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If Jeremy Corbyn was kicked out
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" The wrong brother won ! | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" For me it would have to be Corbyn and Abbott to go at least before I could ever contemplate voting Labour. | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? For me it would have to be Corbyn and Abbott to go at least before I could ever contemplate voting Labour. "  Need to lose the militant connections too, life has moved on since the 70s and 80s. | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? For me it would have to be Corbyn and Abbott to go at least before I could ever contemplate voting Labour. Need to lose the militant connections too, life has moved on since the 70s and 80s."If I was in that party, I’d get rid of him, based on his election record he hasn’t really inspired much in confidence that labour can be a credible election alternative to the tories. He only appeals to the hard core lefties in his party, not the general public, and the only person who cannot see that is him. He’s just as stubborn as Theresa May, and a much bigger cunt. | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? For me it would have to be Corbyn and Abbott to go at least before I could ever contemplate voting Labour. Need to lose the militant connections too, life has moved on since the 70s and 80s."Indeed | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" Maybe, maybe not. The one thing that is for sure is that many Labour Party members would leave for a second time and never return changing allegiance to the Green Party in all likelihood. | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" Yes | |||
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"I would love to see abbot in charge along side lammy. That would be sensational "Now your talking .Almost as sexy as a boris moggy duo.The silver spoon dastardly duo born rule the plebs. | |||
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"No Bob.... I'd prefer to see those two kept as gimps in the No. 10 cellar "So kinky.I like it. | |||
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"If labour gets in again anybody owning their own home or with any kind of property better look out for the rise in taxes "That's why I vote green. Universal basic income! | |||
"If labour gets in again anybody owning their own home or with any kind of property better look out for the rise in taxes "Think of it as nationalising your home and turning it into a national asset | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" If he was kicked out you would get john mcdonell momentum will make sure of that.  | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" I do. | |||
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"Ah good ol Jezza, the gift that just keeps on giving, to the Tories." yeah we might find out what he stands for as soon as momentum tell him. | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? The wrong brother won ! " This | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? Maybe, maybe not. The one thing that is for sure is that many Labour Party members would leave for a second time and never return changing allegiance to the Green Party in all likelihood." I think the first election of JC was due to anti and militant elements infiltrating the party. This undermined the Labour Party. I know the SWP are pro Corbyn and they are extreme left. If they do leave, they will be replaced by pro EU centrists, which represent a big majority. Why hold onto to the one in three for when the two in three are larger. JC is a professional campaigner, he would be far suited in the grassroots, but not leading the party. | |||
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"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left?" Your use of data is disingenuous. According to exit polls 67% of labour voters voted to remain whereas 39% of conservative voters voted remain. It is unlikely that enough Labour leave or Tory remain voters would switch allegiance to the other parties to significantly change a general election outcome when comparing Labour and Conservative dominance of UK politics. However there is a strong likelihood that a new 3rd party would emerge (in my view). | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? Your use of data is disingenuous. According to exit polls 67% of labour voters voted to remain whereas 39% of conservative voters voted remain. It is unlikely that enough Labour leave or Tory remain voters would switch allegiance to the other parties to significantly change a general election outcome when comparing Labour and Conservative dominance of UK politics. However there is a strong likelihood that a new 3rd party would emerge (in my view)." Silly me, and there I was thinking an MP is there to represent all the people in their constituency. Also the MP's also said they would represent what the country voted for ie to Leave. I agree a third party could win the seat especially if they were a leave party! | |||
