FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > That Apparently Interminable ‘Game’
That Apparently Interminable ‘Game’
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"It’s fun and you get to interact with others you may not do normally " Saying, “it’s fun,” doesn’t explain what’s fun about it. And it barely qualifies as interaction. There are other, far more interesting and constructive ways to do the latter. | |||
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"It's harmless and gets the grey cells working.... "Really? | |||
"It’s fun and you get to interact with others you may not do normally Saying, “it’s fun,” doesn’t explain what’s fun about it. And it barely qualifies as interaction. There are other, far more interesting and constructive ways to do the latter." Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? | |||
"you used your brain. " Okaaay. | |||
"It's harmless and gets the grey cells working....
Really?"... rallys...  | |||
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"It's harmless and gets the grey cells working....
Really?... rallys... " | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? " No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player. | |||
"It's harmless and gets the grey cells working....
Really?... rallys... " | |||
"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." Psst! Apparently, some women are turned on by intelligent men. If only there was some way to display this attribute. Assuming one has it of course...   | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player." Clearly people do enjoy it though  | |||
" Psst! Apparently, some women are turned on by intelligent men. If only there was some way to display this attribute." I’m not entirely sure how participating in a game as intellectually challenging as breathing quite qualifies for that. | |||
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"You say you enjoy Scrabble, but you can see any pleasure or point in what is essentially a totally stripped-down 5-second version of it? Is it that it's a game with no winners or losers that leaves you non-plussed? " *can't see | |||
"You say you enjoy Scrabble, but you can see any pleasure or point in what is essentially a totally stripped-down 5-second version of it? Is it that it's a game with no winners or losers that leaves you non-plussed? " No, I play lots of games with no winners or losers. But they tend to involve a degree of challenge. There is no challenge to this game. | |||
"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." It keeps my teeny, tiny, brain cell ticking over and I've made friends with some formites, who I would normally think would be way out of our league! Mrs x | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player." As I see it, the game involves rearranging letters in a word to create a new word, whilst changing one letter. Obviously it's not exactly quantum physics but it does present a minor intellectual challenge. So I am afraid I can't see your point. | |||
"You say you enjoy Scrabble, but you can see any pleasure or point in what is essentially a totally stripped-down 5-second version of it? Is it that it's a game with no winners or losers that leaves you non-plussed? No, I play lots of games with no winners or losers. But they tend to involve a degree of challenge. There is no challenge to this game." There is no challenge to you. The people who play may find it challenging. I don't play noughts and crosses Cos there is no challenge. It doesn't mean others don't enjoy it. | |||
"You say you enjoy Scrabble, but you can see any pleasure or point in what is essentially a totally stripped-down 5-second version of it? Is it that it's a game with no winners or losers that leaves you non-plussed? No, I play lots of games with no winners or losers. But they tend to involve a degree of challenge. There is no challenge to this game." Aha, I see. You wouldn't enjoy it because it's a bit of fun which you consider to be beneath your intellect. Hey ho | |||
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"I assume all those types of threads are mainly to make friends. The content is irrelevant, it's just a kind of team building fun thing. Joining in and being part of a group. "Bingo! | |||
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"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." AVOID | |||
"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong. AVOID " | |||
"Oh look . Another I want to cause an argument and belittle everybody else thread . I've played the game. It's fun . Leave it alone. The End ." No, I think he’s got a point this time, they’re dull as shit those threads. | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player." Much like fab. Fuck. | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player. Much like fab. Fuck. " You’ve had no enjoyment from Fab ? | |||
