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Fracking in England
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"We have been told by the drilling companies and government that there is nothing to worry about, its all totally safe. So when they start mixing poisonous chemicals with our drinking water and pumping it into the shale beds we have nothing to worry about... Until we have a dry summer and the reservoirs run dry or the water table becomes contaminated due to unforeseen leaching... Of course it will not matter then either because it will be happening up here in the labour northern wastes not the tory south." there are plenty aquifers which are unsuitable for drinking which can be used, obviously pot water is the best option but sea water has also been used and as we are an island there is plenty sea water, it just depends on the reservoir make up as sometimes there are minerals in the reservoir rock that don't play nice with the minerals dissolved in seawater, last thing we want is barium sulfate scale for obvious reasons. It can take up to 7 million gallons to frack a single well and as you say, sometimes England gets dry summers, field arrogation may be more essential | |||
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"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point." so? is that good or bad? | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?" Probably good for the nation ..bad for its neighbours....never mind I dont live near it ..frack away | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?" . I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it?" Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists .. | |||
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"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists .." . Everything is a natural resource!. The question is do you need to exploit it? | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists ... Everything is a natural resource!. The question is do you need to exploit it?" unfortunately off shore wind farms unpopular solar farms unpopular ..what's the energy answer .. | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists ... Everything is a natural resource!. The question is do you need to exploit it? unfortunately off shore wind farms unpopular solar farms unpopular ..what's the energy answer .." . Well considering we as a country and practically everybody else in the world, just signed up to a 80% drop in c02 levels in....ooooo 14 years time, I think you should be looking to the unpopular stuff. By the way.... Of shore wind farms currently provide the cheapest electricity on the market!. That's not that there the solution but there going to be a big part of the varying solution!. Of course by all means go ahead and frack but don't expect cheap oil, fracked oil has an average production cost of between 40-85 dollars a barrel depending on the play, that's production cost!. Gas can be done a bit cheaper but still way more costly than conventional but then you really need to take into account of environmental damage, which will be somewhere between moderate and severe depending on how left to their own devices you leave the drilling company!. There's always the hidden cost of making money easily, that's just a fact of life | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists ... Everything is a natural resource!. The question is do you need to exploit it? unfortunately off shore wind farms unpopular solar farms unpopular ..what's the energy answer ... Well considering we as a country and practically everybody else in the world, just signed up to a 80% drop in c02 levels in....ooooo 14 years time, I think you should be looking to the unpopular stuff. By the way.... Of shore wind farms currently provide the cheapest electricity on the market!. That's not that there the solution but there going to be a big part of the varying solution!. Of course by all means go ahead and frack but don't expect cheap oil, fracked oil has an average production cost of between 40-85 dollars a barrel depending on the play, that's production cost!. Gas can be done a bit cheaper but still way more costly than conventional but then you really need to take into account of environmental damage, which will be somewhere between moderate and severe depending on how left to their own devices you leave the drilling company!. There's always the hidden cost of making money easily, that's just a fact of life" Sorry didn't make my position clear we lived on the south coast and the wind farm of the Dorset coast coast was unpopular .not for me a I though it was far enough off shore not to ruin any view .i have no problem with wind farms ..or solar farms ..in fact i am in favor of them but people who live near dont seem to like them .. | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?. I've been on more fracking demos than is good for the average person!. The question is do you actually need it? Yes if its a natural resource the UK has exploit it ...money for the UK coffers and employment for some ..dont waste an opportunity if it exists ... Everything is a natural resource!. The question is do you need to exploit it? unfortunately off shore wind farms unpopular solar farms unpopular ..what's the energy answer ... Well considering we as a country and practically everybody else in the world, just signed up to a 80% drop in c02 levels in....ooooo 14 years time, I think you should be looking to the unpopular stuff. By the way.... Of shore wind farms currently provide the cheapest electricity on the market!. That's not that there the solution but