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The Reparations Rant
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I am not opposed to the idea of reparations and formal apologies for our country’s past sins believe it is necessary and that and a lot if other discussions are needed for us to move forwards as a Nation from our current lets be honest stagnation.
That being said with reparations will likely be a future hot topic that gains more support across all parties from all sides of the spectrum.I’m worried it will just be a pointless financial transaction that helps nobody least of all ourselves.
Here are some problems I have if I can have an answer that would be great.
How they will be paid:Are we going to go into debt for it,are we going to transfer assets?
How much:How do you calculate such things?.Do we calculate?,Does the recipient calculate?,Can an impartial committee even be formed to preform such an act?
Ways it will be spent if its a country:Should we demand a way in which it will be spent by recipient?,Should we force it to be spent on infrastructure for the future of their country for the damages we have committed in our past?.Personally against a flat sum that will probably fill some party chiefs pension fund.
Influence:Is it right if our reparations could sway an election or help a possible dictator stay in power by claiming to defeat the colonisers?
Finally and my biggest gripe there is what I call the “rightful inheritance” thing about who recieves.Basically there are millions of British People descended from those maligned by the Empire and the UK state in general. Should they get nothing just for being British while some different branch of their family that may have helped cause the injustices be rewarded simply for staying on foreign ground?.
What about people who’s families never lived under British rule but are now citizens of one of the states that did?.
How do you handle states that no longer exist?,Or successor states where we gave the land to another country. Thinking Pakistan and India we technically by Indias own admission took territory that they now claim as theirs from what they claim to be Pakistan in the past.
How would you handle a country split across multiple empires?
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
I don’t think we should pay reparations in a direct sense for many if the reasons you outline and the sheer complexity of determining who really ought to pay.
I think we (the UK) absolutely should look to invest in countries that may arguably be able to argue for reparations, through favourable trade deals and inward investment along with minimal debt burden on those countries. We should work together to improve those countries and the lives of their citizens. |
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"I think we (the UK) absolutely should look to invest in countries that may arguably be able to argue for reparations, through favourable trade deals and inward investment..."
You need to be careful there. What one person sees as investment to help a country grow will be seen by another as taking control of a country's business and sucking out the profit. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"I think we (the UK) absolutely should look to invest in countries that may arguably be able to argue for reparations, through favourable trade deals and inward investment...
You need to be careful there. What one person sees as investment to help a country grow will be seen by another as taking control of a country's business and sucking out the profit."
Indeed. Depends on the financial structure of the investment and ensuring shared ownership, shared profit. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Don't see why be proud of are past are four fathers are country they made us and are country what it is for me no payment. "
These four fathers. Did they each have a candle? |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Don't see why be proud of are past are four fathers are country they made us and are country what it is for me no payment.
These four fathers. Did they each have a candle? "
 got to love the English language. |
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"Don't see why be proud of are past are four fathers are country they made us and are country what it is for me no payment.
These four fathers. Did they each have a candle? "
Now, now. It's not polite to tease the afflicted. |
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After Britain abolished the trade the West Africa Squadron of the Royal Navy rescued (freed) around 150,000 from ships bound for the new world. At a cost of roughly 1,500 British sailors lives.
I think. Paid in full. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Don't see why be proud of are past are four fathers are country they made us and are country what it is for me no payment.
These four fathers. Did they each have a candle
Now, now. It's not polite to tease the afflicted."
 it's OK I usually spell check being dyslexic forefathers there you go and he asked for a fork handle |
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" Did we get anything from Germany?
Yes. Billions"
Don't think the Italians have paid us for who the Romans took from Britain and don't forget the Barbary pirates who took many from the UK and other parts of Europe.
Maybe Morocco Algeria and Libya owe us a few quid as well. |
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"After Britain abolished the trade the West Africa Squadron of the Royal Navy rescued (freed) around 150,000 from ships bound for the new world. At a cost of roughly 1,500 British sailors lives.
I think. Paid in full."
So glad you mentioned that. Funny that it hardly gets a mention in history lessons. |
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By *yron69Man
over a year ago
Fareham |
I’d increase aid to former colonies but for a limited period. But tbh most are accepting Chinese cash now . They aren’t thinking though of pay day when their new Chinese masters will want their souls in return. |
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By *6travellerMan
over a year ago
Tayside, Midlands and Chester |
Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
I am not opposed to the idea of reparations and formal apologies for our country’s past sins believe it is necessary and that and a lot if other discussions are needed for us to move forwards as a Nation from our current lets be honest stagnation.
That being said with reparations will likely be a future hot topic that gains more support across all parties from all sides of the spectrum.I’m worried it will just be a pointless financial transaction that helps nobody least of all ourselves.
Here are some problems I have if I can have an answer that would be great.
How they will be paid:Are we going to go into debt for it,are we going to transfer assets?
How much:How do you calculate such things?.Do we calculate?,Does the recipient calculate?,Can an impartial committee even be formed to preform such an act?
Ways it will be spent if its a country:Should we demand a way in which it will be spent by recipient?,Should we force it to be spent on infrastructure for the future of their country for the damages we have committed in our past?.Personally against a flat sum that will probably fill some party chiefs pension fund.
Influence:Is it right if our reparations could sway an election or help a possible dictator stay in power by claiming to defeat the colonisers?
Finally and my biggest gripe there is what I call the “rightful inheritance” thing about who recieves.Basically there are millions of British People descended from those maligned by the Empire and the UK state in general. Should they get nothing just for being British while some different branch of their family that may have helped cause the injustices be rewarded simply for staying on foreign ground?.
