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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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This is controversial.. they had to fit gender neutral toilets for a theoretical future child that may appear and require it. I’m a big supporter of personal choice and am liberal, but the cost of that toilet could have bought £10k worth of educational material for the rest of the school.
I quite like our gender differences, and am sensitive to those who feel they were born in the wrong gender and the lifelong battle they endure. However the greater good rule surely means the money would have been better spend divided to Educate all the children.
I’m in for forum lynching ain’t I ? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is controversial.. they had to fit gender neutral toilets for a theoretical future child that may appear and require it. I’m a big supporter of personal choice and am liberal, but the cost of that toilet could have bought £10k worth of educational material for the rest of the school.
I quite like our gender differences, and am sensitive to those who feel they were born in the wrong gender and the lifelong battle they endure. However the greater good rule surely means the money would have been better spend divided to Educate all the children.
I’m in for forum lynching ain’t I ? "
Nope, I’m a teacher too (Male half) and totally agree with you. |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"I’m in for forum lynching ain’t I ? "
No why should you be... unless you want one? ;o)
A few years ago people said this about disabled toilets... "Oh, how much is all this going to cost?!" Look where we are now - not perfect but a damn sight better...
Not school as such but Alzheimers Society recently said they like gender neutral toilets because if you are caring for your spouse (mostly opposite sex) with the condition, carers can accompany them to the loo as they can be confusing places if you have Alzheimers....
It is all about progress... |
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"Where or when did this happen?
I can’t reveal oneself, but a family member was the contractor building them in the East Midlands "
It would be less revealing to just say the place!
Is it a thing just now in schools or something? |
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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago
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"Nope, I’m a teacher too (Male half) and totally agree with you.
Oh dear... I'm glad I'm not your pupil... Such empathy eh?"
Yes but it’s got to be a balance of costs and what else that money could do. |
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"See to be honest. If all toilets are fitted with full cubicals and music playing. Can we nit just have one set of toilets!!!!! "
No chance, that means us guys would have to queue too. We want a big long trough, much more efficient like it is thanks  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"This is controversial.. they had to fit gender neutral toilets for a theoretical future child that may appear and require it. I’m a big supporter of personal choice and am liberal, but the cost of that toilet could have bought £10k worth of educational material for the rest of the school.
I quite like our gender differences, and am sensitive to those who feel they were born in the wrong gender and the lifelong battle they endure. However the greater good rule surely means the money would have been better spend divided to Educate all the children.
I’m in for forum lynching ain’t I ? "
Absolute mismanagement of funds, where does this PC shite end?  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Nope, I’m a teacher too (Male half) and totally agree with you.
Oh dear... I'm glad I'm not your pupil... Such empathy eh?"
I do have empathy, and to be fair I support children in this situation, however the question is the value of one gender neutral toilet, or a raft of teaching materials.
Would the toilet be used by just one person? Talk about making them feel special or singled out.
What about the pupils who then wanted to just use the said toilet because they thought it might be fun?
How would you quantify its use?
What if you never got such ‘future’ pupil? Then you have thousands of pounds doing nothing.
What about putting it to the salary of a professional who could work with said pupil to help them through any issues (like bullying etc) that they WILL encounter at school? |
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"Is it a thing just now in schools or something?
May I politely suggest you Google [Gender Neutral Toilets], I got banned for posting URL's by the mods here...lol"
I did, just some year old theoretical results. If it's in the news it can be linked. Or it is allowed to just say what it is! |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"Yes but it’s got to be a balance of costs and what else that money could do. "
I don't know much about school financing but I would wager that there is a separate budget for building works and one for buying books...? At times, when buildings need renovating, or expansion, new, higher standards of design should not be ignored.
The world is changing mate, and our built environment should reflect that... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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Not enough information to give a definite response to this.
If we’re talking a fancy, private fee-paying school, then 10k could be a relatively small amount. There might already be ample funding for educational resources for the wider school.
And when you say a ‘gender neutral toilet’ do you mean a single cubicle for use only by pupils who are transitioning or don’t particularly identify as one gender or another? Or is it more of a programme of refurbishment to combine existing ‘girls’ and ‘boys’ toilets into one big gender neutral facility? The former would seem counter productive to me, further singling out pupils who might already be in a difficult situation, in which case, regardless of cost it seems like a poor decision. |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"Would the toilet be used by just one person? Talk about making them feel special or singled out.
What about putting it to the salary of a professional who could work with said pupil to help them through any issues (like bullying etc) that they WILL encounter at school?"
You make a couple of good points.
The toilets would be one location, with cubicles that go all the way from floor to ceiling. So no urinals for the boys and long queues for the girls...! LOL!
The hand washing areas will be open and shared and schools that have introduced them have said they've made children more responsible - so no bullying by shoving wee Jimmy's head down the loo by his mates...
