FabSwingers.com > Forums > Politics > I apologise, I was wrong about Brexit
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"The pound has soared against the Euro, from 1.10 upto 1.13 already, Goldman Sachs predict a bumper UK economic year: “Economists said US GDP could grow by 10% in the second quarter of 2021 and a huge 19% in the UK.“ Moderate inflation increases, which is a sign of economic health, and already signs of a long overdue increase in British productivity. I knew Brexit would be good for us, I apologise because even I didn’t think our countries revival would be so soon. " I really hope it does turn out well and will happily admit I was wrong. | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ " Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? " You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms | |||
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"The pound has soared against the Euro, from 1.10 upto 1.13 already, Goldman Sachs predict a bumper UK economic year: “Economists said US GDP could grow by 10% in the second quarter of 2021 and a huge 19% in the UK.“ Moderate inflation increases, which is a sign of economic health, and already signs of a long overdue increase in British productivity. I knew Brexit would be good for us, I apologise because even I didn’t think our countries revival would be so soon. " Its very Easy to beat A big fat Zero | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms " ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim " I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' " Some, that is a bit vague, | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, " Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it " Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? " The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. | |||
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"The pound has soared against the Euro, from 1.10 upto 1.13 already, Goldman Sachs predict a bumper UK economic year: “Economists said US GDP could grow by 10% in the second quarter of 2021 and a huge 19% in the UK.“ Moderate inflation increases, which is a sign of economic health, and already signs of a long overdue increase in British productivity. I knew Brexit would be good for us, I apologise because even I didn’t think our countries revival would be so soon. " Would hold your horses on that one. GDP will be up and down like a yo yo until Covid is over. With a quick Google you can see it rose 22% between April-September, but was still 8% bellow February GDP which no doubt would have been lower than pre covid gdp. We are clearly in recession atm. But most of the world will be in the same boat. | |||
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"The pound has soared against the Euro, from 1.10 upto 1.13 already, Goldman Sachs predict a bumper UK economic year: “Economists said US GDP could grow by 10% in the second quarter of 2021 and a huge 19% in the UK.“ Moderate inflation increases, which is a sign of economic health, and already signs of a long overdue increase in British productivity. I knew Brexit would be good for us, I apologise because even I didn’t think our countries revival would be so soon. " | |||
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"The economist is claiming the forecast is grim so I guess it depends which experts you listen too." The economist shows were up 4.5% of last year | |||
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"The economist is claiming the forecast is grim so I guess it depends which experts you listen too. The economist shows were up 4.5% of last year " https://www.economist.com/britain/2021/01/14/britains-immediate-economic-prospects-are-grim | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part." Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part." Sorry to disappoint you but you must have been dreaming? Strangely enough I had the same dream along with a few million other people. No doubt the remainiacs will say we was having a nightmare! | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP " I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. | |||
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"The economist is claiming the forecast is grim so I guess it depends which experts you listen too. The economist shows were up 4.5% of last year https://www.economist.com/britain/2021/01/14/britains-immediate-economic-prospects-are-grim" Did you read the headline and miss the graphs?? | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"The economist is claiming the forecast is grim so I guess it depends which experts you listen too. The economist shows were up 4.5% of last year https://www.economist.com/britain/2021/01/14/britains-immediate-economic-prospects-are-grim Did you read the headline and miss the graphs??" I quoted the headline which said the prospects look grim. I then said it depends which experts you listen too. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021." And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"The economist is claiming the forecast is grim so I guess it depends which experts you listen too. The economist shows were up 4.5% of last year https://www.economist.com/britain/2021/01/14/britains-immediate-economic-prospects-are-grim Did you read the headline and miss the graphs?? I quoted the headline which said the prospects look grim. I then said it depends which experts you listen too." The headline says one thing but he data within the same website another | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? " You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad " Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ?" No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? " It looks that way, I guess highlighting that something isn’t as shit that it could have been is a sign of ‘victory’ | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink." You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? " We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate " Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery." Twittery love it sums them up nicely. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015??" Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year " But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery." I think you should, how much are you going hope to make in compensation? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. " And what does this prove? | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery." Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment." You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? " It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it." But Brexit is getting the credit when it goes up? | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere " Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it." So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. " The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether. | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether." The Empire?? . Why were you living in the ‘Empire’ whilst we were in the EU? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? " Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? " | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? " Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it?" When are you expecting the pound to grow to pre referendum figures. Eg the average for 2015 was 1.377 | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether." Can you elaborate on "everyone should have got on board"? And can you elaborate on what you mean by "Left the empire altogether" ? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it? When are you expecting the pound to grow to pre referendum figures. Eg the average for 2015 was 1.377 " I'm not expecting it to grow to that. We are in the middle of a pandemic and soon to be a worldwide recession. Why can't we go back to 2009 when it was lower than it is now? Was Brexit the reason for that too? Or can we accept that the cause then was a global banking crisis? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it? When are you expecting the pound to grow to pre referendum figures. Eg the average for 2015 was 1.377 I'm not expecting it to grow to that. We are in the middle of a pandemic and soon to be a worldwide recession. Why can't we go back to 2009 when it was lower than it is now? Was Brexit the reason for that too? Or can we accept that the cause then was a global banking crisis? " So what's the summary of what we're celebrating here? | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it? When are you expecting the pound to grow to pre referendum figures. Eg the average for 2015 was 1.377 I'm not expecting it to grow to that. We are in the middle of a pandemic and soon to be a worldwide recession. Why can't we go back to 2009 when it was lower than it is now? Was Brexit the reason for that too? Or can we accept that the cause then was a global banking crisis? " We were told for years the crash was due to labour | |||
