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poland and hungary veto
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas. |
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“We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"“We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.”"
Saw that too says it all really. I am looking forward to the outcome of this to see what way it will go.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas."
The recovery fund had not flooded.
Surely you would like it, but it won't happen.
What this mentally ill PiS leader said is of little importance. They are close to losing power in Poland. He dreams of a dictatorship, which will never happen.
By the way, if you and your right-wing friends do not know what is really happening in Poland now, stop talking about it because you are making a laughingstock of yourself.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
The recovery fund had not flooded.
Surely you would like it, but it won't happen.
What this mentally ill PiS leader said is of little importance. They are close to losing power in Poland. He dreams of a dictatorship, which will never happen.
By the way, if you and your right-wing friends do not know what is really happening in Poland now, stop talking about it because you are making a laughingstock of yourself.
"
I think you are the one who has just made a laughing stock of themselves, you don't even understand the thread |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
The recovery fund had not flooded.
Surely you would like it, but it won't happen.
What this mentally ill PiS leader said is of little importance. They are close to losing power in Poland. He dreams of a dictatorship, which will never happen.
By the way, if you and your right-wing friends do not know what is really happening in Poland now, stop talking about it because you are making a laughingstock of yourself.
"
Not right wing my friend just posting a thread for debate.Close to losing power? i thought the next election was in the autumn of 2023.You can tell us what is happening in Poland and educate us thats what these threads are for. |
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"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.! 
"
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source."
Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source."
Is that near Birmingham Poland? |
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"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
"
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
 |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
"
ok but as the person who commented actually lives in the uk they are only reading/ hearing whats going on too.You live in suffolk do you know whats going on in Liverpool today? just because you live somewhere you still only know what is happening on your doorstep you have to get news from further afield somewher. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
"
The point though is not what is happening in Poland but that disputes are growing between countries and Brussels over things such as sovereignty, laws, taxes etc and that just one or two countries can veto the EU budget and damage the economies and spending plans of the whole of the EU.
It's good to be out of it |
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"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
ok but as the person who commented actually lives in the uk they are only reading/ hearing whats going on too.You live in suffolk do you know whats going on in Liverpool today? just because you live somewhere you still only know what is happening on your doorstep you have to get news from further afield somewher.
"
I bloody don't! Essex.
No, I have no idea about Liverpool. However, I have friends and family that live in Castleford, for example. I have a much clearer picture of what is going on there.
I'd imagine chatting to friends/family back in Poland would also provide a better picture than our UK centric media. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
ok but as the person who commented actually lives in the uk they are only reading/ hearing whats going on too.You live in suffolk do you know whats going on in Liverpool today? just because you live somewhere you still only know what is happening on your doorstep you have to get news from further afield somewher.
I bloody don't! Essex.
No, I have no idea about Liverpool. However, I have friends and family that live in Castleford, for example. I have a much clearer picture of what is going on there.
I'd imagine chatting to friends/family back in Poland would also provide a better picture than our UK centric media. "
sorry yeah other side of the river lol but you even said in another thread that you can see the docks from your window and didnt have a clue about the troubles there,that was my point. |
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"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
ok but as the person who commented actually lives in the uk they are only reading/ hearing whats going on too.You live in suffolk do you know whats going on in Liverpool today? just because you live somewhere you still only know what is happening on your doorstep you have to get news from further afield somewher.
I bloody don't! Essex.
No, I have no idea about Liverpool. However, I have friends and family that live in Castleford, for example. I have a much clearer picture of what is going on there.
I'd imagine chatting to friends/family back in Poland would also provide a better picture than our UK centric media. sorry yeah other side of the river lol but you even said in another thread that you can see the docks from your window and didnt have a clue about the troubles there,that was my point.
"
Nope, and you live further away, but did know about it. Because you have friends/family work there.
Sort of my point? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Funny how we are not allowed to discuss Poland and the EU say the Polish couple but they are OK to say what they want about UK politics.!
I guess when you live somewhere you get a better insight to the place.
Rather than looking at another place only through the prism of your chosen news source.Some people get their news from all different sources not just the ones that agree with their views so i dont think that is really relevant.
I agree, and that was not my main point.
Simply that living somewhere gives you more knowledge of that place than only reading/seeing what is reported.
