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Axel rudakubana
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"He'll probably be out in 15 years,new identity at our expense and all the support he wants. Should be hard labour breaking rock's on some godforsaken island somewhere for the rest of his natural life." he should be in a cell 23 hours a day no tv.no computer.bed toilet.and im being kind here maybe a book to read. | |||
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"52 years in the nonces wing, in effect solitary with everyone's hand against him Couldn't happen to a nicer bloke" Doesn't need 52 years. I'd give him 2 weeks. But on an open wing with the lads. | |||
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"52 years in the nonces wing, in effect solitary with everyone's hand against him Couldn't happen to a nicer bloke Doesn't need 52 years. I'd give him 2 weeks. But on an open wing with the lads." wouldn't last 12 hours on a open wing. | |||
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"He'll probably be out in 15 years,new identity at our expense and all the support he wants. Should be hard labour breaking rock's on some godforsaken island somewhere for the rest of his natural life." ______________________________________ It's 52 years before he can be considered for release  .
The average life expectancy of serving life term prisoners is mid 50's so it's highly likely he'll die in prison | |||
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"He'll probably be out in 15 years,new identity at our expense and all the support he wants. Should be hard labour breaking rock's on some godforsaken island somewhere for the rest of his natural life. ______________________________________ It's 52 years before he can be considered for release .
The average life expectancy of serving life term prisoners is mid 50's so it's highly likely he'll die in prison"lets hope so fingers crossed | |||
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"The cost of his imprisonment - is it worth it, to keep the illusion of our humanity?" Yes. | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster." I have fuck all sympathy for his family. | |||
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"Should make him do forced labour and use the wages to support good causes in the communities he attacked. That should make him squirm." Agreed. But is that tantamount to convict labour, i.e. sl@very? | |||
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"Should make him do forced labour and use the wages to support good causes in the communities he attacked. That should make him squirm. Agreed. But is that tantamount to convict labour, i.e. sl@very?" Maybe.. I am pretty sure it won't fly within the legal frameworks we have. But one can still dream | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. " to right what i gatherd today is his old man stopped him a week or to before from going on a rampage by convincing a cab driver not to take him, they knew exactaly what sort of monster they had under there roof,amount of times he was involved with the authorities to, something stinks | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. " he will be dead by Christmas mate | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. to right what i gatherd today is his old man stopped him a week or to before from going on a rampage by convincing a cab driver not to take him, they knew exactaly what sort of monster they had under there roof,amount of times he was involved with the authorities to, something stinks" ___________________________________________ Given his Dad tried to sort out his behaviour and the authorities were involved what else did you expect his family to do with the 'monster they had under their roof'? I'm guessing they weren't having cosy nights in with him watching Gogglebox. | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. " your joking he will have 24hr protectin a cell to himself and all the creture comforts he has been shielded from day one of this they aint gona stop protecting him now | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. " Muslim gangs will protect him. | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster." His father stopped him a week earlier i believe..plus his father was also ' known'.. Truly heinous beyond believe | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. to right what i gatherd today is his old man stopped him a week or to before from going on a rampage by convincing a cab driver not to take him, they knew exactaly what sort of monster they had under there roof,amount of times he was involved with the authorities to, something stinks ___________________________________________ Given his Dad tried to sort out his behaviour and the authorities were involved what else did you expect his family to do with the 'monster they had under their roof'? I'm guessing they weren't having cosy nights in with him watching Gogglebox." how did his dad try to sort out his behavior? Attacked someone in school with a cricket bat, caught with knives on numerous occasions yet let go each time,makes you wonder why, and his old man stopped him going on a rampage before why didnt his old man call the police then? Hopefully his parents will be fully investigated to found out how much the knew and if they have any responsibility aswell, i would call the piece of shit an animal but thats an insult to animals | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt " | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt " Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. " If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help " Exactly this , I suppose he'd rather he had counselling and a fucking diversity course 🤡 | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help " He’s got 52 years behind the door. A fair sentence. I’ve seen and dealt with too many mutilated corpses already to talk big game about torturing someone. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help Exactly this , I suppose he'd rather he had counselling and a fucking diversity course 🤡" You suppose wrong then, don’t ya? | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. to right what i gatherd today is his old man stopped him a week or to before from going on a rampage by convincing a cab driver not to take him, they knew exactaly what sort of monster they had under there roof,amount of times he was involved with the authorities to, something stinks" I don't know what his family was doing in Britain at all. They left Rwanda before the Hutu led genocide began and were living in Uganda. It's reported his father claimed asylum in 2000, long after the genocide was over and when the Tutsi armed forces he was apparently part of were running the country. | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. your joking he will have 24hr protectin a cell to himself and all the creture comforts he has been shielded from day one of this they aint gona stop protecting him now" Sometimes "staff shortages" can be advantageous.  | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. to right what i gatherd today is his old man stopped him a week or to before from going on a rampage by convincing a cab driver not to take him, they knew exactaly what sort of monster they had under there roof,amount of times he was involved with the authorities to, something stinks ___________________________________________ Given his Dad tried to sort out his behaviour and the authorities were involved what else did you expect his family to do with the 'monster they had under their roof'? I'm guessing they weren't having cosy nights in with him watching Gogglebox." I don't know or care. They were given safety and security in this country and gave us a monster in return. Fuck them all. | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. " Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim? | |||
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"I am hoping and praying that he is placed in the same prison and block as our family friend's son, Damien Fowkes. Look him up. " Weird flex | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim?" 
Why do these things have to explained to people like you? Seriously?
A search of his house revealed a PDF file entitled Military Studies In The Jihad Against The Tyrants (note the word Jihad), and also an Al Qaeda training manual.
I know you like to think he was a Welsh choirboy, and probably Christian, but deep down you know he wasn't. We all KNOW he wasn't. | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim?
Why do these things have to explained to people like you? Seriously?