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"*nibbles her popcorn*" *pulls up a chair* | |||
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"Like any thread on here they appeal to some and not to others - they may or may not have a point - live and let live and all that "Most threads could start out with that point. But then that might detract from the fun somewhat. *offers popcorn around* | |||
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"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." All games, like life, are ultimately pointless. Sit down, shut up and enjoy the ride. | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player." The game is only as challenging as the participants can make it. Scrabble can be played with a five year old but he won't present a challenge to an adult. Your idea of fun, is not universal. Fun cannot be taught via a book. Its personal. | |||
"...but to post a thread essentially looking down on those playing it because you don't think it's changing enough just makes you look bad..." It’s not a thread to look down on those playing it. I’ve often found myself playing video games which are full of the ‘busywork’ I described above. Sometimes you don’t even realise. Your brain says you’re playing a game, ergo having fun, but when you stop and actually analyse if there’s anything fun about what you’re doing, if there’s any rewarding feedback loop, it’s entirely absent. I see little difference between this game, and the threads where the OP just reads, “175.” And I don’t see any eveidence of the interaction that people are claiming. There’s no communication, just a list of words. | |||
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"...but to post a thread essentially looking down on those playing it because you don't think it's changing enough just makes you look bad... It’s not a thread to look down on those playing it. I’ve often found myself playing video games which are full of the ‘busywork’ I described above. Sometimes you don’t even realise. Your brain says you’re playing a game, ergo having fun, but when you stop and actually analyse if there’s anything fun about what you’re doing, if there’s any rewarding feedback loop, it’s entirely absent. I see little difference between this game, and the threads where the OP just reads, “175.” And I don’t see any eveidence of the interaction that people are claiming. There’s no communication, just a list of words." Don't you think you might be over analysing this it's just a game after all | |||
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"I assume all those types of threads are mainly to make friends. The content is irrelevant, it's just a kind of team building fun thing. Joining in and being part of a group.
Bingo! "What do I win? | |||
"Have you tried playing Mornington Crescent? Anyone for a game? French Canadian rules, no squatting, sliding or use of the Reverse Inkerman Kick."
Jack Dee makes a great host | |||
"...but to post a thread essentially looking down on those playing it because you don't think it's changing enough just makes you look bad... It’s not a thread to look down on those playing it. I’ve often found myself playing video games which are full of the ‘busywork’ I described above. Sometimes you don’t even realise. Your brain says you’re playing a game, ergo having fun, but when you stop and actually analyse if there’s anything fun about what you’re doing, if there’s any rewarding feedback loop, it’s entirely absent. I see little difference between this game, and the threads where the OP just reads, “175.” And I don’t see any eveidence of the interaction that people are claiming. There’s no communication, just a list of words." Pffft. I said "Morning all" this morning | |||
"...but to post a thread essentially looking down on those playing it because you don't think it's changing enough just makes you look bad... It’s not a thread to look down on those playing it. I’ve often found myself playing video games which are full of the ‘busywork’ I described above. Sometimes you don’t even realise. Your brain says you’re playing a game, ergo having fun, but when you stop and actually analyse if there’s anything fun about what you’re doing, if there’s any rewarding feedback loop, it’s entirely absent. I see little difference between this game, and the threads where the OP just reads, “175.” And I don’t see any eveidence of the interaction that people are claiming. There’s no communication, just a list of words.Don't you think you might be over analysing this it's just a game after all "I bet he's a riot on dates | |||
It's a game! You play or you don't. No likey, no lighty.
