FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > Shortages is it a good thing?
Shortages is it a good thing?
Jump to: Newest in thread
 |
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
Recently in the news there has been reporting of shortages of workers in the haulage, farming and hospitality industries, to name a few. Due to this there are now issues in getting products and produce to the consumer,
So the question is this, is the current situation of shortages of staff and produce a good thing? What are the benefits of having such supply and demand issues? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago
atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke |
"If it means more people have to go without a kfc bucket or a large big mac meal im all for it,we the fattest nation in europe would do some people good nnot stuffing junk food in there face"
Not quite - but nearly.
"In the UK, 55.7 percent of adults are overweight. But the country is far from alone in battling the bulge: Malta tops the list in Europe, with 61 percent; then comes Iceland, on 57.6 percent; and Croatia is third, with 57.4 percent, according to Eurostat."
2020 figures.
But to be fair 18 months of 'not doing a lot' has contributed much to very many waistlines during long lockdowns and furloughs.
I'm not a take-away fan, but I agree some could do with a more finely tuned diet.
I did read somewhere recently that as we 'grow' as a population we will adapt anthropologically at a slower rate, but adapt all the same.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago
atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke |
"The shortage of glass phials for blood tests is definitely not a good thing "
"August 31 2021 09:17 PM
The UK has secured millions of blood tubes following a warning of shortages.
The British Medical Association (BMA) had said shortages across hospitals and GP surgeries were “severe” and if the NHS did not reduce usage “even the most clinically important blood tests may be at risk”.
On Tuesday, it was announced that medical technology company Becton Dickinson (BD) had received “exceptional use authorisation” to import blood tubes into the UK." |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago
atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke |
"This is good news Cat. Thanks"
I think a UK glassmaker has upped production 50% to at Government requests. They got permission to source silicate beyond their normal remit too _ radio programme chat while in the car _ so don't be surprised if a tractor pulls up alongside you on the beach and starts grabbing sand lol.  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case. "
There are huge backlogs at Chinese ports with estimates of months to clear, which may be felt Christmas time.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *lan157Man
over a year ago
a village near Haywards Heath in East Sussex |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case. "
Tesco seems to have plenty of £4 tins of sweets for Christmas on sale in August |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *mmmMaybeCouple
over a year ago
West Wales |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case. "
There isn’t really a shortage of HGV drivers, there’s a shortage of European HGV driver who work for peanuts. The supermarkets & others have relied on them for over thirty years now. They’ll tell you they keep prices low but when you look at how many they use & say the £2-300pw difference between using someone on a decent wage being paid for nights out etc. Against an East European driver then it’s a tiny part of the equation. I actually think part of this is an obvious ploy by business to try & force the Government into relenting on the driver front not to keep prices low but to keep profits up.
The supermarkets could easily cope with a drop in profits because they have to use UK based drivers earning enough to live well in the UK, but they won’t or don’t want to, hence they are using the cover of Breshit when in reality it’s more the Covid issue causing problems for everyone.
The RHA have estimated there are currently 80,000 UK HGV license holders in other jobs or retired early due in part to pay in the industry & job in general being shit
I’m one of them & why would I go driving on our overcrowded roads, sometimes being seen & talked to by people with the IQ of a brick like i’m a piece of shit, sleep in a truck a couple of times a week to get less than I can in a 9-5 non/fri, go home & forget about it job? I wouldn’t would I.
Overall though it’s us the consumers that need to wake up a bit. Go for a day out, watch a dairy farm on YouTube. Now go work out why two litres of milk is cheaper than two litres of spring water because I can’t.
Stop expecting to eat stuff out of season. Stop buying stuff from the other side of the world because it’s two lousy pound cheaper & then spunking that two pound on an overpriced coffee when it’s a pound in the cafe around the corner as doing things like that makes zero sense in n the overall scheme of things.
I just had to buy an old school timing light £19.95 UK seller, made in China. £22.95 UK seller direct from the manufacturer in Northampton. That’s where my money went. Perhaps if more tried doing that & not wanting to eat strawberries in November etc we wouldn’t need the lorry drivers we are “short” in the first place?
S |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case.