A search of his house revealed a PDF file entitled Military Studies In The Jihad Against The Tyrants (note the word Jihad), and also an Al Qaeda training manual.
I know you like to think he was a Welsh choirboy, and probably Christian, but deep down you know he wasn't. We all KNOW he wasn't. "Are you trying to say that because he had an Al Qaeda training manual and a pdf that's available on Google Books. That "Muslim gangs" in the prison that you havent a clue where he is going to be held. Are going to protect him ? | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim?
Why do these things have to explained to people like you? Seriously?
A search of his house revealed a PDF file entitled Military Studies In The Jihad Against The Tyrants (note the word Jihad), and also an Al Qaeda training manual.
I know you like to think he was a Welsh choirboy, and probably Christian, but deep down you know he wasn't. We all KNOW he wasn't. "He was born in Wales. He was brought up as Christian. His parents are church goers. The only thing linking him to Islam is a single widely available pdf file. The court read out lots of details and he didn't seem to follow any idealogy or religion. | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim?
Why do these things have to explained to people like you? Seriously?
A search of his house revealed a PDF file entitled Military Studies In The Jihad Against The Tyrants (note the word Jihad), and also an Al Qaeda training manual.
I know you like to think he was a Welsh choirboy, and probably Christian, but deep down you know he wasn't. We all KNOW he wasn't.
He was born in Wales. He was brought up as Christian. His parents are church goers. The only thing linking him to Islam is a single widely available pdf file. The court read out lots of details and he didn't seem to follow any idealogy or religion. " | |||
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"I don’t fancy his chances in prison. Muslim gangs will protect him. Why would they do that? He isn't a muslim?
Why do these things have to explained to people like you? Seriously?
A search of his house revealed a PDF file entitled Military Studies In The Jihad Against The Tyrants (note the word Jihad), and also an Al Qaeda training manual.
I know you like to think he was a Welsh choirboy, and probably Christian, but deep down you know he wasn't. We all KNOW he wasn't. "__________________________________________________ The police also discovered a fascination with Hitler and the IRA. | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. " I agree that a perpetrator should face their victims but it's often the case that they don't engage by looking down.. He was disruptive and probably the best thing was to remove him and for the parents sake to get the process done on the day and not have to give him the further control of acting like a whatever.. | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. I agree that a perpetrator should face their victims but it's often the case that they don't engage by looking down.. He was disruptive and probably the best thing was to remove him and for the parents sake to get the process done on the day and not have to give him the further control of acting like a whatever.." Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. I agree that a perpetrator should face their victims but it's often the case that they don't engage by looking down.. He was disruptive and probably the best thing was to remove him and for the parents sake to get the process done on the day and not have to give him the further control of acting like a whatever.. Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt" At the time of the scumbag attacked then yes, two to the torso.. No qualms.. But to lower ourselves to the level of the vile cunts who want us to act like they do then no.. Whilst it's hard to rise above the sheer horror that we feel, the utter repulsion we are better than him and others.. | |||
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"A horrendous case; I hope the families of his victims find some peace & justice from today's sentence. I also feel sad for his family; I am sure they have no idea what caused him to turn out a monster. I have fuck all sympathy for his family. " I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. I agree that a perpetrator should face their victims but it's often the case that they don't engage by looking down.. He was disruptive and probably the best thing was to remove him and for the parents sake to get the process done on the day and not have to give him the further control of acting like a whatever.." I agree that the disruption was impacting the proceedings and removing him helped bring things to the sentence. However, there is no deterrent, we need that deterrent that is worse than sitting in court and facing their responsibilities. Forcing them to face victims families when in prison on numerous occasions, at specific times and dates, could be one way. I’m not qualified to say what would work or not but I do think we need something in place ASAP, these evil bastards are calling the shots…. | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. I agree that a perpetrator should face their victims but it's often the case that they don't engage by looking down.. He was disruptive and probably the best thing was to remove him and for the parents sake to get the process done on the day and not have to give him the further control of acting like a whatever.. I agree that the disruption was impacting the proceedings and removing him helped bring things to the sentence. However, there is no deterrent, we need that deterrent that is worse than sitting in court and facing their responsibilities. Forcing them to face victims families when in prison on numerous occasions, at specific times and dates, could be one way. I’m not qualified to say what would work or not but I do think we need something in place ASAP, these evil bastards are calling the shots…." I don't think him after what he did having to look at the parents would have made a blind bit of difference to how he thinks not would it be a deterrent to others of a similar mindset.. I think it comes under restorative justice but I might have the wrong term, it has to be judged that the perpetrator is truly regretful for their actions because otherwise its too much of a risk for the wellbeing of the victims families etc.. Sentences that mean something and aren't reduced by half for the more serious crimes absolutely but the whole system is flawed and literally broken.. It will cost, if there's ever a consensus across the board to radically overhaul it . | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt" ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. " _____________________________________________ The families probably didn't need the offender howling & screaming whilst they're dignified impact statements were being read to the court. | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? " he wasnt a child he was less than 2weeks short of his 18th birthday | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. " if needs be gagged and dragged into court if he wont go in under his own steam and keep his trap shut, and before anyone mentions human rights that P.O.S gave his up when he vommited those crimes | |||
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"Correct sentence within our legal framework. He may be a monster, but I am not. I do not need to sate a desire for blood or revenge. . If I did, I would be deeply concerned because it would signify 1) he is exerting control over my emotions, and 2) I am unable to contain them. . 1) Hands him a "win". He wants a reaction. 2) He could not contain his destructive emotions. If I cannot contain mine, then we both have something in common. Who is the monster now ? . Nope. My heart goes out to the families of the innocents and I hope they find peace, healing, love and support. " A very eloquent rational to this subject. The law stands and it is called the justice system not the revenge system. Ad for how he has "gotten off" on a 9 day period of a whole life sentence it was the Tony's who brought in the reduction of the WLS from 21 to 18yo so I find it rich they are now saying it should be used on younger offenders given they argued against that in the passing of the law. This is an extreme case with very very grey areas, a much more sensible reaction would to be to send it to the Higher and Supreme Courts in a case where a Judge feels they are constrained to act and sentence within the law. Just my 2 pence | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well " Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? he wasnt a child he was less than 2weeks short of his 18th birthday " __________________________________________________________ Sorry I didn't appreciate you were the arbiter of how legislation should be interpreted. | |||