What about people who’s families never lived under British rule but are now citizens of one of the states that did?.
How do you handle states that no longer exist?,Or successor states where we gave the land to another country. Thinking Pakistan and India we technically by Indias own admission took territory that they now claim as theirs from what they claim to be Pakistan in the past.
How would you handle a country split across multiple empires?
"
As long as the Italians and French pay us reparations. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past."
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes? |
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By *6travellerMan
over a year ago
Tayside, Midlands and Chester |
"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?"
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"After Britain abolished the trade the West Africa Squadron of the Royal Navy rescued (freed) around 150,000 from ships bound for the new world. At a cost of roughly 1,500 British sailors lives.
I think. Paid in full.
So glad you mentioned that. Funny that it hardly gets a mention in history lessons."
hardly a coincidence it doesn’t get taught in our school system! That would get in way of the “fact” we’re inherently racist enjoying our mostly “white privilege” in our unfair and unjust, evil sexist “patriarchal society” I feel guilty at the very thought  |
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"How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus?"
Germany did pay reparation, very large amounts of it.
As for the rest, using the argument of "well no one else has done it" is not going to persuade anyone that it's a bad idea. |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on."
Not sure how you are making a connection between Reparations (monetary compensation) with Repatriation (taking people back to their country of origin, which in this case means several generations later). Maybe just admit you misread the OP and your first post was in error? |
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By *6travellerMan
over a year ago
Tayside, Midlands and Chester |
"How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus?
Germany did pay reparation, very large amounts of it.
As for the rest, using the argument of "well no one else has done it" is not going to persuade anyone that it's a bad idea."
You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation. Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago. |
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By *6travellerMan
over a year ago
Tayside, Midlands and Chester |
"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on.
Not sure how you are making a connection between Reparations (monetary compensation) with Repatriation (taking people back to their country of origin, which in this case means several generations later). Maybe just admit you misread the OP and your first post was in error?"
No I did not misread both ate linked you cannot have one without the other. Who is being compensated? Not the original sufferers they are long since gone. The descendants have had opportunities the same as everyone else. So compensation for what? |
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"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on.
Not sure how you are making a connection between Reparations (monetary compensation) with Repatriation (taking people back to their country of origin, which in this case means several generations later). Maybe just admit you misread the OP and your first post was in error?
No I did not misread both ate linked you cannot have one without the other. Who is being compensated? Not the original sufferers they are long since gone. The descendants have had opportunities the same as everyone else. So compensation for what? "
Why can't you have reparations without repatriation?
For example, were Germans repatriated as part of the reparations they paid between 1919 and 1932? |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus?
Germany did pay reparation, very large amounts of it.
As for the rest, using the argument of "well no one else has done it" is not going to persuade anyone that it's a bad idea.
You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation. Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago. "
Germany is still paying reparations to holocaust survivors today |
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"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on."
post of the day I agree 100%  |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"Repatriation to where? The Caribbean areas of Jamaica etc would not have existed, Black American’s to where? Are you serious? Are you saying all those of black African heritage should be repatriated to Africa? Sorry but one of the good things to come out of (cannot say here the word s - a - e - y) is we live in a multicultural society. It may have unacceptable problems but education, opportunity and integration will go a long way to helping sort this out. History is the past, recognise it, consider the good and the bad and learn from it. Under no circumstances dismiss or try to eradicate the past.
You do of course understand the difference between:
Reparations
and
Repatriation
yes?
Yes but one means nothing without the other. Reparation for what? How far back in history do you go? Germany never paid reparation, Spain for wiping out the Aztecs? Europe for decimating the American Injun? China for the Tibet and Mongolian people? Japan for the war crimes. Turkey for occupying Northern Cyprus? So it goes on and they are just a few. The answer to all this is simply NO. History is in the past - learn from it and move on.
Not sure how you are making a connection between Reparations (monetary compensation) with Repatriation (taking people back to their country of origin, which in this case means several generations later). Maybe just admit you misread the OP and your first post was in error?
No I did not misread both ate linked you cannot have one without the other. Who is being compensated? Not the original sufferers they are long since gone. The descendants have had opportunities the same as everyone else. So compensation for what? "
Sorry my friend but what on Earth are you talking about?
They are two completely different things!  |
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"After Britain abolished the trade the West Africa Squadron of the Royal Navy rescued (freed) around 150,000 from ships bound for the new world. At a cost of roughly 1,500 British sailors lives.
I think. Paid in full.
So glad you mentioned that. Funny that it hardly gets a mention in history lessons. hardly a coincidence it doesn’t get taught in our school system! That would get in way of the “fact” we’re inherently racist enjoying our mostly “white privilege” in our unfair and unjust, evil sexist “patriarchal society” I feel guilty at the very thought "
your in good company on here then guilt is the fashion on here |
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"You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation."
Germany did pay reparations for WWII. The Potsdam Conference set reparations at around $23Bn, plus they signed other agreements to other groups.
"Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago. "
That was a debt to the USA, which made us pay for all the weapons they sent over to help fight the war. Nothing to do with Germany. |
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"I don’t think we should pay reparations in a direct sense for many if the reasons you outline and the sheer complexity of determining who really ought to pay.
I think we (the UK) absolutely should look to invest in countries that may arguably be able to argue for reparations, through favourable trade deals and inward investment along with minimal debt burden on those countries. We should work together to improve those countries and the lives of their citizens."