"Silly me, and there I was thinking an MP is there to represent all the people in their constituency. Also the MP's also said they would represent what the country voted for ie to Leave. I agree a third party could win the seat especially if they were a leave party!" I think you will find you are wrong in just about everything you have said there. Firstly, I believe that when an MP takes up their seat in Parliament they swear an 'Oath of Allegiance' to the Crown (that is the reason no Sinn Fein MP will ever sit in the Commons), now I could be wrong, but I think you will find nothing in that oath that says the MP will represent all their constituents, but does say something about faithfully discharging the duties of an MP for the benefit of the country and their constituents. But as I have said I could be wrong about that. As for winning seats I believe that with our broken 'first past the post' system we operate to realistically have any chance of changing the shape of the House of Commons a new leave party would need to attract a minimum of 30% of the poll across the board and at least 40% in those constituencies it hoped to win. I doubt that a leave party would be able to cross these thresholds. This is not a matter of ideology for me, it is a matter of recognising and acknowledging the basic truth of our electoral system (which I for one would change to a STV system to make our politics more representative). | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? Your use of data is disingenuous. According to exit polls 67% of labour voters voted to remain whereas 39% of conservative voters voted remain. It is unlikely that enough Labour leave or Tory remain voters would switch allegiance to the other parties to significantly change a general election outcome when comparing Labour and Conservative dominance of UK politics. However there is a strong likelihood that a new 3rd party would emerge (in my view)." Why mention overall percentages? In the FPTP system they matter not. Labour cannot retain key seats if it becomes a party of remain. | |||
" Why mention overall percentages? In the FPTP system they matter not. Labour cannot retain key seats if it becomes a party of remain." Because overall percentages matter. In a FPTP system the only way Labour loose out in becoming a remain party is if Labour leave voters change allegiance due to this single issue but no other party suffers the fate. Now I am sure that some Labour supporters would change their vote, but I am fairly confident that Labour would attract votes in the same approximate ratio as they would loose. Seeing that as a % of their total vote there were more Tory remain voters than Labour leave voters it is likely that the marginal shift would be in Labours favour rather than against Labour. Its a question of numbers and statistics and don't forget if the leave side were confident of winning a second referendum we would have had it already. | |||
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"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left?" Comparing a binary vote to a multi polar one is fraught with danger. If Brexit has not happened, and Labour is seen to offer a credible alternative (e.g. 2nd referendum), Labour is forecast to pick up more seats than it would lose. | |||
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"Cannot wait for Corbyn to be dismissed so the country can finally have an effective opposition- his prevarication over Brexit has done a real disservice to the Remain electorate Tory failures enabler" Tory failures enabler? Bit of a spitting image caricature that as only in the real sense of the referendum would they be the enabler. In the sense of the deal - they support it. They have enabled a crisis of parliament and if anything have put May in a position of constant surveillance due to their constant rhetoric over these last few years, despite the fact they do not have a plan and in spite of having 3 years to come up with one. | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left?" It's possible for a labour constituency to be leave yet not one Labour voter to have voted to leave. But unlikely. Most probably the majority of Labour voters voted to remain. So the implicit belief is that an MP represents the views and concerns of all their constituents. Not just those who voted for them. I agree with that. But in Brexit, the view is we won you lost. Get over it. No one on the leave side is listening to the concerns of the 48%, and trying to either reassure or accommodate. Indeed they're pushing for the polar opposite and alienating rather than seeking a middle ground. Indeed they're pushing for a no deal which has no manifesto in the UK parliamentary system. And largely it seems, as much to spite the other side as anything else.... | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? It's possible for a labour constituency to be leave yet not one Labour voter to have voted to leave. But unlikely. Most probably the majority of Labour voters voted to remain. So the implicit belief is that an MP represents the views and concerns of all their constituents. Not just those who voted for them. I agree with that. But in Brexit, the view is we won you lost. Get over it. No one on the leave side is listening to the concerns of the 48%, and trying to either reassure or accommodate. Indeed they're pushing for the polar opposite and alienating rather than seeking a middle ground. Indeed they're pushing for a no deal which has no manifesto in the UK parliamentary system. And largely it seems, as much to spite the other side as anything else...." caroline flint reckoned they would lose at least 40 seats if they backed remain would think she knows a bit more about it than you and me. | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? It's possible for a labour constituency to be leave yet not one Labour voter to have voted to leave. But unlikely. Most probably the majority of Labour voters voted to remain. So the implicit belief is that an MP represents the views and concerns of all their constituents. Not just those who voted for them. I agree with that. But in Brexit, the view is we won you lost. Get over it. No one on the leave side is listening to the concerns of the 48%, and trying to either reassure or accommodate. Indeed they're pushing for the polar opposite and alienating rather than seeking a middle ground. Indeed they're pushing for a no deal which has no manifesto in the UK parliamentary system. And largely it seems, as much to spite the other side as anything else....caroline flint reckoned they would lose at least 40 seats if they backed remain would think she knows a bit more about it than you and me." There was some analysis done which suggested the opposite. I've not seen what flint has based her analysis on. But I didn't make any predictions. It is true that all or most Labour voters in a leave constituency could have voted remain. Indeed its likely in most cases to be true. I've made no prediction about how a switch in policy will affect labour voters or the effect on seats. So let's not strawman. Do you think MP's should represent the views of all their constituants? Or just those which won by backing the winning MP? | |||