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"His ideology was terror and death wherever that came from. The judge said "His culpability is equivalent in its seriousness to terrorist murders, whatever his purpose.” He should not have been allowed to leave the court, and others like him who refuse to attend court and face their victims families, should be made to attend or face the families some other way / time at the request of the families. How, I do not know but I think it be should be worked out and implemented. if needs be gagged and dragged into court if he wont go in under his own steam and keep his trap shut, and before anyone mentions human rights that P.O.S gave his up when he vommited those crimes" ____________________________________________ Human rights should always be mentioned particularly when they're likely to be subverted. There's very good reasons why civilised societies have developed in that direction. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. " I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. " No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? " He's not a child It wasn't a childish mistake Don't defend him by claiming he's a child | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. " Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals" And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. | |||
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"This isn't about revenge, or blood lust What he did was inhuman He's either mentally unstable (wild dog) so can be out down Or He's fully sane and is a cold calculating killer, so can be put down No drama, no pomp or circumstance Quick, efficient, painless The removal of a cancer I have zero empathy for it, and I've no time for people who empathise with it" The state does not, and should not have the right to take a life. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. " As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. " I have seen this conversation come up whenever a teenager commits a crime. Not everyone is as race-obsessed as the leftists. " And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. " If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. | |||
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"This isn't about revenge, or blood lust What he did was inhuman He's either mentally unstable (wild dog) so can be out down Or He's fully sane and is a cold calculating killer, so can be put down No drama, no pomp or circumstance Quick, efficient, painless The removal of a cancer I have zero empathy for it, and I've no time for people who empathise with it The state does not, and should not have the right to take a life. " Why, if the people of that state want a death penalty for crimes, it would have the right to implement them. Whether that sits comfortably with your morals or not, that is the way it is. I'm against the death penalty for 1 reason, it costs far to much money in appeals that would drag on for years. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals" ___________________________________________ You'd be surprised how little control/knowledge you'd have of your teenage children and that would be magnified if you were an overbearing parent. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive." Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. " I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. | |||
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". Why, if the people of that state want a death penalty for crimes, it would have the right to implement them. " That’s not how representative democracy works, especially when you’re a signatory to complex international agreements etc | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre." Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? He's not a child It wasn't a childish mistake Don't defend him by claiming he's a child " ______________________________________ Defend him? You're joking, my first contribution to this thread was commending the 52 year sentence he received. He'll likely die in prison. That's good enough for me without all the pitchforky stuff. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals ___________________________________________ You'd be surprised how little control/knowledge you'd have of your teenage children and that would be magnified if you were an overbearing parent." Exactly. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. " All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? " Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? He's not a child It wasn't a childish mistake Don't defend him by claiming he's a child ______________________________________ Defend him? You're joking, my first contribution to this thread was commending the 52 year sentence he received. He'll likely die in prison. That's good enough for me without all the pitchforky stuff." They love the pitchforks. 52 years isn’t enough for them. They want blood of him and his parents. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds." My parents taught me right from wrong. I still pushed boundaries. You did too, I guarantee. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds." If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? | |||
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"It's pretty obvious the Dad is a wrong un. " Elaborate? | |||
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"It's pretty obvious the Dad is a wrong un. Elaborate? " I just said it's pretty obvious! | |||
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"It's pretty obvious the Dad is a wrong un. Elaborate? I just said it's pretty obvious!" Clearly it’s not that obvious. | |||
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"Could easily have solved his disruptiveness by muzzling him and chaining him He surrendered his "human" rights when he murdered children If a rabid dog had killed the children it would be put down, I see no difference here, just kill the mutt ____________________________________________________ So you're preferred solution is killing children who kill children? He's not a child It wasn't a childish mistake Don't defend him by claiming he's a child ______________________________________ Defend him? You're joking, my first contribution to this thread was commending the 52 year sentence he received. He'll likely die in prison. That's good enough for me without all the pitchforky stuff. They love the pitchforks. 52 years isn’t enough for them. They want blood of him and his parents." __________________________________________ It's quite depressing, and wouldn't be out of place in the days of the witchfinders. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? " You are going to extreme edge cases to try and win a point, try a more rounded approach considering as I mentioned above a child caught vandalising, and the punishment being the parents and child cleaning up that area. Diving into the deep end of gotcha's isn't that helpful. I could suggest to mitigate the scenario you presented we move the age of driving to 18. | |||
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"It's pretty obvious the Dad is a wrong un. Elaborate? I just said it's pretty obvious! Clearly it’s not that obvious. " No, not to you. | |||
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"Just like Shamima Begum this monster and his family seem to get more sympathy from some people than their victims. "Who’s sympathising? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? You are going to extreme edge cases to try and win a point, try a more rounded approach considering as I mentioned above a child caught vandalising, and the punishment being the parents and child cleaning up that area. Diving into the deep end of gotcha's isn't that helpful. I could suggest to mitigate the scenario you presented we move the age of driving to 18." No, you’re being faced with the logical fallacy of your own argument and trying to change the game. Should a parent be punished for the crimes of their child in the case that I gave you? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. My parents taught me right from wrong. I still pushed boundaries. You did too, I guarantee." Pushing the boundaries within normal society does not include stabbing a number of 6 to 10 year olds multiple times until they lay dead or seriously wounded along with a number of brave adults who risked their own lives to try to save lives. Pushing the boundaries does not include telling the police that he was glad that he had killed innocent children. Pushing the boundaries is posting ridiculous statements about pushing boundaries, which is a democratic right. | |||
