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You can think yourself better
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view? |
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Same with pain. I can block it off in many instances.
Broke my leg and carried on playing, same with fractured skull and when my teeth came through my lip.
I've had dentist work done without the injection.
If you think glum you will feel it. I can't do the same with illness so often. If I've got the flu I'm knackered. |
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?"
Fiddlesticks!!!
I’m feeling ill today but doubt my power of imagination will heal me. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?"
As someone who suffers from a chronic pain condition i would have to say ....
Rubbish! |
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By *tonMessCouple
over a year ago
Slough Windsor ish |
The mind is a powerful tool... It can be used to heal in some cases, certainly a positive mental attitude has been proven to be a benefit to recovery from some pretty traumatic injuries but I don't think the mind alone can cure all the time. |
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How many rich and famous people have all the money in the world and can do anything they like to distract themselves from depression, but doesn't stop them from committing suicide in their minds though. |
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?"
Psychologically yes.
Can I think an injury to repair.......nope .... good mental attitude aids recovery though. |
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"Same with pain. I can block it off in many instances.
Broke my leg and carried on playing, same with fractured skull and when my teeth came through my lip.
I've had dentist work done without the injection.
If you think glum you will feel it. I can't do the same with illness so often. If I've got the flu I'm knackered."
That's adrenalin and short term. Your body did it. Not you. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?"
Placebo ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think having a positive attitude can make illnesses and injury easier to bear and therefore make it appear that the positive person gets better more quickly. "
Agree with that. You can almost become a victim of something or just choose to get on with it. |
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"I think having a positive attitude can make illnesses and injury easier to bear and therefore make it appear that the positive person gets better more quickly.
Agree with that. You can almost become a victim of something or just choose to get on with it. "
Yes.
We were having this discussion yesterday. My mum has many, many problems the effects of a broken back, heart failure, catastrophic head injury and several strokes. She is very positive and pushes herself to do things. Sometimes she pushes her self to do things that she really shouldn't but do we stop her, condemn her to sit waiting to die or encourage her knowing its shortening her life? If it was me I think I'd carry on doing as much as I could with as much positivity as possible. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The mind is a powerful tool... It can be used to heal in some cases, certainly a positive mental attitude has been proven to be a benefit to recovery from some pretty traumatic injuries but I don't think the mind alone can cure all the time."
 |
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?"
Absolutely - but of course this comes with some serious caveats. As people have mentioned there is the placebo effect, as well as its opposite number, the nocebo effect - an example of which I heard a while back. Some chap was outcast from his tribe (I'm think Australia but it could have equally been Africa) and cursed by the shaman/magicman - he wondered across the desert and eventually found himself in a white settlement, whereupon he was rushed to hospital.
The doctors examined him and agreed he was at death's door, yet had nothing actually wrong with him. They gave him a placebo and he made a full recovery, due to his belief that the white man's magic was stronger...
Even more interesting than that was the story of a schizophrenic woman, who had about 7 different personalities - one of which was diabetic...
Though we think of that as being a purely physiological thing, when she became that personality, her body developed an insulin deficiency, which I find fascinating.
The mind is a powerful thing.
However, I think the problem with any of this sort of discussion is that it can always veer towards invisible illnesses being treated in a dismissive fashion - such as people with a mental health problem being told "it's all just in your head!"
Yeah, ummm...durrrrr
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?
Absolutely - but of course this comes with some serious caveats. As people have mentioned there is the placebo effect, as well as its opposite number, the nocebo effect - an example of which I heard a while back. Some chap was outcast from his tribe (I'm think Australia but it could have equally been Africa) and cursed by the shaman/magicman - he wondered across the desert and eventually found himself in a white settlement, whereupon he was rushed to hospital.
The doctors examined him and agreed he was at death's door, yet had nothing actually wrong with him. They gave him a placebo and he made a full recovery, due to his belief that the white man's magic was stronger...
Even more interesting than that was the story of a schizophrenic woman, who had about 7 different personalities - one of which was diabetic...
Though we think of that as being a purely physiological thing, when she became that personality, her body developed an insulin deficiency, which I find fascinating.
The mind is a powerful thing.
However, I think the problem with any of this sort of discussion is that it can always veer towards invisible illnesses being treated in a dismissive fashion - such as people with a mental health problem being told "it's all just in your head!"
Yeah, ummm...durrrrr
"
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?
Absolutely - but of course this comes with some serious caveats. As people have mentioned there is the placebo effect, as well as its opposite number, the nocebo effect - an example of which I heard a while back. Some chap was outcast from his tribe (I'm think Australia but it could have equally been Africa) and cursed by the shaman/magicman - he wondered across the desert and eventually found himself in a white settlement, whereupon he was rushed to hospital.
