FabSwingers.com > Forums > The Lounge > Drug Abuse verse Alcohol Abuse!

Drug Abuse verse Alcohol Abuse!

By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

So from another thread I noticed quite a few people are quite quick to condemn drug users on here...often stating the cost to the NHS and crime as the reasons.

I did a quick bit of research last night and found the cost of drug abuse is estimated at £13.9 billion in crime and to the NHS. Whilst alcohol is £21 billion for the same!

I know duty is recovered from alcohol abuse so these are not totally accurate figures.

But alcohol abuse is a massive Burdon the society. .yet people seem to use it and look down on others as theirs is a legal drug of choice.

So I am asking are we hypocritical on this?

Your thoughts

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By *a72Man over a year ago

london

Someone who abuses alcohol is equally in the wrong as someone who abuses drugs in my book. Alcohol abuse usually causes family and relationship abuse, ruins someones health and is very unpleasant to see in another person. Alcohol is fine when used in moderation a few beers now and then or a glass of wine with a meal not a problem but drinking yourself silly everyday is just as bad as sticking a needle in your arm.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Both are illnesses. I see any abuse or addiction as an illness that people don't ask for, any more than they want a terminal illness or disability. The brain is sick and needs help, so help them.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The difference is... alcohol is socially accepted.

But just look how much it costs the tax payer...

Policing (weekends - as 80% of policing over the course of a weekend is alcohol related)

Nhs? Billions...

Alcohol is a culture...

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?

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By *a72Man over a year ago

london

"But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?"

Yes.

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By *aul1973HullMan over a year ago

East Hull

Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

I know its an illness. However trying to understand and sympathise with people who refuse to acknowledge or obtain treatment for an illness is hard. Particularly when they lie, steal and cheat. Affect their children's lives negatively, spend money on alcohol when their kids have nothing to eat, drive when they're pissed potentially harming other people etc etc.

Alcohol is socially acceptable drug abuse when used to excess and a massive drain on the NHS and other emergency servicer. I'm not talking about the glass of wine on Saturday or the occasional one too many on holiday. I'm talking about the silly people who end up being looked after in town centres by police or paramedics. The daft people who drink to excess every weekend and end up with liver damage.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least."

I do not see this as a inflammatory thread at all.

And think if people do not post inflammatory comments all will be OK.

May I add I speak as a person who has never used drugs but in the past had issues with alcohol

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is."

Well said

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least."

You will only get a ban if you abuse a person on the forum or talk about anything that is not allowed.

Technically, talking about illegal drugs isn't allowed.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Just stay away from both is my view.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is.

Well said

Some patients the family bring in alcohol or drugs

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

But would you say them drinkers look down on drug takers?

I know I used to

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I don't think we do encourage people to become dependant on drugs or alcohol.

If a person becomes weak and becomes dependant on either it's not because they were encouraged by society. If that were the case would all be addicts.

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By *aul1973HullMan over a year ago

East Hull

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

I do not see this as a inflammatory thread at all.

And think if people do not post inflammatory comments all will be OK.

May I add I speak as a person who has never used drugs but in the past had issues with alcohol

That wasn't personal Mistress, I just meant that the topic borders being a banned subject on the forums and could easily step over the line. And conflicts between points of view.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

You will only get a ban if you abuse a person on the forum or talk about anything that is not allowed.

Technically, talking about illegal drugs isn't allowed."

I may be wrong but I think that is when people are trying to promote a certain type of drug.

This is not in that vain of topic

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Think both can be as bad. I might not be best person to judge as don't drink or do drugs. Have just spent a week in hospital been at side of a bloke who's had a liver transplant due to excessive drinking he's adamant he'll never touch alcohol again which is a good sign, how many have these transplants and carrying on drinking tho. Dread to think cost to NHS of that operation

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Alcohol is just as dangerous as drugs IMHO. Even more so because of the social acceptance, and yes alcoholism is an illness but as said above it's hard to sympathise, as sufferers can be extremely selfish.

My father in law was an alchoholic, remnant of PTSD. He became sober eventually and stayed that way for 20 years, we still had to watch him die a prolonged painful death. My husband is alcohol dependant and suffers depression, I feel the alcohol plays a part, he knows but not willing to change, I'm tired of supporting him because he is not even trying to help himself.

I just know that he will go out on the way of his Dad. He knows it too and is willing to put me and the boys through that. So yes, it's worse than drugs I feel.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

But would you say them drinkers look down on drug takers?

I know I used to

Yes I would say they do .drinkers think drug users are worse as drinkers don't see they are killing them selves .But I have seen terrible cases of young people alcohol abuse .it's sad but sometimes it's there lives that make them reach the drink and same for drug users

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By *aul1973HullMan over a year ago

East Hull

"Alcohol is just as dangerous as drugs IMHO. Even more so because of the social acceptance, and yes alcoholism is an illness but as said above it's hard to sympathise, as sufferers can be extremely selfish.

