FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Striking junior doctors
Striking junior doctors
Jump to: Newest in thread
"The British Medical Association has announced that the 11th round of junior doctors’ strike action in England will take place from 7am on Thursday 27 June to 7am on Tuesday 2 July. This will be a full walkout".
Good to be reminded that the tories have failed the junior doctors. Bad considering no-one will negotiate before GE result.
Orrrrrrr, could this be an ace up the tories sleeves, negotiate and then state they sorted all the medical strikes?
I wouldn't put it past the tories. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
 |
By *otMe66Man 2 weeks ago
Terra Firma |
It exposes the callous ways of the BMA.
They have no negotiations at this point and won’t until the GE has decided the new government. They are deliberately politicising the strike action to the detriment of the public who need NHS services, absolutely horrid union. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *irldnCouple 2 weeks ago
Brighton |
Got to say while I support the right to strike and do believe junior doctors have had a raw deal from the govt for waaaay too long, the timing of THIS strike is highly cynical and I do not support it.
Not that they will be bothered by what a random on a swinger site says of course  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
The consultants had their's settled , not only for last year but the new tax year also.
The entry level for a consultant is a fraction under 100 grand. Full timers can up to 10% of their NHS wage and also get bonuses (awards for going beyond their remit).
The highest threshold is just under 140,000pa |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
""The British Medical Association has announced that the 11th round of junior doctors’ strike action in England will take place from 7am on Thursday 27 June to 7am on Tuesday 2 July. This will be a full walkout".
Good to be reminded that the tories have failed the junior doctors. Bad considering no-one will negotiate before GE result.
Orrrrrrr, could this be an ace up the tories sleeves, negotiate and then state they sorted all the medical strikes?
I wouldn't put it past the tories."
The problem for the doctors is that it’s pretty difficult for patients to know whether they are on strike or not, the system is so poor.
The country did without healthcare for years during lockdown, a few days here and there isn’t going to make any material difference.
Just sack the money grubbers. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
""The British Medical Association has announced that the 11th round of junior doctors’ strike action in England will take place from 7am on Thursday 27 June to 7am on Tuesday 2 July. This will be a full walkout".
Good to be reminded that the tories have failed the junior doctors. Bad considering no-one will negotiate before GE result.
Orrrrrrr, could this be an ace up the tories sleeves, negotiate and then state they sorted all the medical strikes?
I wouldn't put it past the tories."
Warning shot across Labour’s bows. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Wouldn’t think they just came out of a pandemic fucking piss takers
Exactly, they should be thankful for having worked through the pandemic to not get the treatment they deserve. FFS."
Same for all the staff - but the consultants got looked after! |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes. "
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird."
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me. "
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me. "
They haven't accepted the offer, so no they do not have a pay rise. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises."
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
They haven't accepted the offer, so no they do not have a pay rise."
When did they last receive a pay rise? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises."
It’s kind of like how things work in the private sector.
You apply for a job because you need the work/find the role interesting/see some kind of career progression in it/it otherwise suits your circumstances.
Then the pay progression depends on a number of things. Business and personal performance. Company policy. If the business is doing poorly you don’t get a pay rise. If I get poor service somewhere, I expect the service to improve. I don’t think I’ve ever had anyone in the private sector respond to a complaint: I’m not paid enough. If I was paid more the service wouldn’t be shit.
If you think you are underpaid you moan about it and try to negotiate something better.
They either pay you more or refuse. You accept the position or you leave and go somewhere else.
Generally you don’t say “I’m a posh kid called Quentin playing at revolutionary so give me some more money or I’ll go on strike to bring the Tories down”. That would elicit something along the lines of “piss off”.
If one trains as anything, investment banker, management consultant, accountant, one doesn’t really expect to be paid the same as the Chief Executive on day one.
On my first day at Professional School, I remember being told that the main thing that separates Professionals from everyone else is that Professionals don’t go on strike.
These people are just spoilt kids. They bring shame on their “profession”. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
If people want to have a certain career be it medicine police or fire services I applaud them for starting a profession that looks after the health and security of the country .
