FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > violence in Portland
violence in Portland
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"ive seen the vid of the bloke getting done with the crowbar and yea the police stood there and done fuck all.that is the thing with the antifa rats the like being in a group but one on one they piss there pants" I do not remember you saying similar when it was fascist and nazi thugs with guns in Charlottesville, and remember the police stood by there when one of them used a car to murder a protester. | |||
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"have these things happened in the UK? " Portland oregon. Wee fella got the shit kicked out of him by brave crowds wearing masks, black clothes and spent a large part of the day manufacturing milkshakes using quick dry cement....whilst the reporter spent the weekend in hospital..... Brave brave antifa | |||
"Andy ngo a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally and was beaten and hospitalised while the police just stood there!!. So the media goes into a frenzy over a 16 year old in a cap smirking at an old left wing protester but a guy being hospitalised for nothing while the police look the other way barely registers the local news let alone here. Political bias?." Bad. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/antifa-attack-portland-andy-ngo-portland-proud-boys-alt-right-a8981331.html Not at all edifying. There have been three arrests it seems. He's not quite the victim you seem to be making him out to be. He's a pretty right wing journalist. Ironically doesn't like immigration much or Muslims. Surprise, surprise. He also has a history with Antifa including "outing" it's "members", although I didn't really think that it was anything but a loose organisation of people like the gillets jaunes. None of that excuses his assault before you get over-excited. | |||
"have these things happened in the UK? Portland oregon. Wee fella got the shit kicked out of him by brave crowds wearing masks, black clothes and spent a large part of the day manufacturing milkshakes using quick dry cement....whilst the reporter spent the weekend in hospital..... Brave brave antifa" The cement thing is a flimsy rumour. | |||
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"Andy ngo a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally and was beaten and hospitalised while the police just stood there!!. So the media goes into a frenzy over a 16 year old in a cap smirking at an old left wing protester but a guy being hospitalised for nothing while the police look the other way barely registers the local news let alone here. Political bias?. Bad. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/antifa-attack-portland-andy-ngo-portland-proud-boys-alt-right-a8981331.html Not at all edifying. There have been three arrests it seems. He's not quite the victim you seem to be making him out to be. He's a pretty right wing journalist. Ironically doesn't like immigration much or Muslims. Surprise, surprise. He also has a history with Antifa including "outing" it's "members", although I didn't really think that it was anything but a loose organisation of people like the gillets jaunes. None of that excuses his assault before you get over-excited." . Not quite the victim?. Its interesting, i expected you would be the one to say that. | |||
"Andy ngo a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally and was beaten and hospitalised while the police just stood there!!. So the media goes into a frenzy over a 16 year old in a cap smirking at an old left wing protester but a guy being hospitalised for nothing while the police look the other way barely registers the local news let alone here. Political bias?. Bad. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/antifa-attack-portland-andy-ngo-portland-proud-boys-alt-right-a8981331.html Not at all edifying. There have been three arrests it seems. He's not quite the victim you seem to be making him out to be. He's a pretty right wing journalist. Ironically doesn't like immigration much or Muslims. Surprise, surprise. He also has a history with Antifa including "outing" it's "members", although I didn't really think that it was anything but a loose organisation of people like the gillets jaunes. None of that excuses his assault before you get over-excited.. Not quite the victim?. Its interesting, i expected you would be the one to say that." I said quite plainly that it was unacceptable. How do you interpret "Bad"? You said that he was: "a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally" What relevance was the fact of him being; Vietnamese, gay an immigrant or a journalist? The attack should not have happened. I pointed out something quite separate. He is an anti-immigrant journalist with plenty of experience in covering these events and putting himself in the middle of them. He was well known by the people involved for goading and revealing their identities. He wasn't a hapless bystander. He knew where he was and what he was doing. That doesn't make what happened any more acceptable. Now go ahead and try to spin it again. | |||
