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Alex Salmond and Independence
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Ps. Nicola, any reason the OECD report on Education in Scotland will not be released until after the May elections?  | |||
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"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback." Exactly and smart move one way to get one over a party that fucked him over, going to make a Intresting Scottish election lol.  | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback." He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? " Apparently he can split the vote. Just search can he split the independence vote - lots of analysis comes up about it. | |||
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"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol "It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months | |||
"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol
It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months "Imagine Boris trump and Alex all sat in bar, pint in hand.... nic to perhaps, all meglamaniacs together lol ghost of Maggie refusing to leave lol talking over stunts pulled, then in walks Blair and a dead sadam. ... politicians all the same really... | |||
"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol
It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months
Imagine Boris trump and Alex all sat in bar, pint in hand.... nic to perhaps, all meglamaniacs together lol ghost of Maggie refusing to leave lol talking over stunts pulled, then in walks Blair and a dead sadam. ... politicians all the same really... "That's actually a hillarious thought could be a cracking spitting image sketch. | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? " I've said it before; he just can't abide the fact that independence might happen and he won't be the leader of the party that brings it about if it does - and it's still a big IF. It always has been. As for the system - which many of our friends down south betray their ignorance of in these forums - he's not trying to split the independence vote. He's trying to involve himself in the process again. That's all. David Cameron allowed the Brexit vote because he was shit scared of losing half a dozen seats to UKIP; which is about all that would have happened under FPTP, had UKIP split the right wing vote. Up here, there's a FPTP element and a second vote for a 'list' MSP. It's a complicated process, but the bottom line is that, if your Party gets 50% of the votes, they get 50% of the seats. It's a properly representative system which is superior to purely FPTP; a flawed system which allows a Party with less than 50% of the popular vote, to have a majority - as in the current Westminster Parliament. So, up here, even though roughly 70% of Scots do not vote Tory, the Tories get their 30% of seats in Holyrood because the votes of their supporters are not simply ignored. Nor should they be. The majority of their MSPs are 'list' MSPs, ie. not directly voted for via FPTP. They are treated as equal to those directly elected; in terms of actually doing the job, if not necessarily in regard. Douglas Ross has little chance of direct election in Scotland but he will be No.1 on his Party's list, since he'll be leader when Ruth has to take her hand from up his back and move on to the HoL. So, he will be guaranteed a seat. The same is true for Anas Sarwar; which is why his challenge to stand in Nicola Sturgeon's seat means nothing - for either of them. Alex Salmond's new Party? Well, it may hoover up a fair amount of second votes. I'd be surprised if it were any more than a few. That said, they will all be from the SNP and Green Parties. His idea seems to be to force Nicola Sturgeon to work with him again, hoping she would need his votes to form a majority coalition for independence; such as she curently has with the Green Party. I'm not sure it will work. After all, what's he going to do; sabotage independence just to fuck her over? Well, maybe. Anyone who thinks he wouldn't REALLY doesn't understand Scottish politics in general - and him in particular. As for the upcoming election; even before all this bollocks, I wasn't convinced the SNP could win an outright majority again. Not enough Unionists have died off yet. I've no idea what will happen but I'll take a punt at this: SNP get the most votes - again. Labour erode the Tory vote - but not enough to come second. The Tories remain the official opposition. The Lib-Dems remain largely unaffected. The Greens remain the same, unless Alba hurts them. Alba get enough votes from some of my less stable fellow Scots to take a couple from the SNP. Even if they only get enough votes for one list MSP; you know who it will be. That's Alex's plan. Believe it. | |||
"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol
It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months
Imagine Boris trump and Alex all sat in bar, pint in hand.... nic to perhaps, all meglamaniacs together lol ghost of Maggie refusing to leave lol talking over stunts pulled, then in walks Blair and a dead sadam. ... politicians all the same really...
That's actually a hillarious thought could be a cracking spitting image sketch. "The whole thing is a spitting image sketch, wee nicola in tartan knickers acting a lot like jimmy crankie ...... Im not surprised Alex is back.... I'll be back is his punch line lol think he'll take a chunk of votes if scots see it was nic who made the grab for power..... then she can sit in losers bar with kinnock sipping bitter lemon lol Anyway, congrats to Scotland for beating French, that's fucked your eu membership though lol | |||
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"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes." Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by | |||
"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes." Volumes about what? Please explain fully. | |||
"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by "As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping. The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better. | |||
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"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better."I meant Alex Salmond had been found not guilty but ok  | |||
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"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better."She does remind me of jI'm my crankie, so why less shouts better? For who? Lionel loves nicky. .. Lionel and nicky kissing in a tree.... Yes childish, immature, but I'm taking my lead from our leaders lol | |||
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"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better.
I meant Alex Salmond had been found not guilty but ok "So was nicola. | |||
"For some reason whenever i see Salmond i am instantly reminded of the scene in Return of the Jedi where Jabba the Hutt is slobbering over Princess Leia." Jabba vs lukewarm sturgeon? Nice image lol | |||
"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better.
I meant Alex Salmond had been found not guilty but ok
So was nicola."I’m not interested in Nicola really. I’m talking about the lunacy of someone I was talking to last night who claimed the current UK government was the most right wing government (in the world) since the nazis
I laughed so hard I woke the dogs up Lionel 
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"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better.
I meant Alex Salmond had been found not guilty but ok
So was nicola.
I’m not interested in Nicola really. I’m talking about the lunacy of someone I was talking to last night who claimed the current UK government was the most right wing government (in the world) since the nazis
I laughed so hard I woke the dogs up Lionel
"The most right wing in this country or the world? | |||
"The fact that nicola sturgeon gets more personal abuse on here than a man who was accused of sexual misconduct speaks volumes. Accused. Clues right there for you Careful tho fellow Fabbers, you might get accused of being Nazi’s by hysterical SNP voters if last night was anything to go by
As I recall nicola was found not guilty by an independent party but that hasn't stopped the sniping.
The less said about the Jimmy Krankie shouts the better.
I meant Alex Salmond had been found not guilty but ok
So was nicola.