..................................
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How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life? |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life? "
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion. |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion."
sp what recognition would you like to see then? |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.sp what recognition would you like to see then?"
.................................
I think birdln's post above isn't far from the mark. |
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By *6travellerMan
over a year ago
Tayside, Midlands and Chester |
"You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation.
Germany did pay reparations for WWII. The Potsdam Conference set reparations at around $23Bn, plus they signed other agreements to other groups.
Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago.
That was a debt to the USA, which made us pay for all the weapons they sent over to help fight the war. Nothing to do with Germany."
Of course it was to do with Germany - we would not have bought weapons had they not started the War. Secondly you are wrong Germany did not pay a single penny to the UK and whilst funds were being ploughed into German recovery, the UK was left to recover and did not do so until the 70s |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.sp what recognition would you like to see then?"
A start would be being able to discuss historical fact without being accused of being anti-British, or trying to spread guilt and all the other bollocks. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"
I am not opposed to the idea of reparations and formal apologies for our country’s past sins believe it is necessary and that and a lot if other discussions are needed for us to move forwards as a Nation from our current lets be honest stagnation.
That being said with reparations will likely be a future hot topic that gains more support across all parties from all sides of the spectrum.I’m worried it will just be a pointless financial transaction that helps nobody least of all ourselves.
Here are some problems I have if I can have an answer that would be great.
How they will be paid:Are we going to go into debt for it,are we going to transfer assets?
How much:How do you calculate such things?.Do we calculate?,Does the recipient calculate?,Can an impartial committee even be formed to preform such an act?
Ways it will be spent if its a country:Should we demand a way in which it will be spent by recipient?,Should we force it to be spent on infrastructure for the future of their country for the damages we have committed in our past?.Personally against a flat sum that will probably fill some party chiefs pension fund.
Influence:Is it right if our reparations could sway an election or help a possible dictator stay in power by claiming to defeat the colonisers?
Finally and my biggest gripe there is what I call the “rightful inheritance” thing about who recieves.Basically there are millions of British People descended from those maligned by the Empire and the UK state in general. Should they get nothing just for being British while some different branch of their family that may have helped cause the injustices be rewarded simply for staying on foreign ground?.
What about people who’s families never lived under British rule but are now citizens of one of the states that did?.
How do you handle states that no longer exist?,Or successor states where we gave the land to another country. Thinking Pakistan and India we technically by Indias own admission took territory that they now claim as theirs from what they claim to be Pakistan in the past.
How would you handle a country split across multiple empires?
"
Reparations are not a sensible topic.
There may be an argument for descendents of all the sl@ve owners paid compensation for "having to give up" their sl@ves, paying it into some form of charitable trust for education and medical aid. However, in reality how would you identify these people and how much they ultimately benefited from a payment to an ancestor?
All that really has to be done is genuine acceptance that this country benefitted from both sl@very and the exploitation of others. Countries were emptied of wealth and organised to produce goods useful to the UK, not themselves. At the end of Empire these countries were then deliberately set up split along ethnic, tribal and religious lines to keep them weak and maintain British influence. That has directly led to many of the conflicts still visible in the world today, long after we are no longer relevant.
I really don't have any time for people who know nothing about the cultures and sensibilities of colonised countries and loudly proclaim the benefits that were brought with absolutely no idea about what came before.
The British Empire existed only for the enrichment of Britain. This country is as wealthy as it is for that reason. As are many other European nations to a greater or lesser extent.
None have paid reparations except for Germany and that is largely because their aggression was against other Europeans. Very few have accepted any responsibility for their actions.
That is the minimum. Teach it all. Accept it all. Good and bad. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Is the child responsible for the sins of the father? Are we talking reparations for slav*ry or for colonisation and r*pe of resources? They are quite different, but still both need to be addressed. Regarding slav*ry, who actually profited from this? The working classes? At the height of slav*ry, poverty was huge - poorhouses and workhouses still existed, squalor and slum housing still existed, healthcare for the working classes didn't exist, and state education was minimal. With two world wars, nothing went well for the working classes until 1948 and the beginnings of the welfare state. These people, and their ancestors, have no blood on their hands. However, Buckingham Palace was extended just at the end of the "sl*ve period" at a cost of, in today's money, nearly half a billion pounds. Blenheim Palace, and many other stately and ancestral homes also enjoyed similar improvements.
If reparations are to be discussed, then where the money comes from is key. It shouldn't come from taxation, it should come from the monarchy and the nobility. Don't blame the working class for something that was never their fault, their wish, or their doing. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Is the child responsible for the sins of the father? Are we talking reparations for slav*ry or for colonisation and r*pe of resources? They are quite different, but still both need to be addressed. Regarding slav*ry, who actually profited from this? The working classes? At the height of slav*ry, poverty was huge - poorhouses and workhouses still existed, squalor and slum housing still existed, healthcare for the working classes didn't exist, and state education was minimal. With two world wars, nothing went well for the working classes until 1948 and the beginnings of the welfare state. These people, and their ancestors, have no blood on their hands. However, Buckingham Palace was extended just at the end of the "sl*ve period" at a cost of, in today's money, nearly half a billion pounds. Blenheim Palace, and many other stately and ancestral homes also enjoyed similar improvements.
If reparations are to be discussed, then where the money comes from is key. It shouldn't come from taxation, it should come from the monarchy and the nobility. Don't blame the working class for something that was never their fault, their wish, or their doing."