"Andy ngo a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally and was beaten and hospitalised while the police just stood there!!. So the media goes into a frenzy over a 16 year old in a cap smirking at an old left wing protester but a guy being hospitalised for nothing while the police look the other way barely registers the local news let alone here. Political bias?. Bad. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/antifa-attack-portland-andy-ngo-portland-proud-boys-alt-right-a8981331.html Not at all edifying. There have been three arrests it seems. He's not quite the victim you seem to be making him out to be. He's a pretty right wing journalist. Ironically doesn't like immigration much or Muslims. Surprise, surprise. He also has a history with Antifa including "outing" it's "members", although I didn't really think that it was anything but a loose organisation of people like the gillets jaunes. None of that excuses his assault before you get over-excited.. Not quite the victim?. Its interesting, i expected you would be the one to say that. I said quite plainly that it was unacceptable. How do you interpret "Bad"? You said that he was: "a Vietnamese gay immigrant journalist was documenting a political rally" What relevance was the fact of him being; Vietnamese, gay an immigrant or a journalist? The attack should not have happened. I pointed out something quite separate. He is an anti-immigrant journalist with plenty of experience in covering these events and putting himself in the middle of them. He was well known by the people involved for goading and revealing their identities. He wasn't a hapless bystander. He knew where he was and what he was doing. That doesn't make what happened any more acceptable. Now go ahead and try to spin it again." . I don't need to spin anything your own words portray you perfectly. Hapless bystander? I don't know what else you call somebody who is obeying all laws in a public space, obviously in your warped mind you can find justification for doing anything providing you throw in the buzz words of he's anti Muslim  . | |||
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"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. " I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict. | |||
"By the way you have no idea if he's anti anything you're just making shit up to justify your political violence." Try reading what he's written  | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict." Different guy I think. Same protest. | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict. Different guy I think. Same protest." ? evidence that John Blum(the old man),is in video and pictorial form shows he was far from an innocent,very far in fact. Again I'm just saying misleading information sways people.It's all easy to find out. | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict. Different guy I think. Same protest. ? evidence that John Blum(the old man),is in video and pictorial form shows he was far from an innocent,very far in fact. Again I'm just saying misleading information sways people.It's all easy to find out. " The OP is about Andy Ngo. Perhaps I missed something in your thread of conversation. Apologies if I have. | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict." Oh, and be careful when you categorically condemn the violence because you'll still be told that you support it because you want to introduce nuance | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict. Different guy I think. Same protest. ? evidence that John Blum(the old man),is in video and pictorial form shows he was far from an innocent,very far in fact. Again I'm just saying misleading information sways people.It's all easy to find out. The OP is about Andy Ngo. Perhaps I missed something in your thread of conversation. Apologies if I have." its the quote: "they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing" lol | |||
"Of course I should have added his attackers were left wing Antifa, they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing which is mainly because the radical left wing major is also the police commissioner so he tells the police to stand down every time the left turn violent. I'm not condoning any of the violence but when you claim someone is innocent and willfully ignore key facts(we call this cherry picking),you are just a liar,plain and simple.Those who have not researched properly are just lazy,and laziness with an agenda breeds stupidity. That old guy in question was part of the violence,he was accompanied by his extendable baton,some neo-nazi/white supremacist tattoos and strangely enough the right wing media have omitted the photograph of him shouting and waving the baton before the conflict. Different guy I think. Same protest. ? evidence that John Blum(the old man),is in video and pictorial form shows he was far from an innocent,very far in fact. Again I'm just saying misleading information sways people.It's all easy to find out. The OP is about Andy Ngo. Perhaps I missed something in your thread of conversation. Apologies if I have. its the quote: "they also hit an old guy over the head with a crowbar and still the police did nothing" lol" Ah