I just know that he will go out on the way of his Dad. He knows it too and is willing to put me and the boys through that. So yes, it's worse than drugs I feel."

That's upsetting

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"I don't think we do encourage people to become dependant on drugs or alcohol.

If a person becomes weak and becomes dependant on either it's not because they were encouraged by society. If that were the case would all be addicts. "

Well maybe open it up a little as we all can overindulge in say food for example. ..so maybe we are all capable of being addicts.

But for me the thread was about the hypocrisy that exists on all forms of addiction ie..I can't stop bloody smoking so I have a addiction but do not feel the need to target other people's addiction.

For me they are all the same...but a lot do not seem to recognise this

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

My thoughts are simple ....

Neither option is acceptable and both scenarios should result in any health care costs or treatment to those individuals who abuse those vices

Jail time for repeat offenders

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is.

Well said

Some patients the family bring in alcohol or drugs

I'll keep the conversation to alcohol. But yes, I know they do in fact I know of one incident where a medical professional supplied alcohol, the circumstances were complicated but nevertheless they did it.

I've seen too many cans of at 8a.m. topped up with alcohol and picked up too many tiny kids from school when both parents have been incapable to understand an illness that people refuse treatment for. If you love the illness more than your kids I lose my respect.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I think there is an element of 'looking down their nose' at drug users by hardened drinkers yes..because their indulgence is legal...They think it's not as bad.

I remember a documentary years ago that listed the 10 most destructive "habits" this took into account financial domestic and health .... heroine was no 1 tobacco was no 2.......

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is.

Well said

Some patients the family bring in alcohol or drugs

The medical worker may well have given a totally dependent alcoholic a drink to save his life at that point...as they cannot stop like turning a light off

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

You will only get a ban if you abuse a person on the forum or talk about anything that is not allowed.

Technically, talking about illegal drugs isn't allowed.

I may be wrong but I think that is when people are trying to promote a certain type of drug.

This is not in that vain of topic

Don't talk about your own or others experience of illegal drug use. Just stick to the original question and you should be ok.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I don't think we do encourage people to become dependant on drugs or alcohol.

If a person becomes weak and becomes dependant on either it's not because they were encouraged by society. If that were the case would all be addicts.

Well maybe open it up a little as we all can overindulge in say food for example. ..so maybe we are all capable of being addicts.

But for me the thread was about the hypocrisy that exists on all forms of addiction ie..I can't stop bloody smoking so I have a addiction but do not feel the need to target other people's addiction.

For me they are all the same...but a lot do not seem to recognise this

Give it a rest will you

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By *icecouple561Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

East Sussex

"Both are equally bad in my opinion.

I've no direct experience of drug abuse but two close relatives are alcoholics. Unfortunately they're married to each other.

We have stop encouraging and excusing drinking to excess and start treating it as the drain on resources and blight of families that it is.

Well said

Some patients the family bring in alcohol or drugs

The medical worker may well have given a totally dependent alcoholic a drink to save his life at that point...as they cannot stop like turning a light off

No, but like I say it was complicated

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"My thoughts are simple ....

Neither option is acceptable and both scenarios should result in any health care costs or treatment to those individuals who abuse those vices

Jail time for repeat offenders

I wouldn't have expected any different comment from you

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

In had a friend who was a alcoholic she begged me a few times too get her alcohol .I never did and used to go to hers cook her meal and get shouted at as she wanted alcohol .I managed to get her admitted and 3 days later she discharged herself .A few days later her son came from school and found his mam dead on floor .People never realise what effect it has on family .I see her son and he doesn't drink but after many years he can still see the damage and the selfishness that his mam made in her life .

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My thoughts are simple ....

Neither option is acceptable and both scenarios should result in any health care costs or treatment to those individuals who abuse those vices

Jail time for repeat offenders

I wouldn't have expected any different comment from you

I'd do the same with people who smoke fags too

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"I don't think we do encourage people to become dependant on drugs or alcohol.

If a person becomes weak and becomes dependant on either it's not because they were encouraged by society. If that were the case would all be addicts.

Well maybe open it up a little as we all can overindulge in say food for example. ..so maybe we are all capable of being addicts.

But for me the thread was about the hypocrisy that exists on all forms of addiction ie..I can't stop bloody smoking so I have a addiction but do not feel the need to target other people's addiction.

For me they are all the same...but a lot do not seem to recognise this

Give it a rest will you"

You kicked it all off

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"My thoughts are simple ....

Neither option is acceptable and both scenarios should result in any health care costs or treatment to those individuals who abuse those vices

Jail time for repeat offenders

I wouldn't have expected any different comment from you

I'd do the same with people who smoke fags too

What about them who smoke a "fag"

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I don't think we do encourage people to become dependant on drugs or alcohol.

