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Victim blaming
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"The "Victim Blaming" term often insists that the victim suffered through no fault of their own. In other words, the victim is not responsible for anything that happens to them and simply pointing out that more caution should've been exercised makes you a bad person. People who are accused of "victim blaming" are not excusing the behavior the aggressor, which is often misunderstood by people who simply shout "victim blaming" at others.
Person1: That Lion tore my arm off when I was just walking through the jungle minding my own business.
Person2: We'll you shouldn't be walking through the jungle alone without protection. That's dumb.
Person1: You're victim blaming asshole!
Person2: No, I just think it's common sense to not put yourself in danger. Even I don't walk through the jungle alone.
Person1: Victim Blaming!
Person2: I didn't want you to lose your arm, I'm just pointing out the simple fact that, had you been more cautious, you might still have your arm. I only mention it so you and others might be more careful next time.
Person1: Bigot! Racist! I hope a lion tears your arm off."
The above is something I found on t'internet. What do you think about 'victim blaming'? |
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The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
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By *VineMan
over a year ago
The right place |
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
"
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability. "
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?"
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting. "
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way. |
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By *VineMan
over a year ago
The right place |
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?"
There are laws to protect us from these things.
If someone was walking on the motorway they would be breaking the law. If a driver hit them but didn’t intend to, the victim would be to blame. But, If the driver says pedestrian on the motorway and deliberately steered to hit them then the driver would be at fault.
It’s not illegal to be a fan in the opposite teams stand. It might be a stupid thing to do, but it doesn’t warrant violence against the person. If someone assaults them the attacker is the guilty party.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way. "
I love every single one of your 33 pubes my darling |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way.
I love every single one of your 33 pubes my darling "
42!! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way.
I love every single one of your 33 pubes my darling
42!!"
9 of them are in my teeth |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way.
I love every single one of your 33 pubes my darling "
32! Had to pull one off as it was ROTTEN (saying it with the welsh accent) |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
Agree Jenna, I am not a violent bearded person but when I see your pussy I'd love to give it a good beating with my rock hard cock that it ain't shaved in a weird fashion way.
I love every single one of your 33 pubes my darling
42!!
9 of them are in my teeth"
You're welcome btw. |
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Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance. |
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By *an_LexaCouple
over a year ago
Sunderland |
"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance. "
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance.
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear."
I think people who use that term fundamentally don't understand why other people say certain things. For example, pragmatic people accept that the world isn't perfect and it has bad people in it. So if something shitty happened to you, their brain is probably in problem solving mode trying to help. To suggest those people are trying to say they think you deserved to have a crime committed against you is intellectually dishonest. Just dishing out empathy doesn't really do anything to reduce the chance of it happening again. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance.
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear.
I think people who use that term fundamentally don't understand why other people say certain things. For example, pragmatic people accept that the world isn't perfect and it has bad people in it. So if something shitty happened to you, their brain is probably in problem solving mode trying to help. To suggest those people are trying to say they think you deserved to have a crime committed against you is intellectually dishonest. Just dishing out empathy doesn't really do anything to reduce the chance of it happening again. "
It costs me to say it  but I totally agree with you there |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance.
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear.
I think people who use that term fundamentally don't understand why other people say certain things. For example, pragmatic people accept that the world isn't perfect and it has bad people in it. So if something shitty happened to you, their brain is probably in problem solving mode trying to help. To suggest those people are trying to say they think you deserved to have a crime committed against you is intellectually dishonest. Just dishing out empathy doesn't really do anything to reduce the chance of it happening again. "
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance.
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear.
I think people who use that term fundamentally don't understand why other people say certain things. For example, pragmatic people accept that the world isn't perfect and it has bad people in it. So if something shitty happened to you, their brain is probably in problem solving mode trying to help. To suggest those people are trying to say they think you deserved to have a crime committed against you is intellectually dishonest. Just dishing out empathy doesn't really do anything to reduce the chance of it happening again.
