FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > The dismantling of agriculture.
The dismantling of agriculture.
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"We are seeing the farmers striking all over europe, in countries like, italy, spain, romania, poland, greece, germany, portugal and the netherlands, but the most dramatic ones that are being covered is the ones in france and in brussels. Is it just me or does it feel like that there is a global agenda of the dismantling of agriculture? It seems to only happen in the west and in the usa they are buying up farm land, there is a saying "when you control the food, you control the people" What is your view of it?" I think it’s not so much a dismantling of agriculture as a reorganisation of it so that different people benefit from the profits. It’s going to be another fiasco like electric cars are turning out to be (surprisingly). If the WEF want everyone to “eat ze bugs” then they should really start setting an example at their annual Davos jolly. | |||
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"We are seeing the farmers striking all over europe, in countries like, italy, spain, romania, poland, greece, germany, portugal and the netherlands, but the most dramatic ones that are being covered is the ones in france and in brussels. Is it just me or does it feel like that there is a global agenda of the dismantling of agriculture? It seems to only happen in the west and in the usa they are buying up farm land, there is a saying "when you control the food, you control the people" What is your view of it?" the farmers are not striking, farms are run as a business, trade and imports of food and the relocation of the carbon footprint to developing nations is the eu's vanity goal.   | |||
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"If the ever increasing population of the world wants to continue to eat meat, then we need to find a way of creating it - cellular is one such possibility. There’s just too much demand for not enough grazing land. Or plant based is going to be the future (not in our lifetime, same with cellular). " “By 2050, the global population is expected to hit 10 billion people. This means that – to feed everyone – it will take 56 per cent more food than is produced in the world today, according to the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP)” https://www.un.org/en/chronicle/article/feeding-world-sustainably | |||
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"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia." There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits." Sustainable for a meat based diet? The bbc series on the global climate impact of meat based diets, Liz Bonnin said 80% of global agriculture is to feed animals for human consumption, and that is not sustainable in the face of predicted population growth to ten billion. Plant based diets would require a fraction of current farmland to produce adequate quantities of food. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h04fRFCIRKM | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. Sustainable for a meat based diet? The bbc series on the global climate impact of meat based diets, Liz Bonnin said 80% of global agriculture is to feed animals for human consumption, and that is not sustainable in the face of predicted population growth to ten billion. Plant based diets would require a fraction of current farmland to produce adequate quantities of food. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=h04fRFCIRKM " Yes, a move to plant-based and ultimately cellular food is the answer. And plant-based stuff today is far superior to what it was even a few years ago. | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits." This is pretty much the doomsday theory that was peddled in 1980s about how there won't be enough food for the population in 2000. With the help of research, we managed to increase crop yield massively. I don't think availability of food is a problem unless we are talking about climate change which might hit agriculture. The problem is with political issues which rise because a country is dependent on others for basic needs. | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. This is pretty much the doomsday theory that was peddled in 1980s about how there won't be enough food for the population in 2000. With the help of research, we managed to increase crop yield massively. I don't think availability of food is a problem unless we are talking about climate change which might hit agriculture. The problem is with political issues which rise because a country is dependent on others for basic needs." Unless demand for red meat in particular changes, availability is definitely going to be a problem. The cost of producing red meat in water alone is astronomical, that’s without the space required to be taken up by cattle. | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. This is pretty much the doomsday theory that was peddled in 1980s about how there won't be enough food for the population in 2000. With the help of research, we managed to increase crop yield massively. I don't think availability of food is a problem unless we are talking about climate change which might hit agriculture. The problem is with political issues which rise because a country is dependent on others for basic needs. Unless demand for red meat in particular changes, availability is definitely going to be a problem. The cost of producing red meat in water alone is astronomical, that’s without the space required to be taken up by cattle." Is the cost high? Yes. Are we at a serious risk of death by starvation because of unavailability of food? No. | |||
