FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Inheritance tax
Inheritance tax
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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... a sidetrack from the nhs thread.
"Well perhaps if they weren’t taxed on death they might keep more money in UK accounts and pay tax on it. Wasn’t Cameron’s off shore money inheritance from his daddy?"
Irrc correctly it was a legitamate scheme which would have paid cgt when brought onshore or iht on death.
That said if someone is hiding from iht I’m not sure why they’d unhide it if it were to be taxed in any way ...
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"... a sidetrack from the nhs thread.
Well perhaps if they weren’t taxed on death they might keep more money in UK accounts and pay tax on it. Wasn’t Cameron’s off shore money inheritance from his daddy?
Irrc correctly it was a legitamate scheme which would have paid cgt when brought onshore or iht on death.
That said if someone is hiding from iht I’m not sure why they’d unhide it if it were to be taxed in any way ...
"
Fair point but they would still be earning interest in this country while paying tax on it yet wouldn’t take a big hit at the end. Basically though I just think it’s an unfair tax |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I’d imagine the income tax would be greater (accumulative) than any one off IHT !
I’m always intrigued by those who feel it’s unfair. I’ve seen stats that say many think this way even tho (imo) it’s tax which is a fairer way to distribute wealth than income tax. I guess it’s the fact it’s a one off amount at an emotional time .... and people tend to see the tax they experience rather than look at the tax others pay.... |
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If the government wanted to put an end to tax avoidance and evasion it could do so tomorrow by imposing draconian penalties on all those found to be using tax havens and avoidance schemes to hide taxable income. Say confiscating assets to 10 times the estimated value of the total amount of taxable property not declared.
However this will not happen because only the rich and powerful can afford the expensive accountants required to operate these schemes and our politicians are bought and paid for by those individuals and organisations. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I’d imagine the income tax would be greater (accumulative) than any one off IHT !
I’m always intrigued by those who feel it’s unfair. I’ve seen stats that say many think this way even tho (imo) it’s tax which is a fairer way to distribute wealth than income tax. I guess it’s the fact it’s a one off amount at an emotional time .... and people tend to see the tax they experience rather than look at the tax others pay...."
Chances are. If they’ve got much left at the end then they’ve probably already paid more tax than others. On my death I would prefer my children to ‘benefit ‘ rather than the government, they have taken enough already. And the kids would probably just plough it back into the economy anyway, so the government gets it in the long run  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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And when you say government you mean other people. As ultimately that’s where taxes go...
I think it’s safe to assume we’re in different places on the political spectrum ! But appreciate your answers ... nowt worse than living in a bubble. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"And when you say government you mean other people. As ultimately that’s where taxes go...
I think it’s safe to assume we’re in different places on the political spectrum ! But appreciate your answers ... nowt worse than living in a bubble. "
Sure, thanks.
And if Fabio is reading this from the last thread, I would raise income tax for people earning over say £25000, by how much I haven’t a clue cuz I don’t have the sums but either way, Brexit or no Brexit, taxes would have to rise and at least with Brexit there is something in the pot to start with  |
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"I would prefer my children to ‘benefit ‘ rather than the government, they have taken enough already."
Much better your kids get a car each than your grandchildren grow up in a country with free education, health and social services for all.
By the way the reason I say this is because you may not remove much from the economy through avoiding inheritance taxes but that is not the case for those at the very top, and the reality is that they need your support for tax systems that benefit them. Because although your children may spend what they inherit that is not the case for the worlds richest, they just move it to tax havens and hoard it. (About $34 TRILLION in total by latest estimates.) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I would prefer my children to ‘benefit ‘ rather than the government, they have taken enough already.
Much better your kids get a car each than your grandchildren grow up in a country with free education, health and social services for all.
By the way the reason I say this is because you may not remove much from the economy through avoiding inheritance taxes but that is not the case for those at the very top, and the reality is that they need your support for tax systems that benefit them. Because although your children may spend what they inherit that is not the case for the worlds richest, they just move it to tax havens and hoard it. (About $34 TRILLION in total by latest estimates.)"
So how will raising inheritance tax help that? |
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"And if Fabio is reading this from the last thread, I would raise income tax for people earning over say £25000, by how much I haven’t a clue cuz I don’t have the sums but either way, Brexit or no Brexit, taxes would have to rise and at least with Brexit there is something in the pot to start with "
So you would raise income tax on anyone earning anything over £2,270 under the UK average annual income. How egalitarian of you to spread the burden across the whole nation. I am sure the bankers and corporate CEOs with their 7 figure bonuses would praise, sorry laugh at you as they moved the money they will never spend out of our economy and into their offshore tax haven. |
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"So how will raising inheritance tax help that?"
