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Name and shame
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By *ugby 123 OP Couple
over a year ago
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A Headmaster posted a name and shame wall with a list and photographs of pupils who he thought had under achieved in their mock GCSE's.
I can understand why the kids were humliated and it has now been taken down.
The Headmaster said it was not a desire to humiliate but to support.
Would it have spurred you on to do better if it was you? |
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No and i couldn't believe he had so little understanding of psychology. Labeling someone always runs the danger of them "living up to " the label. For him to be unaware of this is astonishing
How any kids decided since he thought they were failures they might as well give up all together? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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if that was my child he'd posted on the wall telling everyone they wasnt upto his standards id have been after his job
How will that spur a child on, theres NOTHING in this world as cruel as kids all thats provoking is bullying but the kids not on the list
Some people who work with kids ahve no idea at all how kids work |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Naming and Shaming is a powerful emotional trauma many people find it hard to face, according to human psychologists and there are many instances when shame has driven affected people to even committing suicide. Its very wronge him doing that .. Young people who have there lifes a head of them it could lead to alsorts of things And i would be going to the school after him to stand down from his job . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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To be fair, I experienced something like this at school and it did serve to motivate me.
Without delving to deep into things and incurring the wrath of people, I think a lot of kids lack the motivation to make something of themselves, be at home or merely distracted by other influence's.
When I was at school it was the bullys that picked on the clever kids, be it through insecurity of their own skills I wouldn't know as I never asked.
Standards are dropping with basic grammar being a great example. Check out some of the appalling spelling on some Ebay auctions, text wording is rife and I've seen it in my friends kids school work.
Maybe being cruel to be kind is required sometimes although on this instance, I'm remaining neutral as I cant decide whether it was a wise move or not
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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everyone is different, and everyone copes and reacts different, my middle daughter is dyslexic so had one on one tutoring at school, which the other kids took joy in taking the piss out of her for, she never did overly well in her exams and i know for a fact if she was put on some name and shame board for underachievement it would have destroyed her
Many of these kids on this board will be in the bottom sets at school so probably get picked on as it is by the brighter kids, they dont need this on top of it |
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By *ugby 123 OP Couple
over a year ago
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To be fair, the kids were not in the bottom sets but were clever enough to be expected to get above C grades and he thought they had slacked off a bit.
Either way, I don't think it is the right way to do things and I am surprised the Head has made Headteacher if this is how he treats kids.
I know he has taken it down and the school or him ( not sure which) has apologised but I wonder if he thought it good to do it in the first place is a sign that he has done this type of thing before.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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it's wrong no way should it be alound to happen.i would go mad if it was one of my kids.
i have Dyslexia i went thought 3 years of hell at school been picked on,because i need the help.so bad i changed schools and didnt get help when it come to my GCSE and lefted school with none, |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A Headmaster posted a name and shame wall with a list and photographs of pupils who he thought had under achieved in their mock GCSE's.
I can understand why the kids were humliated and it has now been taken down.
The Headmaster said it was not a desire to humiliate but to support.
Would it have spurred you on to do better if it was you?"
If it was my kid he'd shamed - and let's be clear about it, regardless of his intentions, he did shame those on the list as kids can be very cruel at times - I'd have been down that school in a heartbeat to tear a mighty big strip off him. What an asshole!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I know he has taken it down and the school or him ( not sure which) has apologised but I wonder if he thought it good to do it in the first place is a sign that he has done this type of thing before.
"
I find myself questioning the base judgement of a person who could conceive such a foolish idea. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"it's wrong no way should it be alound to happen.i would go mad if it was one of my kids.
i have Dyslexia i went thought 3 years of hell at school been picked on,because i need the help.so bad i changed schools and didnt get help when it come to my GCSE and lefted school with none,"
Snap xx very much my story too . My 4 have this and i did keep close eye on things at there schools but if ever i have come across naming shaming i would have gone mad . |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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theres one or two people i'd like to name an shame
on a serious note though, regardless of him taking the list down, any damage would have already been done, kids can be nasty to eachother over the slightest thing, so giving them ammo is really not the way to get the best out of them!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"theres one or two people i'd like to name an shame
on a serious note though, regardless of him taking the list down, any damage would have already been done, kids can be nasty to eachother over the slightest thing, so giving them ammo is really not the way to get the best out of them!!"
Exactly. What will this 'Head' teacher do now when he finds one kid being mercilessly taunted by others for appearing on the list? Will he issue an edict that states anyone found taunting the children who were on HIS list will be punished? What kind of an example does that set to an impressionable mind? Do as I say not as I do? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"theres one or two people i'd like to name an shame
on a serious note though, regardless of him taking the list down, any damage would have already been done, kids can be nasty to eachother over the slightest thing, so giving them ammo is really not the way to get the best out of them!!