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"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. This is pretty much the doomsday theory that was peddled in 1980s about how there won't be enough food for the population in 2000. With the help of research, we managed to increase crop yield massively. I don't think availability of food is a problem unless we are talking about climate change which might hit agriculture. The problem is with political issues which rise because a country is dependent on others for basic needs. Unless demand for red meat in particular changes, availability is definitely going to be a problem. The cost of producing red meat in water alone is astronomical, that’s without the space required to be taken up by cattle. Is the cost high? Yes. Are we at a serious risk of death by starvation because of unavailability of food? No." Agreed! Technology in the food sector is advanced and I can see a time in the not so distant future where we will understand photosynthesis to the point of being able to manipulate it to help grow plants and crops in climates they would not grow in today. The other benefit of this would be highly advanced and near perfect energy gathering from sunlight, making solar a reality. | |||
"If the ever increasing population of the world wants to continue to eat meat, then we need to find a way of creating it - cellular is one such possibility. There’s just too much demand for not enough grazing land. Or plant based is going to be the future (not in our lifetime, same with cellular). “By 2050, the global population is expected to hit 10 billion people. This means that – to feed everyone – it will take 56 per cent more food than is produced in the world today, according to the United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP)” https://www.un.org/en/chronicle/article/feeding-world-sustainably " From the UNEP website: "The United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) is the leading global authority on the environment. The UNEP is driving transformational change by drilling down on the root causes of the triple planetary crisis of climate change, nature and biodiversity loss and pollution." After reading just these two paragraphs, everything they say has to be the truth! | |||
"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia. There isn’t enough land for sustainable farming at current growth rates. If we lose farming land in Europe, we’re even more fucked. We, the people need to change our habits. This is pretty much the doomsday theory that was peddled in 1980s about how there won't be enough food for the population in 2000. With the help of research, we managed to increase crop yield massively. I don't think availability of food is a problem unless we are talking about climate change which might hit agriculture. The problem is with political issues which rise because a country is dependent on others for basic needs. Unless demand for red meat in particular changes, availability is definitely going to be a problem. The cost of producing red meat in water alone is astronomical, that’s without the space required to be taken up by cattle. Is the cost high? Yes. Are we at a serious risk of death by starvation because of unavailability of food? No. Agreed! Technology in the food sector is advanced and I can see a time in the not so distant future where we will understand photosynthesis to the point of being able to manipulate it to help grow plants and crops in climates they would not grow in today. The other benefit of this would be highly advanced and near perfect energy gathering from sunlight, making solar a reality." 
It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost.
The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids." What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know  | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know "My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI! Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household! You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss! | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
"I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’. We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc. Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it. | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’.
We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc.
Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it."I have told you, recreating photosynthesis and manipulating its near perfect sunlight to energy conversion. 100% free and nearly 100% efficient. | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’.
We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc.
Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it.
I have told you, recreating photosynthesis and manipulating its near perfect sunlight to energy conversion. 100% free and nearly 100% efficient. "And I’m talking in broader terms about energy usage. I thought that much was obvious. | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’.
We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc.
Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it.
I have told you, recreating photosynthesis and manipulating its near perfect sunlight to energy conversion. 100% free and nearly 100% efficient.
And I’m talking in broader terms about energy usage. I thought that much was obvious."So am I, keep up | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’.
We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc.
Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it."But with your economics head on now, are we moving away from oil and coal, say? Does the data support your assertion? | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know
My goodness more free stuff to add to the UBI!
Maybe the government can thrown in a free Tesla for every household!
You are making Corbyn sound like Liz Truss!
I’m sorry, I don’t recall using the word ‘free’.
We subsidise all kinds of stuff when it suits, failing businesses, privatised railways, etc.
Since we know that we’re going to have to move away from petroleum no matter what a minority of numbskulls think, we should probably start thinking about how we’re going to do it.
But with your economics head on now, are we moving away from oil and coal, say?
