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Jon Venables back in prison

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

Should he ever be let out again?

I think not

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No. A very twisted individual from a very young age.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"No. A very twisted individual from a very young age."

This is the 2nd time he has been taken in again...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

They should let him out, definitely.

Where though? That’s the real question. Sahara? Antarctica? Middle of the Atlantic?

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By *ackDMissMorganCouple over a year ago

Halifax

He clearly can't be rehabilitated and is a risk

Apparenly he was posing as a 35 yo woman to lure people in online.

He needs to stay locked up,hes damaged somewhere ,maybe his upbringing.

Miss

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By *appyhumper123Man over a year ago

hull

He should never be allowed out again, children will never be safe as long as scumbags like him are hidden away amongst the public

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

Most children that are abused are abused by someone they know and trust.

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By *bsinthe_boyMan over a year ago

Luton

I believe it was fair to give him a chance at adult life.... But it looks like he cannot be trusted.

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By *sGivesWoodWoman over a year ago

ST. AUSTELL, CORNWALL

Definitely not

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By *appyhumper123Man over a year ago

hull

"Definitely not"

Agreed

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Should hang him problem solved be doing him a favour

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

I still think there are occasions when capital punishment should be reinstated ... and I know I will get shot down in flames for that but I'm sorry I can't apologise...anything where children are involved...

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Should hang him problem solved be doing him a favour

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By *ubsteffTV/TS over a year ago

Portsmouth

Only in a box.

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By *eadchefski1970Man over a year ago

Milton keynes

Personally I think castration is the way. Prison is too easy for these people and it is certainly no deterrent.

Stop them from being able to do anything....

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By *appyhumper123Man over a year ago

hull

"I still think there are occasions when capital punishment should be reinstated ... and I know I will get shot down in flames for that but I'm sorry I can't apologise...anything where children are involved..."

No need to apologize it nothing less than he deserves, 5 million he's cost the tax payer cheaper to hang him

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

No need to apologize it nothing less than he deserves, 5 million he's cost the tax payer cheaper to hang him"

Thanks

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

"Personally I think castration is the way. Prison is too easy for these people and it is certainly no deterrent.

Stop them from being able to do anything...."

Apart from sexual, physical , mental abuse, a variety of tortures, kid nap, imprisonment and murder.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Personally I think castration is the way. Prison is too easy for these people and it is certainly no deterrent.

Stop them from being able to do anything....

Apart from sexual, physical , mental abuse, a variety of tortures, kid nap, imprisonment and murder. "

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"I believe it was fair to give him a chance at adult life.... But it looks like he cannot be trusted. "

I agree.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

He was given a second and then third chance of trying to lead some semblance of a normal life but chose not too, the authorities say he can't be trusted to keep his owm anonymity and this has and will continue to be a massive cost to the tax payer.

It's not often I'll say something like this, but he adds nothing to society and I can't see a reason for keeping him alive, I don't wish him a long and torturous death, just death, erased from society. Then maybe the parents and family of Jamie Bulger can take some peace that they'll never have to hear another atrocity that Venebles has committed.

Ginger

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"They should let him out, definitely.

Where though? That’s the real question. Sahara? Antarctica? Middle of the Atlantic? "
middle of Liverpool. He wouldn't last 2 mins.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"He clearly can't be rehabilitated and is a risk

Apparenly he was posing as a 35 yo woman to lure people in online.

He needs to stay locked up,hes damaged somewhere ,maybe his upbringing.

Miss"
to think he could have even been on sites like this talking to us all.

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By *egs11ABCWoman over a year ago

Aberdeen

Myra hindley and Ian Brady never got out. These 2 shouldn't have either. X

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I strongly disagree.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No need to apologize it nothing less than he deserves, 5 million he's cost the tax payer cheaper to hang him"

Would cost millions for him to have the death penalty too.

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

I strongly disagree. "

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I strongly disagree. "
Maybe if it was your child they had murdered you would feel differently - they are scum and should be exterminated as painfully as possible - like the did to little Jamie - sorry for upsetting the do-gooders xx

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By *mmmMaybeCouple over a year ago

West Wales

"They should let him out, definitely.

Where though? That’s the real question. Sahara? Antarctica? Middle of the Atlantic? "

The desert of Deir Ezzor by parachute with an m/t sa80 glued to his hands..

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By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

I strongly disagree. Maybe if it was your child they had murdered you would feel differently - they are scum and should be exterminated as painfully as possible - like the did to little Jamie - sorry for upsetting the do-gooders xx"

Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

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By *ak777Man over a year ago

shaw

just lock him up for life never let him out safer for all our children .

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

You can call me names but I know how important this issue is to me. So no, you’re wrong with that assumption. And that doesn’t mean I condone what they did. I do however have experience of working with sex offenders and I wouldn’t make a blanket ruling on them all. But even in the situation of there being absolutely nothing to mitigate the offence or potential to rehabilitation, I will never ever condone capital punishment.

You’re entitled to your view.

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

The question of capital punishment is not a simple one. It has nothing to do with whether someone has a murdered child or not

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals. "

And yet many feel that isn’t the right solution.

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals. "

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"He was given a second and then third chance of trying to lead some semblance of a normal life but chose not too, the authorities say he can't be trusted to keep his owm anonymity and this has and will continue to be a massive cost to the tax payer.

Ginger "

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By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

The question of capital punishment is not a simple one. It has nothing to do with whether someone has a murdered child or not

The questionnis simple....does the hard working man/woman want to pay thousands to keep someone alive that doesnt deserve to see the next dawn.