If you actually want to take this route, which I think is futile, then it is not just monarchy and aristocracy that benefitted.
Factory owners, merchants, bankers, insurers, shipbuilders and a huge middle class all benefitted.
Ultimately the working class did benefit because the post WWII benefits that were eventually shared with them came in large part from the profits of Empire.
That does not make anyone alive today culpable, so reparations are not a sensible route. Accepting what happened without pretending the intentions were good and it was a largely benign enterprise. |
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By *yron69Man
over a year ago
Fareham |
"No state has ever r@ped the planet like the vile UK. I cannot wait to piss on that flag come Independence Day. "
The Scots Irish colonised the empire. In the Southern States they largely formed the Confederate wealthy sl;ve owning elite.
Even the dreaded KKK have a very Scots derived name.
Look up BBC Neil Oliver on the subject. |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation.
Germany did pay reparations for WWII. The Potsdam Conference set reparations at around $23Bn, plus they signed other agreements to other groups.
Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago.
That was a debt to the USA, which made us pay for all the weapons they sent over to help fight the war. Nothing to do with Germany.
Of course it was to do with Germany - we would not have bought weapons had they not started the War. Secondly you are wrong Germany did not pay a single penny to the UK and whilst funds were being ploughed into German recovery, the UK was left to recover and did not do so until the 70s "
Germany paid UK over 100 million in the form of industrial assets
Don't believe every meme you see on facebook |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The Windrush Genereration Compensation Fund has already awarded £41million
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/over-41-million-compensation-offered-to-the-windrush-generation"
Off tax payers money? |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"You are 100 percent wrong, Germany did not pay a single pfennig in reperation.
Germany did pay reparations for WWII. The Potsdam Conference set reparations at around $23Bn, plus they signed other agreements to other groups.
Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago.
That was a debt to the USA, which made us pay for all the weapons they sent over to help fight the war. Nothing to do with Germany.
Of course it was to do with Germany - we would not have bought weapons had they not started the War. Secondly you are wrong Germany did not pay a single penny to the UK and whilst funds were being ploughed into German recovery, the UK was left to recover and did not do so until the 70s
Germany paid UK over 100 million in the form of industrial assets
Don't believe every meme you see on facebook"
In 1990 douglas hurd wrote off the rest of Germanys debt for ww2 following the reunification of Germany.Fact. |
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"The Windrush Genereration Compensation Fund has already awarded £41million
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/over-41-million-compensation-offered-to-the-windrush-generation
Off tax payers money? "
Yes! Read the article!!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The Windrush Genereration Compensation Fund has already awarded £41million
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/over-41-million-compensation-offered-to-the-windrush-generation
Off tax payers money?
Yes! Read the article!!! "
Another Tory fuck up we are paying for |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.sp what recognition would you like to see then?
A start would be being able to discuss historical fact without being accused of being anti-British, or trying to spread guilt and all the other bollocks. "
would that be the facts with all the good Britain has done aswell well as the bad because the good is something we never see on here no guilt in good |
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"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.sp what recognition would you like to see then?
A start would be being able to discuss historical fact without being accused of being anti-British, or trying to spread guilt and all the other bollocks. would that be the facts with all the good Britain has done aswell well as the bad because the good is something we never see on here no guilt in good "
History is a fact based discipline. What happened, happened. The facts don't care if you don't like them or not, they don't care if you think they're positive or negative. Not sure why you are upset about it. |
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By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods"
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. "
exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ? |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?"
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial. |
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|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?"
Do you stand up and salute age you hear god save the queen |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
Do you stand up and salute age you hear god save the queen "
When you hear |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?"
Erm. Because we're in the UK and this is what the thread is about. |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial."
bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh "
What's the squad?
What's your education got to do with being upset at people discussing history?
I'm trying to understand what the beef is here. |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
What's the squad?
What's your education got to do with being upset at people discussing history?
I'm trying to understand what the beef is here."
first of all what beef you said I’m upset in another post this is your standard response to posts you don’t like am I only allowed to post on here aslong as I have same beliefs as yourself mate ?if you read the posts and keep up my education was in response to another fella talking about his keep up mate |
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or View forums list | |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh "
................................
It's only hard to discuss if you want it to be, personally I welcome your view and what others have to say, the world might be a much better place if we could accommodate a wide range of opinions, but during my life the 'usual squad' have been the ones who dismiss the consequences of our history, they've hammered their way for centuries, I'm just trying to offer two minutes of balance on a swingers site. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
What's the squad?
What's your education got to do with being upset at people discussing history?
I'm trying to understand what the beef is here.first of all what beef you said I’m upset in another post this is your standard response to posts you don’t like am I only allowed to post on here aslong as I have same beliefs as yourself mate ?if you read the posts and keep up my education was in response to another fella talking about his keep up mate "
Okay.
Still no idea what you're upset about.
Should we not discuss historical events? |
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"In 1990 douglas hurd wrote off the rest of Germanys debt for ww2 following the reunification of Germany.Fact."
Not fact.
In 1990 Douglas Hurd signed the "Treaty on the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany". This was the agreement which rescinded all the residual rights that the allies had, and allowed East and West Germany to reunify as a recognised federal republic.
So he didn't write off the debt (because Germany didn't have any war debt at that point), he made a legal undertaking not to apply for more reparations in the future. |
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"if you read the posts and keep up my education was in response to another fella talking about his keep up mate
..................................
