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The current global financial system
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By *appyPanda OP Man
over a year ago
Kilkenny, but Dublin is more fun |
I know I'm autistic and struggle to comprehend social constructs but why do folk still not realise that money as a concept isn't something absolute?
Since the expansion of the financial system in the 70s, it's continued on a crazy path til where it is now where it's become so utterly focused on the collection of huge unfathomable levels of new imaginary wealth, focused on these billions and trillions of dollars/pounds based on pure speculation far more than the real amounts normal people have or worry about. Is it time to throw it all away and start fresh?
Sure only about 5-10% of the money in the world at this point is actual physical cash. It's kind of like a shared delusion where new money in the system is created by encouraging people to go into debt, and with that foreseen future capital, they can loan out more and more, and this continues til nearly everyone is in debt thinking it's perfectly fine and we have bankers saying things are great because on the books that describe this fantasy world, things seem great even while normal folk are trapped by financial insecurity and stressed out as things get more and more expensive because $1 is now more like $0.50 in comparison to a few decades ago.
Sorry for the little nonsensical ramble. The whole thing confuses me seeing it at the bare bones, while also seeing people taking this pure fantasy concept at this point as something immovably concrete, thinking inflation is all some external factor. |
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By *appyPanda OP Man
over a year ago
Kilkenny, but Dublin is more fun |
"I know I'm autistic and struggle to comprehend social constructs but why do folk still not realise that money as a concept isn't something absolute?
Since the expansion of the financial system in the 70s, it's continued on a crazy path til where it is now where it's become so utterly focused on the collection of huge unfathomable levels of new imaginary wealth, focused on these billions and trillions of dollars/pounds based on pure speculation far more than the real amounts normal people have or worry about. Is it time to throw it all away and start fresh?
Sure only about 5-10% of the money in the world at this point is actual physical cash. It's kind of like a shared delusion where new money in the system is created by encouraging people to go into debt, and with that foreseen future capital, they can loan out more and more, and this continues til nearly everyone is in debt thinking it's perfectly fine and we have bankers saying things are great because on the books that describe this fantasy world, things seem great even while normal folk are trapped by financial insecurity and stressed out as things get more and more expensive because $1 is now more like $0.50 in comparison to a few decades ago.
Sorry for the little nonsensical ramble. The whole thing confuses me seeing it at the bare bones, while also seeing people taking this pure fantasy concept at this point as something immovably concrete, thinking inflation is all some external factor."
And while I don't hate billionaires for simply being billionaires, I just can't make sense of a system of our own creation that has so many new billionaires appearing every year while most people struggle more financially that their parents did. For the most part, billionaires seem to be billionaires simply because we believe them to be with so much of that "wealth" based on nothing but how they're perceived. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
I miss the times when millionaires/billionaires wanted to leave a legacy that benefitted society as a whole, libraries, museums, galleries, charitable foundations aimed at improving the lives of the poor and working class. You know, genuine altruism rather than pure vanity projects (that may also generate further wealth). |
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By *appyPanda OP Man
over a year ago
Kilkenny, but Dublin is more fun |
"I miss the times when millionaires/billionaires wanted to leave a legacy that benefitted society as a whole, libraries, museums, galleries, charitable foundations aimed at improving the lives of the poor and working class. You know, genuine altruism rather than pure vanity projects (that may also generate further wealth). "
Same. Now so much of it is a fierce competition with other billionaires to see who can amass the most imaginary wealth that they could never possibly hope to spend.
I generally do think the financial system as we know it lost the plot completely since focusing on these crazy amounts, seeing them as an utter success, not really caring at all too much that real world wealth for most people has gone down drastically.
Also irritated that housing became an extension of this bat shit crazy system and with so many folk jumping into this idea if houses being "investments", costs for them have gone up like crazy too. |
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Yes it would be nice if some of the super wealthy did invest in the greater good wouldn’t it! There are exceptions like Soros and Gates but when you have people like Musk and Bezos in the world you have to ask yourself what would it take for things to change? |
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By *appyPanda OP Man
over a year ago
Kilkenny, but Dublin is more fun |
"Yes it would be nice if some of the super wealthy did invest in the greater good wouldn’t it! There are exceptions like Soros and Gates but when you have people like Musk and Bezos in the world you have to ask yourself what would it take for things to change?"
I get where you're coming from but I'm not saying that billionaires should just spend their money more on good causes. I'm saying that our concept of money has been hugely distorted and we've gotten lost in this little fantasy world of ours.
Money as we know it started out as a simplification of the bartering process but we allowed this concept of our own imagining to become such an all encompassing entity in itself and now our system is built upon making more and more unfathomable levels of money appear while the actual value of what normal people has gone down in comparison to decades past. |
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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago
Terra Firma |
"Yes it would be nice if some of the super wealthy did invest in the greater good wouldn’t it! There are exceptions like Soros and Gates but when you have people like Musk and Bezos in the world you have to ask yourself what would it take for things to change?
I get where you're coming from but I'm not saying that billionaires should just spend their money more on good causes. I'm saying that our concept of money has been hugely distorted and we've gotten lost in this little fantasy world of ours.