My question to you would be to explain a rational reason to keep 100% convicted criminals of such terrible crimes alive. What is your reason for giving them the gift of life?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

For those that hand out the “if it were your kid what was murdered / violated you’d be fine with capital punishment” view, would you feel that way of your kid committed the offence?

I really wonder.

Not that that has got anything to do with my view that capital punishment is wrong, I just wonder if you for whatever awful turn of events ended in that situation whether you’d be shouting scum and kill em.

Maybe you would.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The question of capital punishment is not a simple one. It has nothing to do with whether someone has a murdered child or not

The questionnis simple....does the hard working man/woman want to pay thousands to keep someone alive that doesnt deserve to see the next dawn.

My question to you would be to explain a rational reason to keep 100% convicted criminals of such terrible crimes alive. What is your reason for giving them the gift of life?"

Because I’ve seen 100% convicted criminals turn their lives around dramatically, and be of such value in society. And for that reason, and the fact we will never know when and if someone can be rehabilitated I would never condone killing someone.

Rational? To me, yes. To you, maybe not.

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By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?"

I have family that work in cid that were unfortunately privvy to what really happened to james bulger. What was reported was tame to the events that took place. My sympathy runs very short with the two that murdered him.

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The emotional response is entirely different to the logical answer.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you."

That’s actually a rather silly statement to say anyone is empathising with him.

But if that’s easier for you to believe then...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

They should bring hanging back

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

BUT I do think full life sentences should be in place for more than is currently happening, absolutely for paedo's they never change. And prison should meet basic needs only, food, shelter, clothing, physical exercise, education programmes to occupy mind, work to contribute to their keep. None of this games consoles etc crap!

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you."

The arguement against capital punishment is not because of any empathy for the perpetrator.

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By *edangel_2013Woman over a year ago

southend

The question of capital punishment is not a simple one. It has nothing to do with whether someone has a murdered child or not

The questionnis simple....does the hard working man/woman want to pay thousands to keep someone alive that doesnt deserve to see the next dawn.

My question to you would be to explain a rational reason to keep 100% convicted criminals of such terrible crimes alive. What is your reason for giving them the gift of life?

Rational? To me, yes. To you, maybe not.

This.

I could go on and on explaining my reasons. But they are many and they are complicated, and I have to be up for work in the morning.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant. "

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

The question of capital punishment is not a simple one. It has nothing to do with whether someone has a murdered child or not

The questionnis simple....does the hard working man/woman want to pay thousands to keep someone alive that doesnt deserve to see the next dawn.

My question to you would be to explain a rational reason to keep 100% convicted criminals of such terrible crimes alive. What is your reason for giving them the gift of life?"

I am not giving THEM the gift of life.

I am smart enough to know that our justice system and capital punishment can be flawed.

Who choses which people get killed? And how? Who decides what crime requires death? Who decides what level of proof is needed?

And who polices them? Who does the killing?

Capital punishment will kill innocent people at times. Not having it will mean no one does for no reason. That's my reason

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant. "

If you ever went to a prison or had the pleasure of working in one you'd have an understanding that it's quite a dangerous place to work.

If you treat people like animals then they'll act like them. TV, a games console here and there keeps things as chilled as they can be and therefore a safer environment for the prison custody officers that have to look after the inmates. I left my job in a cat bale prison before the smoking ban came in cos it was a hard job anyway, I didn't want to be around for when they took fags away from people.

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By *inky-MinxWoman over a year ago

Grantham

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you."

Not wanting capital punishment brought back does NOT mean empathy with Venables.

A decent discussion on this topic requires that things are not twisted to suit your view

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I
"I still think there are occasions when capital punishment should be reinstated ... and I know I will get shot down in flames for that but I'm sorry I can't apologise...anything where children are involved...

You’re entitled to your view. "
I did say sorry for upsetting the do- gooders and clearly you fall in to that bracket - experience of working with sex offenders - was it voluntary or as a job - why bother with them surely you could put your energy to help the people who sudder at their hands xx

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all. "

Evidence from proper studies rather than anecdotal "evidence" overwhelmingly shows otherwise. Huge numbers of incidents go unreported and you must know through your job that it's incredibly hard to get a conviction too.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Fucking phone. Cat b male prison that was supposed to say.

Also I don't think paedophiles change, they probably get better at hiding it. They may not physically act on it again but I don't think you can change someone's sexual preference no matter how much counselling they have or how many workshops they attend.

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By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you.

That’s actually a rather silly statement to say anyone is empathising with him.

But if that’s easier for you to believe then...

You dont know what happened to the poor lad, as i said previously media reports were very tame.

And how about lee rigsbys killer, seen in public cutting his head off. You want to use taxpayers money to help these inbreds?

Id burn the fuckers alive. Sorry if that offends.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"II still think there are occasions when capital punishment should be reinstated ... and I know I will get shot down in flames for that but I'm sorry I can't apologise...anything where children are involved...

You’re entitled to your view. I did say sorry for upsetting the do- gooders and clearly you fall in to that bracket - experience of working with sex offenders - was it voluntary or as a job - why bother with them surely you could put your energy to help the people who sudder at their hands xx"

You are still calling me names. Secondly a job. Thirdly I do. Fourthly, you’re still entitled to your view. Try it without calling names though. If you can.

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By *adame BWoman over a year ago

C'est moi Boudoir

I thought the question was should he be rehabilitated back into society.

He has obviously not changed and at this point is beyond living a normal life it would seem, so no is my answer to that.

I think the crime in question is one of the most horrific but I also believe that too many mistakes have been made in the justice system world wide to safely say a death penalty is the solution.