It costs me to say it but I totally agree with you there"
Fist bump?  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. But the kind of people who use that term aren't interested in truth or nuance.
I agree totally with you.
Every incident is unique, you can’t say it’s right or wrong without knowing the full facts of each specific case. And to be fair, how often do we get to know the FULL facts of each case. Not very often. We normally only get to hear a biased view of what each party wants us to hear.
I think people who use that term fundamentally don't understand why other people say certain things. For example, pragmatic people accept that the world isn't perfect and it has bad people in it. So if something shitty happened to you, their brain is probably in problem solving mode trying to help. To suggest those people are trying to say they think you deserved to have a crime committed against you is intellectually dishonest. Just dishing out empathy doesn't really do anything to reduce the chance of it happening again.
It costs me to say it but I totally agree with you there"
#metoo  |
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By *an_LexaCouple
over a year ago
Sunderland |
It’s sensible to expect, to teach, to talk to people about taking responsibility for their own levels of risk and we all do that here.
Granted to varying levels with socials, not posting our phone numbers, addresses. Letting friends know where we’re meeting someone new, checking in when we’re there. Maybe having find my friends app on our phones etc to track our whereabouts. So many different options.
But quite often that’s what it boils down. People’s own ideas as to what is the right level of personal responsibility in a situation. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think! |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think! "
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The worst form of victim blaming is done in courts by solicitors against victims of sexual attacks and abuse, in that environment it seems the norm to accuse the victim of leading the attacker on. As far as learning from the situation sometimes there is no lesson to be learned, just the person was in the wrong place at the wrong time, or the perpetrator took advantage of other people’s better nature.
We can all be danger aware but you can’t protect yourself from the unexpected x |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"It’s sensible to expect, to teach, to talk to people about taking responsibility for their own levels of risk and we all do that here.
Granted to varying levels with socials, not posting our phone numbers, addresses. Letting friends know where we’re meeting someone new, checking in when we’re there. Maybe having find my friends app on our phones etc to track our whereabouts. So many different options.
But quite often that’s what it boils down. People’s own ideas as to what is the right level of personal responsibility in a situation."
If such things as socials are suggested before a meet, they are 'good tips'.
If such things as socials are suggested after someone has been attacked on a meet, they are 'victim blaming'.
Sometimes people are accused of 'victim blaming' when they are actually trying to help. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions. "
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"The worst form of victim blaming is done in courts by solicitors against victims of sexual attacks and abuse, in that environment it seems the norm to accuse the victim of leading the attacker on. As far as learning from the situation sometimes there is no lesson to be learned, just the person was in the wrong place at the wrong time, or the perpetrator took advantage of other people’s better nature.
We can all be danger aware but you can’t protect yourself from the unexpected x "
I agree. x |
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions. "
It would but unfortunately the majority of people avoid conflict and will go along with the dominant narrative for an easy life. We don't have a constitution guaranteeing our rights the way Americans do so free speech is always in danger here. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved. "
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond. |
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"The worst form of victim blaming is done in courts by solicitors against victims of sexual attacks and abuse, in that environment it seems the norm to accuse the victim of leading the attacker on. As far as learning from the situation sometimes there is no lesson to be learned, just the person was in the wrong place at the wrong time, or the perpetrator took advantage of other people’s better nature.
We can all be danger aware but you can’t protect yourself from the unexpected x "
As a criminal solicitor I am afraid that you are just wrong. That sort of thing hasn't happened since about 1975.
There are two reasons for this. Firstly, a judge would stop it as being an irrelevant line of questioning. Secondly, it would be suicidal for a defendant to say something like. "I only assaulted her because she flirted with me". I can't think of a quicker way to a guilty verdict and a longer sentence.
There's many things wrong with the criminal justice system but it helps no one to perpetuate myths like that.
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved.
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond. "
However you implicitly do in the way you formulate your questions sometimes.