There isn’t really a shortage of HGV drivers, there’s a shortage of European HGV driver who work for peanuts. The supermarkets & others have relied on them for over thirty years now. They’ll tell you they keep prices low but when you look at how many they use & say the £2-300pw difference between using someone on a decent wage being paid for nights out etc. Against an East European driver then it’s a tiny part of the equation. I actually think part of this is an obvious ploy by business to try & force the Government into relenting on the driver front not to keep prices low but to keep profits up.
The supermarkets could easily cope with a drop in profits because they have to use UK based drivers earning enough to live well in the UK, but they won’t or don’t want to, hence they are using the cover of Breshit when in reality it’s more the Covid issue causing problems for everyone.
The RHA have estimated there are currently 80,000 UK HGV license holders in other jobs or retired early due in part to pay in the industry & job in general being shit
I’m one of them & why would I go driving on our overcrowded roads, sometimes being seen & talked to by people with the IQ of a brick like i’m a piece of shit, sleep in a truck a couple of times a week to get less than I can in a 9-5 non/fri, go home & forget about it job? I wouldn’t would I.
Overall though it’s us the consumers that need to wake up a bit. Go for a day out, watch a dairy farm on YouTube. Now go work out why two litres of milk is cheaper than two litres of spring water because I can’t.
Stop expecting to eat stuff out of season. Stop buying stuff from the other side of the world because it’s two lousy pound cheaper & then spunking that two pound on an overpriced coffee when it’s a pound in the cafe around the corner as doing things like that makes zero sense in n the overall scheme of things.
I just had to buy an old school timing light £19.95 UK seller, made in China. £22.95 UK seller direct from the manufacturer in Northampton. That’s where my money went. Perhaps if more tried doing that & not wanting to eat strawberries in November etc we wouldn’t need the lorry drivers we are “short” in the first place?
S"
You talk alot of sense. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case.
There isn’t really a shortage of HGV drivers, there’s a shortage of European HGV driver who work for peanuts. The supermarkets & others have relied on them for over thirty years now. They’ll tell you they keep prices low but when you look at how many they use & say the £2-300pw difference between using someone on a decent wage being paid for nights out etc. Against an East European driver then it’s a tiny part of the equation. I actually think part of this is an obvious ploy by business to try & force the Government into relenting on the driver front not to keep prices low but to keep profits up.
The supermarkets could easily cope with a drop in profits because they have to use UK based drivers earning enough to live well in the UK, but they won’t or don’t want to, hence they are using the cover of Breshit when in reality it’s more the Covid issue causing problems for everyone.
The RHA have estimated there are currently 80,000 UK HGV license holders in other jobs or retired early due in part to pay in the industry & job in general being shit
I’m one of them & why would I go driving on our overcrowded roads, sometimes being seen & talked to by people with the IQ of a brick like i’m a piece of shit, sleep in a truck a couple of times a week to get less than I can in a 9-5 non/fri, go home & forget about it job? I wouldn’t would I.
Overall though it’s us the consumers that need to wake up a bit. Go for a day out, watch a dairy farm on YouTube. Now go work out why two litres of milk is cheaper than two litres of spring water because I can’t.
Stop expecting to eat stuff out of season. Stop buying stuff from the other side of the world because it’s two lousy pound cheaper & then spunking that two pound on an overpriced coffee when it’s a pound in the cafe around the corner as doing things like that makes zero sense in n the overall scheme of things.
I just had to buy an old school timing light £19.95 UK seller, made in China. £22.95 UK seller direct from the manufacturer in Northampton. That’s where my money went. Perhaps if more tried doing that & not wanting to eat strawberries in November etc we wouldn’t need the lorry drivers we are “short” in the first place?
S"
Actually there is a shortage of U.K. hgv drivers and has been well before Brexit and Covid. The Europeans filled some of the gap. Brexit had unwrapped the bandage that was in place!
Pay has been shit I agree btw. But the Europeans came in on the same wages not lower. So not undercutting U.K. drivers at all. There was still a shortage with the Europeans not filling the whole gap. Supply and demand should in theory have driven up wages but there’s no money in the hauliers pots. The supermarkets however are on another level.
There are a number of reasons for the lack of people wanting to be drivers.