I know in this case that Venebles is guilty but where do you (society) draw the line in picking and choosing who lives, who dies. My heartfelt condolences to Jamie's relatives in this being rehashed again.

Madame Boo

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

They also learn from their mistakes...adjusting their methods to avoid getting caught/convicted including targeting victims less likely to be believed - like kids in care? Using condoms if they haven't before? Forcing victims to bathe before letting them go?

As for "treat people like animals they'll behave like animals" I don't think I suggested that at all, I said basic needs, that included psychological needs, nobody NEEDS a games console (with violent games?), tv I could maybe be ok with IF it was monitored.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"He clearly can't be rehabilitated and is a risk

Apparenly he was posing as a 35 yo woman to lure people in online.

He needs to stay locked up,hes damaged somewhere ,maybe his upbringing.

Miss"

Fancy a man pretending to be a woman online. Who would have thought that kind of thing would happen!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you.

That’s actually a rather silly statement to say anyone is empathising with him.

But if that’s easier for you to believe then...

You dont know what happened to the poor lad, as i said previously media reports were very tame.

And how about lee rigsbys killer, seen in public cutting his head off. You want to use taxpayers money to help these inbreds?

Id burn the fuckers alive. Sorry if that offends.

I’m well aware of the case, actually. Stop making assumptions about what people think/know.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you.

That’s actually a rather silly statement to say anyone is empathising with him.

But if that’s easier for you to believe then...

You dont know what happened to the poor lad, as i said previously media reports were very tame.

And how about lee rigsbys killer, seen in public cutting his head off. You want to use taxpayers money to help these inbreds?

Id burn the fuckers alive. Sorry if that offends.

Make martyrs out of them then. They wanted to be killed they probably expected to be fatally shot on site. Those two should be given to the army to use on tour, could walk in front of vehicles to check for ied's!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I thought the question was should he be rehabilitated back into society.

He has obviously not changed and at this point is beyond living a normal life it would seem, so no is my answer to that.

I think the crime in question is one of the most horrific but I also believe that too many mistakes have been made in the justice system world wide to safely say a death penalty is the solution.

Madame Boo"

That was the question, I joined to counter the death penalty supporters.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I understand the emotional response from those who call for capital punishment.

But the action of capital punishment is purely a quick fix emotional response, and not a logical one.

Take out the emotion, apply some logic, and then the far reaching negative implications of capital punishment make sense.

The judicial system does need to change though, I don't know how, I don't have the answers, but better management and resources applied to it would be a start.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"They also learn from their mistakes...adjusting their methods to avoid getting caught/convicted including targeting victims less likely to be believed - like kids in care? Using condoms if they haven't before? Forcing victims to bathe before letting them go?

I still feel your globalised comments in first half

of this post is inaccurate for many.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then? "

No - studies aren't a guarantee of honesty and criminals lie. I genuinely believe they NEVER change, they just get better at hiding it. Even IF they don't personally touch a child they still use child pornography which is abuse by proxy.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I understand the emotional response from those who call for capital punishment.

But the action of capital punishment is purely a quick fix emotional response, and not a logical one.

Take out the emotion, apply some logic, and then the far reaching negative implications of capital punishment make sense.

The judicial system does need to change though, I don't know how, I don't have the answers, but better management and resources applied to it would be a start. "

Agreed

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If you have hate for anybody,regardless of what they have or have not done, you are a murderer at heart...

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

Estella you REALLY think many paedo's are capable of rehabilitation? To the point they don't use child porn, EVER touch a child again, don't seek physical contact with children for sexual gratification? No I really don't believe that.

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By *adame BWoman over a year ago

C'est moi Boudoir

"I understand the emotional response from those who call for capital punishment.

But the action of capital punishment is purely a quick fix emotional response, and not a logical one.

Take out the emotion, apply some logic, and then the far reaching negative implications of capital punishment make sense.

The judicial system does need to change though, I don't know how, I don't have the answers, but better management and resources applied to it would be a start. "

Agreed

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Estella you REALLY think many paedo's are capable of rehabilitation? To the point they don't use child porn, EVER touch a child again, don't seek physical contact with children for sexual gratification? No I really don't believe that. "

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

Well, with that mindset no research showing you different will be believed. You’re entitled to your view. I strongly disagree and it saddens me how actually understanding what is happening for individuals like this is never supported, the kind of “evil” and “never change” commentary will and does push anyone experiencing attraction like this underground rather than feeling able to seek treatment and preventative support.

Yeah, vilifying always works.

It’s an incredibly emotive topic, and it’s a shame that it is only allowed to be had in terms of “evil/scum/hang them” terms. I find it backward, unhelpful and gravely disappointing.

Just my opinion.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Yes. I wouldn’t post it if I didn’t think it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg. "

That’s not the point I’m making though.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported... "

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

Yeah, vilifying always works.

It’s an incredibly emotive topic, and it’s a shame that it is only allowed to be had in terms of “evil/scum/hang them” terms. I find it backward, unhelpful and gravely disappointing.

Just my opinion. "

I reserve my empathy and 'understanding' for the victims thanks - who get accused of lying, undergo invasive physical examination and are ripped to pieces IF they report and it gets to court, thanks. They are far more deserving in my opinion.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles. "

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

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By *adame BWoman over a year ago

C'est moi Boudoir

"I thought the question was should he be rehabilitated back into society.

He has obviously not changed and at this point is beyond living a normal life it would seem, so no is my answer to that.

I think the crime in question is one of the most horrific but I also believe that too many mistakes have been made in the justice system world wide to safely say a death penalty is the solution.