"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? It's possible for a labour constituency to be leave yet not one Labour voter to have voted to leave. But unlikely. Most probably the majority of Labour voters voted to remain. So the implicit belief is that an MP represents the views and concerns of all their constituents. Not just those who voted for them. I agree with that. But in Brexit, the view is we won you lost. Get over it. No one on the leave side is listening to the concerns of the 48%, and trying to either reassure or accommodate. Indeed they're pushing for the polar opposite and alienating rather than seeking a middle ground. Indeed they're pushing for a no deal which has no manifesto in the UK parliamentary system. And largely it seems, as much to spite the other side as anything else....caroline flint reckoned they would lose at least 40 seats if they backed remain would think she knows a bit more about it than you and me. There was some analysis done which suggested the opposite. I've not seen what flint has based her analysis on. But I didn't make any predictions. It is true that all or most Labour voters in a leave constituency could have voted remain. Indeed its likely in most cases to be true. I've made no prediction about how a switch in policy will affect labour voters or the effect on seats. So let's not strawman. Do you think MP's should represent the views of all their constituants? Or just those which won by backing the winning MP? " Of course i do but its estimated that 148 of labour seats voted to leave with 84 remain so tell me how by switching to a remain policy its representing labour supporters. | |||
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"In the 2016 EU referendum, 148 Labour constituencies voted to leave. If Labour now decided to become the party of remain how many of these seats would still vote Labour in a snap general election before we had left? It's possible for a labour constituency to be leave yet not one Labour voter to have voted to leave. But unlikely. Most probably the majority of Labour voters voted to remain. So the implicit belief is that an MP represents the views and concerns of all their constituents. Not just those who voted for them. I agree with that. But in Brexit, the view is we won you lost. Get over it. No one on the leave side is listening to the concerns of the 48%, and trying to either reassure or accommodate. Indeed they're pushing for the polar opposite and alienating rather than seeking a middle ground. Indeed they're pushing for a no deal which has no manifesto in the UK parliamentary system. And largely it seems, as much to spite the other side as anything else....caroline flint reckoned they would lose at least 40 seats if they backed remain would think she knows a bit more about it than you and me. There was some analysis done which suggested the opposite. I've not seen what flint has based her analysis on. But I didn't make any predictions. It is true that all or most Labour voters in a leave constituency could have voted remain. Indeed its likely in most cases to be true. I've made no prediction about how a switch in policy will affect labour voters or the effect on seats. So let's not strawman. Do you think MP's should represent the views of all their constituants? Or just those which won by backing the winning MP? Of course i do but its estimated that 148 of labour seats voted to leave with 84 remain so tell me how by switching to a remain policy its representing labour supporters." Labour have 247 seats...... | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" No | |||
"Spending £3 to join the labour party and getting to vote for a never electable JC was the best money that I ever wasted." | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" Latest poll suggests yes. With Corbyn as leader - Con 30%; Lab 25 % Without Corbyn as leader - Lab 34%; Con 28% Deltapoll for Mail on Sunday | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? Latest poll suggests yes. With Corbyn as leader - Con 30%; Lab 25 % Without Corbyn as leader - Lab 34%; Con 28% Deltapoll for Mail on Sunday" Is that with the peodo finder general in charge? after all he is dept leader | |||
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"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election? Latest poll suggests yes. With Corbyn as leader - Con 30%; Lab 25 % Without Corbyn as leader - Lab 34%; Con 28% Deltapoll for Mail on SundayIs that with the peodo finder general in charge? after all he is dept leader" If Watson was their leader it would no doubt be worse than Corbyn. I just see the Labour Party as an ever giving fountain of shit that has allowed the ineptitude of the tories to go unchallenged for far too long. I was chatting with my old man and three other men in their eighties yesterday. All of them reckon the current and recent politicians are the worse in their lifetime. That’s Blair, Brown, Cameron and May. And as for Corbyn, well even the two Labour supporters said they wouldn’t vote for him! They all reserve judgement on Boris but reckon he may be ok if he gets Brexit done, and bear in mind two of them voted stay! Now I may not know much about politics, but I remember Callaghan, and I read about Chamberlain, and both of them I would have thought were worse than the four leaders mentioned above. Obviously they aren’t as bad as Corbyn, but that’s the opinion of four gentlemen who have seen much more than we have over the years. | |||
