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Brexit negotiations have started
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Continue here, so what kind of deal do you reckon england will get?
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"She said if you lived here more than 5 years you could stay, that means many brits in the eu have to come home.
Not as many as there are EU citizens in the UK that would have to return home! Just saying
Exactly, the EU have more to lose on this issue than the UK.
Again.... I wonder when centaur says something that isn't quite true or misleading
The awful truth is that the people who come here tend to be younger... and thus are paying tax and are net contributing to the country
The people who would have to come back here would be older... who are more likely at that time to for example need more health care for example All the oldies do that now.They come back here and get treated on the NHS and then go back out to spain once theyve had their fill of free medicine and health care.Once you leave for more than 5 years you should be cut a drift if the UK isnt your residence.
The law actually is that if you are not domiciled in the UK; whether British or not, you are not aloud free NHS treatment. Problem is it's just not enforced. A crackdown on NHS tourism is needed.
That's a different question but the point is we could if we wanted to and we could do it now if we wanted to. Being in or out of the EU makes no difference to this. Apparently if you leave the UK for 6 mths your not entitled to treatment from the NHS.Regardless of being a citizen.Immigration could collect a data base on these tourists. "
The same goes for benefits as you wouldn't pass the habitual residency test[/"She said if you lived here more than 5 years you could stay, that means many brits in the eu have to come home.
Not as many as there are EU citizens in the UK that would have to return home! Just saying
Exactly, the EU have more to lose on this issue than the UK.
Again.... I wonder when centaur says something that isn't quite true or misleading
The awful truth is that the people who come here tend to be younger... and thus are paying tax and are net contributing to the country
The people who would have to come back here would be older... who are more likely at that time to for example need more health care for example All the oldies do that now.They come back here and get treated on the NHS and then go back out to spain once theyve had their fill of free medicine and health care.Once you leave for more than 5 years you should be cut a drift if the UK isnt your residence.
The law actually is that if you are not domiciled in the UK; whether British or not, you are not aloud free NHS treatment. Problem is it's just not enforced. A crackdown on NHS tourism is needed.
That's a different question but the point is we could if we wanted to and we could do it now if we wanted to. Being in or out of the EU makes no difference to this. Apparently if you leave the UK for 6 mths your not entitled to treatment from the NHS.Regardless of being a citizen.Immigration could collect a data base on these tourists. "
The same goes for benefits as you wouldn't pass the habitual residency test "
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Thersa May was the sole vote against offering EU citizens security for their future. in the days following the Brexit referendum. Her offer to the EU on citizen rights following Brexit has been deemed insufficient and sub standard and rejected.
https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/23/brexit-may-blocked-unilateral-offer-for-eu-citizens-rights-last-june
There are a number of MPs across all parties looking to work together to force the governments hand to a softer Brexit and make May change course. This seriously undermines the UKs ability to make a deal that will be acceptable to parliament.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-hard-theresa-may-tory-labour-lib-dems-eu-mps-remain-alliance-defeat-a7805581.html
The Torys have suffered a defeat in their climbdown on the sequencing of the talks. And the EU has rejected the offer on citizen rights as inadequate. Theresa May has also been revealed to be the only cabinet minister to block assurances on citizen rights in the days after the referendum.
Poor start by the Torys and their negotiaters and we've only just started. |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
The issue that May & Co are going to have is that the EU will want EU residents in the UK to have full EU rights, not just British rights.
This will be unpalatable to May because there would be a situation where 3,000,000 or so EU migrants who have superior rights to native British residents. This would of course then open the door for native Brits to have dual EU/British nationality andveffectively a two tier society.
A way to prevent this would be to offer EU migrants an opportunity to stay and adopt British rights, or apply for a work permit and remain an EU alien worker - but I see the EU being even less impressed with this option. |
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"The issue that May & Co are going to have is that the EU will want EU residents in the UK to have full EU rights, not just British rights.
This will be unpalatable to May because there would be a situation where 3,000,000 or so EU migrants who have superior rights to native British residents. This would of course then open the door for native Brits to have dual EU/British nationality andveffectively a two tier society.
A way to prevent this would be to offer EU migrants an opportunity to stay and adopt British rights, or apply for a work permit and remain an EU alien worker - but I see the EU being even less impressed with this option."
It's not going to be acceptable to the UK to still be under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justuce, one of the main reasons we are leaving is to get out of it and take back control of our own laws. The EU must accept that when we leave their citizens who live here will be under the jurisdiction of British courts and not EU courts. If the EU want to refuse a deal on this then that is entirely up to them, because they have more to lose. They have 3 million citizens in the UK, by comparison the UK only has 1 million citizens in the EU. The EU has 3 times as much as the UK to lose on this particular issue. |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"The issue that May & Co are going to have is that the EU will want EU residents in the UK to have full EU rights, not just British rights.
This will be unpalatable to May because there would be a situation where 3,000,000 or so EU migrants who have superior rights to native British residents. This would of course then open the door for native Brits to have dual EU/British nationality andveffectively a two tier society.
A way to prevent this would be to offer EU migrants an opportunity to stay and adopt British rights, or apply for a work permit and remain an EU alien worker - but I see the EU being even less impressed with this option.