Does the data support your assertion?"We will move away from oil and coal (and should have made a more concerted effort years ago). My economics head says we’ve missed the boat in an industry in which we could have been a world leader. Now we’re playing catch-up, but it’s inevitable that we move to renewables within the next century. | |||
" It would be nice if people can stop with their doomsday prophecies and control their urge to find overnight solutions to everything. Some of my friends in India installed solar power in their houses recently and apparently it's good enough to cover all their energy needs. They even bought electric mopeds now which is completely charged at free of cost. The original reason they went for solar power was that they were having power outages for at least 4 hours every day. As solar gets cheaper, I can see plenty of people in India going for it as it is cheaper and makes them independent of the terrible state operated electric grids. What we need is more people to think like your friends. And maybe in order to encourage this, governments could subsidise the purchase of renewable energy equipment. Mayhap we could even see government leading the way and plotting a future leading towards wholesale use of renewables, not just solar, but tidal, hydroelectric and wind too, backed up by some nuclear energy where demand outstripped renewable supply until renewables are efficient enough for full coverage 24/7. Crazy thinkin, I know "My friends in India bought solar power themselves because the government was bad at their job. Electricity supply is provided by government for cost in India and many places suffer from frequent power cuts. I mean that's one nice way to get people to do it :?-?P I am fine with governments providing subsidies like you said, to nudge people in the direction. If you want people to do things like buying electric cars, getting solar power or eating plant based food, you should have better arguments than altruism. If installing solar panels is cheap enough to provide good returns in investment, people will do it. If plant based food tastes as good as meat and provides same nutritional value, people would eat it. If electric cars are as cheap as ICE cars and the owning experience is same, then people would do buy more of them. | |||
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"It’s hard to believe how little media coverage this is getting " Not really. | |||
"It’s hard to believe how little media coverage this is getting " I wonder if it's because it's not quite clear what they are protesting for. | |||
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"It’s hard to believe how little media coverage this is getting " Yes, it is strange how the mainstream media isnt covering it, one have to look elsewhere, to see what the latest is about it. | |||
"It’s hard to believe how little media coverage this is getting Yes, it is strange how the mainstream media isnt covering it, one have to look elsewhere, to see what the latest is about it." It is strange that other self employed business people get more attention in the msm, ie two wheeled takeaway delivery drivers. | |||
"It’s hard to believe how little media coverage this is getting Yes, it is strange how the mainstream media isnt covering it, one have to look elsewhere, to see what the latest is about it. It is strange that other self employed business people get more attention in the msm, ie two wheeled takeaway delivery drivers. "Yes, it is strange that, as the farmers strike is a bigger news, that they should cover too. | |||
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" It seems to only happen in the west and in the usa they are buying up farm land, there is a saying "when you control the food, you control the people" What is your view of it?" I think you’re seeing conspiracies in an area perfectly explicable by incompetence and/or indifference. We do need to grow food here, but primarily for reasons of national resilience - an area where recent governments (of all flavours) seem to really not give a crap. | |||
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"What's happening is globalisation of markets. If you are producing something which some other country can produce for much cheaper, you won't be able to survive the competition. Farmers in Europe have ended up facing massive rise in cost of production because of inflation that they aren't able to compete with farmers outside the country. From a globalisation perspective, it's a good thing because farmers in Europe can use the land for some other purposes and people can be fed by the rest of the world. From a political perspective, it's a major risk. If you are depending on other countries for basic needs like food and energy, you are shooting yourself on your foot because you will be caught with your pants down if you there is a political conflict with any of those countries, just like how Germany was fucked because of too much reliance on Russia." So you’re happy to eat food that’s been grown/produced using products that are banned in this country? Farmers have no problem with globalisation of production, but they do have problems with being made to compete with both hands tied behind their back in terms of higher regulations, inspections, lack of being able to use certain products as the govts deem them unsuitable but are happy to import stuff that’s grown with them. And that’s all before the latest ‘greening’ schemes that have to be implemented which other countries don’t have | |||