If a person becomes weak and becomes dependant on either it's not because they were encouraged by society. If that were the case would all be addicts.

Well maybe open it up a little as we all can overindulge in say food for example. ..so maybe we are all capable of being addicts.

But for me the thread was about the hypocrisy that exists on all forms of addiction ie..I can't stop bloody smoking so I have a addiction but do not feel the need to target other people's addiction.

For me they are all the same...but a lot do not seem to recognise this

Give it a rest will you

You kicked it all off

Oh yes a did didnt i.....oooops

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?"

Possibly formed by legislation.

Alcohol and legislation does exist, such as driving when over the limit is illegal.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Another take on this is that the big pharmaceutical companies and the government make billions out of "legal" drugs prescribed to patients every year. You only need to look at the piece of paper inside the box, listing the possible side effects.

Worse then, they get prescribed more drugs to counteract the effects of the first and so on.

They don't want to make us better, instead keep us I'll and make their money.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My thoughts are simple ....

Neither option is acceptable and both scenarios should result in any health care costs or treatment to those individuals who abuse those vices

Jail time for repeat offenders

I wouldn't have expected any different comment from you

I'd do the same with people who smoke fags too

What about them who smoke a "fag"

People who engage in dangerous sports should be charged for treatments when injured and also be charged for rescue costs .....

Fuck the lot of them....

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Good subject to debate. Maybe because drugs (assuming you mean class A etc) are illegal is why people comment to such effect.

Although let's face it, human behaviour costs us the money. You wouldn't believe the cost of mental health and missing persons making suicidal threats.

Social care is becoming an issue nationally that no-one wants to grip.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I'd classify it as the same tbh... if an alcohol abuser needs a new liver, I'm not opposed to giving them one.

But only one... if they screw that one up, they've sealed their own fate imo.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

People who sustain gym injuries charge them too......

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

Livers drained?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

" Good subject to debate. Maybe because drugs (assuming you mean class A etc) are illegal is why people comment to such effect.

Although let's face it, human behaviour costs us the money. You wouldn't believe the cost of mental health and missing persons making suicidal threats.

Social care is becoming an issue nationally that no-one wants to grip."

Ain't that the truth, £220 billion on social care last year

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

I'm off out for a bit...soxy tone your right wing views down a bit

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I think there is an element of 'looking down their nose' at drug users by hardened drinkers yes..because their indulgence is legal...They think it's not as bad.

I remember a documentary years ago that listed the 10 most destructive "habits" this took into account financial domestic and health .... heroine was no 1 tobacco was no 2.......

I have a relative who would talk about "druggies" with contempt, who then almost died from an alcohol related disease. She was over indulging 4 or 5 nights a week; she didn't look like an alcoholic, but was drinking excessively.

Some people won't become addicted or dependant on anything, because that's how their brain works. Others will, because whatever is in their brain that tells them they have had enough and sort yourself out because you're going down a slippery slope, isn't there, or isn't working.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"People who sustain gym injuries charge them too......

Sexually related A&E visits should be charged double.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"I'm off out for a bit...soxy tone your right wing views down a bit

Be carful out there..... If a big beefy Geordie picks on you don't come crying too me ......

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

Livers drained?

Yes they fill up with fluid and there liver expands and tummy gets big and presses on other organs making patient uncomfortable .these have liver disease caused by alcohol.will have yellow skin and are neally causing death at this stage .

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By *rightonCheekyMan over a year ago

Brighton

"Another take on this is that the big pharmaceutical companies and the government make billions out of "legal" drugs prescribed to patients every year. You only need to look at the piece of paper inside the box, listing the possible side effects.

Worse then, they get prescribed more drugs to counteract the effects of the first and so on.

They don't want to make us better, instead keep us I'll and make their money."

And a massive tax take from booze and fags alongside the pharmaceuticals.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

Livers drained?

You're possibly thinking of ascites, failure of the liver causes fluid to build up in the abdomen. This can be drained.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Worse then, they get prescribed more drugs to counteract the effects of the first and so on.

They don't want to make us better, instead keep us I'll and make their money.

And a massive tax take from booze and fags alongside the pharmaceuticals. "

I cannot ever imagine a prohibition era like America had. Simply due to revenue for the government.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Same drug users get admitted to hospitals when they have no money and need drugs to help them .

More alcohol patients are in because of liver disease and other ailments from alcohol abuse over the years .

They get there livers drained and they are back in .They never realise damage they are doing till it's too late .

Livers drained?

You're possibly thinking of ascites, failure of the liver causes fluid to build up in the abdomen. This can be drained."

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 20/09/17 11:53:46]

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

I've deleted my message so as not to get a forum ban

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By *parkle......Woman over a year ago

Staffordshire

"People who sustain gym injuries charge them too......

Sexually related A&E visits should be charged double. "

Road accidents charge them treble!