Madame Boo

That was the question, I joined to counter the death penalty supporters. "

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though. "

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles. "

Exactly

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

Yeah, vilifying always works.

It’s an incredibly emotive topic, and it’s a shame that it is only allowed to be had in terms of “evil/scum/hang them” terms. I find it backward, unhelpful and gravely disappointing.

Just my opinion.

I don’t feel that I have to only have empathy for one group. Please don’t position me as if I don’t have empathy for victims. I understand it’s very emotive and especially if you or someone you know has been abused.

Did you know that a very high number of paedophiles were abused as children? Many *are* victims.

It’s far more complex than you’d like it to be, it’s very easy to say “scum”.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles. "

Can't argue with that logic, but it's not the debate in question

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids. "

I have never argued against custodial sentences. If you review, I argued against capital punishment, which you didn’t seem to support, but did challenge your “never change” comment which you then acquiesced on yourself.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

Can't argue with that logic, but it's not the debate in question

Or even likely!

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Sure, because if they're not in prison they would never

Change their name to avoid background checks showing up convictions.

Lie on job applications

Move countries where their background can't be checked

Apply for jobs that don't APPEAR to give direct access to kids but do

Work in voluntary roles that involve them in the community as a whole.

No that never happens

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids. "

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Fucking phone. Cat b male prison that was supposed to say.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Sure, because if they're not in prison they would never

Change their name to avoid background checks showing up convictions.

Lie on job applications

Move countries where their background can't be checked

Apply for jobs that don't APPEAR to give direct access to kids but do

Work in voluntary roles that involve them in the community as a whole.

No that never happens

That's a system failure.

So because of a systems failure we should lock them all up or kill them all?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Sure, because if they're not in prison they would never

Change their name to avoid background checks showing up convictions.

Lie on job applications

Move countries where their background can't be checked

Apply for jobs that don't APPEAR to give direct access to kids but do

Work in voluntary roles that involve them in the community as a whole.

No that never happens

Oh dear god.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

Yeah, vilifying always works.

It’s an incredibly emotive topic, and it’s a shame that it is only allowed to be had in terms of “evil/scum/hang them” terms. I find it backward, unhelpful and gravely disappointing.

Just my opinion.

Did you know that a very high number of paedophiles were abused as children? Many *are* victims.

It’s far more complex than you’d like it to be, it’s very easy to say “scum”. "

I have to disagree there.

There's no link to peadophiles being so because of abuse suffered.

There is a link to those who abuse children having been abused themselves. But abusing a child does not necessarily make one a Peadophile.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught. "

Oh so you’re saying life sentence (blanket approach) for anyone committing a sexual offence?

Yes, I disagree with that.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why. "

Excellent point - estella I don't know if you have children or not but I'd be interested to know if you would allow any of your 'rehabilitated' paedo's would be allowed by you to babysit your kids or grandkids?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why. "

I’m talking about current law.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's "

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"No to capital punishment -

Too easy an out for these evil people, Ian Brady wanted to die, many of them attempt suicide

They'd appeal repeatedly which would cost taxpayers millions

Why stoop to their level? We're better than them surely.

This person in particular is CLEARLY a danger to and will always be a danger to society especially children. The reasons why are at this point irrelevant.

“Paedos they never change”

Untrue. I know many who have. And actually many do not act on their attraction at all.

I write studies like those. Also to move your position from saying “never” to “overwhelmingly” is quite a shift. I’ll accept you accept that it’s not never then?

Yeah, vilifying always works.

It’s an incredibly emotive topic, and it’s a shame that it is only allowed to be had in terms of “evil/scum/hang them” terms. I find it backward, unhelpful and gravely disappointing.

Just my opinion.

Did you know that a very high number of paedophiles were abused as children? Many *are* victims.

It’s far more complex than you’d like it to be, it’s very easy to say “scum”.

I have to disagree there.

There's no link to peadophiles being so because of abuse suffered.

There is a link to those who abuse children having been abused themselves. But abusing a child does not necessarily make one a Peadophile."

You are absolutely correct, I meant the former.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught.

Oh so you’re saying life sentence (blanket approach) for anyone committing a sexual offence?

Yes, I disagree with that. "

Are you genuinely in a position to influence policy on this, if so I find that deeply worrying.

Regarding anyone committing a sexual offence - against a child? Yes - every time. We are FAR too lax on this in the uk.

I think there is POSSIBLY an argument for an introduction of Romeo and Juliet laws but yea I think where the victim is clearly a child - lock em up throw away the key.

Those committing offences against adults it's slightly more nuanced but again I think we are far too lax.

As for 'most paedo's were abuse victims themselves' that idea has been becoming increasingly debunked in recent years, partly through more research into how victims develop and also in realising hey, criminals lie! They lie to get away with it, they lie to get sympathy, a lighter sentence...

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally? "

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why.

But you’re setting a context I’m not talking about.

I’m disagreeing with killing or imprisoning for life. Reform is about living a meaningful life, it is not about reformation and advocating becoming babysitters. That’s not what I’ve said. Why would I put someone in that situation?

It’s complex. But you’re negating any potential meaning or use someone can be in society if working within restrictions and support. I totally disagree with that view.

I never said eradicate the potential attraction. I said change, rehabilitate and reform.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught.

Oh so you’re saying life sentence (blanket approach) for anyone committing a sexual offence?

Yes, I disagree with that.

Are you genuinely in a position to influence policy on this, if so I find that deeply worrying.

