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Who started the fire at Heathrow power station
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One substation fire started and 1,351 flights to and from Heathrow will be affected today, with some 120 affected aircraft already in the air when the closure was announced
Some who track Russia's campaign of unconventional warfare in Europe will likely wake up wondering if the fire that cut power to Heathrow was an accident or something sinister.
Understanding how and why the fire at a substation started will of course be key.
Investigation being undertaken into the cause. Is this KGB retaliation for Starmers threat of serious consequences for Russia. |
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By *abioMan 5 weeks ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
I know I am not the only person cynical enough that when I first heard of this this morning I immediately thought “Russian attack “
I am more interested to know why Heathrow seems to not have back up generators… |
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"I know I am not the only person cynical enough that when I first heard of this this morning I immediately thought “Russian attack “
I am more interested to know why Heathrow seems to not have back up generators…"
Seems they changed the back up generators from diesel to net zero compliant biomass. The new ones couldn't cope and this is the result.
Russian attack? Who knows? But I wouldn't bet against it. |
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"I know I am not the only person cynical enough that when I first heard of this this morning I immediately thought “Russian attack “
I am more interested to know why Heathrow seems to not have back up generators…
Seems they changed the back up generators from diesel to net zero compliant biomass. The new ones couldn't cope and this is the result.
Russian attack? Who knows? But I wouldn't bet against it. "
The generators would probably have not been able to do the whole of Heathrow any way.
It would of only been critical supplies that were supported |
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We seem to be swinging wildly between Russia being on the verge of collapse and Russia being an omnipotent force responsible for every problem in the UK.
It seems very convenient for Starmer that at the very moment he is desperate to save his failing government by whipping up some frenzy about an external military threat that the Russians have decided to attack Heathrow. |
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whatever the cause, this incident massively strengthens the argument for a web based distribution system that links prosumers and DNO's rather than the outdated linear grid system connecting centralised power stations that we currently have. the current system is hugely vulnerable. |
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By *abioMan 5 weeks ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
I was kinda chuckling when I sent the messages earlier.. and then I had a thought!
I wondered “when is my sister flying back from the Caribbean?” And then I checked!.. she is supposed to be flying back tomorrow to get into Heathrow on Sunday morning!
So guess who the attempted “Sean do you still have any contacts in the transport industry that can help please?” Call has come through to!!!
So I am officially in nice person mode…. Lol |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out
pretty sure the AFDD's would kick in, unless they were all faulty, which is unlikley"
Unfortunately have seen old AFFDs not do their job.
Until we see the report it’s only speculation
Sometimes things just happen.A set of wrong things happen at the right time to cause the biggest problems |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out "
Please don’t be sensible. It’s much more fun to have all the conspiracy theories being thrown around with zero evidence in any direction. This is the forums don’t you know? |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out
Please don’t be sensible. It’s much more fun to have all the conspiracy theories being thrown around with zero evidence in any direction. This is the forums don’t you know?"
Ok can do that as well.
Man snuck into substation and drained all the oil for cooling on the transformer. Disconnected all the alarms. And safety systems.
Stood outside waited outside for the fun to begin and record for his big boss. |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out
Please don’t be sensible. It’s much more fun to have all the conspiracy theories being thrown around with zero evidence in any direction. This is the forums don’t you know?
Ok can do that as well.
Man snuck into substation and drained all the oil for cooling on the transformer. Disconnected all the alarms. And safety systems.
Stood outside waited outside for the fun to begin and record for his big boss. "
you forgot to mention the one about the UPS system failing because it's powered by vegan yoghurt  |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out
Please don’t be sensible. It’s much more fun to have all the conspiracy theories being thrown around with zero evidence in any direction. This is the forums don’t you know?"
Since Feb 22 there's been over 60 attacks / foiled attacks across Europe upon infrastructure, defence linked properties and personnel..
We've just had a group found guilty here so until the cause is established I think it's something we would expect the authorities to be looking at..
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Whatever the cause it is pretty lame that the entire airport was taken down by a single point of failure.
When I worked in the power industry the standard was N -2 ie two standbys for every live circuit.
It will be interesting to read the investigation report. |
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"My thoughts would be an old HV transformer overloaded and switch wiring burning out
Please don’t be sensible. It’s much more fun to have all the conspiracy theories being thrown around with zero evidence in any direction. This is the forums don’t you know?
Since Feb 22 there's been over 60 attacks / foiled attacks across Europe upon infrastructure, defence linked properties and personnel..
We've just had a group found guilty here so until the cause is established I think it's something we would expect the authorities to be looking at..
"
Even in a time of active warfare the balance of probabilities would be to equipment failure. I don’t doubt there is a real chance of external actors causing issues here but then the real story should be how can a third party identify the fundamental single point of failure and disable it whilst that point of failure was not identified by proactive red teams on our side who should be probing how to take out said infrastructure. |
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Whatever the root cause, it does make me wonder how many other infrastructure systems we rely on which have single points of failure creaking away in the background ?