I’m not interested in Nicola really. I’m talking about the lunacy of someone I was talking to last night who claimed the current UK government was the most right wing government (in the world) since the nazis
I laughed so hard I woke the dogs up Lionel
The most right wing in this country or the world?"The world they said. My Bosnian friends would disagree | |||
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"Civil war north of the border love it" Just like Syria ....clown | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? I've said it before; he just can't abide the fact that independence might happen and he won't be the leader of the party that brings it about if it does - and it's still a big IF. It always has been. As for the system - which many of our friends down south betray their ignorance of in these forums - he's not trying to split the independence vote. He's trying to involve himself in the process again. That's all. David Cameron allowed the Brexit vote because he was shit scared of losing half a dozen seats to UKIP; which is about all that would have happened under FPTP, had UKIP split the right wing vote. Up here, there's a FPTP element and a second vote for a 'list' MSP. It's a complicated process, but the bottom line is that, if your Party gets 50% of the votes, they get 50% of the seats. It's a properly representative system which is superior to purely FPTP; a flawed system which allows a Party with less than 50% of the popular vote, to have a majority - as in the current Westminster Parliament. So, up here, even though roughly 70% of Scots do not vote Tory, the Tories get their 30% of seats in Holyrood because the votes of their supporters are not simply ignored. Nor should they be. The majority of their MSPs are 'list' MSPs, ie. not directly voted for via FPTP. They are treated as equal to those directly elected; in terms of actually doing the job, if not necessarily in regard. Douglas Ross has little chance of direct election in Scotland but he will be No.1 on his Party's list, since he'll be leader when Ruth has to take her hand from up his back and move on to the HoL. So, he will be guaranteed a seat. The same is true for Anas Sarwar; which is why his challenge to stand in Nicola Sturgeon's seat means nothing - for either of them. Alex Salmond's new Party? Well, it may hoover up a fair amount of second votes. I'd be surprised if it were any more than a few. That said, they will all be from the SNP and Green Parties. His idea seems to be to force Nicola Sturgeon to work with him again, hoping she would need his votes to form a majority coalition for independence; such as she curently has with the Green Party. I'm not sure it will work. After all, what's he going to do; sabotage independence just to fuck her over? Well, maybe. Anyone who thinks he wouldn't REALLY doesn't understand Scottish politics in general - and him in particular. As for the upcoming election; even before all this bollocks, I wasn't convinced the SNP could win an outright majority again. Not enough Unionists have died off yet. I've no idea what will happen but I'll take a punt at this: SNP get the most votes - again. Labour erode the Tory vote - but not enough to come second. The Tories remain the official opposition. The Lib-Dems remain largely unaffected. The Greens remain the same, unless Alba hurts them. Alba get enough votes from some of my less stable fellow Scots to take a couple from the SNP. Even if they only get enough votes for one list MSP; you know who it will be. That's Alex's plan. Believe it." First rate analysis I'll be keeping a close eye on what policies Alba will be proposing. My first vote will still go to the SNP (because... obviously), but I'll strongly consider sending my second vote Alba's way if theres a strong socialist underpinning to their manifesto. I think the plan to populate parliament with more pro-independence list MPs is actually pretty sound, but its come a little late in the day to make a huge impact at this election. So yeah - I agree this is Alex trying to get into a seat in time for an independence vote - he's nothing if not a glory hound. But I'll not damn him for that - I think he's earned his place. | |||
" I think he’s earned his place. " In prison? | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? I've said it before; he just can't abide the fact that independence might happen and he won't be the leader of the party that brings it about if it does - and it's still a big IF. It always has been. As for the system - which many of our friends down south betray their ignorance of in these forums - he's not trying to split the independence vote. He's trying to involve himself in the process again. That's all. David Cameron allowed the Brexit vote because he was shit scared of losing half a dozen seats to UKIP; which is about all that would have happened under FPTP, had UKIP split the right wing vote. Up here, there's a FPTP element and a second vote for a 'list' MSP. It's a complicated process, but the bottom line is that, if your Party gets 50% of the votes, they get 50% of the seats. It's a properly representative system which is superior to purely FPTP; a flawed system which allows a Party with less than 50% of the popular vote, to have a majority - as in the current Westminster Parliament. So, up here, even though roughly 70% of Scots do not vote Tory, the Tories get their 30% of seats in Holyrood because the votes of their supporters are not simply ignored. Nor should they be. The majority of their MSPs are 'list' MSPs, ie. not directly voted for via FPTP. They are treated as equal to those directly elected; in terms of actually doing the job, if not necessarily in regard. Douglas Ross has little chance of direct election in Scotland but he will be No.1 on his Party's list, since he'll be leader when Ruth has to take her hand from up his back and move on to the HoL. So, he will be guaranteed a seat. The same is true for Anas Sarwar; which is why his challenge to stand in Nicola Sturgeon's seat means nothing - for either of them. Alex Salmond's new Party? Well, it may hoover up a fair amount of second votes. I'd be surprised if it were any more than a few. That said, they will all be from the SNP and Green Parties. His idea seems to be to force Nicola Sturgeon to work with him again, hoping she would need his votes to form a majority coalition for independence; such as she curently has with the Green Party. I'm not sure it will work. After all, what's he going to do; sabotage independence just to fuck her over? Well, maybe. Anyone who thinks he wouldn't REALLY doesn't understand Scottish politics in general - and him in particular. As for the upcoming election; even before all this bollocks, I wasn't convinced the SNP could win an outright majority again. Not enough Unionists have died off yet. I've no idea what will happen but I'll take a punt at this: SNP get the most votes - again. Labour erode the Tory vote - but not enough to come second. The Tories remain the official opposition. The Lib-Dems remain largely unaffected. The Greens remain the same, unless Alba hurts them. Alba get enough votes from some of my less stable fellow Scots to take a couple from the SNP. Even if they only get enough votes for one list MSP; you know who it will be. That's Alex's plan. Believe it. First rate analysis I'll be keeping a close eye on what policies Alba will be proposing. My first vote will still go to the SNP (because... obviously), but I'll strongly consider sending my second vote Alba's way if theres a strong socialist underpinning to their manifesto. I think the plan to populate parliament with more pro-independence list MPs is actually pretty sound, but its come a little late in the day to make a huge impact at this election. So yeah - I agree this is Alex trying to get into a seat in time for an independence vote - he's nothing if not a glory hound. But I'll not damn him for that - I think he's earned his place. " Thank you. Like yourself, I'll be interested to see what the policies are; though the main one will, obviously, overshadow them. As I've said, this is more to do with Alex's ego than it is to do with independence for Scotland - I've just heard him described as "George Galloway minus the hat". Not entirely inaccurate. He knows, as we all do, that even if this strategy does deliver a supermajority for independence, it won't make any difference to Boris. However, it does allow for a number of possibilities. Certainly, the likelihood of him not returning to Holyrood is vanishingly small. There are only 129 seats in our Parliament. Alba would have to get fewer than 1% of the votes cast for him not to. That's going to be a right pain in the arse for Sturgeon - but she's proven she's made of stern stuff. Another possibility - again, a small one - is that enough SNP voters put a tick next to Alba for their second vote, that they are returned as the official opposition. I don't think that will happen - but, if it does, then what nature will that opposition take? Though it will be two Parties, it seems to me it will be a lot like the civil war in the Tory Party - that eventually led to Brexit. Anas Sarwar is smart enough to turn this to his advantage; maybe. Douglas Ross really isn't. Rennie's irrelevant. Harvie, unfortunately, is now neck deep in the shit. One thing that's notable, today, is that all the Unionists who are thrilled about this are still missing the point because they still don't understand the system. IF the SNP and Alba, combined, have over 50% of the 129 seats in Holyrood; that means that over 50% of Scots have voted for a Party that advocates independence for Scotland. Even John Major has said Scotland can't be kept in the UK if the majority of its voters want to leave. To argue that they can isn't sustainable - not if you actually believe in democracy. | |||