Regarding anyone committing a sexual offence - against a child? Yes - every time. We are FAR too lax on this in the uk.

I think there is POSSIBLY an argument for an introduction of Romeo and Juliet laws but yea I think where the victim is clearly a child - lock em up throw away the key.

Those committing offences against adults it's slightly more nuanced but again I think we are far too lax.

Well, you’re entitled to your view.

It’s an emotive topic indeed. I too find your view deeply worrying.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 23/11/17 22:48:40]

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why.

But you’re setting a context I’m not talking about.

It’s complex. But you’re negating any potential meaning or use someone can be in society if working within restrictions and support. I totally disagree with that view.

I never said eradicate the potential attraction. I said change, rehabilitate and reform.

That sounds like a cop out. Children are part of society, by releasing people that we KNOW are highly likely to harm them we are putting them at risk, I've just done a quick google on reoffending rates, there's minor disagreements on exact figures but what is agreed is that it is an increasing problem, that even monitored ex-prisoners are reoffending while supposedly being monitored and again that's before you get into unreported cases and where the authorities have lost track of ex-prisoners... I'm sure they're not hurting anyone

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn. "

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Why? If you believe so strongly that they can be cured, why can't they go on to have jobs where they have direct contact with children? Cos they fucking can't that's why.

But you’re setting a context I’m not talking about.

It’s complex. But you’re negating any potential meaning or use someone can be in society if working within restrictions and support. I totally disagree with that view.

I never said eradicate the potential attraction. I said change, rehabilitate and reform.

Perhaps read about resourcing issues.

Again, you’re very polarised in your view and getting personal so I’ll leave you with your pitchfork.

Manipulating what I’m saying is not fair.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform? "

Seemingly so. And by disagreeing, and not immediately inviting anyone reforming their ways round to babysit then I’m copping out. This is not a debate, it’s just a rant.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught.

Oh so you’re saying life sentence (blanket approach) for anyone committing a sexual offence?

Yes, I disagree with that.

Are you genuinely in a position to influence policy on this, if so I find that deeply worrying.

Regarding anyone committing a sexual offence - against a child? Yes - every time. We are FAR too lax on this in the uk.

I think there is POSSIBLY an argument for an introduction of Romeo and Juliet laws but yea I think where the victim is clearly a child - lock em up throw away the key.

Those committing offences against adults it's slightly more nuanced but again I think we are far too lax.

Well, you’re entitled to your view.

It’s an emotive topic indeed. I too find your view deeply worrying. "

It's far from just my view, it's the view of many experts worldwide with extensive experience of TRYING to change these people.

I genuinely don't understand why my view is deeply worrying considering my way of doing things would reduce the suffering of innocents.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

Actually with a number of friends working as police officers, social workers, paediatric nurses etc I'm well aware of 'resourcing issues' and how they are likely resulting in more children being abused.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

So what’s the crux of the point you’re making that I’m disagreeing with?

You argued that 'many' can be successfully rehabilitated and are therefore then safe to go back into society, when the evidence is that they just get better at avoiding getting caught.

Oh so you’re saying life sentence (blanket approach) for anyone committing a sexual offence?

Yes, I disagree with that.

Are you genuinely in a position to influence policy on this, if so I find that deeply worrying.

Regarding anyone committing a sexual offence - against a child? Yes - every time. We are FAR too lax on this in the uk.

I think there is POSSIBLY an argument for an introduction of Romeo and Juliet laws but yea I think where the victim is clearly a child - lock em up throw away the key.

Those committing offences against adults it's slightly more nuanced but again I think we are far too lax.

Well, you’re entitled to your view.

It’s an emotive topic indeed. I too find your view deeply worrying.

It's far from just my view, it's the view of many experts worldwide with extensive experience of TRYING to change these people.

I genuinely don't understand why my view is deeply worrying considering my way of doing things would reduce the suffering of innocents. "

I’m sorry that you don’t understand.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform? "

Certain crimes dont deserve it. If the right punishment was in place maybe that would be deterrent enough to halt these people before they commit the crimes.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

I'm addressing what you said not manipulating it at all.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Actually with a number of friends working as police officers, social workers, paediatric nurses etc I'm well aware of 'resourcing issues' and how they are likely resulting in more children being abused. "

So the suppprt isn’t always there.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm addressing what you said not manipulating it at all. "

Let’s agree to disagree.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

Out of interest Estella - May I put a hypothesis to you ? You have young children. Would you let a "reformed" p*edophile look after them ? I appreciate this could never happen - but remember this is a hypothesis, so a simple yes or no response is all that is required.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

You can't reform a paedophile and by reform I mean stop them from being sexually attracted to children.

If sexual preferences could be changed then the church or any other organisation would have found a way to stop people being gay.

All anyone can do is give your own child the tools and knowledge to protect themselves from all the fucked up people in the world. That really is all we can do.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform?

Certain crimes dont deserve it. If the right punishment was in place maybe that would be deterrent enough to halt these people before they commit the crimes."

I think there's more than enough evidence right in front of our eyes to prove that isn't the case.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ieman300Man over a year ago

Best Greggs in Cheshire East

It seems he will never be rehabilitated. I can't see any other option than a full life in jail. Not wired right that one.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You can't reform a paedophile and by reform I mean stop them from being sexually attracted to children.

If sexual preferences could be changed then the church or any other organisation would have found a way to stop people being gay.

All anyone can do is give your own child the tools and knowledge to protect themselves from all the fucked up people in the world. That really is all we can do. "

And that is what I’d term cure and I agree. I view the term reform differently.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this. "

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You can't reform a paedophile and by reform I mean stop them from being sexually attracted to children.

