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The 'Racist' Float
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Did anyone read about the Cool Running float in Wales that is being investigated by police as a Hate crime?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/cool-runnings-float-racist-wales-carnival-aberaeron-police-investigation-black-wigs-jamaican-flag-a7922421.html
I assume common sense will prevail and no charges will be made. But it got me thinking of the dangers of such lose and subjective hate crimes laws and the potential risks to our freedom of speech and artistic expression. I mean who is the arbiter of such lose laws? Who decides what is an act of hate and who can and can not offended? Could the framework of these laws be used to silence and prosecute a whole range of voices? I have similar concerns with our extreme porn laws and the digital economies act. Are we becoming a less free society in terms of speech and expression? |
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People can get offended by anything. I think some look for the offensive element in everything they can purely to cause upset.
I haven't read the article and don't want to because it'll probably give me the head shakes. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I haven't looked at your link and I have no knowledge of the story....
But I remember a few years ago some misguided individuals made the news with the theme of their carnival float where a guy was dressed as Jimmy Savile surrounded by his accomplices who were dressed in school uniforms....
They were rightly vilified by the press and the public .. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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I think it was hugely naive to think that doing it wouldn't go unnoticed and cause controversy. We live in a world where everything is scrutinised and I think we should all just be mindful of that. |
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By *olgateMan
over a year ago
on the road to nowhere in particular |
"I haven't looked at your link and I have no knowledge of the story....
But I remember a few years ago some misguided individuals made the news with the theme of their carnival float where a guy was dressed as Jimmy Savile surrounded by his accomplices who were dressed in school uniforms....
They were rightly vilified by the press and the public .. "
Was it the anti smoking lobby complaining about the cigar? |
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"I haven't looked at your link and I have no knowledge of the story....
But I remember a few years ago some misguided individuals made the news with the theme of their carnival float where a guy was dressed as Jimmy Savile surrounded by his accomplices who were dressed in school uniforms....
They were rightly vilified by the press and the public .. "
Racist |
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"Did anyone read about the Cool Running float in Wales that is being investigated by police as a Hate crime?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/cool-runnings-float-racist-wales-carnival-aberaeron-police-investigation-black-wigs-jamaican-flag-a7922421.html
I assume common sense will prevail and no charges will be made. But it got me thinking of the dangers of such lose and subjective hate crimes laws and the potential risks to our freedom of speech and artistic expression. I mean who is the arbiter of such lose laws? Who decides what is an act of hate and who can and can not offended? Could the framework of these laws be used to silence and prosecute a whole range of voices? I have similar concerns with our extreme porn laws and the digital economies act. Are we becoming a less free society in terms of speech and expression?"
Madness if you ask me... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"People can get offended by anything. I think some look for the offensive element in everything they can purely to cause upset.
I haven't read the article and don't want to because it'll probably give me the head shakes."
I'm offended by your notion that I might be offended  |
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People should learn what racism IS before they decide whether the float was racist or not.
"less favourable treatment on grounds of colour, race, or ethnic or national origins"
The above still stands today. Albeit the wording may be different.
Dressing up as a black hero isn't racism. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it |
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"People should learn what racism IS before they decide whether the float was racist or not.
"less favourable treatment on grounds of colour, race, or ethnic or national origins"
The above still stands today. Albeit the wording may be different.
Dressing up as a black hero isn't racism. "
Got it in one.
 |
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"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it "
It's not always to mock. The 'mummers' of Padstow - who still black to this day - did so ( originally ) to hide their identity and keep their pride , as they went from door to door dancing and singing for money to relieve their poverty. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it
It's not always to mock. The 'mummers' of Padstow - who still black to this day - did so ( originally ) to hide their identity and keep their pride , as they went from door to door dancing and singing for money to relieve their poverty. "
sorry I meant to add, the popular 'blacking up' from tv shows etc..in fact I think some cartoons were more offensive than most in bygone days! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it "
.
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken..."
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float! |
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Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!"
.
Oh right, I'll keep my eye out for those offended Tigers then  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars."
agree on the cool runnings aspects..
but I dont think it is stupidity about the golliwog...I know people who have them(and the dolls dont offend me), however..you might want to look more into why they are offensive to many.