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"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? I've said it before; he just can't abide the fact that independence might happen and he won't be the leader of the party that brings it about if it does - and it's still a big IF. It always has been. As for the system - which many of our friends down south betray their ignorance of in these forums - he's not trying to split the independence vote. He's trying to involve himself in the process again. That's all. David Cameron allowed the Brexit vote because he was shit scared of losing half a dozen seats to UKIP; which is about all that would have happened under FPTP, had UKIP split the right wing vote. Up here, there's a FPTP element and a second vote for a 'list' MSP. It's a complicated process, but the bottom line is that, if your Party gets 50% of the votes, they get 50% of the seats. It's a properly representative system which is superior to purely FPTP; a flawed system which allows a Party with less than 50% of the popular vote, to have a majority - as in the current Westminster Parliament. So, up here, even though roughly 70% of Scots do not vote Tory, the Tories get their 30% of seats in Holyrood because the votes of their supporters are not simply ignored. Nor should they be. The majority of their MSPs are 'list' MSPs, ie. not directly voted for via FPTP. They are treated as equal to those directly elected; in terms of actually doing the job, if not necessarily in regard. Douglas Ross has little chance of direct election in Scotland but he will be No.1 on his Party's list, since he'll be leader when Ruth has to take her hand from up his back and move on to the HoL. So, he will be guaranteed a seat. The same is true for Anas Sarwar; which is why his challenge to stand in Nicola Sturgeon's seat means nothing - for either of them. Alex Salmond's new Party? Well, it may hoover up a fair amount of second votes. I'd be surprised if it were any more than a few. That said, they will all be from the SNP and Green Parties. His idea seems to be to force Nicola Sturgeon to work with him again, hoping she would need his votes to form a majority coalition for independence; such as she curently has with the Green Party. I'm not sure it will work. After all, what's he going to do; sabotage independence just to fuck her over? Well, maybe. Anyone who thinks he wouldn't REALLY doesn't understand Scottish politics in general - and him in particular. As for the upcoming election; even before all this bollocks, I wasn't convinced the SNP could win an outright majority again. Not enough Unionists have died off yet. I've no idea what will happen but I'll take a punt at this: SNP get the most votes - again. Labour erode the Tory vote - but not enough to come second. The Tories remain the official opposition. The Lib-Dems remain largely unaffected. The Greens remain the same, unless Alba hurts them. Alba get enough votes from some of my less stable fellow Scots to take a couple from the SNP. Even if they only get enough votes for one list MSP; you know who it will be. That's Alex's plan. Believe it. First rate analysis I'll be keeping a close eye on what policies Alba will be proposing. My first vote will still go to the SNP (because... obviously), but I'll strongly consider sending my second vote Alba's way if theres a strong socialist underpinning to their manifesto. I think the plan to populate parliament with more pro-independence list MPs is actually pretty sound, but its come a little late in the day to make a huge impact at this election. So yeah - I agree this is Alex trying to get into a seat in time for an independence vote - he's nothing if not a glory hound. But I'll not damn him for that - I think he's earned his place. Thank you. Like yourself, I'll be interested to see what the policies are; though the main one will, obviously, overshadow them. As I've said, this is more to do with Alex's ego than it is to do with independence for Scotland - I've just heard him described as "George Galloway minus the hat". Not entirely inaccurate. He knows, as we all do, that even if this strategy does deliver a supermajority for independence, it won't make any difference to Boris. However, it does allow for a number of possibilities. Certainly, the likelihood of him not returning to Holyrood is vanishingly small. There are only 129 seats in our Parliament. Alba would have to get fewer than 1% of the votes cast for him not to. That's going to be a right pain in the arse for Sturgeon - but she's proven she's made of stern stuff. Another possibility - again, a small one - is that enough SNP voters put a tick next to Alba for their second vote, that they are returned as the official opposition. I don't think that will happen - but, if it does, then what nature will that opposition take? Though it will be two Parties, it seems to me it will be a lot like the civil war in the Tory Party - that eventually led to Brexit. Anas Sarwar is smart enough to turn this to his advantage; maybe. Douglas Ross really isn't. Rennie's irrelevant. Harvie, unfortunately, is now neck deep in the shit. One thing that's notable, today, is that all the Unionists who are thrilled about this are still missing the point because they still don't understand the system. IF the SNP and Alba, combined, have over 50% of the 129 seats in Holyrood; that means that over 50% of Scots have voted for a Party that advocates independence for Scotland. Even John Major has said Scotland can't be kept in the UK if the majority of its voters want to leave. To argue that they can isn't sustainable - not if you actually believe in democracy." Alba in opposition (however unlikely) is something I think I might quite like to see if I'm honest. A pro-independence opposition will be free to examine Scottish policy without a unionist agenda driving their decisions. This can only improve policy making imo, as more energy will be directed into coming up with credible alternatives to government policy rather than automatic (and lazy) opposition policies which have no basis in political thought other than to thwart Independence. Strategically, Alba would need to position themselves to the left of the SNP in order to do this I think. Tbh, if I were Sarwar this might have me worried. With another party taking up position to the left of the SNP, this is likely to push Labour firmly into the right wing of Scottish political thought, which I can't imagine is going to be comfortable for them. Stinks for Patrick Harvie though, I agree. Which is a shame cos I've always had a lot of time for him. | |||