Ps I'm female btw "
lol oh sorry my mistake no offence |
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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago
milton keynes |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
................................
It's only hard to discuss if you want it to be, personally I welcome your view and what others have to say, the world might be a much better place if we could accommodate a wide range of opinions, but during my life the 'usual squad' have been the ones who dismiss the consequences of our history, they've hammered their way for centuries, I'm just trying to offer two minutes of balance on a swingers site."
I think it's that balance that foxy was asking for. It should also be the same when discussing other countries pasts. |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
................................
It's only hard to discuss if you want it to be, personally I welcome your view and what others have to say, the world might be a much better place if we could accommodate a wide range of opinions, but during my life the 'usual squad' have been the ones who dismiss the consequences of our history, they've hammered their way for centuries, I'm just trying to offer two minutes of balance on a swingers site.
I think it's that balance that foxy was asking for. It should also be the same when discussing other countries pasts. "
.................................
I'm sure foxy can speak for themselves and provide balance (to this topic) by discussing the salient points.
I'm already familiar with the great deeds of this country, as are most natives, but we're generally less acquainted with the negative aspects of our endeavours.
|
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"if you read the posts and keep up my education was in response to another fella talking about his keep up mate
..................................
Ps I'm female btw lol oh sorry my mistake no offence "
.................................
No worries, my moustache probably needs a trim!  |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
................................
It's only hard to discuss if you want it to be, personally I welcome your view and what others have to say, the world might be a much better place if we could accommodate a wide range of opinions, but during my life the 'usual squad' have been the ones who dismiss the consequences of our history, they've hammered their way for centuries, I'm just trying to offer two minutes of balance on a swingers site.
I think it's that balance that foxy was asking for. It should also be the same when discussing other countries pasts.
.................................
I'm sure foxy can speak for themselves and provide balance (to this topic) by discussing the salient points.
I'm already familiar with the great deeds of this country, as are most natives, but we're generally less acquainted with the negative aspects of our endeavours.
"
we’ll in that case stay on this thread I’m sure one of the lads will be on to point out plenty of them for you mate |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"The Windrush Genereration Compensation Fund has already awarded £41million
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/over-41-million-compensation-offered-to-the-windrush-generation"
Those aren't reparations.
That's for illegally deporting people entitled to live here.
What point are you making? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"How about the entire GDP of the UK be given up to the rest of the world and we volunteer ourselves into xxxxxxx ad infinitum....or we could just get accept that bad things have happened, will happen and get on with life?
.................................
Which of course is easy to say from a privileged position.
Personally I don't necessarily believe in reparation payments, but some recognition that the life we enjoy today was largely built on the blood, sweat & tears of others is perfectly acceptable in my opinion.sp what recognition would you like to see then?
A start would be being able to discuss historical fact without being accused of being anti-British, or trying to spread guilt and all the other bollocks. would that be the facts with all the good Britain has done aswell well as the bad because the good is something we never see on here no guilt in good "
What is the good and what is the bad?
List some of both |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh
................................
It's only hard to discuss if you want it to be, personally I welcome your view and what others have to say, the world might be a much better place if we could accommodate a wide range of opinions, but during my life the 'usual squad' have been the ones who dismiss the consequences of our history, they've hammered their way for centuries, I'm just trying to offer two minutes of balance on a swingers site.
I think it's that balance that foxy was asking for. It should also be the same when discussing other countries pasts.
.................................
I'm sure foxy can speak for themselves and provide balance (to this topic) by discussing the salient points.
I'm already familiar with the great deeds of this country, as are most natives, but we're generally less acquainted with the negative aspects of our endeavours.
we’ll in that case stay on this thread I’m sure one of the lads will be on to point out plenty of them for you mate "
Would you prefer to lay out a list of acceptable topics? So we know what we're allowed to discuss. Without knowing why you're upset about this, it's hard to know what's okay to talk about, and what's not. |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh "
Me neither learnt a lot about romans and spartans though. |
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"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?"
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird. |
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or View forums list | |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh Me neither learnt a lot about romans and spartans though."
.............................
You didn't learn anything about British history? |
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|
By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh Me neither learnt a lot about romans and spartans though.
.............................
You didn't learn anything about British history? "
Nope not what i can remember but it was a long time ago i do remember being taught about alexandra the great, gengis khan and as i said the romans, spartans and of course troy. |
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"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh Me neither learnt a lot about romans and spartans though.
.............................
You didn't learn anything about British history? Nope not what i can remember but it was a long time ago i do remember being taught about alexandra the great, gengis khan and as i said the romans, spartans and of course troy."
..................................
I'm assuming your education was in the UK, in which case the teaching of British history has always been a significant element of the history curriculum! |
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By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Some hope of getting anything owed out of the British,your Museums are full of stolen artifacts of cultural importance to other countries that you won't give back.
Literally stolen goods
I totally agree with you and the UK’s global reach has largely been based on theft.
Don’t forget to hold your fellow Irishmen for taking over great swathes if the indigenous populations lands around the world. One in ten Americans claim Irish ancestry as do one in ten Australians.
Also remember the natives of all these countries were paid to support us and that includes the sl4ve catchers of west Africa. If they didn’t catch them we couldn’t sell them.
History is full of behaviour today we are disgusted by. The horrific behaviour was not limited to the U.K. exactly that every country as history of some sort or other it’s inevitable with population growth the theme on here tho it’s only the bad they want to talk about wonder why that is ?
..................................