Exactly. What will this 'Head' teacher do now when he finds one kid being mercilessly taunted by others for appearing on the list? Will he issue an edict that states anyone found taunting the children who were on HIS list will be punished? What kind of an example does that set to an impressionable mind? Do as I say not as I do? "
He should be made to resit his exams as a teacher to see if he is an under achiever, I think he is. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"theres one or two people i'd like to name an shame
on a serious note though, regardless of him taking the list down, any damage would have already been done, kids can be nasty to eachother over the slightest thing, so giving them ammo is really not the way to get the best out of them!!
Exactly. What will this 'Head' teacher do now when he finds one kid being mercilessly taunted by others for appearing on the list? Will he issue an edict that states anyone found taunting the children who were on HIS list will be punished? What kind of an example does that set to an impressionable mind? Do as I say not as I do? "
its a 'no-brainer' as far as putting the list up, amazed it even crossed his mind 
also what would he do if one of the kids dads (or mums!!) were certified pysco's who didnt take too kindly to their kid being made a fool of by a person they had entrustred with their well being?? |
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By *ugby 123 OP Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"I know he has taken it down and the school or him ( not sure which) has apologised but I wonder if he thought it good to do it in the first place is a sign that he has done this type of thing before.
I find myself questioning the base judgement of a person who could conceive such a foolish idea."
Me too.
I would have thought if he wanted to motivate the pupils he would have been better putting names up of people who had excelled in their mocks. |
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"I know he has taken it down and the school or him ( not sure which) has apologised but I wonder if he thought it good to do it in the first place is a sign that he has done this type of thing before.
I find myself questioning the base judgement of a person who could conceive such a foolish idea.
Me too.
I would have thought if he wanted to motivate the pupils he would have been better putting names up of people who had excelled in their mocks."
Exactly and how was he deciding they had under achieved? Did it ever occur to hi that there may be reasons they were doing badly totally unrelated to the amount of effort a child was putting in? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Well in the first instance he must have the confidence of the local authority to get to the position of head master so he probably had reasons for his decision. With some children punishment works others need encouragement. The fact he chose under achieving students means he thought they were capable of. I would have thought by the time the children in question had taken their mocks they will have received years of encouragement from teachers and the results they achieved are testament that motivation or encouragement don’t work with these students. Humiliation isn’t nice but if it gets even a few of these children to work harder for their final exams then he has achieved something. Its a matter if the ends justify the means so you can only say if he was right or wrong once the final results are compared with the mock results. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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One of my friends works for a company that specialises in online car rental deals.
If they make a mistake, rather than being taken to one side, it is standard procedure that the supervisor sends out an email highlighting the error to them.
BUT
that email also gets copied to all other members of their department for them to see !
Surely they are on dodgy ground with that sort of procedure ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Well in the first instance he must have the confidence of the local authority to get to the position of head master so he probably had reasons for his decision. With some children punishment works others need encouragement. The fact he chose under achieving students means he thought they were capable of. I would have thought by the time the children in question had taken their mocks they will have received years of encouragement from teachers and the results they achieved are testament that motivation or encouragement don’t work with these students. Humiliation isn’t nice but if it gets even a few of these children to work harder for their final exams then he has achieved something. Its a matter if the ends justify the means so you can only say if he was right or wrong once the final results are compared with the mock results."
The end certainly does not justify the means as this 'head' will have had these children in his care for a number of years if they have reached mock exam age, and if, in all that time he's had then, he hasn't determined who are the achievers, who could do better and who needs more help then he isn't fit to hold the office of Headmaster. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Well in the first instance he must have the confidence of the local authority to get to the position of head master so he probably had reasons for his decision. With some children punishment works others need encouragement. The fact he chose under achieving students means he thought they were capable of. I would have thought by the time the children in question had taken their mocks they will have received years of encouragement from teachers and the results they achieved are testament that motivation or encouragement don’t work with these students. Humiliation isn’t nice but if it gets even a few of these children to work harder for their final exams then he has achieved something. Its a matter if the ends justify the means so you can only say if he was right or wrong once the final results are compared with the mock results.
The end certainly does not justify the means as this 'head' will have had these children in his care for a number of years if they have reached mock exam age, and if, in all that time he's had then, he hasn't determined who are the achievers, who could do better and who needs more help then he isn't fit to hold the office of Headmaster."
Read the thread he made an example of the ones who under achieved in the mocks not throughout their school career. |
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Well i was going to type a long reply, but all im going to say is i hope he hasnt done any of them any severe pyscological damage.
