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So Trump's 60 Russian expulsions was an April Fools trick!
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All he did was name 60 US security services identified 'diplomat spies' that Russia has to swap out for 60 new diplomats. Thus in reality Trump has yet again screwed over the US security services by using his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power (Putin's Russia). |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"All he did was name 60 US security services identified 'diplomat spies' that Russia has to swap out for 60 new diplomats. Thus in reality Trump has yet again screwed over the US security services by using his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power (Putin's Russia)."
Should he have kept them in place and thrown out the janitors and chauffeurs instead? |
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There are a couple of points heere.
First, fact is if you know who the legal spies are you can negate them, if you don't, you first have to identify them before you can negate them. By ordering out 60 known spies Trump has ensured that they will not be posted to any other US allies Russian legations therefore all the shared intelligence that could have been gleaned is lost as they will now be replaced by unknowns.
Secondly the normal format of diplomatic expulsions is not swap outs, it is a reduction in the total number of accredited diplomats a legation is allowed in a country. So all the hype was more Trumpian smoke and mirrors and what he actually did was inform Moscow that 60 of their spies covers had been blown and therefore they were no longer a Russian asset but were in fact a liability.
But hey ho, what would that matter to either of you two pro Putin, pro Russia, pro Trump cheerleaders. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There are a couple of points heere.
First, fact is if you know who the legal spies are you can negate them, if you don't, you first have to identify them before you can negate them. By ordering out 60 known spies Trump has ensured that they will not be posted to any other US allies Russian legations therefore all the shared intelligence that could have been gleaned is lost as they will now be replaced by unknowns.
Secondly the normal format of diplomatic expulsions is not swap outs, it is a reduction in the total number of accredited diplomats a legation is allowed in a country. So all the hype was more Trumpian smoke and mirrors and what he actually did was inform Moscow that 60 of their spies covers had been blown and therefore they were no longer a Russian asset but were in fact a liability.
But hey ho, what would that matter to either of you two pro Putin, pro Russia, pro Trump cheerleaders. "
You really think you know everything don't you... even down to the colour of my cheerleaders outfit.
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"You really think you know everything don't you... even down to the colour of my cheerleaders outfit.
"
So rather than admitting that you passed an ill thought out sarcastic comment about a defense matter you clearly have no understanding of you again attack me.
You really are playing straight out of the Trump playbook. If you can't attack the argument, rather than admit you were uninformed and wrong, attack the messenger. |
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"So if I say good on you that means I support you or maybe I just think he's done a good thing for a change "
So you think him destroying years of counter intelligence work, probably spread over a number of counter intelligence agencies of multiple countries is a good thing?
Or have you failed to digest exactly what Commander In Chief Donald (callsign 'Bone Spurs') Trump has actually done? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"You really think you know everything don't you... even down to the colour of my cheerleaders outfit.
So rather than admitting that you passed an ill thought out sarcastic comment about a defense matter you clearly have no understanding of you again attack me.
You really are playing straight out of the Trump playbook. If you can't attack the argument, rather than admit you were uninformed and wrong, attack the messenger."
You attacked me by calling me a pro Russian, pro Putin and pro Trump cheerleader when I dared to question your post.
Did Britain and the EU states who also expelled 'diplomats' also aid a hostile foreign power?
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"Did Britain and the EU states who also expelled 'diplomats' also aid a hostile foreign power?
"
No, because the diplomats they expelled are not going to be replaced as the total number of diplomats that Russia can send to every other country that have expelled diplomats has been reduced by that number! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Did Britain and the EU states who also expelled 'diplomats' also aid a hostile foreign power?
No, because the diplomats they expelled are not going to be replaced as the total number of diplomats that Russia can send to every other country that have expelled diplomats has been reduced by that number!"
Obama expelled 35 Russian diplomats in response to Russia's interference in the 2016 US election. All these positions were replaced.
Did Obama use his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power too? |
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"Obama expelled 35 Russian diplomats in response to Russia's interference in the 2016 US election. All these positions were replaced.
Did Obama use his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power too?"
Thanks for reminding me of that...
I think if you fully check your facts you will find it was Trump that allowed the Russians replace those 35 as one of his first acts as president. Just like he invited a Russian spymaster into the Oval Office, had US media banned from the meeting but not Russian Media and handed over Israeli secrets and knowledge of a high placed Israeli spy in the Syrian regime. There is a good reason why the US and NATO military commanders are all agreed that Trump is a 'clear and present danger to the security of the USA and NATO'. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Obama expelled 35 Russian diplomats in response to Russia's interference in the 2016 US election. All these positions were replaced.
Did Obama use his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power too?
Thanks for reminding me of that...
I think if you fully check your facts you will find it was Trump that allowed the Russians replace those 35 as one of his first acts as president. Just like he invited a Russian spymaster into the Oval Office, had US media banned from the meeting but not Russian Media and handed over Israeli secrets and knowledge of a high placed Israeli spy in the Syrian regime. There is a good reason why the US and NATO military commanders are all agreed that Trump is a 'clear and present danger to the security of the USA and NATO'."
I said Obama expelled them. I didn't say he replaced them.
Who replaced them is irrelevant. Expelling them is the problem because 'if know who the legal spies are you can negate them'.
By expelling legal spies did Obama aid a hostile foreign power? |
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"Who replaced them is irrelevant. Expelling them is the problem because 'if know who the legal spies are you can negate them'.
