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Salmond says autumn of 2018
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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It appears 2018 is the beginning of the new generation, last generation ending 2017.
So will this be the separation of nations, England on its own, with Wales as its lapdog?
or Will the UK continue "United"  |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
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"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
"
Should,nt we all wait and see what happens instead of guessing and complaining about things that hav,nt happened yet that you seem so fond of doing. |
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By *LCCCouple
over a year ago
Cambridge |
"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
Should,nt we all wait and see what happens instead of guessing and complaining about things that hav,nt happened yet that you seem so fond of doing."
In my opinion hard-Brexit or soft-Brexit is still going to be worse than remaining a full member of the EU. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
Should,nt we all wait and see what happens instead of guessing and complaining about things that hav,nt happened yet that you seem so fond of doing.
In my opinion hard-Brexit or soft-Brexit is still going to be worse than remaining a full member of the EU. "
We'd never have known  |
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"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
Should,nt we all wait and see what happens instead of guessing and complaining about things that hav,nt happened yet that you seem so fond of doing.
In my opinion hard-Brexit or soft-Brexit is still going to be worse than remaining a full member of the EU. "
You may well be right in the short term but in a few years time we will much better off in my opinion |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It appears 2018 is the beginning of the new generation, last generation ending 2017.
So will this be the separation of nations, England on its own, with Wales as its lapdog?
or Will the UK continue "United" "
.
Your forgetting about northern Ireland!.
I don't really care what Scotland does, it's for people in Scotland to decide, it's no skin off my nose either way |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"It appears 2018 is the beginning of the new generation, last generation ending 2017.
So will this be the separation of nations, England on its own, with Wales as its lapdog?
or Will the UK continue "United" .
Your forgetting about northern Ireland!.
I don't really care what Scotland does, it's for people in Scotland to decide, it's no skin off my nose either way"
That is true; You will have no vote, and no say  |
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"Hand in Hand, am I right in thinking that you are Pro-Brexit and Pro-Scottish independence? How will you feel if Scotland leaves the UK, and then joins/rejoins the EU? "
He can come and live in England if he wants.  |
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"Hand in Hand, am I right in thinking that you are Pro-Brexit and Pro-Scottish independence? How will you feel if Scotland leaves the UK, and then joins/rejoins the EU?
He can come and live in England if he wants. "
not without a bloody visa he can't..
 |
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2 years ago I listened to the pro union, Westminster PM tell the Scott's that if they left the UK they would by default leave the EU because they could not remain in the EU and leave the the UK at the same time. I am certain that that threat was what pushed many Scott's into voting to to stay part of the UK. I now hear our latest pro union Westminster PM twist the fact that Scotland voted to remain in the UK to remain in the EU to refuse to listen to the voice of Scotland in Westminster.
I for one will be amazed if Scotland remains a part of the UK for much longer if Ms May continues to use the same sort of rhetoric when speaking to the Scott's, because that is what she does when she answers questions put by the SNP from her Westminster dispatch box. |
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"Hand in Hand, am I right in thinking that you are Pro-Brexit and Pro-Scottish independence? How will you feel if Scotland leaves the UK, and then joins/rejoins the EU?
He can come and live in England if he wants.
not without a bloody visa he can't..
"
Oh yeah forgot about that sorry mate you,ll have to stay in Scotland. |
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By *ane DTV/TS
over a year ago
Glasgow ish |
Salmond says...
"I have legal advice"
"There will be a currency union"
"Oil is just a bonus"
"Once in a generation, if not a lifetime"
In the end, all Scotland and the Scottish public are to Mr Salmond is a foot note to his place in 'his'tory.
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"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
"
This is actually a very good point. And if the FIrst Minister take your pony on board she could do very well indeed. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Salmond says...
"I have legal advice"
"There will be a currency union"
"Oil is just a bonus"
"Once in a generation, if not a lifetime"
In the end, all Scotland and the Scottish public are to Mr Salmond is a foot note to his place in 'his'tory.
"
If you ever sit and chat with him, share a meal with him, you will find he is a very educated man who has spent his life working for the good of Scotland, present history also tells the same
what have you done for Scotland? |
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By *ane DTV/TS
over a year ago
Glasgow ish |
"Salmond says...