Rounders anyone? Last time we played Ace ran off with the ball though  | |||
"Have you tried playing Mornington Crescent?" I started a Mornington Crescent thread a few weeks ago. | |||
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"Have you tried playing Mornington Crescent? I started a Mornington Crescent thread a few weeks ago." Isn't Mornington Crescent even less challenging and more thoroughly pointless than a daft word game? | |||
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"Isn't Mornington Crescent even less challenging and more thoroughly pointless than a daft word game?" Not if it’s played properly, no. | |||
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"It's harmless and gets the grey cells working.... "And it's something to do when you're bored | |||
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"Me too "I'm going back for another go race you | |||
"Despite some comments here, just because I don’t see the entertainment in one game, it does not mean that I’m boring in real life. It means I like other things. I have no need to lighten up. I haven’t gone into the thread and disrupted it. ‘If you don’t like it, don’t participate,’ has been the tone of a few responses. Well, the same could be said about this thread. If you don’t like the subject, you don’t have to participate in the discussion." There you go, you nailed it. You like other things. The people taking part in those threads like other things. Simple | |||
"...but to post a thread essentially looking down on those playing it because you don't think it's changing enough just makes you look bad... It’s not a thread to look down on those playing it. I’ve often found myself playing video games which are full of the ‘busywork’ I described above. Sometimes you don’t even realise. Your brain says you’re playing a game, ergo having fun, but when you stop and actually analyse if there’s anything fun about what you’re doing, if there’s any rewarding feedback loop, it’s entirely absent. I see little difference between this game, and the threads where the OP just reads, “175.” And I don’t see any eveidence of the interaction that people are claiming. There’s no communication, just a list of words." Apart from the PMs that eminate from it of course. | |||
"You do need to lighten up. Why start a thread about not getting the point of another thread? " Why not? It’s a discussion forum, it was something I wanted to discuss. And, since you have no idea what my current mood is, you’re in no place to tell me to lighten up. Thanks for your input. | |||
"There you go, you nailed it. You like other things. The people taking part in those threads like other things. Simple "I’m well aware that people like other things. I never said otherwise. | |||
"You do need to lighten up. Why start a thread about not getting the point of another thread? Why not? It’s a discussion forum, it was something I wanted to discuss. And, since you have no idea what my current mood is, you’re in no place to tell me to lighten up. Thanks for your input." Your welcome. | |||
"Despite some comments here, just because I don’t see the entertainment in one game, it does not mean that I’m boring in real life. It means I like other things. I have no need to lighten up. I haven’t gone into the thread and disrupted it. ‘If you don’t like it, don’t participate,’ has been the tone of a few responses. Well, the same could be said about this thread. If you don’t like the subject, you don’t have to participate in the discussion." That was just a jest about dates. Only teasing sorry. I do like the subject of this thread, and will probably continue to participate in the discussion for as long as it goes on. I consider myself educated and intelligent, but I can still enjoy a silly game that has no point and little challenge just for the hell of it. Debating why I can while others can't is fun in itself and it's a good laugh doing so. "Not if it’s played properly, no." I thought the whole point of MC is that there is absolutely no proper way to play it. Hence the running gag about MC rules. Unless by "properly" you mean that you hoped to recreate in a thread the hilarity of assorted talented comedians on a well-established comedy show. I shall find your thread and see how it worked out | |||
"There you go, you nailed it. You like other things. The people taking part in those threads like other things. Simple
I’m well aware that people like other things. I never said otherwise."Well you kinda did. You don’t find something fun, so you don’t understand why someone else should. | |||
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"Well you kinda did. You don’t find something fun, so you don’t understand why someone else should. " Incorrect. There are plenty of things I don’t like, but I can see where others find the enjoyment. | |||
"You don't find that much fun, so you aren't wrong. " You don’t have even the first idea about what I do and don’t find fun, so you can keep comments like that to yourself. | |||
"Unless by "properly" you mean that you hoped to recreate in a thread the hilarity of assorted talented comedians on a well-established comedy show." No, I didn’t anticipate that it would be as funny as professional comedians. I did, nevertheless, hope to attract some funny responses. It was a mixed success. | |||
"Well you kinda did. You don’t find something fun, so you don’t understand why someone else should. Incorrect. There are plenty of things I don’t like, but I can see where others find the enjoyment." But you don’t have to see where they find the enjoyment. It’s also funny to me that you have a pop at another poster for making a comment about what you find fun, yet your entire thread is doing exactly that | |||
"But you don’t have to see where they find the enjoyment." There are lots of things in life we don’t have to understand. That makes them all the more worth discussing. "It’s also funny to me that you have a pop at another poster for making a comment about what you find fun, yet your entire thread is doing exactly that "You’re not very good at this, are you? No, I have objected to people saying that I’m no fun, or that there is very little that I find fun. That’s a very different thing indeed. | |||
