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Transgenders Competing Against Women in Sports
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I've seen an increasing number of XY chromosomers competing against XX chromosomers and absolutely destroying them. Is this fair? We wouldn't accept a heavyweight boxing a featherweight so why is this happening? Are women being disenfranchised by having to compete against transgender athletes? |
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There's so much sophistry on this. People saying male bodied trans women should not compete against biological women are merely acknowledging the physical advantages that male bodied people have over female bodied people
If you need any proof of this, note the fact that there are no trans men competing against biological men. |
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By *irthandgirthMan
over a year ago
Camberley occasionally doncaster |
If anyone needs any proof, Google Fallon Fox. She was a M to F trans lady who competed in UFC. Beat the crap out of several CIS ladies. Not pretty at all.
I have no issue with males, females and trans people competing directly where the sport is around skill alone. But they shouldn't be competing head to head where years of male hormones and growth and body structure could provide advantage. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"If anyone needs any proof, Google Fallon Fox. She was a M to F trans lady who competed in UFC. Beat the crap out of several CIS ladies. Not pretty at all.
I have no issue with males, females and trans people competing directly where the sport is around skill alone. But they shouldn't be competing head to head where years of male hormones and growth and body structure could provide advantage."
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"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events. "
All that shows is that RK is not a very good cyclist.
The reason we have separate male and female categories in sport is because males have significant physical advantages. Those who argue for trans women to compete as women are essentially arguing there should be no separation by sex in sport. |
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By *adyJayneWoman
over a year ago
Burnleyish (She/They) |
"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events.
All that shows is that RK is not a very good cyclist.
The reason we have separate male and female categories in sport is because males have significant physical advantages. Those who argue for trans women to compete as women are essentially arguing there should be no separation by sex in sport. "
She's a world champion so it's hardly like she is shit. I highlighted her losses to show the fact that as a transwoman she's actually evenly matched with her competitors. |
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"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events.
All that shows is that RK is not a very good cyclist.
The reason we have separate male and female categories in sport is because males have significant physical advantages. Those who argue for trans women to compete as women are essentially arguing there should be no separation by sex in sport.
She's a world champion so it's hardly like she is shit. I highlighted her losses to show the fact that as a transwoman she's actually evenly matched with her competitors. "
If she stayed a man would she be world champion?
I don’t think so. |
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"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events.
All that shows is that RK is not a very good cyclist.
The reason we have separate male and female categories in sport is because males have significant physical advantages. Those who argue for trans women to compete as women are essentially arguing there should be no separation by sex in sport.
She's a world champion so it's hardly like she is shit. I highlighted her losses to show the fact that as a transwoman she's actually evenly matched with her competitors. "
She's a world champion amongst veterans.
All that proves is that she'd be crap amongst men at that level but can compete with women.
Again, the logic of of your position is that males who are uncompetitive in male categories should be allowed to compete against women. |
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By *adyJayneWoman
over a year ago
Burnleyish (She/They) |
"If she stayed a man would she be world champion?
I don’t think so. "
Erm, ok I think you need to explain your point to me here. She hasn't 'stayed a man' she's a woman who happens to be trans, competing with women.
This thread was a discusion about transwomen being better by some margin than their cisgendered counterparts, not if a transwomen hadnt transitioned would they be a bad male athlete. |
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By *adyJayneWoman
over a year ago
Burnleyish (She/They) |
"All that proves is that she'd be crap amongst men at that level but can compete with women.
Again, the logic of of your position is that males who are uncompetitive in male categories should be allowed to compete against women. "
But that's the whole point of the discussion. Can a transwomen compete with cisgendered women?
You can't dismiss the example given because she's transgendered. That's literally the point. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events. "
Brazil's first transgender volleyball player, Tiffany Abreu, broke the record for the most points in a match in the country's championship.
Terry Miller, who was born a male came in first place twice during the State Open track and field 100m and 200m competition setting new state records in both races. Another transgender, Andraya Yearwood, came in second place in the 100m dash. In the year prior, Yearwood came in first in both the 100m and 200m dashes. Parents and the girls who competed were broken and angry and they thought it was unfair.
Mack Beggs, a transgender, defeated Kayla Fitts, who had a 52-0 record, in the Texas girls wrestling champion. Mack Beggs destroyed her hard earned record and won back-to-back state titles.
Fallon Fox, a transgender American MMA fighter has been obliterating women and even cracked Tamikka Brents' skull. Brents suffered a concussion, an orbital bone fracture, and seven staples to the head losing in the 1st round. Brents said "I've fought a lot of women and have never felt the strength that I felt in a fight as I did that night."
There are numerous more cases but there's a little teaser to get you started.
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"All that proves is that she'd be crap amongst men at that level but can compete with women.
Again, the logic of of your position is that males who are uncompetitive in male categories should be allowed to compete against women.
