (incorrectky imo) been converted to a 40% cull.
I imagine the suggestion is a lot of exports is done under an fta or another. Ans lamb is price sensitive that a 40% tarriff kills those markets.
A few leaps of faith in there tho. .
Were negative 8000 tonnes on the UK market, that's a 4% cull if you couldn't manage to export that 8000 tonnes anywhere in the world at all.
Does that also mean we rwplace all imports with welsh lamb? Im guessing that means a drop in price. And that assumes we can like for like. Is lamb seasonal? Do we import different cuts tjan we export.
I dont disagree 40% feels wrong. Im just guessing there are reasons why we import and export as we do... "
.
Well it's definitely seasonal but then it's also definitely freezable  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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And don't forget in just 2 years were all meant to be eating red meat only once a week maximum.
Otherwise it's curtains for the planet.
Plough up those Welsh hillsides for Paddy fields I say |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. "
.
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in"
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting. |
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless."
So, they stiff 40% tariffs on our lamb, we do the same to them, over time they will learn that tariffs will be mirrored, and they will stop doing it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
So, they stiff 40% tariffs on our lamb, we do the same to them, over time they will learn that tariffs will be mirrored, and they will stop doing it."
In 2015 95% of uk sheep exports went to the eu.
Eu supplies 10% of imports to uk.
Tit for tat only works if you are equals.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting."
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?. |
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
So, they stiff 40% tariffs on our lamb, we do the same to them, over time they will learn that tariffs will be mirrored, and they will stop doing it.
In 2015 95% of uk sheep exports went to the eu.
Eu supplies 10% of imports to uk.
Tit for tat only works if you are equals.
"
Well, I'm no expert, but I'd find something that the country that are slapping tariffs on are exporting to us and whack tariffs on that too, they would soon get the message. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
So, they stiff 40% tariffs on our lamb, we do the same to them, over time they will learn that tariffs will be mirrored, and they will stop doing it.
In 2015 95% of uk sheep exports went to the eu.
Eu supplies 10% of imports to uk.
Tit for tat only works if you are equals.
Well, I'm no expert, but I'd find something that the country that are slapping tariffs on are exporting to us and whack tariffs on that too, they would soon get the message."
Afaik cant just whack on tarriffs for one country under WTO. Its the same for all unless you have a trade agreement. Or a concern aboit security. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting.
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?."
Maybe they could try selling the less expensive meat over here too. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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This is how we will lose out with a 40% tariff. The importer to the continent pays the tariff. Therefore an £80 lamb carcass here would cost £112 when it is unloaded on the continent .
The continental importer would then pass the tariff down the line
And we as producers would inevitably bear the tariff and I for one don't relish that . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I fail to see how any of this has any relevance to the real world coz absolutely no one has a clue what is going to happen if we crash out.
It's just one small piece of a multi billion piece jigsaw that we've got to piece together without a picture to work with. Someone has taken 46 years to put it all together and no we are about to upset the tray and spew it all over the floor again LOL. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.
So, they stiff 40% tariffs on our lamb, we do the same to them, over time they will learn that tariffs will be mirrored, and they will stop doing it."
Or just buy from countries they have trade agreements with and ignore us with our 40% WTO tarrifs |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
considering they are usually slaughtered between 6-7 months and only breed once a year it would only need the government to subsidize them this year as per the eu subsidy and then they have a whole year to sort it out. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting.
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?."
Because cheap meat cuts and expensive meat cuts come ftom the same sheep.
Currently we eat eight legs of lamb and no carcuses. We do tbis via killing one of our sheep, selling the legs fo the uk and the carcus to the eu.
If we cant sell the carcus to the eu either the uk legs become more expensive (to make up for the lost carcus income) or the farmer makes less.
Saying that as, on average, we consume a sheep doesnt help. Farmers cant own two sheep and just sell the legs. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
The UK's biggest market by far is obviously the UK, in this case we actually slightly overproduce what the market caters for by around 8000 tonnes or 4% of the total UK market.
It's only out of season for a short time and freezes for six months.