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"Just like Shamima Begum this monster and his family seem to get more sympathy from some people than their victims. "___________________________________________________ He's gone to jail for 52 years (at least) and will probably die there, it's hardly a sympathetic outcome! | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. My parents taught me right from wrong. I still pushed boundaries. You did too, I guarantee. Pushing the boundaries within normal society does not include stabbing a number of 6 to 10 year olds multiple times until they lay dead or seriously wounded along with a number of brave adults who risked their own lives to try to save lives. Pushing the boundaries does not include telling the police that he was glad that he had killed innocent children. Pushing the boundaries is posting ridiculous statements about pushing boundaries, which is a democratic right. " The broader point was about parental supervision, I assume you’re smart enough to understand, in the context of punishing parents for the acts of their children. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? You are going to extreme edge cases to try and win a point, try a more rounded approach considering as I mentioned above a child caught vandalising, and the punishment being the parents and child cleaning up that area. Diving into the deep end of gotcha's isn't that helpful. I could suggest to mitigate the scenario you presented we move the age of driving to 18. No, you’re being faced with the logical fallacy of your own argument and trying to change the game. Should a parent be punished for the crimes of their child in the case that I gave you? " There is no point discussing this with you as you are approaching it in a very 1 dimensional way. You are arguing that parents shouldn't be have any responsibility for the actions of their children and to support that view you have ignored the thousands of things that are day to day and moved to an outlier to prove a point, and will not let go when I gave you an example of how to tackle that outlier. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? You are going to extreme edge cases to try and win a point, try a more rounded approach considering as I mentioned above a child caught vandalising, and the punishment being the parents and child cleaning up that area. Diving into the deep end of gotcha's isn't that helpful. I could suggest to mitigate the scenario you presented we move the age of driving to 18. No, you’re being faced with the logical fallacy of your own argument and trying to change the game. Should a parent be punished for the crimes of their child in the case that I gave you? There is no point discussing this with you as you are approaching it in a very 1 dimensional way. You are arguing that parents shouldn't be have any responsibility for the actions of their children and to support that view you have ignored the thousands of things that are day to day and moved to an outlier to prove a point, and will not let go when I gave you an example of how to tackle that outlier. " I didn’t say parents have no responsibility, so don’t put words in my mouth. I said parents shouldn’t be charged. And of course you don’t want to discuss it further because you don’t like the perfectly valid question I posed. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. If a 17 year old causes death by dangerous driving, should his parent lose their licence? You are going to extreme edge cases to try and win a point, try a more rounded approach considering as I mentioned above a child caught vandalising, and the punishment being the parents and child cleaning up that area. Diving into the deep end of gotcha's isn't that helpful. I could suggest to mitigate the scenario you presented we move the age of driving to 18. No, you’re being faced with the logical fallacy of your own argument and trying to change the game. Should a parent be punished for the crimes of their child in the case that I gave you? There is no point discussing this with you as you are approaching it in a very 1 dimensional way. You are arguing that parents shouldn't be have any responsibility for the actions of their children and to support that view you have ignored the thousands of things that are day to day and moved to an outlier to prove a point, and will not let go when I gave you an example of how to tackle that outlier. I didn’t say parents have no responsibility, so don’t put words in my mouth. I said parents shouldn’t be charged. And of course you don’t want to discuss it further because you don’t like the perfectly valid question I posed. " It was valid but I gave you a response that was equally valid and you would not accept it. That is the natural end to the discussion with you. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? " Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? " How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today." Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime?" Historically, plenty. Plenty of young men have always carried weapons, not on the scale of today - but a rudimentary knowledge of life in the 60’s, 70’s and later would make you realise that knife carrying isn’t a new trend - it’s just far bigger than ever | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements "I can't get into other people's mind. You can't either. So don't pretend like you do. And it's lame to see some anecdotal examples you see on the internet and extrapolate it to the whole population. There are numerous instances when people said parents should take responsibility for such crimes committed by children, irrespective of race. Only leftists are capable of bringing race needlessly into every discussion like this | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime?" It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? Historically, plenty. Plenty of young men have always carried weapons, not on the scale of today - but a rudimentary knowledge of life in the 60’s, 70’s and later would make you realise that knife carrying isn’t a new trend - it’s just far bigger than ever " But UK banned carrying knives around only in 1988. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements
I can't get into other people's mind. You can't either. So don't pretend like you do.
And it's lame to see some anecdotal examples you see on the internet and extrapolate it to the whole population. There are numerous instances when people said parents should take responsibility for such crimes committed by children, irrespective of race.
Only leftists are capable of bringing race needlessly into every discussion like this"Taking responsibility is one thing, charging them is another, correct? And once again, take a look at comments across a broad section of social media about the father and tell me who brings face into it. (I know you won’t do this, since you believe in echo chambers) | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? Historically, plenty. Plenty of young men have always carried weapons, not on the scale of today - but a rudimentary knowledge of life in the 60’s, 70’s and later would make you realise that knife carrying isn’t a new trend - it’s just far bigger than ever But UK banned carrying knives around only in 1988." Prior to 1988 young men only carried them to butter bread when out with mates, presumably? | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. " Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. The left has been trying really hard to take away parents responsibility and replace parents with the state. Every attempt at this has been proven to be a miserable failure. Of course, they will blame it on lack of money - "If only we can tax you and invest a few more billions, we will create a utopian society of our dreams" | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. " Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. " I thought you were against anecdotal stories? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements
I can't get into other people's mind. You can't either. So don't pretend like you do.
And it's lame to see some anecdotal examples you see on the internet and extrapolate it to the whole population. There are numerous instances when people said parents should take responsibility for such crimes committed by children, irrespective of race.
Only leftists are capable of bringing race needlessly into every discussion like this
Taking responsibility is one thing, charging them is another, correct?