But that's the whole point of the discussion. Can a transwomen compete with cisgendered women?
You can't dismiss the example given because she's transgendered. That's literally the point. "
I think you first need to define what a transgender woman is. The current definition appears to be that's it anyone who identifies as a woman. So someone could be completely male bodied with no hormonal or surgical intervention and as long as they identify as a woman. They're a woman.
Should such people be entitled to compete against women? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I've seen an increasing number of XY chromosomers competing against XX chromosomers and absolutely destroying them. Is this fair? We wouldn't accept a heavyweight boxing a featherweight so why is this happening? Are women being disenfranchised by having to compete against transgender athletes? "
Can you list all of these increasing numbers if cases?
There are literally a handful of cases across a myriad of sports and far far more championships. |
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So where would transmale competitors fit in ?
As surely with a male physique they would have the unfair advantage in spades but still tick the chromosome box to compete against women ?
I'm unsure of any answer as legally validating somebody as a different gender than that of what they were born with then removing it within the world of sports does seem to be a bit sketchy.
Perhaps we should ban sports and bring in competetive raving  |
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"So where would transmale competitors fit in ?
As surely with a male physique they would have the unfair advantage in spades but still tick the chromosome box to compete against women ?
I'm unsure of any answer as legally validating somebody as a different gender than that of what they were born with then removing it within the world of sports does seem to be a bit sketchy.
Perhaps we should ban sports and bring in competetive raving "
No one is born with a gender. We're all born with a sex. Gender is the social convention generally attached to the sexes. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"If she stayed a man would she be world champion?
I don’t think so.
Erm, ok I think you need to explain your point to me here. She hasn't 'stayed a man' she's a woman who happens to be trans, competing with women.
This thread was a discusion about transwomen being better by some margin than their cisgendered counterparts, not if a transwomen hadnt transitioned would they be a bad male athlete. "
No, it's not about "being better" it's about having an unfair advantage due to being a biological male. For example, I may have a biological advantage over you in a fight but that doesn't mean you couldn't get the better of me somehow. Maybe I suffer an injury, maybe I'm out of shape, maybe I'm just starting out. A heavyweight amateur boxer for example can be beaten by a featherweight champion. But the heavyweight has an unfair advantage and if he actually trains.. the featherweight doesn't stand a chance in hell, in principle, therefore, it's unfair to match them. |
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"So where would transmale competitors fit in ?
As surely with a male physique they would have the unfair advantage in spades but still tick the chromosome box to compete against women ?
I'm unsure of any answer as legally validating somebody as a different gender than that of what they were born with then removing it within the world of sports does seem to be a bit sketchy.
Perhaps we should ban sports and bring in competetive raving
No one is born with a gender. We're all born with a sex. Gender is the social convention generally attached to the sexes. "
Thank you for that , worst thing was i did know that |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Where are you seeing a transgender male to female 'destroying' their competitors?
The only person I know of is Rachel McKinnon who had been beaten in her previous 10 out of 12 events. "
And masters racing at that age point is dominated by riders not food enough to compere at senior level and who have enough money/motivation to travel to the championships. It's a but of a non event really |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I've seen an increasing number of XY chromosomers competing against XX chromosomers and absolutely destroying them. Is this fair? We wouldn't accept a heavyweight boxing a featherweight so why is this happening? Are women being disenfranchised by having to compete against transgender athletes?
Can you list all of these increasing numbers of cases?"
Hell no! Can you list all the transgenders competing against women? I'm only referring to what I'm seeing as I stated.
"There are literally a handful of cases across a myriad of sports and far far more championships."
Do you know more than a handful of transgenders who are competing against women so you can list them and we can see that there only a handful of cases where they are dominating women? And yes the championships are where it matters for competitors. You can't trivialise championships as though they are not where the medals, trophies and accolades are issued. Championships matter!
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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If you cosign with 3rd wave femenism...labour party and antifa/hope Not hate
Then this is ALL YOUR FAULT
Like the recession in 2007 was partly caused by stupid letchers who buy everything on tick and expect regular people to feel sorry for them being on debt.
These issues/Islamic terrorism in UK
It's all caused by the same idiots and their mindless badly thought out "progression/social justice"
I like the UFC example best. Those poor ladies who spent years perfecting a sport and being even better than most male practitioners in their movement/cardio
....they are now getting lit up by a man in drag with a dense bone structure.
Muay thai isn't so stupid. kathoy nak muay fight men....end of discussion.
Asians are so much more culturally advanced and conservative thinking. They have a better smarter culture. They reject left wing ideas like any logical civilization.
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"If you cosign with 3rd wave femenism...labour party and antifa/hope Not hate
Then this is ALL YOUR FAULT
Like the recession in 2007 was partly caused by stupid letchers who buy everything on tick and expect regular people to feel sorry for them being on debt.
