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p i p
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"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately. "Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. | |||
"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately.
Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. "Ditto the first time around. | |||
"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately.
Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. "You probably know this already but on an assessment they do, just tell them you are going to record the conversation. They cannot deny you the right to do this and obviously it is great for backing up any mistakes they make. Mrs x | |||
" were do they think all these so called jobs are cumming from" Jobs come from people setting up companies. I have set up several over the years and probably created a thousand plus jobs over that time in different organisations. We have to break this mentality that jobs are some how created by “other” people. They are created by us. I appreciate the point of the post is to rail against the PIP plans but the fact remains that _we_ all need to create new jobs. If _we_ do that then there will be the money to go around to pay for the PIP stuff. If we don’t, there won’t. | |||
"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately.
Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. You probably know this already but on an assessment they do, just tell them you are going to record the conversation. They cannot deny you the right to do this and obviously it is great for backing up any mistakes they make.
Mrs x"We recorded it. All 2.5hrs. But I can't use/submit it until they actually make a decision. Out of interest, the DWP today wasted the cost of producing and posting a letter, to tell me they'd not yet made a decision. They sent me a text message with the same content a few days ago. It's pretty fucking obvious that they've not made a decision, because I don't have a decision. Perhaps they could look at slimming down the ridiculous admin bill, before condemning people to cuts? | |||
" were do they think all these so called jobs are cumming from Jobs come from people setting up companies. I have set up several over the years and probably created a thousand plus jobs over that time in different organisations. We have to break this mentality that jobs are some how created by “other” people. They are created by us. I appreciate the point of the post is to rail against the PIP plans but the fact remains that _we_ all need to create new jobs. If _we_ do that then there will be the money to go around to pay for the PIP stuff. If we don’t, there won’t." Becoming self employed, as a disabled person, is a very dangerous sport. If you become ill and can't tend to your endeavours, then you're screwed. Plus employment can bring some other benefits, such as welfare plans and other such things. | |||
"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately.
Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. You probably know this already but on an assessment they do, just tell them you are going to record the conversation. They cannot deny you the right to do this and obviously it is great for backing up any mistakes they make.
Mrs x
We recorded it. All 2.5hrs. But I can't use/submit it until they actually make a decision.
Out of interest, the DWP today wasted the cost of producing and posting a letter, to tell me they'd not yet made a decision. They sent me a text message with the same content a few days ago. It's pretty fucking obvious that they've not made a decision, because I don't have a decision.
Perhaps they could look at slimming down the ridiculous admin bill, before condemning people to cuts? "So if they did not tell you about the decision that would be OK but as the let you know by mail and TXT it a problem. I would guess you ticked post and by phone on a form at some point or they felt the need to cover to points of letting you know. But at least you have an up date. Rather than know communications at all. | |||
" were do they think all these so called jobs are cumming from Jobs come from people setting up companies. I have set up several over the years and probably created a thousand plus jobs over that time in different organisations. We have to break this mentality that jobs are some how created by “other” people. They are created by us. I appreciate the point of the post is to rail against the PIP plans but the fact remains that _we_ all need to create new jobs. If _we_ do that then there will be the money to go around to pay for the PIP stuff. If we don’t, there won’t. Becoming self employed, as a disabled person, is a very dangerous sport. If you become ill and can't tend to your endeavours, then you're screwed. Plus employment can bring some other benefits, such as welfare plans and other such things." As a person working for there own company that sounds like you want to work a system to your best interests. The same as big companies working TAX rules for there best interests. | |||
" were do they think all these so called jobs are cumming from Jobs come from people setting up companies. I have set up several over the years and probably created a thousand plus jobs over that time in different organisations. We have to break this mentality that jobs are some how created by “other” people. They are created by us. I appreciate the point of the post is to rail against the PIP plans but the fact remains that _we_ all need to create new jobs. If _we_ do that then there will be the money to go around to pay for the PIP stuff. If we don’t, there won’t."  | |||
"People have always been allowed to work and receive PIP; none of the rhetoric makes any sense. If assessment was fair, then the 4-points increase would be acceptable, but assessors work hard to give claimants as few points as possible. I sat through an assessment with an autistic girl who was literally screaming from distress and utterly clueless to what was going on, and they gave her zero points for communication, saying she understood and responded properly and appropriately.
Different reasons but similar experience for me, in terms of the assessor writing things that either didn't happen or twisting what did happen/was said. You probably know this already but on an assessment they do, just tell them you are going to record the conversation. They cannot deny you the right to do this and obviously it is great for backing up any mistakes they make.
Mrs x
We recorded it. All 2.5hrs. But I can't use/submit it until they actually make a decision.