"We are seeing the farmers striking all over europe, in countries like, italy, spain, romania, poland, greece, germany, portugal and the netherlands, but the most dramatic ones that are being covered is the ones in france and in brussels. Is it just me or does it feel like that there is a global agenda of the dismantling of agriculture? It seems to only happen in the west and in the usa they are buying up farm land, there is a saying "when you control the food, you control the people" What is your view of it?" Yes you are correct, yes that's what's happening and it's controlled by huge corporations who seek this control. Weak governments roll over to it as they are weak, don't possess the bollocks to push back and support freedom, choice, the right to self determination, business decision making that's good for you and not others, etc etc. These are mostly values of the right wing of politics and form the basis of why farmers vote conservative and voted for brexit. The left predominantly push corporate dominance, hammer local business people due to politics of envy and favour state control etc .. the current farmer protests are about all these things. Attacking old businesses for doing what they've done for generations producing food and forcing draconian eco mentalist policies on rural communities because so many urban dwellers just don't understand the ways of agriculture. Huge corporations let's say pharma who have developed GMO crop solutions that you can only take advantage of if you deal exclusively with them, thereby seeking to establish a cartel and destroys the perfect oligopoly that farming is traditionally all over the world that has managed to feed an expanding population. Corporations hate this .. they seek to force tech, convince gov of the benefits and convenience, pull the wool over the populations eyes, and end up taking choice away, creating a marketplace where they are huge, dominant and controlling the prices such that they are the only ones that prosper. The climate policies are just the latest element of what WEF have been pushing. This is what's happening, farmers can see it, others as yet are blind to it and sucked in by modernism. | |||
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"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. " Is that figure per quarter. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Is that figure per quarter." £94.24 per acre a year 0.02p per sqm a year Provided you meet new conditions. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. " Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem." Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control." "Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem." "Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape " Odd that you posted that part of the Guardian article, but you didn't post the bit that said "However, British farmers welcomed the change as it gives them an advantage over foreign producers in the domestic market". | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem. Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape Odd that you posted that part of the Guardian article, but you didn't post the bit that said "However, British farmers welcomed the change as it gives them an advantage over foreign producers in the domestic market"." Can you point me to that part, which I must have missed Guardian Article “Brexit has cost UK food companies exporting to EU an extra £170m” Author Jack Simpson Wed 21 Feb 2024 05.00 GMT You’ll have to look it up, four forum bans for posting links referencing statements, tedious. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control." "Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem." "Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape" "Odd that you posted that part of the Guardian article, but you didn't post the bit that said "However, British farmers welcomed the change as it gives them an advantage over foreign producers in the domestic market"." "Can you point me to that part, which I must have missed Guardian Article “Brexit has cost UK food companies exporting to EU an extra £170m” Author Jack Simpson Wed 21 Feb 2024 05.00 GMT You’ll have to look it up, four forum bans for posting links referencing statements, tedious." Here you go: https://theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/21/uk-food-firms-exporting-eu-brexit-red-tape It's the 5th paragraph up from the bottom of the article (not including the correction). I'm at a loss to see how you could have missed it. Oh, and no one gets banned for posting links to mainstream media websites. The forum rules explicitly allow it. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem. Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape " This is directly due to the EU making it unreasonably difficult because we voted democratically to leave and it's a thorn in the side of the EU. We can't be seen to make a success if it or it's open season on the rest leaving and the break up of the whole thing. (Writing has been on the wall for years) we didn't mind being part of the trading block, but the EU were told constantly by successive UK governments, our civil service, unions, trade organizations, from the UK, and other EU countries that they must cut red tape bureaucracy and meddling in the affairs of farmers. David Cameron told them if they didn't there would be a referendum, and all these people were proven right. You are missing the point about brexit. These experts have found increased costs in dealing with the EU .. But we have signed numerous trade deals with the rest of the world that have none of these costs imposed on them. So these experts should seek to find customers that aren't in the EU. These costs are imposed by the EU as punishment not the UK. Brexit needed to happen, and 100pc of farmers would vote for it again tomorrow. If you don't accept that you don't know the subject in the agricultural context well enough quite frankly. | |||