"I have legal advice"
"There will be a currency union"
"Oil is just a bonus"
"Once in a generation, if not a lifetime"
In the end, all Scotland and the Scottish public are to Mr Salmond is a foot note to his place in 'his'tory.
If you ever sit and chat with him, share a meal with him, you will find he is a very educated man who has spent his life working for the good of Scotland, present history also tells the same
what have you done for Scotland?"
And out pops the standard "what have you done..." bit of crap.
Paid for his salary and expenses
Help educate hundreds of postgraduate scientists.
You know folk who actually go out and develop new tech and industries.
Like all "nationalists" he has used the honeyed words of soft xenophobia drive his aganda.
Played with the fear of "them" that lurks deep in the soul of everyone.
If thats what you think is working for the goos of Scotland, then god help us.
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By *ane DTV/TS
over a year ago
Glasgow ish |
d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
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An indy Scotland joining the EU will be no easy task, if indeed it is accepted which it couldnt at the moment. It may well be folly depending on how the Brexit negotiations go, as the remaining UK would be outside the EU any trade deal would not be Scotlands or even the rUK,s to make, it would be Brussels that dictates how Scotland trades with the (external market) rUK. As it is by far Scotlands greatest export market, a hard Brexit could see exports subject to tariffs, a soft Brexit might be easier but I really cant see how it would actually gain from it considering the cost of gaining membership.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
"
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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He has repeatedly said Scotland would retain the pound.
If they leave U.K. And join EU then one of the terms, as it is for any new member state, would be joining the Euro. So what "currency union" does he really seek.
Either was....independently their debt to GDP ratio is miles over the acceptable limit. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"2 years ago I listened to the pro union, Westminster PM tell the Scott's that if they left the UK they would by default leave the EU because they could not remain in the EU and leave the the UK at the same time. I am certain that that threat was what pushed many Scott's into voting to to stay part of the UK. I now hear our latest pro union Westminster PM twist the fact that Scotland voted to remain in the UK to remain in the EU to refuse to listen to the voice of Scotland in Westminster.
I for one will be amazed if Scotland remains a part of the UK for much longer if Ms May continues to use the same sort of rhetoric when speaking to the Scott's, because that is what she does when she answers questions put by the SNP from her Westminster dispatch box."
But that is true. By leaving the UK they would have automatically left the EU and the SNP knew this so why now are they making such a fuss about the UK leaving the EU? |
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By *ane DTV/TS
over a year ago
Glasgow ish |
"
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism."
And calling No voters: "traitors", "uncle jocks", "quislings", "not true scots", etc. isn't intimadatory and agressive nationalisim.
I voted No and I have lost friends because of it. One told me to "fuck off to your english tory friends in the south" - charming.
There is plenty of nationalist comment on the fact that 'incomers' and 'not true scots' lost them the Referendum and that any other referendum should be limited to "true scots only".
As for Karadzic, I use him as an exemplar of where a so called "educated man" can lead you.
There were lies on both sides of the indy ref.
What we are left with is a highly divided Scotland, at war with itself.
How we reconcile the division, I haven't a clue.
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
And calling No voters: "traitors", "uncle jocks", "quislings", "not true scots", etc. isn't intimadatory and agressive nationalisim.
I voted No and I have lost friends because of it. One told me to "fuck off to your english tory friends in the south" - charming.
"
Never seem any name calling of that nature in Perthshire, but then Perthshire is more upper class, in Perthshire the no voters were simply called "Gutless", or they had "lack of Bottle" |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism."
. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?"
just when they open their mouths |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?
just when they open their mouths "
.
I can do a perfect Scottish accent.... Where do I sign up |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?
just when they open their mouths .
I can do a perfect Scottish accent.... Where do I sign up"
but do you live resident in Scotland |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?
just when they open their mouths .
I can do a perfect Scottish accent.... Where do I sign up
but do you live resident in Scotland "
.
So it's only people with Scottish accents who live in Scotland that count as a Scottish national? |
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By *ewels74Woman
over a year ago
Dundee/Angus/Blackpool |
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?
just when they open their mouths "
Ah wrong actually |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"d.
As in good. Touch screen typo.