It is very hard to hide the country pile, or the Central London letting property empire, and even harder to dispose of them and remove the liquefied assets without paying taxes on them (unless the tax no longer is). |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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A desire for high inheritance tax seems to come from a sense that everyone should suffer equally for a living (the kids don't earn the inheritated money) but it's a view espoused by those who also tend to support high levels of social welfare (people getting unearned money) - opposing thoughts in the same framework. I find it confusing!
If you want to work extra hard to give your kids a headstart in life why should that be penalised and the money had already been taxed the first time as income or capital gains tax. |
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"The people who despise those who outwork or outsmart or outsave them."
I've heard that many times before, usually in the slightly different form of 'why should you be penalised if you work hard all your life?'.
But when I look around I notice that the people who do all the work either have nothing or the bowl they have to piss in gets smaller each year while the fat cats that do fuck all are raking it in hand over fist.
At what point do we wake up to the reality that 100 people have $34 Trillion! They could end wold poverty over night and still be rich beyond the dreams of avarice. But truth is they will not be satisfied until they own everything and the rest of the world are paupers. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The people who despise those who outwork or outsmart or outsave them.
I've heard that many times before, usually in the slightly different form of 'why should you be penalised if you work hard all your life?'.
But when I look around I notice that the people who do all the work either have nothing or the bowl they have to piss in gets smaller each year while the fat cats that do fuck all are raking it in hand over fist.
At what point do we wake up to the reality that 100 people have $34 Trillion! They could end wold poverty over night and still be rich beyond the dreams of avarice. But truth is they will not be satisfied until they own everything and the rest of the world are paupers. "
I know what you are saying Will and I agree to an extent.....BUT in trying to catch the ultrarich minority you are penalising the average sensible family at the expense of the average reckless family.
I disagree about your point about work but most people who work hard (and smart) and live within their means over the longterm do ok for themselves.
It's the people who don't work to improve themselves and have bad habits (drink, smoking, gambling, consumerism, bad debt, don't plan for retirement) that end up without a pot to piss in.
Of course luck and life are factors too. |
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"It's the people who don't work to improve themselves and have bad habits (drink, smoking, gambling, consumerism, bad debt, don't plan for retirement) that end up without a pot to piss in.
Of course luck and life are factors too. "
So it is nurses faults that they need to use foodbanks to make ends meet? And it is the workers faults when their companies are bought up by asset strippers who first stop paying into and then empty the pension funds before selling the jobs to China after taking nice fat bonuses for themselves and then watching the business collapse taking suppliers with it. (Al a Trump.) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It's the people who don't work to improve themselves and have bad habits (drink, smoking, gambling, consumerism, bad debt, don't plan for retirement) that end up without a pot to piss in.
Of course luck and life are factors too.
So it is nurses faults that they need to use foodbanks to make ends meet? And it is the workers faults when their companies are bought up by asset strippers who first stop paying into and then empty the pension funds before selling the jobs to China after taking nice fat bonuses for themselves and then watching the business collapse taking suppliers with it. (Al a Trump.)"
Of course not - but they are special cases you are choosing for sake of argument.
Why should mr and mrs sensible and their kids be taxed twice? |
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"Of course not - but they are special cases you are choosing for sake of argument.
Why should mr and mrs sensible and their kids be taxed twice?"
Ah right, they (that's millions dating back to the 80's when that little money making wheeze started, along with the greed is good kick), and it rolled ever so easily off your pc. Could it be you have used it before?
Anyone told you people and societies are judged by how they care for their most vulnerable not how they venerate their most powerful? |
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"The people who despise those who outwork or outsmart or outsave them.
I've heard that many times before, usually in the slightly different form of 'why should you be penalised if you work hard all your life?'.
But when I look around I notice that the people who do all the work either have nothing or the bowl they have to piss in gets smaller each year while the fat cats that do fuck all are raking it in hand over fist.
At what point do we wake up to the reality that 100 people have $34 Trillion! They could end wold poverty over night and still be rich beyond the dreams of avarice. But truth is they will not be satisfied until they own everything and the rest of the world are paupers. "
Do you believe that everyone that works hard ends up with nothing ? I hope no one ever approaches you for career guidance |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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A lot of money gets taxed more than once.
IHT also targets money which hasn’t necesssrily been worked hard for ... but money which has worked hard.
The house. The shares. The art collection.
I’d rather tax this than put up income tax which is really targeting people who are working hard. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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If inheritance tax kicks in at 370000 pounds it is not a huge allowance.
I was brought up in a council house, worked hard but do not see myself as rich.
However I have ammassed assets over the tax limit. If it puts moderate earners like myself into this bracket then the allowance needs to rise. |
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"A lot of money gets taxed more than once.
IHT also targets money which hasn’t necesssrily been worked hard for ... but money which has worked hard.
The house. The shares. The art collection.