Plus if you don't state your opinion, you really aren't discussing, just sharing 'facts' found online or on some papers.
|
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"The worst form of victim blaming is done in courts by solicitors against victims of sexual attacks and abuse, in that environment it seems the norm to accuse the victim of leading the attacker on.
"
I struggle to see how that would be a good strategy in court? A lawyer is supposed to argue that the alledged crime didn't happen (assuming a not guilty plea). It wouldn't be an effective argument to say that the crime did happen but the victim deserved it.
"
As far as learning from the situation sometimes there is no lesson to be learned, just the person was in the wrong place at the wrong time, or the perpetrator took advantage of other people’s better nature.
We can all be danger aware but you can’t protect yourself from the unexpected x "
Sometimes there isn't a lesson for the reasons you say. Most of the time there are mitigation strategies that weren't employed. Criminals are mainly predators looking for an easy target, although some are just indiscriminate and not thinking right. |
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"The worst form of victim blaming is done in courts by solicitors against victims of sexual attacks and abuse, in that environment it seems the norm to accuse the victim of leading the attacker on.
I struggle to see how that would be a good strategy in court? A lawyer is supposed to argue that the alledged crime didn't happen (assuming a not guilty plea). It wouldn't be an effective argument to say that the crime did happen but the victim deserved it.
"
In the old days, it would be an argument about belief in consent. You were flirty with him, so he believed you consented to him sticking three fingers up you.
That argument might have run in 1975 when even an unreasonable belief in consent meant you were not guilty. However since 2003 the belief has to be a reasonable one and no one would now consider such a belief to be reasonable. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved.
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond.
However you implicitly do in the way you formulate your questions sometimes.
Plus if you don't state your opinion, you really aren't discussing, just sharing 'facts' found online or on some papers.
"
I always pose questions a certain way. Sometimes veering to one side and sometimes trying to word it with no bias.
Discussion happens in the body of the thread. |
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By *an_LexaCouple
over a year ago
Sunderland |
" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
It would but unfortunately the majority of people avoid conflict and will go along with the dominant narrative for an easy life. We don't have a constitution guaranteeing our rights the way Americans do so free speech is always in danger here. "
I think quite often the avoidance of a topic is because people are afraid to go out on a limb and give an opinion that might be different to their friends, part of their group or pack and alienate themselves in some way. If a member of their group says something then suddenly there is an influx of opinion. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved.
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond.
However you implicitly do in the way you formulate your questions sometimes.
Plus if you don't state your opinion, you really aren't discussing, just sharing 'facts' found online or on some papers.
I always pose questions a certain way. Sometimes veering to one side and sometimes trying to word it with no bias.
Discussion happens in the body of the thread. "
Discussion you rarely get invovled in to state your opinion.
To answer your thread then, what do you think ? You must have an opinion abt it ?
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved.
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond.
However you implicitly do in the way you formulate your questions sometimes.
Plus if you don't state your opinion, you really aren't discussing, just sharing 'facts' found online or on some papers.
I always pose questions a certain way. Sometimes veering to one side and sometimes trying to word it with no bias.
Discussion happens in the body of the thread.
Discussion you rarely get invovled in to state your opinion.
To answer your thread then, what do you think ? You must have an opinion abt it ?
"
I already said what I think:
"If such things as socials are suggested before a meet, they are 'good tips'.
If such things as socials are suggested after someone has been attacked on a meet, they are 'victim blaming'.
Sometimes people are accused of 'victim blaming' when they are actually trying to help. "
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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" I think there's somethings you just can't discuss anymore unless you're agreeing with popular opinion.
There's some subjects that are simply forum suicide! But then again that's the OP's fault for raising a subject worthy of debate and inciting others to think!
Sometimes feels like everything I say is forum suicide.
I think it would be crap if people always avoided discussing difficult questions.