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By *aul1973HullMan over a year ago

East Hull

"I've deleted my message so as not to get a forum ban

You did make a fair point though.

And alcohol is more addictive than some other substances.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

A lot of people use both with little or no problem. Not everyone that uses recreational drugs is an addict in the same way that not everyone that has a drink isn't an alcoholic. But society pays a huge social amd financial cost for both.

Society is in denail about the effects of alcohol. The amount of disorder linked to alcohol I'd huge with huge swathes of police funding go towards looking after d*unks in every town centre every weekend. And police stations and A&E departments full of drinks on a weekend. People die of being intoxicated, die of chronic conditions linked to alcohol abuse amd due in accidents while pissed. People kill amd injure people while pissed, be that in fights, accidents or all top often behind the wheel of a car. Amd yes of course drugs also cause problems but I think alcohol is by far the bigger issue.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"I'm off out for a bit...soxy tone your right wing views down a bit

Be carful out there..... If a big beefy Geordie picks on you don't come crying too me ......

Divnt worry lad I came back unscathed

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?

Possibly formed by legislation.

Alcohol and legislation does exist, such as driving when over the limit is illegal.

Yes it does exist on alcohol...but I think as you can buy it from almost anywhere legally..this gives the view that it is all hunky dory to the abusers.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

Worse then, they get prescribed more drugs to counteract the effects of the first and so on.

They don't want to make us better, instead keep us I'll and make their money.

And a massive tax take from booze and fags alongside the pharmaceuticals.

I cannot ever imagine a prohibition era like America had. Simply due to revenue for the government."

Leave out the revenue and you'll find it failed anyhow in the USA. ..it's not going to happen

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"A lot of people use both with little or no problem. Not everyone that uses recreational drugs is an addict in the same way that not everyone that has a drink isn't an alcoholic. But society pays a huge social amd financial cost for both.

I whole heartedly agree

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

people don't mind booze so much because it's something they use, they like a wine with dinner or a pint watching the game just like their dads and mums so it couldn't possibly be bad, after all, they're all good law abiding citizens, not 'drug users' besides, the law and government say it's ok and that's what seems to set many peoples moral compass

personally, i think booze is pretty filthy. i've worked gigs for 17/18 years now and there is always be more trouble/need for medical treatment because of booze than from any other drug, no question.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?"

For sure! But its just plain ignorance from the uneducated people, i was in the pub a few weeks ago and this guy was going on about how much he hates drugs and drug users, he was ranting away with a fag in one hand and a pint in the other, i just hada walk away from such ignorance, some people just dont understand

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"people don't mind booze so much because it's something they use, they like a wine with dinner or a pint watching the game just like their dads and mums so it couldn't possibly be bad, after all, they're all good law abiding citizens, not 'drug users' besides, the law and government say it's ok and that's what seems to set many peoples moral compass

personally, i think booze is pretty filthy. i've worked gigs for 17/18 years now and there is always be more trouble/need for medical treatment because of booze than from any other drug, no question. "

Agreed I was one of those you mention once

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"But do you not think that there is a lot of hypocrisy amongst drinkers views on drug users?

That was me over three years back

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Legalise drugs and put a sensible tax on them then like alcohol.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Addiction to anything is seldom a good thing, for the most positive activities there will be a down side.

The big difference between alcohol and drugs is that alcohol, being legal, is largely controlled in its production and you have a good idea how it is made and what it contains. With drugs there is no safeguard.

Feel sorry for anyone with an issue with either but I suppose I feel sorry for some more than others.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Legalise drugs and put a sensible tax on them then like alcohol."

Never!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Or scrap the NHS remove all taxes and legalise all drugs, let people choose what when and how much and crucially take the consequences

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

personally, i think booze is pretty filthy. i've worked gigs for 17/18 years now and there is always be more trouble/need for medical treatment because of booze than from any other drug, no question.

Agreed I was one of those you mention once

many have been! almost a right of passage in this country is getting way too d*unk!

done it myself

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Addiction to anything is seldom a good thing, for the most positive activities there will be a down side.

Feel sorry for anyone with an issue with either but I suppose I feel sorry for some more than others."

Addiction crosses many borders not just drugs and alcohol...none off them good.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Or scrap the NHS remove all taxes and legalise all drugs, let people choose what when and how much and crucially take the consequences

Alcohol and tobacco was legalised long before we knew the damage it caused...two wrongs don't make a right.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

personally, i think booze is pretty filthy. i've worked gigs for 17/18 years now and there is always be more trouble/need for medical treatment because of booze than from any other drug, no question.

Agreed I was one of those you mention once

many have been! almost a right of passage in this country is getting way too d*unk!

done it myself

"
.

Well actually I've been hammered most of my life and still managed to never break any laws while d*unk!!! I know crazy hey

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Or scrap the NHS remove all taxes and legalise all drugs, let people choose what when and how much and crucially take the consequences

Alcohol and tobacco was legalised long before we knew the damage it caused...two wrongs don't make a right."
.