My preconceptions of a place are nearly always wrong when I get to go there.
Even bloody Suffolk isn't as bad as it seems...
ok but as the person who commented actually lives in the uk they are only reading/ hearing whats going on too.You live in suffolk do you know whats going on in Liverpool today? just because you live somewhere you still only know what is happening on your doorstep you have to get news from further afield somewher.
I bloody don't! Essex.
No, I have no idea about Liverpool. However, I have friends and family that live in Castleford, for example. I have a much clearer picture of what is going on there.
I'd imagine chatting to friends/family back in Poland would also provide a better picture than our UK centric media. sorry yeah other side of the river lol but you even said in another thread that you can see the docks from your window and didnt have a clue about the troubles there,that was my point.
Nope, and you live further away, but did know about it. Because you have friends/family work there.
Sort of my point?"
sort of mine too personal knowledge, im not sure anyone on here has inside info on the eu budget. |
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What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem"
No its because the eu have attached a caveat to receiving the aid which they say it seriously erodes democratic standards and sovereignty . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem"
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption. "
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society."
How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77% |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society.How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77%"
People I'm believed in their lies. The same as in the UK on Brexit lies. PiS now has around 26% support |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society.How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77%
People I'm believed in their lies. The same as in the UK on Brexit lies. PiS now has around 26% support"
Im not surprised, confidence in a government usually dips after a year or so of power and especially with their backward way of thinking on abortion etc but they are in until autumn 2023.I do understand the thinking on immigration though, they have seen what happened in sweden and are not going to let the eu dictate how many imigrants they have to take. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas."
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship  |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship "
you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society.How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77%
People I'm believed in their lies. The same as in the UK on Brexit lies. PiS now has around 26% supportIm not surprised, confidence in a government usually dips after a year or so of power and especially with their backward way of thinking on abortion etc but they are in until autumn 2023.I do understand the thinking on immigration though, they have seen what happened in sweden and are not going to let the eu dictate how many imigrants they have to take."
Talking about accepting or not accepting migrants from Africa is just covering up deeper problems in Poland.
This government and the party will not last until 2023. I think there will be early elections. The veto to the EU budget will be the nail in the coffin of this government and this party |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship "
There is no veto yet. There are only allegations to the previously signed treaty. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society.How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77%
People I'm believed in their lies. The same as in the UK on Brexit lies. PiS now has around 26% supportIm not surprised, confidence in a government usually dips after a year or so of power and especially with their backward way of thinking on abortion etc but they are in until autumn 2023.I do understand the thinking on immigration though, they have seen what happened in sweden and are not going to let the eu dictate how many imigrants they have to take.
Talking about accepting or not accepting migrants from Africa is just covering up deeper problems in Poland.
This government and the party will not last until 2023. I think there will be early elections. The veto to the EU budget will be the nail in the coffin of this government and this party"
how will that happen if they have a majority do they work the same way as the uk or is it different? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
There is no veto yet. There are only allegations to the previously signed treaty."
Ah right, so it’s all talk atm? I am sure they will all come to a compromise, that is what democracy is all about |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship "
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
There is no veto yet. There are only allegations to the previously signed treaty."
Yes there is they vetoed it last night . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf. "
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing,  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not."
Does each member state have the power of veto or not? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not."
Err not. And what's all this political project? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, "
Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"What is the reason given by these 2 countries to block the whole thing? are they after more cash ect?
Is this linked to the aid given to Spain and Italy for covid where some countries wanted it as a loan rather than aid or maybe thats another seperate problem
The problem is that the constitution is broken in Poland. Poland wants to withdraw from the treaty signed in July. The constitutional tribunal and the disciplinary chamber have been illegally elected and are politicized. Basic human rights are violated. Thousands of people send letters to the European commission with complaints about the Polish government because it is seeking totalitarian rule. The Polish government has a lot to hide, therefore it is afraid of making the payments of EU funds dependent on the rule of law.
Plus corruption, as well as in Hungary when it comes to corruption.
And I agree with the European Union, as do 77% of Polish society.How come the pis vote percentage went up from 37.6 in 2015 to 43.6 in 2019 that really does not tally with your 77%
People I'm believed in their lies. The same as in the UK on Brexit lies. PiS now has around 26% supportIm not surprised, confidence in a government usually dips after a year or so of power and especially with their backward way of thinking on abortion etc but they are in until autumn 2023.I do understand the thinking on immigration though, they have seen what happened in sweden and are not going to let the eu dictate how many imigrants they have to take.