Perhaps because it's the bad we find so hard to discuss, let alone acknowledge.
Throughout my formal education, 30+ years ago, all I was taught about was how great the Empire had been and celebrating British military campaigns and victories, the flipside to that was never discussed or considered.
It seems reasonable to have an adult conversation about it now rather than continue in a state of denial.bloody hell hard to discuss it’s on here every week or so the usual squad hammer this subject and when I was at school we never celebrated any military victories barely spoke about them tbh Me neither learnt a lot about romans and spartans though.
.............................
You didn't learn anything about British history? Nope not what i can remember but it was a long time ago i do remember being taught about alexandra the great, gengis khan and as i said the romans, spartans and of course troy.
..................................
I'm assuming your education was in the UK, in which case the teaching of British history has always been a significant element of the history curriculum!"
Seems my school was more or than and. 
History Examination Syllabuses 1960s-present dayThe main trends in O level and CSE (1965-1988)i)Outline courses for O level were segmented into dated ‘chunks’ and students typically covered two or unusually three of these, so that they could find sufficient questions to answer. Studentsmightcover1485-1603 or say 1789-1914 (but might not get beyond 1870 in fact). Topics were largely English history and/or European history.
|
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird. "
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
|
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"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
"
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
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"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?"
In fairness, you do seem upset and called people "the squad" whatever that means.
Maybe you can explain why you don't like talking about history? I'm sure no one deliberately wants to offend you. But it would help if you explained your problem. |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?"
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?"
firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance |
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or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance "
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world" |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance "
Why do you keep talking about history being negative or positive? Why's that important? It's all just history.
History should be taught based on what's relevant to the subject. Not what you perceive to be positive or negative. I'm really struggling to understand what your beef is. |
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"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world""
well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho "
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with? "
how is balance censoring history don’t you think it’s a good thing to discuss both sides hmmm I guess not |
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or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with? "
.................................
Indeed, it's the warts n all of how we got to where we are now! |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with?
.................................
Indeed, it's the warts n all of how we got to where we are now! "
agree with you there mate I’d be interested to read where I posted anything other than that |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with? how is balance censoring history don’t you think it’s a good thing to discuss both sides hmmm I guess not "
Okay. I gave you a chance to give the positive side of Britains involvement with the transatlantic sl@ve trade. Work away. |
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Indeed the UK only finished paying our war debt 15 years ago.
That was a debt to the USA, which made us pay for all the weapons they sent over to help fight the war. Nothing to do with Germany."
WW2 was "nothing to do with Germany"? The debt to the USA would never have arisen had it not been for the war! |
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By *atonMan
over a year ago
barnet |
My father when he came to London he spoke of signs on pub doors" No blacks no dogs no irish". The English invaded and subjugated the Irish for 800 years including culpability in the great famine where almost half the population perished while the English landowners sent food to England. Should I receive reparations for the sins visited on my ancestors? Absolutely not. My dad availed himself of this countries hospitality and thrived and prospered here. The sins of the fathers are not visited on the sons. That means contemporary brits cannot be contrite for something they had nothing to do with. |
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"WW2 was "nothing to do with Germany"? The debt to the USA would never have arisen had it not been for the war!"
I didn't say WWII was nothing to do with Germany, I said that our debt to the US was nothing to do with Germany.
If the interest on my credit card debt makes the payments unaffordable, I blame the bank. I don't blame Tesco for making me buy food. |
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"WW2 was "nothing to do with Germany"? The debt to the USA would never have arisen had it not been for the war!
I didn't say WWII was nothing to do with Germany, I said that our debt to the US was nothing to do with Germany.
If the interest on my credit card debt makes the payments unaffordable, I blame the bank. I don't blame Tesco for making me buy food."
There you go not good logic, you shouldn't use credit cards in the first place |
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I am not opposed to the idea of reparations and formal apologies for our country’s past sins believe it is necessary and that and a lot if other discussions are needed for us to move forwards as a Nation from our current lets be honest stagnation.
That being said with reparations will likely be a future hot topic that gains more support across all parties from all sides of the spectrum.I’m worried it will just be a pointless financial transaction that helps nobody least of all ourselves.
Here are some problems I have if I can have an answer that would be great.
How they will be paid:Are we going to go into debt for it,are we going to transfer assets?
How much:How do you calculate such things?.Do we calculate?,Does the recipient calculate?,Can an impartial committee even be formed to preform such an act?
Ways it will be spent if its a country:Should we demand a way in which it will be spent by recipient?,Should we force it to be spent on infrastructure for the future of their country for the damages we have committed in our past?.Personally against a flat sum that will probably fill some party chiefs pension fund.
Influence:Is it right if our reparations could sway an election or help a possible dictator stay in power by claiming to defeat the colonisers?
Finally and my biggest gripe there is what I call the “rightful inheritance” thing about who recieves.Basically there are millions of British People descended from those maligned by the Empire and the UK state in general. Should they get nothing just for being British while some different branch of their family that may have helped cause the injustices be rewarded simply for staying on foreign ground?.
What about people who’s families never lived under British rule but are now citizens of one of the states that did?.
How do you handle states that no longer exist?,Or successor states where we gave the land to another country. Thinking Pakistan and India we technically by Indias own admission took territory that they now claim as theirs from what they claim to be Pakistan in the past.
How would you handle a country split across multiple empires?
Reparations are not a sensible topic.