Anyone doing the job does know that starting out the salaries will be roughly as stated in their contracts however while others around get larger increases year on year I don’t think it’s unreasonable that junior doctors should be left behind in the wages department . Different times police or nurses have had special allowances made to get a better increase junior doctors think it’s their turn . Yes they’ll get a nice jump when qualified but should they struggle more in the meantime . I’ve had nothing but good dealings with health workers and the police fortunately not had any dealings with the fire service . I wouldn’t like to walk in their shoes when I see what they have to deal with .
I dread to think how things would go if more of the workers leave with no new blood coming in the services would collapse . |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
""The British Medical Association has announced that the 11th round of junior doctors’ strike action in England will take place from 7am on Thursday 27 June to 7am on Tuesday 2 July. This will be a full walkout".
Good to be reminded that the tories have failed the junior doctors. Bad considering no-one will negotiate before GE result.
Orrrrrrr, could this be an ace up the tories sleeves, negotiate and then state they sorted all the medical strikes?
I wouldn't put it past the tories.
Warning shot across Labour’s bows."
Very possibly a message to Labour as no negotiations before the GE. As ever the public get to suffer for their political moves. Be interesting to see if they stick to their demands when Labour are in office and how much Labour finally give them |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
Full fact says 35% pay restoration for doctors as stated by the British Medical Association which estimates the net cost (ie, its overall impact on public finances) would be around £1 billion a year
Equivalent to
* 1/40th of HMRC losses due to brexit.
* 1/3rd of annual cost of non doms.
* 1/120th of national debt interest
What is all the fuss about just pay them, we need more doctors to look after all the woes of the population.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
They haven't accepted the offer, so no they do not have a pay rise.
When did they last receive a pay rise?"
Apologies, reread that you put wage rises: yeah at some point. Dunno last time. Feel free to look. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
They haven't accepted the offer, so no they do not have a pay rise.
When did they last receive a pay rise?
Apologies, reread that you put wage rises: yeah at some point. Dunno last time. Feel free to look."
I don't need to look if you're conceding that I was correct. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today. "
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If people want to have a certain career be it medicine police or fire services I applaud them for starting a profession that looks after the health and security of the country .
Anyone doing the job does know that starting out the salaries will be roughly as stated in their contracts however while others around get larger increases year on year I don’t think it’s unreasonable that junior doctors should be left behind in the wages department . Different times police or nurses have had special allowances made to get a better increase junior doctors think it’s their turn . Yes they’ll get a nice jump when qualified but should they struggle more in the meantime . I’ve had nothing but good dealings with health workers and the police fortunately not had any dealings with the fire service . I wouldn’t like to walk in their shoes when I see what they have to deal with .
I dread to think how things would go if more of the workers leave with no new blood coming in the services would collapse . "
All around them get wage increases? Not in the NHS due to austerity measures. The junior doctors were offered more than nurses. The junior doctors also went on strike in 2016. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former."
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If people want to have a certain career be it medicine police or fire services I applaud them for starting a profession that looks after the health and security of the country .
Anyone doing the job does know that starting out the salaries will be roughly as stated in their contracts however while others around get larger increases year on year I don’t think it’s unreasonable that junior doctors should be left behind in the wages department . Different times police or nurses have had special allowances made to get a better increase junior doctors think it’s their turn . Yes they’ll get a nice jump when qualified but should they struggle more in the meantime . I’ve had nothing but good dealings with health workers and the police fortunately not had any dealings with the fire service . I wouldn’t like to walk in their shoes when I see what they have to deal with .
I dread to think how things would go if more of the workers leave with no new blood coming in the services would collapse .
All around them get wage increases? Not in the NHS due to austerity measures. The junior doctors were offered more than nurses. The junior doctors also went on strike in 2016. "
Clap for carers long forgotten
Money for everything except public services, roll on 4th July.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former."
29 to 51 grand in five stages, 4-5 years, 2022 salary. I think 35 -55 grand would be a decent amount for junior doctors. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *otMe66Man 2 weeks ago
Terra Firma |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former."
Junior doctors get pay rises as they progress.
Junior doctors don't suffer from pay freezes for years, they progress and with it so does pay.