Tbh you always start threads but never or rarely give your opinion first. You 'discussing' difficult questions without really getting involved.
If the OP states an opinion it changes how people respond.
However you implicitly do in the way you formulate your questions sometimes.
Plus if you don't state your opinion, you really aren't discussing, just sharing 'facts' found online or on some papers.
I always pose questions a certain way. Sometimes veering to one side and sometimes trying to word it with no bias.
Discussion happens in the body of the thread.
Discussion you rarely get invovled in to state your opinion.
To answer your thread then, what do you think ? You must have an opinion abt it ?
I already said what I think:
If such things as socials are suggested before a meet, they are 'good tips'.
If such things as socials are suggested after someone has been attacked on a meet, they are 'victim blaming'.
Sometimes people are accused of 'victim blaming' when they are actually trying to help. "
But do you think that someone who put oneself into a dangerous situation or potentially dangerous situation is a victim or not ? |
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"
But do you think that someone who put oneself into a dangerous situation or potentially dangerous situation is a victim or not ? "
I do. The law applies whether you are stood outside a police station or walking down a dark alley at 3am with your wallet on show and headphones in. It is morally and legally wrong for someone to take that wallet from you, so if they do that then it does make you a victim.
If that happened to a friend then then we might advise them to get a taxi home at 3am next time to reduce the chance of it happening again. But at no point are we saying they deserved it to happen to them. |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"
But do you think that someone who put oneself into a dangerous situation or potentially dangerous situation is a victim or not ?
I do. The law applies whether you are stood outside a police station or walking down a dark alley at 3am with your wallet on show and headphones in. It is morally and legally wrong for someone to take that wallet from you, so if they do that then it does make you a victim.
If that happened to a friend then then we might advise them to get a taxi home at 3am next time to reduce the chance of it happening again. But at no point are we saying they deserved it to happen to them. "
This. |
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I don't know if this will be classed as "victim blaming"
Harvey weinstein is now victim blaming according to the article i read yesterday.
"Apparently" one of his accusers had been emailing him for 4 years After the alleged sexual assault. Asking to meet up/ exchange contact details and organizing their schedules to meet up again.
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As Mo out of the Simpsons said. "it's all politics". Forty years ago an aspiring actress who had sex with a famous director would have been seen as a conniving slut. Now she would be seen as a victim of a power imbalance exploited by the director.
The interesting question is not which version of events is right, but what caused the change. My favourite theory would be that, with the feminisation of the workplace, women have got more economic power and that usually translates into political power. |
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"I don't know if this will be classed as "victim blaming"
Harvey weinstein is now victim blaming according to the article i read yesterday.
"Apparently" one of his accusers had been emailing him for 4 years After the alleged sexual assault. Asking to meet up/ exchange contact details and organizing their schedules to meet up again.
"
Depends what you accuse him of though. There's some subjects we can't discuss on the forum but if you assume he's 'only' guilty of abusing his power (which is still serious) then the email thing is relevant. |
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"As Mo out of the Simpsons said. "it's all politics". Forty years ago an aspiring actress who had sex with a famous director would have been seen as a conniving slut. Now she would be seen as a victim of a power imbalance exploited by the director.
The interesting question is not which version of events is right, but what caused the change. My favourite theory would be that, with the feminisation of the workplace, women have got more economic power and that usually translates into political power. "
I wouldn't deny that's a factor but I'd say it's less influential than numerous business scandals that were responded to with increased regulation and scrutiny on the role of a Director. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
We've all been given advice on how to do our best not to be mugged, assaulted etc. It's not victim blaming. It's useful advice.
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
"
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past. "
I know. I'm referring to how the victim might feel if the advice is levelled at them. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false. "
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO. |
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past.
I know. I'm referring to how the victim might feel if the advice is levelled at them."