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"I doubt it. Brexit has moved England so far to the right that even a return to the Tory-lite Blairism of the past wouldn't get Labour a majority. You're looking at coalitions for years until all the Leave voters have died off." Remain voters also die. | |||
"I doubt it. Brexit has moved England so far to the right that even a return to the Tory-lite Blairism of the past wouldn't get Labour a majority. You're looking at coalitions for years until all the Leave voters have died off." Sad but true. | |||
"I doubt it. Brexit has moved England so far to the right that even a return to the Tory-lite Blairism of the past wouldn't get Labour a majority. You're looking at coalitions for years until all the Leave voters have died off." wow all died off ya lovely leftie so careing pmsl | |||
"I doubt it. Brexit has moved England so far to the right that even a return to the Tory-lite Blairism of the past wouldn't get Labour a majority. You're looking at coalitions for years until all the Leave voters have died off. Remain voters also die." And theres me thinking they had God on their side. | |||
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"Remain voters also die." Of course we do. That said, there's only a few percent more of you and most of you are nearer to the grave than we are. It's not about caring (or not) it's about demographics - which will, for sure, change politics. Hopefully, enough to stop the country going even further to the right than it already is. | |||
"Remain voters also die. Of course we do. That said, there's only a few percent more of you and most of you are nearer to the grave than we are. It's not about caring (or not) it's about demographics - which will, for sure, change politics. Hopefully, enough to stop the country going even further to the right than it already is." Why have you assumed I’m a leaver? | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" Yes for certain | |||
"Remain voters also die. Of course we do. That said, there's only a few percent more of you and most of you are nearer to the grave than we are. It's not about caring (or not) it's about demographics - which will, for sure, change politics. Hopefully, enough to stop the country going even further to the right than it already is." So, because leavers are older, you eagerly await their demise in order to see the younger generation take their place. Thus, ( in your eyes ) quelling the ever increasing lean to the right that this country is experiencing. Well, sadly for you and your ilk, Corbyn has done more than enough to show even the most zealous left wing youngster that it’s a path that’s not going to take anyone anywhere. Unless you, like Corbyn, think Venezuela is a good example of how left wing socialist politics can work. Like it or not, we live in a capitalist society. Capitalism drives us forward, it gives us a purpose, a responsibility to ourselves and our families. It helps us realise from a young age that the world doesn’t owe us a living, and that we are the masters of our own destiny. If we work hard and do the right thing we will be rewarded, not pilloried and taxed to the hilt forcing us out of the UK to a fairer environment that doesn’t treat success with punishment and hate. And with the exodus of the most successful we also lose the jobs they create, and the taxes they pay. But never mind huh? Under a left wing socialist government everyone would have a never ending supply of money from the bottomless pot of money available like there was before Gordon Brown sold the gold to Japan, and Byrne left the infamous note to the incoming chancellor saying ‘there’s no money left’. The irony with the legacy left by the last labour government is that they weren’t even that far left, more of a slight tilt from the centre. But if Diane Abbott gets control at least she could get more police on the streets for less than it’s going to cost Boris! And we would need a serious socialist model to give them and their families a fighting chance on their £30 a year salary. Yep, she still sits there next to brother Corbyn with the terrorist sympathiser McDonnell, and the odious deputy leader Watson sits at the back waiting for his next opportunity to ruin more people’s lives by using his parliamentary privilege in supporting a revolting specimen of pond life like Carl Beech. | |||
"Anyone but Corbyn, as I understood it" Not Tom Watson, don't like the guy. He comes across as smarmy, sneaky, and power hungry to me. | |||
"Remain voters also die. Of course we do. That said, there's only a few percent more of you and most of you are nearer to the grave than we are. It's not about caring (or not) it's about demographics - which will, for sure, change politics. Hopefully, enough to stop the country going even further to the right than it already is." . Yea we'll be dandy when the young communists of the EU take power, what could possibly go wrong  | |||
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"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st ". "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government ". My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it "He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals. | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals.". The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories. They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain. So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics. | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals..
