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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds. "
So would have left them both in Russia when you can get one home? Not even the family of Paul whelan are saying that!
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"If she was definitely carrying cannabis oil then she deserves everything she got definitely not worth trading to her for that animal "
You may well have extensive knowledge on the legal and circumstantial issues here. You also may not.
The judge who tried Bout said on Newsnight that the sentence was excessive but there was a mandated one with no flexibility. This is a country where mentally ill people buying weapons is okay and children getting shot at school doesn't automatically lead to changes in gun laws. She also thought that the trade was probably reasonable considering that he had no value to the USA or to the illegal arms trade.
From Griner's perspective it was certainly stupid taking an illegal narcotic anywhere, let alone to Russia. However, it is hardly international drug smuggling and clearly done to have a hostage to trade. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds. "
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration."
young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"If she was definitely carrying cannabis oil then she deserves everything she got definitely not worth trading to her for that animal
You may well have extensive knowledge on the legal and circumstantial issues here. You also may not.
The judge who tried Bout said on Newsnight that the sentence was excessive but there was a mandated one with no flexibility. This is a country where mentally ill people buying weapons is okay and children getting shot at school doesn't automatically lead to changes in gun laws. She also thought that the trade was probably reasonable considering that he had no value to the USA or to the illegal arms trade.
From Griner's perspective it was certainly stupid taking an illegal narcotic anywhere, let alone to Russia. However, it is hardly international drug smuggling and clearly done to have a hostage to trade."
Gun control lol we just released one of the prolific arms dealers on the planet. Ironic your statement is. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration.young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport "
I didn't disagree with you on respecting the laws of any country you visit, did I?
It's illegal in the US too.
However, this was deliberately done to bl@ckmail the USA wasn't it? Do you really believe otherwise?
It's not a question of legality, it's geopolitics.
Is there a reason you think that there is a simple conclusion to a complex problem? Why wouldn't Russia keep collecting American citizens for minor or imaginary infractions until they get what they want? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"If she was definitely carrying cannabis oil then she deserves everything she got definitely not worth trading to her for that animal
You may well have extensive knowledge on the legal and circumstantial issues here. You also may not.
The judge who tried Bout said on Newsnight that the sentence was excessive but there was a mandated one with no flexibility. This is a country where mentally ill people buying weapons is okay and children getting shot at school doesn't automatically lead to changes in gun laws. She also thought that the trade was probably reasonable considering that he had no value to the USA or to the illegal arms trade.
From Griner's perspective it was certainly stupid taking an illegal narcotic anywhere, let alone to Russia. However, it is hardly international drug smuggling and clearly done to have a hostage to trade. Gun control lol we just released one of the prolific arms dealers on the planet. Ironic your statement is."
You've missed the point, completely. You only ever seen to read what confirms your own views or biases.
I agree. You don't care about gun control so releasing a has-been arm's dealer in exchange for a young person who is a US citizen should be a no-brainer. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration.young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport
I didn't disagree with you on respecting the laws of any country you visit, did I?
It's illegal in the US too.
However, this was deliberately done to bl@ckmail the USA wasn't it? Do you really believe otherwise?
It's not a question of legality, it's geopolitics.
Is there a reason you think that there is a simple conclusion to a complex problem? Why wouldn't Russia keep collecting American citizens for minor or imaginary infractions until they get what they want?"
like I've said if she really was carrying it no excuse I'd even lock her up when back home to America for trafficking. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration.young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport
I didn't disagree with you on respecting the laws of any country you visit, did I?
It's illegal in the US too.
However, this was deliberately done to bl@ckmail the USA wasn't it? Do you really believe otherwise?
It's not a question of legality, it's geopolitics.
Is there a reason you think that there is a simple conclusion to a complex problem? Why wouldn't Russia keep collecting American citizens for minor or imaginary infractions until they get what they want? like I've said if she really was carrying it no excuse I'd even lock her up when back home to America for trafficking."
Was she "trafficking"? Was she intending to supply it to anybody? She was leaving the country when she was detained.
Was she arrested simply because she broke the law or because it was politically useful for Russia? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Surely we could of made a better deal and got a man that enlisted to protect our country out instead of a basketball player  "
Does that person exist?
Do you not try to get your hostages back unless they are serving for the military? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration.young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport
I didn't disagree with you on respecting the laws of any country you visit, did I?
It's illegal in the US too.
However, this was deliberately done to bl@ckmail the USA wasn't it? Do you really believe otherwise?
It's not a question of legality, it's geopolitics.
Is there a reason you think that there is a simple conclusion to a complex problem? Why wouldn't Russia keep collecting American citizens for minor or imaginary infractions until they get what they want? like I've said if she really was carrying it no excuse I'd even lock her up when back home to America for trafficking."
Trafficking? |
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A life for a life look at it that way.
But no two words about it. Russia got the better deal.
His expertise in procuring arms on a global market is going to pay dividends for the war in Ukraine.
Bad deal for the people of Ukraine. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"A life for a life look at it that way.
But no two words about it. Russia got the better deal.
His expertise in procuring arms on a global market is going to pay dividends for the war in Ukraine.
Bad deal for the people of Ukraine. "
I am sure Russia weren’t having any problem buying arms before he was released |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"A life for a life look at it that way.
But no two words about it. Russia got the better deal.
His expertise in procuring arms on a global market is going to pay dividends for the war in Ukraine.
Bad deal for the people of Ukraine. "
Really? What "expertise" does he have in procuring arms on a national scale that Russia doesn't possess, do you think? Does he have better links to the Chinese or Iranian state than the Russian government? They don't need to wander around illegal arms fairs to buy a couple of hundred Kalashnikovs. They need to supply an actual army.