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"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? I've said it before; he just can't abide the fact that independence might happen and he won't be the leader of the party that brings it about if it does - and it's still a big IF. It always has been. As for the system - which many of our friends down south betray their ignorance of in these forums - he's not trying to split the independence vote. He's trying to involve himself in the process again. That's all. David Cameron allowed the Brexit vote because he was shit scared of losing half a dozen seats to UKIP; which is about all that would have happened under FPTP, had UKIP split the right wing vote. Up here, there's a FPTP element and a second vote for a 'list' MSP. It's a complicated process, but the bottom line is that, if your Party gets 50% of the votes, they get 50% of the seats. It's a properly representative system which is superior to purely FPTP; a flawed system which allows a Party with less than 50% of the popular vote, to have a majority - as in the current Westminster Parliament. So, up here, even though roughly 70% of Scots do not vote Tory, the Tories get their 30% of seats in Holyrood because the votes of their supporters are not simply ignored. Nor should they be. The majority of their MSPs are 'list' MSPs, ie. not directly voted for via FPTP. They are treated as equal to those directly elected; in terms of actually doing the job, if not necessarily in regard. Douglas Ross has little chance of direct election in Scotland but he will be No.1 on his Party's list, since he'll be leader when Ruth has to take her hand from up his back and move on to the HoL. So, he will be guaranteed a seat. The same is true for Anas Sarwar; which is why his challenge to stand in Nicola Sturgeon's seat means nothing - for either of them. Alex Salmond's new Party? Well, it may hoover up a fair amount of second votes. I'd be surprised if it were any more than a few. That said, they will all be from the SNP and Green Parties. His idea seems to be to force Nicola Sturgeon to work with him again, hoping she would need his votes to form a majority coalition for independence; such as she curently has with the Green Party. I'm not sure it will work. After all, what's he going to do; sabotage independence just to fuck her over? Well, maybe. Anyone who thinks he wouldn't REALLY doesn't understand Scottish politics in general - and him in particular. As for the upcoming election; even before all this bollocks, I wasn't convinced the SNP could win an outright majority again. Not enough Unionists have died off yet. I've no idea what will happen but I'll take a punt at this: SNP get the most votes - again. Labour erode the Tory vote - but not enough to come second. The Tories remain the official opposition. The Lib-Dems remain largely unaffected. The Greens remain the same, unless Alba hurts them. Alba get enough votes from some of my less stable fellow Scots to take a couple from the SNP. Even if they only get enough votes for one list MSP; you know who it will be. That's Alex's plan. Believe it. First rate analysis I'll be keeping a close eye on what policies Alba will be proposing. My first vote will still go to the SNP (because... obviously), but I'll strongly consider sending my second vote Alba's way if theres a strong socialist underpinning to their manifesto. I think the plan to populate parliament with more pro-independence list MPs is actually pretty sound, but its come a little late in the day to make a huge impact at this election. So yeah - I agree this is Alex trying to get into a seat in time for an independence vote - he's nothing if not a glory hound. But I'll not damn him for that - I think he's earned his place. Thank you. Like yourself, I'll be interested to see what the policies are; though the main one will, obviously, overshadow them. As I've said, this is more to do with Alex's ego than it is to do with independence for Scotland - I've just heard him described as "George Galloway minus the hat". Not entirely inaccurate. He knows, as we all do, that even if this strategy does deliver a supermajority for independence, it won't make any difference to Boris. However, it does allow for a number of possibilities. Certainly, the likelihood of him not returning to Holyrood is vanishingly small. There are only 129 seats in our Parliament. Alba would have to get fewer than 1% of the votes cast for him not to. That's going to be a right pain in the arse for Sturgeon - but she's proven she's made of stern stuff. Another possibility - again, a small one - is that enough SNP voters put a tick next to Alba for their second vote, that they are returned as the official opposition. I don't think that will happen - but, if it does, then what nature will that opposition take? Though it will be two Parties, it seems to me it will be a lot like the civil war in the Tory Party - that eventually led to Brexit. Anas Sarwar is smart enough to turn this to his advantage; maybe. Douglas Ross really isn't. Rennie's irrelevant. Harvie, unfortunately, is now neck deep in the shit. One thing that's notable, today, is that all the Unionists who are thrilled about this are still missing the point because they still don't understand the system. IF the SNP and Alba, combined, have over 50% of the 129 seats in Holyrood; that means that over 50% of Scots have voted for a Party that advocates independence for Scotland. Even John Major has said Scotland can't be kept in the UK if the majority of its voters want to leave. To argue that they can isn't sustainable - not if you actually believe in democracy. Alba in opposition (however unlikely) is something I think I might quite like to see if I'm honest. A pro-independence opposition will be free to examine Scottish policy without a unionist agenda driving their decisions. This can only improve policy making imo, as more energy will be directed into coming up with credible alternatives to government policy rather than automatic (and lazy) opposition policies which have no basis in political thought other than to thwart Independence. Strategically, Alba would need to position themselves to the left of the SNP in order to do this I think. Tbh, if I were Sarwar this might have me worried. With another party taking up position to the left of the SNP, this is likely to push Labour firmly into the right wing of Scottish political thought, which I can't imagine is going to be comfortable for them. Stinks for Patrick Harvie though, I agree. Which is a shame cos I've always had a lot of time for him." Fair point about Sarwar but I'm not sure he's that worried. He's clearly learned how toxic getting into bed with the Tories is. Below is what he had to say to the utterly out of his depth Douglas Ross, when he requested a meeting with Sarwar (and Rennie) in a bid to "rediscover the Better Together spirit". He didn't miss and hit the wall - and I think it betrays the Tories as his real target. Up here, in an election like this, that's a smart move - and it's his only chance of becoming leader of the opposition; which, ironically, Alba may well help him to become. "It cannot be about Nicola Sturgeon and Alex Salmond settling old scores. And it cannot be about your petty agenda of game playing. This election must be about the people of Scotland, their families and a national recovery. As you have recognised yourself, one of the largest threats to the Union is the leader of your own party." "Rather than entertain your latest desperate plea for attention, I am focusing our energy on what matters - guaranteeing a fairer recovery and a stronger Scotland. Scotland deserves a better government and - as your letter demonstrates - it deserves a better opposition." | |||
"Now Alba already have an MP in Westminster, with the defection of East Lothian MP, Kenny MacAskill. Going to be interesting in the next few weeks. One more step on the train crash journey that is Scotland's slide into being a failed state (Albania with kilts). Just got to hope when the Dear Leader demands Indy Ref 2 Boris allows all Scots to have a vote. As in Scots living outside Scotland same as people in Gibraltar were allowed a vote in Brexit. It should also be a 75% of the vote that way it would be clear that a true majority in Scotland wanted to leave the UK. This wont not go down well but it is the fairest way. " | |||
"Now Alba already have an MP in Westminster, with the defection of East Lothian MP, Kenny MacAskill. Going to be interesting in the next few weeks. " Indeed. Though I'm sure, as he did when he was a SNP MP, he'll continue to abstain on votes only affecting England. You're right, though; interesting times ahead. Which is good. As I've said already, the likelihood of Salmond not returning to Holyrood, as a list MSP, is vanishingly small. I'll not be voting for his Party because I don't want his return to be down to anything I've done. That's just a personal/conscience thing, though. It'll be interesting to see what Sarwar does. He's already told Douglas Ross - quite rightly - that he wants nothing to do with him. I think his aim will be to take as many votes from the Tories and lib-Dems as he can, in an effort to lead the opposition. To be fair, I wouldn't mind that (not that it really matters what I mind); but I'm not sure he can achieve it. Certainly, he's a far more capable politician than Ross - and, as a non-Tory, more likely to be taken seriously at FMQs. | |||
"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol
It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months
Imagine Boris trump and Alex all sat in bar, pint in hand.... nic to perhaps, all meglamaniacs together lol ghost of Maggie refusing to leave lol talking over stunts pulled, then in walks Blair and a dead sadam. ... politicians all the same really...