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"I can’t post memes here, but all I have in my head is the Mad Max one - ‘that’s bait’ Ha, I thought the same . I am glad we now have a true and accurate measurement of the success of Brexit. The strength of the pound compared to the EURO is the only comparator, is that correct OP? You completely missed the economists predictions. When the economists predicted that our economy would be annihilated due to Brexit all the Remainers were up in arms ‘All the remainers’ ??? Do you have any data to back up that claim I'll rescind that and say 'some remainers' Some, that is a bit vague, Is it? There's plenty of data to show that 'some' were up in arms over it Can you show me the link? Btw, are the current economic forecast by Goldman Sachs accurate? The link for Remainers being up in arms over economic forecasts? No I can't, that would mean me finding information for which is freely available. If you wanna argue that my statement is false then get your own data to show so. Current Forecasts, I have no idea. I just stated you missed that part. Yeah, show me the link that proves your statement. The latest Goldman Sachs UK GDP forecasts dated 8th Jan 2021 contradict the OP I don't need to prove the statement. It's my own pov. You are correct on the latest forecast though. GS put us at +5.6% for 2021. And can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? You can't accept that an increase twice the targeted rate is successful? No I know why you're so pessimistic all the time. Even good news is seen as bad Based on an economist’s forecast? Are all economists forecasts accurate? I will ask you again, can you highlight the part of the article that states that these figures indicate the success of Brexit ? No I cannot. And the reason for the is GDP is measured on more than one issue. We both know that whatever happens isn't solely due to Brexit. However, I guarantee Brexit will be blamed should it shrink. You ‘guarantee’?? Your making a lot of assumptions. At least you have acknowledged that the OP is inaccurate Yes I guarantee it. A comment above regards the strength of sterling kinda proves my point. Apparently it declined because of the Brexit vote. Do we just omit the fact that the decline started late 2015?? Yes, the strength of the pound fluctuates throughout every year But it didn't fluctuate. It started to decline and kept going before and after the vote. And what does this prove? It proves that the point declined before Brexit yet Brexit gets the blame for it. So any increase in the pounds value isn’t down to Brexit either?? Why not? The pound declined before Brexit, therefore can't be attributed to that vote. It's increasing 'all be it not by much' now that we have left the EU. So it can be attributed. If you choose not to accept that then that's cool but it doesn't mean others have to think the same way as you I see, so if the pound grows again in 2021 then it can’t be attributed to Brexit but if it goes down it can’t?? Whether it goes up or down now it can be. What's so hard to understand? Do you think that because my argument is pro Brexit on this occasion that i won't accept any bad from it? When are you expecting the pound to grow to pre referendum figures. Eg the average for 2015 was 1.377 I'm not expecting it to grow to that. We are in the middle of a pandemic and soon to be a worldwide recession. Why can't we go back to 2009 when it was lower than it is now? Was Brexit the reason for that too? Or can we accept that the cause then was a global banking crisis? " Sure, let’s go back to 2009 , the average was 1.12, | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether. Can you elaborate on "everyone should have got on board"? And can you elaborate on what you mean by "Left the empire altogether" ?" On board is the opposite of braying and whinging in a twittish manner Leave is the opposite of staying and annoying the rest of us Can’t really dumb it down for you anymore than that. | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether. Can you elaborate on "everyone should have got on board"? And can you elaborate on what you mean by "Left the empire altogether" ? On board is the opposite of braying and whinging in a twittish manner Leave is the opposite of staying and annoying the rest of us Can’t really dumb it down for you anymore than that. " So you're suggesting that political dissent should have ended after the referendum and we should all just accept the brexit sandwich without speaking up. Or we should leave the UK (I assume that's what you mean by "empire"). So anyway on that bizarre note. I'll leave you to you to wildly celebrate the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere you imagine said it would be. | |||
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"What are we celebrating here? The pound is worth way less than before the referendum when we voted for the brexit sandwich. We we saying that the pound not being as devalued as someone somewhere predicted is cause for jubilation? We’ve.......just.......left...... After five years of ludicrous hysterical outpourings of wokeness. I’m considering starting a class action against the remainers who have caused so much economic damage to this country with their Twittery. Just so we're clear. You're now suggesting that the economic damage caused by brexit is the fault of people who are alert to social injustice, and Remainers. Well, we've known that remainers have been one of the main scapegoats for Brexiteers, but now woke people too. You should post more of your thoughts. This is top notch entertainment. You have to be fair to him, he has had an unhappy life for over 40 years were he has blamed the EU , he has to direct that blame elsewhere Woke people is my favourite so far. Although I still like the irony of blaming people who voted against brexit, for the damage caused by brexit. Still, it's all for fun. The economy and markets hate uncertainty. Once we had the democratic vote, that should have been it, everyone should have got on board or left the Empire altogether. Can you elaborate on "everyone should have got on board"? And can you elaborate on what you mean by "Left the empire altogether" ? On board is the opposite of braying and whinging in a twittish manner Leave is the opposite of staying and annoying the rest of us Can’t really dumb it down for you anymore than that. " When did you start to become ‘unhappy’ about the EU and what did you do about this anguish? | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate." So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate." Indeed, what are they apologising for? | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. " I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage. | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage." | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage." Damage? Are you a snowflake ? | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage." And breathe... You'll get no apology. Either leaving the EU works out or it doesn't. The time of speculation is now over. Can't blame Remainers, can't blame the EU, can't blame Covid-19. That you would still seek a scapegoat after we've left actually shows lack of confidence and conviction. I genuinely hope it all works out for all of us but these outbursts make me think that the pressure is on to deliver. | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage." Is everything okay? | |||