*even a ragdoll could be deemed offensive(a representation of a poor person), but it sort of pales(no pun intended), to what I believe a golliwog denotes..the clue might be in 'wog'. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!.
Oh right, I'll keep my eye out for those offended Tigers then "
especially the walking deads tiger..it knows if your a good one or bad one... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!.
Oh right, I'll keep my eye out for those offended Tigers then
especially the walking deads tiger..it knows if your a good one or bad one..."
.
Meh I'm no big believer in television characters  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!"
They would think we were cute baby tigers and snuggle up to us. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!.
Oh right, I'll keep my eye out for those offended Tigers then
especially the walking deads tiger..it knows if your a good one or bad one....
Meh I'm no big believer in television characters "
It's CGI'd anyway. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!
They would think we were cute baby tigers and snuggle up to us. "
call yersel 'the brain'...  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"In my knowledge 'blacking up' was only really ever used to mock...
this story to me is akin to dressing up at Halloween.
*tigers dont get offended at their gorgeous faces being painted on kids and adults...though they might take your face off just for the sake of it .
There's no moral right to violence because of the offence you've taken...
what the fuck are you on about...I said TIGERS taking offence...and as said I take NO offence to the float!.
Oh right, I'll keep my eye out for those offended Tigers then
especially the walking deads tiger..it knows if your a good one or bad one....
Meh I'm no big believer in television characters
It's CGI'd anyway."
.
Even worserer |
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"Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars.
agree on the cool runnings aspects..
but I dont think it is stupidity about the golliwog...I know people who have them(and the dolls dont offend me), however..you might want to look more into why they are offensive to many.
*even a ragdoll could be deemed offensive(a representation of a poor person), but it sort of pales(no pun intended), to what I believe a golliwog denotes..the clue might be in 'wog'."
Fair point, I understand the negative image a golliwog may give, but only a minority of people would deem it as offensive or racist? Isn't a golliwog doll just the old version of a brown coloured doll on sale in many toy shops today?
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"People should learn what racism IS before they decide whether the float was racist or not.
"less favourable treatment on grounds of colour, race, or ethnic or national origins"
The above still stands today. Albeit the wording may be different.
Dressing up as a black hero isn't racism. "
This how I took it, as a tribute to a globally popular team of sporting underdogs. If a black man had portrayed Eddie The Eagle in tribute would anyone have complained? |
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My point is not so much about blackface, more about are such laws potentially dangerous to everyone's freedom of speech and expressions. They are very subjective. There are many examples of where new anti terrorism laws have been abused way out of context by local councils and the police. What if in the future we had a more oppressive government. These laws could give the frame work to be used to silence and crack down all that are politically incorrect (don't subscribe to the party narrative). I have the same problems with the extreme porn laws and the digital economies act. I see them as a threat to our human rights and a potential method of thought policing. As a fairly liberated, liberal and kinky community I think its important to think of the implication of these laws because one day it may be some of us they bite in the arse. |
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"White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended."
Maybe if you got of your high horse a minute maybe you could see how potentially dangerous these laws could be for many different groups in society.
And I am actually opposed to the concept of political correctness. The idea that people must only believe in and follow the party narrative to me is a very dangerous concept. We just have to look at communist Russia to see the dangers of when true political correctness is enforced by the state. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars.
agree on the cool runnings aspects..
but I dont think it is stupidity about the golliwog...I know people who have them(and the dolls dont offend me), however..you might want to look more into why they are offensive to many.
*even a ragdoll could be deemed offensive(a representation of a poor person), but it sort of pales(no pun intended), to what I believe a golliwog denotes..the clue might be in 'wog'.
Fair point, I understand the negative image a golliwog may give, but only a minority of people would deem it as offensive or racist? Isn't a golliwog doll just the old version of a brown coloured doll on sale in many toy shops today?
"
.
No it was a doll from children's books I believe originally spelt golliwogg... The doll nor the writer showed racist intent but It's possible to subvert anything into racism I guess.
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars.
agree on the cool runnings aspects..
but I dont think it is stupidity about the golliwog...I know people who have them(and the dolls dont offend me), however..you might want to look more into why they are offensive to many.