That's actually a hillarious thought could be a cracking spitting image sketch.
The whole thing is a spitting image sketch, wee nicola in tartan knickers acting a lot like jimmy crankie ......
Im not surprised Alex is back.... I'll be back is his punch line lol think he'll take a chunk of votes if scots see it was nic who made the grab for power..... then she can sit in losers bar with kinnock sipping bitter lemon lol
Anyway, congrats to Scotland for beating French, that's fucked your eu membership though lol "So I vote for a candidate in the election but still get 7 others who i didn't vote for who have a say over the area I live in that I never voted for and don't live in my area and really have no interest what happens to us as long as they get to pick up their salary & expenses great system | |||
"Is Boris wearing an Alex mask? Or perhaps priti is a double agent? Anything is possible with these fuckers lol
It's so fucking hillarious Alex Salmond this was his ploy all along got to admire his tenacious character and his balls in standing up there lol going to keep the media jumping up and down in the conspirsory theories for a few months
Imagine Boris trump and Alex all sat in bar, pint in hand.... nic to perhaps, all meglamaniacs together lol ghost of Maggie refusing to leave lol talking over stunts pulled, then in walks Blair and a dead sadam. ... politicians all the same really...
That's actually a hillarious thought could be a cracking spitting image sketch.
The whole thing is a spitting image sketch, wee nicola in tartan knickers acting a lot like jimmy crankie ......
Im not surprised Alex is back.... I'll be back is his punch line lol think he'll take a chunk of votes if scots see it was nic who made the grab for power..... then she can sit in losers bar with kinnock sipping bitter lemon lol
Anyway, congrats to Scotland for beating French, that's fucked your eu membership though lol
So I vote for a candidate in the election but still get 7 others who i didn't vote for who have a say over the area I live in that I never voted for and don't live in my area and really have no interest what happens to us as long as they get to pick up their salary & expenses great system "better than 365 of them... | |||
| |||
"Believe that another MP has defected to Alba. " Alba has more MP’s than Labour now from scotland. | |||
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"Will he tempt Joanna Cherry though? She's denying all the speculation but you just never know.... "I doubt she would want to be in a room alone with him. | |||
"Will he tempt Joanna Cherry though? She's denying all the speculation but you just never know.... "No you don't. I'd be very surprised if she did, though. She's a QC. Lying in public isn't going to help her image. I was just listening to Prof. Sir John Curtice. He says a candidate needs about 6% of the vote to get a list seat. Obviously, he knows way better than I do (or any of us), regarding the voting system. So, I was wrong about the chances of Alex not getting a seat being vanishingly low - they're anything but. Bearing that in mind, if you were Joanna, would you bother buggering your reputation for that; especially when your health isn't 100%? | |||
| |||
"Will he tempt Joanna Cherry though? She's denying all the speculation but you just never know....
No you don't. I'd be very surprised if she did, though. She's a QC. Lying in public isn't going to help her image.
I was just listening to Prof. Sir John Curtice. He says a candidate needs about 6% of the vote to get a list seat. Obviously, he knows way better than I do (or any of us), regarding the voting system.
So, I was wrong about the chances of Alex not getting a seat being vanishingly low - they're anything but.
Bearing that in mind, if you were Joanna, would you bother buggering your reputation for that; especially when your health isn't 100%?"Wasnt there a very public spat with Kirsty Blackman earlier this year? And didn't Ms Cherry get removed from the SNP front bench? I see that she's taking some time out for health reasons, so lets hope thats her main focus. | |||
| |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.........." Go Scotland Go | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go" Yes pls go | |||
| |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go "Why??? | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???"Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals? | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
"And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt? Wouldn't have financial difficulty? Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries? How are we governed by English Nationalists? What about the effect on the rest of the UK? | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt?
Wouldn't have financial difficulty?
Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries?
How are we governed by English Nationalists?
What about the effect on the rest of the UK?"What about the effect on the eest of the UK? Most would be happy to get rid of Scotland and usually quote that they subsidise the Scots out of their taxes. Surely this must be win-win? | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt?
Wouldn't have financial difficulty?
Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries?
How are we governed by English Nationalists?
What about the effect on the rest of the UK?
What about the effect on the eest of the UK?
Most would be happy to get rid of Scotland and usually quote that they subsidise the Scots out of their taxes.
Surely this must be win-win?"No it wouldn't the effects would be disastrous for all. That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly.I hate it and all who parrot it.I've heard enough of it to last me a lifetime. Both countries would have to untangle from one another and that would have fallout.Also Scotlands Eu membership would be under heavy conditions if it wants to join the euro. Example what do you think would happen if Corsica went independent from France? | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt?
Wouldn't have financial difficulty?
Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries?
How are we governed by English Nationalists?
What about the effect on the rest of the UK?
What about the effect on the eest of the UK?
Most would be happy to get rid of Scotland and usually quote that they subsidise the Scots out of their taxes.
Surely this must be win-win?
No it wouldn't the effects would be disastrous for all.
That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly.I hate it and all who parrot it.I've heard enough of it to last me a lifetime.
Both countries would have to untangle from one another and that would have fallout.Also Scotlands Eu membership would be under heavy conditions if it wants to join the euro.