They wanted him because he's one of Putin's drinking buddies. |
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"A life for a life look at it that way.
But no two words about it. Russia got the better deal.
His expertise in procuring arms on a global market is going to pay dividends for the war in Ukraine.
Bad deal for the people of Ukraine.
Really? What "expertise" does he have in procuring arms on a national scale that Russia doesn't possess, do you think? Does he have better links to the Chinese or Iranian state than the Russian government? They don't need to wander around illegal arms fairs to buy a couple of hundred Kalashnikovs. They need to supply an actual army.
They wanted him because he's one of Putin's drinking buddies."
He is a brilliant logistician. I am sure he can orchestrate the movement of articles from countries under sanction with greater ease and a layer of deniability for all concerned.
All conjecture by myself of course like them wanting him to be Putins drinking buddy. He could of course put his feet up and enjoy his retirement getting pissed at Putins Dacha for all I know.
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By *estivalMan
over a year ago
borehamwood |
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds. "
merchant of death pmsl bout wasnt any different to uk or us arms dealers, only reason your lot locked him up is he was selling weapons to people the u.s goverment didnt like him selling to, hes no more a merchant of death than ratheon or BEA systems
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"A life for a life look at it that way.
But no two words about it. Russia got the better deal.
His expertise in procuring arms on a global market is going to pay dividends for the war in Ukraine.
Bad deal for the people of Ukraine.
Really? What "expertise" does he have in procuring arms on a national scale that Russia doesn't possess, do you think? Does he have better links to the Chinese or Iranian state than the Russian government? They don't need to wander around illegal arms fairs to buy a couple of hundred Kalashnikovs. They need to supply an actual army.
They wanted him because he's one of Putin's drinking buddies.
He is a brilliant logistician. I am sure he can orchestrate the movement of articles from countries under sanction with greater ease and a layer of deniability for all concerned.
All conjecture by myself of course like them wanting him to be Putins drinking buddy. He could of course put his feet up and enjoy his retirement getting pissed at Putins Dacha for all I know.
"
"Brilliant logistician"?
Russia is perfectly capable of finding ways of sanctions busting without expending political capital on this guy. You've read about their shadow tanker fleet, right?
"Putin and the generals were worried that Viktor Bout might start providing detailed and consistent evidence of what he knew about Russian intelligence helping terrorist organisations and organising sabotage abroad,"...
"It was a matter of honour for them to take their agent back."
However, the US Bring Our Families Home Campaign suggested Russians saw Bout in a very different light. "Over the years they built him up like the spy of the century. There's a domestic political problem in Russia to keep the lie going,"
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63905112 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"We traded the merchant of death for a athlete...This administration lost their minds.
No. They protected your own.
They traded a has-been for someone young with a future.
Realpolitik is what it is and Russia would continue to collect American hostages until they got the right person. Equally for a Republican as for a Democratic administration.young future sorry drug trafficker if the country you are visiting doesn't allow something doesn't matter that you don't agree there country there rules I'd definitely not let her back into sport
I didn't disagree with you on respecting the laws of any country you visit, did I?
It's illegal in the US too.
However, this was deliberately done to bl@ckmail the USA wasn't it? Do you really believe otherwise?
It's not a question of legality, it's geopolitics.
Is there a reason you think that there is a simple conclusion to a complex problem? Why wouldn't Russia keep collecting American citizens for minor or imaginary infractions until they get what they want? like I've said if she really was carrying it no excuse I'd even lock her up when back home to America for trafficking.yes trafficking if court with any illegal stuff be it personal or intended to be moved on whilst moving from one place to another it's classed as trafficking what would you say?
Trafficking? "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The BB player had a small personal supply of cannabis oil (Google it) - hardly a drugs dealer - she's simply been used as a politcal pawn.
"
still her fault no matter how small |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"The BB player had a small personal supply of cannabis oil (Google it) - hardly a drugs dealer - she's simply been used as a politcal pawn.
still her fault no matter how small "
It's her fault that Russia wanted her as a political pawn?
Was she actually "trafficking" cannabis oil?
Do you think she was arrested and held because she had a small quantity of cannabis oil or because she was politically useful?
Why would you avoid answering those straightforward (non-trick) questions? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
Trafficking
"the act of buying or selling goods illegally"
Did she buy or sell any cannabis oil in Russia?
If not, then she was not trafficking or smuggling.
Yes possession of cannabis oil is illegal in Russia, but that is what she is guilty of. Correct?
She is not a drugs dealer, is she? Why would you wish to imply that she is? |
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"Did she buy or sell any cannabis oil in Russia?
If not, then she was not trafficking or smuggling."
If she didn't buy the cannabis oil in Russia, then she must have brought it in from the USA, which is definitely snuggling. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"Did she buy or sell any cannabis oil in Russia?
If not, then she was not trafficking or smuggling.
If she didn't buy the cannabis oil in Russia, then she must have brought it in from the USA, which is definitely snuggling."
Basically she had a vape pen with less than a gram of cbd cannabis oil in it…. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Did she buy or sell any cannabis oil in Russia?
If not, then she was not trafficking or smuggling.
If she didn't buy the cannabis oil in Russia, then she must have brought it in from the USA, which is definitely snuggling."
"Smuggling" for what purpose? |
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"Did she buy or sell any cannabis oil in Russia?
If not, then she was not trafficking or smuggling."
"If she didn't buy the cannabis oil in Russia, then she must have brought it in from the USA, which is definitely snuggling."
""Smuggling" for what purpose?"
Presumably the Russians think that she smuggled it in for her own use, otherwise they would have charged her with 'traffiking' as well.
But bringing it in for your own use doesn't stop it from being smuggling. |
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