Panic over, although on medical grounds I would recommend you limit your intake of red meat and it could also help to keep that dreaded end of the world in 12 years at bay. |
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"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting.
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?.
Because cheap meat cuts and expensive meat cuts come ftom the same sheep.
Currently we eat eight legs of lamb and no carcuses. We do tbis via killing one of our sheep, selling the legs fo the uk and the carcus to the eu.
If we cant sell the carcus to the eu either the uk legs become more expensive (to make up for the lost carcus income) or the farmer makes less.
Saying that as, on average, we consume a sheep doesnt help. Farmers cant own two sheep and just sell the legs. "
Or we use our initiative and find new markets for the carcasses |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting.
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?.
Because cheap meat cuts and expensive meat cuts come ftom the same sheep.
Currently we eat eight legs of lamb and no carcuses. We do tbis via killing one of our sheep, selling the legs fo the uk and the carcus to the eu.
If we cant sell the carcus to the eu either the uk legs become more expensive (to make up for the lost carcus income) or the farmer makes less.
Saying that as, on average, we consume a sheep doesnt help. Farmers cant own two sheep and just sell the legs. "
.
I'm going to say this really slow so even you can grasp it, according to the British lamb association in 2017 our exports although slightly more in mass were less in monetary amounts than our imports.
Now unless we're keeping our imports and only losing our exports I fail to grasp how farmers here in the UK are going to lose out significantly.
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
The animal rights groups should be happy too no more shipping live lambs to french abattoirs to slaughter.Seems this is only done so that it can have a french lamb label on under eu rules and command a greater price on the french market. |
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"The animal rights groups should be happy too no more shipping live lambs to french abattoirs to slaughter.Seems this is only done so that it can have a french lamb label on under eu rules and command a greater price on the french market."
Wow!
Re-selling british lamb as french lamb?
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Thx. So we dont import one sheep and expiry another but import half a sheep (the good half from nz) and export half (the carcus of a uk sheep). So if we cant export that half uk sheep goes up or farmers make a lit less per sheep.
Ans it sounds like our exported sheep is also chilled. So notvreally sonething which can be sent to japan. Even if they are in the market for carcus. .
No, our export market despite being larger in tonnage by 8000 tonnes is actually less in value than our import market. Cheap meat out, expensive meat in
So in order to replace gje expensive meat in via uk lamb either we have to start eating cheap meat. Or expect tje farmers to have more sheep. But throw away the carcus.
Otherwise im not sure what yiu are suggesting.
If we're importing expensive meat and exporting cheap meat and all that ends then UK farmers will lose the cheap meat exports but gain the expensive meat imports.
The import market is more in cost than the export market.
I fail to see how farmers could loose out on that?.
Because cheap meat cuts and expensive meat cuts come ftom the same sheep.
Currently we eat eight legs of lamb and no carcuses. We do tbis via killing one of our sheep, selling the legs fo the uk and the carcus to the eu.
If we cant sell the carcus to the eu either the uk legs become more expensive (to make up for the lost carcus income) or the farmer makes less.
Saying that as, on average, we consume a sheep doesnt help. Farmers cant own two sheep and just sell the legs. .
I'm going to say this really slow so even you can grasp it, according to the British lamb association in 2017 our exports although slightly more in mass were less in monetary amounts than our imports.
Now unless we're keeping our imports and only losing our exports I fail to grasp how farmers here in the UK are going to lose out significantly.
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in."
Thanks for the patronisation. I understand your point.
However my understanding as i have tried to explain how it isnt as easy as that. The cuts of meat we export are different to the cuts of meat we import. So id suggest you look at the balance of trade of quality cuts of meat and the balance of trade of carcuses and offal.
Or maybe i should ask a different question. If we inport better qjaligy of meat thats of higher vakue... Why don't Welsh farmers just trade in this market? |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in."
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
|
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"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
"
Yes, but your underestimating the value of the quality of the british product . |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"The animal rights groups should be happy too no more shipping live lambs to french abattoirs to slaughter.Seems this is only done so that it can have a french lamb label on under eu rules and command a greater price on the french market.