I’d rather tax this than put up income tax which is really targeting people who are working hard. "
So there's a problem with people being able to get on the housing ladder now...when their parents own their own houses.
And the answer to this is not to allow the benefits of the parents finances, house, etc to be passed on to the children to help them financially, it's to take it away in tax?
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
There will be no need for any change to Inheritance tax if the EU follow the lead of the US Supreme Court on a decision that they made yesterday. Essentially the state where the e transaction takes place can now tax the seller on a one off, or cumulative tariff.
This could see the long overdue ending of Corporation Tax where Companies shelter tax liabilities by tenuous linkages across different jurisdictions. In the US at least now a supplier can be taxed in the state where the transaction is made, no matter which state the supplier is registered.
Translating that to the U.K. as an example, the U.K. could tax Amazon at the end of the year based on the cumulative volume of business that they made selling and delivering packages in the UK. Same with Starbucks, they would pay a tax based on their overall sales in the UK. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A lot of money gets taxed more than once.
IHT also targets money which hasn’t necesssrily been worked hard for ... but money which has worked hard.
The house. The shares. The art collection.
I’d rather tax this than put up income tax which is really targeting people who are working hard.
So there's a problem with people being able to get on the housing ladder now...when their parents own their own houses.
And the answer to this is not to allow the benefits of the parents finances, house, etc to be passed on to the children to help them financially, it's to take it away in tax?
"
And if your parents don’t own their own house let’s squeeze out the supply ?
If you’re paying IHT then chances are you can afford a house after paying the tax.
What’s a better tax ? As I said before i like Iht as it helps redistribute wealth |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A lot of money gets taxed more than once.
IHT also targets money which hasn’t necesssrily been worked hard for ... but money which has worked hard.
The house. The shares. The art collection.
I’d rather tax this than put up income tax which is really targeting people who are working hard. "
Which again brings us back to everyone suffering equally for a living.
You don't want people saving and putting their money to work.
That's what you really want right?
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
"
It would be interesting to know where you would build the 10 million houses and all the infrastructure that goes with it as we are a bit over crowded already!? Massive over supply would no doubt lead to a property crash so at least you wouln't have to worry about any inheritance tax! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A lot of money gets taxed more than once.
IHT also targets money which hasn’t necesssrily been worked hard for ... but money which has worked hard.
The house. The shares. The art collection.
I’d rather tax this than put up income tax which is really targeting people who are working hard.
Which again brings us back to everyone suffering equally for a living.
You don't want people saving and putting their money to work.
That's what you really want right?
"
I’m working off the basis that tax is a necessity. And so if see IHT increases being a fair way of increasing tax revenue.
Rather than income tax which hits the workers harder. Or vat which is regressive.
Which personal tax would you raise to meet increased NHS funding ? |
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
"
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
"
You can think whatever you want...  |
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
"
He is an "all property is theft " kind of person just not when it's own! Typical hypocrite! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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How about all taxation is theft
Personal I'd spend less before taxing more...governments waste so much money. A full deep and critical review of all spending.
Really you are taxing ordinary people twice in a half baked attempt to get at the ultra rich while your taxes pay for the obliteration of innocent lives in stupid wars overseas.
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By *andS66Couple
over a year ago
Derby |
"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
He is an "all property is theft " kind of person just not when it's own! Typical hypocrite! "
Typical socialist. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
He is an "all property is theft " kind of person just not when it's own! Typical hypocrite!
Typical socialist."
That would be a champagne socialist !
Although I can't stand the stuff.I Prefer cider my soft brained lovely.
I'm a green voter and a capitalist who believes in social responsibility .A Self employed property renovator who's education ended at 16 and I have never voted labour or Tory in my lifetime.But please feel free to make up as much bullshit about me as you like .Whatever gives you an enormous sense of we'll being bro.Its all water off a ducks back.As my grandfather said"When the gobshites are bitching about you l,let them because some other less fortunate sod is having a day off from their irrelevant shite." so knock yourself out son |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"How about all taxation is theft
Personal I'd spend less before taxing more...governments waste so much money. A full deep and critical review of all spending.
Really you are taxing ordinary people twice in a half baked attempt to get at the ultra rich while your taxes pay for the obliteration of innocent lives in stupid wars overseas.
"
and which taxes would you cut first ... |
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
It would be interesting to know where you would build the 10 million houses and all the infrastructure that goes with it as we are a bit over crowded already!? Massive over supply would no doubt lead to a property crash so at least you wouln't have to worry about any inheritance tax! "
Plus as Bob keeps telling everyone he's a Green party voter I wonder how many of those 10 million houses he'd build in the green belt? |
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
It would be interesting to know where you would build the 10 million houses and all the infrastructure that goes with it as we are a bit over crowded already!? Massive over supply would no doubt lead to a property crash so at least you wouln't have to worry about any inheritance tax!