Ok impose your authority on a society like a dictator and ban everything you dislike

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By *ophieslutTV/TS over a year ago

Central

We're hypocritical for sure, sided and a better by a media with its own agenda, business sectors that prefer the status quo and politicians who know the current system isn't working but are frightened to push for changes. People are somewhat like sheep, happy to follow the medias influence and not be discerning in their judgement of others or politicians for upholding a farce at huge cost financially and to society. Portugal has a system that is fairer and more adult - it works at low cost, for example.

The alcohol industry appears to have supressed information on the dangers from alcohol, like the tobacco industry has done. We probably don't know the full extent of the true rangers and cost of alcohol damage.

A better, affordable public transport system would help keep streets safer and prevent uninvolved innocent people from being harmed - but this would run counter to the ideology of many of those who prefer a punitive system that is a failure, because of their ideological zeal.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

personally, i think booze is pretty filthy. i've worked gigs for 17/18 years now and there is always be more trouble/need for medical treatment because of booze than from any other drug, no question.

Agreed I was one of those you mention once

many have been! almost a right of passage in this country is getting way too d*unk!

done it myself

There's no easy answer to it..I just wanted to make people aware that call users of other substances whilst indulging in alcohol.

They are no better then the people they call

Just my view of course

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By *tarbeckCouple over a year ago

york

I had an addiction with alcohol due to circumstances in my life , i am now sober and would never condem anybody with an addiction as you dont know what is going on in some peoples lifes

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By *wesomeSauce!Man over a year ago

Brighton

I am not really sure the terms "Alcohol abuse" and "Drug abuse" are equal.

Alcohol abuse is usually taken to mean drinking to excess, and may not even mean addiction.

Drug abuse seems to mean using any controlled substance at all, no matter how infrequently.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Addiction to anything is seldom a good thing, for the most positive activities there will be a down side.

Feel sorry for anyone with an issue with either but I suppose I feel sorry for some more than others.

Addiction crosses many borders not just drugs and alcohol...none off them good."

True...a lot of people here are suffering addictive traits in relation to sex and promiscuity?

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By *parkle......Woman over a year ago

Staffordshire

"Or scrap the NHS remove all taxes and legalise all drugs, let people choose what when and how much and crucially take the consequences

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!"

Alcohol impairs people's judgement so of course it does Something??

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!

Alcohol impairs people's judgement so of course it does Something??"
.

Not really, good judgement just stops them being the knobs they are by nature, remove the good judgement and the real them emerges.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Legalise drugs and put a sensible tax on them then like alcohol."

I have to agree with this. Or at the very least decriminalise the possession of it. The amount of police hours wasted cautioning or charging people for personal use is hard to justify.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

No one going to mention smokers or obessity through addiction to unhealthy amounts of crap food, i dont think you can pick just two topics to go head to head in terms of social acceptance and the negative drain on resources.. im sure many ppl commenting have their vices but still choose to stand on a soap box and look down on others.. and the irony of it is we are all on a swinging site together, no doubt being looked down on by conformist as socially unacceptable.

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By *tarbeckCouple over a year ago

york

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!"
I take it you have never had any problem with Alcohol

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Legalise drugs and put a sensible tax on them then like alcohol.

I have to agree with this. Or at the very least decriminalise the possession of it. The amount of police hours wasted cautioning or charging people for personal use is hard to justify. "
.

It's not just that though is it, the minute you legalise it, you remove all the dodgy dealers, the cutting it with battery acid, the home made shit, you can regulate it's strength and most importantly you can sell it at costs that stop the need for the vast vast vast majority to break into your shed and nick your mower or bike to pay for over inflated prices

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!I take it you have never had any problem with Alcohol"
.

No I've had problems with it, mostly from over doing it which meant late mornings...

Never had a fight, never had an affair, never d*unk drive, never broke the law in any meaningful way.....

While d*unk

Done most of the above sober though

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By *ophieslutTV/TS over a year ago

Central

"I had an addiction with alcohol due to circumstances in my life , i am now sober and would never condem anybody with an addiction as you dont know what is going on in some peoples lifes "

We're not all equal physically either - some people don't have the genetic protections that others have.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Addiction to anything is seldom a good thing, for the most positive activities there will be a down side.

Feel sorry for anyone with an issue with either but I suppose I feel sorry for some more than others.

Addiction crosses many borders not just drugs and alcohol...none off them good.

True...a lot of people here are suffering addictive traits in relation to sex and promiscuity?"

Oh I agree just look at all them addicted to cake

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!

Alcohol impairs people's judgement so of course it does Something??.

Not really, good judgement just stops them being the knobs they are by nature, remove the good judgement and the real them emerges.

Not sure I agree with that. I've witnessed relatively quiet folk behave completely out of character on alcohol.

