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9/11 The Falling Man
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Yeah it was right to be shown it’s true fact and a major terror attack and just to prove the problem that was coming ahead. It has been here and security forces all over the U.K. USA 0.Z France Sweden are facing a major problem daily. |
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"A terror attack by the US government. same as Manchester by the U.K. same as Paris by the French same as the ones in Germany by the Germans then  "
You forgot about the poisoning in Salisbury as well  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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This programme has identified the falling man too; I didn't know this had happened...Norberto Hernandez.
His daughter is being interviewed...very emotional |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government. same as Manchester by the U.K. same as Paris by the French same as the ones in Germany by the Germans then
You forgot about the poisoning in Salisbury as well "
yeah wasn’t worth reporting on  |
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Fucking tragic. Such a powerful image.
I think it brings it home to anyone with human decency that these things aren't a quick, painless death, and the consequences are greater than any imaginable on more people than you think. I think it's not a good image for those who knew the man, as each time it's seen it's gotta break them. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Fucking tragic. Such a powerful image.
I think it brings it home to anyone with human decency that these things aren't a quick, painless death, and the consequences are greater than any imaginable on more people than you think. I think it's not a good image for those who knew the man, as each time it's seen it's gotta break them. "
One of the most awful things I have heard on this show was someone who said:-
"they looked graceful falling, and there were hundreds of them, but you lost sight of them but you heard them hit the ground, like sacks of concrete"  |
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"Fucking tragic. Such a powerful image.
I think it brings it home to anyone with human decency that these things aren't a quick, painless death, and the consequences are greater than any imaginable on more people than you think. I think it's not a good image for those who knew the man, as each time it's seen it's gotta break them.
One of the most awful things I have heard on this show was someone who said:-
"they looked graceful falling, and there were hundreds of them, but you lost sight of them but you heard them hit the ground, like sacks of concrete" "
Yep. I watched it a few years ago and I remember. Sad beyond belief.
Choosing your own death must be one of the hardest yet simplest decisions. Taking your life and having control of your end or having it taken and possibly suffer the most intense pain and mental torture whilst looking for an escape. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact 
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2 "
Please let's not go there ...
This isn't the thread for that  |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2 "
Look into it and you'll find out. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Fucking tragic. Such a powerful image.
I think it brings it home to anyone with human decency that these things aren't a quick, painless death, and the consequences are greater than any imaginable on more people than you think. I think it's not a good image for those who knew the man, as each time it's seen it's gotta break them.
One of the most awful things I have heard on this show was someone who said:-
"they looked graceful falling, and there were hundreds of them, but you lost sight of them but you heard them hit the ground, like sacks of concrete"
Yep. I watched it a few years ago and I remember. Sad beyond belief.
Choosing your own death must be one of the hardest yet simplest decisions. Taking your life and having control of your end or having it taken and possibly suffer the most intense pain and mental torture whilst looking for an escape."
I couldn't imagine being in that position. Essentially decide whether to jump to your death or just burn to death ... Awful just awful |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2 "
Austria and de Germans bombed our chip shop  |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out."
look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"This programme has identified the falling man too; I didn't know this had happened...Norberto Hernandez.
His daughter is being interviewed...very emotional "
It actually WASN'T Norberto Hernandez |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe "
As I asked before please don't go into this on this thread. Thanks |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe "
Or the loony people who believe what they are told. |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
As I asked before please don't go into this on this thread. Thanks "
Sorry just seen this, I'll stop xx |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
Or the loony people who believe what they are told. "
The loons are the ones whose brains can't comprehend that bad shit can happen. They need to look for reasons and excuses. It's conspiracists that are the looms. I find it completely disrespectful to the victims and their families especially in this case. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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It's so sad just watching it on +1 i remember it well I was 16 at the time Sat in my aunties kitchen we just couldn't believe what we were watching can't believe it was 17 years ago wow just hope we never see anything like that again |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
As I asked before please don't go into this on this thread. Thanks
Sorry just seen this, I'll stop xx"
 Appreciated. This thread is just for the poor guy (and the others) who died on that day.