I agree and I think there's a time and place to give advice in a way that's tactful too. But victim blaming is typically a term used by people in the media to shut down debate about advice or mitigation strategy and refocus the conversation on whatever agenda they are pushing. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting. "
I understand the point you're trying to make and a green violence isn't excusable but you fall into the trap of removing any responsibility of the choices and actions of the isolated fan or the motorway stroller.
We unfortunately live in a society which has been removing personal responsibility fromantic individuals for over a couple decades that we now have created a society that genuinely believes personal responsibility isn't something to be reconed with.
Were always looking for excuses to blame someone else or something else for our own choices and actions.
Our society would be such a different place if that one simple approach were to be changed and we all took responsibility for our actions.
|
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"I don't know if this will be classed as "victim blaming"
Harvey weinstein is now victim blaming according to the article i read yesterday.
"Apparently" one of his accusers had been emailing him for 4 years After the alleged sexual assault. Asking to meet up/ exchange contact details and organizing their schedules to meet up again.
Depends what you accuse him of though. There's some subjects we can't discuss on the forum but if you assume he's 'only' guilty of abusing his power (which is still serious) then the email thing is relevant. "
No as i stated, It was in reference to a sexual assult allegation by an actress.
Personally I think he has abused his power,But i also believe alot of actresses consented for a career.
But as it was an open secret in hollywood about "ensuring your place",
Alot of actresses who came forward must have knew/heard the rumours.
Similar to kevin spacey...its an open secret that those on that industry would hear. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO."
Much like SJWs who label anyone nazi/ racist for not believing in their ridiculous ideals. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO."
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past.
I know. I'm referring to how the victim might feel if the advice is levelled at them.
I agree and I think there's a time and place to give advice in a way that's tactful too. But victim blaming is typically a term used by people in the media to shut down debate about advice or mitigation strategy and refocus the conversation on whatever agenda they are pushing. "
I agree. I hate the term. I'm all for taking personal responsibility for my own safety. Others are free to do the same or not. |
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past.
I know. I'm referring to how the victim might feel if the advice is levelled at them.
I agree and I think there's a time and place to give advice in a way that's tactful too. But victim blaming is typically a term used by people in the media to shut down debate about advice or mitigation strategy and refocus the conversation on whatever agenda they are pushing.
I agree. I hate the term. I'm all for taking personal responsibility for my own safety. Others are free to do the same or not."
It's all about balance and I agree with everyone saying we've lost that. I'm never going to sympathise with the thief who says "but their wallet was hanging out their back pocket just waiting to be taken and they weren't paying attention". At the same time, I put my wallet in a different place when i go to central London compared to when i walk around a low risk place. |
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"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
I understand the point you're trying to make and a green violence isn't excusable but you fall into the trap of removing any responsibility of the choices and actions of the isolated fan or the motorway stroller.
We unfortunately live in a society which has been removing personal responsibility fromantic individuals for over a couple decades that we now have created a society that genuinely believes personal responsibility isn't something to be reconed with.
Were always looking for excuses to blame someone else or something else for our own choices and actions.
Our society would be such a different place if that one simple approach were to be changed and we all took responsibility for our actions.
"
Exactly. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it. "
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think people get defensive when advice is given after the fact when it is of no use to the victim.
When most of us hear a crime story, we think "oh shit, how can we reduce the risk of that happening again". We're fully away it won't change the past.
I know. I'm referring to how the victim might feel if the advice is levelled at them.
I agree and I think there's a time and place to give advice in a way that's tactful too. But victim blaming is typically a term used by people in the media to shut down debate about advice or mitigation strategy and refocus the conversation on whatever agenda they are pushing.
I agree. I hate the term. I'm all for taking personal responsibility for my own safety. Others are free to do the same or not.
It's all about balance and I agree with everyone saying we've lost that. I'm never going to sympathise with the thief who says "but their wallet was hanging out their back pocket just waiting to be taken and they weren't paying attention". At the same time, I put my wallet in a different place when i go to central London compared to when i walk around a low risk place. "
That's exactly what I mean about taking responsibility for my safety. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally."