Out of interest, the DWP today wasted the cost of producing and posting a letter, to tell me they'd not yet made a decision. They sent me a text message with the same content a few days ago. It's pretty fucking obvious that they've not made a decision, because I don't have a decision.
Perhaps they could look at slimming down the ridiculous admin bill, before condemning people to cuts?
So if they did not tell you about the decision that would be OK but as the let you know by mail and TXT it a problem. I would guess you ticked post and by phone on a form at some point or they felt the need to cover to points of letting you know. But at least you have an up date. Rather than know communications at all. "They wrote to me (having already text messaged me the same information) to say "we have not yet made a decision, you do not need to contact us." It's unnecessary to tell me they've NOT made a decision, because until they write to me to MAKE a decision, then it's evident that no decision has been made. You can't opt out of paper letters when, in the North of England, the entire application system is paper based. You can opt into text messaging (which I have done). In the South, PIP is applied for, and corresponded about, via an online portal (unless you cannot use such a portal, in which case, you can ask to make a paper application). Having sent me a text message (presumably automated) several days ago, one assumes it is unnecessary to repeat the "we have not made a decision yet" info via a piece of paper, that has had to be printed onto paper, inserted into a windowed envelope and postage paid for. Obviously when they DO make a decision, considering that the "PIP award letter" is required as evidence for such delights as a wheelchair accessible theatre ticket or access to a theme park (even when you can't go on any of the rides and you're just there to make your kids happy), then yes, I'm fine with a paper letter. If it was not necessary to prove you are disabled by showing them a PIP letter for the various places that insist upon it, then I would NOT want to be faffed with a paper decision letter and they could simply send an email or something in an e-portal. Even the dinosaur that is the NHS has now stopped sending paper letters willy nilly and now sends a secure e-link by text message or email, for e-letters. Of course, one can opt back into paper letters if desired but you don't get both paper and e-letters. | |||
" were do they think all these so called jobs are cumming from Jobs come from people setting up companies. I have set up several over the years and probably created a thousand plus jobs over that time in different organisations. We have to break this mentality that jobs are some how created by “other” people. They are created by us. I appreciate the point of the post is to rail against the PIP plans but the fact remains that _we_ all need to create new jobs. If _we_ do that then there will be the money to go around to pay for the PIP stuff. If we don’t, there won’t. Becoming self employed, as a disabled person, is a very dangerous sport. If you become ill and can't tend to your endeavours, then you're screwed. Plus employment can bring some other benefits, such as welfare plans and other such things. As a person working for there own company that sounds like you want to work a system to your best interests. The same as big companies working TAX rules for there best interests. " I want to not be destitute if I find myself too unwell or disabled to work. Becoming self employed is a risk I am unwilling to take. If my employer sees fit to sack me for being too ill or disabled, then I'll have to deal with it, but the UK can't have it both ways. You can't be grounded out of employment for being too sick or disabled whilst also not being deemed worthy of state support when you are too sick or disabled. At that point, we might as well just shoot all disabled people and have done with it. For the sake of the minutes, I work FT. I work over and above my contracted hours without overtime payments and have done so for the entire 13yrs of my service with my employer. I receive exactly the same benefits and rewards as any other employee at my pay grade and choose to PAY EXTRA into a medical benefits scheme that I cannot use all of the benefits of, because I was already disabled when it was launched and most pre existing stuff was barred. Even so, it's worth being able to recoup routine dental, eyesight and physio related fees (like everyone else who pays extra). Were I self employed and looking to any kind of private healthcare scheme as an individual, I'd be even less able to benefit, despite paying into a scheme, because of the pre existing conditions/disabilities I have and because bigger employers negotiate large group discounts for their employees. | |||
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"Plenty of work out there. People just don't want to do it.. " Jeez. PIP isn't an out of work benefit. I hope that helps. Yours truly, A disabled, wheelchair user who WORKS full time and is awaiting the outcome of a PIP application to alleviate some of the tens of thousands of pounds I've already spent on being disabled, including £600 a MONTH on the carers who come to help me to get ready for WORK. Love n sprinkles. | |||
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"[Removed by poster at 19/03/25 23:42:58]" Awwwwwwwww. I'll reply anyway. Everyone and anyone is one little accident or incident away from disability. A lovely thought to go to sleep on  | |||