Look around your local area and see where the trucks can park at night. There’s unlikely to be a truck stop or council parking. Gypsies get more consideration.
Then add the lack of road building so traffic congestion. No where to park and eat. Unwelcome at factories “ stay in your cab and I don’t care you need the toilet” . You’ll have to crap in a lay-bye later. If you find a petrol station, have you seen the state of their toilets? (if they actually still have a public toilet)
It’s a shitty horrible career and they are treated like animals. ( some behave that way)
The total lack of respect the professional drivers receive in this country is shocking.
They are called Chauffeurs on the continent and along with ten times better facilities they are treated with far more respect.
You maybe read the BBC post where the driver was given a 40% rise but was still quitting the industry. That tells you all you need to know.
One of our suppliers lost 40 drivers to Morrison’s recently. Just like Tesco’s they were poaching rather than training. Now the hauliers aren’t able to supply the supermarket’s own DCs as the drivers have gone to the supermarkets. Nice one.
A large number of hgv drivers work in industry such as skip trucks or road workers so the excess is only a small part of that number you quote. Also some people take the test like ex forces personnel as it’s another thing to have on your cv like a forklift licence.
One more thing, some of those licence holders are just shit workers/ drivers and can’t be arsed to get up early so don’t get or want the job.
Pay is important but just as you said people want cheap like food or £2 t-shirts so where does the money come from. Haulier profits are crap.
Maybe as you say it’s time people started paying a proper price for stuff. Not a vote winner though is it.
Or just maybe the government could take less fuel tax off the hauliers as they did with the buses and so give them a chance to pay more. It won’t fix the issue but it could help.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning. "
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Apparantly we now have a shortage of flu jabsno shortage of the jabs themselves just having trouble getting them to where the need to go"
Yes that is correct. I heard a GP this morning saying his staff now need to rearrange 5,500 appointments |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
"
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all. "
Nonsense  Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
Just been reading a few of the comments, it seems that there a wide variety of views,
I do see a trend, this situation is forcing a rethink of how our consumer driven culture is unsupportable in its present state.
On one hand, I see comments supporting the benefit of a reversion to reduced choices and supporting local businesses suppliers.
On the other hand, I see comments seeing benefits of driving increases of workforce wages.
Many are supporting the view that this situation is highlighting the underinvestment in our infrastructure and the need to diversify the way we transport goods in the UK in a cost effective and sustainable way.
Some are concerned about our over reliance of using China as our manufacturing base which leads to delays on imports into the country.
Everyone has a valid solution, each is should be part of an overall strategy.
All I wonder why if we have all the answers that we are not being listen to for? Clearly there are bunch of clever people in here.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *oi_LucyCouple
over a year ago
Barbados |
"My view is we won’t seriously run out of food but there will be increasingly less choice and what is available is going to be more expensive. The head of Tesco is now openly warning of shortages getting worse and Christmas being an issue if the government don’t relent on allowing drivers in from the EU..
Given that most retail make their profits in the run up to Christmas the whole thing is not good for job security in retail.
If you’re thinking of gifts for Christmas buy them now would be wise just in case. "
Indeed. We just recently moved to Barbados, and I guess that gives a bit of a taste as to what Brexit might bring to the U.K. in terms of the supermarket shelves. Everything here cost 50%-100% more than in the U.K. as most things are imported, and even local produce can be expensive as only a limited space to grow stuff. And whilst there are no shortages in general, certain things can be scare. Eg it has been almost impossible to find tomatoes the past few weeks. Is that catastrophic? No. But you just have to be prepared for less choice and higher costs. It has taken me 3 weeks to find spring onions. A box of breakfast cereal is £10, etc.
The flip side is in writing the from my hammock by the pool
-Matt |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"Recently in the news there has been reporting of shortages of workers in the haulage, farming and hospitality industries, to name a few. Due to this there are now issues in getting products and produce to the consumer,
So the question is this, is the current situation of shortages of staff and produce a good thing? What are the benefits of having such supply and demand issues?"
Well, you could make the argument that an increase in wages and a decrease in dividends to shareholders would be a benefit to more people than it would be a disbenefit to others.
You could also argue that, if more of the profits had been spent on recruiting and training staff, we wouldn't be in this situation in the first place.