Example what do you think would happen if Corsica went independent from France?"Exactly why spain cracked down on Catalonia. | |||
"Splitting the vote is also a neat political ploy for payback. He's already poached one SNP candidate but i'm not sure if the Scottish voting system works for splitting the vote. Any Scottish voter like to comment on their system of PR and lists, could benefit the new Alba Party? " It didn't do them any good last time out. I voted Yes, in 2014. It didn't happen. I've always said it's unlikely to, in the next decade/my lifetime. However, independence for Scotland will, eventually, happen; especially if the FPTP system isn't scrapped and sufficient of the voters of England keep returning the likes of Boris and his Cabinet to power. Once in a generation is a weak argument - especially from Tories who are content to back a PM who is more than happy to break the law - never mind his word. As for the democracy argument; if Boris thinks it's so important to preserve in Ukraine and Hong Kong - then why not Scotland? After all, most Scots voted for parties in favour of independence, at the last Holyrood election. Or is it only democracy when 44% of UK voters put an entitled liar, with no regard for the law, with no integrity, credibility or moral backbone into power? Support for independence isn't actually 50% yet - so why not just allow IndyRef2? Well, that's because if it's held under Boris' rule, support will spike over 50% - maybe even 52/48? - and he knows it. That's why he's opposed to it. Bottom line - and to repeat myself - IF (and it's a big if) Scotland becomes independent, the UK loses a third of its landmass, all the territorial water surrounding it, any oil they might want to extract from under those waters and a place to park Trident, that won't upset the NIMBY vote in England. That's something no UK government will risk; particularly the current one, or any subsequent that are similar. | |||
"Vote percentages Alba needs to win a seat. In each of the regions who it would damage. Central Scotland: 5.8% - Labour Glasgow: 5.9% - Greens Highlands: 5.5% - LibDems Lothian: 6.6% - Labour Mid Scotland 6.0% - Conservative North East Scotland : 6.2% - Greens South Scotland: 5.4% - SNP West Scotland: 5.3% - Labour " Well, events have proven Alba to be incapable of even this. They're likely to remain so. | |||
 which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers. "Pensions , currency , debt failing NHS and education for which they don't have answers . (Facepalm emoji)  | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Pensions , currency , debt failing NHS and education for which they don't have answers . (Facepalm emoji) "Much smaller population, investment in renewables and no need to support England. An oven ready deal if there ever was one. I look forward to seeing the bus. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Pensions , currency , debt failing NHS and education for which they don't have answers . (Facepalm emoji)
Much smaller population, investment in renewables and no need to support England.
An oven ready deal if there ever was one.
I look forward to seeing the bus."Support England, you realize that Scotland gets the most money per head under the Barnet formula? sorry stupid question otherwise you would not have made that statement. | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt?
Wouldn't have financial difficulty?
Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries?
How are we governed by English Nationalists?
What about the effect on the rest of the UK?
What about the effect on the eest of the UK?
Most would be happy to get rid of Scotland and usually quote that they subsidise the Scots out of their taxes.
Surely this must be win-win?
No it wouldn't the effects would be disastrous for all.
That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly.I hate it and all who parrot it.I've heard enough of it to last me a lifetime.
Both countries would have to untangle from one another and that would have fallout.Also Scotlands Eu membership would be under heavy conditions if it wants to join the euro.
Example what do you think would happen if Corsica went independent from France?Exactly why spain cracked down on Catalonia. "That was a little different that was an illegal attempt however I do acknowledge the Spanish response to its own citizens was heavy handed. I will say many things about "Scottish Independence" but they never tried to do it illegally. | |||
"Just heard the news, looks like its all kicking off again yawn.......... Go Scotland Go Yes pls go
Why???
Why remain part of a corrupt country, governed by English Nationalists which values the cost of wallpaper more highly than school meals?
And an independent Scotland wouldn't be corrupt?
Wouldn't have financial difficulty?
Don't have sea zone disputes with neighbouring countries?
How are we governed by English Nationalists?
What about the effect on the rest of the UK?
What about the effect on the eest of the UK?
Most would be happy to get rid of Scotland and usually quote that they subsidise the Scots out of their taxes.
Surely this must be win-win?
No it wouldn't the effects would be disastrous for all.
That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly.I hate it and all who parrot it.I've heard enough of it to last me a lifetime.
Both countries would have to untangle from one another and that would have fallout.Also Scotlands Eu membership would be under heavy conditions if it wants to join the euro.
Example what do you think would happen if Corsica went independent from France?"Well said, somebody who sees the bigger picture for everyone. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Pensions , currency , debt failing NHS and education for which they don't have answers . (Facepalm emoji)
Much smaller population, investment in renewables and no need to support England.
An oven ready deal if there ever was one.
I look forward to seeing the bus." support England? Really? Of course i am sure you have the facts to back that up | |||
"That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly." The Barnett Formula was introduced in 1978. | |||
"That whole Barnett formula(subsidy) thing was rubbish(to counter Yes rubbish but two wrongs don't make a right) made up by the No campaign in 2014 since been parroted endlessly. The Barnett Formula was introduced in 1978." You are indeed right I meant its use as an anti independence argument is too simplistic its really dilutes the reality of independence and its effects on the UK.Especially with the way a lot of folks bandy it about like its all zero-sum. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers. "Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets "So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries. | |||
| |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries. "Scotland's Oil Scotland's water And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health. Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region. Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro. There is no down side.. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries.
Scotland's Oil
Scotland's water
And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health.
Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region.
Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro.
There is no down side.."you are assuming that scotland would be granted the right to join the eu the day they left the uk which is pure fantasy.I would be very surprised if they ever met the criteria to join and doubt that the eu would want another external boarder to deal with. So the down side is they would have to stand on their own two feet for years without any help from the eu. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries.
Scotland's Oil
Scotland's water
And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health.
Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region.
Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro.
There is no down side.."There is when half of what you just posted is absolute waffle, where does the 350million come from?? That sounds made up like another one was. Scotland would not automatically gain ascension to the EU if it parted the uk it would take years to meet all the criteria so therefore would not have freedom of movement and the adoption of the euro would increase the cost of almost everything on sale in Scotland considerably and that's apart from business costs associated with this which would also have a negative impact on the economy hurting everyone in Scotland. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries.
Scotland's Oil
Scotland's water
And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health.
Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region.
Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro.
There is no down side..
There is when half of what you just posted is absolute waffle, where does the 350million come from?? That sounds made up like another one was. Scotland would not automatically gain ascension to the EU if it parted the uk it would take years to meet all the criteria so therefore would not have freedom of movement and the adoption of the euro would increase the cost of almost everything on sale in Scotland considerably and that's apart from business costs associated with this which would also have a negative impact on the economy hurting everyone in Scotland. "Don't worry - my head is not in the clouds but, if writing rubbish can win a referendum for Johnson then why can't the same apply for Scotland? There will be more jobs and higher wages. Cheaper fuel Less tax No more unelected beurocrats from Westminster. Yes - Scotland can go it alone. | |||
| |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries.