*even a ragdoll could be deemed offensive(a representation of a poor person), but it sort of pales(no pun intended), to what I believe a golliwog denotes..the clue might be in 'wog'.
Fair point, I understand the negative image a golliwog may give, but only a minority of people would deem it as offensive or racist? Isn't a golliwog doll just the old version of a brown coloured doll on sale in many toy shops today?
.
No it was a doll from children's books I believe originally spelt golliwogg... The doll nor the writer showed racist intent but It's possible to subvert anything into racism I guess.
"
I was in a woman's shop recently with my son, shop was actually owned by the lady. She was selling golliwogs all sizes. I said to my son oh look I havent seen a golliwog in years. She piped up "its gollydolly not gollywog, if you want to be racist please do it outside my shop"  so gollydolly was a new one on me, not sure if the change in wording removes the perceived racist undertones or not. But if she is that touchy about it why even have them in her shop?? Confused me lol |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/ |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/"
.
Thomas sowell is a brilliant mind that's unheard of because he's black .... Although he would say it's because they don't like what he says |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/.
Thomas sowell is a brilliant mind that's unheard of because he's black .... Although he would say it's because they don't like what he says"
If more people (black, white, men and women ) read his books and watched his life videos they would have a better understanding of using logic rather than emotions to understand things. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended."
Nicely said. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/.
Thomas sowell is a brilliant mind that's unheard of because he's black .... Although he would say it's because they don't like what he says
If more people (black, white, men and women ) read his books and watched his life videos they would have a better understanding of using logic rather than emotions to understand things. "
.
We've just undertaken a 20 year massive promotion in showing and understanding emotions in the West.
Nobody wants to know about logic and data anymore, it's yesterday's news... We want emotion and emotional outbursts, wailing footballers, crying pop stars, sobbing news presenters and distraught bloggers... Won't somebody think of the children  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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The more some people jump on minor slightly none PC or possibly you could say it's racist if you squint and turn your head round and look at it at exactly the right angle...
The more desensitised to the words 'racist' & 'racism' the more likely people are to ignore genuine racism with malice and an agenda. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
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"The more some people jump on minor slightly none PC or possibly you could say it's racist if you squint and turn your head round and look at it at exactly the right angle...
The more desensitised to the words 'racist' & 'racism' the more likely people are to ignore genuine racism with malice and an agenda. "
I disagree. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended.
Maybe if you got of your high horse a minute maybe you could see how potentially dangerous these laws could be for many different groups in society.
And I am actually opposed to the concept of political correctness. The idea that people must only believe in and follow the party narrative to me is a very dangerous concept. We just have to look at communist Russia to see the dangers of when true political correctness is enforced by the state."
Eugh. People need history lessons. The UK does not have "freedom of speech". It never did. Its kinda worrying that education has become lacklustre that people seem to think that the very first US amendment applies to a country that the US broke away from a couple hundred years ago. There has never been any kind of strict constitutional protection of freedom of speech here.
Whilst it can be agreed upon that there should be reasonable allowances for civil expression, people need to accept that "PC" is not actually a thing and that mainstream social and political sensibilities have changed a lot over the years. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"People should learn what racism IS before they decide whether the float was racist or not.
"less favourable treatment on grounds of colour, race, or ethnic or national origins"
The above still stands today. Albeit the wording may be different.
Dressing up as a black hero isn't racism.
This how I took it, as a tribute to a globally popular team of sporting underdogs. If a black man had portrayed Eddie The Eagle in tribute would anyone have complained?"
You know another big problem people in this country have? Disingenuity. People cry about "political correctness" but are too chickenshit to really espouse how they truly feel. Lets not pretend as if, in our current climate, dressing up in black face would be really done for any other reason than to rustle feathers and court controversy.
Its funny, I could purchase an ISIS flag and a rucksack on the internet then proceed to walk through the London underground with both in tow despite me knowing full well that not only do I have no affiliation with ISIS, but that I am not even Muslim.
I wonder how many people would come to my aid when I am inevitably arrested and/or tackled by police or shot??? I doubt very many.
It may not be racist...but it is clearly trying to take the piss. Stupid games are rewarded with stupid prizes. |
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The two incidents aren't comparable and it makes a very poor point to put them together.