Carful, they will tell you that you were laughing at the old guy getting hit
It really is like that in here | |||
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"Here's an interesting article from the new York times written by Andy ngo. In the early hours on Saturday, police in Tacoma, Wash., rushed to the local Immigration and Customs Enforcement facility. An armed man was firebombing the building and nearby vehicles. Police killed him in a shootout after he attempted to set off a large propane tank connected to the facility. Antifa social media accounts subsequently identified their fallen “comrade” as Willem Van Spronsen. The underreported incident marks a new chapter in the return of armed left-wing terrorism to the United States. It also triggered a flash of memory in my mind: I had crossed paths with Van Spronsen in December, when a group of rifle-carrying antifa militiamen tried to prevent me from filming their protest outside Seattle City Hall. Little did I know then that I would soon have a more immediate encounter with antifa violence. Two weeks ago, I was left hospitalized with a brain hemorrhage after a mob of mask-clad rioters beat and robbed me while I was covering a demonstration in downtown Portland, Ore. The attack, claimed by Rose City Antifa, was caught on videos that went viral online. As shocking as my unprovoked beating was, I’m hardly the first to be cruelly beaten by antifa. I have been covering antifa since the days after the 2016 election, when Portlanders woke up to find that downtown had been ravaged by black-clad vandals and arsonists overnight. Since then, the militants have repeatedly brutalized the city’s population. They have learned from experience that city government and police lack the political will to protect citizens. Though known for their hallmark masks and black uniforms, antifa isn’t a formal, centralized group. Its “members” operate as a loose grouping of militant Marxists and anarchists drawn from various autonomous far-left groups. Political violence is a feature, not a bug, of antifa, which believes itself to be in an existential struggle with latter-day fascism. The worst part is how prominent media figures and politicians glamorize and even promote antifa as a movement for a just cause. CNN’s Chris Cuomo and Don Lemon have defended antifa on-air. Chuck Todd invited antifa ideologue Mark Bray on “Meet the Press” to explain why antifa’s political violence is “ethical.” Keith Ellison gleefully posted — and recently deleted — a selfie of himself holding Bray’s antifa handbook. Rep. Maxine Waters met hard-left political operative Joseph Alcoff in 2016. Alcoff is currently facing felony charges for his alleged involvement in an antifa mob beating of two Marines in Philadelphia. That last choice of targets — Marines — was no accident. Antifa operates by a very broad definition of “fascists.” By antifa’s telling, fascists include mainstream conservatives and even centrist journalists who dare criticize them. But they save most of their hatred for US law enforcement and military service members. Antifa’s goal is violent political revolution, and it sees law-enforcement officers and the military as the main obstacles. Will other Dems join Biden in condeming antifa violence? Will other Dems join Biden in condeming antifa violence? In the Pacific Northwest, where antifa is especially active, the group has continually targeted ICE. Last summer, the local ICE building in Portland faced a five-week siege that shut down the facility. Why? Antifa seeks to destabilize and destroy the nation-state by attacking its sovereign borders. And the group draws morale from mainstream progressive politicians, such as Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, who normalize hatred of border enforcement and sovereignty as such. Van Spronsen, last weekend’s antifa fire bomber, expressed disdain for the state in a manifesto attributed to him on Seattle Antifascist Action’s Facebook page (it has since been deleted). He allegedly wrote: “I am antifa” and referred to ICE centers as “concentration camps” — language taken directly from AOC. Last summer, he took part in a siege of the same Tacoma ICE facility he attacked Saturday, assaulted an officer and was found to be carrying a baton and knife. He pleaded guilty to obstructing police and was released under a deferred sentence. As the Saturday incident shows, law enforcement should pay more attention to the various armed militias that ally with the wider antifa movement. Van Spronsen was a member of the John Brown Gun Club, a Marxist gun organization that calls itself “anti-fascist, anti-racist, anti-capitalist and anti-patriarchy.” The JBGC was glowingly featured in a May episode of CNN’s “United Shades of America.” Host W. Kamau Bell even solicited donations from the public on the group’s behalf. Elite cheering of terrorism hasn’t been this chic since Leonard Bernstein fundraised for the Black Panthers at his Park Avenue pad. Andy Ngo is an editor at Quillette. Twitter: @MrAndyNgo "
Thanks for posting that, very informative, it's very disturbing behaviour indeed, | |||