If sexual preferences could be changed then the church or any other organisation would have found a way to stop people being gay.

All anyone can do is give your own child the tools and knowledge to protect themselves from all the fucked up people in the world. That really is all we can do. "

I wholeheartedly agree, but do so with sadness at the loss of innocence of the younger generation.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

It is a none question though really because it just wouldn't happen

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform?

Certain crimes dont deserve it. If the right punishment was in place maybe that would be deterrent enough to halt these people before they commit the crimes."

Exactly!

There's little to no deterrent because

A unlikely to be convicted

B even if they are, it's likely to be a pathetically light sentence.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED."

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform?

Certain crimes dont deserve it. If the right punishment was in place maybe that would be deterrent enough to halt these people before they commit the crimes.

I think there's more than enough evidence right in front of our eyes to prove that isn't the case. "

Take a holiday to north korea....the british law system is way too soft.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"You can't reform a paedophile and by reform I mean stop them from being sexually attracted to children.

If sexual preferences could be changed then the church or any other organisation would have found a way to stop people being gay.

All anyone can do is give your own child the tools and knowledge to protect themselves from all the fucked up people in the world. That really is all we can do.

I wholeheartedly agree, but do so with sadness at the loss of innocence of the younger generation.

True

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

So the suppprt isn’t always there.

Even when it is it doesn't stop them reoffending because we could never have eg police accompany them 24/7 365 days a year AND monitor all their online activity.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I'll answer that.

No.

In the same way I wouldn't let a pyromaniac work in a fireworks factory.

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple over a year ago

Basingstoke

The sad thing about threads like this are that it shows just how many people are happy to completely de-humanise someone. I'd go as far as to say some people want to find someone they can dehumanise and give a nice justified torture to.

Maybe pick up a history book and see where that leads before looking at it like a simple accounting question.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *heLaserGuyMan over a year ago

Coventry

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I'll answer that.

No.

In the same way I wouldn't let a pyromaniac work in a fireworks factory.

Why not....if such people can be returned into society as valued people ?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So the suppprt isn’t always there.

Even when it is it doesn't stop them reoffending because we could never have eg police accompany them 24/7 365 days a year AND monitor all their online activity. "

Do you feel the same about all crime? That there’s no potential for reform?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is FAR more abuse goes on than we could possibly comprehend. The amount already reported is tip of the iceberg.

That’s not the point I’m making though.

But it's the crux of the matter - there would be FEWER victims and suffering if these people were kept in prison and physically STOPPED from hurting more kids.

Can't argue with that logic either, but again not the debate in question

If you're referring to the op

John Venables is a repeat offender, rehabilitation has not worked for him, so no he should not be released ever.

I am simply applying that to all paedo's

All peadophiles that abuse? Or just all peadophiles unconditionally?

All that abuse (because we can't prove thought) and I include abuse by proxy - use of child porn.

Certainly not by thought, if so most of us would probably be in jail for thinking about one crime or another!

But you'd keep them locked up without any chance of rehabilitation or reform?

Certain crimes dont deserve it. If the right punishment was in place maybe that would be deterrent enough to halt these people before they commit the crimes.

I think there's more than enough evidence right in front of our eyes to prove that isn't the case.

Take a holiday to north korea....the british law system is way too soft.

Yes, because they're social understanding is the envy of the world....

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I'll answer that.

No.

In the same way I wouldn't let a pyromaniac work in a fireworks factory.

Why not....if such people can be returned into society as valued people ?"

You’re completely missing the point about value and meaningful contribution which doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive to risk management.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED. "

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"They should let him out, definitely.

Where though? That’s the real question. Sahara? Antarctica? Middle of the Atlantic? middle of Liverpool. He wouldn't last 2 mins. "

True. But why should other people flout the law when the law should be dealing with him. Sadly there seems no hope of rehabilitation for him. Incarceration is the only option available.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Should he ever be let out again?

I think not

Realistically we all know they can't keep him forever but as for being given new identity again and protection I say enough is enough

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"The sad thing about threads like this are that it shows just how many people are happy to completely de-humanise someone. I'd go as far as to say some people want to find someone they can dehumanise and give a nice justified torture to.

Maybe pick up a history book and see where that leads before looking at it like a simple accounting question. "

Sometimes you articulate succinctly everything I want to scream.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I'll answer that.

No.

In the same way I wouldn't let a pyromaniac work in a fireworks factory.

Why not....if such people can be returned into society as valued people ?"

If you don't understand why, there's no way I could help you understand it.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

So the suppprt isn’t always there.

Even when it is it doesn't stop them reoffending because we could never have eg police accompany them 24/7 365 days a year AND monitor all their online activity.

Do you feel the same about all crime? That there’s no potential for reform?"

No, but in relation to all serious crime - child sexual abuse, r@pists and murderers, certain types of violent offenders yes.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I'll answer that.

No.

In the same way I wouldn't let a pyromaniac work in a fireworks factory.

Why not....if such people can be returned into society as valued people ?

If you don't understand why, there's no way I could help you understand it. "

Brick wall. Bang. Head hurts. Ouch.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So the suppprt isn’t always there.

Even when it is it doesn't stop them reoffending because we could never have eg police accompany them 24/7 365 days a year AND monitor all their online activity.

Do you feel the same about all crime? That there’s no potential for reform?

No, but in relation to all serious crime - child sexual abuse, r@pists and murderers, certain types of violent offenders yes.