You'd be imitating a follower or member of a known active terrorist group. The entire world is highly sensitive about the destruction of their cities and the murdering of their people right now.
The 'others' were in a carnival dressed as sporting heroes.
I'd be pretty annoyed if you weren't challenged. And you are right. I wouldn't come to your rescue - in that instance.
In any case, as far as im aware , flying the isis flag is not illegal in Britain. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"The two incidents aren't comparable and it makes a very poor point to put them together.
You'd be imitating a follower or member of a known active terrorist group. The entire world is highly sensitive about the destruction of their cities and the murdering of their people right now.
The 'others' were in a carnival dressed as sporting heroes.
I'd be pretty annoyed if you weren't challenged. And you are right. I wouldn't come to your rescue - in that instance.
In any case, as far as im aware , flying the isis flag is not illegal in Britain."
An ISIS flag may not be illegal but its in poor taste. There is also plenty of poor history in regards to racism so really talk of distaste is completely redundant.
Whether it be flying an ISIS flag. Or dressing up in black face. Or marching through the streets with a leash on your wife and a muffler in her mouth...some things are in poor taste or perhaps just best kept in the confines of your own domain. There seems to be a strong contingent among many here to keep these things purely on the merit that they infringe on their immature grasp of free speech. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/.
Thomas sowell is a brilliant mind that's unheard of because he's black .... Although he would say it's because they don't like what he says
If more people (black, white, men and women ) read his books and watched his life videos they would have a better understanding of using logic rather than emotions to understand things. .
We've just undertaken a 20 year massive promotion in showing and understanding emotions in the West.
Nobody wants to know about logic and data anymore, it's yesterday's news... We want emotion and emotional outbursts, wailing footballers, crying pop stars, sobbing news presenters and distraught bloggers... Won't somebody think of the children "
It's a logical fallacy called appeal to emotion.
Over the last 3 weeks there have been a few left wing liberals making red pill videos explaining why they don't follow the far left liberals any more. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/"
Thomas Sowell is trash peddled by sycophants and racists without even the most basic understanding of American history. Actually take some time and examine some of his works, a lot of it dont hold up to the slightest scrutiny and dont really veer too far from eugenicist nonsense that used to be peddled in the West during the 19th and 20th century.
Its nothing more than pseudo-science and racism that used to be peddled against the Jews/Irish (concepts of underclasses/untermensch "culture, selective breeding, race and IQ) repackaged and sold to racist white supremacists who now want some credence for their toxic ideas and an excuse for their bigotry. Evidently, its little surprise that he still peddles his schtick on Fox News...despite many right leaning political scientists and economists distancing themselves from the network.
I laugh heartily whenever an idiot cites Thomas Sowell as some kind of example of intellectual integrity. It makes me kinda doubt whether they have any real understanding of American history or social dynamics. |
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"White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended.
Maybe if you got of your high horse a minute maybe you could see how potentially dangerous these laws could be for many different groups in society.
And I am actually opposed to the concept of political correctness. The idea that people must only believe in and follow the party narrative to me is a very dangerous concept. We just have to look at communist Russia to see the dangers of when true political correctness is enforced by the state.
Eugh. People need history lessons. The UK does not have "freedom of speech". It never did. Its kinda worrying that education has become lacklustre that people seem to think that the very first US amendment applies to a country that the US broke away from a couple hundred years ago. There has never been any kind of strict constitutional protection of freedom of speech here.
Whilst it can be agreed upon that there should be reasonable allowances for civil expression, people need to accept that "PC" is not actually a thing and that mainstream social and political sensibilities have changed a lot over the years. "
In the UK we don't not have freedom of speech. Granted its not protected maybe in the way it is in the US constitution but our liberty (in the absence of it being oppressed) of expression is something we have, we use and I value. It is something that the UN class as a basic human right. Often the nature of human rights defence is defending the rights of people you are ideologically opposed to. I believe in it a as universal human right for everyone therefore I must support those I don't agree with right to expression. Obviously in reason but my point is the hate crime law is too vague and subjective.