Talking about accepting or not accepting migrants from Africa is just covering up deeper problems in Poland.
This government and the party will not last until 2023. I think there will be early elections. The veto to the EU budget will be the nail in the coffin of this government and this partyhow will that happen if they have a majority do they work the same way as the uk or is it different?"
Pis suspended few weeks ago a dozen MPs for insubordination. They did not vote the party leader as intended. A few days ago he had to return them to the parliamentary chamber because several MPs left for another party. Besides, they have a coalition with another party, a small party, but this coalition is not very strong. If the coalition is broken, PiS will lose the majority. And it looks like it will. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing "
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Err not. And what's all this political project? "
oops slip of the tongue |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not? "
Yes |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not."
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? "
No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism. "
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism. "
We know. But you're missing the point |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them. "
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism.
We know. But you're missing the point "
What is your point |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. "
Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism.
We know. But you're missing the point
What is your point "
I think you know. And what is this political project thing? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market."
Which we agreed to , I know the EU is far from perfect and I have a feeling they are going to make some radical changes in the future, Unfortunately we won’t be in a position to benefit from them . |
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism.
We know. But you're missing the point
What is your point
I think you know. And what is this political project thing? "
It's that thing the remainers said doesn't exist..! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Which we agreed to , I know the EU is far from perfect and I have a feeling they are going to make some radical changes in the future, Unfortunately we won’t be in a position to benefit from them . "
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Guess what, the club has rules, if you want the benefits of that structural funding then you follow the rules. Hungary and Poland haven't been following the rules, they have been going out of their way not to. Hungary is an autocracy and Poland is up their with the UK when it comes to crony capitalism.
We know. But you're missing the point
What is your point
I think you know. And what is this political project thing? "
I honestly don’t, spell it out for me. ‘Political project thing’? I have no idea , what do you think it is |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market."
Wich UK accepted. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Which we agreed to , I know the EU is far from perfect and I have a feeling they are going to make some radical changes in the future, Unfortunately we won’t be in a position to benefit from them .
"
Only time will tell, if you think the EU isn’t going to make changes and collapse then I guess you are hoping they fail. I will ask you the same question as Costa, are you one of the Brexit voters that are hoping the EU fails ? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. "
we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not? "
Yes they do. But do you understand how the veto system actually works in the EU? Do some research on it and understand how the system works then maybe you will see how useless the system is if one country wants something different to the rest. Start from the Lisbon treaty as that was the last change made to the current veto system.
Do you think the statement from the EU could be classed as democratic then? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?"
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not?
Yes they do. But do you understand how the veto system actually works in the EU? Do some research on it and understand how the system works then maybe you will see how useless the system is if one country wants something different to the rest. Start from the Lisbon treaty as that was the last change made to the current veto system.
Do you think the statement from the EU could be classed as democratic then?"
I know how the Veto system works and it is far from perfect, yes their statement ‘could be classed as’ democratic. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision "
Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty, |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,"
How many MPs apposed the treaty? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not?
Yes they do. But do you understand how the veto system actually works in the EU? Do some research on it and understand how the system works then maybe you will see how useless the system is if one country wants something different to the rest. Start from the Lisbon treaty as that was the last change made to the current veto system.
Do you think the statement from the EU could be classed as democratic then?
I know how the Veto system works and it is far from perfect, yes their statement ‘could be classed as’ democratic. "
Well you certainly have a different view of what a democracy is to me then. Far from perfect is a understatement, and if you do understand how it works then you will know that those two countries veto won't change a thing, they will just be added to the number of outstanding cases for the EU Court to rule on if they don't tow the line. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? "
224 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224 "
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market."
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not?
Yes they do. But do you understand how the veto system actually works in the EU? Do some research on it and understand how the system works then maybe you will see how useless the system is if one country wants something different to the rest. Start from the Lisbon treaty as that was the last change made to the current veto system.
Do you think the statement from the EU could be classed as democratic then?
I know how the Veto system works and it is far from perfect, yes their statement ‘could be classed as’ democratic.