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"Seems like the remainers have run out of steam a bit ITT. I think now apologies from them to the country would be appropriate. So in summary, you started a self trolling thread. Then suggested that anyone who doesn't blindly follow the pro-brexit narrative without question, should leave the UK (which you voted for us not be able to do). And now you want remainers to apologise for some unspecified reason, to the country. I’m reading between the lines there that you are now more of a Brexiteer. Yes I think apologies are appropriate, five years of nonsensical shrieking twittery has caused us a lot of damage. And breathe... You'll get no apology. Either leaving the EU works out or it doesn't. The time of speculation is now over. Can't blame Remainers, can't blame the EU, can't blame Covid-19. That you would still seek a scapegoat after we've left actually shows lack of confidence and conviction. I genuinely hope it all works out for all of us but these outbursts make me think that the pressure is on to deliver." Spot on, there are a number of Brexit voters who need reassurance and validation , that is why they continue with the Anti Eu threads and pathetic attempts to find Brexit benefits . The EU was and still is an obsession to them, it is sad to see | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.." I'd like to know too. Personally, if the rich get richer then it's failed...Horribly! | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.." It's a good question Maybe they should have campaigned on the ticket..vote for Brexit now and your grandkids may seem some benefit? Stick that on the side of a bus and see how the vote goes . | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.." It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight." Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? " I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. | |||
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"I take the post above seriously, I do, but most of us know you will never get a remainer admitting to any level of success of Brexit by whichever measure you like. What is clear is that Brussels was a domesday machine for many sectors in this and other countries. The closure of Ford Southampton, Peugeot Ryton, the halving of the UK fishing fleet and landings, repeat failures to get the French and Germans to even play by the rules (British sheep burned, Italian wine poured away), etc etc it is a catalogue of corruption that is unreformable. Anyway, many of use Brexiteers are actually very outward looking, both friendly with other European countries and the rest of the world. We tend to find it is the shrieking harpie remainers who are far more close minded, who don’t believe in exceptionalism, who constantly put this country down while tucking into their fish supper and peroni in front of bargain hunt. " I prefer salvage hunters as they like to visit our European friends , Bargain hunt is based in the UK . Can you remind me what was the purpose and motivation for starting this thread? | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country." And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? " If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country." Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time" If it was a failure..should any responsibility be laid anywhere? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart." And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"I take the post above seriously, I do, but most of us know you will never get a remainer admitting to any level of success of Brexit by whichever measure you like. What is clear is that Brussels was a domesday machine for many sectors in this and other countries. The closure of Ford Southampton, Peugeot Ryton, the halving of the UK fishing fleet and landings, repeat failures to get the French and Germans to even play by the rules (British sheep burned, Italian wine poured away), etc etc it is a catalogue of corruption that is unreformable. Anyway, many of use Brexiteers are actually very outward looking, both friendly with other European countries and the rest of the world. We tend to find it is the shrieking harpie remainers who are far more close minded, who don’t believe in exceptionalism, who constantly put this country down while tucking into their fish supper and peroni in front of bargain hunt. " So - the answer you would provide is that there is no measure. Surely, all the pain has to give a better future? Better standard of living perhaps? Better education? But it seems not. It takes as long as it will take to be better but nobody had defined what better is. It matters nothing to me. I live in France so am just an onlooker. It is your future. Your choice. I would have thought that before making it you would have had a measure or a target. Sorry... sovereignty That eleven letter word. Means so much. Take back control. Absolutely. I have answered my own question. Silly me - I forgot. And of course, Turkey. How could I forget that. We don't want Turkish people to have free travel to the UK. But... Turkey is not on the EU. Silly me. It was Farage who told us that. I should know better So, sovereignty it is then. Well done. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time" Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time If it was a failure..should any responsibility be laid anywhere?" Looking to lay blame as usual | |||
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"The pound has soared against the Euro, from 1.10 upto 1.13 already, Goldman Sachs predict a bumper UK economic year: “Economists said US GDP could grow by 10% in the second quarter of 2021 and a huge 19% in the UK.“ Moderate inflation increases, which is a sign of economic health, and already signs of a long overdue increase in British productivity. I knew Brexit would be good for us, I apologise because even I didn’t think our countries revival would be so soon. " Look over your shoulder.. You might be being chased by fishermen swinging a halibut yo hit you with | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart." Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, " I am a rational person You'd probably find a lot of Brexit voters are but having been constantly pilloried and antagonized since the vote a lot now just backlash. You probably would never believe it but I'm neither what I myself would class as a Tory or a Brexiteer | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, I am a rational person You'd probably find a lot of Brexit voters are but having been constantly pilloried and antagonized since the vote a lot now just backlash. You probably would never believe it but I'm neither what I myself would class as a Tory or a Brexiteer " Out of interest, what would you class as a Tory or a Brexit supporter? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, I am a rational person You'd probably find a lot of Brexit voters are but having been constantly pilloried and antagonized since the vote a lot now just backlash. You probably would never believe it but I'm neither what I myself would class as a Tory or a Brexiteer " We all realise that people like the OP aren't standard brexiteers. They're just the ones that make the most noise, so they become the stereotype. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. " See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet." Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. | |||
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"I take the post above seriously, I do, but most of us know you will never get a remainer admitting to any level of success of Brexit by whichever measure you like. What is clear is that Brussels was a domesday machine for many sectors in this and other countries. The closure of Ford Southampton, Peugeot Ryton, the halving of the UK fishing fleet and landings, repeat failures to get the French and Germans to even play by the rules (British sheep burned, Italian wine poured away), etc etc it is a catalogue of corruption that is unreformable. Anyway, many of use Brexiteers are actually very outward looking, both friendly with other European countries and the rest of the world. We tend to find it is the shrieking harpie remainers who are far more close minded, who don’t believe in exceptionalism, who constantly put this country down while tucking into their fish supper and peroni in front of bargain hunt. So - the answer you would provide is that there is no measure. Surely, all the pain has to give a better future? Better standard of living perhaps? Better education? But it seems not. It takes as long as it will take to be better but nobody had defined what better is. It matters nothing to me. I live in France so am just an onlooker. It is your future. Your choice. I would have thought that before making it you would have had a measure or a target. Sorry... sovereignty That eleven letter word. Means so much. Take back control. Absolutely. I have answered my own question. Silly me - I forgot. And of course, Turkey. How could I forget that. We don't want Turkish people to have free travel to the UK. But... Turkey is not on the EU. Silly me. It was Farage who told us that. I should know better So, sovereignty it is then. Well done." Ah don’t worry I was way ahead of you. We get those faux naive remainer questions all the time in the politics forum, all “open minded, just tell me” and then it turns out, big surprise, you’re not interested in any other viewpoint and you have your own agenda. Rest assured there are many like you on this forum, you’ll find friends here | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, I am a rational person You'd probably find a lot of Brexit voters are but having been constantly pilloried and antagonized since the vote a lot now just backlash. You probably would never believe it but I'm neither what I myself would class as a Tory or a Brexiteer Out of interest, what would you class as a Tory or a Brexit supporter? " It's the same answer to both. Someone who will not even consider an opposing argument. That also goes goes Remainers, Labour voters, Green voters etc. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. " Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them?" Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time" Me too but if we rejoined and it wasn't a success in 3 weeks i would want another one. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time Again, fair comment, you seem more rational and realistic than most Brexit voters on here, I am a rational person You'd probably find a lot of Brexit voters are but having been constantly pilloried and antagonized since the vote a lot now just backlash. You probably would never believe it but I'm neither what I myself would class as a Tory or a Brexiteer Out of interest, what would you class as a Tory or a Brexit supporter? It's the same answer to both. Someone who will not even consider an opposing argument. That also goes goes Remainers, Labour voters, Green voters etc." I voted remain, I accepted the result and was looking forward to some of the benefits that we were promised . I know we have technically only just left but if this takes 50 years to be back to where we were in 2016 then it hasn’t been worth it. It has cost the country a fortune and we are still paying the EU . This is money that could have been spent on the NHS etc, | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time If it was a failure..should any responsibility be laid anywhere? Looking to lay blame as usual " Simple question Yes or no? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the timeMe too but if we rejoined and it wasn't a success in 3 weeks i would want another one. " 3 weeks? We voted to leave in 2016, | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish " I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that." The EU don’t govern the UK though, | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. The EU don’t govern the UK though, " A good job too. | |||
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"I take the post above seriously, I do, but most of us know you will never get a remainer admitting to any level of success of Brexit by whichever measure you like. What is clear is that Brussels was a domesday machine for many sectors in this and other countries. The closure of Ford Southampton, Peugeot Ryton, the halving of the UK fishing fleet and landings, repeat failures to get the French and Germans to even play by the rules (British sheep burned, Italian wine poured away), etc etc it is a catalogue of corruption that is unreformable. Anyway, many of use Brexiteers are actually very outward looking, both friendly with other European countries and the rest of the world. We tend to find it is the shrieking harpie remainers who are far more close minded, who don’t believe in exceptionalism, who constantly put this country down while tucking into their fish supper and peroni in front of bargain hunt. So - the answer you would provide is that there is no measure. Surely, all the pain has to give a better future? Better standard of living perhaps? Better education? But it seems not. It takes as long as it will take to be better but nobody had defined what better is. It matters nothing to me. I live in France so am just an onlooker. It is your future. Your choice. I would have thought that before making it you would have had a measure or a target. Sorry... sovereignty That eleven letter word. Means so much. Take back control. Absolutely. I have answered my own question. Silly me - I forgot. And of course, Turkey. How could I forget that. We don't want Turkish people to have free travel to the UK. But... Turkey is not on the EU. Silly me. It was Farage who told us that. I should know better So, sovereignty it is then. Well done. Ah don’t worry I was way ahead of you. We get those faux naive remainer questions all the time in the politics forum, all “open minded, just tell me” and then it turns out, big surprise, you’re not interested in any other viewpoint and you have your own agenda. Rest assured there are many like you on this forum, you’ll find friends here " And you’ve neatly proved my point about close minded remainers | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. The EU don’t govern the UK though, A good job too. " You are agreeing with something that never happened and would never have happened if we stayed in the EU. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. The EU don’t govern the UK though, " I never said they did. We didn't vote to have them not govern the UK. We voted to leave the Union. Having said that, according to the EU. Part of their purpose is to enact legislation in justice and home affairs. | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet." we arnt allowed different views on here not to some remainers they still won’t accept 17.4 million voted leave they roll out the red bud crap then the insults | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that." It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet.we arnt allowed different views on here not to some remainers they still won’t accept 17.4 million voted leave they roll out the red bud crap then the insults " Weird. Haven't seen anyone saying they don't accept that more people voted leave than voted remain. | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. The EU don’t govern the UK though, I never said they did. We didn't vote to have them not govern the UK. We voted to leave the Union. Having said that, according to the EU. Part of their purpose is to enact legislation in justice and home affairs." When are they going to enforce this? Or is it something that is just a proposal | |||
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"Anyone want to answer my question? Tell me what benifit we have to look forward to by leaving the EU and perhaps, when we will see this. If the second part is too complicated, please ignore." I gave you a thoughtful honest answer above, have a look | |||
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"Anyone want to answer my question? Tell me what benifit we have to look forward to by leaving the EU and perhaps, when we will see this. If the second part is too complicated, please ignore. I gave you a thoughtful honest answer above, have a look " You got angry and insulted people. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. " It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you | |||
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"Anyone want to answer my question? Tell me what benifit we have to look forward to by leaving the EU and perhaps, when we will see this. If the second part is too complicated, please ignore." I would also like to know the answer to this . Something tangible that we can look forward to in the future | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you" I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. " According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave" Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. | |||
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"Anyone want to answer my question? Tell me what benifit we have to look forward to by leaving the EU and perhaps, when we will see this. If the second part is too complicated, please ignore." The problem is,the benefits we were told were vague concepts like 'taking back control ' How do you measure something like that? | |||