Plus as Bob keeps telling everyone he's a Green party voter I wonder how many of those 10 million houses he'd build in the green belt? "
Building across isn't the only option. You can always build up. Flats count too plus they're cheaper to build compared to houses. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"How about all taxation is theft
Personal I'd spend less before taxing more...governments waste so much money. A full deep and critical review of all spending.
Really you are taxing ordinary people twice in a half baked attempt to get at the ultra rich while your taxes pay for the obliteration of innocent lives in stupid wars overseas.
and which taxes would you cut first ..."
Stop the bleeding of expenditure first.
Ideally...a simple multi-tiered income tax. Income is income no matter the source...if you work for it, have property, dividends, etc.
Carve up social welfare to give more to those who can't work and much much much less to those who won't work with free training/upskilling/job schemes as required. Let some of them starve if needs be until they get some motivation. Tough love.
Reduce all road taxes to a single tax on fuel (with credits for haulage companies).
Increase bank interest rates to encourage saving.
Make payday loans illegal.
Financial education in schools.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
It would be interesting to know where you would build the 10 million houses and all the infrastructure that goes with it as we are a bit over crowded already!? Massive over supply would no doubt lead to a property crash so at least you wouln't have to worry about any inheritance tax!
Plus as Bob keeps telling everyone he's a Green party voter I wonder how many of those 10 million houses he'd build in the green belt?
Building across isn't the only option. You can always build up. Flats count too plus they're cheaper to build compared to houses. "
Of course you are correct and the country is full of brown field sites. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"How about all taxation is theft
Personal I'd spend less before taxing more...governments waste so much money. A full deep and critical review of all spending.
Really you are taxing ordinary people twice in a half baked attempt to get at the ultra rich while your taxes pay for the obliteration of innocent lives in stupid wars overseas.
and which taxes would you cut first ...
Stop the bleeding of expenditure first.
Ideally...a simple multi-tiered income tax. Income is income no matter the source...if you work for it, have property, dividends, etc.
Carve up social welfare to give more to those who can't work and much much much less to those who won't work with free training/upskilling/job schemes as required. Let some of them starve if needs be until they get some motivation. Tough love.
Reduce all road taxes to a single tax on fuel (with credits for haulage companies).
Increase bank interest rates to encourage saving.
Make payday loans illegal.
Financial education in schools.
"
. I’m not sure how you’re dealing with capital gains here (or are you counting this as income?). It is all if the second home fair game when sold ? (Actually that may prevent second homes !!) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Income is income.
No tax on inheritance though.
Penalising families for accumulating assets fairly with their hard earned alreasy taxed cash makes no sense.
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Income is income.
No tax on inheritance though.
Penalising families for accumulating assets fairly with their hard earned alreasy taxed cash makes no sense.
"
so if I buy a house for 200k and sell it for 300k what’s the income ? (I’m not trying to pick holes I’m just struggling to see how income works here)
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"The biggest taxable asset the average person has is their home.The reason property is so expensive is supply and demand .
Build 10 million properties and deflate the market below the IHT threshold and at the same create lots of work for young people and making buying their first gone affordable.
I'm only in my forties and already way over the threshold for IHT threshold and every penny that went into my property was taxed once.
10,000,000 properties? Do we need that many?
So what you're saying is you think it's unfair to be taxed on any property you've accumulated, as you've already paid tax on the money you've earned to buy that property?
I'd have thought you were an "all property is theft" kind of person.
He is an "all property is theft " kind of person just not when it's own! Typical hypocrite!
Typical socialist.
That would be a champagne socialist !
Although I can't stand the stuff.I Prefer cider my soft brained lovely.
I'm a green voter and a capitalist who believes in social responsibility .A Self employed property renovator who's education ended at 16 and I have never voted labour or Tory in my lifetime.But please feel free to make up as much bullshit about me as you like .Whatever gives you an enormous sense of we'll being bro.Its all water off a ducks back.As my grandfather said"When the gobshites are bitching about you l,let them because some other less fortunate sod is having a day off from their irrelevant shite." so knock yourself out son "
Ah the figure of 10 million new homes came from a genius shall we take it!? How long did it take to come up with that figure and what did you base it on?
If you hadn't already noticed they have been building on brown field sites for years and after Grenfell who wants to live in a flat!
Massive over supply will cause prices to drop but then you have the double whammy of massive demand for materials and skilled labour causing the cost of these to rise, bankruptcy for the house builders quickly following.Your green credentials have been well and trully flushed down the loo!
Perhaps you should write a "White Paper" on it for the government you could call it " How to ruin the enviroment, bankrupt the big house builders and devalue everyone's biggest asset by Bobbangs" |
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