On you point pf being "well educated" - Radovan Karadzic, Psychiatrist (Columbia Med), was a well educated man too, look where his nationalisim took him.
Why in the name of the Wee man are you comparing Alex Salmond to Radovan Karadzic?
If the yes campaign was based on such a flag waving, xenophobic, murderous type of nationalism then why were English nationals allowed to vote (in huge numbers) on the future of Scotland? No wild eyed rabid unionist has been able to answer this yet.
Imperialistic, jingoistic flag waving nationalism only exists in one form on these islands and that's British Nationlaism.. Just one question...
How do you work out who's an English national and who's a Scottish one?
just when they open their mouths .
I can do a perfect Scottish accent.... Where do I sign up
but do you live resident in Scotland .
So it's only people with Scottish accents who live in Scotland that count as a Scottish national?"
no, they have to be wearing a skirt too |
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By *i_garyMan
over a year ago
glasgow |
I'll repeat what I posted immediately after the Brexit vote, there won't be another indy referendum but there will be a lot of noise about having one. The SNP are just being their usual duplicitious selves and are pandering to the hardcore among their support who are demanding independence asap no matter the costs etc. They know they won't win a referendum (if they thought they would they'd have called for it by now) and all these statements are really just about kicking it further and further back. Now they're in power they're quite enjoying it, in fact some of their MP's are enjoying it a lot, so it's all about clinging to power and trying to keep the hardcore onside by promising a referendum... at some point further down the line... |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I'll repeat what I posted immediately after the Brexit vote, there won't be another indy referendum but there will be a lot of noise about having one. The SNP are just being their usual duplicitious selves and are pandering to the hardcore among their support who are demanding independence asap no matter the costs etc. They know they won't win a referendum (if they thought they would they'd have called for it by now) and all these statements are really just about kicking it further and further back. Now they're in power they're quite enjoying it, in fact some of their MP's are enjoying it a lot, so it's all about clinging to power and trying to keep the hardcore onside by promising a referendum... at some point further down the line..."
You are aware they have been in Power for a considerable time (now they are in power) 
And who do you think can fill their steps?
Kezia Dugdale (the laughing stalk of Labour)
Willie Rennie (last man standing of Lib Dems)
Ruth Davidson (she is not a dyke)
only one with an ounce of chance is Ruth Davidson and can you really see Scotland voting in the Tories, if you can, you are either very young or have a very short memory. |
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By *i_garyMan
over a year ago
glasgow |
"I'll repeat what I posted immediately after the Brexit vote, there won't be another indy referendum but there will be a lot of noise about having one. The SNP are just being their usual duplicitious selves and are pandering to the hardcore among their support who are demanding independence asap no matter the costs etc. They know they won't win a referendum (if they thought they would they'd have called for it by now) and all these statements are really just about kicking it further and further back. Now they're in power they're quite enjoying it, in fact some of their MP's are enjoying it a lot, so it's all about clinging to power and trying to keep the hardcore onside by promising a referendum... at some point further down the line...
You are aware they have been in Power for a considerable time (now they are in power)
And who do you think can fill their steps?
Kezia Dugdale (the laughing stalk of Labour)
Willie Rennie (last man standing of Lib Dems)
Ruth Davidson (she is not a dyke)
only one with an ounce of chance is Ruth Davidson and can you really see Scotland voting in the Tories, if you can, you are either very young or have a very short memory."
I think you may have quoted my post in error as I was discussing the fact their won't be an indy referendum. Not sure who you're replying to. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Either way....calling for a referendum in the Scottish parliament doesn't necessarily get one....as the UK parliament needs to grant permission as they did last time but are unlikely to now. Even though it would probably guarantee Tory majorities in English Parliament for the foreseeable ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up"
I think she has played quite cleverly as she said she will wait till articale 50 has been called then see what is best for scotland you also say she could possibly lose another referendum which is true but she could possibily win as the margins are very slim , the thing that bothers me is after the scottish referendum we were told the ppl have spoken and it was no which is true but in the euro ref every local athaurity region in scotland voted to stay in the euro but somehow that is different seems a bit hypocritical to me |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Either way....calling for a referendum in the Scottish parliament doesn't necessarily get one....as the UK parliament needs to grant permission as they did last time but are unlikely to now. Even though it would probably guarantee Tory majorities in English Parliament for the foreseeable !"