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"And .. nobody can actually tell me what all this pain has actually been for. ..which I think sums up things quite nicely Quelle surprise " Exactly. | |||
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"Anyone want to answer my question? Tell me what benifit we have to look forward to by leaving the EU and perhaps, when we will see this. If the second part is too complicated, please ignore. The problem is,the benefits we were told were vague concepts like 'taking back control ' How do you measure something like that?" True, they made them purposefully vague so that they can mean different things to different people . Another example is ‘sovereignty’ | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. " See you tomorrow The question of “what benefits” has been asked ad infinitum by remainers on this forum, which is telling in itself as they used to say how disadvantaged we would be. They consistently show themselves uninterested in reasoned examples, to them literally everything is “insignificant” or “same as we had” etc etc To many of them, in a nation of animal lovers, animal welfare is apparently insignificant. Pacific bowl trade deals are tiny. The mental leaps they have to make are mind boggling to reconcile their wokeness with their lack of ambition. | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. See you tomorrow The question of “what benefits” has been asked ad infinitum by remainers on this forum, which is telling in itself as they used to say how disadvantaged we would be. They consistently show themselves uninterested in reasoned examples, to them literally everything is “insignificant” or “same as we had” etc etc To many of them, in a nation of animal lovers, animal welfare is apparently insignificant. Pacific bowl trade deals are tiny. The mental leaps they have to make are mind boggling to reconcile their wokeness with their lack of ambition." Animal rights during transport is certainly a benefit. The pacific bowl trade deal???? Has this been signed | |||
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"Negatives - Financially worse off - Borders where they’re weren’t before (internal & external - Limited physical access to the EU - Import/Export beaurocracy - Reduction in Overseas Aid - Ruination of Britains standing in the International Community as we can’t be trusted in agreements - Loss of access to Security Data - Loss of access to Scientific and Education exchange - Loss of London being the major Financial Centre in Europe - Capital flow to Dublin, Paris, Frankfurt - Increased Tariffs & costs to goods from Europe (we buy most commercial goods from here) - Loss of employment opportunities for people who worked in Europe - Additional £7bn in costs to administer eu trade - Fishing Industry screwed - Some people are a lot less happy - & many more Positives - We will not spend ~£200m per week to the EU - Some people feel a bit happier Net - Financially way worse off - No strong difference between happy/unhappy Conclusion - What the fuck have we done this for?" We’ve broken no agreements, it’s called negotiating, London is still and will always be the Worlds financial centre, Brussels screwed our fishing industry over the past 44 years, we have the same physical access as before, overseas aid don’t get me started (Indian space programme), etc etc etc | |||
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"Negatives - Financially worse off - Borders where they’re weren’t before (internal & external - Limited physical access to the EU - Import/Export beaurocracy - Reduction in Overseas Aid - Ruination of Britains standing in the International Community as we can’t be trusted in agreements - Loss of access to Security Data - Loss of access to Scientific and Education exchange - Loss of London being the major Financial Centre in Europe - Capital flow to Dublin, Paris, Frankfurt - Increased Tariffs & costs to goods from Europe (we buy most commercial goods from here) - Loss of employment opportunities for people who worked in Europe - Additional £7bn in costs to administer eu trade - Fishing Industry screwed - Some people are a lot less happy - & many more Positives - We will not spend ~£200m per week to the EU - Some people feel a bit happier Net - Financially way worse off - No strong difference between happy/unhappy Conclusion - What the fuck have we done this for? We’ve broken no agreements, it’s called negotiating, London is still and will always be the Worlds financial centre, Brussels screwed our fishing industry over the past 44 years, we have the same physical access as before, overseas aid don’t get me started (Indian space programme), etc etc etc " - we signed into law the ability to unilateraly break the treaty - we are more like NK than a trusted country - London cannot close Euro business in 18 months, Capital flight to EU, many jobs lost to EU - Our own govt has done more to screw the Fishing industry in 3 weeks than the EU did in 44 years - we do not have the same physical access. Only allowed 90 days in 185 days, so many Brits cannot stay in EU unless they get dual citizanship (usually need to show income status in country, so many cannot do it) Overseas Dev is and always has been UK Sovereign decision as to where and how it is spent. If it went on the ‘wrong stuff before’, it will only do more so now. You can’t blame the EU. Nothing positive then? | |||
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"Negatives - Financially worse off - Borders where they’re weren’t before (internal & external - Limited physical access to the EU - Import/Export beaurocracy - Reduction in Overseas Aid - Ruination of Britains standing in the International Community as we can’t be trusted in agreements - Loss of access to Security Data - Loss of access to Scientific and Education exchange - Loss of London being the major Financial Centre in Europe - Capital flow to Dublin, Paris, Frankfurt - Increased Tariffs & costs to goods from Europe (we buy most commercial goods from here) - Loss of employment opportunities for people who worked in Europe - Additional £7bn in costs to administer eu trade - Fishing Industry screwed - Some people are a lot less happy - & many more Positives - We will not spend ~£200m per week to the EU - Some people feel a bit happier Net - Financially way worse off - No strong difference between happy/unhappy Conclusion - What the fuck have we done this for?" Before the deal the question was constantly asked on here..what are the benefits? We are still waiting for an answer | |||
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"Negatives - Financially worse off - Borders where they’re weren’t before (internal & external - Limited physical access to the EU - Import/Export beaurocracy - Reduction in Overseas Aid - Ruination of Britains standing in the International Community as we can’t be trusted in agreements - Loss of access to Security Data - Loss of access to Scientific and Education exchange - Loss of London being the major Financial Centre in Europe - Capital flow to Dublin, Paris, Frankfurt - Increased Tariffs & costs to goods from Europe (we buy most commercial goods from here) - Loss of employment opportunities for people who worked in Europe - Additional £7bn in costs to administer eu trade - Fishing Industry screwed - Some people are a lot less happy - & many more Positives - We will not spend ~£200m per week to the EU - Some people feel a bit happier Net - Financially way worse off - No strong difference between happy/unhappy Conclusion - What the fuck have we done this for? We’ve broken no agreements, it’s called negotiating, London is still and will always be the Worlds financial centre, Brussels screwed our fishing industry over the past 44 years, we have the same physical access as before, overseas aid don’t get me started (Indian space programme), etc etc etc - we signed into law the ability to unilateraly break the treaty - we are more like NK than a trusted country - London cannot close Euro business in 18 months, Capital flight to EU, many jobs lost to EU - Our own govt has done more to screw the Fishing industry in 3 weeks than the EU did in 44 years - we do not have the same physical access. Only allowed 90 days in 185 days, so many Brits cannot stay in EU unless they get dual citizanship (usually need to show income status in country, so many cannot do it) Overseas Dev is and always has been UK Sovereign decision as to where and how it is spent. If it went on the ‘wrong stuff before’, it will only do more so now. You can’t blame the EU. Nothing positive then? " These fallacies have all been covered before, but if you want to be specific about specific EU foreign aid how about the 40 million spent supporting Columbian tobacco farmers at the same time as having a European anti smoking campaign? | |||
