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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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It has been mentioned on different threads a number of times so why not discuss it directly.
What would be wrong with the EU states coming together to form more than just a trading platform?
It would give greater power and security across Europe, a single army to protect the region funded centrally rather than independently by each country would make more sense, it would be little different to the US, China, Russia etc. in size, land mass etc.
It would be unlikely to happen in my lifetime but I can see it becoming reality at some time in the future.
What are the downsides? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Tighter Currency control would have to be implemented another Greece would lead to disastrous consequences
Common Fishing rights would have to be set up which could be confusing.
Administrative areas may have to be reformed as well
Armies would likely have to be integrated which could take years, navies too
Minority rights is also a massive question that will hit any Union |
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By *uietbloke67Man
over a year ago
outside your bedroom window ;-) |
"It has been mentioned on different threads a number of times so why not discuss it directly.
What would be wrong with the EU states coming together to form more than just a trading platform?
It would give greater power and security across Europe, a single army to protect the region funded centrally rather than independently by each country would make more sense, it would be little different to the US, China, Russia etc. in size, land mass etc.
It would be unlikely to happen in my lifetime but I can see it becoming reality at some time in the future.
What are the downsides?"
Inglush nationslism, clowns for eaton and yhe latter using the former to line their pockets.
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For me, the whole 'united states' idea is an anachronism. It worked well two hundred years ago when it brought broadly similar countries together, allowing them to strike trade deals, expand their reach, and defend themselves from enemies. It's clear to me that the states of North America wouldn't be anything like as powerful as they are today if they hadn't come together as the USA.
But nowadays we live in different times. We can have trade deals, and defend our collective borders without needing to politically unify under one leadership.
If we wanted to start a new empire, spreading out to dominate the world, a United States of Europe would be a good way to do it. If we just want to live happy prosperous lives, we don't need the extra layer of unnecessary governance. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"For me, the whole 'united states' idea is an anachronism. It worked well two hundred years ago when it brought broadly similar countries together, allowing them to strike trade deals, expand their reach, and defend themselves from enemies. It's clear to me that the states of North America wouldn't be anything like as powerful as they are today if they hadn't come together as the USA.
But nowadays we live in different times. We can have trade deals, and defend our collective borders without needing to politically unify under one leadership.
If we wanted to start a new empire, spreading out to dominate the world, a United States of Europe would be a good way to do it. If we just want to live happy prosperous lives, we don't need the extra layer of unnecessary governance."
To put another angle, the world is increasing small and connected. Working in isolation, without collaboration, is detrimental.
Take crime. It's increasingly across borders and will be more so as tech changes accelerate.
Also, scales is needed to pressure the huge companies that are being created. There's no way individual countries could change the way Microsoft, Facebook, Google etc work. They'd just bail on that country.
Now, this doesnt need one leader. It does need a sensible collaborative framework. And that probably needs some structure. Is this extra governance? Probably. Does it add value ... iMO it would.
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By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
Global business will eventually lead the way here.
The idea that small individual states will have the ability to push against this is just stubborn denial.
We’ve taken a huge step backward with Brexit but harsh economic reality will eventually push us closer to Europe.
The original kingdoms of England became stronger and much wealthier together as did the United Kingdom of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland.
I’m all for keeping local cultures such as Cornishmen and Welshmen etc but economics will dictate we won’t succeed alone as the U.K.
We need to wake up, embrace reality and work within the new order or just get left behind. |
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"It has been mentioned on different threads a number of times so why not discuss it directly.
What would be wrong with the EU states coming together to form more than just a trading platform?
It would give greater power and security across Europe, a single army to protect the region funded centrally rather than independently by each country would make more sense, it would be little different to the US, China, Russia etc. in size, land mass etc.
It would be unlikely to happen in my lifetime but I can see it becoming reality at some time in the future.
What are the downsides?"
None and I agree with all your points.
A single, federal super state is my dream goal. Amercia has one, China has one, and to some extent so does Russia.