Both Brexit and Covid have had their effects - but the real rot set in decades ago, when profit, with as little investment as possible (in order to maximise it), became the goal and it didn't matter who was getting exploited in pursuit of it.
Sadly, the greatest shortage in the UK is in common sense. From the Government down, as Al Murray once said:
"Common sense isn't what it used to be. It's not common any more." |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all.
Nonsense Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
"
i disagree with your data which appears to be based on existing short sighted rail management that we have been stuck with courtesy of failed government. the reality from the leading universities is that far greeater use could be made of even the existing rail infrastructure at a far lower cost than the dead horse flogging of current road haulage. basically too many tory donators have a say in holding back any alternatives that threaten excessive profits made by a highly polluting and massively inefficient truck industry. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ostafunMan
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all.
Nonsense Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
"
A lot of trains leave felixstowe docks less than a 3rd full, you do not need trains running to supermarket doorsteps just to a rail depot in the area you then use local hgv,s to transport it from there its not rocket science. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ercuryMan
over a year ago
Grantham |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all.
Nonsense Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
i disagree with your data which appears to be based on existing short sighted rail management that we have been stuck with courtesy of failed government. the reality from the leading universities is that far greeater use could be made of even the existing rail infrastructure at a far lower cost than the dead horse flogging of current road haulage. basically too many tory donators have a say in holding back any alternatives that threaten excessive profits made by a highly polluting and massively inefficient truck industry."
There is little or no capacity on the UK railways right now. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all.
Nonsense Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
A lot of trains leave felixstowe docks less than a 3rd full, you do not need trains running to supermarket doorsteps just to a rail depot in the area you then use local hgv,s to transport it from there its not rocket science. "
A lot of trains travel empty that’s correct. Look at a regular train you see trundling past daily and good chances are it’s running back empty as getting bulk to work on trains is a nightmare.
A thousand tons of coal one way and tv’s the other . I don’t think so.
How do the loads get to and on the train and how do they get off and to the store. Big logistics areas are needed. There just aren’t enough facilities and no one is going to spend the money needed. Especially as the network doesn’t have the capacity.
The trains from Felixstowe carry containers full to the brim which are de stuffed at distribution centres and then sent to supermarkets in cages where staff can push and manage the goods.
You can’t send a full imported container of goods to a store it doesn’t work that way.
Look how many thousands of pairs of jeans you can stuff in a container to how many are on the hooks in one Asda. (Lightweight furniture maybe)
The alternative would be pre- pack containers for each store before they leave the country of production but that’s assuming the various manufacturers are all together in the same country and selling at the same time. It will also mean 20 times as many containers needed as the weights will be a fraction of today’s loads.
Distribution centres work because they reduce the number of trucks feeding in and by consolidation reduce the number of journeys. No store wants 26 pallets of biscuits at once!
The supermarkets woke up to using their own fleets to collect goods from U.K. suppliers so utilising empty trucks but it only works to a limited amount and they still get fed through the distribution system nationally to get to the stores.
Trains certainly have their place and we always look at the option but years of underinvestment means they are way behind on what would have been possible. I know this all sounds negative but it’s the reality at the moment. I wish it wasn’t.
Simple answer is stop buying so much imported throw away shit and there will be less trucks.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"All that will happen is wages will rise to attract people into lorry driving ect now companies carnt exploit cheaper labour for the eu
Long term no real problems only benefits for workers "
Until those same workers can’t afford to pay their more expensive bills . It’s about balance. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"less lorries has meant it being a much nicer experience riding a motorcycle, far less pollution in towns, no elephant races between slow moving juggernauts blocking both lanes of roads for miles at a time. get the railways up and running for freight and keep these ghastly planet destroying monsters from returning.
That’s a 2000% increase in rails capacity so good luck with that and not sure people living near a supermarket would appreciate a train track being built past their houses to the store!! Trucks are needed and it’s unavoidable .
Personal air travel isn’t and neither would cars be needed as much if we had better public transport .
this country used to transport far more freight by rail so i disagree with you dismissing the notion out of hand and resorting to nonsense without considering the facts first. it's not your usual m/o so not sure why you've made nonsense your position now. addressing vacuous consumerism would be good for the people, the economy and the environment after all.