15 is a very emotional age and im sure all teenagers of that age can have different reactions to it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Read the thread he made an example of the ones who under achieved in the mocks not throughout their school career. "
And isn't an exam a culmination of years of education? Isn't that what an education prepares one for? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Read the thread he made an example of the ones who under achieved in the mocks not throughout their school career.
And isn't an exam a culmination of years of education? Isn't that what an education prepares one for?"
No you intimated he had the children in question for a number of years and should have been able to assess who were archivers and not. They failed to live up to his expectations.
You need to read the first post and understand what is its about before jumping in.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I don't see why he just couldn't have had a word with them individualy, there could be many reasons they didn't do so well, didn't mean they HAD to have been slacking. 
The guy sounds like a dick |
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He could of taken each child to one side explain that he didnt think they had reached their full potential and get the child to discuss with him the reasons it could of been and they could of worked together |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't see why he just couldn't have had a word with them individualy, there could be many reasons they didn't do so well, didn't mean they HAD to have been slacking.
The guy sounds like a dick"
Who is to say he didn't before hand? I would say for most students its a poor way of motivation them but there is little discipline in classrooms these days and many children are misled by others in their class. Without knowing the background of all 30 involved all we know is it wasn't the bottom 30 it was the ones who should and could have achieved more but didn't. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" Without knowing the background of all 30 involved all we know is it wasn't the bottom 30 it was the ones who should and could have achieved more but didn't. "
Shouldn't you be following your own advice?:
"understand what is its about before jumping in."
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By *teborahCouple
over a year ago
warrington |
I was in school in Johannesburg South Africa in the 70s, primary school that is, The headmaster was one sadistic bastard (Afrikaans) one of his rules was if you forgot your homework or he thought you was not performing properly you would get what was called an offence. when you accumulated 3 offences your name was read out at the morning assembly and you was then told to wait outside his office where you would get 3 strikes accross your arse. he didnt use a normal cane by the way it was a piece of electrical insulated cable and fuck did it hurt It was always the same faces as well and they all happened to be English as pointed out by him. Must have had something to do with the fact that he hated English people with a passion as one of us told him  So no I would not agree to naming and shaming as it solves nothing except humiliating someone and filling them with insecurity. He wasnt Afrikaans this teacher was he? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't see why he just couldn't have had a word with them individualy, there could be many reasons they didn't do so well, didn't mean they HAD to have been slacking.
The guy sounds like a dick
Who is to say he didn't before hand? I would say for most students its a poor way of motivation them but there is little discipline in classrooms these days and many children are misled by others in their class. Without knowing the background of all 30 involved all we know is it wasn't the bottom 30 it was the ones who should and could have achieved more but didn't. "
Its an interesting situation possibly driven by the government setting school targets, teachers assessing children and predicting grades and children not working hard enough for exams. Was he right? No but he wasn't wrong either. I would think it would be far more humiliating for the under achievers to be receiving under qualified replies to job applications in the future.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" Without knowing the background of all 30 involved all we know is it wasn't the bottom 30 it was the ones who should and could have achieved more but didn't.
Shouldn't you be following your own advice?:
understand what is its about before jumping in. "
I actually read the thread and the article where it came from. You made assumptions which were incorrect and showed your ignorance. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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We had a wall that was similar.. We had positions on the wall.. and could be moved up or down the wall depending on how well or not we did..
You of course never really wanted your name to go down the wall.. I was morified one week when I went down 3 spots... I soon got my name back up there.
So it can work if its done in a way that you can find a positive.. ie.. everyone knew those at the bottom of the list were the worse behaved or not so good in the lessons... but it was done so as we all tried to at least maintain our spot if not better ourselves.
One girl in my class took tutoring in a group and got herself up 10 spaces.. for that she got an award.
Our headteacher would also read out the names in assembly of those that had detentions etc...
Cali |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" Without knowing the background of all 30 involved all we know is it wasn't the bottom 30 it was the ones who should and could have achieved more but didn't.
Shouldn't you be following your own advice?:
understand what is its about before jumping in.
I actually read the thread and the article where it came from. You made assumptions which were incorrect and showed your ignorance. "
I and quite a few others who have more or less posted the same condemnation as I have, or agreed with me.
Are we all ignorant then, and you are the only one among us who is enlightened? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"We had a wall that was similar.. We had positions on the wall.. and could be moved up or down the wall depending on how well or not we did..
You of course never really wanted your name to go down the wall.. I was morified one week when I went down 3 spots... I soon got my name back up there.
So it can work if its done in a way that you can find a positive.. ie.. everyone knew those at the bottom of the list were the worse behaved or not so good in the lessons... but it was done so as we all tried to at least maintain our spot if not better ourselves.