Wow!
Re-selling british lamb as french lamb?
"
It seems so if its in france before its killed.One thing about these brexit debates you sure learn alot that you didnt know. |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
I don't think so.
A product is worth only what a buyer is willing to pay for it.
The Welsh worry is their product will become 40% more expensive overnight.
I'd think twice about buying anything that shot up in price like that.
|
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"The animal rights groups should be happy too no more shipping live lambs to french abattoirs to slaughter.Seems this is only done so that it can have a french lamb label on under eu rules and command a greater price on the french market.
Wow!
Re-selling british lamb as french lamb?
It seems so if its in france before its killed.One thing about these brexit debates you sure learn alot that you didnt know. "
So the lamb is born and raised in the foothills and lush green fields of the welsh mountains.. the terroir if you like ... and then it’s shipped to France, slaughtered and labelled French lamb! 
And that’s all above board !!!
I’m going to have dig in to this ... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I don't think so.
A product is worth only what a buyer is willing to pay for it.
The Welsh worry is their product will become 40% more expensive overnight.
I'd think twice about buying anything that shot up in price like that.
"
so will English and Scotch lamb |
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"I don't think so.
A product is worth only what a buyer is willing to pay for it.
The Welsh worry is their product will become 40% more expensive overnight.
I'd think twice about buying anything that shot up in price like that.
"
Depends on what your end customer is prepared to accept as an alternative ... if it’s lesser quality and not acceptable .. they will seek better quality elsewhere.
|
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"The animal rights groups should be happy too no more shipping live lambs to french abattoirs to slaughter.Seems this is only done so that it can have a french lamb label on under eu rules and command a greater price on the french market.
Wow!
Re-selling british lamb as french lamb?
It seems so if its in france before its killed.One thing about these brexit debates you sure learn alot that you didnt know.
So the lamb is born and raised in the foothills and lush green fields of the welsh mountains.. the terroir if you like ... and then it’s shipped to France, slaughtered and labelled French lamb!
And that’s all above board !!!
I’m going to have dig in to this ... "
just google why do we ship live lambs to france.The independent comes up top of the search read that. |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless."
We voted to leave,the EU offered us a deal that parliament would not exept,if they refuse to alter the deal we have no choice FACT |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"
Now unless we're keeping our imports and only losing our exports I fail to grasp how farmers here in the UK are going to lose out significantly.
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in."
356 Million of "higher quality" lamb in... 384 million of "lower quality" lamb out...
there are various things you are not taking in consideration, for example farming standards that mean they may not be used for human food chain but for other reasons....
lower quality cuts that we may shy away from in the UK that they don't in the EU....
different breeds of sheep may produce different quality meat... and ect ect.....
you are being way too simplistic..... |
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By *mmabluTV/TS
over a year ago
upton wirral |
"I don't think they care I'm afraid. We are constantly told by brexiteers it's not about the economy, it's about the principle of Britain being our own country again.
I've tried to stop worrying about it tbh as it gets to the point that it's pointless fretting over it.
Que Sera."
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"
Now unless we're keeping our imports and only losing our exports I fail to grasp how farmers here in the UK are going to lose out significantly.
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
356 Million of "higher quality" lamb in... 384 million of "lower quality" lamb out...
there are various things you are not taking in consideration, for example farming standards that mean they may not be used for human food chain but for other reasons....
lower quality cuts that we may shy away from in the UK that they don't in the EU....
different breeds of sheep may produce different quality meat... and ect ect.....
you are being way too simplistic..... "
I can remember the days when we had breast of lamb for dinner cant get it now but then again i am old. |
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"During the PM's visit to Wales today, the National Sheep Association warned a No Deal Brexit would be catastrophic for its members and could lead to civil unrest.
Without any trade agreements, lamb exports will be hit with 40 per cent tariffs.
The NFU estimates 40 per cent of livestock will need to be culled.
No need to worry, says Alun Cairns, the new Secretary of State for Wales, there will be lots of new markets.