"But you don’t have to see where they find the enjoyment. There are lots of things in life we don’t have to understand. That makes them all the more worth discussing. It’s also funny to me that you have a pop at another poster for making a comment about what you find fun, yet your entire thread is doing exactly that
You’re not very good at this, are you? No, I have objected to people saying that I’m no fun, or that there is very little that I find fun. That’s a very different thing indeed."No, the poster didn’t say you’re no fun, they said you don’t find many things fun. Read it again | |||
"No, the poster didn’t say you’re no fun, they said you don’t find many things fun. Read it again "It makes not a jot of difference. It still does not equate to this thread, which is what you were trying to do. It’s also only one of several threads having a pop at whether or not I’m fun. | |||
"No, the poster didn’t say you’re no fun, they said you don’t find many things fun. Read it again
It makes not a jot of difference. It still does not equate to this thread, which is what you were trying to do. It’s also only one of several threads having a pop at whether or not I’m fun."Ahhh I haven’t seen those.... but you really are fun! | |||
"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." .... I think your wrong because it was an easy way for me to dip my toe into this forum and have since posted on other threads and interacted with folk that I might not have ... so its not completely pointless... plus as I said earlier it's harmless fun so it also has an objective yes.? | |||
"It’s also only one of several threads having a pop at whether or not I’m fun. Ahhh I haven’t seen those.... but you really are fun! "My mistake, sorry, that should say posts, not threads. . "...plus as I said earlier it's harmless fun so it also has an objective yes.? "At the risk of repeating myself, just saying that something is harmless fun does not explain what is fun about it. | |||
"Unless by "properly" you mean that you hoped to recreate in a thread the hilarity of assorted talented comedians on a well-established comedy show. No, I didn’t anticipate that it would be as funny as professional comedians. I did, nevertheless, hope to attract some funny responses. It was a mixed success." I couldn't find it using your green arrow. I seem to recall seeing it briefly. I'd imagine it wouldn't work easily in a forum. The reason it works so well on ISIHAC I think is not about the professional comedians but the dynamics of the panel, the spontaneity, the input of the host and the general atmosphere of the show. All things very difficult to recreate in a text-based thread. | |||
"It’s also only one of several threads having a pop at whether or not I’m fun. Ahhh I haven’t seen those.... but you really are fun!
My mistake, sorry, that should say posts, not threads.
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...plus as I said earlier it's harmless fun so it also has an objective yes.?
At the risk of repeating myself, just saying that something is harmless fun does not explain what is fun about it.".. I assume that as you only quoted on half my post that you concede it's not pointless... | |||
"I assume that as you only quoted on half my post that you concede it's not pointless... "You assume incorrectly. | |||
"Right, I fully appreciate that this will not aid the impression that some of you have that I’m no fun, but... Can anyone explain to me the fun to be had in that ‘change one letter’ game that is now onto its twelfth thread? Don’t get me wrong, I love a word game. Boggle, Scrabble, Countdown, Words With Friends, even Hangman... but what they all have in common, what makes them fun, is that they have an objective. The ‘change one letter’ game seems devoid of any objective; completely pointless. Please tell me why I’m wrong." I’ve played it on occasion when filling in time and there doesn’t appear to be many other threads on the go (late at night par example). For me it’s been more of a distraction that led me to it. I have however had enjoyment in racing a friend to post answers - that was fun. And I’d concur with what Sammi has already posted that I can imagine it’s a very easy first dip into posting in the forum as it’s not overly challenging, it usually gets a next response quickly so you can post again - so perhaps the fun for some people is gained in that - it’s easily fast moving pace allowing multiple goes on the thread without potentially attracting a negative snipe or critique of spamming or having the wrong answer. I find them gentle, harmless fun in terms of being involved in something rather than nothing. | |||
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"You’ve made the most potentially convincing argument so far, Estella, I’ll give you that. I’m still not buying it, though." Would you care to clarify further as to why? Just so I understand more fully. | |||
"You’ve made the most potentially convincing argument so far, Estella, I’ll give you that. I’m still not buying it, though." So why do YOU think it's on its thirteenth thread and still going strong? I mean if it's unchallenging and no fun, then what would your explanation be? | |||
"Is your point that a game cannot be fun if it doesn't have a pre determined end point where a winner will be decided? No. There are games that can be fun in the playing, but they tend to either be challenging, or the act of playing has a rewarding feedback loop. As far as I can see, the change one letter game offers neither of those. It is what would be described in game design theory as ‘busywork’. Yes, it takes time to perform functions that offer no challenge whatsoever, but with little or no tangible enjoyment for the player." Why are you judging what other people find fun by your own metrics? 
