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broken britain ?
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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reading todays bolton news an old lad 71yrold beaten black and blue by young yobs on the bus,the chaps face is a mess, whats happend too respect,manners and decencey?   |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Was he beaten in the same way that the railway man was beaten in the 'great train robbery'?
Were the organised criminals opperating in the blitz, raping, pillaging and looting their way through the bombed out ruins of the east end?
Are we more violent now than when the Met was set up in the 1860's when there was no force of law or order?
Sorry, but this opinion is reactionary and does not take account of historical facts.... |
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I can no longer read things like this, there was a thing the other week on facebook pictures of a nice young looking lad about 15 and then pictures of him in hospital badly beaten, it upset me for days.
Its even worse thinking when you have children and your parents are getting older.
I wish i knew the answers |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I don't believe for a second that society is worse now than in the past. News is so readily available now, that we here about many things we would not have years ago. |
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"Bring back parents belting their kids if they step outta line...it worked!!!"
You say that but some of these thugs are second and sometimes even third generation that come from the same family
Discipline yes, beatings no, i never had to beat my son(although he had the odd arse smack in his time). |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Until the law puts the fear of fuck up these tossers it will continue
Yes I realise some would still do it and ya canna stop some thick twats at any cost
But an example of the harshness I'd like to see
Would be for example a shop lifter given 10 years with no parole ( so ya can work the rest out from that)
But I won't hold my breath as there are to many namby pamby do gooders in positions of power
And also the sad thing is crime is now actually nessasary to the economy
Think how many jobs would be lost without crime
Sad isn't it  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Bring back parents belting their kids if they step outta line...it worked!!!"
My hubby always used to say that, now i agree with him. There isnt enough disipline. |
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I think short sentences but really hard labour, no comfy cells, no television no nothing, the only thing i would give them would be education programmes on different things. They would work from 6 to 10 hard, basic food, it may just stop some reoffending, however, im sure it wouldnt be long before someone screamed human rights. Someone needs to take control, take away this bloody stupid human rights thing. Once you break the law you shouldnt have human rights |
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I don't believe behaviour is any worse now, then it was previously. Just the media got bigger, and rely on shock tactics like this to sell their papers.
There has always been gangs, there has always been people beaten up for money, and unless we end up with something like a "clockwork orange" then there always will be.
Belting kids isn't going to help, the teddies of the '60's got a swift belt round the head, but they still went out playing with cut throats, the Scuttlers of the 1890's most likely got a clip around the ear for misbehaving, but they still went out and beat people up for the hell of it.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't believe behaviour is any worse now, then it was previously. Just the media got bigger, and rely on shock tactics like this to sell their papers.
There has always been gangs, there has always been people beaten up for money, and unless we end up with something like a "clockwork orange" then there always will be.
Belting kids isn't going to help, the teddies of the '60's got a swift belt round the head, but they still went out playing with cut throats, the Scuttlers of the 1890's most likely got a clip around the ear for misbehaving, but they still went out and beat people up for the hell of it.
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It's defiantly no worse these days its just we get to hear about it more. If you look back 50 years you had Ian Brady and Myra Hindley doing far worse and then the Krays and that was only the tip of the iceberg as smaller crimes just didn't hit the headlines.
Britain is far from broken its just a slogan that people pick up on and sensationalise.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The problem with using prison (either for the short sharp shock, or for long punative sentences) is not the human rights issue, it's that We (the people) would never wear the tax bill that it would cost to do it.
My Old Man was a screw for 20 odd years so I have some (Vicarious) experience of this. Prison is not a nice place. It's smelly, depressing and dangerous. the food is awfull and most of the screws are bloody horible people.
And Prison does not work! If it did there would never, ever have been repeat offenders (see Poridge).
I have some sympathy with the corporal punishment argument, particularly with reoffending adolescents for whom little seems to work, but mark you me, as soon as cons are out doing manual labour, all the unconvicted people doing those things would be laid off as it would be cheaper to get the cons to do it!
What needs to be done is restorative justice. I have heard tell (from profesionals) that even the hardest criminals can be moved to tears when confronted by the people they have offended against and I have spoken to ex cons who have had their whole lives turned around by the experience of being forced to confron the damage that they have done.