Recently they have had 2 pay rises 2% in 2021 - 2022 and 8.8% in 2023 - 2024. They also have approx 25% uplift in their salaries for unsociable hours. Year 1 approx 32K by year end 2 they should be on a basic 43K + additional pay as mentioned, that is a 34% increase over a 2 year period plus the % pay rises. It then increases further and further over the forthcoming years, between years 3 - 8 they can expect to wages to rise to 63K a 93% increase form where they started. From that point as they specialise it can be rising to 140K within 5 years.
All this is common knowledge, and it has been mentioned they knew the salary rises and bandings from the get go, asking for 35% is utter nonsense |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?"
Private sector earn more |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Junior doctors get pay rises as they progress.
Junior doctors don't suffer from pay freezes for years, they progress and with it so does pay.
Recently they have had 2 pay rises 2% in 2021 - 2022 and 8.8% in 2023 - 2024. They also have approx 25% uplift in their salaries for unsociable hours. Year 1 approx 32K by year end 2 they should be on a basic 43K + additional pay as mentioned, that is a 34% increase over a 2 year period plus the % pay rises. It then increases further and further over the forthcoming years, between years 3 - 8 they can expect to wages to rise to 63K a 93% increase form where they started. From that point as they specialise it can be rising to 140K within 5 years.
All this is common knowledge, and it has been mentioned they knew the salary rises and bandings from the get go, asking for 35% is utter nonsense"
8.8% is the offer not the rise. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
Private sector earn more"
And? Their wage increases haven't kept up with inflation. Which is the point trying to be argued. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *otMe66Man 2 weeks ago
Terra Firma |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Junior doctors get pay rises as they progress.
Junior doctors don't suffer from pay freezes for years, they progress and with it so does pay.
Recently they have had 2 pay rises 2% in 2021 - 2022 and 8.8% in 2023 - 2024. They also have approx 25% uplift in their salaries for unsociable hours. Year 1 approx 32K by year end 2 they should be on a basic 43K + additional pay as mentioned, that is a 34% increase over a 2 year period plus the % pay rises. It then increases further and further over the forthcoming years, between years 3 - 8 they can expect to wages to rise to 63K a 93% increase form where they started. From that point as they specialise it can be rising to 140K within 5 years.
All this is common knowledge, and it has been mentioned they knew the salary rises and bandings from the get go, asking for 35% is utter nonsense
8.8% is the offer not the rise."
They received it Sept 23 |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?"
In 2010 an FY1 started on £28,274
In 2023 an FY1 started on £32,398
That is not 30% it’s less than half that
Using CPI to calculate inflation what cost £100 in 2010, would cost £149.76 today. A 49% increase. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
In 2010 an FY1 started on £28,274
In 2023 an FY1 started on £32,398
That is not 30% it’s less than half that
Using CPI to calculate inflation what cost £100 in 2010, would cost £149.76 today. A 49% increase."
I think you need to relook at your figures  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
Private sector earn more
And? Their wage increases haven't kept up with inflation. Which is the point trying to be argued. "
Then it's up to them to strike if they feel it's valid. Earning more than NHS staff possibly keeps them grounded.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Junior doctors get pay rises as they progress.
Junior doctors don't suffer from pay freezes for years, they progress and with it so does pay.
Recently they have had 2 pay rises 2% in 2021 - 2022 and 8.8% in 2023 - 2024. They also have approx 25% uplift in their salaries for unsociable hours. Year 1 approx 32K by year end 2 they should be on a basic 43K + additional pay as mentioned, that is a 34% increase over a 2 year period plus the % pay rises. It then increases further and further over the forthcoming years, between years 3 - 8 they can expect to wages to rise to 63K a 93% increase form where they started. From that point as they specialise it can be rising to 140K within 5 years.
All this is common knowledge, and it has been mentioned they knew the salary rises and bandings from the get go, asking for 35% is utter nonsense
8.8% is the offer not the rise.
They received it Sept 23"
Since it hasn't been accepted, I assume not. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
Private sector earn more
And? Their wage increases haven't kept up with inflation. Which is the point trying to be argued.
Then it's up to them to strike if they feel it's valid. Earning more than NHS staff possibly keeps them grounded.