The devestation sits in my heart and I hurt for the families involved.
I'm a big softie really. Sorry  |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"It's so sad just watching it on +1 i remember it well I was 16 at the time Sat in my aunties kitchen we just couldn't believe what we were watching can't believe it was 17 years ago wow just hope we never see anything like that again "
My parents were on holiday and I was terrified when they flew home. Silly I know but thank god they got home safely ... The poor devils in the planes need remembering too. |
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One of those moments that we all remember where we were and what we were doing at the time that this was all going off.
Regardless of the theories, everyone was still united as one in the shock and sadness of it all. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I agree they all need to be remembered I think a lot of people forget about the other planes that flew into the Pentagon and the one that was shot down.its not silly I would of been the same if I had family travel on a plane the day that happened. |
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"One of those moments that we all remember where we were and what we were doing at the time that this was all going off.
Regardless of the theories, everyone was still united as one in the shock and sadness of it all. "
 |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I remember watching a doc about jumpers at the golden Gate bridge. Something uncomfortable about watching people doing it"
Yeah I've seen that. I felt really uncomfortable too. It's a very powerful documentary. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I agree they all need to be remembered I think a lot of people forget about the other planes that flew into the Pentagon and the one that was shot down.its not silly I would of been the same if I had family travel on a plane the day that happened. "
Thanks x |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
As I asked before please don't go into this on this thread. Thanks
Sorry just seen this, I'll stop xx
Appreciated. This thread is just for the poor guy (and the others) who died on that day.
The devestation sits in my heart and I hurt for the families involved.
I'm a big softie really. Sorry "
exactly . It does not matter who was guilty of doing it . It's the poor people who died and the families x |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
As I asked before please don't go into this on this thread. Thanks
Sorry just seen this, I'll stop xx
Appreciated. This thread is just for the poor guy (and the others) who died on that day.
The devestation sits in my heart and I hurt for the families involved.
I'm a big softie really. Sorry exactly . It does not matter who was guilty of doing it . It's the poor people who died and the families x"
It still makes me cry seeing things like this.
Makes me appreciate my family more even though we sometimes get on the others wick, at least we still have each other. My parents are still central to my life even at my age... |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"All together 2,977 poor souls lost there lives on that day RIP"
Totally agree 
No matter how many times I see footage of those planes going into the WTC it never ceases to amaze, upset and upset me |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"I found the day very emotional and still do. I found out I was pregnant with my daughter that morning and lay on the sofa cradling my stomach watching the events unfold on tv.
Lex"
A blessing arriving as it happened, that's a positive thing |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out."
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
"
 I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame"
|
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I remember where I was that day. I was at school. My boyfriend met me from school and told me about a plan crash in America. On the bus ride home we were wondering what the "twin towers" were. I remember going home putting the tv on and just crying at the tv.
I've been to NY and Ground Zero and few years back, just before the museum opened. It's a very beautiful, sombre place. Xx |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame "
perhaps this isn’t the place to discuss it then if you feel that strong obviously you are going to get different views especially when comments like the us government killed thousands of innocent people |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame perhaps this isn’t the place to discuss it then if you feel that strong obviously you are going to get different views especially when comments like the us government killed thousands of innocent people "
not at all. The thread was to show respect to the people who died and the familes who lost love ones . If you want to talk about who was to blame . Maybe start another thread and leave this one too the ones who have sympathy for those who died |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I do think it's correct, so many atrocities happen around the world and we only hear or see what is shown on the media, I once had the privilege of working with a man who worked for itn during the genocide in Africa, the Lockerbie bombing ect and some of the stories are unbelievable, so in some cases yes the death of man by man should be shared less never forget. |
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By *ky19Man
over a year ago
Plymouth |
As some might know I'm someone who believes the what, who and how of what happened that day entail a lot more than we've been publically told.
But I agree with everyone else, we all agree it was awful, for everyone who perished and for those who were compelled to jump rather than be in the building.
I don't know about this documentary? I take it it is about the people who jumped from the buildings?