The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories.
They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain.
So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics.
"I completely agree that we aren't going to get a better deal but even a lot of leavers aren't happy with the deal as they're living in some fantasy land that we'll somehow get a better deal from the outside or basically the same terms we have now without any financial commitment which is delusional. A no deal brexit only means we have to continue to negotiate from the outside so I have no idea how so many seem to think that is the better option. As the conservatives committed to having the referendum in the first place then I agree they should respect the vote. Then on top of that they again committed to leading us out of the EU. However, their MPs clearly haven't held that promise as enough of them have voted against the deal for it to not go through. As I said before, the point of a majority government is that they should be able to get things through parliament without any backing from opposition parties. | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals..
The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories.
They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain.
So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics.
I completely agree that we aren't going to get a better deal but even a lot of leavers aren't happy with the deal as they're living in some fantasy land that we'll somehow get a better deal from the outside or basically the same terms we have now without any financial commitment which is delusional. A no deal brexit only means we have to continue to negotiate from the outside so I have no idea how so many seem to think that is the better option.
As the conservatives committed to having the referendum in the first place then I agree they should respect the vote. Then on top of that they again committed to leading us out of the EU. However, their MPs clearly haven't held that promise as enough of them have voted against the deal for it to not go through. As I said before, the point of a majority government is that they should be able to get things through parliament without any backing from opposition parties.". But the reality is it's parliament and the people that are divided, three quarters of parliament are remainers and unfortunately a big massive slice of that are hardened remainers ie they don't give a flying fuck for democracy, they won't give a second vote because they're terrified it will still be leave. So we kick cans down the road until we're truly fucked and then hopefully reverse democracy and nobody goes ape shit. | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals..
The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories.
They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain.
So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics.
I completely agree that we aren't going to get a better deal but even a lot of leavers aren't happy with the deal as they're living in some fantasy land that we'll somehow get a better deal from the outside or basically the same terms we have now without any financial commitment which is delusional. A no deal brexit only means we have to continue to negotiate from the outside so I have no idea how so many seem to think that is the better option.
As the conservatives committed to having the referendum in the first place then I agree they should respect the vote. Then on top of that they again committed to leading us out of the EU. However, their MPs clearly haven't held that promise as enough of them have voted against the deal for it to not go through. As I said before, the point of a majority government is that they should be able to get things through parliament without any backing from opposition parties..
But the reality is it's parliament and the people that are divided, three quarters of parliament are remainers and unfortunately a big massive slice of that are hardened remainers ie they don't give a flying fuck for democracy, they won't give a second vote because they're terrified it will still be leave.
So we kick cans down the road until we're truly fucked and then hopefully reverse democracy and nobody goes ape shit."I thought most leavers thought a second vote was undemocratic? There's huge support on the remain side for a second vote. | |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals..
The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories.
They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain.
So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics.
I completely agree that we aren't going to get a better deal but even a lot of leavers aren't happy with the deal as they're living in some fantasy land that we'll somehow get a better deal from the outside or basically the same terms we have now without any financial commitment which is delusional. A no deal brexit only means we have to continue to negotiate from the outside so I have no idea how so many seem to think that is the better option.
As the conservatives committed to having the referendum in the first place then I agree they should respect the vote. Then on top of that they again committed to leading us out of the EU. However, their MPs clearly haven't held that promise as enough of them have voted against the deal for it to not go through. As I said before, the point of a majority government is that they should be able to get things through parliament without any backing from opposition parties..
But the reality is it's parliament and the people that are divided, three quarters of parliament are remainers and unfortunately a big massive slice of that are hardened remainers ie they don't give a flying fuck for democracy, they won't give a second vote because they're terrified it will still be leave.
So we kick cans down the road until we're truly fucked and then hopefully reverse democracy and nobody goes ape shit.