there going to be a big part of the varying solution!. Of course by all means go ahead and frack but don't expect cheap oil, fracked oil has an average production cost of between 40-85 dollars a barrel depending on the play, that's production cost!. Gas can be done a bit cheaper but still way more costly than conventional but then you really need to take into account of environmental damage, which will be somewhere between moderate and severe depending on how left to their own devices you leave the drilling company!. There's always the hidden cost of making money easily, that's just a fact of life Sorry didn't make my position clear we lived on the south coast and the wind farm of the Dorset coast coast was unpopular .not for me a I though it was far enough off shore not to ruin any view .i have no problem with wind farms ..or solar farms ..in fact i am in favor of them but people who live near dont seem to like them .." . I don't deny they are unpopular.... But then if you ask somebody do you want a wind farm or a nuclear power station.... Guess what, there not as unpopular as they were | |||
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" I don't deny they are unpopular.... But then if you ask somebody do you want a wind farm or a nuclear power station.... Guess what, there not as unpopular as they were" 2 Nuclear Power plants are just what we need to provide peak time supplies for years to come  | |||
"2 Nuclear Power plants are just what we need to provide peak time supplies for years to come "I would disagree, what we need to do is perfect fusion and not rely on a 3rd generation of fission which has massive downstream costs that we are failing to account for, even though we are dealing with the decommissioning and cleanup costs of our first generation of nuclear power plants (forget the problems with waste). | |||
"2 Nuclear Power plants are just what we need to provide peak time supplies for years to come
I would disagree, what we need to do is perfect fusion and not rely on a 3rd generation of fission which has massive downstream costs that we are failing to account for, even though we are dealing with the decommissioning and cleanup costs of our first generation of nuclear power plants (forget the problems with waste)."so what are your answers for supply of peak power demands | |||
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"Perfect fusion, use more hydroelectric power and build more pump storage facilities like Dinorwick. Then instead of turning off wind turbines because there is not the demand we can store the power they generate for use when required." We do have a few power stations such as that in Scotland | |||
"Perfect fusion, use more hydroelectric power and build more pump storage facilities like Dinorwick. Then instead of turning off wind turbines because there is not the demand we can store the power they generate for use when required. We do have a few power stations such as that in Scotland" There is only 1 pump storage facility in the UK. We built the first one in the world and found it was 98% efficient so plans for more were shelved! However Scotland has does have a lot of small hydroelectric power stations. | |||
"Perfect fusion, use more hydroelectric power and build more pump storage facilities like Dinorwick. Then instead of turning off wind turbines because there is not the demand we can store the power they generate for use when required. We do have a few power stations such as that in Scotland There is only 1 pump storage facility in the UK. We built the first one in the world and found it was 98% efficient so plans for more were shelved! However Scotland has does have a lot of small hydroelectric power stations." Hydro power produces about 12% of Scotland’s electricity, with considerable potential remaining to introduce new hydro schemes and expand or improve the efficiency of existing facilities. More than half of Scotland’s 145 hydroelectric schemes are in the Highlands and Islands area, with the most modern plants achieving energy conversion rates topping 90%. The closest to me is The Tummel-Garry hydro scheme, of which Pitlochry dam and power station are a part, it marked a huge change for the rural community of Perthshire | |||
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"I have read to "google" reports of $40 - $85 per barrel production costs and they are unfeasible. Anything at that cost will be capped and left for another day. infact anything with a break even price costing more that $25 per barrel production will be shelved for later years, that's what happens. If it can be extracted safely which I see no reason it cant then why not use our natural resources rather than buy at a higher rate " . You can't just wind down tens of thousands of workers and millions of dollars of plant every time the price falls below your cost, well you can but it costs alot to do it, the fracking industry in America is pretty much being sustained by the junk bond market, hardly any of them actually make profit today, so there "selling" the idea that they might make profit in the future at 10,15,20% interest, you get some crazy half wit speculators buying into it. They don't call it junk bond for nothing | |||
"You can't just wind down tens of thousands of workers and millions of dollars of plant every time the price falls below your cost, well you can but it costs alot to do it, the fracking industry in America is pretty much being sustained by the junk bond market, hardly any of them actually make profit today, so there "selling" the idea that they might make profit in the future at 10,15,20% interest, you get some crazy half wit speculators buying into it. They don't call it junk bond for nothing" You can if your the directors parachuted in to the businesses to represent the interests of the financial industry that make that skim their 4% off the top of all stock-market, commodity and currency deals. | |||