There may be an argument for descendents of all the sl@ve owners paid compensation for "having to give up" their sl@ves, paying it into some form of charitable trust for education and medical aid. However, in reality how would you identify these people and how much they ultimately benefited from a payment to an ancestor?
All that really has to be done is genuine acceptance that this country benefitted from both sl@very and the exploitation of others. Countries were emptied of wealth and organised to produce goods useful to the UK, not themselves. At the end of Empire these countries were then deliberately set up split along ethnic, tribal and religious lines to keep them weak and maintain British influence. That has directly led to many of the conflicts still visible in the world today, long after we are no longer relevant.
I really don't have any time for people who know nothing about the cultures and sensibilities of colonised countries and loudly proclaim the benefits that were brought with absolutely no idea about what came before.
The British Empire existed only for the enrichment of Britain. This country is as wealthy as it is for that reason. As are many other European nations to a greater or lesser extent.
None have paid reparations except for Germany and that is largely because their aggression was against other Europeans. Very few have accepted any responsibility for their actions.
That is the minimum. Teach it all. Accept it all. Good and bad."
Yep. Pretty much this. Not sure where the money would come from for reparations, anyway.
Even if you accept a debt is owed, it's a massive one - and would be unpayable, in any meaningful way, right now. |
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"My father when he came to London he spoke of signs on pub doors" No blacks no dogs no irish". The English invaded and subjugated the Irish for 800 years including culpability in the great famine where almost half the population perished while the English landowners sent food to England. Should I receive reparations for the sins visited on my ancestors? Absolutely not. My dad availed himself of this countries hospitality and thrived and prospered here. The sins of the fathers are not visited on the sons. That means contemporary brits cannot be contrite for something they had nothing to do with."
Can't they? I think you'll find some of them can. David Cameron apologised for Bloody Sunday. |
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"Is your role in the sla^e trade and colonialism taught as part of the school curriculum?
No, and it appears that we're not allowed to discuss it here. For some reason people get upset and think we have to only discuss other aspects of history. Which is really weird.
The reason they get upset is because it is not taught in schools so why should they listen to real history lessons now at this late stage of their lives.
The denial and lies is bred into them early,and deliberately.
Might not fill those armies so quick for more oppression if the truth was taught.
Lying by omission is still lying.
I don’t see anyone upset or angry on here can you show some posts that seem that way ?
Is that the part of my post that you want to talk about?
How about the main point,that Britain's part in the Atlantic sla^e trade and the realities of its colonial past isn't taught in schools?firstly the squad is a bit of banter between me and a few of the other lads who have been on here a while so don’t get upset from that it’s just a bit of craic and yes I’d be happy for that to be taught in schools how can that be a bad thing but you can’t just teach about the negatives of Britain’s past there as to be balance
..................................
Nobody's suggested only the negative aspects are covered, that's the point, they haven't been but the 'glory' of the empire has been!
This is an extract from the National Curriculum, relating to the teaching of History in Key Stages 1&2
"Aims-The national curriculum for history aims to ensure that all pupils: know and understand the history of these islands as a coherent, chronological
narrative, from the earliest times to the present day: how people’s lives have shaped this nation and how Britain has influenced and been influenced by the wider world"well that sounds fine to me iv no problem with that but tbh I’m onabout the balance on this thread it’s only the negatives that ever get discussed and soon as that’s pointed out on here you get the loony lefts talking about beef anger and being upset lol it’s been the norm on here for years now tho
Why is it only "loony left" who are able to discuss history without getting confused about negatives and positives?
Why should history be censored to provide a view that you personally are happy with?
.................................
Indeed, it's the warts n all of how we got to where we are now! agree with you there mate I’d be interested to read where I posted anything other than that "
................................
I didn't say you had, I just disagree with the assertion that the balance in the conversation needs to come from those who've opened the conversation to include a discussion about all aspects of Britain's colonial past. |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"After Britain abolished the trade the West Africa Squadron of the Royal Navy rescued (freed) around 150,000 from ships bound for the new world. At a cost of roughly 1,500 British sailors lives.
I think. Paid in full."
The Royal Navy helped to end the trade that the UK had grown to an industrial scale? The estimate for British transportation was 3.5m of which 2.7m arrived at their destination.
The abolition that was ended by paying the sl@ve owners £20m (£20bn today) compensation (reparations?) for having to give up their "property"?
Whilst it existed between the late 1600s and 1807 about £6m per year (£600m today) was made in the trade to purchase of and goods produced by sl@ves.
It's certainly a good thing that sl@very was ended and enforced through the hard work and campaigning of many good people.
The "but" which balances this is pretty huge, though. |
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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago
milton keynes |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII."
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries"
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain |
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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago
milton keynes |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain "
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years |
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By *ad NannaWoman
over a year ago
East London |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years "
It's in the curriculum. |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years
It's in the curriculum. "
Teaching about uks role in s(ave trade is NOT mandatory in British schools
This is just a fact |
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"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years
It's in the curriculum.
Teaching about uks role in s(ave trade is NOT mandatory in British schools
This is just a fact"
There's far too much British history to cover all of it in schools.
You could study British in China and the far East for years. And not stray from that subject. The opium wars were long, brutal and had a lasting impact on the region. As a single example.
It should all be available to learn about. I really don't get why people are so upset about history being discussed. It's important to know and understand how the past shaped the modern world. Then we can have a sensible discussion about reparations and other such subjects. |
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"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years
It's in the curriculum.