The doctors examined him and agreed he was at death's door, yet had nothing actually wrong with him. They gave him a placebo and he made a full recovery, due to his belief that the white man's magic was stronger...
Even more interesting than that was the story of a schizophrenic woman, who had about 7 different personalities - one of which was diabetic...
Though we think of that as being a purely physiological thing, when she became that personality, her body developed an insulin deficiency, which I find fascinating.
The mind is a powerful thing.
However, I think the problem with any of this sort of discussion is that it can always veer towards invisible illnesses being treated in a dismissive fashion - such as people with a mental health problem being told "it's all just in your head!"
Yeah, ummm...durrrrr
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing."
Do you think she doesn't believe they're serious or is she in denial?
Or maybe positive thinking and sticking 2 fingers up at her conditions and living life in spite of it?
I suppose it depends on what the condition is. An elderly diabetic still eating sugar may be in denial of the possible effects, or thinking fuck it, I'll die anyway, I'll have a biscuit. |
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"I had an interesting discussion about it yesterday, if you feel ill you could heal yourself as we can use the power of our imagination and resulting emotions to access and heal all parts of the body, whats your view?
Absolutely - but of course this comes with some serious caveats. As people have mentioned there is the placebo effect, as well as its opposite number, the nocebo effect - an example of which I heard a while back. Some chap was outcast from his tribe (I'm think Australia but it could have equally been Africa) and cursed by the shaman/magicman - he wondered across the desert and eventually found himself in a white settlement, whereupon he was rushed to hospital.
The doctors examined him and agreed he was at death's door, yet had nothing actually wrong with him. They gave him a placebo and he made a full recovery, due to his belief that the white man's magic was stronger...
Even more interesting than that was the story of a schizophrenic woman, who had about 7 different personalities - one of which was diabetic...
Though we think of that as being a purely physiological thing, when she became that personality, her body developed an insulin deficiency, which I find fascinating.
The mind is a powerful thing.
However, I think the problem with any of this sort of discussion is that it can always veer towards invisible illnesses being treated in a dismissive fashion - such as people with a mental health problem being told "it's all just in your head!"
Yeah, ummm...durrrrr
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing."
Yeah, my eldest Aunt was a sturdy Scouse 4'10" battleaxe that used to live in Bootle and had no qualms about jumping in between two big lads beating the shit out of each other to give them both a clip round the ear and to grow up.
When she got pancreatic cancer (for those that are blessed enough to have never come across this strain - it's super-aggressive, and you've got 6 months if you're lucky. Or unlucky, depending on your take on things) the doctors didn't want to give her any treatments, because they knew what lie ahead.
But as ever, she wouldn't take no for an answer, so they gave her chemo to mollify her, and she thought she was going to recover  |
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"
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing.
Yeah, my eldest Aunt was a sturdy Scouse 4'10" battleaxe that used to live in Bootle and had no qualms about jumping in between two big lads beating the shit out of each other to give them both a clip round the ear and to grow up.
When she got pancreatic cancer (for those that are blessed enough to have never come across this strain - it's super-aggressive, and you've got 6 months if you're lucky. Or unlucky, depending on your take on things) the doctors didn't want to give her any treatments, because they knew what lie ahead.
But as ever, she wouldn't take no for an answer, so they gave her chemo to mollify her, and she thought she was going to recover "
Bless her heart. Do you think her last months were better because she believed she would recover?
I wonder if my mum's refusal to accept how serious her injuries are is a blessing in some ways. |
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"
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing.
Yeah, my eldest Aunt was a sturdy Scouse 4'10" battleaxe that used to live in Bootle and had no qualms about jumping in between two big lads beating the shit out of each other to give them both a clip round the ear and to grow up.
When she got pancreatic cancer (for those that are blessed enough to have never come across this strain - it's super-aggressive, and you've got 6 months if you're lucky. Or unlucky, depending on your take on things) the doctors didn't want to give her any treatments, because they knew what lie ahead.
But as ever, she wouldn't take no for an answer, so they gave her chemo to mollify her, and she thought she was going to recover
Bless her heart. Do you think her last months were better because she believed she would recover?
I wonder if my mum's refusal to accept how serious her injuries are is a blessing in some ways."
Not really. I think her last month's were excruciating because she poisoned herself with the chemo in the mistaken belief it would make a difference. Instead it just made her life hell.
I remember the last time I saw her, not long before, and she was little more than skin and bones. She'd finally resigned herself to her fate then, and more than anything it was that giving up - from the lady that never accepted defeat on anything - that was the most heartbreaking |
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"
Indeed. Or as in my mum's case an inability to believe that her conditions are in any way serious. The mind is very powerful but it's not always a good thing.