"What smokescreen ? It's common knowledge we have it we will extract it at some point. so? is that good or bad?" I'm not sure our opinion will be taken into account and feel it will be a financial move. | |||
"The EU referendum is a lovely smoke screen when it comes to Fracking? Who said Fracking??? We are all to busy debating the EU to worry about Fracking!! whats going on with fracking? should we be concerned? . Plans by the shale gas firm Cuadrilla to drill and frack wells at two sites in Lancashire were the subject of a planning inquiry earlier this year. . A report and recommendation by the inquiry's planning inspector will be submitted to the government by 4 July. It will then be up to the Communities Secretary, Greg Clark, to decide whether to approve the plans. . The Scottish parliament has voted narrowly in favour of a ban on fracking and has announced a moratorium on all planning consents for unconventional oil and gas extraction, including fracking. . What do you know about Fracking? and do you think it is a necessity for England and the whole UK?" No, we should not go ahead with it. Not only due to carcinogenic chemicals used in fracking, not only due to the risks of drinking and leisure water sources being polluted and not only due to the risks of land erosion, evaluation and de-stability, but also due to the fact that it is just another signal for our government, and others around the world to ignore the looming task at hand in tackling anthropogenic climate change and climate pollution. In reference to using the sea as a umping ground for waste water - no good if ourselves, Norway, Iceland, Denmark and the Netherlands want a sustainable, healthy, North sea fishing industry. In my opinion fracking should be put to a public vote. It should not be to the government on its own to decide whether it can extract natural resources from our landscape, and where, without public backing. Especially not when the notion involves exploiting reserves in national parks and areas of natural beauty. | |||
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"The EU referendum is a lovely smoke screen when it comes to Fracking? Who said Fracking??? We are all to busy debating the EU to worry about Fracking!! whats going on with fracking? should we be concerned? . Plans by the shale gas firm Cuadrilla to drill and frack wells at two sites in Lancashire were the subject of a planning inquiry earlier this year. . A report and recommendation by the inquiry's planning inspector will be submitted to the government by 4 July. It will then be up to the Communities Secretary, Greg Clark, to decide whether to approve the plans. . The Scottish parliament has voted narrowly in favour of a ban on fracking and has announced a moratorium on all planning consents for unconventional oil and gas extraction, including fracking. . What do you know about Fracking? and do you think it is a necessity for England and the whole UK? No, we should not go ahead with it. Not only due to carcinogenic chemicals used in fracking, not only due to the risks of drinking and leisure water sources being polluted and not only due to the risks of land erosion, evaluation and de-stability, but also due to the fact that it is just another signal for our government, and others around the world to ignore the looming task at hand in tackling anthropogenic climate change and climate pollution. In reference to using the sea as a umping ground for waste water - no good if ourselves, Norway, Iceland, Denmark and the Netherlands want a sustainable, healthy, North sea fishing industry. In my opinion fracking should be put to a public vote. It should not be to the government on its own to decide whether it can extract natural resources from our landscape, and where, without public backing. Especially not when the notion involves exploiting reserves in national parks and areas of natural beauty." Perhaps we should stop using all products produced from hydro carbons , virtually all are carcinogenic. The problem with renewables are they are often unpredictable, the latest rush is to energy barns to store production from solar/wind etc and release it into the grid at peak demand.Fusion is the long term answer | |||
"I know this, but Dinorwick is not a power station, it is a power storage facility. " Dinorwig IS a power station, currently there is no such thing as a "power storage facility" , other than batteries 
What Dinorwig does is pumps water to the top of a big fucking mountain during off peak times when electricity is cheaper though it still costs quite a lot to do that.
Then when electricity demand increases
quickly over a very short period of time Dinorwig opens the floodgates and the water coming down hill through the pipework drives the turbines to generate electric for a short period of time.
Once the water runs out it has to be pumped back up the mountain again which actually costs more to do that than it actually generates. | |||
"I know this, but Dinorwick is not a power station, it is a power storage facility. Dinorwig IS a power station, currently there is no such thing as a "power storage facility" , other than batteries
What Dinorwig does is pumps water to the top of a big fucking mountain during off peak times when electricity is cheaper though it still costs quite a lot to do that.
