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i've worked out i actually need to create my own major political party...
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"i am very socially liberal.... but fairly fiscally conservative
help......
your centrist friend..........  "
There are many like you/us around and the ground is fertile.
We just need a billionaire donor and a few high level political defections and we are away. |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground."
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes. |
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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes. "
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015? |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?"
I know, many love to trash New Labour, but they were the electable Labour. Unfortunately Corbyn’s Labour doesn’t stand a chance. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?"
.
But the SNP are far more left wing than new labour ever were and have stormed the elections in Scotland?.
How does one "appear electable".
I'd argue that the media in Scotland have just been far more Pro SNP and therefore electable.
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By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
I've seen a few "ask the voter on the streets" interviews. I'm astonished by what I've seen....traditional labour voting conservative because they want Brexit done, traditional labour voting for Lib-Dems As they don't like Jeremy Corbyn, traditional Labour voting Lib-Dems As they voted Remain.....it's like the average man has firmly turned it's back on Labour. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"i am very socially liberal.... but fairly fiscally conservative
help......
your centrist friend.......... "
.
I dont think its good to be ideologically stuck to either being fiscally conservative or a spend thrift.
Fiscal conservatives are no more economically? successful as spend thrifts are.
I think thats the biggest problem with UK politics and politicans.
Circumstances should dictate fiscal policy not ideology.
For instance, if the Japanese had been fiscally conservative for the last 20 years they would have gone tits up, the Japanese are tight twats by nature but they could see that being a tight twat at that point would have been disastrous for them.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've seen a few "ask the voter on the streets" interviews. I'm astonished by what I've seen....traditional labour voting conservative because they want Brexit done, traditional labour voting for Lib-Dems As they don't like Jeremy Corbyn, traditional Labour voting Lib-Dems As they voted Remain.....it's like the average man has firmly turned it's back on Labour."
.
First things first, i dont like Jeremy Corbyn as a person, his whole persona annoys my incredibly, his wording annoys me, his face annoys me and his tone of his voice is just incredibly dull!.
That said.
The guy from day one has had a complete hatchet job done on him by the establishment, anything and everything hes done has had the press down on him like a ton of bricks (both left and right wing).
Hes been right royally fucked over and the age old saying of say it often enough and it becomes true is no better shown than with Corbyn which is why he's trying to be the anti establishment? figure now, its his only card left to play.
The centre ground establishment? is doing it's utter best to hang on to power because its policies have worked wonders for them personally, unfortunately they've not worked out so great for alot of others which is why we are where we are with trump,brexit,le pen and even to an extent Putin.
The left and the right are not that different economically speaking, there both for screwing the establishment neo liberals |
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"I've seen a few "ask the voter on the streets" interviews. I'm astonished by what I've seen....traditional labour voting conservative because they want Brexit done, traditional labour voting for Lib-Dems As they don't like Jeremy Corbyn, traditional Labour voting Lib-Dems As they voted Remain.....it's like the average man has firmly turned it's back on Labour."
New Labour despite its successfully being elected 3 times effectively turned its back on the 'average man' in its move to the right..
yes it needed to do so but in doing that it left a lot of people in its heartlands and core voters wondering what it stood for..
where its going i am not sure but a rampant Tory party may well suit some but like any ideology if left unchecked its not the best thing.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've seen a few "ask the voter on the streets" interviews. I'm astonished by what I've seen....traditional labour voting conservative because they want Brexit done, traditional labour voting for Lib-Dems As they don't like Jeremy Corbyn, traditional Labour voting Lib-Dems As they voted Remain.....it's like the average man has firmly turned it's back on Labour."
That's what happens when you have something as devicive as a referendum.
It splits society and it looses its voting cohesion.
As it stands though the media focuses on the labour loss and lib dem gain. The reality is that the tory party might lose a lot of their remain and centrist voters.