Nonsense Tongue in cheek maybe .
Ok if I tell you I’ve chartered block trains would that help convince you I understand a small amount of the issues. I have plans to start moving bulk trains out of the east coast in three years time but it’s heavy raw material not stuff to deliver in trucks.
I tried to do a deal with material out of Glasgow a few years ago to supply through ships calling at Liverpool.
No slots available as no line capacity to divert at the time . We shook hands with the rail operators and went our separate ways .
The main benefit of HS 2 is it will free up some rail slots for freight . However rail is not capable of dealing with the logistics needs of clients in such a small country .
Tesco’s train to glasgow is one of the few serious retail attempts .
Also the old under invested infrastructure of our rail network rail stops containers being moved in the most direct fashion due to low bridges .
Trains are way too slow for the hub and spoke distribution systems in this country .
The capacity of train and their benefits is mostly targeted at international multimodal operations so .load a container in The West Country then put it on a train in Bristol to Felixstowe for deep sea ships .
If you do the same thing near say Glasgow you have either train to Felixstowe / London Gateway etc or you use a feeder service out of Greenock or Grangemouth using smaller ships to connect with deep sea ships at major ports.
Rail is great for bulk or consolidated same destination high volume traffic but would not work if you tried to replace trucks in most domestic work. The costs are astronomical and the pace is too slow.
I’m not anti rail as you can see I just know from experience the wishful thinking isn’t backed up by the infrastructure or practical solutions.
A truck can change direction for a delivery and go anywhere for a reload . A train can’t .
If you doubled the rail network capacity and trains and they worked perfectly all the time they still wouldn’t scratch the surface of what trucks deliver.
i disagree with your data which appears to be based on existing short sighted rail management that we have been stuck with courtesy of failed government. the reality from the leading universities is that far greeater use could be made of even the existing rail infrastructure at a far lower cost than the dead horse flogging of current road haulage. basically too many tory donators have a say in holding back any alternatives that threaten excessive profits made by a highly polluting and massively inefficient truck industry."
Lack of investment has held rails potential back that is the biggest fact.
The current rail infrastructure does not work. I know how it works and I know how it doesn’t. We use trains as I said but only where we have time and consolidation options for exports. Domestic is too problematic.
Trains are slow . They claim 95% on time for freight but they set slow times to achieve. So pointless data.
A truck from London to Leeds takes a morning. The train firstly has to be consolidated then shunted then hauled to Leeds then broken down before delivery. It’s just too slow. It can take 3-4 days.
Just imagine the congestion if we went in that direction.
As for your highly polluting comment. Euro 6 trucks are very clean. Maybe also see how quickly bio fuels and hydrogen along with electric trucks will be rolling out.
Personally the battery issue on electric trucks makes me doubt their green credentials.
Trucks will start to move ahead of cars in the next few years due to plans already in place and possible tax breaks.
“Excessive profits” that just amused me. Logistics and specifically trucking has one of the worst ROI of any industry.
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
|
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
"
Sadly to a lot of people his word was Gospel.  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
Sadly to a lot of people his word was Gospel. "
nar not a lot of ppl they just wanted out of the eu it’s just so hard for remainers to still accept |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
Sadly to a lot of people his word was Gospel. nar not a lot of ppl they just wanted out of the eu it’s just so hard for remainers to still accept "
What’s hard to be accept is people voted for this mess despite being told it will be a mess and cost us far more than actually being in the eu whether you believe the gravy train bull shit or not.
He played a major part in that lie!! And they believed his repeated lies! The guys record in the eu Parliament is appalling. He had one agenda and didn’t give a fuck about any of the people in this country he was representing for years! His view and only his view mattered. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *lan157Man
over a year ago
a village near Haywards Heath in East Sussex |
"why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
Sadly to a lot of people his word was Gospel. nar not a lot of ppl they just wanted out of the eu it’s just so hard for remainers to still accept
What’s hard to be accept is people voted for this mess despite being told it will be a mess and cost us far more than actually being in the eu whether you believe the gravy train bull shit or not.
He played a major part in that lie!! And they believed his repeated lies! The guys record in the eu Parliament is appalling. He had one agenda and didn’t give a fuck about any of the people in this country he was representing for years! His view and only his view mattered."