I enjoy the change a letter game as it's just a gentle mental masturbation. It's calming. I enjoy reading through the thread to see how it has evolved. That's my fun at that time.
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"Oh look . Another I want to cause an argument and belittle everybody else thread . I've played the game. It's fun . Leave it alone. The End ." I don’t agree. | |||
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"Would you care to clarify further as to why? Just so I understand more fully." Well, you pointed out that it started as a distraction. And it doesn’t really progress from there. Telling me that you do something because there was nothing else to do does little to convince me that the activity is gripping; it’s just better than nothing. Picking your nose is better than nothing. . "So why do YOU think it's on its thirteenth thread and still going strong?" If I knew the answer to that, I wouldn’t have posted the thread. "I mean if it's unchallenging and no fun, then what would your explanation be? " As I said before, people have a remarkable capacity for busywork. Games like FarmVille made a killing on that; you don’t have to give people something fun to do, you just have to give them rudimentary tasks, and ‘reward’ them with cynically designed sounds and pictures that give them a manipulated endorphin hit. The change-one-letter game doesn’t even have that, but once people are tuned into busywork, they require less reward to keep going. That’s my best guess. . "Why are you judging what other people find fun by your own metrics?" In what sense? I’ve already said, there are plenty of things I don’t like, but which I can see and understand why others like them. That’s not what’s going on here. If your issue is with my comparison to (or use of the phrase) busywork, then you’re barking up the wrong tree. This isn’t something I’ve made up, and you’ll need to take on those engaged in game design theory. . "Why dont you post in there and turn your avatar upside down to show your disdain? " Because, contrary to popular opinion, I’m not a dick. It would serve no purpose to disrupt that thread. By creating this thread, those participating in the game can crack on, and ignore this discussion if they wish. | |||
"Would you care to clarify further as to why? Just so I understand more fully. Well, you pointed out that it started as a distraction. And it doesn’t really progress from there. Telling me that you do something because there was nothing else to do does little to convince me that the activity is gripping; it’s just better than nothing. Picking your nose is better than nothing. " No, you see you’ve extrapolated upon my point to reach your own conclusion. I did say it was distraction that led me to it, yes. But that doesn’t then have to follow that it didn’t progress from there, in fact I actually said it did and explained the fun I had on it competing to post faster than my friend, which you’ve omitted, and is relevant to that thread in particular. I’d also suggest on further reflection that, whether the participant is new to the forum or longstanding member that there’s fun to be had in a faster paced thread that you can easily be involved in (not controversial nor overly challenging) and post multiple times on without issue, as way of being linked into a group activity without the demands of discursive interaction or having to have specialist knowledge (or bluster as such), or huge focus on your post - the fellowship (at any level) is fun and totally different to say picking your nose as your surmise. So fun in terms of being involved in something unpressured and widely inclusive with others. | |||
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"No, you see you’ve extrapolated upon my point to reach your own conclusion." Not my extrapolation; your post began, repeated, and explicitly ended by saying that it was better than nothing. That’s damning with faint praise, if ever I heard it. I’ll concede the point that it’s potentially an easy way for poor souls to get over the terrifying prospect of typing in a box. One of the problems of the incredibly rudimentary nature of this forum is sustaining an obvious ‘welcome’ thread for people to post in. Although, a few forumites do a good job of starting threads encouraging others to post. Those threads are better suited to actually getting people engaging in the forum, and properly interacting with others. Far more so than a list of 176 words. That also doesn’t go any way to explaining what’s fun about it. ‘Easy to new people to post in’ and ‘better than nothing’ are not exactly ringing endorsements of something’s entertainment value. | |||