That said, they will probably get a net gain from defecting labour and UKIP voters to ensure brexit gets done. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"i am very socially liberal.... but fairly fiscally conservative
help......
your centrist friend.......... "
Can I join and let's bring in the idea of qualified democracy while we are at it |
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
i started the thread because i figured out i would either be on the very left of any conservative party... and we know they are dispised in may's right wing eurosceptic hard brexit tory pary...... or i would end up being on the very right of corbyns labour party and we all know what the momentum and corbynista's think of those....
so i am a man without a party.......
i suppose it would be the lib dems.... but its still the lib dems and whilst i agree with them on some stuff... it still doesn't feel like a true natural home...... |
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By *UNKIEMan
over a year ago
south east |
"i started the thread because i figured out i would either be on the very left of any conservative party... and we know they are dispised in may's right wing eurosceptic hard brexit tory pary...... or i would end up being on the very right of corbyns labour party and we all know what the momentum and corbynista's think of those....
so i am a man without a party.......
i suppose it would be the lib dems.... but its still the lib dems and whilst i agree with them on some stuff... it still doesn't feel like a true natural home......"
Just move a few miles further north and join the nationalists ..they'd love to have you  |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"i started the thread because i figured out i would either be on the very left of any conservative party... and we know they are dispised in may's right wing eurosceptic hard brexit tory pary...... or i would end up being on the very right of corbyns labour party and we all know what the momentum and corbynista's think of those....
so i am a man without a party.......
i suppose it would be the lib dems.... but its still the lib dems and whilst i agree with them on some stuff... it still doesn't feel like a true natural home......
Just move a few miles further north and join the nationalists ..they'd love to have you "
Are you talking about the SNP? Would you describe them as fiscally conservative? |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?
I know, many love to trash New Labour, but they were the electable Labour. Unfortunately Corbyn’s Labour doesn’t stand a chance."
They weere not, however "The Left". They made themselves electable by moving so far to the right that you could put a gigarette paper between them and the tories.
I think that Corbyns mission was just that - to make an electable, social democrat party. I honestly don't think he had ever intended on standing in a general election, he's retirement age. I think his plan had been to clean up the Labour Party and leave it being lead by a younger, more charismatic leader. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?
I know, many love to trash New Labour, but they were the electable Labour. Unfortunately Corbyn’s Labour doesn’t stand a chance.
They weere not, however "The Left". They made themselves electable by moving so far to the right that you could put a gigarette paper between them and the tories.
I think that Corbyns mission was just that - to make an electable, social democrat party. I honestly don't think he had ever intended on standing in a general election, he's retirement age. I think his plan had been to clean up the Labour Party and leave it being lead by a younger, more charismatic leader. "
I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values. |
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By *abio OP Man
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values."
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended...... |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......"
I don't think that Blairites were centrist, they were right of centre. Corbyn is hardly "far left", despite how he is sometimes painted by the media. |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......
I don't think that Blairites were centrist, they were right of centre. Corbyn is hardly "far left", despite how he is sometimes painted by the media. "
Corbyn is a Christmas present for the Tories. |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......
I don't think that Blairites were centrist, they were right of centre. Corbyn is hardly "far left", despite how he is sometimes painted by the media.
Corbyn is a Christmas present for the Tories. "
Tony Blair was the tories. Plus ca change.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......"
Lets be honest the Tories vacated the center also when they went ukip lite.Corbyn isnt as far left as foot hes more kinnock left.Who is in the center?. |
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"i started the thread because i figured out i would either be on the very left of any conservative party... and we know they are dispised in may's right wing eurosceptic hard brexit tory pary...... or i would end up being on the very right of corbyns labour party and we all know what the momentum and corbynista's think of those....
so i am a man without a party.......
i suppose it would be the lib dems.... but its still the lib dems and whilst i agree with them on some stuff... it still doesn't feel like a true natural home......"
Embrace it Bro, I'm switching my vote to them for the first time.
I've voted conservative before but not willing to just put my life on hold for two years while they have a back room discussion about what's going to happen. Not while the pound is like it is anyway. So fuck them.
I would have voted new labour in '97 but wasn't old enough. Most the criticism of new labour are simplistic and come from people who don't understand economics. Corbyn is Corbyn, but it's John McDonnell as chancellor that should really frighten you. That you makes Trump look like a scholar. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I will vote Lib dem...but it is an anti SNP vote as much as anything....The SNP are not left wing.They talk the talk but all policy is designed to help the better off...Council tax freezes, free university places while college courses are decimated etc
I too am socially liberal with a strong sense that any Govt has a duty of care for its citizens...I would not allow Uk workers too be treated as serfs by the multi-national companies ... |
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"I will vote Lib dem...but it is an anti SNP vote as much as anything....The SNP are not left wing.They talk the talk but all policy is designed to help the better off...Council tax freezes, free university places while college courses are decimated etc
I too am socially liberal with a strong sense that any Govt has a duty of care for its citizens...I would not allow Uk workers too be treated as serfs by the multi-national companies ..."