Anything that impairs or alters a person's judgement needs to be taken responsibly.

I think the crux of the debate is about the difference in judgement between alcohol and drug issues.

Why not include generally unhealthy people too who cost the NHS billions by not making an effort to be fit....where do you draw the line !!!

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By *rbean69Man over a year ago

Stroud

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!"

So the real person wants to kill innocent people with his car?

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!"

Alcohol takes away all your inhibitions.

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By *parkle......Woman over a year ago

Staffordshire

No I've had problems with it, mostly from over doing it which meant late mornings...

Never had a fight, never had an affair, never d*unk drive, never broke the law in any meaningful way.....

While d*unk

Done most of the above sober though

Hahaha haha

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By *rbean69Man over a year ago

Stroud

There has never been a war on drugs. Many members of the ruling class take recreational drugs. They do not care about the cost of them as they have plenty of money. They do care about the supply being cut off. And those members of the ruling class who don't take drugs have friends who do, and who will put pressure on them not to do anything serious about the problem.

Also, the whole system of permissive liberalism by which western societies are run - where the criminal is more worthy of help and sympathy than his victim.

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By *rbean69Man over a year ago

Stroud

Regarding the original point of the forum, alcohol is a drug. It is not as bad as heroin, it may be worse than cannabis (my knowledge is insufficient to rank all drugs).

I used to find that half a pint of cider made me light-headed. I did not like the feeling, so I gave up all alcohol when I was 18.

Can anyone please explain what the attraction is of losing even partial control of one's mind?

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Regarding the original point of the forum, alcohol is a drug. It is not as bad as heroin, it may be worse than cannabis (my knowledge is insufficient to rank all drugs).

I used to find that half a pint of cider made me light-headed. I did not like the feeling, so I gave up all alcohol when I was 18.

Can anyone please explain what the attraction is of losing even partial control of one's mind?"

Because real ale is bloody good

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Regarding the original point of the forum, alcohol is a drug. It is not as bad as heroin, it may be worse than cannabis (my knowledge is insufficient to rank all drugs).

I used to find that half a pint of cider made me light-headed. I did not like the feeling, so I gave up all alcohol when I was 18.

Can anyone please explain what the attraction is of losing even partial control of one's mind?

Because real ale is bloody good"

Given you up as a listed cause

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!

Alcohol impairs people's judgement so of course it does Something??.

Not really, good judgement just stops them being the knobs they are by nature, remove the good judgement and the real them emerges.

Not sure I agree with that. I've witnessed relatively quiet folk behave completely out of character on alcohol.

Anything that impairs or alters a person's judgement needs to be taken responsibly.

I think the crux of the debate is about the difference in judgement between alcohol and drug issues.

Why not include generally unhealthy people too who cost the NHS billions by not making an effort to be fit....where do you draw the line !!! "
.

Sports and keep fit injuries cost the NHS an absolute fortune, skiing, tennis, squash, football, rugby, golf... The list in endless of Sunday Muppets breaking their legs and backs ....

Nail em up I say

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Alcohol doesn't do anything, it's just a catalyst to bring out the real person lurking in the back which they usually mask from society..... Of course alcohol gets the blame!

Alcohol impairs people's judgement so of course it does Something??.

Not really, good judgement just stops them being the knobs they are by nature, remove the good judgement and the real them emerges.

Not sure I agree with that. I've witnessed relatively quiet folk behave completely out of character on alcohol.

Anything that impairs or alters a person's judgement needs to be taken responsibly.

I think the crux of the debate is about the difference in judgement between alcohol and drug issues.

Why not include generally unhealthy people too who cost the NHS billions by not making an effort to be fit....where do you draw the line !!! .

Sports and keep fit injuries cost the NHS an absolute fortune, skiing, tennis, squash, football, rugby, golf... The list in endless of Sunday Muppets breaking their legs and backs ....

Nail em up I say

Oh there's plenty I would nail up to say the least on here

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Let's all go and live in North Korea..... They have a brilliant str@ngle hold on which drugs society can and cannot take.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Japan has a very stable society but then they actually throw you in jail for like a year for taking drugs.

No liberal wishy washy sentiment over there

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

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By *ink Panther.Woman over a year ago

Preston

"Both are illnesses. I see any abuse or addiction as an illness that people don't ask for, any more than they want a terminal illness or disability. The brain is sick and needs help, so help them. "

This ^^^^^^^^

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Interesting. How do you propose the transition of criminals supplying to drugs to respectable outlets?

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

You are bringing the nhs into it...but what about crime and the victims of it?

I don't think a taxation or even a prison sentence will be much comfort to some.

Reply privately (thread closed by moderator)

By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Interesting. How do you propose the transition of criminals supplying to drugs to respectable outlets? "
.

Capitalists costs?.

Opium is a ridiculously cheap crop, its costs at source in Afghanistan are about £3 a kilo.