It's not going to be acceptable to the UK to still be under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justuce, one of the main reasons we are leaving is to get out of it and take back control of our own laws. The EU must accept that when we leave their citizens who live here will be under the jurisdiction of British courts and not EU courts. If the EU want to refuse a deal on this then that is entirely up to them, because they have more to lose. They have 3 million citizens in the UK, by comparison the UK only has 1 million citizens in the EU. The EU has 3 times as much as the UK to lose on this particular issue. "
The UK has a population of around 65m, the EU has a population of around 230m, so which would make a bigger difference? Adding 1m to 65m, or 3m to 230m? |
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"The issue that May & Co are going to have is that the EU will want EU residents in the UK to have full EU rights, not just British rights.
This will be unpalatable to May because there would be a situation where 3,000,000 or so EU migrants who have superior rights to native British residents. This would of course then open the door for native Brits to have dual EU/British nationality andveffectively a two tier society.
A way to prevent this would be to offer EU migrants an opportunity to stay and adopt British rights, or apply for a work permit and remain an EU alien worker - but I see the EU being even less impressed with this option.
It's not going to be acceptable to the UK to still be under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justuce, one of the main reasons we are leaving is to get out of it and take back control of our own laws. The EU must accept that when we leave their citizens who live here will be under the jurisdiction of British courts and not EU courts. If the EU want to refuse a deal on this then that is entirely up to them, because they have more to lose. They have 3 million citizens in the UK, by comparison the UK only has 1 million citizens in the EU. The EU has 3 times as much as the UK to lose on this particular issue. "
Dream on |
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"The issue that May & Co are going to have is that the EU will want EU residents in the UK to have full EU rights, not just British rights.
This will be unpalatable to May because there would be a situation where 3,000,000 or so EU migrants who have superior rights to native British residents. This would of course then open the door for native Brits to have dual EU/British nationality andveffectively a two tier society.
A way to prevent this would be to offer EU migrants an opportunity to stay and adopt British rights, or apply for a work permit and remain an EU alien worker - but I see the EU being even less impressed with this option.
It's not going to be acceptable to the UK to still be under the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justuce, one of the main reasons we are leaving is to get out of it and take back control of our own laws. The EU must accept that when we leave their citizens who live here will be under the jurisdiction of British courts and not EU courts. If the EU want to refuse a deal on this then that is entirely up to them, because they have more to lose. They have 3 million citizens in the UK, by comparison the UK only has 1 million citizens in the EU. The EU has 3 times as much as the UK to lose on this particular issue. "
If theres no deal agreed on citizen rights then the trade talks wont start.
See Centaur this is the problem for the Torys. They have to agree a trade deal (and likely an interim membership of the EU until they can organise themselves trade deals with other countries). The EU wants a better deal for the people and it will get it because they have all the leverage.
The EU refused to accept a bad deal on citizen rights before Article 50 was triggered and the Tories admitted defeat. The EU refused to budge on the sequencing of talks and the Tories capitulated. And now its going to force May and Davis to agree to a better deal for citizens because the Tories have to cave.
The wins and losses are starting to rack up here.... |
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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago
Bristol |
It says it all really that all but the most deluded of Fab's hardcore Brexiteers have stopped posting about it as the enormous shitshow lumbers into ever clearer view, having realised no doubt what a monumental, indefensible fuckup they've gifted us all.
There will soon come a time when Brexiteers will be ashamed to admit to their own families which way they voted, |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It says it all really that all but the most deluded of Fab's hardcore Brexiteers have stopped posting about it as the enormous shitshow lumbers into ever clearer view, having realised no doubt what a monumental, indefensible fuckup they've gifted us all.
There will soon come a time when Brexiteers will be ashamed to admit to their own families which way they voted,"
Thats only because we qre getting on with and enjoying life, but we do enjoy reading the bitterness of all those who don't get it. Plus we have faith and belief in our great nation  |
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"It says it all really that all but the most deluded of Fab's hardcore Brexiteers have stopped posting about it as the enormous shitshow lumbers into ever clearer view, having realised no doubt what a monumental, indefensible fuckup they've gifted us all.
There will soon come a time when Brexiteers will be ashamed to admit to their own families which way they voted,
Thats only because we qre getting on with and enjoying life, but we do enjoy reading the bitterness of all those who don't get it. Plus we have faith and belief in our great nation "
Actually statistically and anecdotally brexit voters are NOT getting on and enjoying life they are moaning about the state of the country and how hard their lives are 
There are indeed some moderately affluent people who voted remain and out whos life right now is just dandy and have the privilege to just enjoy life x
What is sad is the selfish nature from comfortable brexit supporters who have convinced the suffering majority that leaving the eu WILL make their lives better |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"It says it all really that all but the most deluded of Fab's hardcore Brexiteers have stopped posting about it as the enormous shitshow lumbers into ever clearer view, having realised no doubt what a monumental, indefensible fuckup they've gifted us all.
There will soon come a time when Brexiteers will be ashamed to admit to their own families which way they voted,"
Yes and I feel sorry for the younger generation as they have been robbed of their future. |
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