"I will point to the market on Japan that has just been opened to Welsh and British sheep, for example. This is a new market for us, so exports are already taking place there. This is a significant market for which we haven't even scratched the surface yet."
It has been pointed out to Mr Cairns since that this new market is a result of the free trade agreement recently announced by the EU and Japan - an agreement that the UK will be excluded from after October 31.
This is the calibre of politicians taking the UK out of the EU. Clueless. Totally clueless.We voted to leave,the EU offered us a deal that parliament would not exept,if they refuse to alter the deal we have no choice FACT"
We have loads of choices. Stop being a sheep. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Now unless we're keeping our imports and only losing our exports I fail to grasp how farmers here in the UK are going to lose out significantly.
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
356 Million of "higher quality" lamb in... 384 million of "lower quality" lamb out...
there are various things you are not taking in consideration, for example farming standards that mean they may not be used for human food chain but for other reasons....
lower quality cuts that we may shy away from in the UK that they don't in the EU....
different breeds of sheep may produce different quality meat... and ect ect.....
you are being way too simplistic..... "
Ohhh isn't Brexit such an interesting "black and white" situation |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
"
.
There's no import duty on British lamb sold in the UK  .
The UK lamb industry runs at a very slight surplus to the UK lamb market.
All the UK produced lamb COULD AND HAS A MARKET IN THE UK.
There's 3% that's surplus, I recommend we stop importing lamb and just eat British lamb, raised, slaughtered, and consumed in the UK, how green is that |
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Forget about the weight of lamb in verse lamb out
The UK does not produce enough high quality lamb meet to supply its own market
Yet has a surplus of very low end meet which it exports
The UK imports most of its high end cuts from Ireland
If there is a no deal you can slap 40% on to the high end cuts
Your average joe wont spend that kind of money on lamb
Ireland will have to find a new market
Can the uk farmers just not produce more lamb
Not really as the current farmers are probably at max
Will dairy and tilage farmers turn to sheep farming no because there is very little money to be made from lamb and it is produced on poor land
For them farmers to turn to sheep farming there would have to be an incrase in lamb price but as i said your average joe will not pay for it so the only losers here are the farmer and buyer in the supermarket
See you have Irish sheep farmer over a barrel not really yes it will be painful but the UK is only one market and the EU is 26 plus the EU has the power of trade deals all over the world so just like the banking crisise we will ride it out
Best of luck with it all though |
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By *ara J OP TV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
None of this was written on the side of a bus in 2016.
No, no, it would be a land of milk and honey.
After three years, I am still waiting for evidence of one single, tangible benefit.
It's a lung-bursting, treasury-busting exercise in damage limitation.
|
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment.."
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment..
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually."
That pasture land can become forest .
The government committe on climate change has suggested this should happen in a report last year .
Of course the NFU are opposed to the CCC recommendations to reduce beef /lamb production by up to 50%..
The report came out in Nov 2018 and you can find it online . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
.
There's no import duty on British lamb sold in the UK .
The UK lamb industry runs at a very slight surplus to the UK lamb market.
All the UK produced lamb COULD AND HAS A MARKET IN THE UK.
There's 3% that's surplus, I recommend we stop importing lamb and just eat British lamb, raised, slaughtered, and consumed in the UK, how green is that "
I think you're getting mixed up by just looking at the final import and export figures and not understanding the difference of cuts that come from the animals and who or where the consumption of them are based either home or abroad.
For the UK to be self sufficient in lamb production would require the entire population to change their lamb eating habits drastically. |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment..
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually.
That pasture land can become forest .
The government committe on climate change has suggested this should happen in a report last year .
Of course the NFU are opposed to the CCC recommendations to reduce beef /lamb production by up to 50%..
The report came out in Nov 2018 and you can find it online ."
You can't eat forest, Bob. Youd then have to import more food from elsewhere, which negates the planting of forest in the first place. Pasture can absorb more carbon, the more it is fertilised (especially with compost), which also helps our food waste problem.
A lot of "solutions" seem to involve the first world washing its hands of food production, leading to more habitat destruction elsewhere |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment..
