Just a thought but if John Bercow was still the Speaker would half of the shit Boris has done happened? Is his successor wary of confrontation given that Boris refused to give Bercow a place in the Lords? It seems to me that love him or loathe him Bercow was a believer in Parliamentary Democracy and would not have been afraid to stand up to Boris and his cronies |
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Exactly. And this is why they could not be just content with Bercow being gone, they had to totally destroy him. I actually couldn't think of a finer person to be the next prime minister, someone that would have the principle to take a flamethrower to the cancer that has spread throughout the entire governance process during Johnson's time. |
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"Exactly. And this is why they could not be just content with Bercow being gone, they had to totally destroy him. I actually couldn't think of a finer person to be the next prime minister, someone that would have the principle to take a flamethrower to the cancer that has spread throughout the entire governance process during Johnson's time."
Your posts are always so refreshing Polly, it’s good to know  |
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"Lyndsey Hoyle has called the government out several times from the speakers chair for not informing parliament before the press, not sure what else he can do in his position..
"
I do see that but I feel he is rather like the nice schoolteacher in that he plays so fair that he undermines his own position at times. Having said that any speaker trying to contain Boris and his accomplices would find it a struggle but I just feel Bercow would have been better at the job which is why Boris got rid of him! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line. None of these people have our interests at heart. |
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"No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line. None of these people have our interests at heart."
Do you have examples or is that just an opinion? |
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"Lyndsey Hoyle has called the government out several times from the speakers chair for not informing parliament before the press, not sure what else he can do in his position..
I do see that but I feel he is rather like the nice schoolteacher in that he plays so fair that he undermines his own position at times. Having said that any speaker trying to contain Boris and his accomplices would find it a struggle but I just feel Bercow would have been better at the job which is why Boris got rid of him!"
One thing that frustrates is the continuous lying that Boris has done from the despatch box, he's streets ahead of any other person in that position but whether it's the arcane rules of that place that such things go unchecked in the actual chamber or because of something else I don't know..
It's part of the reason why the level of apathy and disengagement is as high as it is.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line. None of these people have our interests at heart.
Do you have examples or is that just an opinion?"
There were hundreds of examples, you merely had to watch the Television!
Democracy meant nothing to Bercow! |
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By *oo hotCouple
over a year ago
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"No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line. None of these people have our interests at heart.
Do you have examples or is that just an opinion?
There were hundreds of examples, you merely had to watch the Television!
Democracy meant nothing to Bercow! "
So you can’t give any examples then?
Adhering to Parliamentary protocol is the very heart of our democracy and Bercow insisted that this was followed to the letter.
As was said most eloquently yesterday by a well known broadcast journalist, “democracy and honesty are inter-dependent and you can’t have one without the other.”
Bercow critics preferred lying to get their own way and they drove a horse and cart through parliamentary protocols.
Lying to get your way is not democratic. |
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"No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line."
"Do you have examples or is that just an opinion?"
"There were hundreds of examples, you merely had to watch the Television!"
"So you can’t give any examples then?
Adhering to Parliamentary protocol is the very heart of our democracy and Bercow insisted that this was followed to the letter."
Well there was that time that Bercow allowed a vote on a cross party amendment, in defiance of commons rules:
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jan/09/john-bercow-decision-endangers-the-office-of-speaker-and-our-democracy
There was also that other time when Bercow refused to allow a vote on an issue by saying it was too similar to one that had been voted on before, quoting a precedent which hadn't been used for a hundred years, and which he hadn't applied to a similar issue the week before:
https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/18/brexit-john-bercow-rules-out-third-meaningful-vote-on-same-deal
In addition Bercow was later found by an independent inquiry to be a liar and a bully:
https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2022/mar/08/rude-and-threatening-the-main-findings-of-the-john-bercow-bullying-inquiry
Since we have all recently decided that it is a bad idea to appoint to high office a person against whom there are recent and credible accusations of abuse, it seems that one of Boris' better decisions was to refuse to elevate Bercow to the House of Lords. |
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"No, Bercow didn't care for democracy. He was just chose actions that he thought would benefit him and his cronies down the line.
Do you have examples or is that just an opinion?
There were hundreds of examples, you merely had to watch the Television!
So you can’t give any examples then?
Adhering to Parliamentary protocol is the very heart of our democracy and Bercow insisted that this was followed to the letter.
Well there was that time that Bercow allowed a vote on a cross party amendment, in defiance of commons rules:
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/jan/09/john-bercow-decision-endangers-the-office-of-speaker-and-our-democracy
There was also that other time when Bercow refused to allow a vote on an issue by saying it was too similar to one that had been voted on before, quoting a precedent which hadn't been used for a hundred years, and which he hadn't applied to a similar issue the week before:
https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2019/mar/18/brexit-john-bercow-rules-out-third-meaningful-vote-on-same-deal
In addition Bercow was later found by an independent inquiry to be a liar and a bully:
https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2022/mar/08/rude-and-threatening-the-main-findings-of-the-john-bercow-bullying-inquiry
Since we have all recently decided that it is a bad idea to appoint to high office a person against whom there are recent and credible accusations of abuse, it seems that one of Boris' better decisions was to refuse to elevate Bercow to the House of Lords."
Oh I wouldn’t deny that at times his behaviour was overbearing and brutish but then he saw his rule as being pro-active and maintaining parliamentary control rather than sweeping up the fallout. Boris thought himself a president( emperor Nero!) and removed anyone from power that could limit his plans, point out his failings or make life complicated for him and yes he surrounded himself with a cabinet of less than bright young things whose inexperience showed in everything they attempted to do. It’s been a shower of shit for the past 3 years dominated by Brexit and COVID and now Ukraine and the cost of living crisis. God knows what’s going to happen now but the god times are well and truly over! |
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