That's the level of power the EU should be aspiring towards (America/China) with an national army to surpass both those nations.
The EU could make and shape the world but they are not ambitious enough, and neither are their Member Countries. Too frightened of the USA / China and Russia.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Language and the fact you cannot vote on the people in the committee who hold power. Even the USA allows folk to pick their president, though a committee whittled out who gets to run as president. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"It has been mentioned on different threads a number of times so why not discuss it directly.
What would be wrong with the EU states coming together to form more than just a trading platform?
It would give greater power and security across Europe, a single army to protect the region funded centrally rather than independently by each country would make more sense, it would be little different to the US, China, Russia etc. in size, land mass etc.
It would be unlikely to happen in my lifetime but I can see it becoming reality at some time in the future.
What are the downsides?
Inglush nationslism, clowns for eaton and yhe latter using the former to line their pockets.
"
Do you honestly think nationalism is confined to the English you really need to travel more.  |
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By *landAnnCouple
over a year ago
Inverness |
"Global business will eventually lead the way here.
The idea that small individual states will have the ability to push against this is just stubborn denial.
We’ve taken a huge step backward with Brexit but harsh economic reality will eventually push us closer to Europe.
The original kingdoms of England became stronger and much wealthier together as did the United Kingdom of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland.
I’m all for keeping local cultures such as Cornishmen and Welshmen etc but economics will dictate we won’t succeed alone as the U.K.
We need to wake up, embrace reality and work within the new order or just get left behind. "
_________
So you can understand why Scotland might want to leave the UK and join the EU..?
__________ |
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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago
Terra Firma |
I think this idea is the tip of the iceberg and it will become the united states of the world in the next 1000 years.
For humans to succeed, which will probably mean leaving or have the ability to travel off the planet, the resources of the world need to be shared into the common goal. Energy, innovation, food will become globalised, diminishing the self destruction of war. However, there will be plenty of wars to get us to the no more wars phase.
Good luck fellow time travellers  |
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By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"Global business will eventually lead the way here.
The idea that small individual states will have the ability to push against this is just stubborn denial.
We’ve taken a huge step backward with Brexit but harsh economic reality will eventually push us closer to Europe.
The original kingdoms of England became stronger and much wealthier together as did the United Kingdom of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland.
I’m all for keeping local cultures such as Cornishmen and Welshmen etc but economics will dictate we won’t succeed alone as the U.K.
We need to wake up, embrace reality and work within the new order or just get left behind.
_________
So you can understand why Scotland might want to leave the UK and join the EU..?
__________"
Indeed I can but Scotlands government needs to be better before you can even thing to do that . The SNP isn’t exactly showering it’s self in glory economically or socially. |
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"Global business will eventually lead the way here.
The idea that small individual states will have the ability to push against this is just stubborn denial.
We’ve taken a huge step backward with Brexit but harsh economic reality will eventually push us closer to Europe.
The original kingdoms of England became stronger and much wealthier together as did the United Kingdom of Scotland, England, Wales and Northern Ireland.
I’m all for keeping local cultures such as Cornishmen and Welshmen etc but economics will dictate we won’t succeed alone as the U.K.
We need to wake up, embrace reality and work within the new order or just get left behind.
_________
So you can understand why Scotland might want to leave the UK and join the EU..?
__________
Indeed I can but Scotlands government needs to be better before you can even thing to do that . The SNP isn’t exactly showering it’s self in glory economically or socially. "
True. However, a change of Union - with an unavoidable spell in neither - is what's required.
Believe me, if the people of Scotland ever achieve independence, the SNP will not be guaranteed power. They aren't now.
Scotland is a representative democracy. They are a minority party - in terms of the popular vote - and would continue to be, post-independence.
Free of any possibility of Tory rule and the harm it often does, support for the SNP will slump; since there will be no need for it.
Westminster, where 44% of the popular vote gets you an 80 seat majority, will no longer be a factor. |
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