I see.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

but you didn't answer the previous question..... having read this thread all the way through you've answered every other counter point that has been made, why not this one?

or is it a case of yes I believe that they can be rehabilitated and let back into public life, but just not so long as it's in the area where I live?

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say....."

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"but you didn't answer the previous question..... having read this thread all the way through you've answered every other counter point that has been made, why not this one?

or is it a case of yes I believe that they can be rehabilitated and let back into public life, but just not so long as it's in the area where I live?"

Nope. That’s missing the complexity of my point.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It should have been done a long time ago. Don't ever apologise for something were all thinking.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It should have been done a long time ago. Don't ever apologise for something were all thinking. "

Not everyone. Please don’t tar me with your brush.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you. "

It wasn’t a real answer.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

I don't thing it's complex at all - if you wouldn't inflict them on your kids why should the rest of us have them endangering ours?

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By *y Favorite PornstarCouple over a year ago

Basingstoke

Maybe pick up a history book and see where that leads before looking at it like a simple accounting question.

Sometimes you articulate succinctly everything I want to scream.

I'm not going to pretend to be an expert in paedophiles, the subject makes me feel a bit sick if I'm honest but i would encourage anyone seriously interested to consider cases like this one:

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/features/a-40-year-old-developed-an-obsession-with-child-pornography-then-doctors-discovered-why-a6893756.html

Where the a man became a paedophile in his 40's. The cause was a brain tumor and once removed he went back to normal.

I'm not suggesting that will apply to all or even most paedophiles and certainly many are beyond any known cure. Frankly i wouldn't have a 'cured' one anywhere near my family either.

What i would say is that i see no reason to believe paedophilia is natural in the sense i can't see why anyone would be born that way, it serves absolutely no purpose in evolution. So i think it's something they develop in life and that gives me hope some of them could reverse it. But that's as far as my current knowledge on the subject can take me.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you.

It wasn’t a real answer.

I know it wasn't and you can't say no to the question because then you're making your entire argument invalid.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By *aisyDDWoman over a year ago

North West

With the shit they did to little Jamie Bulger when they were 10yrs old they should never have been let out. It was a premeditated attack at that age. There is no way he should be let out now.

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By *hamboy69Man over a year ago

huddersfield

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you."

A good friend of mine worked on the prosecution and one night after too many we,d had too much to drink he let it all out about some of the details.My oldest son was about 15 months old at the time the same age as when J B was murdered and all I wanted to do was hide him away it gave me sleepless nights.Those boys must have been evil

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

So to clarify, I don’t think we should have capital punishment. I don’t believe incarceration for anyone committing a sexual offence with no potential for reform is the answer. I do believe in custodial sentences. I do believe in reform and rehabilitation. I do believe there’s a difference in cure and reform. I do think rehabilitated offenders can go on to contribute to society. Not all, necessarily. But some. And hence a blanket rule of life imprisonment, I don’t support. I do care about victims. I do care about reoffending. I do care about children. I do think robust risk assessment and management is needed. I think more resources are needed for our criminal justice forces. I think more education is needed about sexual offenders and I think a more compassionate discussion about the complexities of these offences would allow more preventative and intervention work to be done. That, I believe would reduce offending rates. Which is what we all want.

And I won’t be told who I have to have babysitting to enable me to have a view. I wouldn’t have any of the pitchfork brigade round to babysit either.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I don't thing it's complex at all - if you wouldn't inflict them on your kids why should the rest of us have them endangering ours? "

You’ve not understood my point at all.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you.

It wasn’t a real answer.

I know it wasn't and you can't say no to the question because then you're making your entire argument invalid. "

It’s not. At no point have I advocated any reformed paedophiles to become babysitters. If I had, then I would be negating my point. But I haven’t. I talked about reform and contributing to society. Not working with children.

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By *aisyDDWoman over a year ago

North West

"Totally agree. In the right circumstances capital punishment should be handed out. Same goes for lee rigsby's killer.

Only one solution for scum like these individuals.

And when someone takes your sperm and uses it at a crime scene you'll happily be murdered painfully because you're scum?

But feel free to empathise with mr venebles if its easier for you.

Exactly! It wasn't quite the way it came out in the press. Nasty nasty boys!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you.

It wasn’t a real answer.

I know it wasn't and you can't say no to the question because then you're making your entire argument invalid. "

It doesn't make the argument invalid at all.

I said no, yet I still argue against capital punishment, and believe in rehabilitation.

In this case, I think life imprisonment is the only course of action left.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you."

Oh jog on. Adults are talking.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you.

Oh jog on. Adults are talking. "

Perhaps you should try an be one. It's really not that difficult madam.

Reply privately (closed, thread got too big)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Then you would be deemed an inappropriate safeguard and would most likely have your children placed on an at risk register or even have them taken away from you.

It wasn’t a real answer.

I know it wasn't and you can't say no to the question because then you're making your entire argument invalid.

It doesn't make the argument invalid at all.

I said no, yet I still argue against capital punishment, and believe in rehabilitation.

In this case, I think life imprisonment is the only course of action left. "

And in JB’s case, I’m in agreement. I am not agreeing for a blanket approach to all offenders though.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"So to clarify, I don’t think we should have capital punishment. I don’t believe incarceration for anyone committing a sexual offence with no potential for reform is the answer. I do believe in custodial sentences. I do believe in reform and rehabilitation. I do believe there’s a difference in cure and reform. I do think rehabilitated offenders can go on to contribute to society. Not all, necessarily. But some. And hence a blanket rule of life imprisonment, I don’t support. I do care about victims. I do care about reoffending. I do care about children. I do think robust risk assessment and management is needed. I think more resources are needed for our criminal justice forces. I think more education is needed about sexual offenders and I think a more compassionate discussion about the complexities of these offences would allow more preventative and intervention work to be done. That, I believe would reduce offending rates. Which is what we all want.