I think you should realise that scotland is a sovereign nation and as so the british goverment know that it cannot stand in the way or block a referendum if that is the will of the scottish people |
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"Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up
I think she has played quite cleverly as she said she will wait till articale 50 has been called then see what is best for scotland you also say she could possibly lose another referendum which is true but she could possibily win as the margins are very slim , the thing that bothers me is after the scottish referendum we were told the ppl have spoken and it was no which is true but in the euro ref every local athaurity region in scotland voted to stay in the euro but somehow that is different seems a bit hypocritical to me"
You had a referendum and voted to stay part of the UK we then had referendum for the UK to leave the EU which means even if every person in Scotland voted to stay in the EU as Scotland is part of the UK you would still be leaving.
And as only 35% voted to stay you have to go with the majority as do all the 48% that voted to stay. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up
I think she has played quite cleverly as she said she will wait till articale 50 has been called then see what is best for scotland you also say she could possibly lose another referendum which is true but she could possibily win as the margins are very slim , the thing that bothers me is after the scottish referendum we were told the ppl have spoken and it was no which is true but in the euro ref every local athaurity region in scotland voted to stay in the euro but somehow that is different seems a bit hypocritical to me
You had a referendum and voted to stay part of the UK we then had referendum for the UK to leave the EU which means even if every person in Scotland voted to stay in the EU as Scotland is part of the UK you would still be leaving.
And as only 35% voted to stay you have to go with the majority as do all the 48% that voted to stay."
I think you will find 62% of scots voted to stay |
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"Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up
I think she has played quite cleverly as she said she will wait till articale 50 has been called then see what is best for scotland you also say she could possibly lose another referendum which is true but she could possibily win as the margins are very slim , the thing that bothers me is after the scottish referendum we were told the ppl have spoken and it was no which is true but in the euro ref every local athaurity region in scotland voted to stay in the euro but somehow that is different seems a bit hypocritical to me
You had a referendum and voted to stay part of the UK we then had referendum for the UK to leave the EU which means even if every person in Scotland voted to stay in the EU as Scotland is part of the UK you would still be leaving.
And as only 35% voted to stay you have to go with the majority as do all the 48% that voted to stay.
I think you will find 62% of scots voted to stay "
I think you,ll find 35% voted to stay 33% voted to leave and 32% did,nt vote your not taking into account the no voters. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Oh Sturgeon has boxed herself into a bit of a corner. She is a very astute politician but she has misread the mood. If she now backs off her party may splinter....if she goes for indy 2 she looks like she will possibly lose, That would cost her the office of First Minister. I think she will let article 50 be her excuse to let things ride till the scottish economy picks up
I think she has played quite cleverly as she said she will wait till articale 50 has been called then see what is best for scotland you also say she could possibly lose another referendum which is true but she could possibily win as the margins are very slim , the thing that bothers me is after the scottish referendum we were told the ppl have spoken and it was no which is true but in the euro ref every local athaurity region in scotland voted to stay in the euro but somehow that is different seems a bit hypocritical to me
You had a referendum and voted to stay part of the UK we then had referendum for the UK to leave the EU which means even if every person in Scotland voted to stay in the EU as Scotland is part of the UK you would still be leaving.
And as only 35% voted to stay you have to go with the majority as do all the 48% that voted to stay.
I think you will find 62% of scots voted to stay
I think you,ll find 35% voted to stay 33% voted to leave and 32% did,nt vote your not taking into account the no voters. "
62% of those who voted done so to remain and ms sturgeoun is trying to get the best deal for them |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat"
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways |
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat"
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways "
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave."
I havent said we should not accept the vote to leave ive been saying ms sturgeoun is trying to get the best deal for scotland when we do leave |
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave.
I havent said we should not accept the vote to leave ive been saying ms sturgeoun is trying to get the best deal for scotland when we do leave "
How is she going to do that by having another Scottish independence referendum which is what she is asking for? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave."
True, I am an SNP Member but voted with the UK to Leave
I am still on the side of snp (just) and my voting is made easier as there is no other solid party in Scotland to vote for that specifically fights for the rights of Scotland |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave.