"No, you see you’ve extrapolated upon my point to reach your own conclusion. Not my extrapolation; your post began, repeated, and explicitly ended by saying that it was better than nothing. That’s damning with faint praise, if ever I heard it. I’ll concede the point that it’s potentially an easy way for poor souls to get over the terrifying prospect of typing in a box. One of the problems of the incredibly rudimentary nature of this forum is sustaining an obvious ‘welcome’ thread for people to post in. Although, a few forumites do a good job of starting threads encouraging others to post. Those threads are better suited to actually getting people engaging in the forum, and properly interacting with others. Far more so than a list of 176 words. That also doesn’t go any way to explaining what’s fun about it. ‘Easy to new people to post in’ and ‘better than nothing’ are not exactly ringing endorsements of something’s entertainment value." I opened with distraction, and ended with involved in something, being better than nothing - I meant involved, as in with others, but concede I wasn’t clear. I didn’t repeat though. My middle in relation to me expressed what I found fun, in my first post. So I don’t think you’re wholly accurate here in your opening response, if we’re splitting hairs. You’re now moving goalposts for what you deem acceptable as a clarification of fun. If it’s entirely subjective to your view of what’s fun or not, then it’s all rather a moot discussion. You subjectively may find the welcome new people threads better for people’s first posts in the forum, other new people may disagree and want to join something less spotlight on them as being new. Hence may enjoy the game thread for those reasons. You’re subjectively deciding what’s better to get people interacting and engaged, and subjectively deciding what constitutes fun despite answers that clearly have provided a reason and clarified that fun was had. The thread may not be “the bestest funnest thing in the world” but that wasn’t your original question. Your question has been answered. You’re just in disagreement with those that have provided justification. You’ve even given justification of the fun through your own posts, “busywork” and being involved and engaged in something even if not wholly meaningful can constitute fun. Fun can be defined as lighthearted pleasure. | |||
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"I haven’t shifted any goalposts. I pointed out right near the very start that saying, “It is fun,” does not answer the question. " That’s not what I said though. I said people provided their reason and confirmed fun was had (due to the reason given), and that you are simply saying you don’t recognise their reason as fun - that’s making the whole point of a discussion moot. I gave an example of how I found that specific thread fun, you’ve chosen to say my explanation is not enough (for you) and that it was apparently not of a high enough fun level to be an acceptable answer (albeit ignoring both specific instances I cited why it was enjoyable - the competing with my friend and the fellowship aspect of being involved in something). " It’s muddying the waters to continue talking about whether other threads are better at introducing newbies. I discussed it because I concede that the ‘game’ is not without value if people use it that way. However, that value is limited, in comparison to other threads. Again, though, that is beside the point; there has been no explanation why a list of words, with no other interaction, is a ‘fun’ way to introduce new people. That value does not make it fun. " I didn’t say to introduce newbies in terms of “hi I’m a newbie”, so referenced this again to correct your understanding of my point. My point is about the involvement for newbies not their way of introducing themselves a la welcome thread hence I disagreed with your comments, I’m simply cleaning the waters you muddied. There has been, by me, a reason given as to why that thread could be fun/light hearted enjoyment for people to get involved in, I said for both new and old users of the forum - and explained why that thread rather than others - but you’ve ignored it. Read back. " It’s also evident that you’ve misunderstood the point about busywork. The point is that busywork is not fun, but regularly tricks people simply by keeping them busy. " Yes, I understand - but suggest that if it has tricked them (a la placebo) and they feel as if they’re having fun, why can’t this constitute fun? Maybe I’ll invent my own pseudo phrase for it - I’m just wondering whether when something is occupying someone and thus keeping them engaged and feeling like they’re having fun it simply therefore