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually.
That pasture land can become forest .
The government committe on climate change has suggested this should happen in a report last year .
Of course the NFU are opposed to the CCC recommendations to reduce beef /lamb production by up to 50%..
The report came out in Nov 2018 and you can find it online .
You can't eat forest, Bob. Youd then have to import more food from elsewhere, which negates the planting of forest in the first place. Pasture can absorb more carbon, the more it is fertilised (especially with compost), which also helps our food waste problem.
A lot of "solutions" seem to involve the first world washing its hands of food production, leading to more habitat destruction elsewhere "
Take it up with the scientists who wrote the report.
I don't eat meat so I won't need to be buying my meat from abroad.Do you think the mantra we can't eat forests should apply to the rainforests of Brazil and Indonesia or is it the British/European forests that are irrelevant and inedible and surplus to requirements.
I wouldn't worry jimmy nobody gives a fuck about the environment or biodiversity in government .That report is the bin and they won't be asking for anymore reports on the subject.
They were the wrong scientists giving us information that didn't fit the brexit agenda. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
.
There's no import duty on British lamb sold in the UK .
The UK lamb industry runs at a very slight surplus to the UK lamb market.
All the UK produced lamb COULD AND HAS A MARKET IN THE UK.
There's 3% that's surplus, I recommend we stop importing lamb and just eat British lamb, raised, slaughtered, and consumed in the UK, how green is that
I think you're getting mixed up by just looking at the final import and export figures and not understanding the difference of cuts that come from the animals and who or where the consumption of them are based either home or abroad.
For the UK to be self sufficient in lamb production would require the entire population to change their lamb eating habits drastically. "
.
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
|
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
"
again... showing no understanding...
the stuff that comes in is "higher quality" than the stuff that is exported...
it may be exported because the type of sheep raised may not be fit for human consumption, or may not produce the type of meat and cuts that produces good meat....
and remember that is just "lamb"...
what about "beef".......
what about "pork".......
|
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment..
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually.
That pasture land can become forest .
The government committe on climate change has suggested this should happen in a report last year .
Of course the NFU are opposed to the CCC recommendations to reduce beef /lamb production by up to 50%..
The report came out in Nov 2018 and you can find it online .
You can't eat forest, Bob. Youd then have to import more food from elsewhere, which negates the planting of forest in the first place. Pasture can absorb more carbon, the more it is fertilised (especially with compost), which also helps our food waste problem.
A lot of "solutions" seem to involve the first world washing its hands of food production, leading to more habitat destruction elsewhere
Take it up with the scientists who wrote the report.
I don't eat meat so I won't need to be buying my meat from abroad.Do you think the mantra we can't eat forests should apply to the rainforests of Brazil and Indonesia or is it the British/European forests that are irrelevant and inedible and surplus to requirements.
I wouldn't worry jimmy nobody gives a fuck about the environment or biodiversity in government .That report is the bin and they won't be asking for anymore reports on the subject.
They were the wrong scientists giving us information that didn't fit the brexit agenda. "
It's not just meat from abroad, Bob. Importing grains etc also has a big carbon footprint.
Of course, even the footprint of the less environmentally friendly foods (factory farmed meat, quinoa, soya) pales into insignificance compared to buying pre made food (ready meals, processed foods - including vege ones). |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
again... showing no understanding...
the stuff that comes in is "higher quality" than the stuff that is exported...
it may be exported because the type of sheep raised may not be fit for human consumption, or may not produce the type of meat and cuts that produces good meat....
and remember that is just "lamb"...
what about "beef".......
what about "pork".......
"
.
Again showing no understanding, throw the shit stuff away forget it, it's worth less than what we're importing which when we stop that, that market will be open to British farmers only.
I have no idea about beef or pork I only looked up lamb as this thread was about lamb.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain? |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
I have to ask to question.... do you actually think about what you write.... i am trying to work out if it is just ignorance.. or trolling...
"Again showing no understanding, throw the shit stuff away forget it,"
erm... that "shit stuff" is worth almost 400 million
" it's worth less than what we're importing which when we stop that, that market will be open to British farmers only."