I havent said we should not accept the vote to leave ive been saying ms sturgeoun is trying to get the best deal for scotland when we do leave
How is she going to do that by having another Scottish independence referendum which is what she is asking for? "
No she is not asking for that just yet she is saying it is on the table if scotland gets pulled out without getting a good deal for scotland and as first minister thats her job to whats best for scotland |
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave.
True, I am an SNP Member but voted with the UK to Leave
I am still on the side of snp (just) and my voting is made easier as there is no other solid party in Scotland to vote for that specifically fights for the rights of Scotland"
Your lucky we don't really have a choice in England now the Labour Party is in such a mess. At least you have got Ms Sturgeon to fight for you. |
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave.
I havent said we should not accept the vote to leave ive been saying ms sturgeoun is trying to get the best deal for scotland when we do leave
How is she going to do that by having another Scottish independence referendum which is what she is asking for?
No she is not asking for that just yet she is saying it is on the table if scotland gets pulled out without getting a good deal for scotland and as first minister thats her job to whats best for scotland "
I think it will be hard for a few years but I cant see the EU lasting for more than another 20 years the way its going now they need to reform it altogether. |
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"I do wish Ms Sturgeon would respect the 55% who voted No.....and although i voted to remain a sizeable proportion of Scots voted to leave......It is called democracy, you do not always get what you want..Pity Ms Sturgeon is not a true democrat
See this is what bugs me being told to respect the no vote (which i actually do )but to just overlook the 62% who voted to remain ,you cant have it both ways
No you cant but you choose to stay in the UK the referendum was for the UK not for Scotland so Scotland must accept the majority vote to leave."
I agree, we had a referendum on Scottish independence and it was rejected. I really don't think Scotland on its own, even as an EU member, is going to be very economically viable. We are better in the UK even if the UK is out of the EU. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I know its just Salmond's prediction of when it will be, but I dont think it would make much sense to have it until article 50 is concluded and the people of Scotland will know what they are staying with or leaving.
"
England should save them the trouble and leave the Uk !
Then Scotland , Wales and Nortern Ireland would be the Uk
And we would be an Independent Nation again |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x"
I asked a similar question. If they had left the UK then that would have meant they automatically left the EU. So why are they making such a fuss about being in the EU now? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
I asked a similar question. If they had left the UK then that would have meant they automatically left the EU. So why are they making such a fuss about being in the EU now?"
Maybe someone will enlighten us then? X |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
I asked a similar question. If they had left the UK then that would have meant they automatically left the EU. So why are they making such a fuss about being in the EU now?
Maybe someone will enlighten us then? X"
I doubt it |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x"
Perhaps some Scots have long memories, very long memories, of how Scots were treated
Some Scots may act polite and sincere, but they still remember and will not forget |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x"
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Perhaps some Scots have long memories, very long memories, of how Scots were treated
Some Scots may act polite and sincere, but they still remember and will not forget "
So enlighten me? |
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity."
So are you saying the EU don't make some of our laws, don't tell our fishermen how much fish they can catch? |
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I can't see a way for Scotland to simply remain somehow in the EU, enjoying some of the benefits the UK negotiated. That sounds like the kind of fairy tale the SNP tried to sell last time regarding the Pound and Scotland's likely prosperity as an oil based economy.
At least one thing will be clear to Scots voters next time, and this is a good thing. If they want independence it will be because they genuinely want it irrespective of whether they will be better off or not. I thought the last campaign was miserably opportunist and petty minded. You couldn't imagine Garibaldi firing the imagination of Nineteenth century Italians with the message that they might be a few lira better off without the Austrians in charge!
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity.
So are you saying the EU don't make some of our laws, don't tell our fishermen how much fish they can catch?"
We were an equal part of the EU. 1 of 28. They didn't tell us anything, we all agreed like grown up boys and girls should. Part of the benefit of a political union of independent states is that you have common policies, only in the UK is that seen as a bad thing.
The elected representatives of twenty eight EU countries all agree on common policies. Here in the UK an upper chamber of unelected Lords sign off on UK Laws. |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"I can't see a way for Scotland to simply remain somehow in the EU, enjoying some of the benefits the UK negotiated. That sounds like the kind of fairy tale the SNP tried to sell last time regarding the Pound and Scotland's likely prosperity as an oil based economy.