Yeah, my eldest Aunt was a sturdy Scouse 4'10" battleaxe that used to live in Bootle and had no qualms about jumping in between two big lads beating the shit out of each other to give them both a clip round the ear and to grow up.
When she got pancreatic cancer (for those that are blessed enough to have never come across this strain - it's super-aggressive, and you've got 6 months if you're lucky. Or unlucky, depending on your take on things) the doctors didn't want to give her any treatments, because they knew what lie ahead.
But as ever, she wouldn't take no for an answer, so they gave her chemo to mollify her, and she thought she was going to recover
Bless her heart. Do you think her last months were better because she believed she would recover?
I wonder if my mum's refusal to accept how serious her injuries are is a blessing in some ways.
Not really. I think her last month's were excruciating because she poisoned herself with the chemo in the mistaken belief it would make a difference. Instead it just made her life hell.
I remember the last time I saw her, not long before, and she was little more than skin and bones. She'd finally resigned herself to her fate then, and more than anything it was that giving up - from the lady that never accepted defeat on anything - that was the most heartbreaking "
I understand and empathise. |
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"Cancer truly is a bastard"
I think watching those you love and knew as strong, vital younger people diminished and brought low by any disease or injury is heartbreaking. Suggesting that its possible to heal oneself by the power of thought isn't useful in that instance. |
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"Cancer truly is a bastard
I think watching those you love and knew as strong, vital younger people diminished and brought low by any disease or injury is heartbreaking. Suggesting that its possible to heal oneself by the power of thought isn't useful in that instance."
Very true.
But that's not to say there can't be a place for positivity in those circumstances - rather than dwelling on the "Why me! This is so unfair!" (which of course it is, but that doesn't change things) I've known people who have taken a rather more stoical view of it being the new reality, that is going to happen whether you accept it or not, and have accepted it and made the most if their time.
I have a limitless amount of admiration for those people. I would like to think I'd be able to do similar if I ever found myself in that situation, but i really dont know if id actually ve able to... |
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By *oxy_minxWoman
over a year ago
Scotland - Aberdeen |
In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not! |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!"
Wrong thread? |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread? "
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending"
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I don't think for one minute that my positive attitude and mental strength will remove the tumour growing in my brain. Believe me, I've tried all sorts of things, but yep, it's still there nearly 8 years on.
Sorry Shag but I don't believe it. |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
"
Yeah, my uncle (brother of aforementioned Aunt) also got pancreatic cancer. But his they caught purely by accident, checking something else out - they caught it so early they actually suggested surgery and treatment, which they don't normally bother with.
He lasted all of 6 months as well, and afterwards he said he wished he'd never bother.
If I got one that was terminal, and treatment was the difference between X amount of months or Y amount of months, I'd just go "fuck it, gimme the morphine and stuff all the rest"
Why spend your last days fighting an unwinnable battle? It's different if there was some chance of recovery, but to spend the last period of your life struggling in agony?
Fuck that |
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"I don't think for one minute that my positive attitude and mental strength will remove the tumour growing in my brain. Believe me, I've tried all sorts of things, but yep, it's still there nearly 8 years on.
Sorry Shag but I don't believe it. "
*hugs* |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
Yeah, my uncle (brother of aforementioned Aunt) also got pancreatic cancer. But his they caught purely by accident, checking something else out - they caught it so early they actually suggested surgery and treatment, which they don't normally bother with.
He lasted all of 6 months as well, and afterwards he said he wished he'd never bother.
If I got one that was terminal, and treatment was the difference between X amount of months or Y amount of months, I'd just go "fuck it, gimme the morphine and stuff all the rest"
Why spend your last days fighting an unwinnable battle? It's different if there was some chance of recovery, but to spend the last period of your life struggling in agony?
Fuck that"
Yes. My aunt had a rare form of cancer for which she refused treatment.
I was more thinking of the people who are diagnosed and for which treatment is a possibility. Often people's reaction is to tell them to "be strong" and to "fight it". Maybe all they want is to curl up and be weak and have other people be strong for them.
I think supporting an ill person to remain as positive mentally as they can is a good thing and can only improve a horrible experience. However to put the onus for recovery on an ill person is wrong. |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
Yeah, my uncle (brother of aforementioned Aunt) also got pancreatic cancer. But his they caught purely by accident, checking something else out - they caught it so early they actually suggested surgery and treatment, which they don't normally bother with.
He lasted all of 6 months as well, and afterwards he said he wished he'd never bother.