Gender diversity is not unique to the UK - trans and non-binary can be found in every culture worldwide - it is only recently (maybe through power of internet and social media) that this has gained traction.
So progressive schools have made a multi-pronged approach to make schools a good place for learning for everyone, including gender variant kids. |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"Not enough information to give a definite response to this.
If we’re talking a fancy, private fee-paying school, then 10k could be a relatively small amount. There might already be ample funding for educational resources for the wider school.
And when you say a ‘gender neutral toilet’ do you mean a single cubicle for use only by pupils who are transitioning or don’t particularly identify as one gender or another? Or is it more of a programme of refurbishment to combine existing ‘girls’ and ‘boys’ toilets into one big gender neutral facility? The former would seem counter productive to me, further singling out pupils who might already be in a difficult situation, in which case, regardless of cost it seems like a poor decision. "
Again I don't want to be banned for posting URLs but if you Google [Derek Hooper TransEqual], he and I developed a module for Schools and Colleges on how to tackle pupils who are presenting as Gender Variant. There are videos there where these pupils have said what hell school is for them. |
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"Not enough information to give a definite response to this.
If we’re talking a fancy, private fee-paying school, then 10k could be a relatively small amount. There might already be ample funding for educational resources for the wider school.
And when you say a ‘gender neutral toilet’ do you mean a single cubicle for use only by pupils who are transitioning or don’t particularly identify as one gender or another? Or is it more of a programme of refurbishment to combine existing ‘girls’ and ‘boys’ toilets into one big gender neutral facility? The former would seem counter productive to me, further singling out pupils who might already be in a difficult situation, in which case, regardless of cost it seems like a poor decision.
Again I don't want to be banned for posting URLs but if you Google [Derek Hooper TransEqual], he and I developed a module for Schools and Colleges on how to tackle pupils who are presenting as Gender Variant. There are videos there where these pupils have said what hell school is for them."
The thread is about somewhere spending £10k on gender neutral toilets.
All I'm asking is, has this actually happened, or is it just theoretical or fake news?? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"Not enough information to give a definite response to this.
If we’re talking a fancy, private fee-paying school, then 10k could be a relatively small amount. There might already be ample funding for educational resources for the wider school.
And when you say a ‘gender neutral toilet’ do you mean a single cubicle for use only by pupils who are transitioning or don’t particularly identify as one gender or another? Or is it more of a programme of refurbishment to combine existing ‘girls’ and ‘boys’ toilets into one big gender neutral facility? The former would seem counter productive to me, further singling out pupils who might already be in a difficult situation, in which case, regardless of cost it seems like a poor decision.
Again I don't want to be banned for posting URLs but if you Google [Derek Hooper TransEqual], he and I developed a module for Schools and Colleges on how to tackle pupils who are presenting as Gender Variant. There are videos there where these pupils have said what hell school is for them."
.
As the OP said ‘they had to fit...’ I assumed this was something being implemented by a specific school. I was saying that I didn’t have enough info on the nature of that school and how they planned to implement the new toilet arrangements. I’m not against gender neutral toilets by any means, but if not done appropriately, could it not do more harm than good. So I was just enquiring this particular school was going about it.
Having looked at the Derek you mentioned, he seems to be an independent consultant, so whilst his suggestions mignt be great, it wouldnt appear to be a national policy on how schools will go about this. |
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All. Toilets are gender neutral. All they had to do was change the sign on the door!
Years ago I worked somewhere where a guy bravely came out as trans. We didn't have to fit gender neutral toilets, although we did have single cubicle toilets that she could use. That was until she got locked in the area they were in one night.
Some of the older generation complained about her using the female toilets so for a while she used the disabled one. At no point did the company have to spend money on gender neutral toilets. |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"Some of the older generation complained about her using the female toilets so for a while she used the disabled one. At no point did the company have to spend money on gender neutral toilets."
As I was under-going treatment under the care of my GP and GIC (Gender Identity Clinic), I had to live as a woman for a year (to prove that I can hack it) before they would start hormone treatment.
It was a terrifying year because I did not want to be accused of being a sex predator in the ladies loo (when actually I'm attracted to men anyway).
So until I got my Drivers Licence changed to female, I would never use ladies loo. So make sure I pee on train loo (gender neutral) before arriving at stations (separate). The Drivers Licence was my way of proving I am Trans rather than a Cross Dressing sex deviant. |
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By *uzie69xTV/TS
over a year ago
Maidstone |
"Having looked at the Derek you mentioned, he seems to be an independent consultant, so whilst his suggestions mignt be great, it wouldnt appear to be a national policy on how schools will go about this."
I am no educationalist but for these sort of issues, it is up to the individual school / college. No such National policy exist. Derek and I have written up Good Practice Guidelines but it is up to the individual Head to implement - if at all. |
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