Another, very simple, way of cutting crume and criminality would be to legalise and controll the use of narcotics. At a stroke decriminalising anmd regulating the supply of controlled substances would take a major source of income from the hands of the nefarious pushers (who would go to a dingy house to meet hardened criminals to get their blow when you could go to a shop?). This works in a number of places accross the world, it's just the vested interests of those in positions of power which stops it happening. |
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The problem is we only hear about select crimes these days. I'm not saying it's not sad that a 71 year old lady was beat up for what little pension money she had on her. Hell if it was my Nan, I'd go after the bastards and do the same to them.
But what about the 15 under 18's that were murdered in London alone last year? They weren't front page.
How many of you heard that a 17 year old girl was strangled in London on 7th February?
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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there will always be murders ,etc as some have mentioned, but i know me n my mates were taught please thank you and repect others and your elders,wudnt have dared get lippy  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"seems to be getting worse for sure,no police on the streets as they stuck in the station allegedly doing paperwork!. "
We must live in different Birminghams because I see them all the time and that's with travelling around the area for work.
Less coppers, more paperwork demanded by the government and lots of men and women doing the best job they can in circumstances. |
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sadly it was probably ever thus..
'reactionary justice' may work for a small few but in other countries where the regime set in prison was severe the inmates reacted accordingly..
a downward spiral..
not saying softly softly but any incarceration should be appropriate to the individual..
pointless having mental health patients banged up cos there is not enough treatment 'outside'..
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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago
Kidderminster+ surrounding areas. |
"seems to be getting worse for sure,no police on the streets as they stuck in the station allegedly doing paperwork!.
We must live in different Birminghams because I see them all the time and that's with travelling around the area for work. "
you sure they are not keeping an eye on you?. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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answer a few comments made above
my brother was a copper and yes its lots of paperwork.
beating kids is not necessary at all. a light smack is all thats required. both my kids are polite,will stand up on a bus for someone older or a pregnant lady. both will open doors for someone. and i hv smacked them less than 10 times between them.
there is more media coverage hence crime rate appears higher and the crimes worse. its always been there just never reported 24hrs a day like now. i dont think the amount of news coverage is necessary. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Levels of violence are no different now than 30, 40, 50 or 100 years ago - it's just reported better today so we hear about it more, which gives the impression that there is more of it about.
Do you recall when there were 'devil dogs' in the papers on an almost daily basis? Not so now, but there are no fewer attacks by dangerous dogs today than there were five years ago. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Was he beaten in the same way that the railway man was beaten in the 'great train robbery'?
Were the organised criminals opperating in the blitz, raping, pillaging and looting their way through the bombed out ruins of the east end?
Are we more violent now than when the Met was set up in the 1860's when there was no force of law or order?
Sorry, but this opinion is reactionary and does not take account of historical facts...."
Have I missed any replies or has anything been edited between the original post and your answer Georgie? |
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By *ucky_LadsCouple (MM)
over a year ago
Kidderminster+ surrounding areas. |
"Was he beaten in the same way that the railway man was beaten in the 'great train robbery'?
Were the organised criminals opperating in the blitz, raping, pillaging and looting their way through the bombed out ruins of the east end?
Are we more violent now than when the Met was set up in the 1860's when there was no force of law or order?
Sorry, but this opinion is reactionary and does not take account of historical facts....
Have I missed any replies or has anything been edited between the original post and your answer Georgie?"
indeed it is a very confusing jump from op to the post from georgie!,just what is the connection?. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I haven't read all the replies on this thread so forgive me if I repeat anything.
Has anyone thought that the reason crime statistics are higher now than back in the good old days is the fact laws have changed?
Gun crime is higher now because of new gun laws.
Drug crime is higher because drugs have been given different classifications. Also drugs seem to be the easier way of extorting money from people instead of violence.
Car crime is higher due to laws changing for motorists.
Freud is more available to online criminals so new laws have been brought in.
But what is still the same is violence.
An old man gets beat up by youths, this is unforgivable in any day and age.
When was the last time you heard of OAP's beating youths or gangs up?
The gang of lads who found it justifiable to beat an old man up need flogging in my oppinion so they know how it feels to be unmercifully beaten and demorilised and have it done in public too.
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"Was he beaten in the same way that the railway man was beaten in the 'great train robbery'?
Were the organised criminals opperating in the blitz, raping, pillaging and looting their way through the bombed out ruins of the east end?
