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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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No state aid for any business .Im in business and if I faced bankruptcy nobody in goverment would give a fuck or offer me a quid.Nobody is to big to fail.Let market forces sort the wheat from the chaff.
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But why shouldn't industries be protected in the short term?
We could and should have protected the steel industry.
We have protected the East Coast Main line twice now.
We protected the banks.
Sometimes you cannot just sit there and so - hard luck, no trains, the operator has gone bust; or
Hard luck, you've lost your savings. The bank has gone bust.
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"No state aid for any business .Im in business and if I faced bankruptcy nobody in goverment would give a fuck or offer me a quid.Nobody is to big to fail.Let market forces sort the wheat from the chaff.
"
And do you employ anyone? Because if you do, and you were bust, then the Government would be paying your employees' redundancy payments for you.
And do you ever use a late night bus? Because that is probably being subsidised by the Local Authority too. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Sorry guys if you can't turn a profit you are either shit at what you do or your business model sucks.You shouldn't subsidise poor business men and women or rubbish ideas .Or greedy banks that make poor decisions .
Government services that are now traded services have to make a profit.If the goverment chooses to fund or sibsidiise a service it considers statutory then I'm ok with that . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"But why shouldn't industries be protected in the short term?
We could and should have protected the steel industry.
We have protected the East Coast Main line twice now.
We protected the banks.
Sometimes you cannot just sit there and so - hard luck, no trains, the operator has gone bust; or
Hard luck, you've lost your savings. The bank has gone bust.
"
It's called market forces. If you can't stand the head get out of the kitchen. The railways are franchisees - the government grants franchises hence when they fail the state takes control.
The banks have a state guarantee - around £70,000 - so you just got to stay under the limit - simples!
Finally we sold off state industries in the Thatcher years - another example of government getting it wrong by "giving it away".
At the end of the day surely this is what brexit is all about? Free trade, supply & demand - macro economics? |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"But why shouldn't industries be protected in the short term?
We could and should have protected the steel industry.
We have protected the East Coast Main line twice now.
We protected the banks.
Sometimes you cannot just sit there and so - hard luck, no trains, the operator has gone bust; or
Hard luck, you've lost your savings. The bank has gone bust.
It's called market forces. If you can't stand the head get out of the kitchen. The railways are franchisees - the government grants franchises hence when they fail the state takes control.
The banks have a state guarantee - around £70,000 - so you just got to stay under the limit - simples!
Finally we sold off state industries in the Thatcher years - another example of government getting it wrong by "giving it away".
At the end of the day surely this is what brexit is all about? Free trade, supply & demand - macro economics? "
I find the language of those opposed to re-nationalising industry interesting. They talk of "cost" as if it was an item that you buy, as opposed to "investment", the term for buying a business.... |
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"The Government should always do what it thinks is best for the Country."
Should being the operative word...and yet it so rarely does, preferring instead to do what it thinks is best for the government... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The Government should always do what it thinks is best for the Country.
Should being the operative word...and yet it so rarely does, preferring instead to do what it thinks is best for the government..."
Very true, should is the crux word |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Post BREXIT it will depend on which party gets elected, and what their policy is on such matters. Obviously if they don’t get things right and fail to keep their promises, they will be ousted in the next election.
THAT is us taking control of our own national interests. No EU rules, just governments that are answerable to the British people. |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
I don't have a strong view about state aid, other than to suggest it will depend on whether UK is inside or outside the single market and what rules it does or does not need to comply with.
The story of nationalised industry is fascinating and shows how great ideas wither over time.
Go back to the late 1930s, everyone struggling through the Depression and then, just when you think it cannot get any worse, war breaks out.
By the early 1940s, the political leaders began to think about life after the war and concluded there was no way they could expect people to return to the living conditions of the 1930s after such a sacrifice. The Establishment would be overthrown, basically.
So Beveridge identified the "five giants" that needed to be slayed in order to build a new Britain after the war:
Want
Disease
Squalor
Ignorance
Idleness
His report really was the last time anyone had a holistic vision to transform the UK for the better. The first peacetime Government took up the challenge:
Want - the creation of the welfare state
Disease - the nationalisation of healthcare
Squalor - huge programme of council house building
Ignorance - state education
Idleness - nationalisation of industry
Want and idleness were inextricably linked. By nationalising industry, everyone was guaranteed a job after the war. Therefore, welfare would be only for those who were too old or infirm to work.
it worked for a while.
But over time, like all great ideas, it drifted. Thatcher came along and took an axe to a lot of it - essentially scrapping council housing, breaking up education and denationalisation of industry.
Welfare now is a very different beast from 1945.
The only edifice of the "five giants" still standing is the NHS. Even the Tories know smashing up the NHS is political suicide.
Needless to say, all these initiatives were done in an era before EU regulation.
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If businesses fail due to Brexit, I'm potentially in favour of leave voters paying much higher taxes, so that state services and private businesses are supported. Many of the leave voters were happy for things to be tough due to their decision - with rights, come responsibilities. |
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By *LCC OP Couple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"Post BREXIT it will depend on which party gets elected, and what their policy is on such matters. Obviously if they don’t get things right and fail to keep their promises, they will be ousted in the next election.
THAT is us taking control of our own national interests. No EU rules, just governments that are answerable to the British people."
Unless of course the Tories are agreeing with the EU to sign up to their state aid rules, to make sure that if Corbyn ever becomes PM he can't have the economic levers available to him that he would like. Which is exactly what is happening. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Post BREXIT it will depend on which party gets elected, and what their policy is on such matters. Obviously if they don’t get things right and fail to keep their promises, they will be ousted in the next election.
THAT is us taking control of our own national interests. No EU rules, just governments that are answerable to the British people."
just wto rules on government subsidies (admittedly they seem less stringent. But control is control) |
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