becomes fun as a result and requires no further deconstruct. But yes, I was twisting the meaning of the term because a lot of this thread is overly subjective and perhaps you should have set clearer parameters for what fun must be beyond have an objective, when objectives have been provided but you’re not accepting them. " Just like the studies on the games which utilise that addictive mechanic, I’d put money on the pleasure centres of the brain showing little to no activity for the majority of people the majority of time they participate in the thread. People are very good (or bad) at convincing themselves they had fun simply because they were doing something and time passed. And, to reiterate, I’m not saying this because I think I’m better than anyone. I play video games, and get caught out with it myself." You see, now you’re defining it more clearly - and yet there’s no way of proving or disproving on here right now, if their pleasure centres are showing activity so I guess if this is the standard that you wanted as proof, it’s a thread that has to end in stalemate. So, whilst I’m not advocating it as the thread I find most fun on here, OP - I do disagree that there is no explanation of how it can be an enjoyable thread and fun for others, but I do agree that there’s no way of answering you to the standard you seek without necessary scientific equipment, consent and some testing. | |||
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"[Removed by poster at 14/06/18 02:09:17]" People need to keep the mind active. You'd be surprised at how many people are on this site that live on the their own and spend hours waiting to interact with someone, anyone!!! The forum is a helpful way of passing that time and keeping the brain motoring | |||
"Did you read the thread?" I did, yes. Isn’t it about figuring out why something is fun? | |||
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"Any chance of keeping this going till the threads full? "Absolutely not. | |||
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"Of all the threads on here that's one you have an problem with? " | |||
"Any chance of keeping this going till the threads full?
Absolutely not. "Oh your no fun anymore! | |||
"[Added by poster at 14/06/18 19:32:44]" | |||
"Any chance of keeping this going till the threads full?
Absolutely not.
Oh your no fun anymore! "I’m holding out for a spaceman. | |||
"That’s not what I said though. I said people provided their reason and confirmed fun was had (due to the reason given), and that you are simply saying you don’t recognise their reason as fun - that’s making the whole point of a discussion moot." Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. "I gave an example of how I found that specific thread fun, you’ve chosen to say my explanation is not enough (for you) and that it was apparently not of a high enough fun level to be an acceptable answer (albeit ignoring both specific instances I cited why it was enjoyable - the competing with my friend and the fellowship aspect of being involved in something)." Well, it’s not enough for me (no need to put it in brackets) to accept it. Heightened busywork is still just busywork. As for the aspect of being involved, I still don’t accept that as fun, any more than I accept smokers citing the benefits of smoking. Just because something fills a void, it doesn’t give it additional value. "I didn’t say to introduce newbies in terms of “hi I’m a newbie”, so referenced this again to correct your understanding of my point. My point is about the involvement for newbies not their way of introducing themselves a la welcome thread hence I disagreed with your comments, I’m simply cleaning the waters you muddied." I fully understood that it is not welcoming new folk by having them introduce themselves. That’s what makes that (totally irrelevant to this thread) point of even less value. "There has been, by me, a reason given as to why that thread could be fun/light hearted enjoyment for people to get involved in, I said for both new and old users of the forum - and explained why that thread rather than others - but you’ve ignored it. Read back." I haven’t ignored it, I just don’t accept it. "Yes, I understand - but suggest that if it has tricked them (a la placebo) and they feel as if they’re having fun, why can’t this constitute fun?" Well, to use your own analogy, a placebo doesn’t constitute medicine. "Maybe I’ll invent my own pseudo phrase for it - I’m just wondering whether when something is occupying someone and thus keeping them engaged and feeling like they’re having fun it simply therefore becomes fun as a result and requires no further deconstruct." Because, when people are simply