Money as we know it started out as a simplification of the bartering process but we allowed this concept of our own imagining to become such an all encompassing entity in itself and now our system is built upon making more and more unfathomable levels of money appear while the actual value of what normal people has gone down in comparison to decades past."
With choice comes greed, the more you have the greater the choice.
Money is the answer to bartering as in it gives everyone a chance to partake, your items or time that were being bartered, now have a local and global scale of value in money.
I think the trading and manipulation of money by the markets, will always confuse us, it is meant to! |
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By *JB1954Man
over a year ago
Reading |
A thought about billionaires . Such as Elon Musk. Does he have billions of pounds in his bank account / accounts . Most I would think is in his ownership of companies and their perceived value on stock exchange. My point he raised the money from equity and banks to buy Twitter. So not cash . |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"A thought about billionaires . Such as Elon Musk. Does he have billions of pounds in his bank account / accounts . Most I would think is in his ownership of companies and their perceived value on stock exchange. My point he raised the money from equity and banks to buy Twitter. So not cash . "
I *think* that is the point of the thread. So much “wealth” is theoretical or “paper wealth” rather than actual money and physical asset based wealth.
Elon Musk most certainly does not have c.$200 billion sitting in a bank vault somewhere. His wealth is calculated by his shareholdings in companies whose values are dictated by traders buying/selling shares who determine the value of each share based on expected future performance of the company.
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By *appyPanda OP Man
over a year ago
Kilkenny, but Dublin is more fun |
"Yes it would be nice if some of the super wealthy did invest in the greater good wouldn’t it! There are exceptions like Soros and Gates but when you have people like Musk and Bezos in the world you have to ask yourself what would it take for things to change?
I get where you're coming from but I'm not saying that billionaires should just spend their money more on good causes. I'm saying that our concept of money has been hugely distorted and we've gotten lost in this little fantasy world of ours.
Money as we know it started out as a simplification of the bartering process but we allowed this concept of our own imagining to become such an all encompassing entity in itself and now our system is built upon making more and more unfathomable levels of money appear while the actual value of what normal people has gone down in comparison to decades past.
With choice comes greed, the more you have the greater the choice.
Money is the answer to bartering as in it gives everyone a chance to partake, your items or time that were being bartered, now have a local and global scale of value in money.
I think the trading and manipulation of money by the markets, will always confuse us, it is meant to! "
Exactly. If only we could detach the "money" that real people use from the huge imaginary amounts the markets and those who engineer the system obsess over with it being so utterly based on speculation and built from debt.
Money is intrinsically worthless apart from the value that we perceive it to be, and you give it to some alien visitor, they're not going to care about it. With how much the system it's expanded, the amounts that normal people stress over is absolutely insignificant in comparison to what those in power make or think about.
That's why I genuinely think we need to bring it back to the drawing board so it can work for us, and not have us suffering due to the speculative errors those obsessed over millions and billions make. |
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By *JB1954Man
over a year ago
Reading |
"A thought about billionaires . Such as Elon Musk. Does he have billions of pounds in his bank account / accounts . Most I would think is in his ownership of companies and their perceived value on stock exchange. My point he raised the money from equity and banks to buy Twitter. So not cash .
I *think* that is the point of the thread. So much “wealth” is theoretical or “paper wealth” rather than actual money and physical asset based wealth.
Elon Musk most certainly does not have c.$200 billion sitting in a bank vault somewhere. His wealth is calculated by his shareholdings in companies whose values are dictated by traders buying/selling shares who determine the value of each share based on expected future performance of the company.
"
Before I retired. The company I worked for was owned by a billionaire / family , plus a couple of investors. He tried to buy out a very large company . Which did not happen . The banks who at that point loaning the money called in their debts. He lost millions . So much that the banks had to take over the companies . He actually took his own life when informed no longer would be allowed to run company. |
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"It's kind of like a shared delusion where new money in the system is created by encouraging people to go into debt, and with that foreseen future capital, they can loan out more and more, and this continues til nearly everyone is in debt thinking it's perfectly fine and we have bankers saying things are great because on the books that describe this fantasy world, things seem great even while normal folk are trapped by financial insecurity and stressed out as things get more and more expensive because $1 is now more like $0.50 in comparison to a few decades ago."
You've almost hit the nail on the head.
It is about coercion and control. That is what these systems are engineered for at a fundamental level.
So imagine my tribe of cave people encounter your tribe. We have an abundance of resources in "Happy Valley". You are nomadic and wander. But you have better warriors than us.
Your tribe have 2 choices. Fight us for our resources, or we trade things you want without the bloodshed. The easy route is the best route for both parties.
Of course, we don't know if you will renege on the deal, so it makes sense to build in "protections". Our job is to make ourselves desirable trade partners, and thus our commoditisation of our resource comes with attached strings. That's coercion and control.
Money is just an extension of that. Perhaps we only accept blue seashells for the trade, and we control access to them. That puts in a favourable position against a much stronger competitor.
If we can somehow manipulate the supply of blue seashells, we can deepen your reliance on us because of uncertainty and protect our interests further.
And as a warrior tribe, we need to ensure you are never in a position to threaten us should you change your mind. You can play strong.
We have to play crafty.
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