You could triple this to £30 a kilo to give Afghan farmers a fair deal.

Once you've made that market properly work, you can then open it up to big corporations on refining and regulation, they will drive costs down to around a hundredth of current Street costs instantaneously throwing every single step of the illegal trade on the scrap heap.

Without the vast profits from the illegal drug trade most of them would find it hard to proliferate their other illegal industries as well.

Voila

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By *tarbeckCouple over a year ago

york

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Now the only problem is a state funded NHS, this can be solved through a taxation of the substance, a sensible one that covers costs NOT one designed to make you stop, it's not the business of society to impose their morals on issues that only effect the individual"
I never acted like a knob when i was drinking and never hurt anybody , i started drinking after an accident that left me epeleptic , changed my life completly , not helped by someone robbing me in the street when i had a fit , left me unable to go out for years as got panic attacks ,so i started drinking try been stuck in the house for years , you would maybe take to drink

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Now the only problem is a state funded NHS, this can be solved through a taxation of the substance, a sensible one that covers costs NOT one designed to make you stop, it's not the business of society to impose their morals on issues that only effect the individual I never acted like a knob when i was drinking and never hurt anybody , i started drinking after an accident that left me epeleptic , changed my life completly , not helped by someone robbing me in the street when i had a fit , left me unable to go out for years as got panic attacks ,so i started drinking try been stuck in the house for years , you would maybe take to drink"
.

Madam, I think you've mistaken me for somebody who wants to stop you, far from it, I think you should be allowed to do whatever you want providing you don't break laws or hurt somebody else while doing it.... Be that drink or drugs.

The vast majority of people who drink DON'T beat people up while d*unk, DON'T smash your car windows in and DON'T break the law, I was actually talking about how best to cut down on the ones who do.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Now the only problem is a state funded NHS, this can be solved through a taxation of the substance, a sensible one that covers costs NOT one designed to make you stop, it's not the business of society to impose their morals on issues that only effect the individual I never acted like a knob when i was drinking and never hurt anybody , i started drinking after an accident that left me epeleptic , changed my life completly , not helped by someone robbing me in the street when i had a fit , left me unable to go out for years as got panic attacks ,so i started drinking try been stuck in the house for years , you would maybe take to drink"

This is what happens when something awful happens .I knew someone who had Parkinson's and he crawled to shop .he couldn't bare the pain and his life .was sad as all he needed was help .

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Interesting. How do you propose the transition of criminals supplying to drugs to respectable outlets? .

Capitalists costs?.

Opium is a ridiculously cheap crop, its costs at source in Afghanistan are about £3 a kilo.

You could triple this to £30 a kilo to give Afghan farmers a fair deal.

Without the vast profits from the illegal drug trade most of them would find it hard to proliferate their other illegal industries as well.

Voila

And the massive organised criminal infrastructure would just say hey ho times are changing well move on?

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By *tarbeckCouple over a year ago

york

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Now the only problem is a state funded NHS, this can be solved through a taxation of the substance, a sensible one that covers costs NOT one designed to make you stop, it's not the business of society to impose their morals on issues that only effect the individual I never acted like a knob when i was drinking and never hurt anybody , i started drinking after an accident that left me epeleptic , changed my life completly , not helped by someone robbing me in the street when i had a fit , left me unable to go out for years as got panic attacks ,so i started drinking try been stuck in the house for years , you would maybe take to drink.

The vast majority of people who drink DON'T beat people up while d*unk, DON'T smash your car windows in and DON'T break the law, I was actually talking about how best to cut down on the ones who do.

"
i dont drink anymore

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

The answer is to decriminalise possession but possession with intent remains a criminal offence. Variablons of this work well in a number of countries. But we seem to go down the draconian route and tge police/government seem to think an effective use of resources is a snuffer dog at tube stations to potentially fuck up someone's life with a caution for possession because they realise a pill is a far cheaper night that paying a over fiver a beer. Tell me how that is fighting crime or 'winning the battle on drigs' because I can't see it.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

"My personal opinion is that the state and society have no right to dictate to an individuals liberty providing there not breaking any laws while doing it.

There's a very easy way to cut back on people acting like knobs while d*unk or high and that's hard jail time! Make it known that it's socially unacceptable and will NOT be tolerated!.

Interesting. How do you propose the transition of criminals supplying to drugs to respectable outlets? .

Capitalists costs?.

Opium is a ridiculously cheap crop, its costs at source in Afghanistan are about £3 a kilo.

You could triple this to £30 a kilo to give Afghan farmers a fair deal.

Without the vast profits from the illegal drug trade most of them would find it hard to proliferate their other illegal industries as well.

Voila

And the massive organised criminal infrastructure would just say hey ho times are changing well move on? "
.