I agree it is getting a bit better if your not white, male and hetero. More people are getting a voice. And so may it continue. Hopefully one day a society where everyone can be heard and debate. And of course offend (although hopefully not for the sake of offending) because there is always going to be some offence when an idea is challenged. But we have to be very careful that very subjective laws don't become a double edged sword and undo the progression that has been made. Human rights should be for all, even far right activists, even far left activist. If you shut down voices how do you stop society becoming a highly censored, political correct echo chamber? How can you trust your voice will always be allowed when others have been shut down?
The poem Them Came by Martin Niemöller always springs to mind for me. It reminds me that if I don't stick up for everyone else's rights how can I expect my own to be defended. |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"People should learn what racism IS before they decide whether the float was racist or not.
"less favourable treatment on grounds of colour, race, or ethnic or national origins"
The above still stands today. Albeit the wording may be different.
Dressing up as a black hero isn't racism. "
Yes granny, but that doesn't sell newspapers does it? |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"White hetero male takes offence as his freeedom being restricted. World explodes on the irony.
Are we beoming a less free society? Well, it's getting a little better if you're not white, male and hetero. If you'e white, male and hetero, being threatened at the loss of your privileged position in the social hierarchy is understandable, though unjustified.
With the number of ranting "It's PC gone mad" brigadeers about, it might appear we're becoming less empathetic.
Who decides what and what isn't acceptable law? Well, it's been white men for centuries, who may or may not have been hetero but at least presented as such. I'm guessing you were pretty ok with that setup.
Homosexuality was illegal until the 1970s and marital r*pe wasn't considered r*pe at all until the 1980s. The 19 fucking 80s! Is that the kind of political correctness you find perfectly acceptable? Is that your idea of freedom?
So frankly, fuck dinosaur sensitivies being offended.
Maybe if you got of your high horse a minute maybe you could see how potentially dangerous these laws could be for many different groups in society.
And I am actually opposed to the concept of political correctness. The idea that people must only believe in and follow the party narrative to me is a very dangerous concept. We just have to look at communist Russia to see the dangers of when true political correctness is enforced by the state.
Eugh. People need history lessons. The UK does not have "freedom of speech". It never did. Its kinda worrying that education has become lacklustre that people seem to think that the very first US amendment applies to a country that the US broke away from a couple hundred years ago. There has never been any kind of strict constitutional protection of freedom of speech here.
Whilst it can be agreed upon that there should be reasonable allowances for civil expression, people need to accept that "PC" is not actually a thing and that mainstream social and political sensibilities have changed a lot over the years.
In the UK we don't not have freedom of speech. Granted its not protected maybe in the way it is in the US constitution but our liberty (in the absence of it being oppressed) of expression is something we have, we use and I value. It is something that the UN class as a basic human right. Often the nature of human rights defence is defending the rights of people you are ideologically opposed to. I believe in it a as universal human right for everyone therefore I must support those I don't agree with right to expression. Obviously in reason but my point is the hate crime law is too vague and subjective.
I agree it is getting a bit better if your not white, male and hetero. More people are getting a voice. And so may it continue. Hopefully one day a society where everyone can be heard and debate. And of course offend (although hopefully not for the sake of offending) because there is always going to be some offence when an idea is challenged. But we have to be very careful that very subjective laws don't become a double edged sword and undo the progression that has been made. Human rights should be for all, even far right activists, even far left activist. If you shut down voices how do you stop society becoming a highly censored, political correct echo chamber? How can you trust your voice will always be allowed when others have been shut down?
The poem Them Came by Martin Niemöller always springs to mind for me. It reminds me that if I don't stick up for everyone else's rights how can I expect my own to be defended."
You have Niemoller - I have Pop Will Eat Itself. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"My point is not so much about blackface, more about are such laws potentially dangerous to everyone's freedom of speech and expressions. They are very subjective."
When the expression of freespeech is stupid and linked to historical prejudice and oppression, I reserve the right to freely, and unequivocally, say 'fuck you.' |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"My point is not so much about blackface, more about are such laws potentially dangerous to everyone's freedom of speech and expressions. They are very subjective.
When the expression of freespeech is stupid and linked to historical prejudice and oppression, I reserve the right to freely, and unequivocally, say 'fuck you.' "
And this is the point that so many people keep missing about "free speech". "Free Speech" means you can say what you like (except within the context of slander) and not be commiting a criminal offense.