If a significant enough group of workers felt that they were being mistreated by a multi national company, why would they not form together under a new company? - as a cooperative for example? |
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"Okay i will meet you outside Sports Direct.......see how that goes down with there family friendly management "
Yeah but what I'm asking is why those people don't get together and form a new company called "indirect sports ltd" and run it better themselves?
Retail has very few barriers to entry, it's one of the easier industries to start a new company in... |
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"I've seen a few "ask the voter on the streets" interviews. I'm astonished by what I've seen....traditional labour voting conservative because they want Brexit done, traditional labour voting for Lib-Dems As they don't like Jeremy Corbyn, traditional Labour voting Lib-Dems As they voted Remain.....it's like the average man has firmly turned it's back on Labour."
Labour has no clear position on the most important issue of the day, and that's BREXIT. If you're pro you can vote Conservative, if you're anti LibDem. |
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"i started the thread because i figured out i would either be on the very left of any conservative party... and we know they are dispised in may's right wing eurosceptic hard brexit tory pary...... or i would end up being on the very right of corbyns labour party and we all know what the momentum and corbynista's think of those....
so i am a man without a party.......
i suppose it would be the lib dems.... but its still the lib dems and whilst i agree with them on some stuff... it still doesn't feel like a true natural home......"
Currently it's the best choice available to those only slightly left or right of centre. |
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"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?
I know, many love to trash New Labour, but they were the electable Labour. Unfortunately Corbyn’s Labour doesn’t stand a chance.
They weere not, however "The Left". They made themselves electable by moving so far to the right that you could put a gigarette paper between them and the tories.
I think that Corbyns mission was just that - to make an electable, social democrat party. I honestly don't think he had ever intended on standing in a general election, he's retirement age. I think his plan had been to clean up the Labour Party and leave it being lead by a younger, more charismatic leader. I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values."
And making it an unelectable, ineffectual opposition just at the time when an effective opposition is needed more than ever. |
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". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......
I don't think that Blairites were centrist, they were right of centre. Corbyn is hardly "far left", despite how he is sometimes painted by the media.
Corbyn is a Christmas present for the Tories. "
This |
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"Political cycles will repeat themselves.
Another 10 years and the extremes will head back towards the centre ground.
And how much damage will be done in the meantime? This feels like a much bigger cycle, now that all the WWII veterans are gone, we seem to be trying to make the same mistakes.
I have been banging on in the forums for months, that the left need to get their act together.
Become electable first, then they have 5 years to do what they want. It seems that time has nearly run out for them and decades in the political wilderness await them.
Did they not have a big enough warning in Scotland in 2015?
I know, many love to trash New Labour, but they were the electable Labour. Unfortunately Corbyn’s Labour doesn’t stand a chance.
They weere not, however "The Left". They made themselves electable by moving so far to the right that you could put a gigarette paper between them and the tories.
I think that Corbyns mission was just that - to make an electable, social democrat party. I honestly don't think he had ever intended on standing in a general election, he's retirement age. I think his plan had been to clean up the Labour Party and leave it being lead by a younger, more charismatic leader. I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values."
The problem is that those core values have been tried and failed. The majority of people don't want shortages, energy blackouts and double digit inflation. |
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". I think your correct.Corbyn has been successful in pushing out the blairites and returning the party to its core values.
you mean vacating the centre ground and going back to the left wing of michael foot... and we know how that ended......Lets be honest the Tories vacated the center also when they went ukip lite.Corbyn isnt as far left as foot hes more kinnock left.Who is in the center?."
Corbyn is well to the left of Kinnock, in fact I'd place him further to the left than even Foot. And at least Foot, along with T. Benn, where good and sometimes inspirational orators. Listening to Corbyn is like listening to a dying cow IMHO. |
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"i am very socially liberal.... but fairly fiscally conservative
help......
your centrist friend.......... "
I wish i knew what I am. Socially liberal tradionalist? And i have no idea who to vote for any more.
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