I don't know if this is the right place to say, but a couple of thoughts amongst others which have stuck with me: People were hanging out of windows with one hand and taking clothes off with the other. There was also a woman on the phone with family, saying she's getting out, going down stairs. 2 floors down later and she too jumped...
I also didn't know so many firefighters died... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.look into what ? The loony conspiracy theory’s on 9.11 or the history of wars in Europe
Or the loony people who believe what they are told.
The loons are the ones whose brains can't comprehend that bad shit can happen. They need to look for reasons and excuses. It's conspiracists that are the looms. I find it completely disrespectful to the victims and their families especially in this case. "
Bang on! Probably believe that all the ISIS beheadings were all organised by their respective governments and Jihadi John was Donald Trump dressed up. As for Neil and Buzz landing on the Moon, nah. They’re probably all just pissed off that Alex Jones has been lobbed off Twitter and feeling a bit lost now. |
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I think it being aired again is needed to remember what happened that day.
I for one, like most people remember where I was when i heard that Diana had died, and where and what I was doing on that trajic day when the whole world watched the second tower being hit live in tv. I remember as if it were yesterday for both.
I can only ever imagine what horror those poor men and women must have gone through that morning.. for the people that survived, their guilt.. for the people who died, their desperation.
No one knows what they would do faced with that situation, was jumping the split second to have an extra 10 seconds of life before death? Did they jump in panic and regret it the second their foot left the shelf? No one will ever know.
I personally think all those souls who did jump were brave!
Brave to make the decision to take their life in the hope that by some miracle they “may” “possibly” survive ... in the face of impending death...
They did not commit suicide in my eyes even if the decision was theirs in the end... they ALL died by the despicable act or terrorism. And the desperate act of self preservation.
I watch all the programmes related to 911 every year, if nothing more than to remember I’m a lucky one, I still walk this earth.. and to respect the fact that thousands of innocent people had that chance taken from them that very sad day. |
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As well as those who died on the day, hundreds or even thousands who were in the vicinity either as bystanders or emergency services have died in the years since as a direct result of what they were breathing in that day.
I remember it well, I was only 19 and called in at my grandma's on my way home from work and it was on the news, I thought it was the trailer for a new action movie at first till it dawned on me it was real. The course of millions of lives all over the world changed on 9/11 and the ripples of it will carry on for decades to come. |
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"Fucking tragic. Such a powerful image.
I think it brings it home to anyone with human decency that these things aren't a quick, painless death, and the consequences are greater than any imaginable on more people than you think. I think it's not a good image for those who knew the man, as each time it's seen it's gotta break them. "
Get a lump in my throat every time I see it. Imagine being that desperate faced with the option of burning to death or throwing yourself from a skyscraper and having to have the balls to do it. Doesn’t even bare thinking about |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I remember watching a doc about jumpers at the golden Gate bridge. Something uncomfortable about watching people doing it
Yeah I've seen that. I felt really uncomfortable too. s a very powerful documentary. "
it is. i know someone who jumped off the suspension bridge in bristol |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I remember walking home from school and actually thinking it was a movie. It was so horrific to watch, I honestly can't imagine what it was like for all involved.
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions."
I remember watching it live on BBC News as the 2nd plane hit the tower. Later, it dawned on me I had just watched mass murder live on my telly. I hope never to see anything like it again.
I'm in two minds about the imagery. It must be very difficult for the family of the victim.
Plenty images of suffering as a result of military action in places like Syria, Afghanistan are sanitised and never see the light of day.
Re the conspiracy theory, no, I do not believe it. But that is not to say the idea isn't credible - just google "Operation Northwood" to see what heinous false-flag plots the US state is capable of dreaming up.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions."
I read that the first firefighter to be killed was killed by a falling body.
Images like that remind of the price paid by real,ordinary people,who were not involved in any conspiracy theories or international machinations.