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"What is your actual point here? Are you saying that the media underreport the violence of those from the extreme left compared to the extreme right? Are you saying that violence from the extreme left is worse than that of the right or of the same level? Are you saying that you should be surprised if as a vocal critic of a violent group you are attacked if you stand amongst them? Is it inadequate to condemn extreme left wing violence in the same way as that of the extreme right wing? Does it require greater criticism? I'm not sure what you disagree with me about, so this would be helpful." Asking questions lol, brilliant | |||
"What is your actual point here? Are you saying that the media underreport the violence of those from the extreme left compared to the extreme right? Are you saying that violence from the extreme left is worse than that of the right or of the same level? Are you saying that you should be surprised if as a vocal critic of a violent group you are attacked if you stand amongst them? Is it inadequate to condemn extreme left wing violence in the same way as that of the extreme right wing? Does it require greater criticism? I'm not sure what you disagree with me about, so this would be helpful." . Who said this thread was about you and me disagreeing?. It's about the perception of political violence only being associated with the right of politics, anyone with an ear to the ground and a scrap of honesty knows the left of politics have a violent armed and dangerous wing of their group and anybody that actually pays attention has seen it's been completely underplayed by the main stream while they've ramped up the danger from the right side of politics, this is called bias, the very thing your always bringing up about politics and obviously one of the reasons you and your fellow lefties have stayed away from this thread. The truth is despite your protestations your just as bias as the right wing nut jobs and from my prospective as somebody in the middle who's got a little bit of history knowledge I worry far more about the far left than the far right because there sneaky fuckers who always come in with dreams of utopia while secretly building gulags for people who disagree. | |||
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"What is your actual point here? Are you saying that the media underreport the violence of those from the extreme left compared to the extreme right? Are you saying that violence from the extreme left is worse than that of the right or of the same level? Are you saying that you should be surprised if as a vocal critic of a violent group you are attacked if you stand amongst them? Is it inadequate to condemn extreme left wing violence in the same way as that of the extreme right wing? Does it require greater criticism? I'm not sure what you disagree with me about, so this would be helpful.. Who said this thread was about you and me disagreeing?. It's about the perception of political violence only being associated with the right of politics, anyone with an ear to the ground and a scrap of honesty knows the left of politics have a violent armed and dangerous wing of their group and anybody that actually pays attention has seen it's been completely underplayed by the main stream while they've ramped up the danger from the right side of politics, this is called bias, the very thing your always bringing up about politics and obviously one of the reasons you and your fellow lefties have stayed away from this thread. The truth is despite your protestations your just as bias as the right wing nut jobs and from my prospective as somebody in the middle who's got a little bit of history knowledge I worry far more about the far left than the far right because there sneaky fuckers who always come in with dreams of utopia while secretly building gulags for people who disagree." So from that I think that you haven't said that left and right wing violence is equally unacceptable. I suspect that you think that it is though. Can you clarify that? I certainly think that they are. You think that left wing violence is underreported though. It may be. My perception, perhaps incorrect, is that something like AntiFa is ad-hoc and somewhat chaotic with no particular agenda other than to oppose extremists at the other end of the spectrum. My impression is that their presence occurs in reaction to right wing marches and rallies. Are there many stand alone left wing extremist marches that lead to violence? Their violence is unacceptable regardless. How do I condemn it to a level that satisfies you? | |||
"Here's your starter for ten!!! There's three different profiles used that same old fashioned phrase in the last four days!. It's like one voice in here at times "You see the same thing from those from the other extreme on other threads. Do you think that is also unacceptable? | |||
"Here's your starter for ten!!! There's three different profiles used that same old fashioned phrase in the last four days!. It's like one voice in here at times
You see the same thing from those from the other extreme on other threads.