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally.
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame. "
Ooh now that's a good scenario. Personally i think this is the kind of social regulation of behaviour that CCTV has destroyed, with many unintended consequences. Team America said it best with their dicks, pussies and asshole analogy. These days, dicks are allowed to fuck assholes. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally.
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame. "
Interesting scenario. I wouldn't say you were to blame. Maybe that you could have foreseen that it could be an outcome if you got caught. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally.
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame.
Interesting scenario. I wouldn't say you were to blame. Maybe that you could have foreseen that it could be an outcome if you got caught."
My point is not about any particular scenario. It's about the fact that. "blame" is a socially defined concept which is continually changing. |
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally.
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame.
Ooh now that's a good scenario. Personally i think this is the kind of social regulation of behaviour that CCTV has destroyed, with many unintended consequences. Team America said it best with their dicks, pussies and asshole analogy. These days, dicks are allowed to fuck assholes. "
And in the end...Everyone ends up covered in Shit... |
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Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim? |
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?"
No they just eat others cubs.... |
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By *an_LexaCouple
over a year ago
Sunderland |
The problems comes as I said at the beginning of the thread this morning. Each case is always going to be different. And as a bystander you’re very unlikely to get the whole truth of both sides. You can have an opinion but as far as blame, who really has the right to apportion that? |
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By *ooskiMan
over a year ago
south coast |
I'm thinking isn't the lion the victim as the arm could have tasted like sxxt and had a bad tummy for weeks after, this meant his enclose was shut down and then the keeper lost viewing numbers...which in turn cost jobs at the park....
Where does it stop just because they hypothetically trespassed |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?"
so by having a cam on their head, a motorist is compelled to break the law if they see one?
Look, if someone suffers in any way shape or form then I'm sorry.
But we all need to act responsibly and realise there's consequences to all actions.
Of course that doesn't include dressing provocatively, or simply being in a place where you should reasonably expect to be and such examples. But I'm sure we all have examples where our patience towards a victim is slightly more strained than normal?
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
|
"The lion isn't really a good comparison. Normally when people talk about victim blaming they're making the point that another person chose to assault/rob/whatever them, so the blame should be on them. A wild animal with no sense of morals doesn't really fit into that.
I agree. The clear parallel of the example is with violent or sexual assault. I think it’s dangerous to use the lion in the analogy. It implies that acting on animal instrincts removes moral culpability.
Fair point.
Other examples would be someone walking onto a motorway and getting run over. Or a football fan sitting in the stands with the opposing team but cheering on his own team then getting beaten up.
Was what happened to them in any way their fault?
Violence is inexcusable in any case. You shouldn’t be beaten up for sitting somewhere and cheering for your team. For some reason it’s normal in a football setting and it’s disgusting.
I understand the point you're trying to make and a green violence isn't excusable but you fall into the trap of removing any responsibility of the choices and actions of the isolated fan or the motorway stroller.
We unfortunately live in a society which has been removing personal responsibility fromantic individuals for over a couple decades that we now have created a society that genuinely believes personal responsibility isn't something to be reconed with.
Were always looking for excuses to blame someone else or something else for our own choices and actions.
Our society would be such a different place if that one simple approach were to be changed and we all took responsibility for our actions.
"
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?"
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere. |
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere."
#bemorelion |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere.
#bemorelion "
You do realise this will encourage more "I can eat pussy for hours" messages? You need to be more responsible! |
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere.
#bemorelion
You do realise this will encourage more "I can eat pussy for hours" messages? You need to be more responsible! "
They won't get in our collective knickers. Self deprecating humour wins the day with us. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere.
#bemorelion
You do realise this will encourage more "I can eat pussy for hours" messages? You need to be more responsible! "
If so little do they know that women get bored of gaving their pussy eaten for more than 5 mins at a time... only reason to do it longer is one doesn't know when to stop and change approach  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
A lion doesn't eat it's own cubs not out of any form of morality but out of survival... he'll eat another's cubs so only his genetics continue. No morals involved anywhere.