If I got one that was terminal, and treatment was the difference between X amount of months or Y amount of months, I'd just go "fuck it, gimme the morphine and stuff all the rest"
Why spend your last days fighting an unwinnable battle? It's different if there was some chance of recovery, but to spend the last period of your life struggling in agony?
Fuck that
Yes. My aunt had a rare form of cancer for which she refused treatment.
I was more thinking of the people who are diagnosed and for which treatment is a possibility. Often people's reaction is to tell them to "be strong" and to "fight it". Maybe all they want is to curl up and be weak and have other people be strong for them.
I think supporting an ill person to remain as positive mentally as they can is a good thing and can only improve a horrible experience. However to put the onus for recovery on an ill person is wrong."
In my experience people are good at *saying* that they are there to support etc, but not quite so good at doing the actual supporting...
But, we are all human, and all so flawed in so many ways.
Forgive us our trespasses and all that... |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
Yeah, my uncle (brother of aforementioned Aunt) also got pancreatic cancer. But his they caught purely by accident, checking something else out - they caught it so early they actually suggested surgery and treatment, which they don't normally bother with.
He lasted all of 6 months as well, and afterwards he said he wished he'd never bother.
If I got one that was terminal, and treatment was the difference between X amount of months or Y amount of months, I'd just go "fuck it, gimme the morphine and stuff all the rest"
Why spend your last days fighting an unwinnable battle? It's different if there was some chance of recovery, but to spend the last period of your life struggling in agony?
Fuck that
Yes. My aunt had a rare form of cancer for which she refused treatment.
I was more thinking of the people who are diagnosed and for which treatment is a possibility. Often people's reaction is to tell them to "be strong" and to "fight it". Maybe all they want is to curl up and be weak and have other people be strong for them.
I think supporting an ill person to remain as positive mentally as they can is a good thing and can only improve a horrible experience. However to put the onus for recovery on an ill person is wrong.
In my experience people are good at *saying* that they are there to support etc, but not quite so good at doing the actual supporting...
But, we are all human, and all so flawed in so many ways.
Forgive us our trespasses and all that..."
Indeed. Also I think there's an element of fear in believing that illness doesn't discriminate in who it affects. If you can somehow place the responsibilty for their recovery on the ill person it's not as scary. |
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"In some cases you can, in some, trying to belittle them is trying to belittle the person! I'm normally strong but if I have a mini mental breakdown due to a litigation case I have been dealing with it is highly likely I am going to tell you to fuck off and do one in no uncertain terms, as in more serious cases I would guess would be the same, trying to belittle the problem does more harm than good! Whether good intentions or not!
Wrong thread?
No, I think I get the gist.
The whole concept of "just think yourself better" could come across very belittling and condescending
Yes, I think you're right. I understand now.
I often cringe when I hear people tell cancer patients "you must fight it" putting all the onus on them to cure themselves at the lowest point in their life.
Yeah, my uncle (brother of aforementioned Aunt) also got pancreatic cancer. But his they caught purely by accident, checking something else out - they caught it so early they actually suggested surgery and treatment, which they don't normally bother with.
He lasted all of 6 months as well, and afterwards he said he wished he'd never bother.
If I got one that was terminal, and treatment was the difference between X amount of months or Y amount of months, I'd just go "fuck it, gimme the morphine and stuff all the rest"
Why spend your last days fighting an unwinnable battle? It's different if there was some chance of recovery, but to spend the last period of your life struggling in agony?
Fuck that
Yes. My aunt had a rare form of cancer for which she refused treatment.
I was more thinking of the people who are diagnosed and for which treatment is a possibility. Often people's reaction is to tell them to "be strong" and to "fight it". Maybe all they want is to curl up and be weak and have other people be strong for them.
I think supporting an ill person to remain as positive mentally as they can is a good thing and can only improve a horrible experience. However to put the onus for recovery on an ill person is wrong.
In my experience people are good at *saying* that they are there to support etc, but not quite so good at doing the actual supporting...
But, we are all human, and all so flawed in so many ways.
Forgive us our trespasses and all that...
Indeed. Also I think there's an element of fear in believing that illness doesn't discriminate in who it affects. If you can somehow place the responsibilty for their recovery on the ill person it's not as scary."
I'd never really thought of it like that, but I think you probably are onto something there. I think the chaos and unpredictability of the world just isn't something our brains are naturally hard-wired to handle... |
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"I think having a positive attitude can make illnesses and injury easier to bear and therefore make it appear that the positive person gets better more quickly. "
I agree. When I'm feeling low, my chronic pain seems worse, when feeling positive, it slightly improves.
Meditation also helps me. When I'm relaxed, my muscles are less tense with less spasm. That's why acupuncture works for me. |
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