These issues/Islamic terrorism in UK
It's all caused by the same idiots and their mindless badly thought out "progression/social justice"
I like the UFC example best. Those poor ladies who spent years perfecting a sport and being even better than most male practitioners in their movement/cardio
....they are now getting lit up by a man in drag with a dense bone structure.
Muay thai isn't so stupid. kathoy nak muay fight men....end of discussion.
Asians are so much more culturally advanced and conservative thinking. They have a better smarter culture. They reject left wing ideas like any logical civilization.
"
So how come the most populus country in the world is in Asia and is ruled by the Communist Party |
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By *adyJayneWoman
over a year ago
Burnleyish (She/They) |
"All that proves is that she'd be crap amongst men at that level but can compete with women.
Again, the logic of of your position is that males who are uncompetitive in male categories should be allowed to compete against women.
But that's the whole point of the discussion. Can a transwomen compete with cisgendered women?
You can't dismiss the example given because she's transgendered. That's literally the point.
I think you first need to define what a transgender woman is. The current definition appears to be that's it anyone who identifies as a woman. So someone could be completely male bodied with no hormonal or surgical intervention and as long as they identify as a woman. They're a woman.
Should such people be entitled to compete against women? "
The "current definition" changes depending situation, who you ask and how they are viewing things.
From the point of sport the IOC have stated that transwomen must have been on hormone treatment for at least 12 months. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Nong toom is a professional muay thai fighter who is transgender and fights men.
The ufc example is basicly an able bodied shit person compeating in the Paralympics
Obviously we get where we are now because people vote for the Labour party or US democrats or angeler merkle or the Canadian president.
They implement crazy laws and protocol to create "anarchy". They side with "any cause of the proliteriate" (even if it's stupid)
The goal is to cause anarchy and being down culture/nationalism/morral and replace it with socialism leading to communism...
It's not as stupid as you first thought.
The elites are not the stupid ones and jeromy corbyn is very smart and manipulative.
It's the voters who cause all this. They vote labour because they steryotype that it's "for the peopl" "working class"....when really it's just supporting the elites like sorros.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"
So how come the most populus country in the world is in Asia and is ruled by the Communist Party "
Because they are majority backwards and stupid in China.
The smart ones are playing a game because they get punished if they step out of line.
They hate living there and want to escape. (Ask the ones in the chippy)
They like buddah and buddism is banned along with many old chinise philosophy from better times.
The Koreans, singapourians and japanise are very advanced culturally and economicly.
The thais are lazy. But they have a superiour culture to Europe and America. (Dispite being individually simple)
The Cambodians are smarter than the Thais and not formally educated. But they fucked the country beyond repairs during communism and it will take them atleast 100 years to develop to what they were in the 1960s.
Traditional culture of Thailand Japan and Korea is more advanced than Britain America and most of Europe.
We have social problems that don't exist in east Asian culture.
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"Nong toom was a professional muay thai fighter who is transgender and fought men."
FTFY
Perhaps a more informed bio may help with peoples opinions.
At 12 she joined a muay thai training camp as a boy winning 20 out of 22 matches
1998 aged 16 She had a year long short lived public/pro career pre transistion - and had been training in makeup, dress, and comportment to transition to female,
1999 retired and underwent SRS
2006 Fought and won an exhibition match against a man (Kenshiro Lookchaomaekhemthong).
She fought one more notable match against a woman, in Sweden
2010 returned to retirement to teach kickboxing and aerobics to children.
Her pro career was pre transistion and afterwards she fought a few fights against a man and woman
Thanks for the name though as i had never heard of her and it was nice to look at her story xx
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"There's so much sophistry on this. People saying male bodied trans women should not compete against biological women are merely acknowledging the physical advantages that male bodied people have over female bodied people
If you need any proof of this, note the fact that there are no trans men competing against biological men. "
They would most likley be banned because thier testosterone levels would beyond doping limits |
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The only sports where anybody can compete against anybody would be race car driving and like snooker and shit like that but anything physical like most sports should be kept the way it is for fairness, average man has 50% more upper body strength than the average woman and has more dense bone structure so spending 30yrs as a man and only 2yrs as a trans woman then stepping into the ring to kick the crap out of a woman isn't exactly a fair fight. We make it as fair as possible with weight divisions but that's all we can really do. Even with female football you can see how ridiculous they look compared to male football players, we are just built differently. I'm not saying that trans people shouldn't be able to complete but there is definitely a grey area that we gotta figure out because there are definitely unfair advantages when it comes to the world of sport. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The only sports where anybody can compete against anybody would be race car driving and like snooker and....."
I think it's ok to fight/go hard with women if your a practitioner and they are at the top of their game.
I ask to have it recognised as a difference in ability level for exhibition.
I wouldn't ban it alltogether...
Just have seprate titles/belts/competition
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