At least one thing will be clear to Scots voters next time, and this is a good thing. If they want independence it will be because they genuinely want it irrespective of whether they will be better off or not. I thought the last campaign was miserably opportunist and petty minded. You couldn't imagine Garibaldi firing the imagination of Nineteenth century Italians with the message that they might be a few lira better off without the Austrians in charge!
"
I think that the Brexit vote has started a process of disintegration of the United Kingdom that will pick up pace and in our lifetime, the U.K. as we know it will no longer exist. I think that the whole Brexit issue has brought out unpleasant and long suppressed emotions on a large percentage of the English population and it will now be difficult to put that particular genie back in the bottle.
It is not just in the UK where globalisation and liberalism is being challenged by mainly middle aged indigenous people who have perceived their quality of life to have suffered and who want someone to blame and want an ideal to aim for. Brexit and English Nationism is now rife in this country and anyone not agreeing tends to be aggressively labelled in a demeaning way. Similarly in the United States the Trump phenomena is ideologically aligned with the Brexit campaign and its supporters are equally bombastic and aggressive when it comes to non believers.
The one country that is going in an entirely different direction is Canada and their new uber Liberal Leader Mr Trudeau Jnr. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I can't see a way for Scotland to simply remain somehow in the EU, enjoying some of the benefits the UK negotiated. That sounds like the kind of fairy tale the SNP tried to sell last time regarding the Pound and Scotland's likely prosperity as an oil based economy.
At least one thing will be clear to Scots voters next time, and this is a good thing. If they want independence it will be because they genuinely want it irrespective of whether they will be better off or not. I thought the last campaign was miserably opportunist and petty minded. You couldn't imagine Garibaldi firing the imagination of Nineteenth century Italians with the message that they might be a few lira better off without the Austrians in charge!
I think that the Brexit vote has started a process of disintegration of the United Kingdom that will pick up pace and in our lifetime, the U.K. as we know it will no longer exist. I think that the whole Brexit issue has brought out unpleasant and long suppressed emotions on a large percentage of the English population and it will now be difficult to put that particular genie back in the bottle.
It is not just in the UK where globalisation and liberalism is being challenged by mainly middle aged indigenous people who have perceived their quality of life to have suffered and who want someone to blame and want an ideal to aim for. Brexit and English Nationism is now rife in this country and anyone not agreeing tends to be aggressively labelled in a demeaning way. Similarly in the United States the Trump phenomena is ideologically aligned with the Brexit campaign and its supporters are equally bombastic and aggressive when it comes to non believers.
The one country that is going in an entirely different direction is Canada and their new uber Liberal Leader Mr Trudeau Jnr. "
what came first, the EU referendum or the Scottish referendum? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Perhaps some Scots have long memories, very long memories, of how Scots were treated
Some Scots may act polite and sincere, but they still remember and will not forget
So enlighten me? "
Listen to the words of your national anthem including the verse you removed.
.
and the Declaration of Arbroath |
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Well I voted to stay in the EU and have seen nothing of this supposed outbreak of atavistic narrow minded nationalism which Brexit is supposed to have released in the UK. That seems to me to be entirely a media invention ( using a few isolated anecdotes to try to portray a " national mood"). There is a continued bitterness on the part of some of those who lost the vote, although I don't see much of that really in real life either- but it's certainly there on social media.
However this thread is about a possible second Scottish independence referendum. In my view Brexit makes the prospect of success for the SNP less not more likely.
If indeed there were some mechanism which could enable Scotland to remain in the EU as an independent country at the point where the UK left ( and on the same favourable terms the UK has enjoyed) there might be some appeal to those who might feel nervous about being an isolated small nation beyond the patronage of either the UK or the EU. As I said before I suspect this may be the fairy tale the SNP is trying to spin at present. But it's clear to me that there is no such mechanism. Scotland would have to apply to join as a new nation.
So the choice at a referendum would be either staying within the UK or real independence. No safety net of an EU which might be seen, illusory though that might be, as a safety net, or at least a comfort blanket. Just the prospect of applying to join a large but generally failing Union having left a smaller but generally successful one. And how would such an application be received? Hard to tell. Some in Europe would relish the thought of the snub to the UK, but others would be very wary of inviting a country carrying a greater deficit as a proportion of its GDP than Greece. |
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity.