Well you certainly have a different view of what a democracy is to me then. Far from perfect is a understatement, and if you do understand how it works then you will know that those two countries veto won't change a thing, they will just be added to the number of outstanding cases for the EU Court to rule on if they don't tow the line."
They knew the rules ? And we all have a different ‘view’ of what democracy is, is your version more valid than mine? |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same "
It required a constitutional amendment, hence the referendum. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?"
yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same
It required a constitutional amendment, hence the referendum."
And then it was passed, they were the only EU nation that held a referendum though |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same "
yes and ireland rejected it so suprise,suprise have another one until we get the result we want. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight. "
Who are you watching? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same yes and ireland rejected it so suprise,suprise have another one until we get the result we want."
That isn’t how it worked , |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
Wich UK accepted. we in the uk were not ask we were signed up because people like kinnock could see they could make millions after being kicked out of uk politics,when were the people ever ask if that was what they wanted?
The parliament that decided was elected by the people, do you have faith in the MPs that you vote for or should there be a referendum on every EU decision Well yes T blair said there would be then u turned.
Although the United Kingdom ratified the treaty in Parliament, this was not without some opposition. Broadly the governing Labour party supported the treaty, while the opposition Conservatives did not. The Liberal Democrats supported the treaty, while calling for a referendum on the UK's membership of the EU as a whole.[119] Several 'Eurosceptic' MPs called for a referendum on the ratification of the treaty. Daniel Hannan pointed out that the Prime Minister, Tony Blair had twice promised a referendum on the matter, to which Blair replied that he had promised a referendum on the European Constitution rather than the Lisbon Treaty,
How many MPs apposed the treaty? 224
That is far more than I realised , but they lost in a democratic vote. Ireland were the only EU nation to hold a referendum on the Lisbon treaty so I dont think it was necessary for the UK to do the same yes and ireland rejected it so suprise,suprise have another one until we get the result we want."
Your relationship with facts is sub optimal at best. The text was changed and the revised treaty was voted on. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twenty-eighth_Amendment_of_the_Constitution_of_Ireland#Changes_to_the_text |
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By *coptoCouple
over a year ago
Côte d'Azur & Great Yarmouth |
“… promised a referendum on the European Constitution”
In the end he didn’t have to though, did he? France vetoed it, and when he said to Jack Straw: “I was rather looking forward to a referendum” he got the reply: “Then you’re dafter than I thought”
But if the UK had been more pro-active in the formulation of Lisbon rather than just opting out of the bits it didn’t like, we wouldn’t have had the weakening of the Commission, Parliament and Council of Ministers in favour of the now all-too-familiar “dictatorship” of the European Council. Water under the bridge of course and, mixing metaphors, we’ve already thrown the baby out with the bath-water. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship
Oh don't worry they won't be able too, "We will look, if we need to, as a last resort, how to move ahead without the countries blocking. Because Europe can’t be held hostage by a certain number of countries which don’t want to respect the essential foundations of our political project.” I will leave you to decide if that statement could be classed as democratic or not.
Does each member state have the power of veto or not?
Yes they do. But do you understand how the veto system actually works in the EU? Do some research on it and understand how the system works then maybe you will see how useless the system is if one country wants something different to the rest. Start from the Lisbon treaty as that was the last change made to the current veto system.
Do you think the statement from the EU could be classed as democratic then?
I know how the Veto system works and it is far from perfect, yes their statement ‘could be classed as’ democratic.
Well you certainly have a different view of what a democracy is to me then. Far from perfect is a understatement, and if you do understand how it works then you will know that those two countries veto won't change a thing, they will just be added to the number of outstanding cases for the EU Court to rule on if they don't tow the line.
They knew the rules ? And we all have a different ‘view’ of what democracy is, is your version more valid than mine? "
No idea what your version is if you think that's a democratic statement, but each to there own, as you said mate. |
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas."
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all. |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all."
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon. |
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"Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas."
Agreed, it's exactly what I think every time I vote SNP.
Or is it only the right thing to do if you're a Little Englander? LOL |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon. "
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon. "
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon. "
What is the political project they are planning? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
What is the political project they are planning? "
PiS and their mentally ill party leader plans a dictate. As it was during the communist era.