Even if any solid new evidence has come to light to prove any of these conspiracy theories,why show an image like that now? What can that add to the investigation? |
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By *ymaleMan
over a year ago
nr Bradford |
Aside from the conspiracy theories and endless conjecture, the fact remains alot of people were innocently killed by the direct actions of others. And if you are ever going to learn from such a sorry state of affairs, you need to face up to the realities of what that actually means, however upsetting it may be. Because for it to happen again would be even more upsetting. |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
Plenty images of suffering as a result of military action in places like Syria, Afghanistan are sanitised and never see the light of day.
That's because we in the west don't care if its brown people being killed same as we care when its us
How else do you explain this annual mourning on 9/11 while elsewhere in the world thousands of deaths barely raises a ripple with us? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Iv never been into conspiracy theories but this one seems kinda suspicious if you just think for yourself instead of what the news said. The man who owned the towers who was known for always being at work every morning didnt show up that day, his son who was due in a meeting that morning also didnt show up and the same for his daughter aswell, any demolition expect will tell you that both towers free fell in a controlled manner, if they fell naturally then they would have fell over to the side destroying everything around them and I dont think you need to be an expert to see this for yourself, building seven also fell for some reason which had basically no damage fell also in a controlled way... also the bbc news reported live that building seven had collapsed but could clearly still be seen standing in the background and didnt fall till later, the planes exploded in fireballs and the buildings reduced to rubble with people saying that not even tables and chairs or file cabinets could be found in one piece but still they found a passport and it just so happens to belong to a terrorist, the security footage released afterwards from the airport claiming that it shows the terrorists checking in that morning had the bottom of the screen cropped out which has to be done manually and is a legal requirement and it usualy shows the numbers running with time and date and location which means that the images could come from anywhere anytime, the steel rods sticking up from the rubble were all cut at an angle which again any demolition expert will say has to be cut prior to demolition as without the cuts they wont fall, those rods were taken away almost immediately after the collapse to be sold and shipped to china as scrap which is illegal as the site should have been sealed off the same as a crime scene and would have shown evidence of being tampered with so that only suggests they were covering their tracks, countless eye witness statements that contradict the "official" report... and many more.
So much stuff about it smells like shite |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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911 is set to become an event which people have differing opinions on. Like the assassination of JFK. I think the time has passed to try and censor those opinions as being in some way distasteful or disrespectful. They aren't. You can believe there was a degree of US government involvement and still share in remembering the tragedy which it was and honouring the dead.
I personally appreciate that there's a broad church here in the way people remember the event. People could have lost a loved one in the catastrophe and hold a "conspiratorial" view about it. I think they should be allowed to sit and grieve with all the others. They may not need to convert others and they may not want to be converted either. They just want to say what they personally think and share what the date means to them and that's all. This is simply what 911 will be to people going forward and I'm ok with accepting that. I don't need to fight over it |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear suppose your theroy is correct then who really started ww1 and ww2
Look into it and you'll find out.
Agreed. The USA is not innocent, U believe it is corrupt and a lot of groups were targeted/scapegoated.
Osama Bin Laden was trained by the USA... They can make us believe what they want us too.
I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame perhaps this isn’t the place to discuss it then if you feel that strong obviously you are going to get different views especially when comments like the us government killed thousands of innocent people not at all. The thread was to show respect to the people who died and the familes who lost love ones . If you want to talk about who was to blame . Maybe start another thread and leave this one too the ones who have sympathy for those who died "
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Yeah i get upset at 9/11 still. Great documentary
Mrs S xx"
It was, very sad and the sadness factor was what I started this thread for, not a lot of bickering over who was to blame x |
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By *ky19Man
over a year ago
Plymouth |
"911 is set to become an event which people have differing opinions on. Like the assassination of JFK. I think the time has passed to try and censor those opinions as being in some way distasteful or disrespectful. They aren't. You can believe there was a degree of US government involvement and still share in remembering the tragedy which it was and honouring the dead.