#bemorelion
You do realise this will encourage more "I can eat pussy for hours" messages? You need to be more responsible!
If so little do they know that women get bored of gaving their pussy eaten for more than 5 mins at a time... only reason to do it longer is one doesn't know when to stop and change approach "
Not this woman!  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Someone mentioned a lion having no morals but a lion does not eat its own cubs so they have a sense of right or wrong
And what about the cyclists with cams on their heads deliberately provoking other road users and then playing the victim?
so by having a cam on their head, a motorist is compelled to break the law if they see one?
Look, if someone suffers in any way shape or form then I'm sorry.
But we all need to act responsibly and realise there's consequences to all actions.
Of course that doesn't include dressing provocatively, or simply being in a place where you should reasonably expect to be and such examples. But I'm sure we all have examples where our patience towards a victim is slightly more strained than normal?
"
Absolutely agree.
I’ve seen it on social media online “stop victim blaming” when someone is simply trying to get more information on the story mentioned or asking what else has happened so they can understand.
Some people are so quick to jump down people’s throats these days & a lot of people tend to take the “let’s get offended over nothing” approach these days. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"I think the important thing is that they are still a victim. They may have been foolish or naive but they still lost an arm. "
DING DING DING, people who attack "victim blaming" usually aren't arguing for viable and reasonable change in good faith but lauding their own righteousness over someone imo. |
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I keep wondering about the lion thing. If two men jumped into the lion enclosure and one was naked and wore a really strong set of medieval armour. Then the naked guy gets eaten would that be victim blaming? If they both wore armour then they could both escape. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Victim blaming is a bullshit term invented to shut down sensible discussion. It's usually projected by people that are angry the world isn't the way they think it should be.
The idea that the victim of a crime is always 0% to blame and the aggressor is always 100% to blame is patently false.
I agree, I think the pendulum has swung too far, we all need to take responsibility for our safety IMO.
It's important not to confuse causation with blame. Someone who commits a crime is always completely to blame, otherwise it wouldn't be a crime.
Notwithstanding that, it is often the case that something in the victims behaviour was a causative factor in them being a victim. I might look at some psycho in a funny way and that may be a causative factor in him beating the shit out of me. In one sense I have caused the crime, but you wouldn't say I am to blame for it.
But if you goaded the psycho, IMO you would be partly to blame, yes, morally, if not legally.
It all depends on what are the governing social standards in any particular situation. Some people would think that if I look a man's girlfriend up and down I am to blame if he gives me a slap. Others might consider him totally to blame.
Interesting scenario. I wouldn't say you were to blame. Maybe that you could have foreseen that it could be an outcome if you got caught.
My point is not about any particular scenario. It's about the fact that. "blame" is a socially defined concept which is continually changing. "
Fair enough |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Person 1: That egg box ripped a vertebrae out of my spine as it hurtled to earth from the back of a poorly designed primary school experiment that involved strapping an old lady's shopping to a drone and seeing how high it could fly before it disintegrated
Person 2: Well it's your own fault for wearing high heels and strapping two magnetised egg-attracting chickens to your boxing gloves
Person 1: That's victim blaming!
Person 2: You bet it is! Now stop talking and carry on trying to crack this safe before the police arrive
Something like that? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Person 1: That egg box ripped a vertebrae out of my spine as it hurtled to earth from the back of a poorly designed primary school experiment that involved strapping an old lady's shopping to a drone and seeing how high it could fly before it disintegrated
Person 2: Well it's your own fault for wearing high heels and strapping two magnetised egg-attracting chickens to your boxing gloves
Person 1: That's victim blaming!
Person 2: You bet it is! Now stop talking and carry on trying to crack this safe before the police arrive
Something like that? "
I'll have some of whatever you're drinking.
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