By expelling legal spies did Obama aid a hostile foreign power?"
Either you are being deliberately obtuse in your defense of CIC'bonespurs' or you totally miss the point because who does what is the whole point when it comes to intelligence and counterintelligence! |
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"All he did was name 60 US security services identified 'diplomat spies' that Russia has to swap out for 60 new diplomats. Thus in reality Trump has yet again screwed over the US security services by using his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power (Putin's Russia)."
"Hostile foreign power"
I see someone is jumping on the russia is evil, russia is the enemy band wagon.
Putin if you actually go and educate yourself and watch some of his interviews speaks with total commom sense.
Infact i wish we had a leader like that.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Who replaced them is irrelevant. Expelling them is the problem because 'if know who the legal spies are you can negate them'.
By expelling legal spies did Obama aid a hostile foreign power?
Either you are being deliberately obtuse in your defense of CIC'bonespurs' or you totally miss the point because who does what is the whole point when it comes to intelligence and counterintelligence!"
I'm not being obtuse and I'm not defending Trump. I'm questioning your statements.
You said that when Trump expels 'legal spies' he is aiding a hostile foreign power.
So surely when Obama expels 'legal spies' he is also aiding a hostile foreign power? |
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""Hostile foreign power"
I see someone is jumping on the russia is evil, russia is the enemy band wagon.
Putin if you actually go and educate yourself and watch some of his interviews speaks with total commom sense.
Infact i wish we had a leader like that.
"
Russia is a 'hostile foreign power', we in the West are more than a little responsible for this. But our complicity in producing the environment in which Putin was able to come to power does not change what Putin or his regime is. As for your wish to have a leader like him, all I can say is you need to ask yourself how an ex KGB interrogation officer has managed to keep power and become the richest person in the world in 19 years?
Be careful what you wish for, you may just get it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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""Hostile foreign power"
I see someone is jumping on the russia is evil, russia is the enemy band wagon.
Putin if you actually go and educate yourself and watch some of his interviews speaks with total commom sense.
Infact i wish we had a leader like that.
Russia is a 'hostile foreign power', we in the West are more than a little responsible for this. But our complicity in producing the environment in which Putin was able to come to power does not change what Putin or his regime is. As for your wish to have a leader like him, all I can say is you need to ask yourself how an ex KGB interrogation officer has managed to keep power and become the richest person in the world in 19 years?
Be careful what you wish for, you may just get it."
He’s the richest person in the world... until he leaves power. |
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He’s the richest person in the world... until he leaves power."
No, he is the richest person in the world because of the personal fortune he has amassed in shell companies around the world during his time in power. |
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There are legal and illegal spies.
Illegal spies are businessmen, tourists, 'migrants' and the like, or totally illegal entrants to a country.
Legal spies are members of a diplomatic legation who travel openly on diplomatic passports and have full diplomatic immunity or members of trade legations. They may be employed on open roles such as military attaches, or in hidden roles such as cooks, drivers or janitors. But regardless of their declared diplomatic role by dint of traveling on a full diplomatic passport they are considered to have legal status. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Ah, thanks for that. So are immune to prosecution?
I'm asking this from a position of ignorance: so if they are replaced by others under diplomatic immunity, are they not going to be assumed as legal spies, too? |
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"Ah, thanks for that. So are immune to prosecution?
I'm asking this from a position of ignorance: so if they are replaced by others under diplomatic immunity, are they not going to be assumed as legal spies, too?"
Any spy with full diplomatic immunity is considered legal, those with partial immunity are a grey area. Although in my day there were rules that covered diplomatic spying. |
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"Not now? Or not enforced?
Please cheer me up and say it's better the devil you know, in that anyone with a diplomatic passport is assumed to be a spy?"
I am out of the forces for over 35 years now, so my knowledge of diplomatic protocols and the rules regarding military enforcement of those protocols is long out of date.
But in my day all diplomats were watched from time to time, some more than others and when suspicious activity was spotted they were closely watched and so were all the people they interacted with. No doubt things have changed. But I expect that considering the cuts to both security services and military there is less mk1 eyeball surveillance and a much greater reliance on shared information. Donny seems determined to undermine that shared library of knowledge at every opportunity.
Again this is my opinion, formed as a result of what I have read about his actions and it seems to be shared by the US military and security services if we are to believe what they are saying. I do on this subject by the way. |
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"That depresses me."
when over half the world's wealth is controlled by 49 families then many things have to be sacrificed. When the richest of the 49 is a single individual called Vladimir Putin then you have a good reason to be depressed. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"All he did was name 60 US security services identified 'diplomat spies' that Russia has to swap out for 60 new diplomats. Thus in reality Trump has yet again screwed over the US security services by using his position as president to aid a hostile foreign power (Putin's Russia)."
Interesting.
Not sure why you got such a hostile response to posting this though.
Not sure why this is good for the USA. Also not sure why anyone would want to live in a state run along the lines of Russian as it is today.
Also interesting. |
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"Interesting.
Not sure why you got such a hostile response to posting this though.
Not sure why this is good for the USA. Also not sure why anyone would want to live in a state run along the lines of Russian as it is today.
Also interesting."
Because those who are hostile to me on this subject did not understand the issues and like all the Trump vase refuse to believe that anything Trump does could be bad for America and the West and actually designed to help Putin and Russia.
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