I personally appreciate that there's a broad church here in the way people remember the event. People could have lost a loved one in the catastrophe and hold a "conspiratorial" view about it. I think they should be allowed to sit and grieve with all the others. They may not need to convert others and they may not want to be converted either. They just want to say what they personally think and share what the date means to them and that's all. This is simply what 911 will be to people going forward and I'm ok with accepting that. I don't need to fight over it "
Yeah this. We agree to remember the victims even if we don't agree what and how it happened. x |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"
I started this thread out of respect for the poor people who lost their lives during 9/11 ... Not to argue about who was to blame"
To be fair you started a discussion about a film so people can discuss
If it was a RIP thread that would have been different |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If people are going to join in on the discussion , don't attack people for their views as it is against forum rules"
Fair comment, but as its now a political points scoring contest should it not be in a relevant forum? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear "
Dear god, you’re sitting in your bedroom with a tin foil hat on arn’t you. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"343 Firefighters also lost their lives that day... "
And over 70 police officers too. The death toll rises each day. At present 2500 ground zero workers have cancer. The cancer rates of police officers who attended the scene have soared way past normal figures. |
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear
Dear god, you’re sitting in your bedroom with a tin foil hat on arn’t you. "
Are you walking around with blinkers on? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Plenty images of suffering as a result of military action in places like Syria, Afghanistan are sanitised and never see the light of day.
That's because we in the west don't care if its brown people being killed same as we care when its us
How else do you explain this annual mourning on 9/11 while elsewhere in the world thousands of deaths barely raises a ripple with us? "
Because its different when it’s your own isn’t it. I doubt very much whether people in the Middle East for instance give two hoots about 9/11 but I bet they mourn victims of their own disasters. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear
Dear god, you’re sitting in your bedroom with a tin foil hat on arn’t you.
Are you walking around with blinkers on?"
Nope. Feel free to add the facts that you form your opinions from, see if you can sway me. All the conspiracy theories I’ve watched or read can be debunked without too much thought. |
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By *ky19Man
over a year ago
Plymouth |
IMO the easiest things to debunk are some of the official stories we get told. Nothing more than crazy theories if not outright lies some of them, debunked with a few facts that get dug up, the facts that don't get reported much but are there.
Even the found passport alone should be enough to make a rational person think that's odd.
I don't know how it got there but I don't consider it a sign of mental illness to think it possible it was placed there, and the holder killed beforehand. It might not be that but I see the logic in it. I don't see the logic in dismissing that out of hand yet clinging to the belief it fell out of the plane, and also happened to belong to one of the alleged terrorists rather than any other passenger.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Complete 100% false flag. I feel so sorry for the people and families of the people who lost their lives that day and in the days since through lung problems and subsequent wars that have been fought on this falsehood of an event . May they rest in peace |
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"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions."
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking... |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"
Plenty images of suffering as a result of military action in places like Syria, Afghanistan are sanitised and never see the light of day.
That's because we in the west don't care if its brown people being killed same as we care when its us
How else do you explain this annual mourning on 9/11 while elsewhere in the world thousands of deaths barely raises a ripple with us?
Because its different when it’s your own isn’t it. I doubt very much whether people in the Middle East for instance give two hoots about 9/11 but I bet they mourn victims of their own disasters. "
Ye I bet they mourn the hundreds of thousands of middle easterns that unjustly were killed in retaliation for 9/11 alright
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Plenty images of suffering as a result of military action in places like Syria, Afghanistan are sanitised and never see the light of day.
That's because we in the west don't care if its brown people being killed same as we care when its us
How else do you explain this annual mourning on 9/11 while elsewhere in the world thousands of deaths barely raises a ripple with us?
Because its different when it’s your own isn’t it. I doubt very much whether people in the Middle East for instance give two hoots about 9/11 but I bet they mourn victims of their own disasters.
Ye I bet they mourn the hundreds of thousands of middle easterns that unjustly were killed in retaliation for 9/11 alright
"
|
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking..."
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking...
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
"
Where are you getting your figures from? |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking...
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
Where are you getting your figures from?"
That's the amount killed in the "war on terror" |
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"IMO the easiest things to debunk are some of the official stories we get told. Nothing more than crazy theories if not outright lies some of them, debunked with a few facts that get dug up, the facts that don't get reported much but are there.