Then when electricity demand increases
quickly over a very short period of time Dinorwig opens the floodgates and the water coming down hill through the pipework drives the turbines to generate electric for a short period of time.
Once the water runs out it has to be pumped back up the mountain again which actually costs more to do that than it actually generates.". I think that was there point, like a batterie you have to put power into dinorwick to get power out... However in your defence the same is true for all power making systems, it's just less obvious with some than dinorwick!. It's why fracking at this moment is going bust, it's very energy intensive. So unlike conventional hydrocarbon drilling, your not just tapping into a big pool of it and then sitting there for a few years sucking it up through large straws.... hydraulic fracturing isn't even a new process, it's been around for decades(although horizontal drilling for miles with a bendy drill bit is) the reason they didn't do it decades ago was.. Well quite obvious, there was shit loads of conventional sites, however recently that's become less so, so when the oil was 100 dollars a barrel you could make a living fracking, fracking requires firstly a shit load of water, this water has to come in and out by tanker...,time and energy intensive, the water is then contaminated which means more time and energy dealing with it, then u have the problem with well die off, basically you gets full amount of oil/gas when you first drill but then very quickly it dies off, so if your starting with let's says 2000 barrels a day, you'll be down to less than 200 barrels within a year or maybe less, so then you have to drill another well, basically your doing an awful lot of drilling.. Time and energy intensive. Then you've got to get the product out of there.... Again by tanker.. Time and energy intensive. Roads need to be built, facilities, holding tanks... And then move everything every 12 months because of die off and start all over again. So fracking will never give you cheap energy, it may give you a temporary abundance but not cheaply.... And that's the critical bit about oil, the world, finance and commerce has evolved not just on oil but on cheap oil and I can tell you with all honestly that won't go on much longer... When they talk about peak oil(convectional oil), it doesn't mean the oil is gone, it actually means they've reached the half way pointish and from this point your on a decline, so no growth and bigger prices... Those two things are more earth shattering news than every news feed ever broadcast!. Sadly that won't be talked about on the news, that moment slipped quietly past us about 7 years ago! | |||
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"It's why fracking at this moment is going bust, it's very energy intensive. So unlike conventional hydrocarbon drilling, your not just tapping into a big pool of it and then sitting there for a few years sucking it up through large straws.... hydraulic fracturing isn't even a new process, it's been around for decades(although horizontal drilling for miles with a bendy drill bit is) the reason they didn't do it decades ago was.. Well quite obvious, there was shit loads of conventional sites, however recently that's become less so, so when the oil was 100 dollars a barrel you could make a living fracking, fracking requires firstly a shit load of water, this water has to come in and out by tanker...,time and energy intensive, the water is then contaminated which means more time and energy dealing with it, then u have the problem with well die off, basically you gets full amount of oil/gas when you first drill but then very quickly it dies off, so if your starting with let's says 2000 barrels a day, you'll be down to less than 200 barrels within a year or maybe less, so then you have to drill another well, basically your doing an awful lot of drilling.. Time and energy intensive. Then you've got to get the product out of there.... Again by tanker.. Time and energy intensive. Roads need to be built, facilities, holding tanks... And then move everything every 12 months because of die off and start all over again. So fracking will never give you cheap energy, it may give you a temporary abundance but not cheaply.... And that's the critical bit about oil, the world, finance and commerce has evolved not just on oil but on cheap oil and I can tell you with all honestly that won't go on much longer... When they talk about peak oil(convectional oil), it doesn't mean the oil is gone, it actually means they've reached the half way pointish and from this point your on a decline, so no growth and bigger prices... Those two things are more earth shattering news than every news feed ever broadcast!. Sadly that won't be talked about on the news, that moment slipped quietly past us about 7 years ago!" You need to read the above with a pinch of salt, it has been written by a person who has no idea what is involved in reservoirs, depletion or retention nor any idea of rock formations, porosity or permeability. Who ever above has wrote this has never worked in the oil or gas industry and is pre-guessing or has picked comments from google and Pssst Horizontal drilling has been round for decades. I am also afraid that if the water has to come in and out by tanker there wont be much fracking, the majority of water used is from aquifers. no point talking here of sea water injection, acid flushing, Polymer injection, well stimulation/flushing/bombing/perforating EOR has been going on in the North Sea for decades as well as all over the world, we are also finding HP/HT wells which are a whole different ball game There are at this moment many licenses being considered for Fracking through out England, many of the sites being considered are close to motorways where retail parks once stood Will be interesting to hear what decisions come through. | |||