Do you think that is also unacceptable?"I don't think it's unacceptable on either side, people are free to have 28 accounts and create their own echo chamber if they want, it's no business of mine, I'm just letting them know I wasn't born yesterday | |||
"What is your actual point here? Are you saying that the media underreport the violence of those from the extreme left compared to the extreme right? Are you saying that violence from the extreme left is worse than that of the right or of the same level? Are you saying that you should be surprised if as a vocal critic of a violent group you are attacked if you stand amongst them? Is it inadequate to condemn extreme left wing violence in the same way as that of the extreme right wing? Does it require greater criticism? I'm not sure what you disagree with me about, so this would be helpful.. Who said this thread was about you and me disagreeing?. It's about the perception of political violence only being associated with the right of politics, anyone with an ear to the ground and a scrap of honesty knows the left of politics have a violent armed and dangerous wing of their group and anybody that actually pays attention has seen it's been completely underplayed by the main stream while they've ramped up the danger from the right side of politics, this is called bias, the very thing your always bringing up about politics and obviously one of the reasons you and your fellow lefties have stayed away from this thread. The truth is despite your protestations your just as bias as the right wing nut jobs and from my prospective as somebody in the middle who's got a little bit of history knowledge I worry far more about the far left than the far right because there sneaky fuckers who always come in with dreams of utopia while secretly building gulags for people who disagree. So from that I think that you haven't said that left and right wing violence is equally unacceptable. I suspect that you think that it is though. Can you clarify that? I certainly think that they are. You think that left wing violence is underreported though. It may be. My perception, perhaps incorrect, is that something like AntiFa is ad-hoc and somewhat chaotic with no particular agenda other than to oppose extremists at the other end of the spectrum. My impression is that their presence occurs in reaction to right wing marches and rallies. Are there many stand alone left wing extremist marches that lead to violence? Their violence is unacceptable regardless. How do I condemn it to a level that satisfies you?" . The fact that you think right wing political terrorists are planning, meeting and abundant while you think left wing is scarce, not planning and popping up randomly for the good of the masses in general just confirms my suspicions on propaganda by the mainstream media. To your other point do you really think left wing extremists only occur to fight the right wing extremists? You don't think one begets another?, do you know how the EDL came about? Do you think the MDL is random or begat from the EDL?. BAMN by any means necessary, you know what that implies don't you? That group has had 18 people sent to prison for violent assault in form or another since it's inception. Radical extremists have a political side and it's violent militia side, you see this from all sides of the political spectrum, to route out Nazis you first need to route at the ideology, the same goes for Islamists and socialist. Don't let the fluffy smiley ones who make the TV fool you, the nasty fuckers aren't stood to far behind them. | |||
" So from that I think that you haven't said that left and right wing violence is equally unacceptable. I suspect that you think that it is though. Can you clarify that? I certainly think that they are. You think that left wing violence is underreported though. It may be. My perception, perhaps incorrect, is that something like AntiFa is ad-hoc and somewhat chaotic with no particular agenda other than to oppose extremists at the other end of the spectrum. My impression is that their presence occurs in reaction to right wing marches and rallies. Are there many stand alone left wing extremist marches that lead to violence? Their violence is unacceptable regardless. How do I condemn it to a level that satisfies you?. The fact that you think right wing political terrorists are planning, meeting and abundant while you think left wing is scarce, not planning and popping up randomly for the good of the masses in general just confirms my suspicions on propaganda by the mainstream media. To your other point do you really think left wing extremists only occur to fight the right wing extremists? You don't think one begets another?, do you know how the EDL came about? Do you think the MDL is random or begat from the EDL?. BAMN by any means necessary, you know what that implies don't you? That group has had 18 people sent to prison for violent assault in form or another since it's inception. Radical extremists have a political side and it's violent militia side, you see this from all sides of the political spectrum, to route out Nazis you first need to route at the ideology, the same goes for Islamists and socialist. Don't let the fluffy smiley ones who make the TV fool you, the nasty fuckers aren't stood to far behind them." So are extreme left and right wing violence equally unacceptable? I assume yes but you haven't clarified. You think that they are both equally frequent but that by the extreme left is underreported? This is due to a "conspiracy" of some description? What extreme left wing marches have there been? What violence has resulted from them? What I have heard about is in reaction to right wing ones. Do you know otherwise? Are animal rights extremists left wing? Anarchist groups? Religious? I don't know. How are they characterised? You've pointed to one group. There was Baader Minhoff too. I'm sure that there are others. All violent extremist groups are rare from both sides bit the right seem to encompass rather more. Some feel free to be very open about their views. Many seem to crave publicity and power. Perhaps that is why we hear more about them whilst left wing extremists pass unnoticed? Are you claiming that I, personally, am willing to ignore one type of violence but not another? Based on what? What would I have to do for you to not think that I was biased in some way? | |||