Even the found passport alone should be enough to make a rational person think that's odd.
I don't know how it got there but I don't consider it a sign of mental illness to think it possible it was placed there, and the holder killed beforehand. It might not be that but I see the logic in it. I don't see the logic in dismissing that out of hand yet clinging to the belief it fell out of the plane, and also happened to belong to one of the alleged terrorists rather than any other passenger. "
Luckily there was that guy with the harley shirt to tell us exactly what had happened...! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking...
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
Where are you getting your figures from?
That's the amount killed in the "war on terror""
Where are you getting your figures from? |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking...
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
Where are you getting your figures from?
That's the amount killed in the "war on terror""
Have you got a link for that information please? |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Watching this on More4, still very emotional nearly 17 years on.
There was an outcry at that picture being shown around the world ... Do you think it was wrong and why??
Do you think it was right to show it and why?
Interested to hear opinions.
I think it's absolutely necessary to show it - because it underlines what it is so so easy to forget - that first and foremost, regardless of what happened afterwards, this was and is primarily a human - not political - tragedy.
Every one of those people that died was an individual. A person, with a family.
When people start talking numbers, the impact is lessened, it becomes just another statistic. It becomes abstract. People forget about the humanity involved in it and start arguing about the politics.
It's the same with the holocaust, or the people that have died in wars, or the people that die in natural disasters, famine, through sanctions or whatever - we hear a number and our brains cannot comprehend or process what that actually means.
Regardless of who actually perpetrated the atrocity, the important thing is actually that individual story - because that's what makes it 'real'
And heartbreaking...
2 million people have been killed in retaliation for 9/11. Now that is heartbreaking
Where are you getting your figures from?
That's the amount killed in the "war on terror"
Have you got a link for that information please?"
Google it. Wiki it |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
And its around 20 million people from all around the world the US government has killed since the end of WW2 up to 9/11
Yet every year we mourn 9/11 victims like they were the only people ever to die a horrible death |
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"And its around 20 million people from all around the world the US government has killed since the end of WW2 up to 9/11
Yet every year we mourn 9/11 victims like they were the only people ever to die a horrible death "
So 40 million since the end of ww2. Blimy, and they call those cowards deliberately targeting women and children terrorists... the cheek! |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"And its around 20 million people from all around the world the US government has killed since the end of WW2 up to 9/11
Yet every year we mourn 9/11 victims like they were the only people ever to die a horrible death
So 40 million since the end of ww2. Blimy, and they call those cowards deliberately targeting women and children terrorists... the cheek! "
|
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info"
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"Of course if we lined up the body bags of toddlers killed by our bombs in the name of freedom .We probably wouldn't be so keen on "freedom"."
Unfortunately I think we still would be keen,on our freedoms,not theirs |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on"
Maybe I explained it wrong
The us government has killed 20 million at least since the end of ww2 not since the end of 9/11
They have only killed 2 million since the end of 9/11 |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on
Maybe I explained it wrong
The us government has killed 20 million at least since the end of ww2 not since the end of 9/11
They have only killed 2 million since the end of 9/11"
But that wasn't what I was quoting you to ask for links to where you got your info from.
According to the ones I have read it is 1.3 million , which is bad enough but that isn't 2 million |
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on
Maybe I explained it wrong
The us government has killed 20 million at least since the end of ww2 not since the end of 9/11
They have only killed 2 million since the end of 9/11
But that wasn't what I was quoting you to ask for links to where you got your info from.
According to the ones I have read it is 1.3 million , which is bad enough but that isn't 2 million"
According to that wiki article its 1.3 to 2 million. Hard to give exact figures I'm sure
My point still stands tho |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on
Maybe I explained it wrong
The us government has killed 20 million at least since the end of ww2 not since the end of 9/11
They have only killed 2 million since the end of 9/11
But that wasn't what I was quoting you to ask for links to where you got your info from.