Teaching about uks role in s(ave trade is NOT mandatory in British schools
This is just a fact
There's far too much British history to cover all of it in schools.
You could study British in China and the far East for years. And not stray from that subject. The opium wars were long, brutal and had a lasting impact on the region. As a single example.
It should all be available to learn about. I really don't get why people are so upset about history being discussed. It's important to know and understand how the past shaped the modern world. Then we can have a sensible discussion about reparations and other such subjects. "
haha you say sensible discussion and say people are so upset iv not read any posts that come across as so upset It doesn’t mean there upset just because they don’t agree with you |
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"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years
It's in the curriculum.
Teaching about uks role in s(ave trade is NOT mandatory in British schools
This is just a fact
There's far too much British history to cover all of it in schools.
You could study British in China and the far East for years. And not stray from that subject. The opium wars were long, brutal and had a lasting impact on the region. As a single example.
It should all be available to learn about. I really don't get why people are so upset about history being discussed. It's important to know and understand how the past shaped the modern world. Then we can have a sensible discussion about reparations and other such subjects. haha you say sensible discussion and say people are so upset iv not read any posts that come across as so upset It doesn’t mean there upset just because they don’t agree with you "
You have come across as very upset because no one is discussing what you think is the positive side of British involvement in the trans Atlantic sl@ve trade. Instead of complaining about the posts. Why don't you add the things you think are "positive"?
I have genuinely tried to understand your problem with talking about history.
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards. |
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"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
This is a sensible approach. It's going to help the other countries in the long term more.
Also returning stolen historical artifacts would be nice.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
Belgium have an extraordinarily dark past by the way. |
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By *ate_BMan
over a year ago
London |
"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
Belgium DOES have dark sh1t in their history. They’re the reason why DR Congo have had civil wars, and surprise surprise the USA was involved too. Otherwise, I generally agree with your opinion |
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"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
agree with you again post of the day for me |
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards.
Belgium have an extraordinarily dark past by the way. "
I’m sure they do, it was a joke but yeah Congo! So crap joke! |
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By *eroy1000Man
over a year ago
milton keynes |
"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
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By *irldnCouple
over a year ago
Brighton |
Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit. |
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"Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit."
more compassion have you no clue about the compassion for the ukrain |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit.more compassion have you no clue about the compassion for the ukrain "
How is our government, whom you voted for, demonstrating its compassion for Ukraine? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"You didn't learn anything about British history?
I'm British, and my school history lessons stopped at Henry VIII.
I was educated here too and we started with Henry VIII in middle school and went up to WW2 I seem to recall. It did include the sl##e trade too. Not sure if it was mandatory to be included or not. Unfortunately sl##es have been a fact for thousands of years and affected many countries
It us not part of the school curriculum in Britain
Like I said I am not sure if it was mandatory or not. Either way it was part of my school work. I think the subject needs to be mandatory and cover all forms as it goes back thousands of years
It's in the curriculum.
Teaching about uks role in s(ave trade is NOT mandatory in British schools
This is just a fact
There's far too much British history to cover all of it in schools.
You could study British in China and the far East for years. And not stray from that subject. The opium wars were long, brutal and had a lasting impact on the region. As a single example.
It should all be available to learn about. I really don't get why people are so upset about history being discussed. It's important to know and understand how the past shaped the modern world. Then we can have a sensible discussion about reparations and other such subjects. haha you say sensible discussion and say people are so upset iv not read any posts that come across as so upset It doesn’t mean there upset just because they don’t agree with you "
What are the positives and the negatives?
If you want more positive, then enlighten us... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Most countries (apart from Belgium maybe) have some dark sh1t in their history, the UK included. Doubt many countries can honestly hold their head up and say otherwise.
But historical reparations are therefore quite frankly a silly notion. Where in history would you draw the line and why?
Reparations against a state immediately put in place following an event makes sense, such as Germany at the end of WWI, as the provenance is clear and current. Not so for something going back 200 years.
Instead, as I said earlier in the thread, what makes more sense is for richer countries like the UK who undoubtedly benefited, to offer the hand of friendship and financial support through investment at favourable terms. Help build up those countries without further exploitation. Share the risks and the rewards."
|
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"Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit.more compassion have you no clue about the compassion for the ukrain
How is our government, whom you voted for, demonstrating its compassion for Ukraine?"
taking in ukrains fleeing war |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit.more compassion have you no clue about the compassion for the ukrain
How is our government, whom you voted for, demonstrating its compassion for Ukraine? taking in ukrains fleeing war "
There are on-going complaints at the extremely slow rate of visa processing for Ukrainian refugees.16,400 compared to the millions of refugees.
Could this be a deliberate measure to discourage applications being pursued? That is the impression.
Is the policy of having a special visa route not inherently racist? Are those seeking other conflicts not equally deserving of the same treatment? |
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By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
"Remember Live8? Remember “Make Poverty History”. Remember “Drop the Debt”
The world used to have more optimism. More love. More compassion.
Over the last decade or do it has become increasingly angry, tribalist, angry, mean, greedy.
Best time was mid 90s to mid 00s and then we had the financial crash in 2008 and everything since stems from there including Brexit.more compassion have you no clue about the compassion for the ukrain
How is our government, whom you voted for, demonstrating its compassion for Ukraine? taking in ukrains fleeing war "
...and, it seems, a system designed to fail:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/apr/23/homes-for-ukraine-whistleblower-says-uk-refugee-scheme-is-designed-to-fail
Withholding visas for one child in a family.
Compassion? |
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