"
I asked why I don't see the same outrage for private sector employees. I didn't ask what they should do about it. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked."
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+ |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple 2 weeks ago
Manchester |
The BMA state that despite pay increases since 2010, that junior doctors pay has reduced in real terms by 26%. So even if they knew the salary when joining they would expect it to at least stay in touch around real terms. Would you take a 26% cut?
According to full fact MP s salaries have reduced by 10% in real terms. Their expenses however, which account for most of their living costs, have all kept pace in real terms so the loss is well compensated.
Given the true value of doctors over hundreds of incompetent lying arseholes in parliament I would suggest pay the doctors what they are worth. Cut the number of MPs and Lords to help foot the bill. (Yes I know the numbers are vastly different).
Maybe cut the ridiculous numbers of Directors in the NHS too?
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *otMe66Man 2 weeks ago
Terra Firma |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Junior doctors get pay rises as they progress.
Junior doctors don't suffer from pay freezes for years, they progress and with it so does pay.
Recently they have had 2 pay rises 2% in 2021 - 2022 and 8.8% in 2023 - 2024. They also have approx 25% uplift in their salaries for unsociable hours. Year 1 approx 32K by year end 2 they should be on a basic 43K + additional pay as mentioned, that is a 34% increase over a 2 year period plus the % pay rises. It then increases further and further over the forthcoming years, between years 3 - 8 they can expect to wages to rise to 63K a 93% increase form where they started. From that point as they specialise it can be rising to 140K within 5 years.
All this is common knowledge, and it has been mentioned they knew the salary rises and bandings from the get go, asking for 35% is utter nonsense
8.8% is the offer not the rise.
They received it Sept 23
Since it hasn't been accepted, I assume not."
If you really want to find out the answer and not assume, simply google did junior doctor get a pay rise in 2023, follow the BBC link snd it will show you. for further reading try the Gov website that will break down how it is back dated to April 23 and 1st year actually get over 10%.
Or not  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+ "
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+ "
Then that practice needs to stop (usury interest). |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game."
Austerity started 2010, how long should they wait? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game.
Austerity started 2010, how long should they wait? "
Well with an imminent Labour government with ready access to a Magic Money Tree, they can expect 20% a year for 5 years. Public Sector workers should order their luxury yachts now. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
In 2010 an FY1 started on £28,274
In 2023 an FY1 started on £32,398
That is not 30% it’s less than half that
Using CPI to calculate inflation what cost £100 in 2010, would cost £149.76 today. A 49% increase.
I think you need to relook at your figures "
Apologies, I looked at the wrong column!
Still 19% below inflation though. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *irldnCouple 2 weeks ago
Brighton |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game.
Austerity started 2010, how long should they wait?
Well with an imminent Labour government with ready access to a Magic Money Tree, they can expect 20% a year for 5 years. Public Sector workers should order their luxury yachts now."
Ah the old tropes are the best  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game.
Austerity started 2010, how long should they wait?
Well with an imminent Labour government with ready access to a Magic Money Tree, they can expect 20% a year for 5 years. Public Sector workers should order their luxury yachts now.
Ah the old tropes are the best "
Indeed, but then Labour do have form of pr0fligacy with public money. Let's see.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I think it's important to be aware that junior doctors ARE the health service. They may be the first people you see making critical decisions on health. To have them healthy and hearty is paramount to an excelling health service. Over 20 years the government has not only ruined training for juniors (which means it took longer to become a consultant), accomodation in hospital was removed (tantamount to wage reduction), high student loans and higher interest, higher mortgage rates (obv affects everyone) and a pension raid. Couple that with the increased workload by understaffing.... They are basically saying fuck the NHS and go private. "
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *otMe66Man 2 weeks ago
Terra Firma |
"For me, a 35% pay demand is unrealistic and naïve. It just shows immaturity by these junior doctors. If they get awarded anything like that amount, it opens the flood gates. That apart, this is just blackm@iI at the end of the day. They can hold a gun to our heads because they have collective power. If you're a freelance roofer or car mechanic, you have no such power and you're fucked.