And I won’t be told who I have to have babysitting to enable me to have a view. I wouldn’t have any of the pitchfork brigade round to babysit either.

Nicely put

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you.

Oh jog on. Adults are talking.

Perhaps you should try an be one. It's really not that difficult madam."

Come and actually debate, don’t rehash a hypothetical question that doesn’t relate and then be all pleased with yourself. I’m happy to

discuss but be original and relevant, purhlease.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

And I won’t be told who I have to have babysitting to enable me to have a view. I wouldn’t have any of the pitchfork brigade round to babysit either.

Nicely put

Thank you. And thank you for actually understanding the points I’ve made not manipulating them. The PMs have been vile in the meantime!!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Maybe pick up a history book and see where that leads before looking at it like a simple accounting question.

Sometimes you articulate succinctly everything I want to scream.

I completely agree. I work in a Secure Training Centre (prison for 12-17 year old kids, basically) and make it a personal policy to never find out what crime the young person has committed before I've got to know them on a personal level. You'd be surprised at the insight you get; the level of abuse that probably 80-90 percent of them have suffered, whether it be: physical, emotional, neglect or sexual is horrifying

Also, if you think 'prison' is easy, come and do a few shifts with me and I'll categorically prove you otherwise.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you.

Oh jog on. Adults are talking.

Perhaps you should try an be one. It's really not that difficult madam.

Come and actually debate, don’t rehash a hypothetical question that doesn’t relate and then be all pleased with yourself. I’m happy to

discuss but be original and relevant, purhlease."

Happy to debate, so long as you can pretend to be an adult and refrain from using terms like "jog on", and making unnecessary remarks like "I don't crave your respect" ? You hardly look credible and/or intelligent when posting in such a manner. I'll standby for a further rude post directed at me, but if you can refrain let the debate continue.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

If every paedophile acted on their urges, the amount of sexual abuse cases would be multiplied countless times, and that would be just those that are reported...

That's not curing them though is it? They still have the thoughts, whether they act on it or not I don't want anyone that finds children attractive to even have their eyeballs on my child.

I also wouldn't leave my child in the care of any "reformed" paedophiles.

They would never be in the position to look after your children, so don’t worry.

I’ve answered this.

As I suspected - not a yes or no answer. Thanks all the same. QED.

It’s a point that is not related to what I am advocating. I am advocating that not all paedophiles should be locked up for life.

So your question is moot.

And your answer was not a yes or no precisely as I expected. Thanks all the same. QED.

Ok. Then yes.

In your hypothetical, yes.

Thanks for giving a straight answer Estella. I respect that. I have nothing further to say.....

I don’t particularly crave your respect. And if you didn’t pick up on the issue with your question in relation to the points actually being discussed, you have my pity.

Although I am upset that you don't "crave" (!?) my respect, I am glad that you are showing your true personality by making such silly remarks. Thank you.

Oh jog on. Adults are talking.

Perhaps you should try an be one. It's really not that difficult madam.

Come and actually debate, don’t rehash a hypothetical question that doesn’t relate and then be all pleased with yourself. I’m happy to

discuss but be original and relevant, purhlease.

I’m apologise. You just posted the same thing as someone else and haven’t yet added to the debate. I’m happy to see what you’re bringing...

over to you.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

*I apologise

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"*I apologise

Thanks for the apology, but actually I need to get to sleep now. Work tomorrow.

Been lovely chatting. Sleep well.xx

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"*I apologise

Thanks for the apology, but actually I need to get to sleep now. Work tomorrow.

Been lovely chatting. Sleep well.xx"

Hahahahaha. So nothing to actually bring.

Fair enough.

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By *ampWithABrainWoman over a year ago

Glasgow

"I don't thing it's complex at all - if you wouldn't inflict them on your kids why should the rest of us have them endangering ours?

You’ve not understood my point at all. "

Really? I think I have. Just not working with children doesn't prevent them having contact with and abusing even killing children. It certainly doesn't prevent use of child porn which is created by children being abused.

Look at the cases where children are abused and even murdered by men that have inveigled their way into the child's family.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I don't thing it's complex at all - if you wouldn't inflict them on your kids why should the rest of us have them endangering ours?

You’ve not understood my point at all.

Look at the cases where children are abused and even murdered by men that have inveigled their way into the child's family.

You asked me about babysitting. We’ve already established you want to lock everyone up for life and I don’t. What’s more to say? My point above was about babysitting.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 23/11/17 23:43:09]

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

It’s Estella, not a popular lager!

But thanks

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"With the shit they did to little Jamie Bulger when they were 10yrs old they should never have been let out. It was a premeditated attack at that age. There is no way he should be let out now. "

That evil bastard has proved he can't be rehabilitated. How many chances does one sick sadist need, before enough is enough. As our soft touch country will never bring back capital punishment, then time to lock the disturbed garbage away and throw away the key.

No child will ever be safe while he is protected. He's had his chance, now let the piece of shit rot.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Fortunately it's a hypothetical debate because the decision on State murder based on a deterrent that didn't stop those crimes in the past, revenge or economic limitations is a thing of the past. We've moved on.

Society has failed most of these individuals in some way, society shouldn't be allowed to murder them. In certain cases, life should mean life because although rehabilitation should always be a goal, its never a guarantee.

Some people should lose their liberty for life but not their life prematurely.

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