It does NOT mean that you can say whatever the fuck you like without other people challenging you/calling you a cunt etc. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"My point is not so much about blackface, more about are such laws potentially dangerous to everyone's freedom of speech and expressions. They are very subjective.
When the expression of freespeech is stupid and linked to historical prejudice and oppression, I reserve the right to freely, and unequivocally, say 'fuck you.'
And this is the point that so many people keep missing about "free speech". "Free Speech" means you can say what you like (except within the context of slander) and not be commiting a criminal offense.
It does NOT mean that you can say whatever the fuck you like without other people challenging you/calling you a cunt etc. "
I agree. The right to say it doesn't mean I have to agree with it, and I reserve the same right to say exactly that
We have to be careful that if we encourage free speech that we aware of what that actually means and the dangers/pitfalls  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Absolutely ridiculous!
Cool running is a brilliant movie!
Race has nothing to do with it!
It's about a group of friends who want to be Olympic bobsleighers but have to overcome the difficulties of not having snow in Jamaica to practice on. They proved their talent and determination to the world and even the Germans approved!
These 3 guy have only highlighted what the Jamaicans have had to overcome to become equal in a sport dominated by countries who have a colder climate and more disposable income in the form of sponsorship. Similar to Britain's Eddie 'The Eagle' Edwards in Olympic ski jumping.
Notice how the person who complained was white? Maybe they should be investigated for racism?!
This is the kind of stupidity that forced Robinsons to remove the golliwog logo from their jam jars."
I csn remember stories about golly and the other toys.
The other toy dolls would end up in trouble and Golly was the brave doll that used to rescue them. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/
Thomas Sowell is trash peddled by sycophants and racists without even the most basic understanding of American history. Actually take some time and examine some of his works, a lot of it dont hold up to the slightest scrutiny and dont really veer too far from eugenicist nonsense that used to be peddled in the West during the 19th and 20th century.
Its nothing more than pseudo-science and racism that used to be peddled against the Jews/Irish (concepts of underclasses/untermensch "culture, selective breeding, race and IQ) repackaged and sold to racist white supremacists who now want some credence for their toxic ideas and an excuse for their bigotry. Evidently, its little surprise that he still peddles his schtick on Fox News...despite many right leaning political scientists and economists distancing themselves from the network.
I laugh heartily whenever an idiot cites Thomas Sowell as some kind of example of intellectual integrity. It makes me kinda doubt whether they have any real understanding of American history or social dynamics. "
.
That's coz your a bigoted idiot who fails to grasp basic data even when it's shoved in your face.
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome "
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are.  |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. "
.
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
|
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
Self identifying with social flaws is the worst of all traits, like being white somehow makes you responsible for slavery or Nazism and being black makes you responsible for ghetto violence and rap music.
It's bollocks but we just can't resist defending our ethnicity |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. .
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
"
And indoctrination |
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"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. "
What's the petrol for then ?
Waster ! |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/
Thomas Sowell is trash peddled by sycophants and racists without even the most basic understanding of American history. Actually take some time and examine some of his works, a lot of it dont hold up to the slightest scrutiny and dont really veer too far from eugenicist nonsense that used to be peddled in the West during the 19th and 20th century.
Its nothing more than pseudo-science and racism that used to be peddled against the Jews/Irish (concepts of underclasses/untermensch "culture, selective breeding, race and IQ) repackaged and sold to racist white supremacists who now want some credence for their toxic ideas and an excuse for their bigotry. Evidently, its little surprise that he still peddles his schtick on Fox News...despite many right leaning political scientists and economists distancing themselves from the network.
I laugh heartily whenever an idiot cites Thomas Sowell as some kind of example of intellectual integrity. It makes me kinda doubt whether they have any real understanding of American history or social dynamics. .
That's coz your a bigoted idiot who fails to grasp basic data even when it's shoved in your face.
"
What "data"? Show me this data. Since when can data be used to determine fundamental differences between races and culture?
I take it you're one of these Thomas Sewell lovers? What am I willing to guess that you're poorly educated and lacking in critical thinking skills? LOL you dont even realize that a ton of political scientists, economists and social scientists alike have distanced themselves from race based analyses because of how crap the science is.