Are we more violent now than when the Met was set up in the 1860's when there was no force of law or order?
Sorry, but this opinion is reactionary and does not take account of historical facts...."
Frank Dewhurts and Thomas Kett can tell u all about being bashed in the face by yobs on a train. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Have I missed any replies or has anything been edited between the original post and your answer Georgie?
indeed it is a very confusing jump from op to the post from georgie!,just what is the connection?."
No I was 1st to comment.
My comment was arguing that nothing much has happened to make us more criminal now than we have ever been (my post was a list of specific events to challenge the OP).
There are lots of examples of things which are better now.
There is an awfull lot less domestic abuse now than there was 30 years ago (far fewer Wives and children being beaten up than at the beging of the 80's when a big campaign was launched.......). That's not to say it doesn't happen, but with far less frequency. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I don't believe for a second that society is worse now than in the past. News is so readily available now, that we here about many things we would not have years ago."
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"reading todays bolton news an old lad 71yrold beaten black and blue by young yobs on the bus,the chaps face is a mess, whats happend too respect,manners and decencey? "
http://www.theboltonnews.co.uk/news/9529237.Buses_may_be_pulled_after_vandal_attacks/ |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The violence that happens now is worse than years gone by.
The feral gangs that roam at nightimes (and daytimes) wearing their protection of hooded tops, baseball caps and bandana's. They hide behind the menacing look.
Beating a 71 year old man sensless on the bus cannot be compared to a 40's something train operative during the train robbery. The train robbery was just that...robbery...beating an old man senseless on a bus is completely different...that is violence for the sake of pure enjoyment.
Prisons...drab and dreary..awful ?
playstations, tvs, dvd players, open university courses, car shop, decent food...as agreed by Human Rights !...hmmm..not really punishment for awful crimes (when they eventually do serve any time)
The answer is quite simple...zero tolerance policing, more prisons with less (not more) luxuries.
I dont remember anytime in the past when we had organised riots for pure looting and violence....all aided by Twitter, facebook and blackberry...and the police..powerless. Tear gas, water cannons, rubber bullets...all should have been used.
The Krays were organised crime...and dealt harsh punishment within their own crime circles....not beating up innocent elderly people for fun.
The answer...get a government that has the balls to throw out Human rights, build more prisons and get scum off the streets before its too late.  |
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"The violence that happens now is worse than years gone by.
The feral gangs that roam at nightimes (and daytimes) wearing their protection of hooded tops, baseball caps and bandana's. They hide behind the menacing look.
Beating a 71 year old man sensless on the bus cannot be compared to a 40's something train operative during the train robbery. The train robbery was just that...robbery...beating an old man senseless on a bus is completely different...that is violence for the sake of pure enjoyment.
Prisons...drab and dreary..awful ?
playstations, tvs, dvd players, open university courses, car shop, decent food...as agreed by Human Rights !...hmmm..not really punishment for awful crimes (when they eventually do serve any time)
The answer is quite simple...zero tolerance policing, more prisons with less (not more) luxuries.
I dont remember anytime in the past when we had organised riots for pure looting and violence....all aided by Twitter, facebook and blackberry...and the police..powerless. Tear gas, water cannons, rubber bullets...all should have been used.
The Krays were organised crime...and dealt harsh punishment within their own crime circles....not beating up innocent elderly people for fun.
The answer...get a government that has the balls to throw out Human rights, build more prisons and get scum off the streets before its too late. "
ahhh sorry i didnt realize beating someone senseless because they worked for british rail was acceptable...understand now |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The gang of lads who found it justifiable to beat an old man up need flogging in my oppinion so they know how it feels to be unmercifully beaten and demorilised and have it done in public too.
couldnt agree more.....  |
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"The gang of lads who found it justifiable to beat an old man up need flogging in my oppinion so they know how it feels to be unmercifully beaten and demorilised and have it done in public too.
couldnt agree more..... "
mmmmm public flogging...now you are talking  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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ahhh sorry i didnt realize beating someone senseless because they worked for british rail was acceptable...understand now
at least the guys who beat up the 2 employees got 25-30 years in prison....
if the little vile thugs who beat a 71 year old man for kicks (not money)...will they even get to prison..or get just a wrap over the knuckles and sent on their way...to do it again? |
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