We are not Self sufficient in producing the "higher grade meat"... hence why we are having to import the "higher grade meat" in the first bloody place!!!!!!
"I have no idea about beef or pork I only looked up lamb as this thread was about lamb. "
well when you have worked out what you are going to do with all these excess sheep... maybe you can then figure out what you are going to do with the excess cows, and pigs, and chickens.... ect ect ect..... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
again... showing no understanding...
the stuff that comes in is "higher quality" than the stuff that is exported...
it may be exported because the type of sheep raised may not be fit for human consumption, or may not produce the type of meat and cuts that produces good meat....
and remember that is just "lamb"...
what about "beef".......
what about "pork".......
.
Again showing no understanding, throw the shit stuff away forget it, it's worth less than what we're importing which when we stop that, that market will be open to British farmers only.
I have no idea about beef or pork I only looked up lamb as this thread was about lamb. "
But you are saying that farners should make less per sheep (as currently they sell both the good parts and the bad parts) yet farm more sheep (to sell more good meat).
There is nothing stoping them from doing this now. They don't. Why do you think this is? |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain?"
the type of sheep here may not produce the type of meat we eat for example, or the cuts we like, or might not be fit for human consumption so may be used for other things ect ect ect..... |
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"
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
again... showing no understanding...
the stuff that comes in is "higher quality" than the stuff that is exported...
it may be exported because the type of sheep raised may not be fit for human consumption, or may not produce the type of meat and cuts that produces good meat....
and remember that is just "lamb"...
what about "beef".......
what about "pork".......
.
Again showing no understanding, throw the shit stuff away forget it, it's worth less than what we're importing which when we stop that, that market will be open to British farmers only.
I have no idea about beef or pork I only looked up lamb as this thread was about lamb.
But you are saying that farners should make less per sheep (as currently they sell both the good parts and the bad parts) yet farm more sheep (to sell more good meat).
There is nothing stoping them from doing this now. They don't. Why do you think this is? "
But of course it's easy enough to fix after brexit by taking control and just banning all foreign meat imports, why do we want that foreign muck anyway
Instead our farmers can just double or triple the price, after all there will be a meat shortage so they can charge what they like and throw away the bits not fit to eat. Although that won't be much, as with the meat shortage and the quadrupled price, people will be fighting over the scraps.
Farmers happy, brexiteers happy, how does anybody lose out?  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Brekshit gang must've realised what a gaffe Cairns made.
Times now running with a story the UK Government will spend £500m buying up any unsold lamb because of tariffs.
Lamb mountains, anyone?
Reducing the lamb we produce would help in combating climate change.So maybe there will be a silver lining for the environment..
Hows that Bob? Pasture is our biggest carbon sink. Most sheep spend their entire lives on pasture. The carbon cost of producing pasture only meat is negative, even when you include the diesel.
Typically, a 150ac livestock farm removes 388 tonnes of carbon from the atmosphere annually.
That pasture land can become forest .
The government committe on climate change has suggested this should happen in a report last year .
Of course the NFU are opposed to the CCC recommendations to reduce beef /lamb production by up to 50%..
The report came out in Nov 2018 and you can find it online .
You can't eat forest, Bob. Youd then have to import more food from elsewhere, which negates the planting of forest in the first place. Pasture can absorb more carbon, the more it is fertilised (especially with compost), which also helps our food waste problem.
A lot of "solutions" seem to involve the first world washing its hands of food production, leading to more habitat destruction elsewhere
Take it up with the scientists who wrote the report.
I don't eat meat so I won't need to be buying my meat from abroad.Do you think the mantra we can't eat forests should apply to the rainforests of Brazil and Indonesia or is it the British/European forests that are irrelevant and inedible and surplus to requirements.
I wouldn't worry jimmy nobody gives a fuck about the environment or biodiversity in government .That report is the bin and they won't be asking for anymore reports on the subject.
They were the wrong scientists giving us information that didn't fit the brexit agenda.