I thought most leavers thought a second vote was undemocratic? There's huge support on the remain side for a second vote.". Well it is undemocratic, we had one implement it and if your not happy have another, we did that between 1975 and 2016. You didn't get it I noticed though did you? No second vote I mean despite parliament being stacked sideways with remainers and most of them hardened ones, funny ain't it?. | |||
"If JC was kicked out as Leader of the Labour Party and a centrist candidate like Dan Jarvis or Tom Watson was made leader, do you think that labour could win the next general election?" No. | |||
| |||
"Corbyn in a nutshell. He's happy seeing his party go into decline of hardly anything left of it as long as it means the Tories are dead and buried forever. Which is why he's not going down the stop the brexit path (it would attract to many votes and gain labour power), the horror, no far better to vote down every deal and let the Tories take the rap for a no deal brexit. I will keep my wager on no deal come October 31st . "Letting the tories take the rap !!??"" ,,,,,, it might be worth pointing out that the Tory manifesto for the 2015 General Election said they would have an in/out referendum if they won ,, they did win ,, they held an in/ out referendum ,,, the tories had continually told us they had " a long term economic plan " ,, on the morning following the referendum instead of a plan kicking into shape the PM resigned ( after he said he wouldn't ) to be replaced by a PM who said she wouldn't hold a General Election , then did , who has since been replaced by someone who could have stood to be leader after Cameron left but didn't ,, so maybe the Conservative party are perhaps just a little bit responsible for the chaos that has ensued ,, it might also be worth pointing out that after the magic money tree ( which is quickly growing into a forest ) found its way to the DUP it is actually irrelevant how labour voted because the tories have a majority , , the reason we had a referendum was the Tory government , the reason we didn't agree a deal is the Tory government , the reason we haven't left is the Tory government .
My bad, obviously any democratic decision you dislike should never be given in the first place, next time a party gets elected I don't like I won't blame the election or the people who elected them, I'll just grow a pair and get over it
He never said that. Just that it was the conservatives who called the referendum and the conservatives who cocked up the deal. You can't blame Labour for blocking the deal from going through parliament as the whole point of the conservatives apparently having a majority government is that they don't need the oppositions votes to get something through. Unfortunalty too many of their own party and the DUP (who were paid off to vote in their favour but seemingly aren't) are also rejecting the deals..
The conservatives didn't cock up any deal, the deal they got was the only deal the EU was giving and it's still the only deal regardless of who's leading the Tories.
They offered a referendum on EU membership and obviously an awful lot wanted it because they voted them in, they kept that election manifesto and gave the people a vote, they recommend the people VOTE REMAIN far more than Corbyn did, the people voted to leave, we're leaving with that deal or without it, labour have voted that deal down because they think it will lead to the end of the Tories, the Tories voted it down because most of them want to remain the libdems voted it down because all of them want to remain.
So now as far as I can see were leaving on no deal because half our politicans don't care about democracy and the other half are hell bent on party politics.
I completely agree that we aren't going to get a better deal but even a lot of leavers aren't happy with the deal as they're living in some fantasy land that we'll somehow get a better deal from the outside or basically the same terms we have now without any financial commitment which is delusional. A no deal brexit only means we have to continue to negotiate from the outside so I have no idea how so many seem to think that is the better option.
As the conservatives committed to having the referendum in the first place then I agree they should respect the vote. Then on top of that they again committed to leading us out of the EU. However, their MPs clearly haven't held that promise as enough of them have voted against the deal for it to not go through. As I said before, the point of a majority government is that they should be able to get things through parliament without any backing from opposition parties..
But the reality is it's parliament and the people that are divided, three quarters of parliament are remainers and unfortunately a big massive slice of that are hardened remainers ie they don't give a flying fuck for democracy, they won't give a second vote because they're terrified it will still be leave.
So we kick cans down the road until we're truly fucked and then hopefully reverse democracy and nobody goes ape shit.
I thought most leavers thought a second vote was undemocratic? There's huge support on the remain side for a second vote..
Well it is undemocratic, we had one implement it and if your not happy have another, we did that between 1975 and 2016.
You didn't get it I noticed though did you? No second vote I mean despite parliament being stacked sideways with remainers and most of them hardened ones, funny ain't it?."I don't think so. I think they believe their reputation would never recover if they had another and the result was remain so we never left. If the result was leave again they would have just wasted even more time. I believe the conservatives intend for us to leave, they're just totally incompetent at making that happen. | |||