You're peddling 20th century pseudo-science because you have an inflated sense of self whilst probably lacking in any scientific/academic pedigree beyond an ability to use Wikipedia and consume whatever diet of shitty alt-right trash you can find online. Calling me a bigot for criticizing other bigots is possibly the most tired argumentation one can use. But you dont strike me as the sharpest tool in the shed so cant say I am surprised. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
The biggest problem with this incident, is the fact that a politician hijacked the story by tweeting it and claiming her abject horror, demanding local counsellors take action which in turned forces an investigation to appease.
Is it racist to dress up as another race? |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. .
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
And indoctrination "
There are no "wings". Critical thinkers never suscribe wholly to anyone political theory and anyone who does clearly needs to invest in some reading. I dont have any allegiance with any left leaning political standpoints...I simply dont like idiots who parrot shit they hear from alt-right outlets/the daily mail/breitbart/4chan and pass it off as fact due to their intellectual insecurity. For all the idiocy that progressive liberals have been shown up for, the last year has shown that those on the right are just as bad.
I would bet cash none of you could actually cite any of the theories people like Sowell posits without a Google search and I am also willing to bet none of you have delved into any of the nuances of the political theories you claim to demonize/worship. Thats because most of you are as emotional and dimwitted as the lefties you criticize. Two sides of the same idiot millennial coin. Both do nothing but serve as a damning indictment of the shockingly poor educational levels of much of the anglicized world. Worst thing of all is that it seems said ignorance is by design. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. .
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
And indoctrination
There are no "wings". Critical thinkers never suscribe wholly to anyone political theory and anyone who does clearly needs to invest in some reading. I dont have any allegiance with any left leaning political standpoints...I simply dont like idiots who parrot shit they hear from alt-right outlets/the daily mail/breitbart/4chan and pass it off as fact due to their intellectual insecurity. For all the idiocy that progressive liberals have been shown up for, the last year has shown that those on the right are just as bad.
I would bet cash none of you could actually cite any of the theories people like Sowell posits without a Google search and I am also willing to bet none of you have delved into any of the nuances of the political theories you claim to demonize/worship. Thats because most of you are as emotional and dimwitted as the lefties you criticize. Two sides of the same idiot millennial coin. Both do nothing but serve as a damning indictment of the shockingly poor educational levels of much of the anglicized world. Worst thing of all is that it seems said ignorance is by design. "
Isn't there an element of irony in your assumption, that most of us have shockingly poor education and created our ignorance by our own volition?
The greatest sign of intelligence is accepting that you don't know everything. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"For a slightly different perspective you can read several articles online about speech being equivalent to violence. Like the one below.
And for another point of view you can read what Thomas sowell saids about discrimination.
https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2017/07/why-its-a-bad-idea-to-tell-students-words-are-violence/533970/
Thomas Sowell is trash peddled by sycophants and racists without even the most basic understanding of American history. Actually take some time and examine some of his works, a lot of it dont hold up to the slightest scrutiny and dont really veer too far from eugenicist nonsense that used to be peddled in the West during the 19th and 20th century.
Its nothing more than pseudo-science and racism that used to be peddled against the Jews/Irish (concepts of underclasses/untermensch "culture, selective breeding, race and IQ) repackaged and sold to racist white supremacists who now want some credence for their toxic ideas and an excuse for their bigotry. Evidently, its little surprise that he still peddles his schtick on Fox News...despite many right leaning political scientists and economists distancing themselves from the network.
I laugh heartily whenever an idiot cites Thomas Sowell as some kind of example of intellectual integrity. It makes me kinda doubt whether they have any real understanding of American history or social dynamics. .
That's coz your a bigoted idiot who fails to grasp basic data even when it's shoved in your face.
What "data"? Show me this data. Since when can data be used to determine fundamental differences between races and culture?
I take it you're one of these Thomas Sewell lovers? What am I willing to guess that you're poorly educated and lacking in critical thinking skills? LOL you dont even realize that a ton of political scientists, economists and social scientists alike have distanced themselves from race based analyses because of how crap the science is.