It's not just meat from abroad, Bob. Importing grains etc also has a big carbon footprint.
Of course, even the footprint of the less environmentally friendly foods (factory farmed meat, quinoa, soya) pales into insignificance compared to buying pre made food (ready meals, processed foods - including vege ones)."
I eat mostly fish and vegetables and living next to the coast most of what I eat or catch myself is local.
It's your choice and everyone else's choice what they eat .
I'm probably part of the problem in many other ways and if I'm honest I have no faith in the farmers and their union and the conservatives and labour protecting the environment .Onevifcthe reasons I've never voted labour or conservative
As youve said "you can't eat trees..."
That about sums it up and their value to many including yourself.
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"would be interesting to compare sales of lamb in Aldi, coop and Morrisson’s before and after they committed to stocking 100% british lamb
"
. Though also only sold British meat anyway I may be wrong tho |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
again... showing no understanding...
the stuff that comes in is "higher quality" than the stuff that is exported...
it may be exported because the type of sheep raised may not be fit for human consumption, or may not produce the type of meat and cuts that produces good meat....
and remember that is just "lamb"...
what about "beef".......
what about "pork".......
.
Again showing no understanding, throw the shit stuff away forget it, it's worth less than what we're importing which when we stop that, that market will be open to British farmers only.
I have no idea about beef or pork I only looked up lamb as this thread was about lamb.
But you are saying that farners should make less per sheep (as currently they sell both the good parts and the bad parts) yet farm more sheep (to sell more good meat).
There is nothing stoping them from doing this now. They don't. Why do you think this is? "
.
Because we import cheap meat from abroad where costs and wages are lower, you want farmers to earn more money and be self sustainable then you have to pay for it, or you can tell them to fuck off and find another profession like we did the miners but you can't say one while importing cheap meat from abroad, that's just silly.
Look sooner or later we as a nation are going to have to face up to our current account deficit which is running at 130 billon a year, our biggest market is the UK and we've been selling it off bit by bit for decades while saying we'll make it up on let's say the services which has never made up for it in the EU or out of the EU.
This problem has been coming down the pipe for decades and now it's here. |
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"would be interesting to compare sales of lamb in Aldi, coop and Morrisson’s before and after they committed to stocking 100% british lamb
. Though also only sold British meat anyway I may be wrong tho "
I think in 2016 aldi committed to stocking only british lamb.
Not sure about when coop and Morrison’s decided to also do this .
Some more digging I think....
Although I’m still digging around the revelation that british lambs are being sent to France and rebadged as being “agneau français” |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain?
the type of sheep here may not produce the type of meat we eat for example, or the cuts we like, or might not be fit for human consumption so may be used for other things ect ect ect....."
Actually, it's this.
The French seem to value quality, and hill breed carcasses are very tasty, but also small (hill breeds are naturally smaller). The British market demands a larger carcase, and so buys most of the lowland breed lambs.
Most export lamb (as far as I'm aware) is slaughtered here and exported to France (live exports are expensive and require a lot of paperwork), where "British Lamb" is a quality mark.
The fact that the French pay a premium makes lamb prices buoyant here.
Small lambs of the kind the French like probably wouldn't even make £40 in marts here, but the east of England abbotoirs pay a premium.
Lambs for domestic consumption (40KG liveweight plus) can make as much as £80/head, especially in May. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
https://www.independent.co.uk › News › Business
"would be interesting to compare sales of lamb in Aldi, coop and Morrisson’s before and after they committed to stocking 100% british lamb
. Though also only sold British meat anyway I may be wrong tho
I think in 2016 aldi committed to stocking only british lamb.
Not sure about when coop and Morrison’s decided to also do this .
Some more digging I think....
Although I’m still digging around the revelation that british lambs are being sent to France and rebadged as being “agneau français” "
here you go.https://www.independent.co.uk › News › Business
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain?
the type of sheep here may not produce the type of meat we eat for example, or the cuts we like, or might not be fit for human consumption so may be used for other things ect ect ect.....
Actually, it's this.