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"Negatives - Financially worse off - Borders where they’re weren’t before (internal & external - Limited physical access to the EU - Import/Export beaurocracy - Reduction in Overseas Aid - Ruination of Britains standing in the International Community as we can’t be trusted in agreements - Loss of access to Security Data - Loss of access to Scientific and Education exchange - Loss of London being the major Financial Centre in Europe - Capital flow to Dublin, Paris, Frankfurt - Increased Tariffs & costs to goods from Europe (we buy most commercial goods from here) - Loss of employment opportunities for people who worked in Europe - Additional £7bn in costs to administer eu trade - Fishing Industry screwed - Some people are a lot less happy - & many more Positives - We will not spend ~£200m per week to the EU - Some people feel a bit happier Net - Financially way worse off - No strong difference between happy/unhappy Conclusion - What the fuck have we done this for? We’ve broken no agreements, it’s called negotiating, London is still and will always be the Worlds financial centre, Brussels screwed our fishing industry over the past 44 years, we have the same physical access as before, overseas aid don’t get me started (Indian space programme), etc etc etc - we signed into law the ability to unilateraly break the treaty - we are more like NK than a trusted country - London cannot close Euro business in 18 months, Capital flight to EU, many jobs lost to EU - Our own govt has done more to screw the Fishing industry in 3 weeks than the EU did in 44 years - we do not have the same physical access. Only allowed 90 days in 185 days, so many Brits cannot stay in EU unless they get dual citizanship (usually need to show income status in country, so many cannot do it) Overseas Dev is and always has been UK Sovereign decision as to where and how it is spent. If it went on the ‘wrong stuff before’, it will only do more so now. You can’t blame the EU. Nothing positive then? These fallacies have all been covered before, but if you want to be specific about specific EU foreign aid how about the 40 million spent supporting Columbian tobacco farmers at the same time as having a European anti smoking campaign?" You are criticising the EU again instead of making a list of the benefits of Brexit | |||
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"These fallacies have all been covered before, but if you want to be specific about specific EU foreign aid how about the 40 million spent supporting Columbian tobacco farmers at the same time as having a European anti smoking campaign? Thank you Well at least you have answered my question. The UK left the EU because of the the support given to Columbian tobacco farmers was hypocritical. Now I know and can look forward to the UK no longer funding this (any more). I do wonder however why the UK did not do more when part of the EU to stop this. Lets look forward and not back - the UK had left and the Columbian tobacco farmers will no longer be funded by the UK. Phew..we have a tangible reason for the UK leaving the EU. At last. 17.4 million people (or 38% of the voting population in 2016) were right to vote leave. " | |||
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"These fallacies have all been covered before, but if you want to be specific about specific EU foreign aid how about the 40 million spent supporting Columbian tobacco farmers at the same time as having a European anti smoking campaign? Thank you Well at least you have answered my question. The UK left the EU because of the the support given to Columbian tobacco farmers was hypocritical. Now I know and can look forward to the UK no longer funding this (any more). I do wonder however why the UK did not do more when part of the EU to stop this. Lets look forward and not back - the UK had left and the Columbian tobacco farmers will no longer be funded by the UK. Phew..we have a tangible reason for the UK leaving the EU. At last. 17.4 million people (or 38% of the voting population in 2016) were right to vote leave. " Thanks for a considered response al least for the first half of your reply. Then like lots of others you diminish your credibility with me by pretending 38% of the entire voting population isn’t very considerably more than haver voted for the winner of a general election. I mean how does your 33% stack up then. Absolutely ridiculous. | |||
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"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. And you would have no problem in supporting any vote to re joining the EU if Brexit turns out to be a failure? If Brexit is a failure and there is another referendum in years to come then I wouldn't argue with it. That doesn't mean I'd vote to rejoin but I'd consider the options on the table at the time" Thanks for the realistic post. On a serious note what options and points did you consider before that made your vote a leave one? I’m asking seriously not to antagonise. I don’t believe for one moment people thought just the bus and sovereignty . | |||
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. " do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ?" Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. " yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million " Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. " google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"Silly question.. didnt leave break the law over its spending?" apparantly so Christ imagine how much the spending gap would of been if they hadn’t tho | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think " Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? | |||
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"Silly question.. didnt leave break the law over its spending?apparantly so Christ imagine how much the spending gap would of been if they hadn’t tho " Apparently both sides underreported what they spent so I'm not sure how accurate that is. Fuck knows what remain spent their money on. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? " Wow. The Leave campaign as a whole lied but if The Remain Campaign lies, it's down to the individuals You do realise how ridiculous that is don't you Btw, the government stated that no tax payers money would be spent on Remain or Leave but that pamphlet was all about staying. And yes, The Leave campaign spent 700k more than they should have once the 'spending limit' kicked in. No one ever speaks of the 6m more that the Remain Campaign spent before it kicked in. Nor that 9m from government. That's 15m more for those who struggle with maths | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? " so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? " The government were legally obliged to send the leaflet? Were they also legally obliged to encourage people to vote remain in that leaflet? Good job the majority saw it for what it was and promptly placed it in the bin | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? Wow. The Leave campaign as a whole lied but if The Remain Campaign lies, it's down to the individuals You do realise how ridiculous that is don't you Btw, the government stated that no tax payers money would be spent on Remain or Leave but that pamphlet was all about staying. And yes, The Leave campaign spent 700k more than they should have once the 'spending limit' kicked in. No one ever speaks of the 6m more that the Remain Campaign spent before it kicked in. Nor that 9m from government. That's 15m more for those who struggle with maths " thank you but remainers on here will still say it was unfair remain because leave used a red bus apparantly it was the only bud in London apparantly my opinion not a fact lol | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ?" No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. " I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh " He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh " I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 " So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! " as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues?" You're deflecting from the question asked. Do you think it would've