Scotland's Oil
Scotland's water
And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health.
Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region.
Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro.
There is no down side..
There is when half of what you just posted is absolute waffle, where does the 350million come from?? That sounds made up like another one was. Scotland would not automatically gain ascension to the EU if it parted the uk it would take years to meet all the criteria so therefore would not have freedom of movement and the adoption of the euro would increase the cost of almost everything on sale in Scotland considerably and that's apart from business costs associated with this which would also have a negative impact on the economy hurting everyone in Scotland.
Don't worry - my head is not in the clouds but, if writing rubbish can win a referendum for Johnson then why can't the same apply for Scotland?
There will be more jobs and higher wages.
Cheaper fuel
Less tax
No more unelected beurocrats from Westminster.
Yes - Scotland can go it alone.
"Well for once i DO agree with you ,you are writing rubbish. | |||
"Im looking forward to seeing the actual details which suprise,suprise will be coming later. Watching a spokesman today it seems he believes they will have automatic entry into the eu which i think is pie in the sky as they do have a waiting list to join and a strict monetary requirement. With Scotland inheriting part of the uk,s current debt i doubt if they could meet it anyway.Then there is the armed forces what they going to do about that not have one or take over the scottish regiments? so many questions and cant wait to see the answers.
Yes scotland would inherit its part of uk debt but im pretty sure it will also be due a substancial amount from all uk resources and assets So if thats the case the uk would be equally due Scottish resources and assets too.As i said im really looking forward to the nitty gritty instead of a cherry picked comparison with other countries.
Scotland's Oil
Scotland's water
And a saving of £350 million each and every week which could be used to support Scottish Health.
Freedom of movement through the EU and Schengen region.
Getting rid of the English £ and adopting the euro.
There is no down side..
There is when half of what you just posted is absolute waffle, where does the 350million come from?? That sounds made up like another one was. Scotland would not automatically gain ascension to the EU if it parted the uk it would take years to meet all the criteria so therefore would not have freedom of movement and the adoption of the euro would increase the cost of almost everything on sale in Scotland considerably and that's apart from business costs associated with this which would also have a negative impact on the economy hurting everyone in Scotland.
Don't worry - my head is not in the clouds but, if writing rubbish can win a referendum for Johnson then why can't the same apply for Scotland?
There will be more jobs and higher wages.
Cheaper fuel
Less tax
No more unelected beurocrats from Westminster.
Yes - Scotland can go it alone.
Well for once i DO agree with you ,you are writing rubbish. "Better education Higher wages Border controls Scottish European Passport No nuclear submarines Clean renewable energy The list just goes on and on.. | |||
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"Once Scotland gets into the EU they will also qualify for investment for poorer areas (called levelling up in English Tory Speak). This system was a proven success when Scotland (as part of non Sovereign UK - well the UK was actually Sovereign but most voters who wanted to leave the EU didn't actually understand that so it is easier to keep the story simple to appease that level of intellect) was in the EU. Since leaving the EU the levelling up policy has seen less money being made available and of those funds, the money channelled toward Tory seats or donors (I.e. bribes). Scotland will once again have to opportunity to be be treated equally and grants awarded on merit. There is no down side to Scottish Independence. " someones been on the pastis early today. How long do you think it will take Scotland to join the EU after leaving the uk in your personal opinion? | |||
"Once Scotland gets into the EU they will also qualify for investment for poorer areas (called levelling up in English Tory Speak). This system was a proven success when Scotland (as part of non Sovereign UK - well the UK was actually Sovereign but most voters who wanted to leave the EU didn't actually understand that so it is easier to keep the story simple to appease that level of intellect) was in the EU. Since leaving the EU the levelling up policy has seen less money being made available and of those funds, the money channelled toward Tory seats or donors (I.e. bribes). Scotland will once again have to opportunity to be be treated equally and grants awarded on merit. There is no down side to Scottish Independence. someones been on the pastis early today. How long do you think it will take Scotland to join the EU after leaving the uk in your personal opinion?" You can't jump that far ahead of things.. Let's get independence first then take things from there! When Scotland gets independence it will then apply to join the EU. That process will take as long as it takes. Fortunately there are only positives for Scotland - and Freedom from Westminster. | |||
"Once Scotland gets into the EU they will also qualify for investment for poorer areas (called levelling up in English Tory Speak). This system was a proven success when Scotland (as part of non Sovereign UK - well the UK was actually Sovereign but most voters who wanted to leave the EU didn't actually understand that so it is easier to keep the story simple to appease that level of intellect) was in the EU. Since leaving the EU the levelling up policy has seen less money being made available and of those funds, the money channelled toward Tory seats or donors (I.e. bribes). Scotland will once again have to opportunity to be be treated equally and grants awarded on merit. There is no down side to Scottish Independence. someones been on the pastis early today. How long do you think it will take Scotland to join the EU after leaving the uk in your personal opinion? You can't jump that far ahead of things.. Let's get independence first then take things from there! When Scotland gets independence it will then apply to join the EU. That process will take as long as it takes. Fortunately there are only positives for Scotland - and Freedom from Westminster. " Well just as i thought a pipe dream. Would they meet the financial criteria even to join? | |||
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"Would they meet the financial criteria even to join?" Probably not, but that hasn't stopped the EU from admitting other countries in the past. | |||
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"They already have their own currency - The POOND " Did I mention that leaving the UK would free up £350million pounds per week to spend on health care in Scotland? There are no downsides to Scottish Independence | |||
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"As someone who voted for independence in 2014, I'm now glad we didn't get it. All these figures thrown about saying we will save this and build that. Scotland will be part of the EU? Christ knows how "Interestingly enough, I voted against Scottish Independence in 2014 and, had the status quo remained (remaining in the EU and not having a lying and corrupt goverment in Westminster), I would have voted the same again. ..times change | |||
"As someone who voted for independence in 2014, I'm now glad we didn't get it. All these figures thrown about saying we will save this and build that. Scotland will be part of the EU? Christ knows how "I agree I also voted for Independence but I am off totally opposite thoughts now I believe the nuclear deterrents should remain in Scotland I believe we should increase oil and gas production and exploration I voted for Brexit and to leave the EU Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for. I read that Scottish pensioners receiving state pension fully believe that should Scotland gain independence, the working people of England will have to pay Scottish state pension I am sure this would go down well | |||
"As someone who voted for independence in 2014, I'm now glad we didn't get it. All these figures thrown about saying we will save this and build that. Scotland will be part of the EU? Christ knows how
I agree
I also voted for Independence but I am off totally opposite thoughts now
I believe the nuclear deterrents should remain in Scotland
I believe we should increase oil and gas production and exploration
I voted for Brexit and to leave the EU
Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for.