"There is a global agenda. The elites are a tiny group and the poor get ever larger. They need control and the best form of control is to control not just fuel but the very food people need. Who's buying farmland when farmers go bust? Those are the wankers that need to face a noose or chop." . I'll help you haul em up | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem. Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape This is directly due to the EU making it unreasonably difficult because we voted democratically to leave and it's a thorn in the side of the EU. We can't be seen to make a success if it or it's open season on the rest leaving and the break up of the whole thing. (Writing has been on the wall for years) we didn't mind being part of the trading block, but the EU were told constantly by successive UK governments, our civil service, unions, trade organizations, from the UK, and other EU countries that they must cut red tape bureaucracy and meddling in the affairs of farmers. David Cameron told them if they didn't there would be a referendum, and all these people were proven right. You are missing the point about brexit. These experts have found increased costs in dealing with the EU .. But we have signed numerous trade deals with the rest of the world that have none of these costs imposed on them. So these experts should seek to find customers that aren't in the EU. These costs are imposed by the EU as punishment not the UK. Brexit needed to happen, and 100pc of farmers would vote for it again tomorrow. If you don't accept that you don't know the subject in the agricultural context well enough quite frankly. " As of May 2023, the United Kingdom has 38 active free trade agreements with nations and trade blocs, covering 99 countries and territories. FIVE of these are 'NEW’ trade agreements, such as with Australia and New Zealand. The remaining 33 are continuity agreements | |||
"There is a global agenda. The elites are a tiny group and the poor get ever larger. They need control and the best form of control is to control not just fuel but the very food people need. Who's buying farmland when farmers go bust? Those are the wankers that need to face a noose or chop.. I'll help you haul em up "Me too. Because it's corporations. Massive companies. Making so much money from us all because they operate in a cartel. They don't even need to make profit from farming it's simply a tax evasion cash sink. Profit averaging on a huge scale. A lot of this should be disallowed. So many 'continuity agreements' then, so we are trading successfully with the EU still then, despite Brexit .. | |||
"Welsh government have introduced the new single payments scheme, farmers will receive £94.24 per acre, on condition they have to prove 10% of their land is woodland and 10% of it is quality habitat for wildlife These were not conditions of the EU payments scheme More rules for taking back control. Fewer rules, since UK farmers no longer have to comply with the EU regulations of the Common Agricultural Policy. Farmers in the EU are currently protesting about the high level of red tape in the CAP, where UK farmers no longer have that problem. Laughable “In the past 12 months alone, exporters have paid more than £58m. The extra costs have resulted in a sharp fall in exports, particularly among smaller producers, with the value of meat products sent to the EU down by 17% since 2019” Talk to them about post Brest export red tape This is directly due to the EU making it unreasonably difficult because we voted democratically to leave and it's a thorn in the side of the EU. We can't be seen to make a success if it or it's open season on the rest leaving and the break up of the whole thing. (Writing has been on the wall for years) we didn't mind being part of the trading block, but the EU were told constantly by successive UK governments, our civil service, unions, trade organizations, from the UK, and other EU countries that they must cut red tape bureaucracy and meddling in the affairs of farmers. David Cameron told them if they didn't there would be a referendum, and all these people were proven right. You are missing the point about brexit. These experts have found increased costs in dealing with the EU .. But we have signed numerous trade deals with the rest of the world that have none of these costs imposed on them. So these experts should seek to find customers that aren't in the EU. These costs are imposed by the EU as punishment not the UK. Brexit needed to happen, and 100pc of farmers would vote for it again tomorrow. If you don't accept that you don't know the subject in the agricultural context well enough quite frankly. " what's an example of unreasonably difficult ? | |||
" Brexit needed to happen, and 100pc of farmers would vote for it again tomorrow. If you don't accept that you don't know the subject in the agricultural context well enough quite frankly. " https://www.fwi.co.uk/news/eu-referendum/analysis-7-years-after-brexit-farmers-count-the-cost#:~:text=According%20to%20the%20survey%2C%20some,rape%20growers%20felt%20that%20way. | |||