I think we'd all be quite horrified if we knew the answer to that !
But redundancy costs money doesn't it ? That cost gets passed on. Do we want redundant systems to kick in and face higher costs for stuff, or are we prepared to deal with systems that are down and deal with the inconvenience ?
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"17 hours since the fire started
230,000 registered electricians in the uk and nobody knows the cause. "
Will almost certainly require an inquiry that will cost several million pounds and will report back in 12 months’ time, by which point nobody will remember it happened.
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"17 hours since the fire started
230,000 registered electricians in the uk and nobody knows the cause."
The fire was in a sub-station. The UK does not have 230,000 people qualified to work with high voltage equipment. |
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At least the proposed third runway at Heathrow isn’t up and running as well, vowed to create ‘Europe’s Silicon Valley’ between Oxford and Cambridge along with up to 18 new towns.
One sub station failure or sabotage and Europes busiest airport can’t accept a single flight
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"17 hours since the fire started
230,000 registered electricians in the uk and nobody knows the cause.
Will almost certainly require an inquiry that will cost several million pounds and will report back in 12 months’ time, by which point nobody will remember it happened.
"
And lessons will be learnt. |
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"Whether or not it was a technical failure or sabotage, a facility of key infrastructure like Heathrow should have far better resilience than this. Poor system architecture."
It is, but don't forget these things are highlighted during planning and commissioning stages. And invariably they are "shot down" because no one wants to pay the extra cost to cover such eventualities.
.
Dear Airline # 1 : Would you mind paying a surcharge for extra resilience in the airport in case of an issue like power outage ?
Airline # 1 : No. Why should we ? That's the airport's issue not ours. We're not paying them more money for the right to operate in their airport. We'll take our business elsewhere and they can go fcuk themselves.
.
I know folks who have been in those meetings, and it's not pleasant. |
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"It may have been a rodent, shorted out the transformer treading on the terminals or nibbled on the wires and went to that old bin site in the sky.
"
Agreed. I think the law of Occam's Razor is applicable here and that's the most likely precursor. Either that or just poorly maintained equipment, probably on a list to get round to reviewing, but not had a chance yet, and wear and tear did the rest. Ooopsie ! |
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Well apart from some major disruption and probably great costs I assume no-one was hurt or injured either directly or indirectly?
So let's hope lesson learned and BAA or whoever is in control of the systems will look at robust back up systems put in place to ensure that this situation cannot happen again. |
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By *9alMan 5 weeks ago
Bridgend |
Heathrow managers should have had enough stand by generators to keep the main bit of the airport running, to be entirely reliant on the external grid shows a lack of planning & common sense. the airlines will surely insist on a change of management ? |
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Sorry you want heathrow to have its own generation when A substation was at fault. This is possible a once in a lifetime event. But you want a company to spend a small fortune for something they might never use. Even Hospitals only have backup for essential services. Posably the only company that has 100% cover is Waste Water. Or they did when I was working on generators. |
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"Heathrow managers should have had enough stand by generators to keep the main bit of the airport running, to be entirely reliant on the external grid shows a lack of planning & common sense. the airlines will surely insist on a change of management ? "
And how much fule would you recommend they stock 24hour for each machine or more remember fule dose not keep indefinitely. |
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By *9alMan 5 weeks ago
Bridgend |
"Heathrow managers should have had enough stand by generators to keep the main bit of the airport running, to be entirely reliant on the external grid shows a lack of planning & common sense. the airlines will surely insist on a change of management ?
And how much fule would you recommend they stock 24hour for each machine or more remember fule dose not keep indefinitely. "
diesel keeps quite well & many big generators used by hospitals etc run on natural gas , I have lived in loads of places where power cuts are not unusual & always have alternative sources of heat & light |
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"Heathrow managers should have had enough stand by generators to keep the main bit of the airport running, to be entirely reliant on the external grid shows a lack of planning & common sense. the airlines will surely insist on a change of management ?"
"And how much fule would you recommend they stock 24hour for each machine or more remember fule dose not keep indefinitely."
Heathrow is on the government fuel pipeline. The airport has access to as much fuel as it can use. |
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"Sorry you want heathrow to have its own generation when A substation was at fault. This is possible a once in a lifetime event. But you want a company to spend a small fortune for something they might never use. Even Hospitals only have backup for essential services. Posably the only company that has 100% cover is Waste Water. Or they did when I was working on generators."
Having now retired . Yes worked on electrical systems. From 11kv to 415v to 240v and below.
Now from news a sub station went bang.
Yes backup systems are there to be used like generators. This only if cables , etc are intact.
One system can be isolated from another.
From reading news . I may be wrong.
Explosion , fire . So lot of damage. Yes back ups at Heathrow kicked in. But only for systems that are safety needed.
This could happen if Heathrow had its own power supply , substations ?
Now reading seems human error possibly on checks not being done correctly ? |
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