And once again, take a look at comments across a broad section of social media about the father and tell me who brings face into it. (I know you won’t do this, since you believe in echo chambers)
"You are shifting focus, it is here on this topic in these posts that you brought race into it, nobody else, which proves the point being made. Surely you can see this? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements
I can't get into other people's mind. You can't either. So don't pretend like you do.
And it's lame to see some anecdotal examples you see on the internet and extrapolate it to the whole population. There are numerous instances when people said parents should take responsibility for such crimes committed by children, irrespective of race.
Only leftists are capable of bringing race needlessly into every discussion like this
Taking responsibility is one thing, charging them is another, correct?
And once again, take a look at comments across a broad section of social media about the father and tell me who brings face into it. (I know you won’t do this, since you believe in echo chambers)
You are shifting focus, it is here on this topic in these posts that you brought race into it, nobody else, which proves the point being made.
Surely you can see this? "I made a statement that I stand by in response to people’s attitude to the parent, yes. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? " Because as I said, there are thousands fo things that need tackling. Taking an outlier into consideration for addition to a framework of joint responsibility doesn't start the ball rolling, it deflates it as you know.... | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? Historically, plenty. Plenty of young men have always carried weapons, not on the scale of today - but a rudimentary knowledge of life in the 60’s, 70’s and later would make you realise that knife carrying isn’t a new trend - it’s just far bigger than ever But UK banned carrying knives around only in 1988. Prior to 1988 young men only carried them to butter bread when out with mates, presumably? " It wasn't illegal to carry it around at that time. If it was announced then that parents would face charges for kids committing knife crime, it would have had an immediate impact then. | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. Parents don't have to watch the children 24/7 to stop them from becoming criminals And children can/do become criminals without evidence that their parents are at fault. I *guarantee* we wouldn’t be having this conversation if the parents in this case were white middle class. I missed this.. Why do you think like this, why does everything come back to race. It is just so bizarre. Because some people are that basic - we’ve already seen people on social media saying the dad was a criminal known to authorities. On what grounds do they make these claims? Most people aren't "basic" as you claim. It's funny that you call other people basic and then go on to make a statement that some people on social media called the dad a criminal and somehow we know the answer to that. Looking everything through the lens of race is one of the main reason why the left has become a laughing stock today. Why do you think people claimed the dad is a criminal then? Have a guess? Because you’re acting with the same info as those making the claims, right? And if you want to accuse anyone of weaponising race, take a glance at the comments about stop and search, have a look who doesn’t factor In socioeconomic information when making statements
I can't get into other people's mind. You can't either. So don't pretend like you do.
And it's lame to see some anecdotal examples you see on the internet and extrapolate it to the whole population. There are numerous instances when people said parents should take responsibility for such crimes committed by children, irrespective of race.
Only leftists are capable of bringing race needlessly into every discussion like this
Taking responsibility is one thing, charging them is another, correct?
And once again, take a look at comments across a broad section of social media about the father and tell me who brings face into it. (I know you won’t do this, since you believe in echo chambers)
You are shifting focus, it is here on this topic in these posts that you brought race into it, nobody else, which proves the point being made.
Surely you can see this?
I made a statement that I stand by in response to people’s attitude to the parent, yes. "That doesn't make sense. If someone rightly or wrongly states the parent was up to no good, what on earth as that got to do with race? | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? " Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? Because as I said, there are thousands fo things that need tackling. Taking an outlier into consideration for addition to a framework of joint responsibility doesn't start the ball rolling, it deflates it as you know.... " Dangerous driving is far more serious and impactful than vandalism though, is it not? I find it strange that you want to cherry pick the crimes that parents should be punished for along with their children, but ignore this very obvious example. | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids." How many school shooters were ‘good kids’? | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? Because as I said, there are thousands fo things that need tackling. Taking an outlier into consideration for addition to a framework of joint responsibility doesn't start the ball rolling, it deflates it as you know.... Dangerous driving is far more serious and impactful than vandalism though, is it not? I find it strange that you want to cherry pick the crimes that parents should be punished for along with their children, but ignore this very obvious example." I can see that you find it strange, you can't see the fundamentals of tackling anti social behaviour and things that can be better managed with quick wins, over something so series the minor doing that crime would end up in prison on first offence. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? Because as I said, there are thousands fo things that need tackling. Taking an outlier into consideration for addition to a framework of joint responsibility doesn't start the ball rolling, it deflates it as you know.... Dangerous driving is far more serious and impactful than vandalism though, is it not? I find it strange that you want to cherry pick the crimes that parents should be punished for along with their children, but ignore this very obvious example. I can see that you find it strange, you can't see the fundamentals of tackling anti social behaviour and things that can be better managed with quick wins, over something so series the minor doing that crime would end up in prison on first offence. " Ah but that wasn’t your argument - you wanted the car driver to be 18, not 17 in this discussion, remember? And yet you’re the first to accuse others of moving goalposts. | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. How many school shooters were ‘good kids’?" This is in the US by the way where the parent of the school shooter was charged too: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wj0vyl8xko Son and father are white by the way. | |||
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"In fact, why keep this at knife crime - since we’re browsing into wider discussion. How many young football hooligans were taught right from wrong? I suspect the vast majority were. But tribes can be more powerful than family. " Knife crime or pretty much any violent crime are serious enough to take a deep look at. It should be the parent's responsibility to keep the kid from getting into those stuff. | |||