been more fair if they had spent the same amount of money? You don't need to know about spending. It's just a question to answer ased on your opinion. Also, could you point me to the subsection in the above act that states the governement was obliged to send that leaflet supporting Remain | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000" The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. " I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues? You're deflecting from the question asked. Do you think it would've been more fair if they had spent the same amount of money? You don't need to know about spending. It's just a question to answer ased on your opinion. Also, could you point me to the subsection in the above act that states the governement was obliged to send that leaflet supporting Remain" You didn't ask a question. The other person asked me a question about a complex subject, of which I do not know enough about. This act is published on line. I'm not prepared to trawl through it and then tell you which page to look at. If you think I've made up that the government was obliged to provide a leaflet detailing their position. Either look for yourself, or just think I'm telling lies. I genuinely do not care about your opinion, of my opinion of the referendum and elections act 2000. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally?" I am not claiming anything. I am telling you why the government provided a leaflet. You're claiming something contrary to this. If you can point me in the direct to learn more about how campaign funding and spending for referendums are regulated. I can read up and offer you an opinion. As I mentioned before. We all know what happens when people give a yes/no answer to something they're not informed on. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues? You're deflecting from the question asked. Do you think it would've been more fair if they had spent the same amount of money? You don't need to know about spending. It's just a question to answer ased on your opinion. Also, could you point me to the subsection in the above act that states the governement was obliged to send that leaflet supporting Remain You didn't ask a question. The other person asked me a question about a complex subject, of which I do not know enough about. This act is published on line. I'm not prepared to trawl through it and then tell you which page to look at. If you think I've made up that the government was obliged to provide a leaflet detailing their position. Either look for yourself, or just think I'm telling lies. I genuinely do not care about your opinion, of my opinion of the referendum and elections act 2000. " I further asked the question actually. That's why I typed it out instead of quoting. So you won't answer and you won't show proof of your own claim. Seems to be the way with Remainers. Ask, ask, ask. But never answer | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally? I am not claiming anything. I am telling you why the government provided a leaflet. You're claiming something contrary to this. If you can point me in the direct to learn more about how campaign funding and spending for referendums are regulated. I can read up and offer you an opinion. As I mentioned before. We all know what happens when people give a yes/no answer to something they're not informed on. " You made a claim that the government were obliged by law. You want me to point you in the direction whilst refusing to do the same in return? | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues? You're deflecting from the question asked. Do you think it would've been more fair if they had spent the same amount of money? You don't need to know about spending. It's just a question to answer ased on your opinion. Also, could you point me to the subsection in the above act that states the governement was obliged to send that leaflet supporting Remain You didn't ask a question. The other person asked me a question about a complex subject, of which I do not know enough about. This act is published on line. I'm not prepared to trawl through it and then tell you which page to look at. If you think I've made up that the government was obliged to provide a leaflet detailing their position. Either look for yourself, or just think I'm telling lies. I genuinely do not care about your opinion, of my opinion of the referendum and elections act 2000. I further asked the question actually. That's why I typed it out instead of quoting. So you won't answer and you won't show proof of your own claim. Seems to be the way with Remainers. Ask, ask, ask. But never answer " What difference would it make to you which way I answered. I don't know anything about it. Let's just pretend I answered with whatever answer will make you stop trolling. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally? I am not claiming anything. I am telling you why the government provided a leaflet. You're claiming something contrary to this. If you can point me in the direct to learn more about how campaign funding and spending for referendums are regulated. I can read up and offer you an opinion. As I mentioned before. We all know what happens when people give a yes/no answer to something they're not informed on. You made a claim that the government were obliged by law. You want me to point you in the direction whilst refusing to do the same in return? " The government claimed they were obliged to. I'm not the government. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh He doesn't know about referendum spending or that Remain spent soooooo much more money but he sure as hell knows The Elections and Referendum Act 2000 So now we're descending into pointless jabs. Do you need to be written off as another troll, or do you actually want to discuss the issues? You're deflecting from the question asked. Do you think it would've been more fair if they had spent the same amount of money? You don't need to know about spending. It's just a question to answer ased on your opinion. Also, could you point me to the subsection in the above act that states the governement was obliged to send that leaflet supporting Remain You didn't ask a question. The other person asked me a question about a complex subject, of which I do not know enough about. This act is published on line. I'm not prepared to trawl through it and then tell you which page to look at. If you think I've made up that the government was obliged to provide a leaflet detailing their position. Either look for yourself, or just think I'm telling lies. I genuinely do not care about your opinion, of my opinion of the referendum and elections act 2000. I further asked the question actually. That's why I typed it out instead of quoting. So you won't answer and you won't show proof of your own claim. Seems to be the way with Remainers. Ask, ask, ask. But never answer What difference would it make to you which way I answered. I don't know anything about it. Let's just pretend I answered with whatever answer will make you stop trolling." You should try looking up the definition of troll. | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
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Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally? I am not claiming anything. I am telling you why the government provided a leaflet. You're claiming something contrary to this. If you can point me in the direct to learn more about how campaign funding and spending for referendums are regulated. I can read up and offer you an opinion. As I mentioned before. We all know what happens when people give a yes/no answer to something they're not informed on. You made a claim that the government were obliged by law. You want me to point you in the direction whilst refusing to do the same in return? The government claimed they were obliged to. I'm not the government." 'The governement were legally obliged to send the leaflet' That was your claim, not the government's | |||
Reply privately (closed, thread got too big) |