There'd never compete, it's as simple as that, most crime syndicates are incredibly inefficient and ran by fuckwits... There'd go the same way as Ryan air

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

I'm sorry but I think this is going off track from the original op.

Please read again as this is not about legalising drugs.

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Whatever the addiction, the addicted person will try to find ways to justify or rationalise their actions and behaviours, putting down other addictions is just a way of validating their own as not being so bad.

I've known people with drink and drug addictions but also know that in the main they've had some pretty shit things happen to them over the years which has probably led them to where they are, sadly not everyone is able to resist these temptations.

From a recreational point of view, anyone that's d*unk or under the influence of drugs thinks they are amazing and acting no different but the reality is usually quite the opposite.

Ginger

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By (user no longer on site) over a year ago

Drinking a bottle of wine every night is cool. Needing a drink on a night out is cool. Still being d*unk when driving the day after a night out is cool.

Drugs are not cool.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Drinking a bottle of wine every night is cool. Needing a drink on a night out is cool. Still being d*unk when driving the day after a night out is cool.

Drugs are not cool. "

Ah and there you have it

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

You will only get a ban if you abuse a person on the forum or talk about anything that is not allowed.

Technically, talking about illegal drugs isn't allowed.

I may be wrong but I think that is when people are trying to promote a certain type of drug.

This is not in that vain of topic

No it isn't. It is talking about drugs at all.

Taken from the forum rules

"Threads we remove

Threads containing racism, threats, nasty stuff like that will be removed and the posters banned or given timeouts. We also don't want discussions of serious illegal subjects like r***, child abuse, illegal drugs because inevitably someone will post about their own crimes / experiences of crimes and we can get hauled up in court to provide evidence. We do this for fun and we don't want the hassle, sorry."

As the thread has been going a while and as far as I have read is not talking about experiences then I will leave it on. But if it is full of experiences by the time I get to the bottom it will be removed

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan over a year ago

salisbury

"So from another thread I noticed quite a few people are quite quick to condemn drug users on here...often stating the cost to the NHS and crime as the reasons.

I did a quick bit of research last night and found the cost of drug abuse is estimated at £13.9 billion in crime and to the NHS. Whilst alcohol is £21 billion for the same!

I know duty is recovered from alcohol abuse so these are not totally accurate figures.

But alcohol abuse is a massive Burdon the society. .yet people seem to use it and look down on others as theirs is a legal drug of choice.

So I am asking are we hypocritical on this?

Your thoughts

I'm an alcohol user. I look down on drug users because they are breaking the law. I look down on people who abuse alcohol because they have no self control or respect. The same as users of addictive controlled drugs, or people who feel the need to get stoned. I don't feel like a hypocrite because I'm not addicted to alcohol, and I'm not breaking the law.

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By (user no longer on site) OP over a year ago

"Oh Mistress, what a potentially dangerous thread, I would really like to share my opinion on this, but I fear there would be a high risk of me getting a forum ban at the very least.

You will only get a ban if you abuse a person on the forum or talk about anything that is not allowed.

Technically, talking about illegal drugs isn't allowed.

I may be wrong but I think that is when people are trying to promote a certain type of drug.

This is not in that vain of topic

No it isn't. It is talking about drugs at all.

Taken from the forum rules

"Threads we remove

Well I hope my earlier post got it back on track as it was heading that way.

Cheers

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By *ensualtouch15Man over a year ago

ashby de la zouch

"So from another thread I noticed quite a few people are quite quick to condemn drug users on here...often stating the cost to the NHS and crime as the reasons.

I did a quick bit of research last night and found the cost of drug abuse is estimated at £13.9 billion in crime and to the NHS. Whilst alcohol is £21 billion for the same!

I know duty is recovered from alcohol abuse so these are not totally accurate figures.

But alcohol abuse is a massive Burdon the society. .yet people seem to use it and look down on others as theirs is a legal drug of choice.

So I am asking are we hypocritical on this?

Your thoughts

So you have no issue with a person who travels to Colorado or Amsterdam to occasionally enjoy a smoke of cannabis ?

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By *lem-H-FandangoMan over a year ago

salisbury

"So from another thread I noticed quite a few people are quite quick to condemn drug users on here...often stating the cost to the NHS and crime as the reasons.

I did a quick bit of research last night and found the cost of drug abuse is estimated at £13.9 billion in crime and to the NHS. Whilst alcohol is £21 billion for the same!

I know duty is recovered from alcohol abuse so these are not totally accurate figures.

But alcohol abuse is a massive Burdon the society. .yet people seem to use it and look down on others as theirs is a legal drug of choice.

So I am asking are we hypocritical on this?

Your thoughts

So you have no issue with a person who travels to Colorado or Amsterdam to occasionally enjoy a smoke of cannabis ?"

I guess id feel a bit sorry for them.

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By *ugby 123Couple over a year ago
Forum Mod

O o O oo

Ok I think nows the time to stop

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