According to the ones I have read it is 1.3 million , which is bad enough but that isn't 2 million
According to that wiki article its 1.3 to 2 million. Hard to give exact figures I'm sure
My point still stands tho"
I would of thought the US would have no interest in collecting exact figures on civilian deaths as it has no benefit and doesn't read well back home .
|
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By *al2001Man
over a year ago
kildare |
"
Have you got a link for that information please?
Google it. Wiki it
I did, was shit at trying to find it so asked you to show me where I can find the correct info
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_casualties_in_the_war_in_Afghanistan_(2001%E2%80%93present)
https://www.newstalk.com/The-War-on-Terror-has-killed-13-million-people-report-finds
I found these but none with 20 million on
Maybe I explained it wrong
The us government has killed 20 million at least since the end of ww2 not since the end of 9/11
They have only killed 2 million since the end of 9/11
But that wasn't what I was quoting you to ask for links to where you got your info from.
According to the ones I have read it is 1.3 million , which is bad enough but that isn't 2 million
According to that wiki article its 1.3 to 2 million. Hard to give exact figures I'm sure
My point still stands tho
I would of thought the US would have no interest in collecting exact figures on civilian deaths as it has no benefit and doesn't read well back home .
"
I'd go as far as say they lie about the figures and cover them up
Not that they really have to as the public really don't care |
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By *ara JTV/TS
over a year ago
Bristol East |
Let's not forget the earlier 9/11.
September 11, 1973, when the CIA and Australian intelligence service combined to overthrow the government of Chile and install the fascist dictator Pinochet.
130,00 arrested within 3 years, torture widespread, political enemies executed and a death toll estimated in tens of thousands.
|
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"
According to the ones I have read it is 1.3 million , which is bad enough but that isn't 2 million
According to that wiki article its 1.3 to 2 million. Hard to give exact figures I'm sure
My point still stands tho"
No worries. I read more of the second link which said 1.3 but it could be more too...which doesn't mean there is of course.
I doubt if we will find out the true amount anyway...be that higher or lower |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If people are going to join in on the discussion , don't attack people for their views as it is against forum rules"
And mixing a sad and tragic event on a site which is predominantly filled with sexual content makes a lot of sense too, and pays much respect to the victims and their families; yes, of course it does! There are more appropriate platforms. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"If people are going to join in on the discussion , don't attack people for their views as it is against forum rules
And mixing a sad and tragic event on a site which is predominantly filled with sexual content makes a lot of sense too, and pays much respect to the victims and their families; yes, of course it does! There are more appropriate platforms."
Feel free to use them. It’s forum to be used for any subject, nobody is forced to read them or comment. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful "
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss"
And here’s us thinking fab might be filled with titillation. Isn’t Facebook meant for discussing doom/gloom or telling all your so called mates that you burnt your toast this morning? Whilst we fully appreciate that a forum is open for most topics, have to question the mind set of someone logging into a swinging site to discuss death, mortality and so called respect to both the deceased and their families. I’m sure they’d all be delighted to know they have your support given the type of site this is. Jesus. |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss
And here’s us thinking fab might be filled with titillation. Isn’t Facebook meant for discussing doom/gloom or telling all your so called mates that you burnt your toast this morning? Whilst we fully appreciate that a forum is open for most topics, have to question the mind set of someone logging into a swinging site to discuss death, mortality and so called respect to both the deceased and their families. I’m sure they’d all be delighted to know they have your support given the type of site this is. Jesus."
I am not sure why you quoted both my posts to have your say on what should be said on a forum...but for info , the lounge is for anything people want to chat about ( within rules ) . If you don't want to read things like this maybe don't open the thread with an obvious title of what it is about |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss
And here’s us thinking fab might be filled with titillation. Isn’t Facebook meant for discussing doom/gloom or telling all your so called mates that you burnt your toast this morning? Whilst we fully appreciate that a forum is open for most topics, have to question the mind set of someone logging into a swinging site to discuss death, mortality and so called respect to both the deceased and their families. I’m sure they’d all be delighted to know they have your support given the type of site this is. Jesus."