It’s argued as pay restoration. Three years of austerity they fell behind
Average doctor student debt is £84k charged at usury interest rates.
I think someone recently calculated that most medics with loans would pay back 200-250k, paid from taxed income, real cost 300k+
Yes, I get that, but to attempt to claw it back in one move is unrealistic. They have to play a longer game.
Austerity started 2010, how long should they wait?
Well with an imminent Labour government with ready access to a Magic Money Tree, they can expect 20% a year for 5 years. Public Sector workers should order their luxury yachts now.
Ah the old tropes are the best "
It is a fact that labour use money they haven’t got and end up in debt.
The last time they funded the NHS with money they didn’t have was in the 2000’s when they used private sector funding to the tune of 13 billion which ended up costing the taxpayer 55 billion of debt.
That translates today into the NHS was run so much better in 2010, how the left progressives pick and choose what to champion baffles me. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
They were aware of the salaries before taking the job. I didn't say they couldn't complain. You're making some weird fucking statements about me today.
Have you spent too long in the sun today? If someone started the process of becoming a doctor, by applying to study medicine, in 2010, they would qualify as a specialty doctor in around 2024-2026 (depending on the specialty). I don’t think that person back in 2010 expecting their wage to have at least kept up with inflation is unrealistic or unreasonable. Becoming a doctor is not an apprenticeship, it doesn’t take 2 years. They aren’t working in a shop or fixing cars.
These are some of the most intelligent and dedicated people in the country. They have levels of responsibility most people would find crushing, and they could all earn far more elsewhere. You might be happy with mr or Mrs average looking after the health of you and yours but I want the brightest and the best, because what health professionals do is important. They deserve not only respect but a decent wage, and by not giving them the latter we are doing the opposite of the former.
Why do you continue to try to get personal with me?
I don't need a rundown of how long it takes doctors to become specialist, I have 1 in the family.
In terms of 2010 to today, the starting salary for FY1 is up over 30%. BTW, very few people have had rises that have kept up with inflation.
The only people trying to speak of 'real terms' wage rises are the public sector, why don't I see the same outrage for the private sector?
In 2010 an FY1 started on £28,274
In 2023 an FY1 started on £32,398
That is not 30% it’s less than half that
Using CPI to calculate inflation what cost £100 in 2010, would cost £149.76 today. A 49% increase.
I think you need to relook at your figures
Apologies, I looked at the wrong column!
Still 19% below inflation though."
Yet again, you chose to argue instead of get the facts. This is getting boring now |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *irldnCouple 1 week ago
Brighton |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
It’s kind of like how things work in the private sector.
You apply for a job because you need the work/find the role interesting/see some kind of career progression in it/it otherwise suits your circumstances.
Then the pay progression depends on a number of things. Business and personal performance. Company policy. If the business is doing poorly you don’t get a pay rise. If I get poor service somewhere, I expect the service to improve. I don’t think I’ve ever had anyone in the private sector respond to a complaint: I’m not paid enough. If I was paid more the service wouldn’t be shit.
If you think you are underpaid you moan about it and try to negotiate something better.
They either pay you more or refuse. You accept the position or you leave and go somewhere else.
Generally you don’t say “I’m a posh kid called Quentin playing at revolutionary so give me some more money or I’ll go on strike to bring the Tories down”. That would elicit something along the lines of “piss off”.
If one trains as anything, investment banker, management consultant, accountant, one doesn’t really expect to be paid the same as the Chief Executive on day one.
On my first day at Professional School, I remember being told that the main thing that separates Professionals from everyone else is that Professionals don’t go on strike.
These people are just spoilt kids. They bring shame on their “profession”."
Didn’t Barristers go on strike? Are they not professionals who went to professional (law) school?
You’ll also note that medical school is classed as “professional school” as well. But obviously those doctors don’t meet your classification of being “professional”?
 |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
It’s kind of like how things work in the private sector.
You apply for a job because you need the work/find the role interesting/see some kind of career progression in it/it otherwise suits your circumstances.
Then the pay progression depends on a number of things. Business and personal performance. Company policy. If the business is doing poorly you don’t get a pay rise. If I get poor service somewhere, I expect the service to improve. I don’t think I’ve ever had anyone in the private sector respond to a complaint: I’m not paid enough. If I was paid more the service wouldn’t be shit.