So are you saying the EU don't make some of our laws, don't tell our fishermen how much fish they can catch?
We were an equal part of the EU. 1 of 28. They didn't tell us anything, we all agreed like grown up boys and girls should. Part of the benefit of a political union of independent states is that you have common policies, only in the UK is that seen as a bad thing.
The elected representatives of twenty eight EU countries all agree on common policies. Here in the UK an upper chamber of unelected Lords sign off on UK Laws."
So explain why the Republic of Ireland were asked to vote 3 times on the same issue until they voted the right way for the EU. |
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"Well I voted to stay in the EU and have seen nothing of this supposed outbreak of atavistic narrow minded nationalism which Brexit is supposed to have released in the UK. That seems to me to be entirely a media invention ( using a few isolated anecdotes to try to portray a " national mood"). There is a continued bitterness on the part of some of those who lost the vote, although I don't see much of that really in real life either- but it's certainly there on social media.
However this thread is about a possible second Scottish independence referendum. In my view Brexit makes the prospect of success for the SNP less not more likely.
If indeed there were some mechanism which could enable Scotland to remain in the EU as an independent country at the point where the UK left ( and on the same favourable terms the UK has enjoyed) there might be some appeal to those who might feel nervous about being an isolated small nation beyond the patronage of either the UK or the EU. As I said before I suspect this may be the fairy tale the SNP is trying to spin at present. But it's clear to me that there is no such mechanism. Scotland would have to apply to join as a new nation.
So the choice at a referendum would be either staying within the UK or real independence. No safety net of an EU which might be seen, illusory though that might be, as a safety net, or at least a comfort blanket. Just the prospect of applying to join a large but generally failing Union having left a smaller but generally successful one. And how would such an application be received? Hard to tell. Some in Europe would relish the thought of the snub to the UK, but others would be very wary of inviting a country carrying a greater deficit as a proportion of its GDP than Greece."
Scotland would also have to be an independent country for 3 years before they can apply to join the EU and they would have to agree to use the Euro too. |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
North West |
"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity.
So are you saying the EU don't make some of our laws, don't tell our fishermen how much fish they can catch?
We were an equal part of the EU. 1 of 28. They didn't tell us anything, we all agreed like grown up boys and girls should. Part of the benefit of a political union of independent states is that you have common policies, only in the UK is that seen as a bad thing.
The elected representatives of twenty eight EU countries all agree on common policies. Here in the UK an upper chamber of unelected Lords sign off on UK Laws.
So explain why the Republic of Ireland were asked to vote 3 times on the same issue until they voted the right way for the EU. "
Why do you keep asking me questions about things that I could not possibly answer and which have no relevance to the thread. Ask the Irish if you want to know about Ireland. But really, what has that statement got to docwithxanything? |
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"What I don't understand is why do some in Scotland want independence from the UK but want to be a part of the EU?
Either you want independence or you don't?
Genuine question x
Only an English person who has been told by the Daily Mail and Nigel Farage that their country is not independent in Europe could ask that question with any element of sincerity.
So are you saying the EU don't make some of our laws, don't tell our fishermen how much fish they can catch?
We were an equal part of the EU. 1 of 28. They didn't tell us anything, we all agreed like grown up boys and girls should. Part of the benefit of a political union of independent states is that you have common policies, only in the UK is that seen as a bad thing.
The elected representatives of twenty eight EU countries all agree on common policies. Here in the UK an upper chamber of unelected Lords sign off on UK Laws.
So explain why the Republic of Ireland were asked to vote 3 times on the same issue until they voted the right way for the EU.
Why do you keep asking me questions about things that I could not possibly answer and which have no relevance to the thread. Ask the Irish if you want to know about Ireland. But really, what has that statement got to docwithxanything?"
To show you the EU bully other countries into voting the way they want. Not that you would understand as for the EU can do no wrong, but that wont matter in a couple of years time.
Have a nice day. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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if the Scottish Parliament continues to be given more powers, “you have a situation where you’re independent in all but name … “then presumably, you declare yourself to be independent |
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