You're peddling 20th century pseudo-science because you have an inflated sense of self whilst probably lacking in any scientific/academic pedigree beyond an ability to use Wikipedia and consume whatever diet of shitty alt-right trash you can find online. Calling me a bigot for criticizing other bigots is possibly the most tired argumentation one can use. But you dont strike me as the sharpest tool in the shed so cant say I am surprised. "
.I thought it was show me the money not
Show me the data .
So you jumped on somebody's post about Thomas sowell being brilliant to slam in some warped sense of self genius? And denounce him as some uncle Tom alt right loon (yeah they love them type at Stamford apparently).
Anyhoo.... |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
I have read lots of books by Thomas Sowell and he has written a few about American history and the history of various immigrants that went to America.
Most of his books have been put on youtube as audio books so anyone can listen to them.
One thing I can't spot is anyone making ad hominem acts. |
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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago
|
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. .
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
And indoctrination
There are no "wings". Critical thinkers never suscribe wholly to anyone political theory and anyone who does clearly needs to invest in some reading. I dont have any allegiance with any left leaning political standpoints...I simply dont like idiots who parrot shit they hear from alt-right outlets/the daily mail/breitbart/4chan and pass it off as fact due to their intellectual insecurity. For all the idiocy that progressive liberals have been shown up for, the last year has shown that those on the right are just as bad.
I would bet cash none of you could actually cite any of the theories people like Sowell posits without a Google search and I am also willing to bet none of you have delved into any of the nuances of the political theories you claim to demonize/worship. Thats because most of you are as emotional and dimwitted as the lefties you criticize. Two sides of the same idiot millennial coin. Both do nothing but serve as a damning indictment of the shockingly poor educational levels of much of the anglicized world. Worst thing of all is that it seems said ignorance is by design.
Isn't there an element of irony in your assumption, that most of us have shockingly poor education and created our ignorance by our own volition?
The greatest sign of intelligence is accepting that you don't know everything."
I would say a good sign of self awareness is also being comfortable with the fact that people often know even less.
The internet has made it easy for people to hide behind hokey statistics and "studies" which parrot poorly researched rubbish and then proceeds to peddle it as fact. This is being done constantly on both sides so much so that trying to attribute any particular kind of thinking/emotional weakness/intellectual indiscipline to any political wing is a fools errand. The feminists do it, the left do it, the right do it. No one seems to have a monopoly on the piss poor nature of modern political discourse, but it does irk me when people on the right try to pretend as if they're any better.
Thomas Sowell always comes across as insightful to newbies the same way Adam Smith comes across as eye-opening to someone attending Economics 101. American history and social dynamics are far more complex than he tries to make for his very, VERY biased and moronic audience. |
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By *imiUKMan
over a year ago
Hereford |
"Having just had many many many shots of vodka, and not having really read much of what's been typed here,I now feel fully equipt to make a sensible contribution to this subject.
'When the revolution comes, you'll all be doused in petrol, stuck up against a bus and shot'
Your welcome
Because the left wing idiots are as narrow minded bigoted and prejudiced as the right wing idiots are. .
Bigoted is just a perception based on your life experiences.
And indoctrination
There are no "wings". Critical thinkers never suscribe wholly to anyone political theory and anyone who does clearly needs to invest in some reading. I dont have any allegiance with any left leaning political standpoints...I simply dont like idiots who parrot shit they hear from alt-right outlets/the daily mail/breitbart/4chan and pass it off as fact due to their intellectual insecurity. For all the idiocy that progressive liberals have been shown up for, the last year has shown that those on the right are just as bad.
I would bet cash none of you could actually cite any of the theories people like Sowell posits without a Google search and I am also willing to bet none of you have delved into any of the nuances of the political theories you claim to demonize/worship. Thats because most of you are as emotional and dimwitted as the lefties you criticize. Two sides of the same idiot millennial coin. Both do nothing but serve as a damning indictment of the shockingly poor educational levels of much of the anglicized world. Worst thing of all is that it seems said ignorance is by design. "
The notion that being on the left or the right are two sides of a "millenial" coin is one of the most perplexing pieces of idiocy I've read so far today.
The left is the left, it's hardly new, "alt-right" is merely a rebranding of "fascist" because admitting you are a fascist tends not to be met with support these days... |
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