engaged in busywork, they don’t get the same physiological benefits as those who are genuinely having fun. The result is more often a feeling of time lost than time well spent. "But yes, I was twisting the meaning of the term because a lot of this thread is overly subjective and perhaps you should have set clearer parameters for what fun must be beyond have an objective, when objectives have been provided but you’re not accepting them." Well, I conceded that a final objective is not the only thing that makes a game fun. But I’m not sure why you seem so certain that I’m supposed to just accept any of the answers given if I don’t agree with them. "You see, now you’re defining it more clearly - and yet there’s no way of proving or disproving on here right now, if their pleasure centres are showing activity so I guess if this is the standard that you wanted as proof, it’s a thread that has to end in stalemate." Quite possibly but, then, it’s not a thread that I ever anticipated would conclude with all parties in agreement. "So, whilst I’m not advocating it as the thread I find most fun on here, OP - I do disagree that there is no explanation of how it can be an enjoyable thread and fun for others, but I do agree that there’s no way of answering you to the standard you seek without necessary scientific equipment, consent and some testing. "Oh, I don’t know. There is every possibility that someone will have cause to consider their participation and whether or not they’re actually having fun. Although, there’s next to no possibility that they’d come here to admit it. . "Let them crack on, not worth fretting about" I have, and I’m not. . "You'd be surprised at how many people are on this site that live on the their own and spend hours waiting to interact with someone, anyone!!!" I’m not so sure I would. . "I did, yes. Isn’t it about figuring out why something is fun? " Not in the manner your first post implied. . "Of all the threads on here that's one you have an problem with? "No, but it’s the one that I happened to want to discuss at that particular moment, and one that I thought best not to disrupt by posting in it. Your valuable contribution has been noted, however. | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. " But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? | |||
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"What would make say Boggle fun, in fuller detail than citing it has an objective, please? " If you had to change one of its letters | |||
"What would make say Boggle fun, in fuller detail than citing it has an objective, please? If you had to change one of its letters " | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? " Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off. | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off." And yet, I’ll prove you wrong with this; https://youtu.be/0zSWqJGTa-I *prods you with my forefinger in the middle of your forehead and cries “tuuuuuuuuuuuune!* | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off." Or anything by James Blunt | |||
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" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off. And yet, I’ll prove you wrong with this; https://youtu.be/0zSWqJGTa-I *prods you with my forefinger in the middle of your forehead and cries “tuuuuuuuuuuuune!* "You just broke my phone! | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off. And yet, I’ll prove you wrong with this; https://youtu.be/0zSWqJGTa-I *prods you with my forefinger in the middle of your forehead and cries “tuuuuuuuuuuuune!*
You just broke my phone! "Is that like Kim Kardashian’s butt “breaking the internet”....?! | |||
" Not really. I asked for people to tell me why I’m wrong. I haven’t seen any explanation that does that yet. That doesn’t make the discussion moot; i just means that I remain unconvinced. But the whole concept of something being fun or not, whether there's any point to it, is so subjective that your saying that the game thread is pointless can only ever be an opinion. How can a subjective opinion be proved wrong? Exactly. It may as we be argued that someone is objectively wrong to like a particular song. Which would be daft. Unless it was Simply Red or UB40. Then all bets are off. And yet, I’ll prove you wrong with this; https://youtu.be/0zSWqJGTa-I *prods you with my forefinger in the middle of your forehead and cries “tuuuuuuuuuuuune!*
You just broke my phone!
Is that like Kim Kardashian’s butt “breaking the internet”....?! "Haha! Exactly like that!
But I think we’ve proved the point that people can still find something enjoyable even if someone else doesn’t! | |||
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