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"[Removed by poster at 19/03/25 23:42:58] Awwwwwwwww. I'll reply anyway. Everyone and anyone is one little accident or incident away from disability. A lovely thought to go to sleep on "Absolutely. One sneeze received and my brain is damaged. | |||
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"Finding an employer willing to give people with a disability a chance is also a challenge. I've been trying to help one of my kids who has severe Autism find work for over a year. Had a few interviews but as soon as they figure out he isn't neuro typical it's game over. He really wants a job, what is he supposed to do if no one will even give him a bloody chance "Exactly this! Mr KC did not disclose his ASD until he'd passed probation and just suffered quietly until then. He's brilliant at his job... | |||
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"Are these reforms designed to help people into work, or reduce the welfare bill? Flushing out those playing the system is going to be a tough ask and time consuming, so they make it tough for everyone and see how many stop claiming. £5billion is the target. " It's going to make it harder for the people can't score 4 points on one section of the daily living PIP, but who score 2 or 3 points across many areas, totalling 8 or 12 points. Those people might lose the ability to pay for care support and might need to ask family members to become unpaid carers. That's now 2 people less likely to work. | |||
"Are these reforms designed to help people into work, or reduce the welfare bill? Flushing out those playing the system is going to be a tough ask and time consuming, so they make it tough for everyone and see how many stop claiming. £5billion is the target. It's going to make it harder for the people can't score 4 points on one section of the daily living PIP, but who score 2 or 3 points across many areas, totalling 8 or 12 points. Those people might lose the ability to pay for care support and might need to ask family members to become unpaid carers. That's now 2 people less likely to work. " I guess my question was rhetorical, there is a lot of government noise around the young going education to benefits, and people playing a mental health card for PIP. Their aim is to raise £5billion to balance the budget and not face having to increase working peoples taxes (that has already happened in other ways, but another topic). We will see more cuts to government departments and services in the Spring Statement, it is important that the £5billion is in those figures. People begged for a change in government, the party name changed, other than that it is BAU. | |||
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Before anyone thinks I'm judgemental, I've had severe depression but never once thought of it as a disability. I suppose because I think of a disability as something permanent. | |||
"Are these reforms designed to help people into work, or reduce the welfare bill? Flushing out those playing the system is going to be a tough ask and time consuming, so they make it tough for everyone and see how many stop claiming. £5billion is the target. It's going to make it harder for the people can't score 4 points on one section of the daily living PIP, but who score 2 or 3 points across many areas, totalling 8 or 12 points. Those people might lose the ability to pay for care support and might need to ask family members to become unpaid carers. That's now 2 people less likely to work. I guess my question was rhetorical, there is a lot of government noise around the young going education to benefits, and people playing a mental health card for PIP. Their aim is to raise £5billion to balance the budget and not face having to increase working peoples taxes (that has already happened in other ways, but another topic). We will see more cuts to government departments and services in the Spring Statement, it is important that the £5billion is in those figures. People begged for a change in government, the party name changed, other than that it is BAU. " They need a behavioural analysis unit in govt? Could be helpful  | |||
"Psychiatric disorders - 1,406,044 claims - 38.41% of total claims This includes: Stress Anxiety Mood disorders Cognitive disorders Eating disorders Learning disabilities Fuck me, who doesn't have stress/anxiety in today's world. I imagine this is what Streeting was talking about re over diagnosing. These tend to be transient states and need cbt and medication, not money thrown at them. If they are long lasting that is more about being on waiting lists to get mental health help .
Before anyone thinks I'm judgemental, I've had severe depression but never once thought of it as a disability. I suppose because I think of a disability as something permanent."I am with you on this. I think the mental aspect has been massively overplayed in the last few years. You then have people like Kinky who are struggling to get proper access to carers etc and it isn’t right. | |||
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"Psychiatric disorders - 1,406,044 claims - 38.41% of total claims This includes: Stress Anxiety Mood disorders Cognitive disorders Eating disorders Learning disabilities Fuck me, who doesn't have stress/anxiety in today's world. I imagine this is what Streeting was talking about re over diagnosing. These tend to be transient states and need cbt and medication, not money thrown at them. If they are long lasting that is more about being on waiting lists to get mental health help .
Before anyone thinks I'm judgemental, I've had severe depression but never once thought of it as a disability. I suppose because I think of a disability as something permanent.