But they have a big problem. They won't succeed. Their end is nigh. |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is "
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
What is the political project they are planning?
PiS and their mentally ill party leader plans a dictate. As it was during the communist era.
But they have a big problem. They won't succeed. Their end is nigh. "
I was talking of the EU |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now. "
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? "
quins v exeter. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
Agreed, it's exactly what I think every time I vote SNP.
Or is it only the right thing to do if you're a Little Englander? LOL"
no im all for scotish independence if thats what they want.Im with you on that one i wont havee to see that ian blackford greetin every day in the HOC. |
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? quins v exeter."
How are the chiefs doing without the Scottish  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
What is the political project they are planning?
PiS and their mentally ill party leader plans a dictate. As it was during the communist era.
But they have a big problem. They won't succeed. Their end is nigh.
I was talking of the EU "
Of course, it's so typical |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? quins v exeter."
Easy win for Exeter, good to see Sale winning |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now.
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed? "
Budget has not been vetoed. Objections were raised.
|
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? quins v exeter.
How are the chiefs doing without the Scottish "
They won 33 3 |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now.
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?
Budget has not been vetoed. Objections were raised.
"
It was vetoed last night, they now have to talk about it for another few months as the eu always do and something will have to give. |
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? quins v exeter.
How are the chiefs doing without the Scottish They won 33 3"
England Ireland tomorrow - easy win for the Irish I reckon  |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
I am confused, how did Poland & Hungary manage to veto the EU’s proposals? I thought they were an undemocratic dictatorship you need consent from every country when borrowing and spending on their behalf.
Yep, but they knew that when they joined? I am not sure why anti EU people are still so interested in what the EU are doing, Probably for the same reason people are interested in the usa elections what china,russia etc are doing
Is it? Are you one of those Brexit voters who will only feel vindicated if the EU fails? No why would i want them to fail ? i started this post to point out as a nation we can make decisions based on our needs much quicker than the eu can as there are so many conflicting opinions on whats best for them.
I agree, we can, the EU has many faults but when you join you know the rules. Not exactly the rules and the whole concept has changed since the uk joined the common market.
I see this argument "Its because we joined the common market, not the EU" It's almost too stupid to reply to but here goes.
First, do you recognise the world has changed a lot since 1973?
Second, Where was the sweet spot? At what point was the UK a fully signed up member to the European project?yeah you are right probably to stupid to reply to if someone has not got the sense to know the difference between a trade agreement and a federal union.With that im off rugby premiship starts tonight.
Who are you watching? quins v exeter.
How are the chiefs doing without the Scottish They won 33 3
England Ireland tomorrow - easy win for the Irish I reckon "
in your dreams |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now.
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?
Budget has not been vetoed. Objections were raised.
"
I thought you said you knew what was happening in Poland? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now.
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?
Budget has not been vetoed. Objections were raised.
It was vetoed last night, they now have to talk about it for another few months as the eu always do and something will have to give."
You wrong. This is not an official veto. This shows how you understand the EU working.
The time is until December 10th. Time will tell what will happen. It just so happens that Poland and Hungary are the beneficiaries of this budget, so your joy in the failure of the EU is premature.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So it begins the 1.8 trillion recovery fund budget has been sunk by Poland and Hungary.The leader of the pis party was comparing Brussels' actions to the Soviet Union's rule in the past over Poland, adding: "We're on the right side of history, and those who want to take away our sovereignty based on their own whims are headed for a fall.
Another good reason for getting out, being in control of your own destiny instead of being held back by countries with different agendas.
So what begins? The break-up of the EU? I thought Brexit began that already.
Maybe the EU will wear them down? Maybe they'll get kicked out? Maybe they'll leave because self determination is more important than money?
That last one is the best reason of all.
Hungary and Poland won't be leaving the EU anytime soon.
Yeap. These two imbeciles (Morawiecki and Orban) signed a treaty they did not understand. Same as did johnson who signed a Brexit deal with the EU that he didn't understand.
Are populists that stupid? Another proof that it is
I think they know what they're doing. Orban in particular is testing the resolve and will of the EU. He's not interested in playing by the rules and wants to test the response of the EU. He knows the EU doesn't want the fight right now.
So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?
Budget has not been vetoed. Objections were raised.