The French seem to value quality, and hill breed carcasses are very tasty, but also small (hill breeds are naturally smaller). The British market demands a larger carcase, and so buys most of the lowland breed lambs.
Most export lamb (as far as I'm aware) is slaughtered here and exported to France (live exports are expensive and require a lot of paperwork), where "British Lamb" is a quality mark.
The fact that the French pay a premium makes lamb prices buoyant here.
Small lambs of the kind the French like probably wouldn't even make £40 in marts here, but the east of England abbotoirs pay a premium.
Lambs for domestic consumption (40KG liveweight plus) can make as much as £80/head, especially in May. "
Do you still farm sheep jimmy ?? |
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"Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain?
the type of sheep here may not produce the type of meat we eat for example, or the cuts we like, or might not be fit for human consumption so may be used for other things ect ect ect.....
Actually, it's this.
The French seem to value quality, and hill breed carcasses are very tasty, but also small (hill breeds are naturally smaller). The British market demands a larger carcase, and so buys most of the lowland breed lambs.
Most export lamb (as far as I'm aware) is slaughtered here and exported to France (live exports are expensive and require a lot of paperwork), where "British Lamb" is a quality mark.
The fact that the French pay a premium makes lamb prices buoyant here.
Small lambs of the kind the French like probably wouldn't even make £40 in marts here, but the east of England abbotoirs pay a premium.
Lambs for domestic consumption (40KG liveweight plus) can make as much as £80/head, especially in May.
Do you still farm sheep jimmy ??"
End Forum here before someone comes back in with the
Sure we will just buy British lamb
And all will be ok
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
Really really slowly 356 million pounds worth of lamb out 384 million pounds worth of lamb in.
On Nov 1, the asking price for the same amount of UK-produced lamb will be £496 million - £356m plus import duties.
Buyers will find cheaper supplies elsewhere.
I seem to recall a row back in March when the last administration said it would zero-tariff 85 per cent of imports coming into the UK.
.
There's no import duty on British lamb sold in the UK .
The UK lamb industry runs at a very slight surplus to the UK lamb market.
All the UK produced lamb COULD AND HAS A MARKET IN THE UK.
There's 3% that's surplus, I recommend we stop importing lamb and just eat British lamb, raised, slaughtered, and consumed in the UK, how green is that
I think you're getting mixed up by just looking at the final import and export figures and not understanding the difference of cuts that come from the animals and who or where the consumption of them are based either home or abroad.
For the UK to be self sufficient in lamb production would require the entire population to change their lamb eating habits drastically. .
Well that case is even better then, what your actually saying is we need to cull no lamb and actually farmers will be able to raise more sheep giving them more income providing we just stop the imports when/if our exports stop.
"
Farmers would have to more than double their sheep stock to meet demand which would more than double the wastage and probably double the price |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"Forgive me if I'm missing something, but instead of exporting them abroad, and us buying lamb / sheep from overseas, wouldn't it make sense to sell British lamb / sheep in er, Britain?
the type of sheep here may not produce the type of meat we eat for example, or the cuts we like, or might not be fit for human consumption so may be used for other things ect ect ect.....
Actually, it's this.
The French seem to value quality, and hill breed carcasses are very tasty, but also small (hill breeds are naturally smaller). The British market demands a larger carcase, and so buys most of the lowland breed lambs.
Most export lamb (as far as I'm aware) is slaughtered here and exported to France (live exports are expensive and require a lot of paperwork), where "British Lamb" is a quality mark.
The fact that the French pay a premium makes lamb prices buoyant here.
Small lambs of the kind the French like probably wouldn't even make £40 in marts here, but the east of England abbotoirs pay a premium.
Lambs for domestic consumption (40KG liveweight plus) can make as much as £80/head, especially in May.
Do you still farm sheep jimmy ??"
No.
I never had a farm, as such - I had sheep for which I rented grazing (most was stewardship stuff).
I sold up end 2017 because the flock are/were basically my pension, I didn't know what BREXIT would bring, but the uncertainty hadn't hit the market yet, so sheep were making decent money. |
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