I’m not on Facebook. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss
And here’s us thinking fab might be filled with titillation. Isn’t Facebook meant for discussing doom/gloom or telling all your so called mates that you burnt your toast this morning? Whilst we fully appreciate that a forum is open for most topics, have to question the mind set of someone logging into a swinging site to discuss death, mortality and so called respect to both the deceased and their families. I’m sure they’d all be delighted to know they have your support given the type of site this is. Jesus.
I am not sure why you quoted both my posts to have your say on what should be said on a forum...but for info , the lounge is for anything people want to chat about ( within rules ) . If you don't want to read things like this maybe don't open the thread with an obvious title of what it is about"
Looks like you’ll have to remain content with being blissfully unaware then doesn’t it |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I am sure I will live
( it wasn't a question anyway ) "
Yep well aware of that, but most of your statements are filled with remarks like not sure, maybe this, maybe that. Just providing the clarity you quite clearly need. A simple thank you would have sufficed |
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"It's the arguing guys... the arguing is disrespectful. *On both sides* Just leave it be. Some people are convinced by the official story. Some aren't. Just express your opinion, honour the deceased and injured, and leave it at that.
If you want to try and persuade others that your view of events is superior to theirs maybe start a new thread. That's not me being bossy or trying to impose forum rules or anything. That's just respectful
As advised, they don't have to. The OP is not a RIP post, it is an invite to discuss
And here’s us thinking fab might be filled with titillation. Isn’t Facebook meant for discussing doom/gloom or telling all your so called mates that you burnt your toast this morning? Whilst we fully appreciate that a forum is open for most topics, have to question the mind set of someone logging into a swinging site to discuss death, mortality and so called respect to both the deceased and their families. I’m sure they’d all be delighted to know they have your support given the type of site this is. Jesus."
Is the mindset of someone posting about things you don't like any better than the mindset of someone who doesn't like the topic yet posts on it anyway? Surely you've got better things to do than tell people you don't like their thread topic? I mean, you could always start a thread on a topic you feel is more suited to the platform as that seems something you're quite passionate about. |
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By *ugby 123Couple
over a year ago
Forum Mod O o O oo |
"I am sure I will live
( it wasn't a question anyway )
Yep well aware of that, but most of your statements are filled with remarks like not sure, maybe this, maybe that. Just providing the clarity you quite clearly need. A simple thank you would have sufficed "
I am sure...you will be waiting a long time |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"A terror attack by the US government.and you know this for a fact
The easiest way to manipulate people is by fear
Thats how religions started"
That's a popular atheist meme rather than a truism imo. Whilst I agree that it's undoubtedly the case that most people misinterpret religion through a superstitious lens, in particular the monsters behind 911, that for me is a response to the emergence of the faiths, not their cause. Their cause is a much more complicated issue imo.
Think of the "religion was devised by scheming tricksters who wanted to control and manipulate us" as just another whacky conspiracy theory. |
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By *ky19Man
over a year ago
Plymouth |
The post above, thumbs up. I didn't want to quote it to save space.
I had a look for a little information a couple of days ago, regarding people who were jumping.
First, I was quite alarmed, typing in google, the 4th most popular option was for graphic images of the remains of people after impact. That can't all be for research purposes, I conclude that most people searching specifically for graphic images are doing so just to have a big gawk. Surprised how many it seems to be.
I was looking to see again, people were hanging out of windows and some were taking clothes off, like trousers. Its just bizarre.
Just to warn that unfortunately any image search for jumpers will also retrieve very graphic images in the thumbnails too...
Something else that surprised me was a plan diagram outlining the WTC buildings with dots all around signifying locations where bodies landed. There were so many. But more surprising was how far some of them landed, a few measures at over 1,000 feet away - or over 0.2 miles! |
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By *ky19Man
over a year ago
Plymouth |
For comparison, the height of the towers not inc spires were around 1368 feet.
I have no thoughts on why, how, or what right now, it just took me by surprise if that diagram is accurate, one body was found to have impacted about 1132 feet from the building. |
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