I thought you said you knew what was happening in Poland? "
I know what's going on and you? I doubt it |
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So from the posts above it seems Poland and Hungary have democratically elected governments but are taking their respective countries in a more authoritarian direction. Now the EU are trying to influence this by adding new rules to get funds. So leads me to ask if an EU country did go hard left or hard right with the people's consent would they still be able to be in the EU. |
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By *coptoCouple
over a year ago
Côte d'Azur & Great Yarmouth |
"So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK! |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
"So from the posts above it seems Poland and Hungary have democratically elected governments but are taking their respective countries in a more authoritarian direction. Now the EU are trying to influence this by adding new rules to get funds. So leads me to ask if an EU country did go hard left or hard right with the people's consent would they still be able to be in the EU."
The answer I suppose, yes within certain limits. But restricting citizens rights, eliminating the principle of the separation of powers, reducing the power of a free press and eliminating the role of parliament are all contrary to the principles of the EU. All of the examples I cited have occurred in either Hungary or Poland. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!"
Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done |
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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago
Derry |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done"
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. "
yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!"
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"So from the posts above it seems Poland and Hungary have democratically elected governments but are taking their respective countries in a more authoritarian direction. Now the EU are trying to influence this by adding new rules to get funds. So leads me to ask if an EU country did go hard left or hard right with the people's consent would they still be able to be in the EU.
The answer I suppose, yes within certain limits. But restricting citizens rights, eliminating the principle of the separation of powers, reducing the power of a free press and eliminating the role of parliament are all contrary to the principles of the EU. All of the examples I cited have occurred in either Hungary or Poland."
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in. "
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? "
over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like? |
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""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like?"
what is not to like is Spurs top of league lol |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like? what is not to like is Spurs top of league lol"
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Some of you guys don't understand British politics so why go so far and talk about EU or Eastern Europe?!
The more you go East things get more complicated. Unless you wore born/ lived there for many years it's hard to understand.
Hungary has always been the black sheep, playing at many ends ( EU member, BFF with Rusia, but has close ties with USA etc) Orban is a dick thinking he can silence the press and pass any law he likes, close universities, forgetting about the EU treaty.
Poland?? The abortion law is just the cherry on top of a big fat cake that is in the oven for many years.
...and let's not forget other countries in the region:
Bulgaria: coruption at its highest level and the poorest country in EU.
Romania: only last year the leader of the biggest party went to jail, thanks to public going on the streets for months (+ pressure from EU leaders and USA)
EU needs to send a clear message to all the naughty kids that Human rights, coruption, free press are not things to be negotiated.
And remember there are other countries that want to join: Serbia, Turkey, Moldova, Albania.
What mgs would that send to them if EU leaders would make concession on fundamental rights.
? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like? what is not to like is Spurs top of league lol"
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like?"
Yes. It is a great success. Get the same deal as it was. Why are you deceiving yourself that this is success? |
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By *ostafun OP Man
over a year ago
near ipswich |
""So what happens now the budget has been vetoed?"
Even if rejected (it hasn't yet!), everything still carries on under the "provisional twelfths" rule, i.e. you can't spend in any one month more than a twelfth of what was spent last year. Don't forget, salaries still have to be paid, the electricity bills met, the only problem occurs when there's a quarterly rent to be paid. But any worth-while Administrator knows how to get round that... It's not the first time a budget has been rejected/delayed, of course everyone wants a little better out of the next seven-year "Multiannual Financial Framework" but one WILL be agreed and approved. Believe it or not, EU life goes on, and will continue to do so even without the UK!Of course it will its just the time it takes the eu to get anything done
Like the UK leaving the EU? 1 political party 2 elections, 3 leaders and 4 years later. yes exactly like that thank god for boris and getting us out of that mess the remainers were putting us in.
Yeah. God bless boris. Are you ok? over the moon mate england rugby won ,spurs top of the league another trade deal in the bag whats not to like?
Yes. It is a great success. Get the same deal as it was. Why are you deceiving yourself that this is success?"
Because people like you were saying how the uk would be on its knees leaving the eu.We have already a better deal with japan a continuation of a deal with canada with new talks on tech etc to start next year,talks with the cptpp which could be positive and today it looks like a deal with the eu in the next week or two all without a eu parliament,mep,s or 5 presidents happy days. |
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