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" If a child gets into knife crime without parents knowledge, one can be 100% sure that their parents screwed up. All parents screw up. Does that mean they should be charged with offences? How many parents screw up to the point where the kids get into knife crime? It would be such a dynamic change in our society of we were to put certain crimes children can commit into a joint responsibility framework with their parents. Vandalism, theft, knife crime etc, I think it would bring a sharp focus from parents to ensure their children knew right from wrong in areas that matter, shaping a much safer and happier society. Presumably you’d not include death by dangerous driving in the mix? Why is that? Because as I said, there are thousands fo things that need tackling. Taking an outlier into consideration for addition to a framework of joint responsibility doesn't start the ball rolling, it deflates it as you know.... Dangerous driving is far more serious and impactful than vandalism though, is it not? I find it strange that you want to cherry pick the crimes that parents should be punished for along with their children, but ignore this very obvious example. I can see that you find it strange, you can't see the fundamentals of tackling anti social behaviour and things that can be better managed with quick wins, over something so series the minor doing that crime would end up in prison on first offence. Ah but that wasn’t your argument - you wanted the car driver to be 18, not 17 in this discussion, remember? And yet you’re the first to accuse others of moving goalposts. " I suggested there was a way of dealing with the scenario you provided by thinking wider, but I think this may have been lost. | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. How many school shooters were ‘good kids’? This is in the US by the way where the parent of the school shooter was charged too: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wj0vyl8xko Son and father are white by the way. " Sorry, I posted a glib reply to a story that deserves better. When a 14 year old youth gains access to a firearm and his dad knowingly allows it - the father is at least as much to blame as the child. If the 14 year old did that *without* the dad’s awareness (and assuming the guns were stored correctly and legally) then it’s not on the dad. | |||
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"Ah, the apologists are crawling out from the shit-heap again. Predictable "Who’s apologised for the killer? | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. How many school shooters were ‘good kids’? This is in the US by the way where the parent of the school shooter was charged too: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wj0vyl8xko Son and father are white by the way. Sorry, I posted a glib reply to a story that deserves better. When a 14 year old youth gains access to a firearm and his dad knowingly allows it - the father is at least as much to blame as the child. If the 14 year old did that *without* the dad’s awareness (and assuming the guns were stored correctly and legally) then it’s not on the dad. " So if a kid in UK carries knife and their parents are aware, you are fine with charging the parents too? | |||
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"Ah, the apologists are crawling out from the shit-heap again. Predictable
Who’s apologised for the killer?"___________________________________ You really couldn't make it up, unless you're climbing a lamppost to demand the offender's public evisceration on top of his 52 year sentence you must be an apologist! : | |||
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"Ah, the apologists are crawling out from the shit-heap again. Predictable "What's sadly predictable is that no one has been an apologist for the actions of the murderer.. Absolutely no one on here.. Yet because someone used that phrase, others like yourselves make false claims.. It adds fuck all to the debate.. | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. How many school shooters were ‘good kids’? This is in the US by the way where the parent of the school shooter was charged too: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wj0vyl8xko Son and father are white by the way. Sorry, I posted a glib reply to a story that deserves better. When a 14 year old youth gains access to a firearm and his dad knowingly allows it - the father is at least as much to blame as the child. If the 14 year old did that *without* the dad’s awareness (and assuming the guns were stored correctly and legally) then it’s not on the dad. So if a kid in UK carries knife and their parents are aware, you are fine with charging the parents too?" Have they attempted to stop the child? Have they contacted anyone about the child? And has the child attacked anyone? If they have enabled or encouraged, they would be charged under their own crime - not on the child’s charges. | |||
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"There is clearly one definite way to prevent offspring from committing crime. Don't have them. It is fool-proof and 100% effective. Zero comeback. " There is no arguing with that. Game over, you won the internet today  | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. My parents taught me right from wrong. I still pushed boundaries. You did too, I guarantee. Pushing the boundaries within normal society does not include stabbing a number of 6 to 10 year olds multiple times until they lay dead or seriously wounded along with a number of brave adults who risked their own lives to try to save lives. Pushing the boundaries does not include telling the police that he was glad that he had killed innocent children. Pushing the boundaries is posting ridiculous statements about pushing boundaries, which is a democratic right. The broader point was about parental supervision, I assume you’re smart enough to understand, in the context of punishing parents for the acts of their children. " ....and I assume that you realise that some of us may not necessarily agree that this is anything close to pushing boundaries and that stating it as such seems to negate your argument as trivial8sing the issue. If you are referring to "the broader point", should the parents not have taken reasonable steps which can be looked at critically in this case by the authorities, punishment (as you put it) or justice (as others may put it), should undoubtedly be considered? Or do you think that turning a blind eye to what your kids are up to is acceptable and having kids comes without responsibility? | |||
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"I believe to the family are being investigated alot if other countries would have changed the parents as well Charging families purely for the crimes of offspring is abhorrent. I don’t agree with this, I would strongly support any laws that would place the responsibility of a child’s crime on the parent. Vandalism, theft etc. we might see less anti social behaviour and parents correcting their children rather than allowing them to be a problem for others, and not them. No parent can watch/control their children 24/7. It’s a horrendous idea. As you say it is a horrendous idea to expect parents to watch/control their children, and a lot of parents agree with you by letting theirs run wild with no consequence at all. Apologists are so destructive. Did your parents always know where you were or who you were with in your teenage years? Of course they didn't but they taught me wrong from right, which helped shape my behaviour when I was not with them. Did your parents not do this with you? Do you expect parents not to take responsibility for their children's education and upbringing? I think it would be a great idea that if a child is caught vandalising, both parents and child should be tasked by the courts to clean up the area, litter pick etc. It would certainly refocus the minds. My parents taught me right from wrong. I still pushed boundaries. You did too, I guarantee. Pushing the boundaries within normal society does not include stabbing a number of 6 to 10 year olds multiple times until they lay dead or seriously wounded along with a number of brave adults who risked their own lives to try to save lives. Pushing the boundaries does not include telling the police that he was glad that he had killed innocent children. Pushing the boundaries is posting ridiculous statements about pushing boundaries, which is a democratic right. The broader point was about parental supervision, I assume you’re smart enough to understand, in the context of punishing parents for the acts of their children. ....and I assume that you realise that some of us may not necessarily agree that this is anything close to pushing boundaries and that stating it as such seems to negate your argument as trivial8sing the issue. If you are referring to "the broader point", should the parents not have taken reasonable steps which can be looked at critically in this case by the authorities, punishment (as you put it) or justice (as others may put it), should undoubtedly be considered? Or do you think that turning a blind eye to what your kids are up to is acceptable and having kids comes without responsibility?" What steps did the parents take? Do you know, or are you assuming? And who has advocated turning a blind eye to what your kids are upto here? | |||