"It's why fracking at this moment is going bust, it's very energy intensive. So unlike conventional hydrocarbon drilling, your not just tapping into a big pool of it and then sitting there for a few years sucking it up through large straws.... hydraulic fracturing isn't even a new process, it's been around for decades(although horizontal drilling for miles with a bendy drill bit is) the reason they didn't do it decades ago was.. Well quite obvious, there was shit loads of conventional sites, however recently that's become less so, so when the oil was 100 dollars a barrel you could make a living fracking, fracking requires firstly a shit load of water, this water has to come in and out by tanker...,time and energy intensive, the water is then contaminated which means more time and energy dealing with it, then u have the problem with well die off, basically you gets full amount of oil/gas when you first drill but then very quickly it dies off, so if your starting with let's says 2000 barrels a day, you'll be down to less than 200 barrels within a year or maybe less, so then you have to drill another well, basically your doing an awful lot of drilling.. Time and energy intensive. Then you've got to get the product out of there.... Again by tanker.. Time and energy intensive. Roads need to be built, facilities, holding tanks... And then move everything every 12 months because of die off and start all over again. So fracking will never give you cheap energy, it may give you a temporary abundance but not cheaply.... And that's the critical bit about oil, the world, finance and commerce has evolved not just on oil but on cheap oil and I can tell you with all honestly that won't go on much longer... When they talk about peak oil(convectional oil), it doesn't mean the oil is gone, it actually means they've reached the half way pointish and from this point your on a decline, so no growth and bigger prices... Those two things are more earth shattering news than every news feed ever broadcast!. Sadly that won't be talked about on the news, that moment slipped quietly past us about 7 years ago! You need to read the above with a pinch of salt, it has been written by a person who has no idea what is involved in reservoirs, depletion or retention nor any idea of rock formations, porosity or permeability. Who ever above has wrote this has never worked in the oil or gas industry and is pre-guessing or has picked comments from google and Pssst Horizontal drilling has been round for decades. I am also afraid that if the water has to come in and out by tanker there wont be much fracking, the majority of water used is from aquifers. no point talking here of sea water injection, acid flushing, Polymer injection, well stimulation/flushing/bombing/perforating EOR has been going on in the North Sea for decades as well as all over the world, we are also finding HP/HT wells which are a whole different ball game There are at this moment many licenses being considered for Fracking through out England, many of the sites being considered are close to motorways where retail parks once stood Will be interesting to hear what decisions come through." . Obviously I'm paraphrasing the differences between hydraulic fracturing and conventional,i don't have 25,000 spread pages to go through detail!!. . I didn't even mention the differences in refining the fucking stuff, which is why the us are now exporting oil.... They don't have the refineries needed | |||
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"Its horrible and poisons the environment around it...unless they find a better way of doing then not for me....in some of the areas in America...you can set light to the water coming out of the tap....it's really quite scary "https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8 | |||
"Its horrible and poisons the environment around it...unless they find a better way of doing then not for me....in some of the areas in America...you can set light to the water coming out of the tap....it's really quite scary
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8"Exactly | |||
"Its horrible and poisons the environment around it...unless they find a better way of doing then not for me....in some of the areas in America...you can set light to the water coming out of the tap....it's really quite scary
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8"Must be a fairly poor set up from a bore hole supply bore hole pump must cavitate suspect no traps of filters within supply set up either | |||
"Its horrible and poisons the environment around it...unless they find a better way of doing then not for me....in some of the areas in America...you can set light to the water coming out of the tap....it's really quite scary
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LBjSXWQRV8
Must be a fairly poor set up from a bore hole supply
bore hole pump must cavitate
suspect no traps of filters within supply set up either "Like I said, watch gasland. Learn from our mistakes. | |||
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