If you think you are underpaid you moan about it and try to negotiate something better.
They either pay you more or refuse. You accept the position or you leave and go somewhere else.
Generally you don’t say “I’m a posh kid called Quentin playing at revolutionary so give me some more money or I’ll go on strike to bring the Tories down”. That would elicit something along the lines of “piss off”.
If one trains as anything, investment banker, management consultant, accountant, one doesn’t really expect to be paid the same as the Chief Executive on day one.
On my first day at Professional School, I remember being told that the main thing that separates Professionals from everyone else is that Professionals don’t go on strike.
These people are just spoilt kids. They bring shame on their “profession”.
Didn’t Barristers go on strike? Are they not professionals who went to professional (law) school?
You’ll also note that medical school is classed as “professional school” as well. But obviously those doctors don’t meet your classification of being “professional”?
"
There has been a general decline in standards across much of Western society. I’m not sure what point you are making.
Just because there has been a decline in standards in one place doesn’t mean there hasn’t been a decline in standards elsewhere.
I agree. Barristers shouldn’t have gone on strike. It’s crass. Neither should doctors. The BMA should be disciplining them not encouraging them.
But that’s the problem. They are spoilt and entitled kids working for the most entitled organisation on the planet (the NHS). Nobody has said no to them at school, at home. At University they would have been brainwashed with leftist and NHS propaganda. Nobody says no to them at hospitals, the BMA encourages them.
It’s no surprise that all this entitlement has ended in a crap health service.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *irldnCouple 1 week ago
Brighton |
"I've said this on many of the last 'strike rounds'.
If you didn't like the money (which was known prior) then don't be a fucking doctor.
This particular strike will do the JD's and BMA more harm than good in the publics eyes.
You don’t believe people should get pay rises? Weird.
They have received pay rises. Weird that you would pretend otherwise. Also weird that you would make such an assumption about me.
But you said people shouldn’t complain because they know what the money is when they take the job, that sounds like you don’t think they should expect pay rises.
It’s kind of like how things work in the private sector.
You apply for a job because you need the work/find the role interesting/see some kind of career progression in it/it otherwise suits your circumstances.
Then the pay progression depends on a number of things. Business and personal performance. Company policy. If the business is doing poorly you don’t get a pay rise. If I get poor service somewhere, I expect the service to improve. I don’t think I’ve ever had anyone in the private sector respond to a complaint: I’m not paid enough. If I was paid more the service wouldn’t be shit.
If you think you are underpaid you moan about it and try to negotiate something better.
They either pay you more or refuse. You accept the position or you leave and go somewhere else.
Generally you don’t say “I’m a posh kid called Quentin playing at revolutionary so give me some more money or I’ll go on strike to bring the Tories down”. That would elicit something along the lines of “piss off”.
If one trains as anything, investment banker, management consultant, accountant, one doesn’t really expect to be paid the same as the Chief Executive on day one.
On my first day at Professional School, I remember being told that the main thing that separates Professionals from everyone else is that Professionals don’t go on strike.
These people are just spoilt kids. They bring shame on their “profession”.
Didn’t Barristers go on strike? Are they not professionals who went to professional (law) school?
You’ll also note that medical school is classed as “professional school” as well. But obviously those doctors don’t meet your classification of being “professional”?
There has been a general decline in standards across much of Western society. I’m not sure what point you are making.
Just because there has been a decline in standards in one place doesn’t mean there hasn’t been a decline in standards elsewhere.
I agree. Barristers shouldn’t have gone on strike. It’s crass. Neither should doctors. The BMA should be disciplining them not encouraging them.
But that’s the problem. They are spoilt and entitled kids working for the most entitled organisation on the planet (the NHS). Nobody has said no to them at school, at home. At University they would have been brainwashed with leftist and NHS propaganda. Nobody says no to them at hospitals, the BMA encourages them.
It’s no surprise that all this entitlement has ended in a crap health service.
"
Starting to wonder. Are you a chartered accountant by any chance? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
» Add a new message to this topic