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"The apple never falls far from the tree." Instead of taking glibly, why not say what you mean directly about the father? I assume you’ll have some evidence to back up whatever your claim is. | |||
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"The apple never falls far from the tree. Instead of taking glibly, why not say what you mean directly about the father? I assume you’ll have some evidence to back up whatever your claim is. " Those who know, don't need to say. | |||
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"The apple never falls far from the tree. Instead of taking glibly, why not say what you mean directly about the father? I assume you’ll have some evidence to back up whatever your claim is. Those who know, don't need to say." Like I suspected. Based upon nothing. | |||
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"The apple never falls far from the tree. Instead of taking glibly, why not say what you mean directly about the father? I assume you’ll have some evidence to back up whatever your claim is. Those who know, don't need to say. Like I suspected. Based upon nothing." 'Nothing will come of Nothing.' That's from King Lear, all about another dodgy Dad. | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation " The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. " See how your morals stand up to scrutiny if you're ever involved. | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. " Zs But a piece of low life does? | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. See how your morals stand up to scrutiny if you're ever involved. " If you accept the death penalty then you’re accepting that you or a loved one can fall victim to a mistake or miscarriage of justice and be murdered. I don’t accept that. Do you? | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. Zs But a piece of low life does?" No. That’s why this low life got 52 years before consideration of parole and will likely die in prison having never seen the outside world again. | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. See how your morals stand up to scrutiny if you're ever involved. If you accept the death penalty then you’re accepting that you or a loved one can fall victim to a mistake or miscarriage of justice and be murdered. I don’t accept that. Do you? " Clever words. Your opinion would be different if your daughter, son, or family was the subject of a heinous crime. Disgraceful | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. See how your morals stand up to scrutiny if you're ever involved. If you accept the death penalty then you’re accepting that you or a loved one can fall victim to a mistake or miscarriage of justice and be murdered. I don’t accept that. Do you? Clever words. Your opinion would be different if your daughter, son, or family was the subject of a heinous crime. Disgraceful " Would it? Do all victims of horrendous violent crimes immediately call for the death penalty, then? No, they don’t. Don’t judge everyone by your own standards. | |||
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"Apparently anyone that calls for the death penalty is a moron, at least so says the fool that just sent me a message. I would argue with that in certain circumstances....ie the waste of space involved in the Southport incident and I defy anyone to argue the case for rehabilitation The state does not have the right to take a life. Nor should they. See how your morals stand up to scrutiny if you're ever involved. If you accept the death penalty then you’re accepting that you or a loved one can fall victim to a mistake or miscarriage of justice and be murdered. I don’t accept that. Do you? Clever words. Your opinion would be different if your daughter, son, or family was the subject of a heinous crime. Disgraceful " What if your or your sister/ brothers children were one of those convicted of murder and sentenced to death yet were innocent.. There's literally dozens upon dozens who have served years for murder whose convictions were unsafe.. They can't be brought back .. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help " You know... children are not as innocent as you think. They call each other names, spread vicious rumours, fight, and lie. Axel attended secondary school in Formby, an area of merseyside that is 97% white and has less than 55 blacks. He experienced racial bullying to the extent that he brought a knife into the school to kill those who were bullying him. His primary school years are less documented but, given his quiet, meek personality that he is described to have, he was probably bullied as severely back then (by whites). He was also diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder and was most likely neglected by his parents as well as the school system that allowed him to be ruthleslly bullied for his entire childhood. His old neighbours label him as "quiet and unassuming" and as someone they would never think would commit those heinous crimes. He was a bully victim who finally snapped after repressing his righteous rage for all those years. Condolonces to the family of the victims, but those little women were not the real target of his crimes, the real target was the system that allowed him to be tormented for all his youthful years. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help You know... children are not as innocent as you think. They call each other names, spread vicious rumours, fight, and lie. Axel attended secondary school in Formby, an area of merseyside that is 97% white and has less than 55 blacks. He experienced racial bullying to the extent that he brought a knife into the school to kill those who were bullying him. His primary school years are less documented but, given his quiet, meek personality that he is described to have, he was probably bullied as severely back then (by whites). He was also diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder and was most likely neglected by his parents as well as the school system that allowed him to be ruthleslly bullied for his entire childhood. His old neighbours label him as "quiet and unassuming" and as someone they would never think would commit those heinous crimes. He was a bully victim who finally snapped after repressing his righteous rage for all those years. Condolonces to the family of the victims, but those little women were not the real target of his crimes, the real target was the system that allowed him to be tormented for all his youthful years." Seeing as you have such an in-depth understanding of what he went through... what am I saying? You're just making up bullshit so you can play your victim card Little women? They were children. Little children Righteous rage? What an absolutely cunt take | |||
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" Pretty much every anti social kids I have come across in my life has absent or abusive parents. I thought you were against anecdotal stories? Do you know of cases where parents spent time with their kids every day, teaching them good morals and still the kids got into knife crime? I could give plenty of examples of this debate being had about white kids. How many school shooters were ‘good kids’? This is in the US by the way where the parent of the school shooter was charged too: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c9wj0vyl8xko Son and father are white by the way. Sorry, I posted a glib reply to a story that deserves better. When a 14 year old youth gains access to a firearm and his dad knowingly allows it - the father is at least as much to blame as the child. If the 14 year old did that *without* the dad’s awareness (and assuming the guns were stored correctly and legally) then it’s not on the dad. So if a kid in UK carries knife and their parents are aware, you are fine with charging the parents too? Have they attempted to stop the child? Have they contacted anyone about the child? And has the child attacked anyone? If they have enabled or encouraged, they would be charged under their own crime - not on the child’s charges." Let's say they knew that their child carried knife all the time but did not care. One fine day, the child stabbed someone. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help You know... children are not as innocent as you think. They call each other names, spread vicious rumours, fight, and lie. Axel attended secondary school in Formby, an area of merseyside that is 97% white and has less than 55 blacks. He experienced racial bullying to the extent that he brought a knife into the school to kill those who were bullying him. His primary school years are less documented but, given his quiet, meek personality that he is described to have, he was probably bullied as severely back then (by whites). He was also diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder and was most likely neglected by his parents as well as the school system that allowed him to be ruthleslly bullied for his entire childhood. His old neighbours label him as "quiet and unassuming" and as someone they would never think would commit those heinous crimes. He was a bully victim who finally snapped after repressing his righteous rage for all those years. Condolonces to the family of the victims, but those little women were not the real target of his crimes, the real target was the system that allowed him to be tormented for all his youthful years." It takes some serious level of mental gymnastics to blame such an evil act on the "system". Individuals have choice. It's really easy to make a choice that doesn't involve going out and killing children. | |||
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"It takes some serious level of mental gymnastics to blame such an evil act on the "system". Individuals have choice. It's really easy to make a choice that doesn't involve going out and killing children." You're right, but nobody in their right mind wakes up one day and decides to go on a killing spree - there must have been events, triggers, traumas and environmental factors that contributed to his descent into evil. As rare as these cases are, I don't think they just happen in a vaccuum. The 'system' is not responsible for any of that, and he is still accountable for his decisions - but it does seem there may have been a failure to intervene properly - and that's not a new story. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help You know... children are not as innocent as you think. They call each other names, spread vicious rumours, fight, and lie. Axel attended secondary school in Formby, an area of merseyside that is 97% white and has less than 55 blacks. He experienced racial bullying to the extent that he brought a knife into the school to kill those who were bullying him. His primary school years are less documented but, given his quiet, meek personality that he is described to have, he was probably bullied as severely back then (by whites). He was also diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder and was most likely neglected by his parents as well as the school system that allowed him to be ruthleslly bullied for his entire childhood. His old neighbours label him as "quiet and unassuming" and as someone they would never think would commit those heinous crimes. He was a bully victim who finally snapped after repressing his righteous rage for all those years. Condolonces to the family of the victims, but those little women were not the real target of his crimes, the real target was the system that allowed him to be tormented for all his youthful years." Sadly many children are bullied at school and don't as a symptom of that research how to make chemical weapons and actually do so.. There's no evidence his parents turned away from him not neglected him, his father successfully stopped him in what looks like a previous attack and called the police multiple times plus the kid was under the mental health team for four years till he stopped engaging so whilst we don't yet know if they are to be prosecuted for anything it's wrong to say he was neglected unless if course you have further information? Your attempting to turn this into it was the system and the towns fault, yes the system made mistakes (but you're almost saying because he was racially bullied which is wrong and goes on but not seen that reported as a possible cause ) and because of that they deserved it which is fucking atrocious. his actions were calculated in the several attempts he made before he attacked the children.. He didn't lash out in response to what you suggest, he didn't react against a racist bully which tbh is often an understandable reaction by someone who has suffered that .. His actions of someone who downloads terrorist instructions and ideology as well as an obsession with Hitler and the IRA are not those of an innocent lad who has been driven to that because he was bullied .. He planned it in the quiet of his bedroom, buying the knives, carrying out research into the activity class so he could target the innocent.. He is fully responsible so stop please with the deflection.. | |||
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"I see his Brother's Instagram account is full of knives and violent images. Clearly he grew up in a family environment where violence was normalised." ___________________________ How do you so emphatically arrive at that conclusion based on the brother's Instagram account? | |||
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"I see his Brother's Instagram account is full of knives and violent images. Clearly he grew up in a family environment where violence was normalised. ___________________________ How do you so emphatically arrive at that conclusion based on the brother's Instagram account?" Do you seriously think someone who carries out such henious crimes grew up in a normal environment? | |||
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"I see his Brother's Instagram account is full of knives and violent images. Clearly he grew up in a family environment where violence was normalised. ___________________________ How do you so emphatically arrive at that conclusion based on the brother's Instagram account? Do you seriously think someone who carries out such henious crimes grew up in a normal environment? " Sadly many wives and families have been in that very situation of living in a very normal environment till a knock on the door and the male is taken away plus all the electronic devices he was using to access material involving children.. It's too early to say what the home environment was of the killer or whether there was any blame from those within as there is still an investigation which will look at Instagram accounts as part of that.. | |||
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"Any punishment other than being brutally tortured to death is far too good for this inhuman piece of shit, that photo of his face with those soulless eyes is burned into my brain and actually has me fantasising the violence I’d like to inflict on him, talked about wanting to kill then picked the easiest target he could filthy fucking cowardly cunt Fantasising torture? I’d get some help. If you honestly can look at him knowing what he’s done to them poor young lassies and not want to hurt him then I’d say it’s you who needs to get some help You know... children are not as innocent as you think. They call each other names, spread vicious rumours, fight, and lie. Axel attended secondary school in Formby, an area of merseyside that is 97% white and has less than 55 blacks. He experienced racial bullying to the extent that he brought a knife into the school to kill those who were bullying him. His primary school years are less documented but, given his quiet, meek personality that he is described to have, he was probably bullied as severely back then (by whites). He was also diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder and was most likely neglected by his parents as well as the school system that allowed him to be ruthleslly bullied for his entire childhood. His old neighbours label him as "quiet and unassuming" and as someone they would never think would commit those heinous crimes. He was a bully victim who finally snapped after repressing his righteous rage for all those years. Condolonces to the family of the victims, but those little women were not the real target of his crimes, the real target was the system that allowed him to be tormented for all his youthful years." 'Little women' is a bit creepy. | |||
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