I am with you on this. I think the mental aspect has been massively overplayed in the last few years. You then have people like Kinky who are struggling to get proper access to carers etc and it isn’t right."I have a permanent disability and it isn't depression. | |||
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"Reporting on the PIP situation is conspicuously absent from frankly anywhere on the Guardian online. Nothing on the front page, nothing on the UK page. One tiny mention on the "Society" page. Is such big news no longer news a day or two after?! " Do you think it will be news in 2030? The £5billion to balance the books will be a distant memory. | |||
"Some info from a Disability Rights Lawyer, posted today. "We have now had a chance to read the entire Green Paper and scrutinise the additional consultation response form. We believe that the Government is not asking the right questions during the consultation; there is no opportunity to respond to the crucial changes proposed, such as the change in PIP scoring, the abolition of the WCA, and other suggested modifications. This indicates that the consultation will not be meaningful, as it fails to address the real issues at stake and invites stakeholders to comment only on the less important matters. Benefits & Work lawyers have flagged this issue, and as a lawyer, I expect challenges to this consultation by the end of June, my colleagues agree. While this does not stop them from trying again, they must conduct it properly and "meaningfully," which will likely delay changes. Please try not to worry about changes happening in the next two years. The only thing they have said before is that more assessments will be conducted face-to-face. However, reasonable adjustments can still be requested from the assessment provider under the Equality Act (S.20) if you find it too difficult to travel to one alone. " . My take on this is that the government are in for a messy battle with this." One bunch of lawyers fighting with another bunch of lawyers masquerading as politicians all at taxpayers expense. | |||
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"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made." Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. | |||
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"Disappointed, thought the thread was going to be about Ruth and David’s daughter "No, it's about disabled people being able to afford to live. Appears to be a non-issue for most people and the Govt, which is highly depressing. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. " . So it sounds like Access to Work is not fit for purpose then.Perhaps if the government scrapped it they could save some money that way.After all why pay someone in a government department that can’t really help and brings no value to the department. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. . So it sounds like Access to Work is not fit for purpose then.Perhaps if the government scrapped it they could save some money that way.After all why pay someone in a government department that can’t really help and brings no value to the department." AtW needs to be made fit for purpose. Not scrapped. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. . So it sounds like Access to Work is not fit for purpose then.Perhaps if the government scrapped it they could save some money that way.After all why pay someone in a government department that can’t really help and brings no value to the department. AtW needs to be made fit for purpose. Not scrapped. " . The whole benefit system needs to be made fit for purpose as for too many it has become a lifestyle choice. I believe Access to Work has been going for at least 16 years that I know off.I wondering if it’s not fit purpose after 16 years when will it be. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. . So it sounds like Access to Work is not fit for purpose then.Perhaps if the government scrapped it they could save some money that way.After all why pay someone in a government department that can’t really help and brings no value to the department. AtW needs to be made fit for purpose. Not scrapped. . The whole benefit system needs to be made fit for purpose as for too many it has become a lifestyle choice. I believe Access to Work has been going for at least 16 years that I know off.I wondering if it’s not fit purpose after 16 years when will it be." Have you ever tried to claim disability related benefits or get help through Access to Work? When I became disabled and required a wheelchair, Access to Work essentially told me to sling my hook but only after keeping my application on ice for over a year. If that's a lifestyle CHOICE, then I'm the Queen of Sheba. You're just parroting Government rhetoric with zero idea of the reality. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. " I need mine updated. It'll be 6 months before it'll get looked at. | |||
"I don’t think this is about getting people back into work it’s about getting the welfare bill down.I think people with a physical disability should be left alone and offered support to get back into work.I believe there is something called Access to Work where they can help people in employment stay in employment by making adjustments in the workplace. Unfortunately things like mental health , stress , depression , anxiety are harder to diagnose and yes I feel some people will put these on and a GP will sign off a fit note.I think these are the ones where savings could be made. Access to Work takes over a year to deal with your application and, like PIP, they find ways to reject your application or reduce the support you need. It's completely unfit for purpose and adding more disabled people onto its books will simply be a disaster. . So it sounds like Access to Work is not fit for purpose then.Perhaps if the government scrapped it they could save some money that way.After all why pay someone in a government department that can’t really help and brings no value to the department. AtW needs to be made fit for purpose. Not scrapped. . The whole benefit system needs to be made fit for purpose as for too many it has become a lifestyle choice. I believe Access to Work has been going for at least 16 years that I know off.I wondering if it’s not fit purpose after 16 years when will it be. Have you ever tried to claim disability related benefits or get help through Access to Work? When I became disabled and required a wheelchair, Access to Work essentially told me to sling my hook but only after keeping my application on ice for over a year. If that's a lifestyle CHOICE, then I'm the Queen of Sheba. You're just parroting Government rhetoric with zero idea of the reality. " . Sorry I didn’t make myself clear when I said lifestyle choice.It was directed at those on Universal Credit who can work but make little effort to look for work if at all.No I have never had to claim disability benefits or use Access to Work as I am fit and able but many years ago fill out a disability form for my dad was a frustrating process as it seemed to be asking the same questions. | |||
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"I claim the Scottish version of PIP and I work full-time. Could I get to work without the money?.... yes but only as I work from home. I'm also a manager so I see both sides. I frequently get told I have to issue warnings to people who have been off sick too often due to life long conditions and from an employer's point of view would you choose to employ someone who's going to be off 3 days a month when you could get someone who'll only take 2 days a year? Who is going to employ all these 'kind of unwell'? Push them into work, they'll get themselves fired and back into the cycle. The DWP needs a way of supporting people who can work but not work enough hours to live on or to support employers for the hit they take. " This! Disability friendly my arse. Actually friendly my arse | |||