I read that Scottish pensioners receiving state pension fully believe that should Scotland gain independence, the working people of England will have to pay Scottish state pension
I am sure this would go down well "I think that given that the UK pension scheme is one of the poorest in Europe, that is a minor matter in the grand scheme of things. Just a case of shaking the money tree as Johnson has shown so often these last few years. £37billion wasted on t&t £11b given to mates for fake p&p payments Illegal claims for furlough ignored The list goes on and on If there is money to burn for Tory doners and the Tory friends & family scheme then there is money for pensions. | |||
" Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for. " Tell your family, friends, neighbours… spread the word | |||
" Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for. Tell your family, friends, neighbours… spread the word "The word has been spread and the snp will defeat the red and blue tories once again like they have in every election since she came to power | |||
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" Oh god your membership of the cult is taking over all reason They fail continually in every devolved power they possess. It like Trumps reign will end badly, the knives are out for Sturgeon from a clique within her own party." Ah-ha Project Fear is alive and well! An Independent Scotland - no down sides plus... Did I mention Burgendy passports? | |||
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" It would explain the continuing fiasco they preside over. From the govt who cannot build a car ferry, meanwhile 6 miles up river they are building state of the art warships with all the latest systems. Yet even now the Sturgeon led government are all scrambling like rats to avoid taking the blame for this latest screw up ." ...yes, pretty bad isn't it. Just as well we are leaving then so the English don't need to subsidise these disasters any more. They can concentrate on lining their own pockets... | |||
" Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for. Tell your family, friends, neighbours… spread the word
The word has been spread and the snp will defeat the red and blue tories once again like they have in every election since she came to power"Ray40 understands what’s really going on in Scotland. Many more will follow | |||
" It would explain the continuing fiasco they preside over. From the govt who cannot build a car ferry, meanwhile 6 miles up river they are building state of the art warships with all the latest systems. Yet even now the Sturgeon led government are all scrambling like rats to avoid taking the blame for this latest screw up . ...yes, pretty bad isn't it. Just as well we are leaving then so the English don't need to subsidise these disasters any more. They can concentrate on lining their own pockets..." If only | |||
" Basically I am now against every single thing Nicola Sturgeon stands for. Tell your family, friends, neighbours… spread the word
The word has been spread and the snp will defeat the red and blue tories once again like they have in every election since she came to power
Ray40 understands what’s really going on in Scotland. Many more will follow "You said the same a few years ago and snp have got stronger and won every election, so what makes you beleive many will follow ray40? | |||
" Oh god your membership of the cult is taking over all reason They fail continually in every devolved power they possess. It like Trumps reign will end badly, the knives are out for Sturgeon from a clique within her own party." Im not in any cult,i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp | |||
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"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp" They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland?" I beleive that they could | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland?" I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help? | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?" Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own? | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own?" In theory i agree but wonder if it would morally be the thing to do. I also seem to recall on the news ages ago that at one point during the last campaign Scotland wanted to use the pound which they are entitled to do, but wanted the bank of England as the guarantor. It was also mentioned that when Scotland was independent before many many years ago, it did not go well | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own? In theory i agree but wonder if it would morally be the thing to do. I also seem to recall on the news ages ago that at one point during the last campaign Scotland wanted to use the pound which they are entitled to do, but wanted the bank of England as the guarantor. It was also mentioned that when Scotland was independent before many many years ago, it did not go well" Are you referring to when the 6th King James of Scotland also became James 1st of England? Yes - that did not go well.. | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own? In theory i agree but wonder if it would morally be the thing to do. I also seem to recall on the news ages ago that at one point during the last campaign Scotland wanted to use the pound which they are entitled to do, but wanted the bank of England as the guarantor. It was also mentioned that when Scotland was independent before many many years ago, it did not go well Are you referring to when the 6th King James of Scotland also became James 1st of England? Yes - that did not go well.. " sounds about the right time line though the report did not go into the monarch much. It was saying that they were at one point independant and then not. Do you think if the worst comes to the worst for Scotland, that the rest of the UK should help? I don't think they will go like that, but if they did, then what? | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own? In theory i agree but wonder if it would morally be the thing to do. I also seem to recall on the news ages ago that at one point during the last campaign Scotland wanted to use the pound which they are entitled to do, but wanted the bank of England as the guarantor. It was also mentioned that when Scotland was independent before many many years ago, it did not go well Are you referring to when the 6th King James of Scotland also became James 1st of England? Yes - that did not go well.. sounds about the right time line though the report did not go into the monarch much. It was saying that they were at one point independant and then not. Do you think if the worst comes to the worst for Scotland, that the rest of the UK should help? I don't think they will go like that, but if they did, then what? " Scotland went broke because of a crazy ambitious adventure called The Darien scheme to set up The New Caledonia in The Gulf of Darien by The Companyof Scotland, Panama. It lost 20% of all Scotlands money. I don't think a independent Scotland would doing that again. | |||
"i vote for the party that wants the best for scotland and for me and many others thats snp They might want the best for Scotland, but are they capable of delivering it? And I don't mean winning independence, I mean are they capable of running a an independent Scotland? I would hope so after all the time they have had to prepare for it. They should be able to but not a given. If after independence they get into serious problems, is the rest of the UK obliged to step in and help?Nope why would they once they have gone it on their own? In theory i agree but wonder if it would morally be the thing to do. I also seem to recall on the news ages ago that at one point during the last campaign Scotland wanted to use the pound which they are entitled to do, but wanted the bank of England as the guarantor. It was also mentioned that when Scotland was independent before many many years ago, it did not go well Are you referring to when the 6th King James of Scotland also became James 1st of England? Yes - that did not go well.. sounds about the right time line though the report did not go into the monarch much. It was saying that they were at one point independant and then not. Do you think if the worst comes to the worst for Scotland, that the rest of the UK should help? I don't think they will go like that, but if they did, then what? " That was a splinter faction of the yes campaign(not the official campaign) that went into that rubbish about the once independence completely ignoring the prevalence of Sophia supporters throughout Scotland at the time. That depends how would it come to the worst is the main question but basically this wouldn't be an Ireland situation the states would have no obligation to each other.The rest of UK would cease obligations to defend Scottish territory. The official yes line was that the pound would be kept as an interim to join the euro but every pound and Euro specialist said that Scotland would have to make sacrifices to stay in either while neither would have any obligations to Scotland. | |||