One girl in my class took tutoring in a group and got herself up 10 spaces.. for that she got an award.
Our headteacher would also read out the names in assembly of those that had detentions etc...
Cali "
We had similar and its not nice but it did make you work harder. I look back and can see when i woke up and hit grades.  |
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"Well in the first instance he must have the confidence of the local authority to get to the position of head master so he probably had reasons for his decision. With some children punishment works others need encouragement. The fact he chose under achieving students means he thought they were capable of. I would have thought by the time the children in question had taken their mocks they will have received years of encouragement from teachers and the results they achieved are testament that motivation or encouragement don’t work with these students. Humiliation isn’t nice but if it gets even a few of these children to work harder for their final exams then he has achieved something. Its a matter if the ends justify the means so you can only say if he was right or wrong once the final results are compared with the mock results."
local authorities do not recruit or employ boards of governors do.You need not have any relevant knowledge or experience to be a school governor .Whilst many are excellent some are simply there because no one else will do it or because they believe they know better than teachers how to run a school |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think motivation charts in an adult place of employ is vastly different from a naming & shaming wall in a school canteen. For one, adults are better equipped to deal with any backlash from appearing at the foot of any such display chart and can even turn it into a running joke. Children however, haven't developed those social skills and where a child on such a shaming feature could outwardly make light of his or her situation and all the jibes that will inevitably pursue, but could well be cringing inside at such a public embarrassment.
I have read the full article and the head teacher is well respected but in this instance he admits he got it wrong in terms of how it would be perceived by the parents and children of those who appeared on his chart.
I think he got it badly wrong. |
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long ago when i was a newly promoted junior nco i ripped someone off verbally in front of others..
the s'arnt major took me to one side and tore me a new arsehole verbally and gave me some good advice..
praise in public, bollock in private..
taught me an important lesson, sought the guy out and apologised in front of the same guys for ripping him off in front of everyone..
then took him to one side to reiterate my earlier point..
you gain nothing but a lack of respect for belittling someone in front of others.. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I agree Surreysensual, praise in public bollock in private.
Positive reinforcement does work with kids.
I have know teens attempt suicide because of poor exam results, the head teacher should recognise that common fact also.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"long ago when i was a newly promoted junior nco i ripped someone off verbally in front of others..
the s'arnt major took me to one side and tore me a new arsehole verbally and gave me some good advice..
praise in public, bollock in private..
taught me an important lesson, sought the guy out and apologised in front of the same guys for ripping him off in front of everyone..
then took him to one side to reiterate my earlier point..
you gain nothing but a lack of respect for belittling someone in front of others.."
I agree with your "praise in public and...' policy entirely.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Even though he has since backed down it was an incredibly immature thing to do.
I would love to have seen his reaction if before this incident someone had suggested his teaching staff should be similarly named-and-shamed.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I am all for naming and shaming, providing it is based on objective evidence that can be substantiated.
However, it needs to be done fairly, in that, for a group/team, everyone needs to be named and shamed, and not just those with the most mistakes/worst scores.
This way, I believe those who are under-achieving can look to those who are high achievers, and hope that they would inspire them to learn from them with the aim to do better.
IMHO, of course.
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"I agree Surreysensual, praise in public bollock in private.
Positive reinforcement does work with kids.
I have know teens attempt suicide because of poor exam results, the head teacher should recognise that common fact also.
"
The use of positive attends is central to every parenting programme going ,people respond better to praise and constructive critism whatever their age.. |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
"We should do a similar thing on here???"
why would we do a similar thing on here.... you never turned up for a meet... i wasted my time coming down, no address, no phone number... i want my money back....
and now you see why it would never word... open to abuse.... which bring me to..... |
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By *abioMan
over a year ago
Newcastle and Gateshead |
the thread.... I was told that I would never pass my A levels.... and that I should look at other options....
I was so determined to get to where I wanted to go (university) that I was never going to listen to them...
each person is going to react to that kind of thing differently...
it will motivate some....
it will deflate others..
it will some a kick up the backside!
what would that have done to me?? nothing!! because I always had my own goal and nothing was changing that...
so yes... when I got to uni it gave me a sense of pride... in that I believed in myself more than my teachers did... and that I stuck it to them.....
it is a very dangerous game to play... i don't think a headteacher should be making that kind of move.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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One of my employers displayed a chart of the number of errors made by a small group with specific duties and responsibilities, and a member in the group cheekily said she did not make any mistake compared with the rest.
The immediate reaction amongst the rest of us was the same, and we told her so: the number of mistakes was in direct proportion with the time one spent performing a particular task, and she hardly did any.
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