There is plenty of food in the supermarkets I frequent.Surely " food shortages " is an exaggeration |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
"why don’t we just ask Nigel for the solution after all he has ‘’20 years experience moving goods round the world’’
and quote/unquote - he said the idea there would be food shortages post Brexit was “utter tosh”
and he seemed so believable….
Sadly to a lot of people his word was Gospel. nar not a lot of ppl they just wanted out of the eu it’s just so hard for remainers to still accept
What’s hard to be accept is people voted for this mess despite being told it will be a mess and cost us far more than actually being in the eu whether you believe the gravy train bull shit or not.
He played a major part in that lie!! And they believed his repeated lies! The guys record in the eu Parliament is appalling. He had one agenda and didn’t give a fuck about any of the people in this country he was representing for years! His view and only his view mattered.
There is plenty of food in the supermarkets I frequent.Surely " food shortages " is an exaggeration "
I agree. it’s a food limitation . All the top stores now are shouting at Boris to pull his finger out . He doesn’t want to admit there’s a problem.
Shortages or limits on choice it’s still shit. Just as well we suspended checks on EU imports otherwise it would be chronic shortages . The government knew this only too well. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *amish SMan
over a year ago
Eastleigh |
I really don't see why the government should step in and help supermarket profits. Price rises will naturally throttle the market place, less demand, less haulage needed.
Even with the current shortages I have still eaten well and not found anything that I wanted actually out of stock.
I know there are serious steel shortages, along with other commodities, this is a global thing and can hardly be blamed on UK haulage not having enough drivers.
Eventually I feel it will all balance out naturally. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
It’s not the food alone it’s the economic damage being done to business. If sales are lost then companies cut jobs.
I agree with the previous poster we do buy too much shit but to lose virtually 20% of our truck driving capacity overnight isn’t a little issue it’s hitting the core of our economy.
I don’t care if I have only two types of carrot to chose from but the guy selling the third type which is not delivered might also stop growing and stop employing.
Same with biscuits , ice cream etc etc . If sales fall it hits the economic model of a company and they can’t survive.
The minister just saying employ local !! How do they do that exactly . The numbers don’t add up. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
"If it means more people have to go without a kfc bucket or a large big mac meal im all for it,we the fattest nation in europe would do some people good nnot stuffing junk food in there face"
Yep, and perhaps it's time people realised bloggers and a degree in social media will not get food on tables lol children once upon a time wanted to be train drivers, nurses.... jobs that were actually required. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
People moaning about prices and shortages, high street shops closed- just stop buying of amazon, as someone mentioned before, shop locally - its gonna cost a little bit more but as long as money flows inside UK, it's gonna help economic growth. And on top of that, you're gonna be more healthy and will have more stamina  |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *ackal1Couple
over a year ago
Manchester |
Looks like the shortages are starting to bite a little harder.
These retailers don’t seem happy.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-58477936
Raw sewage into rivers increasing and it’s the same chemical logistics that makes your drinking water clean so that’s a worry.
So no solution sorted in Northern Ireland and can kicking beyond belief on the new rules.
No rules being implemented on imports from the EU to the rest of U.K. until at least 2022 and that’s doubtful so more power to EU business .
This is going to hurt us for decades to come. How bloody sad that people believed the lies out of Boris .
He’s lying again with triple lock on pensions and your home is safe if you need care. Just as long as you’ve got £86k lose change to hand. More illegal immigrants than ever but workers leaving.
Tax avoiders doing nicely increasing wealth.
This guy is just a lying cheating disgrace and this country has gone backwards decades just because he wanted to be Prime Minister . He said he’s taking tough decisions . Shame he didn’t take the tough decision to say Brexit is bad for the U.K. so let’s stop it. |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
|
By *asyukMan
over a year ago
West London |
Everyone wants higher wages, unless they are companies paying those wages. They can reduce profits, make a loss or pass price rises on to consumers.
Less choice, availability and higher prices are,of course, what all customers want.
Higher prices make your higher wage less valuable.
The only net change is reduced choice and availability.
Is that a benefit? If so, to whom? |
Reply privately, Reply in forum +quote
or View forums list | |
» Add a new message to this topic