"An interesting post and comments and delighted that so many people from both sides of the fence are so active on here. One question... Can somebody tell me what is a measure of success for Brexit? Obviously, for the Remainers here, it would have been the status quo (which would have probably had the value of the £ against the € at a higher rate than 1.13) and no queues in Dover, no problems with selling fish abroad, no factory closures as people move their business abroad but... we know all that and it is boring. We have left the EU. People and businesses will go under but others will emerge. That is what happens when such a great change takes place. No point in looking back. But can the success of Brexit be measured. Jacob Reece Mogg states that it can but, we will not know if it was a success or not for another 50 years. I won't be here in 50 years time so therefore will never find out. Does anyone here have a better insight than Jacob? Has it been a success? And if it has, how do you measure it? Surely not just a minuscule rise in the pound against the euro when , in reality, the pound has fallen to a new low. I am intrigued.. Educate me.. It's impossible to measure any success or failure within 3 weeks. If it's a success it will come in time, different things at different times. If it is 50 years then I'm unlikely to see it but I certainly didn't think that we'd suddenly become successful on our own overnight. Fair comment, how long would you ‘like’ it to take? I'd 'like' it to take as long as it takes providing any measures or deals put in place are the right ones for our country. Are there any indications that any measures or deals being put in place are the right ones for the country? Part of the reason that some people are sceptical about the whole thing, is the distrust of the government. I do not believe they have our best interests at heart. And part of the reason people voted to leave the EU is because they didn't feel they had our best interests at heart. Indeed. The right wing media did an excellent job or shifting the blame for everything wrong in this country, over to the EU. The misinformation campaign is well documented. On the other hand, we have the government who have to be shamed into feeding starving kids by UNICEF and a footballer. Meanwhile handing multi billion pound contracts to their chums for useless PPE. The EU are far from perfect, but the benefits far outweighed the negatives. See, you instantly blame the media. This is what I just commented above above antagonistic views towards Brexit voters. Accept that people are allowed to have different views to you and stop looking to blame some other outlet. Okay, but if someone's view is factually incorrect. Let's say on the EU banning bendy bananas, or the £350 mil written on the side of the bus. It's not a matter of having a different view to me. It's about someone believing false information, then voting on these beliefs. Who said I or other Brexit voters believed those statements. Or that that they voted on them? Those were just two examples to illustrate the point. Pick any you wish I don't need to pick any. You've turned it into 'right wing media lies' You don't believe the government have our best interests at heart and I don't believe the same for the EU. It's as simple as that. It's not as simple as that though. We can point at lies told by the leave campaigns all day long. We can point out lies told about the EU in the right wing media for the last 20 years. You know all this. We can look at our own government, and point out countless examples of how they've acted against our interests. Not every view is equal. My view on black hole physics is less valid than Stephen Hawkins was. The view of someone who believes we paid £350 mil a week to the EU, and that they banned bendy bananas. Is less valid than someone who has an understanding of the EU. It is that simple. There were plenty of lies on either side of that campaign. If you choose to only believe that the Leave Campaign were lying then I can't help you I don't. People lied on both sides. One side was illegally funded and convinced people to vote for a change which was based on complete rubbish. Again. None of this is opinion based. No one has been able to articulate any benefits to leaving. Where as the benefits of EU membership are well documented. To equate both sides of the argument is misleading. According to the Electoral Commission the Remain Campaign spent way more than Leave Okay. The leave campaigns were both judged in court to have been illegally funded. In anycase. I don't think we're getting anywhere. So I will leave you and the OP to celebrate the miniscule rise the pound. Which BTW has dropped since this morning, nearly back to the start of the days trading. And yet is still way way down to the value prior to the referendum. Have a good day. do you accept that remain spent millions more on there campaign than leave them ?don’t you think a fair campaign would of been if both had spent the same ? Do I accept it as fact? I don't know I didn't look into it. I took the person who posted it at their word. It would have been more fair if the leave campaigns hadn't been illegally funded. And hadn't based their campaigns on a pack of lies and meaningless slogans. yes yes you been saying that for yrs mate but do you accept that would of been more fairer if they both spent the same ?bra remain 19.3illion leave 16.3 million Maybe. I don't know much about referendum funding. I defer to the courts. google it mate it’s a fact both sides lied and both used slogans and one side spent 9 million on a leaflet campaign to every household used tax payers money I’m not sure that is in there 19.3 million either so a remainer to complain about the referendum being fair is a bit rich don’t ya think Couple of corrections. The remain campaign didn't lie. Some individual remainers lied and exaggerated. The government was legally obliged to send the leaflet. Are you suggesting that the government should have broken the law and not provided the leaflet? If you're worried about £9 mil. You'll know that in 2020 brexit cost the UK economy £9 mil every 25 minutes or so. So no, I don't think it's too much to expect the leave campaigns to comply with the law over funding, and to base their campaign on truth. Are you comfortable with them breaking the law and filling the electorate with misinformation? so I asked you a question you didn’t answer then ask me one back standard from you mate if I had a pound every time you’ve done that eh if only lol well I’ll answer no I’m not ok with that it was wrong to do that but like I said god knows if they hadn’t they would of had a lot less than the 3 million gap they had with remain amd I’m still not sure if the 9 million leaflet was part of there 19.3 do you know ? No idea. But if you have a problem with the leaflet, then you should lobby your local MP to have the referenda laws around the obligation of the government to communicate their position with the public. It's currently a legal requirement under the Elections and Referendum act 2000. I actually thought I'd answered all your questions. If you point me where I didn't I'll try to answer. I asked you don’t you think it would of been more fairer if both sides spent the same you said maybe but you don’t know much about that amd defer to the courts lol I was looking more for a simple yes or no apparantly it’s not that simple eh I can't give you a yes or no if I don't know enough about it. You know exactly what happens when people answer a yes/no question when they don't know enough about the question! as I expected mate you do it all time then expect ppl to answer yr questions you ain’t guna change now we all know that like the post above you funny how you know nowt about the referendum spending but an expert on election and referendum act 2000 The election and referendum act is public knowledge. Plus it was discussed extensively in 2016 when the government provided the leaflet laying out their position. The issue of campaign spending is extremely complex. I definitely do not understand 99% of how it's regulated. I'm aware that it's public knowledge. But I can't the proof to substantiate your claim. It's not a complex question. What do you think, personally? I am not claiming anything. I am telling you why the government provided a leaflet. You're claiming something contrary to this. If you can point me in the direct to learn more about how campaign funding and spending for referendums are regulated. I can read up and offer you an opinion. As I mentioned before. We all know what happens when people give a yes/no answer to something they're not informed on. You made a claim that the government were obliged by law. You want me to point you in the direction whilst refusing to do the same in return? " fucking howling here aw it’s standard loves asking a question but hates answering don’t waste ya time he’s done this for yrs lol | |||
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